REASON 4 - it's actually here!

[anosou]

if you missed it.
http://www.propellerheads.se , click the black banner below the upper frame. Enjoy.

New sequencer, Thor, Groove, Arpeggiator, New modulation capabilities..

I'm in love and for just 129$ in 4 months ;P

[Fishy]

YES!

TIME SIGNATURE AND TEMPO AUTOMATION!
NEW SEQUENCER!

They actually LISTENED to us!

[DJ SymBiotiX]

OH MAN!! THIS IS THE BEST THING EVER!!! It looks so fricking hot now! I signed up for beta testing too :D Hopefully I get in :)

[anosou]

Yeah I did too :D and I live in sweden so if I won't get beta-testing I will throw bricks through their window, I know where they work ;)

but still BEST THING THAT EVER HAPPENED, CAN'T STOP DANCING!

[OA]

hey guys what is reason is it cool?




Actually I might look into this, I just grabbed the 3.0 demo and am going to check it out tonight.

[DJ SymBiotiX]

Yeah I did too :D and I live in sweden so if I won't get beta-testing I will throw bricks through their window, I know where they work ;)

but still BEST THING THAT EVER HAPPENED, CAN'T STOP DANCING!

haha, if I dont get in, throw a brick for me :P

[tweek]

I'm in love!! I really can't wait for this. Thor is gonna change Reason just as much as the Combinator has!!

[Dr. Rod]

I'm in love!! I really can't wait for this. Thor is gonna change Reason just as much as the Combinator has!!

A Reason without the Combinator? I couldn't imagine that......

[Malcos]

Thor is a massive new synth in so many ways. The new sequencer looks EXCELLENT! Tempo automation? Yes! Now all we need is a clock lol.

[anosou]

and remember kids, sign up for beta-testing!

[V___]

:O

:O:O:O

I come on for the Reason compo and get treated to this.

If my front tooth hadnt chipped massively today, I'd smile like crazy.... (:( and no late night dentist in my area, I have to wait til tomorow.... I'l see if he'l chisel the Reason logo into the cap)

[DJ SymBiotiX]

so guys... this morning I got an e-mail telling me I was chosen for beta testing. YAY!!! I wish this thing would download faster!! lol

[Malcos]

Damn you! Actually I never signed up, I couldn't handle having 4 and then having to go back to 3. Let us know what it's like!

[DJ SymBiotiX]

well I cant remember if I can actually talk about it all too much or something... I'll check in to that. I just dont want to violate the agreement thingy :)

[ILLiterate]

I am in love with 4 already

[anosou]

so guys... this morning I got an e-mail telling me I was chosen for beta testing. YAY!!! I wish this thing would download faster!! lol

HELL YEAH, ME 2 :D

[Tensei]

Holy..Sh*t

WHY did I decide today that I'd need a real DAW, and Reason 3 just won't cut it, then came up here to see this.

DARN YOU, Propellerhead :(


(Here's to hoping for a multiband compressor ^_^)

[anosou]

Holy..Sh*t

WHY did I decide today that I'd need a real DAW, and Reason 3 just won't cut it, then came up here to see this.

DARN YOU, Propellerhead :(


(Here's to hoping for a multiband compressor ^_^)

You can make your own multiband compressor! COMBINATOR BABEH!

[Malcos]

I have a multiband compressor combinator! Just have to ask man.

www.malcos.co.uk/Multiband_Compressor.cmb

Or if you want something a little louder, I came up with this, although it's not tweakable apart from the maximiser module:

www.malcos.co.uk/SuperLOUDmaster.cmb

[anosou]

I have a multiband compressor combinator! Just have to ask man.

www.malcos.co.uk/Multiband_Compressor.cmb

Or if you want something a little louder, I came up with this, although it's not tweakable apart from the maximiser module:

www.malcos.co.uk/SuperLOUDmaster.cmb

You've got it all :O you should do some phat Malcos-refill with all your essentials

[Tensei]

I have a multiband compressor combinator! Just have to ask man.

www.malcos.co.uk/Multiband_Compressor.cmb

Or if you want something a little louder, I came up with this, although it's not tweakable apart from the maximiser module:

www.malcos.co.uk/SuperLOUDmaster.cmb


Thanks a lot! I'll definitely check out your version, but I kind of made an improvised compressor myself (4 Mclass compressors+ 4 Vocoders)

[Xaleph]

I'm sure several of you have, but I also got into the beta. The only thing I hated about the 3.0 beta is that you couldn't render songs - and you had to uninstall the previous version of reason. This made you 100% unable to write music, unless you had a second computer.

I have 4 computers between my work and home, so I'm tempted to put it on a computer I haven't really worked on music with and check it out there instead of my main musical production computer.

I'm pretty hyped though ^_^

[DJ SymBiotiX]

Beta 2 is out now :D I'm not sure, but from what ive read, I think you can save and/or render stuff now :D

[avaris]

Yeah just got in on the 2nd Beta. :-D

Hopefully we can render songs bc I got a lot of tracks going that use Reason.

[DJ SymBiotiX]

hmm.. well I Dont think we can save or render... its weird I saw posts on the forums about the save function doing weird things, and this guy has a reason 4 song on myspace apparantly.

[anosou]

hmm.. well I Dont think we can save or render... its weird I saw posts on the forums about the save function doing weird things, and this guy has a reason 4 song on myspace apparantly.

The ones who can save/render is the oldies, they've been betatesting since Reason 2.5
If you find a lot of bugs and prove useful to props they can give you the full version as a thanks. As it is now, only eXode, neoverse and a couple of other regulars has it ;)

[DJ SymBiotiX]

damn lol.. havent found any bugs yet XD. Anybody else find any?

[anosou]

damn lol.. havent found any bugs yet XD. Anybody else find any?

Haven't tried this version. Found two in the last. I'm trying not to use Reason 4 atm since I'm in the middle of a song in Reason 3 and since they use the same preferences some things can be ugly

[OA]

is there an NDA or anything on this? are you guys allowed to post screenshots? I've heard it's a lot cleaner than V3

I ask because I downloaded the demo of V3, and the thing is a total mess to navigate.
I like the sounds it can produce, but it's such a pain to navigate i'm not sure I have the patience to drop a year just to learn the interface. Even the video tutorial on their site are only marginally helpful.

[anosou]

is there an NDA or anything on this? are you guys allowed to post screenshots? I've heard it's a lot cleaner than V3

I ask because I downloaded the demo of V3, and the thing is a total mess to navigate.
I like the sounds it can produce, but it's such a pain to navigate i'm not sure I have the patience to drop a year just to learn the interface. Even the video tutorial on their site are only marginally helpful.

We can't post anything, sorry :)
But there are screenshots of the new sequencer on props reason 4 website?
also, I find Reason 3 a lot easier than almost anything I've tried O.o

[OA]

I think the main issue for me is that every single addon (subtractor, malstrom, redrum, etc.) has a different interface. Not being uniform makes it very intimidating to learn.

There is a lot of cool stuff though; The piano roll is pretty ugly visually, but editing velocities is easy and fun. Not being able to zoom more than 100% sucks on my monitor as well.
I couldn't find staff notation either, might not have been in the demo. :-(

It looks like a super-powerful and sweet program, but I think that I'll pass.

[Hsia Nu]

is there an NDA or anything on this? are you guys allowed to post screenshots? I've heard it's a lot cleaner than V3

I ask because I downloaded the demo of V3, and the thing is a total mess to navigate.
I like the sounds it can produce, but it's such a pain to navigate i'm not sure I have the patience to drop a year just to learn the interface. Even the video tutorial on their site are only marginally helpful.

Their interface is one of the easiest to learn........ I understood the whole program in about a week.

[Sir_NutS]

Their interface is one of the easiest to learn........ I understood the whole program in about a week.

Well, I spent a lot of years using fruityloops, I was using it since 2.3 or something, and when I made the transition to reason... well suffice to say is that it wasn't very pleasant, specially with the piano roll (I use it normally now and actually find it more efficient than fl's, it's just a matter of getting used to and knowing how it works and the proper shorcuts).

However what kept me going at it, and trying to learn it was how fun it was to mess around with the parameters and cables, this interactivity level is something that keeps it fun and fresh imho.

So yeah, for someone accustomed to some other software, they can have a hard time getting into Reason.

[DDRKirby(ISQ)]

Well, I spent a lot of years using fruityloops, I was using it since 2.3 or something, and when I made the transition to reason... well suffice to say is that it wasn't very pleasant, specially with the piano roll (I use it normally now and actually find it more efficient than fl's, it's just a matter of getting used to and knowing how it works and the proper shorcuts).

However what kept me going at it, and trying to learn it was how fun it was to mess around with the parameters and cables, this interactivity level is something that keeps it fun and fresh imho.

So yeah, for someone accustomed to some other software, they can have a hard time getting into Reason.

amen to that.

of course, i'm using ReWire now...=p

[The Pezman]

Has a specific release date been set yet?

[anosou]

Has a specific release date been set yet?

No. But I figure it'll be a while.

[anosou]

The Reason 4 final version has been shipped to the presses about a week ago so we may not have to wait too long :)

[Malcos]

:grin: So it won't be long now before we have it!

[Nicole Adams]

Wee, let's have a Reason 4 meetup.

[anosou]

wee! Reason 4 is a Reason 4 meetup!
we're all probably pretty scattered. OCRemixers with Reason isn't the most common thing ;P

[anosou]

"August 28, 2007: Propellerhead Software are proud to announce that Reason 4 will be released on September 26 at 12.00, CET. Reason 4 will then be available from the Prop Shop as well as from music stores worldwide. For your convenience, we have added a countdown meter to the Reason 4 banner above."

..I'm speechless

[DJ SymBiotiX]

yeah! lets all meet up in winnipeg,manitoba, canada!!... yea like thats ever gonna happen :P

This is really hot though.

[Nicole Adams]

wee! Reason 4 is a Reason 4 meetup!
we're all probably pretty scattered. OCRemixers with Reason isn't the most common thing ;P
Yeah, I was joking. Anyway, I'm a little surprised they would release it so quickly. Fun, fun!

[Sir_NutS]

Any word on the cost?

[anosou]

Any word on the cost?

I think this was talked about at beta stage. Upgrade would be like 50$ or something that way.. I may be wrong though. I hope not :)

[anosou]

I was ofc wrong, the price for upgrade is 99 Eur / 120$ as the previous versions. Not 100% but I'm rather sure

[Knives]

To quote from their site directly: "The price for the full version of Reason remains the same at EUR449 / USD499. There is also a discounted upgrade available for owners of previous versions of Reason. The upgrade is EUR99 / USD129."

Aside from that, does anybody know if Reason 4 will support multi-core (dual/quad/etc.) processors?

[tweek]

Considering that Reason 3 does support them, it would be logical to assume that 4 will as well.

[anosou]

To quote from their site directly: "The price for the full version of Reason remains the same at EUR449 / USD499. There is also a discounted upgrade available for owners of previous versions of Reason. The upgrade is EUR99 / USD129."

Aside from that, does anybody know if Reason 4 will support multi-core (dual/quad/etc.) processors?

There was a lot of commotion about cores during beta. I can't for the life of me remember if they actually implemented it in the end. but my (very qualified) guess would be no. It's not adapted for multi-core processors. However if you actually own a registered copy of reason (if you don't, feel ashamed) you can easily log on to the forums at propellerheads.se and ask for yourself

[Knives]

Well on my laptop it's pretty clear Reason 3 doesn't support multi-core processors, especially when running a heavy song, one CPU will be dancing and prancing around 60-80% while the other would be chilling around at 5-10% just running typical background system processes. And I did look through propellerhead's site along with searching through different forums at places, the general consensus seems to be that Reason 4 won't support multi-core processors either, which is too bad... =/

[Robotaki]

I've always been impressed with the quality of some of the work that comes out of Reason software. Has no VST support ever popped as a huge setback for this? I'm just wondering, because I'm interested =P

[anosou]

I've always been impressed with the quality of some of the work that comes out of Reason software. Has no VST support ever popped as a huge setback for this? I'm just wondering, because I'm interested =P

Honestly. no, not at all. I find myself being more creative in Reason.
BUT, I do like plugins, so if I need a badass mastering plug or a certain effect I just can't recreate, I rewire into ProTools or Ableton Live. That's the solution if you've got money or the system to support it.
But as I said, I like Reason as it is

[V___]

Well on my laptop it's pretty clear Reason 3 doesn't support multi-core processors, especially when running a heavy song, one CPU will be dancing and prancing around 60-80% while the other would be chilling around at 5-10% just running typical background system processes. And I did look through propellerhead's site along with searching through different forums at places, the general consensus seems to be that Reason 4 won't support multi-core processors either, which is too bad... =/


:O so THATS why my new laptop runs at a high CPU load.... despite being like 2 times better than my old compy :(


That said, still not sure if I'l get R4... the interface really pissed me off...

[DJ SymBiotiX]

WHAT??? How come?

Also, it does really suck that R4 wont support multi cores.

[Knives]

Yep, you guys can always do what I did and send them a user feedback email or say something in the feature suggestion forum to see if they'll listen after enough people voice their desire for some multi-core support. But if you've got a multi-core processor with more than 2GHz processing speed per CPU then I figure you shouldn't have anything to worry about as long as Thor isn't some CPU eating monster. Though I do wonder if there could be any strange hardware related problems with overheating if one CPU is doing 60-80% for a long time while the other is barely doing anything... eh, probably not, right?

[anosou]

one core at 2.33Ghz works pretty well for me. some of my songs are a bit too big for the cpu but I can always export and listen..
.. OK I WANT MULTI-CORE SUPPORT TOO :D
but I still like Reason too much to abandon it for such a small issue

[Knives]

Ah, my laptop's an intel dual core with both CPUs at 1.6GHz. Once while casually surfing the web and having a couple other apps open, I played Sir_Nuts's DeefNutsyGroove.rns and after 20 seconds when the song reached a more complicated part, Reason stops and tell me my computer is too slow to play the song ;(
So to me, at least, multi-core support would really be handy, especially since I think Thor and the new sequencer may take more cpu than normal.

[Knives]

Hey guys, check this out:

----------------------------------------------------
Re:(Case 37136) Reason Feedback

Hi [Knives's real name],

Thanks for your input on this. I have forwarded your e-mail to the Reason product manager.

Best regards,
Leo Nathorst-Boos
----------------------------------------------------

Pretty cool, huh? That chances are now 0.2% greater that they'll implement Reason 4 with multi-core support. w00t :D

[anosou]

Hey guys, check this out:

----------------------------------------------------
Re:(Case 37136) Reason Feedback

Hi [Knives's real name],

Thanks for your input on this. I have forwarded your e-mail to the Reason product manager.

Best regards,
Leo Nathorst-Boos
----------------------------------------------------

Pretty cool, huh? That chances are now 0.2% greater that they'll implement Reason 4 with multi-core support. w00t :D

Yeah Leo is great ;) he sent me a personal birthday greeting and USB stick for 18year present lol

[Knives]

I honestly thought you were joking, until I saw that you live in the city where Reason's headquarters are located at, so that's pretty neat.

[anosou]

I honestly thought you were joking, until I saw that you live in the city where Reason's headquarters are located at, so that's pretty neat.

haha yeah I figured you'd think that ;)
but it was kinda nice to actually talk for real. Me like pheads

[Sir_NutS]

Honestly. no, not at all. I find myself being more creative in Reason.

Indeed. Though I don't make half the music I used to make some time ago (Something called real life hates my free time) everytime I have the chance I have a lot of fun with reason. In Fl sometimes I was too lazy and just popped some presets from my VST's, but Reason always makes me want to do my own sounds. For me, VST support is something that frankly I don't miss.

Can't wait to get my hands on the new R4 tools though. So many new possibilities..

[anosou]

Yeah Thor's gonna be a BEAST :D
and I see myself using the RPG-8 on everything ;P it's going to BECOME my sound :D

life hates freetime :( and it sucks

[Knives]

This may or may not be a newbie question, but what exactly is the difference between the old matrix sequencer and the new arpeggiator in R4? Couldn't you use the matrix sequencer as an arpeggiator?

[anosou]

This may or may not be a newbie question, but what exactly is the difference between the old matrix sequencer and the new arpeggiator in R4? Couldn't you use the matrix sequencer as an arpeggiator?

not in the same way since the matrix is preprogrammed notes. the RPG-8 is arpeggiationg the notes you hold down (that's ONE of it's uses)

[Knives]

Oh, oh... I see now, thanks.

[Sir_NutS]

not in the same way since the matrix is preprogrammed notes. the RPG-8 is arpeggiationg the notes you hold down (that's ONE of it's uses)

you can use the matrix as a rough arpeggiator though (using cv connections with the gate/pitch outpu/inputs) but the RPG-8 is focused on that function =).

[anosou]

you can use the matrix as a rough arpeggiator though (using cv connections with the gate/pitch outpu/inputs) but the RPG-8 is focused on that function =).

See, I don't even know this stuff! That's why Nutsy here rules ;P

Also, Knives, two of my tracks are in the FF7 project, when you get that check it out. It's all Reason and some of Nuts's great patches too :)

[Knives]

Oh, you can count on it, I'm downloading the whole project right now and I'm gonna listen to all of in a bit :D

EDIT: And I knew you could make an arpeggiator out of the matrix sequencer SOMEHOW, lol... oh and whaddya know, VotL just finished downloading, I'm off to go listen to it =)

[Knives]

Woo, those were some sweet tunes, AS. Interesting story though: While I was listening to VotL my brother comes in the room for 5 seconds to pick something up and outta nowhere he says, "Is that mixed in Reason? (referring to the currently playing track)" I said, "Lemme check," and it was AS's "Golden Feathers" XD. He's got sharp ears. But, nonetheless, all the songs on the album that used Reason sounded really nice, including Tweek's stuff =)

I'd ask why stuff made in Reason usually SOUNDS like it was made in Reason... but when Reason generates, mixes and exports the song using it's synthesizers, mixer and audio engine, it'd be kinda hard for the song not to sound like it was made in Reason =/

[tweek]

Is the rewire client going to be the same as R3 or will they be upgrading it which will effectively screw up all Rewire connections I have for Pro Tools and Live.

Anyone know?

[anosou]

Is the rewire client going to be the same as R3 or will they be upgrading it which will effectively screw up all Rewire connections I have for Pro Tools and Live.

Anyone know?

probably the same, but since you can now change timesigs and and tempo there might be trouble but live. During beta most people could rewire perfectly tho.

ALSO YOU USE MY COMING SET-UP :D nice tweek, share your production tips!

[anosou]

Woo, those were some sweet tunes, AS. Interesting story though: While I was listening to VotL my brother comes in the room for 5 seconds to pick something up and outta nowhere he says, "Is that mixed in Reason? (referring to the currently playing track)" I said, "Lemme check," and it was AS's "Golden Feathers" XD. He's got sharp ears. But, nonetheless, all the songs on the album that used Reason sounded really nice, including Tweek's stuff =)

I'd ask why stuff made in Reason usually SOUNDS like it was made in Reason... but when Reason generates, mixes and exports the song using it's synthesizers, mixer and audio engine, it'd be kinda hard for the song not to sound like it was made in Reason =/

It's true tha Reason sounds Reason. but I like Reason :D
Also I'm now trying to expand my setup to Live and ProTools too (damn PT won't start because i upgraded OS tho..) so maybe I'll loose the sounds soon. even though I don't want to :D

[Knives]

@ Tweek: I heard there were no major "techincal" changes in R4 itself, stuff like adding multi-core support or rewriting the audio engine... so I figure rewire would be the same as well, not a 100% sure though.

@ AS: lol... I looked it up and PT is damn weird. I can't figure out what all the different verisons are for and why they are so picky with midi controllers, OS's and soundcards. It look really nice though, and for 250USD (m-powered) it's kinda tempting to get. I heard some people get Reason and use it solely as the primary synthesizer for their host (cubase, live, pro tools, etc) because it emulates hardware well. Another thing you could do, if you're familiar with synthesis, is to layer a Reason synth over a vsti synth (=O) to get some really wicked results :D

[anosou]

@ AS: lol... I looked it up and PT is damn weird. I can't figure out what all the different verisons are for and why they are so picky with midi controllers, OS's and soundcards. It look really nice though, and for 250USD (m-powered) it's kinda tempting to get. I heard some people get Reason and use it solely as the primary synthesizer for their host (cubase, live, pro tools, etc) because it emulates hardware well. Another thing you could do, if you're familiar with synthesis, is to layer a Reason synth over a vsti synth (=O) to get some really wicked results :D

Reason is a great source of sound in any studio, and that's final :)

[tweek]

I looked it up and PT is damn weird. I can't figure out what all the different verisons are for and why they are so picky with midi controllers, OS's and soundcards. It look really nice though, and for 250USD (m-powered) it's kinda tempting to get.

When I was doing the research for my home studio set up about a year ago, I came into the same problem. PT is very confusing, and they really don't tell you what the differences are. So let me break it down for ya:

Simply put, the version of PT that you use is determined by what kind of outboard hardware you use. For instance:

The TDM and HD systems are the big studio systems. The TDM consists of the really complex didgital mixers. Very expensive. The HD systems use the hardware that will convert a regular analog mix into a mixer that PT can read. Again, very expensive, but the HD system is the most popular in studios that I've found. Base price for an HD system is about $10k. I won't go into detail about what they do, but you can find that info pretty easily.

The LE and M-Powered systems are designed more for the traveling engineer and hobbyist musician. The LE systems run on the Mbox, DigiRack 001 (and 002 I believe), and a couple others. The M-Powered runs on certain M-Audio pieces of hardware (there are a lot, so I'll let you look them up :)). You mentioned being tempted by the M-Powered version. Beware (as I'm sure you know) you have to a have an M-Audio product that is supported by M-Powered. I use the M-Audio ProjectMix I/O.

Hope that helps :).

[anosou]

The LE and M-Powered systems are designed more for the traveling engineer and hobbyist musician. The LE systems run on the Mbox, DigiRack 001 (and 002 I believe), and a couple others. The M-Powered runs on certain M-Audio pieces of hardware (there are a lot, so I'll let you look them up :)). You mentioned being tempted by the M-Powered version. Beware (as I'm sure you know) you have to a have an M-Audio product that is supported by M-Powered. I use the M-Audio ProjectMix I/O.

The LE systems also has a wide variety of systems. We are now up to the digi003 (001 and 002 before that) on both rack and non-rack versions. Mbox 2 comes as Mbox 2, Mbox 2 mini and Mbox 2 Pro. I have an Mbox 2 Pro myself.
M-Audio ProjectMix is probably the best choice for homestudio if you're not that picky about M-Audio. I don't really like M-audio that much and I find that Digidesigns own soundcards and system suits me better and sounds better. But for anyone not as dimwitted as me, ProjectMix is a great addition to any set-up. Remember it can be used as I/O for anything. Ableton Live jumps into my mind. And it has FADERS AND KNOBS! :D

Tweek. I'd like to hear about how you use Reason, Live and PT for your projects since I haven't really started using that setup yet. Also, we should collab sometime. Just for funz :)

[Knives]

Ah, thanks Tweek, that does help a bit. I hope you don't mind answering a few more questions though, I've sent you a PM just so that this thread doesn't get too far off topic and turn into a discussion on Pro Tools rather than R4.

[tweek]

Tweek. I'd like to hear about how you use Reason, Live and PT for your projects since I haven't really started using that setup yet. Also, we should collab sometime. Just for funz :)

When it comes to music, my main tool is Reason. However, I focus a lot of time on Foley/Sound Effects. All sound effects project are done in either Live (majority of the time) or Pro Tools. Whne I'm composing the music, it will be in Reason, but as a slave to the host, so I can see the video playing while I'm composing.

A couple of examples:

Foley Effects only done is Live:
http://www.tweexmusic.com/movies/treasure_planet_foley.mov

Foley and Music done in Live and Reason:
http://www.tweexmusic.com/movies/sam_demo_reel.mov

Also, any stutter effects that I use are created in Live (TEEM.ROKIT mix and REAKTR.1 mix).

Totally up for a collab at some point. Don't be surprised if you hear from me soon ;).

[anosou]

Foley and Music done in Live and Reason:
http://www.tweexmusic.com/movies/sam_demo_reel.mov

Also, any stutter effects that I use are created in Live (TEEM.ROKIT mix and REAKTR.1 mix).

Totally up for a collab at some point. Don't be surprised if you hear from me soon ;).

Very interesting to see what you are up too :) nice demo reel, especially the one with music.
I also find Live to be killer for automation and fxs, that's why I'm coupling Reason with it. PT is great for audio, but I can't start it atm lol.

I'm always up for collab man, even though I may not have a whole lot of time on my hands just now. Still, getting started early is the key to success :) I'll warn you though, I only have Live 5.2 atm. It's not entirely legal but I just haven't had time to upgrade live lite. I'll probably get Live 6 in a matter of weeks.

Thanks for the info :)

[Knives]

I'm going to have to download some demos now! Too bad PT (and Cubase, 'cause I was hoping to check that one out as well) don't have any demo downloads. Good thing is that there is one for Live though, so I'll check it out.

EDIT: wow... Live suuuure has one intuitive GUI... o.o (psst, I don't understand a single thing I'm seeing, this is gonna take a while -_-)

[anosou]

I'm going to have to download some demos now! Too bad PT (and Cubase, 'cause I was hoping to check that one out as well) don't have any demo downloads. Good thing is that there is one for Live though, so I'll check it out.

EDIT: wow... Live suuuure has one intuitive GUI... o.o (psst, I don't understand a single thing I'm seeing, this is gonna take a while -_-)

Live has one of the best GUI's I've seen :D It's a matter of trying

[Knives]

Actually, watching some of the video tutorials, Live is a complete BEAST with it's layout. Though I stand by my original statement, it's still very unituitive. It seems to me like it'd have a longer and steeper learning curve than most programs, but once you finally get the hang of it then it works much more smoothly. Heh, Ableton threw out intuitivity for efficiency and design, that's pretty gutsy... but thankfully they at least added that little helper in the bottom left-hand corner, that's probably the only reason I haven't trashed the demo yet ;P

[anosou]

Actually, watching some of the video tutorials, Live is a complete BEAST with it's layout. Though I stand by my original statement, it's still very unituitive. It seems to me like it'd have a longer and steeper learning curve than most programs, but once you finally get the hang of it then it works much more smoothly. Heh, Ableton threw out intuitivity for efficiency and design, that's pretty gutsy... but thankfully they at least added that little helper in the bottom left-hand corner, that's probably the only reason I haven't trashed the demo yet ;P

Heh, you never tried to learn Logic then XD

[The Pezman]

Even though I'm a computer person (and always have been, as long as I can rememeber) it's very difficult for me to learn complex programs. If there's too much presented to me at once I will get frustrated and unable to focus. Most complex programs share common themes (layering, reusability, etc), but it's very hard to reconcile them into the intricacies of each program. Reason may be the exception (we'll see when 4 comes out), but I don't really think I'll be able to remix until I can sit down with someone at length about it. Hopefully that can happen @ MAGFest.

[anosou]

Even though I'm a computer person (and always have been, as long as I can rememeber) it's very difficult for me to learn complex programs. If there's too much presented to me at once I will get frustrated and unable to focus. Most complex programs share common themes (layering, reusability, etc), but it's very hard to reconcile them into the intricacies of each program. Reason may be the exception (we'll see when 4 comes out), but I don't really think I'll be able to remix until I can sit down with someone at length about it. Hopefully that can happen @ MAGFest.

I'm bringing my macbook and reason, you are more than welcome to sit down with me and check it out ;) I bet avaris is totally up for it too

[The Pezman]

Looking forward to it. I've been looking into it long enough that I understand the base concepts (write in your notes in the piano roll and assign a sound to play them), but it's the more complex stuff which makes it sound good that currently eludes me.


A couple of examples:

Foley Effects only done is Live:
http://www.tweexmusic.com/movies/treasure_planet_foley.mov

Foley and Music done in Live and Reason:
http://www.tweexmusic.com/movies/sam_demo_reel.mov

Are you telling us you did the effect for Treasure Planet? And that you made those graphics for your advertisement?

[tweek]

Are you telling us you did the effect for Treasure Planet? And that you made those graphics for your advertisement?

Treasure Planet was a project for a class.

No, I'm not an animator. That was a demo reel done by someone, but wanted sound behind it. As it says here on the site, my name is not Sam Griffiths...:)

[Knives]

AHH! Reason saved my remix in a non-existant folder! Now I have to do that all over again ;_;

EDIT: Oops, nevermind, it just saved it somewhere I'd never look, but I found it anyway, so disregard the above.

[Knives]

Alright, I have a question about upgrading Reason. I have R3, and I'm hoping to get the R4 upgrade. How does that work? Is the R4 upgrade like a big patch that heavily modifies R3 into R4, or is it like the full R4 but you run it with a R3 license number to prove you've bought the previous version? Or is it like neither? O.o

[anosou]

Alright, I have a question about upgrading Reason. I have R3, and I'm hoping to get the R4 upgrade. How does that work? Is the R4 upgrade like a big patch that heavily modifies R3 into R4, or is it like the full R4 but you run it with a R3 license number to prove you've bought the previous version? Or is it like neither? O.o

It's a new program. It's very much alike but some engine changes makes it a purely new installation. If you buy the upgrade you need to have the serial number (I hope you actually bought R3 :P). That's how I understood it anyway. ;)

[Knives]

Oh good, if I understand what you said correctly, that means I should first uninstall R3 from my computer before I install R4, right? Then I'll just input my R3 (and new R4?) license number(s). That works out just fine.

And no, I didn't buy R3, because I have no money. I asked for it as a christmas present two years ago from my parents, they bought it :D

[anosou]

Oh good, if I understand what you said correctly, that means I should first uninstall R3 from my computer before I install R4, right? Then I'll just input my R3 (and new R4?) license number(s). That works out just fine.

And no, I didn't buy R3, because I have no money. I asked for it as a christmas present two years ago from my parents, they bought it :D

I don't know about uninstalling, maybe the installer will handle that. But if you own a true copy of reason 3 with your own working serial, just buy the Reason 4 upgrade and it will tell you what to do ;)

also, cool parents. Mine did the same last christmas.

[Robotaki]

I don't know about uninstalling, maybe the installer will handle that. But if you own a true copy of reason 3 with your own working serial, just buy the Reason 4 upgrade and it will tell you what to do ;)

also, cool parents. Mine did the same last christmas.

lol, my parents are uncool. damn.

[The Pezman]

That shit's too expensive for the folks.

In other news, RELEASE, DAMN YOU!!

[anosou]

I keep counting hours!! :(((((

[Malcos]

Oh good, if I understand what you said correctly, that means I should first uninstall R3 from my computer before I install R4, right? Then I'll just input my R3 (and new R4?) license number(s). That works out just fine.

And no, I didn't buy R3, because I have no money. I asked for it as a christmas present two years ago from my parents, they bought it :D

If you've registered your copy of Reason 3 on the website, then it will all go smoothly.

You will get a card inside the upgrade box (which is just like a full version but with 'upgrade' on the box instead) which will tell you to log in and enter the details on the card.

The system will then check you are a registered user etc, and then you will be emailed a full R4 license number.

[Knives]

Oh, awesome, thanks for the info Malcos. I was just wondering how it worked, and yea, I'm registered on their site.

[avaris]

Called my guitar center and they have their copies of R4 in!!!

Screw the countdown I'm leaving right now to go pick it up. :mrgreen:

[avaris]

Hehe so much fun! :-P

I don't know about the other beta testers but IMO in the beta I thought the sound quality was better...please no flame wars. So out of curiosity I did a phase inversion test with song a song ripped to 44hz 24bit in 3.0 and 44hz 24bit in 4.0. The phase inversion test failed! I did the revese polarity in FL. They said they rewrote the progam. Def try some phase inversion tests when you get a chance def want some more proof on this.

Oh yeah there is C64 commando remix as one of the DEMO songs by Rob Hubbard! Woot. :nicework:

I have just been listening to the demo songs so far...and they all awesome. The sound quality is awesome and the songs are actually wicked catchy.

There are two Orkester DEMO songs too. All the use is NN-XT patches and 2 reverbs set as sends. Def take a listen to that when you dudes get the upgrade.

Opened up some old R3 songs and CPU usage was the same.

Even though I Beta tested it I never had the chance to really work with it bc I was doing songs on R3. The regroove kicks some serious arse. It's even better than Peff's trick with using DR Rex loops to control volume automation. Both of them used in combination yields some awesome results.

[anosou]

SHAUN YOU BASTARD! XD
I need R4 so bad right now.
also Rob Hubbard! SO HOT! Did HE make the remix or someone else?

cool with orkester demos :O

man, get a laptop and let's jam at magfest, improv remixin damnit!

[Knives]

So hey, are you saying you already have a copy of R4 in hand, avaris? That's pretty awesome, and I heard that they were trying to make R4 more cpu lean than R3 but eh, I wasn't expecting much since R3 already takes so little cpu that it'd be hard to make it use even less cpu, which is why I wanted dual core support over cpu efficiency, But anyway... R4 sounds quite exciting :D

I don't recall them ever saying anything about rewriting the program or audio engine though, so I dunno why the phase inverison test failed... perhaps they did some minor tweaks or something.

And regroove, as useless as I originally thought would be, seems like it would come in handy for a lot of little interesting stuff, like humanizing my drums beats :D

I'm looking foward to getting R4 though, I just gotta see if my parents would be willing to get me my christmas gift a little early this year XD

[avaris]

Bwhahaha....

I find this ironic Anso you live in the same town as the Props headquarters yet I got mine before you got yours. To quote the great OverCoat OOOOOHOHOHOHOHO :V

I'm gonna bring my work labtop with R4 loaded on it to Magfest! There is gonna be lots o' music making. ;)

Rob Hubbard did do the remix! They got tunes from eXode (my fav) JB, Arabian Prince, DJ Babu, Jeremy Ellis, etc... A bunch of the demos use patches made by Peff too...go figure. :tomatoface:

FYI my only complaint is it takes a lil while to pipe external audio through Thor. It took me almost an hour to figure out how to do it. You have use the same midi to trigger both thor and whatever you are using for the external audio. And the in the matrix you have to route the audio input to wherever you want it to enter into Thor signal processing chain. Which is time consuming but also very powerful.

Oh yeah I had an Academic version of 3.0, but I bought a commercial upgrade and everything went just fine. For those with academic versions wondering if they can upgrade.

"Rebuilt from the Ground Up"
http://www.propellerheads.se/products/reason4/index.cfm?fuseaction=get_article&article=main

From a proggraming perspective I couldn't imagine them making something like Regroove without recoding a majority of the program.

[anosou]

wow shaun, magfest is going to be more fun in the hotel room than on the actual magfest O.O

Jeremy Ellis is sweet, looking forward to hearing his demo.
Man, I'm going to props tomorrow to kick their ass :( I need this NOW

the Thor thing is a bit so-so but I remember it being much easier in beta? can't remember how though.. maybe I was so happy I didn't care :D

[V___]

I'm gonna bring my work labtop with R4 loaded on it to Magfest! There is gonna be lots o' music making. ;)



....


So much... hate...


bottled up inside......


.....



:(

[anosou]

V, if you're not coming to magfest I will kill u

[avaris]

V, if you're not coming to magfest I will kill u

I concur!

If you get the chance head over the user forum at the props site. eXode just posted a sound demo using only 5 thors as a supersaw type sound unisoned out the yang! Awesome stuff.

EDIT Here is mp3 demo that lizard from combinatorHQ is goin to be doing. It is emulating the Oberheim synth. All of the synth sounds were Thor. http://www.combinatorhq.comdemos/Thor_OB_Demo.mp3

[Knives]

EDIT Here is mp3 demo that lizard from combinatorHQ is goin to be doing. It is emulating the Oberheim synth. All of the synth sounds were Thor. http://www.combinatorhq.comdemos/Thor_OB_Demo.mp3

LOL! That demo is probably the best synth demo I've ever heard, not particularly because of the sounds, but the execution and song choice made it really amusing and fun to listen to :DDD!

[ILLiterate]

Going out to buy it tomorrow, only work will stop me

[anosou]

Got Reason 4 yesterday :D
I love Thor.
And the Jeremy Ellis-demo.

I NEED TO STOP GOING TO SCHOOL AND START STAYING AT HOME WITH REASON 4.

[djredlight]

http://www.djredlight.com/images/r4.png
doo doo doo doo, chh.. what more reason do you need?

[V___]

V, if you're not coming to magfest I will kill u

I concur!


....

Hate you both

.... so much

*glare*

[anosou]

it's okay V, I might not be able to make it this year after all :(
I hate that money thing..

[tweek]

It's been ordered!!!!

Now I wait.....

[ILLiterate]

http://www.djredlight.com/images/r4.png
doo doo doo doo, chh.. what more reason do you need?
I love that demo song :D

[Knives]

I was going to make some breakfast while the trailer for R4 was loading when I visited the props site this morning, but when I came back it was already finished... and now I can't watch it ;_;

Oh, and does anybody know whether I need to uninstall R3 to install the R4 demo? I'm getting the R4 upgrade next week but I wanna get a head start with familiarizing myself with the new sequencer and thor.

And on a closing note, listen to the props, quoted from their site: "Propellerhead Software strongly advice all new users to take care that no domestic animal hungry for plastic cards is waiting to jump you while opening the Reason packaging."

EDIT: Poor props... they released the R4 demo on their site today and now hundreds of people are downloading it. I'm only getting like 10 kbs from their site, it's gonna take two hours to download this thing, lol.

[avaris]

You'll def have to unistall R3. During the beta you had to uninstall R3 and when I installed R4 over the weekend I had to uninstall R3.

[Knives]

But... that's no fair, it's just a demo... it's not like the full verison or the beta =/ I'll try to install it without uninstalling R3 anyway, just to see if I get any problems.

[V___]

Huh? I had R3 and R4 beta installed on the same machine....

[Knives]

Agh, in pain... so much pain. I've been downloading the demo for 4 freakin hours and then it just stalls and stops at 93%, and doesn't move or do anything, just stuck at 93%, so I had to restart it, and I'm gonna have to wait another 4 or something hours ;(

Somebody should seriously set up a torrent mirror for this thing.

EDIT: oh good, I think I found a torrent on it, now this should only take about an hour.

[DJ SymBiotiX]

so I went to my local music store and they had the full version but not the demo version :(. I gotta order that from the props themselves. Now I have to wait a few days :P

[Knives]

HOLY COW! According to my testing it seems like Reason 4 actually uses both of my cores... at least the demo does... this is incredible, they may have actually added multi-core support, though I'm not a hundred percent sure though, cause I just can't believe my eyes, I didn't think they'd actually listen... or whether I'm hallucinating. Though a backdrop is that thor and the new sequencer seem to be a bit more taxing on the cpu in general, it's still great stuff.

Oh and yea, V was right, you can have R3 and the R4 demo on the same machine at the same time, no problems at all.

EDIT: the new sequencer is really growing on me, is there anyway to completely hide the automation clips and velocity edit section or... can those only be minimized?

[anosou]

Knives, I'm pretty sure Reason puts the graphics at one core and the rest on the other, so no true multi-core. Still better than nothing ;)

[Knives]

Oh yea, checking with the demo songs is a bad idea since they aren't that CPU heavy. Well, using a modified version of malcos' deefgroove.rns I made a cputest.rns to use, rebooted my computer in safe mode and here's how my test went:

R3 CPU usage:
CPU1: 40-50%
CPU2: 0-5%

R4 CPU usage:
CPU1: 30-40% (-10% from R3)
CPU2: 5-20% (+15% from R3)

These are rough estimates but in total R4 seems to use a little more CPU, though at least it spreads it apart a bit by separating the graphics and audio processing. It's sort of like a really minor dual core support but hey, like you said, at least it's something.

[Knives]

Questions:

Is the R4 factory and orkestor sound bank the same as R3's but expanded to 2 gigs with new patches and samples? Or does it come with completely new content?

I have a yamaha psr-240 and a psr-270, both +6 years old and probably not even manufactured anymore, but I wanna use them as midi controllers for R4 as soon as a get it as well as a couple of midi-to-usb cables. Everything should work out fine, right? The keyboards being very old shouldn't cause any kind of compatibility issue with R4, the cables or my fairly new laptop?

EDIT 2: I looked on the props site and it says you can set up any kind of basic midi keyboard to control Reason, so I figure my PSRs should work as long as I get the cables. OS and my computer are irrelevant information then I guess.

EDIT: Is there anyway to use Thor's awesome delay, chorus and filters for stuff outside of Thor? Perhaps using some kind of routing/wiring that I'm not aware of?

[avaris]

Yeah you can route audio from other sources and use anyway you feel like it. You have to use the mod matrix on thor to route the audio where you want it. You can route it in almost anywhere. You can also use external audio in to as frequency modulators for Thor's oscillators.

To run audio through Thor you also need some type of midi signal being sent to thor at the same time the audio is coming through. Stupid? YES. But then again it prob boiled down to some crazy thing with the programming.

IMO the best way to do it without sacrificing the step sequencer in thor is to have the same midi being sent to thor and whatever device you are using for external audio at the same time. Make sure under 'trigger' you have the midi box selected if you choose to use Thor as an FX device. If you want to use Thor's OSC in combo with external audio right now this is the only way I know how to do it.

If you don't care about using Thor's step sequencer as a modulation source and just wanna run other audio through it here is a combi as an example. Make sure the sequencer on Thor is running for it to work.

http://avaris.studios.googlepages.com/GlockenThor.cmb

[Knives]

whoa... intense! Thank avaris, but as for not sacrificing the step sequencer in Thor, how do I send the same midi data to my external audio device and Thor at the same time without having to use two sequencer tracks? I thought whatever midi you send to the combinator it simultaneously sends to all the devices within itself... but when I try making a patch with my external audio device, Thor (with the step seq. turned off and the midi box turned on), spider audio, and a mixer, it doesn't work =/

[tweek]

Do any of you with R4 know if Rewire with Live and other DAWs is working properly?

[anosou]

Do any of you with R4 know if Rewire with Live and other DAWs is working properly?

I know your set-up is a bit rewire-intense. But I haven't hear ANYTHING that says it's any change from before. The only thing I've thought of is that you can't sync Reason and Live and do timesig changes in Reason. meh, a small price to pay.
visit the official propellerheads forum and ask :) (you have registered your copy... riiight?)

[tweek]

I have a registered copy of 4, but still waiting for it to be shipped here :).

I think it's supposed to be here today!!!!!!!!

[anosou]

I have a registered copy of 4, but still waiting for it to be shipped here :).

I think it's supposed to be here today!!!!!!!!

AH!! You're going to be so happy :D
I found a thor preset and started making a new remix in a matte rof minutes. Using timesig automation and all! THIS my friends, is a two-hours first-time-R4-wip:
http://soundscape.escariot.net/private_files/CrashFunkWIP.mp3

[Knives]

I HAVE IT! R4 IS IN MY HANDS RIGHT NOW! But man, going and checking out the stuff at Guitar Center was so much cooler than actually getting R4, I got to play with turntables, huge mixer tables, midi controllers and other neat hardware gear. I've never really done this before, so my first experience can be summed up as: IT WAS AWESOME. I would have probably left that store with thousands of dollars worth of equipment if I had any money. I've become a sucker for tangible knobs, faders and hardware devices ;P

EDIT: Woo, my midi-2-usb cables should arrive soon too, this is gonna be great :D

And also, the two orkester demos in R4 are the same ones they used in R3, they aren't new :/

[Vesh]

I hope I'm missing something simple here. I know there's an edit for the [qwerty] keyboard mapping for most of the play control stuff (right-click is my god), but is there a way to edit the shortcuts for the edit tools as well?

(And if not... "Dear Prop, go learn UI platform schemes from Luxology.")

[Dafydd]

Can someone tell me what the deal is with this stupid new sequencer? Why do you have to use clips? Can you turn them off somehow and get everything back to normal? I really don't see the point in having to select and open up a clip in order to edit its contents, or being unable to copy a few notes from a longer clip into somewhere else without either splitting the clip or selecting and opening and then copying the notes you wanted... seriously, the sequencer is so much more complicated and difficult to use now. Why did they change it? I'm guessing it has to have benefits or else they wouldn't have changed it, but all I see is the downsides...

[Knives]

Dafydd, that's what I thought at first and was somewhat disappointed as well, but working with it a bit more, I dunno, it just grew on me and with the addition of the keyboard shortcuts to cycle through tools (cursor, pen, eraser) I've noticed I've been sequencing stuff much faster. Just give it some more time and make a short silly song or two to experiment with it, I think you can learn to like it like I did.

[Dafydd]

Yeah, I thought so too - I'll probably get used to it in a while. I just don't see the point.

[Malcos]

Can someone tell me what the deal is with this stupid new sequencer? Why do you have to use clips? Can you turn them off somehow and get everything back to normal? I really don't see the point in having to select and open up a clip in order to edit its contents, or being unable to copy a few notes from a longer clip into somewhere else without either splitting the clip or selecting and opening and then copying the notes you wanted... seriously, the sequencer is so much more complicated and difficult to use now. Why did they change it? I'm guessing it has to have benefits or else they wouldn't have changed it, but all I see is the downsides...

Ohhhh, I haven't got Reason 4 yet (I'll wait till Christmas or new year), but I always group everything I play and then double click to open the piano roll if I want to copy notes. I guess I wouldn't have to change my personal style for the new sequencer then...?

Have they added any new samples or is it just only Thor that has new sounds? Is the new quantisation method more difficult to use, now they've moved it somewhere else completely?

[Knives]

They've added thor and regroove patches to the factory soundbank. I believe that they also added some random patches here and there, like some for the NN-XT and some for combinator and etc. I think the orkestor soundbank may be exactly as it was in R3, but I'm not sure (porbably is though).

The hovering toolbox thing is pretty neat, I don't think the quantization is anymore difficult now, it's just in a different place sort of. They put a lot of good shortcuts and stuff into the toolbox though, I'd say it only makes things a bit faster, easier and more organized, just like adding the shortcuts on the keyboard to switch between tools (pen, eraser, razor, etc.) helps speed things up quite a bit.

[Sir_NutS]

got R4 today, will test later.

[anosou]

got R4 today, will test later.

TEST NAOW!!!

[Flik]

Bah! I'm still on 2.5. Software is expensive!

[Knives]

I think the upgrade from 2.5 to 4 costs the same as from 3 to 4... but I'm not suuuure. And you can always ask for R4 for christmas :D

[Sir_NutS]

ok, here are some initial impressions:

I installed R4 yesterday and tried it the whole night and part of this morning.

The sequencer: This will get a LOT of time for me to get used to it. My mixing takes a lot of note-writing and the way it is now it's kinda more complicated to do so. Recording notes from my keyboard will take some used to as well. however I like the changes on the way you handle groups and stuff. At last I can name groups and organize them, and also have different lanes for each automation which is pretty neat. However the automation itself is giving me a hard time to get used to the new system, I've always liked more the curves.

Also I would like to see a "close all" button to close/open all lanes in the sequencer (maybe there is one and I haven't seen it yet). The good news is that the tool window makes life SO MUCH EASIER. Randomizing velocities, note lenght and adjusting them has become so much easier and intuitive, I can't really go back to the old ways now.

One thing I do miss is the ability to stretch a note without the snap by pressing shift while I drag them. Seems like that option is gone and I have to click/unclick the magnet every time. bummer.

Thor: Oh sweet jesus. This is a monster of a machine. It will take me A LOT of time just to learn the way it routes the sound through the envelopes/filters etc. but this is one hell of a machine that was much needed. There are a TON of presets, so many that i don't feel the urge to make my own synths, unlike when i first used subtractor! (But I'll still make my own sounds anyways, I'm stubborn like that). The modulation matrix helps keeps the rack clean of mad cv routing and it's pretty flexible.

Whereas Maelstrom was good for certain kind of sounds and subtractor for others, Thor can do practically ANYTHING, and do it right. I still love my subtractor but i think I will start seeing it less in my mixes XD.

The Arpeggiator: Pretty nifty tool. It wasn't as intuitive as i thought it would be but it gets the job done. I didn't mess around much with it but from what I heard in the demos it can be a very cool tool.

ReGroove Another cool thing that at first got me totally lost. This can really give the songs (and specially drums) a very human feeling. No more relying on global shuffle =).

Overall it looks a bit cleaner and with more emphasis on organization and productivity. I will still have to struggle with the new sequencer and there are some things that I really miss(specially some shorcuts) but overall the changes are great and really needed (TEMPO AUTOMATION AT LAST!)

Expect some Thor patches on my next refill :p

[anosou]

Super-Saw sense, tingling!

Be sure to drop by PHeads feature request forum to tell them what you didn't like. especially the shortcut things could be fixed in the next minor update.

and yes, Thor is sex. So much sex it's insane.

[siznas]

sorry to bring this topic back up but god the sequencer for R4 changed in a crappy way!

I mean yeah some things like the effects lanes and stuff are niffty but like the other dude said, GOD i'm pissed off at how u have to "join clips" or extend them in ways that don't make any sense! Why didn't they just keep the same functionning!

Anyone heard of some possible paramater changes that might help?

[anosou]

sorry to bring this topic back up but god the sequencer for R4 changed in a crappy way!

I mean yeah some things like the effects lanes and stuff are niffty but like the other dude said, GOD i'm pissed off at how u have to "join clips" or extend them in ways that don't make any sense! Why didn't they just keep the same functionning!

Anyone heard of some possible paramater changes that might help?

It's a matter of getting used to it, also I don't sequence a lot I mostly record so for me it isn't a problem.
Anyway in the Reason 4.0.1 beta there's some improvements to clip-handling, amongst other it's easier to get in to the clips.
I'll keep you posted on other changes.

[siznas]

as fast as this may seem im actually getting the hang of this thing i hated so much a few hours ago

I've just finished something i could've created with reason 3.0, so i guess im happy =P

still have some issues with it but i think ill get through this lol

[Knives]

Lol, this is EXACTLY what I explained to the previous guy who came in here complaining about the sequencer, it really just takes a short while to get use to it, even I at first was somewhat pissed with it. Anyway, I hope this is a lesson learned: listen to Knives :D

[Sir_NutS]

After I stated in my quick preview, The sequencer would take me some time to get used to it, and it did, but right now I can say that I never want to look back at the old sequencer. This one is MUCH improved and when you figure how things work, you actually do things easier and better. The old way of managing groups was a mess and now that I have this I can clearly see that, same with automation clips. Also the ability to record several lanes of melodies under the same sequencer track with the click of a button is a godsend, specially if you have a keyboard.

In the end I can now clearly see the improvements and although it's not as intuitive as, say, fruity loops' sequencer, right now is just as powerful and flexible, if not more.

[siznas]

Lol, this is EXACTLY what I explained to the previous guy who came in here complaining about the sequencer, it really just takes a short while to get use to it, even I at first was somewhat pissed with it. Anyway, I hope this is a lesson learned: listen to Knives :D

you may be right but,
It's still very much a bitch when i load a song from 3.0 to 4 because everything feels and looks so different in the sequencer =0

very uncomfortable