Silent Hill Discussion

[Firedrake]

That's nice, dear.

[TheDaysOfNetTong]

yeah silent hill 2 was scary as hell, but 3 kind of sucked, i mean they KILLED HARRY! how can they do that?, but it was a good suprise

[ifirit]

Well, it's been a while, but I thought I'd bring you guys a...

Silent Hill Movie Update:
Well, according to the staff at Silent Hill Heaven (http://www.silenthillheaven.com), an interview with Akira Yamaoka has confirmed that production of the Silent Hill movie is underway. Yamaoka-san has stated that he will be one of the producers representing Konami on this project, so quality control will be maintained. In addition to this, Akira Yamaoka will also be composing and scoring his own music for the movie.

Many of you are probably aware of these details already, but here are the really interesting parts. Davis Films (the production company in charge of bringing the Silent Hill movie to life) has constructed a set in the Australian countryside. The set covers a distance of 5km. According to rumors, this set is a reconstruction of Old Silent Hill from the first game, of which the most prominent building in construction is a large "church" at the set's center. It is hard to say if the details are completely correct, since a barracade has been constructed around the set, allowing access to the site only by helicopter. It seems Konami is trying to keep as much secret about the film as possible.

As opposed to the intial rumors that the Silent Hill movie was going to be a CG animated film like Final Fantasy, it seems that the film will be live action due to the construction of the large set.

Silent Hill 4 Update:
With the North American release of Silent Hill 4 fast approaching, and the PAL release only 3 weeks away, Konami has decided to release a special Robbie package (http://www.konamistyle.com/customfactory/sh4t/) for Japanese gamers. (Go figure.)

This package will include a copy of the special CD containing "Robbie's Tracks" and a special Robbie T-shirt (one for men or one for women). The T-shirt is the same as the album cover, which is the British flag with pink and purple colors with Robbie standing in front.

I'm interested in what exactly comes on the CD, but I don't read Japanese and few websites have details about the offer in any other languages. If anyone can offer any additional information, it would be greatly appreciated.

[Sentora]

*Almost feels stupid for asking this, but hey it bumps the Topic*

SPOILERS AHEAD
----------------------------------------------------
Playing through SH3 recently made me wonder about two things.

One: In the alternate version of Office building, that part you go through before arriving home. In the room you enter after burning the painting and going through the hatch...why does it feel like I've seen that cross like painting/image that's on the wall beside the burnt hanging woman somewhere else? It looks like a bunch of smaller pictures making up a symbol or decpiction of something but I can't remember what...anyone have an idea or am I tripping?

Two: In the ride to Silent Hill with Douglass...he comments about a missing persons case that brought him there, (Amanda perhaps?) also that in his field of work he heard bad rumors of that place and said himself it's a screwed up town. (Which he's seemingly got out of unscathed...)

so that makes me wonder, is there others not only aware of what's going on in silent hill, but have their own motives toward it? It seems with parts four and now five, we're getting further away from the town itself but it's influence is spreading outward, so do you think there are others like Claudia and her cult or even servants of the 'old gods of silent hill'?

Just a thought. Like to know what you guys think.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

I reccently just picked up on the series and thought it'd be fun to revive this thread because of it.

In this rathole know as Johnstown, there is only an EB store here and it didn't have either SH 1 or 2, so I had to go to a Gamestop in Monroville (place near Pittsburgh) Mall to pick up used copies of both games.

Right now, I'm playing through SH1... and I don't think I was supposed to kill Cybil like I did... Once I got to the Resort Aera, I got lazy and went straight for the Lighthouse. Looks like I'm gonna have to play through again since I'm in "Nowhere". Has anyone had this the first time they've played through?

[StarZander]

I reccently just picked up on the series and thought it'd be fun to revive this thread because of it.

In this rathole know as Johnstown, there is only an EB store here and it didn't have either SH 1 or 2, so I had to go to a Gamestop in Monroville (place near Pittsburgh) Mall to pick up used copies of both games.

Right now, I'm playing through SH1... and I don't think I was supposed to kill Cybil like I did... Once I got to the Resort Aera, I got lazy and went straight for the Lighthouse. Looks like I'm gonna have to play through again since I'm in "Nowhere". Has anyone had this the first time they've played through?

Yeah, I killed Cybil the first time aswell, but then I had no idea I could save her. :P But yeah, since there are 5 endings in SH1, you should try to get them all :P

[M@]

Speaking of the original Silent Hill, this guy here (http://www.silentscape.tk/) has made a user-friendly GUI for emulation of the game. Essentially it's ePSXe optimised for the SH ROM (which is included in the 400MB torrent), but I found it a most refreshing alternative to playing the game on the PSX, simply because it looks, and plays, much better when emulated on a PC. Mind, you need at least 'mid-level' specs. to play with most of the good graphical options turned on or maximised.

For anyone questioning the legality of my own actions in this instance, I have the original game, and as such believe I am entitled to a backup. M@ does not encourage illegal emulation. However, should you mods wish to edit this post, it's cool with me :wink:.

I also had a picture of a signpost reading 'Bachman Ave.' which I'd share if photo bucket were not going retarded on me. Clearly this continuity error ruined my gaming experience and I was quick to pen a harshly-worded letter to Konami enquiring as to how many of their clearly sub-par employees were fired for such a catastrophic blunder. Has anyone else noticed any such errors they wish to share? One nice touch of emulating the game is that screenshots can easily be taken, which obviously aids discussion for a game such as this.

[ifirit]

One: In the alternate version of Office building, that part you go through before arriving home. In the room you enter after burning the painting and going through the hatch...why does it feel like I've seen that cross like painting/image that's on the wall beside the burnt hanging woman somewhere else? It looks like a bunch of smaller pictures making up a symbol or decpiction of something but I can't remember what...anyone have an idea or am I tripping?

No, you're not misguided. The paintings in the Art Gallery of the Hilltop Center Offices are actual paintings of an artist that the developers felt inspired the motif of SH3. Unfortunately, the artist and the painting titles escape me, right now. When I can remember the artist and find screens of the paintings (both from the game and from real life), I will post them and add them to my collection of outside influences in Silent Hill.

Two: In the ride to Silent Hill with Douglass...he comments about a missing persons case that brought him there, (Amanda perhaps?) also that in his field of work he heard bad rumors of that place and said himself it's a screwed up town. (Which he's seemingly got out of unscathed...)

So, that makes me wonder; are there others not only aware of what's going on in silent hill, but have their own motives toward it? It seems with parts four and now five, we're getting further away from the town itself but it's influence is spreading outward, so do you think there are others like Claudia and her cult or even servants of the 'old gods of silent hill'?

**SH1 & SH3 Spoilers Ahead**
According to the "Lost Memories," the town of Silent Hill is not completely shut-off from the world. Like James, Angela and Eddie, outsiders of Silent Hill have been drawn in by the negative emotions in their hearts. Since the "Lost Memories" also claims that SH2 occurs two years before SH3, it is possible that Douglas could have come to Silent Hill roughly about the same time as James and the others, which means that the effects of the "old gods" has already taken over the town. However, whom he was searching for and the exact time of the search is unknown. (In case you are thinking that Douglas is searching for one of the characters in SH2.) We can however discern that Douglas is aware of the effects that that town has had since it became a ghost town.

As to the reprocussions created by SH4 are yet to be seen, but it is likely that the town is not simply the delusions created by the minds of those with negative emotions in their hearts (or is it? You decide for yourself.) It is possible that other people can see the monsters and have experienced the Alternate World. Well, it's very possible since Douglas also comments on it to Heather in the Amusement Park ("If this is what a god of mercy is like, I don't want to see anymore of him.")

Again unfortunately, this becomes a trivial topic when discussing the topic of Douglas' first visit to Silent Hill, and since his voice actor has passed away, it is very unlikely to ever hear from him again. (R.I.P. Richard Grosse)

There are a variety of tedious questions that I've accumulated over a long period of time. But, if you're interested, let me know.

Right now, I'm playing through SH1... and I don't think I was supposed to kill Cybil like I did... Once I got to the Resort Aera, I got lazy and went straight for the Lighthouse. Looks like I'm gonna have to play through again since I'm in "Nowhere". Has anyone had this the first time they've played through?

Don't worry, not completing everything right the first time through doesn't really hurt your gaming experience in SH1, because as SZ said, there are five different endings in the game: Bad, Bad+, Good, Good+ and UFO endings. And in addition, in order to unlock some secret weapons, you need to get at least one good ending and one bad ending, so you'll have to use the Next Fear game to obtain all the secret stuff.

Needs help finding the the paintings from SH1.

In case you still are looking for a screenshot of the "Light Illuminating Darkness" (http://www.nurserycryme.net/sh1/Script/file/file.htm) painting in SH3, I found a screenshot of the entire smokey room (http://axdx.hp.infoseek.co.jp/sh/kdt.jpg). Apparently, if you use the Trainer Maker (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=2599) with the PC version of SH3, you can use it to walk through walls and camera hack the game. A few screenshots of different areas in the game can be found here (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=12448).

[Sentora]

Thanks as always for answering my questions,ifirit. And yeah, I'm interested in those tedious questions, since I'll probably see a lot of my own on there lol.
Good luck finding the artist.

Richard Grosse died? 8O damn that's a shame...I was really hoping to run into ol' Douglas again in future Silent hills. Now thinking about him seeing the monsters, The story of his past, that trip to silent hill and the situation with his estranged son now sounds like perfect fodder for an installment all of it's own if the Town could affect him. Makes me wonder if he saw the same monsters or something else...*sighs*

Thanks again ^_^

[Stan Tuna]

I got the SH4 demo. It's funny.

Not really.

But I like beating on the worm.

[ifirit]

I got the SH4 demo. It's funny.

Not really.

But I like beating on the worm.
Here. Try writing your text like this. It helps us know where your Silent Hill 4 spoilers are. With the worldwide releases coming soon, it's best to not spoil the goodies for those wanting to have a clean experience their first time through.

Speaking of spoilers, have you seen the unlockable costumes for Eileen and Cynthia. :cat's meow:

Thanks as always for answering my questions,ifirit. And yeah, I'm interested in those tedious questions, since I'll probably see a lot of my own on there lol.

Well, I figure now as good a time as any to post these. Since these are rhetorical and tedious questions, only respond to those you feel strike a chord with you. Otherwise, this can get really ugly, really quick. If anyone else feels compelled to comment, have fun.

**Spoiler Warning**

Heather Morris
1.) Heather comments on quitting smoking, though she is only 17 years old (before her awakening). If she started at such a young age, what pressured her to start? What convinced her to quit?
2.) In the beginning of the game, Heather wakes up in the Happy Burger. Is it possible that she worked there?
3.) Does Heather have friends? Though she did move around a lot to avoid some threating people, would she still have friends (as the song Letter from Lost Days suggests)?
4.) The story only shows Heather through an extreme situation, which she cracks under and has several mental break-downs. Was her character over-simplified, un-expressive, or just underdeveloped in the game? Being that she was both Cheryl and Alessa at one point, should we have seen many more memories and internal dialogue from that time period?
5.) Does Heather go to school? Is she a drop-out or is she homeschooled? If she was homeschooled, how deep was her relationship with Harry then? Is she too much of a "Daddy's girl?"
6.) What does she do after the game is over? Does she go home and sulk in the past? Does she move on with her life and try to build a new one elsewhere? Does she build on her relationship with Douglas?

Harry Mason
1.) Harry was a writer, but it is presumed he was a freelance writer, which doesn't make much money. Did he moonlight on the side?
2.) Seeing as how Harry's relationships were compremised after his murdering of the "occult freak," did he still have friends or other personal relationships? Who was the "freak" and what was the motive behind the shooting?
3.) How was Heather effected by the whole incident?
4.) Thinking about geography some, did Harry live in Portland, Oregon or Portland, Maine? Where is the game taking place during the first half (Central Square Shopping Center, Hilltop Offices, ect.)?

Douglas Cartland
1.) Douglas says that he knew how his son died, but was he actually present at the shooting?
2.) Douglas' voice is very raspy, which suggests years of smoking. Was he another smoker as well? Considering his profession and all that he has gone through, would he be a drinker as well?
3.)Considering that Douglas had been to Silent Hill before, what exactly did he see? (Everything is different for each person, so I wonder how much he saw.) What were the details of his missing-persons case?
4.) Douglas says that he's killed someone before. He says it in a very tense tone of voice, suggesting that it was both disjointing and very personal. Who would he have killed to cause these feelings? His son?
5.) During his encounter with Claudia, she was able to stop Douglas and cause him injury. How was she able to do so? She had no gun and avoided direct physical confrontation when unprovoked.
6.) In the Possessed Ending, Heather kills Douglas. Why would she do so? If she was possessed, what would her possesser gain by killing Douglas?

Vincent
1.) What is his last name?
2.) Vincent speaks of having the "power of money." Though it is possible to extort a good sum of money from his followers, it would not be enough to build a church. Is Vincent a wealthy professional, or does he come from "old-money?"
3.) Though Vincent is referred to as "Father," where is his rank within the church? Is he a subordinate of Claudia's, her superior, or simply her equal?
4.) Vincent's age is said to be in his mid-twenties, while Claudia's is in her thirties. With reference to Leonard's cruelty, was he there during her childhood or did he somehow have visions that connected Claudia and him together?
5.) Why is Vincent trying to prevent "god's" birth? What is his reasoning behind this? What are his beliefs on the matter of "god" and "paradise?"

[Weiss-Engel]

I can't believe I read the WHOLE THING. 8O Took me all day and I'll probably have nightmares once I go to bed when my husband gets home from work at 7 AM (it's 4 AM now), especially since I was taking little breaks from reading by watching the cutscenes for all 3 games on that site posted on, like, page 3 or so; but I really feel like I know a whole lot more about the games. I've watched my husband play most of 2 (he's beaten it a few times) and some of 3 (never could get past one part in the game, but I can't remember what it was), and I'm TRYING to play 2, but I'm too chicken to get any farther than PyramidHead's first appearance :lol: . I'm glad to see that it seems Akira Yamaoka is going to have a hand in the movie...maybe it won't suck like most game-to-movie productions do.

My interesting thing that I discovered by going through the cutscenes and getting curious about the voice talent: the voice actress for Angela in SH2 (Donna Burke) is the same person who did Claudia in SH3, merely covering her voice with an accent for Claudia.

Also: my result for the quiz posted earlier.

http://images.quizilla.com/T/tyles/1086913081_esultslisa.jpg

[Orithil]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v378/Orithil/1086861801_ltsclaudia.jpg

'Nuff said.

[Night10194]

You know what...? I have a crazy, crazy, probably unfounded theory about Henry of SH4, and that little radio broadcast in the trailer.

SH 4 Speculation! Refers to trailer! May be thought of as Spoiler! Warning!



















Okay, that's over, now. I think the wounded woman, the one who died outside the town of South Ashfield...think that might be...Angela? We never see her die. She just runs up the burning stairs. And since she was found with 'murder' victims, Eddy may've been nearby, before hand, possibly. Since she was found near said bodies, and the hotel WAS near the lake, etc. Why do I think this? Because, I honestly think Henry may be Angela's brother, etc. He...looks a bit like her. Perhaps I'm speculating wildly, but that's a favored hobby of us SH fans, eh?

[Night10194]

You know what else is a bit irritating, though? I came back to checking this topic just in time for all the delightful soundtrack and music links to change or go down. I'm stuck streaming the trailor to hear that delightfully creepy, sad lullaby song. If anyone has a link to it...

[Stan Tuna]

I got the SH4 demo. It's funny.

Not really.

But I like beating on the worm.
Here. Try writing your text like this. It helps us know where your Silent Hill 4 spoilers are. With the worldwide releases coming soon, it's best to not spoil the goodies for those wanting to have a clean experience their first time through.

Speaking of spoilers, have you seen the unlockable costumes for Eileen and Cynthia. :cat's meow:


...there were absolutely no spoilers in that post.

There was absolutely no INFORMATION in that post.

But yeah.

[Night10194]

Hey, is it true that there're only 4 or so days until SH4 comes out?

[StarZander]

Hey, is it true that there're only 4 or so days until SH4 comes out?

'Tis true!

[I-n-j-i-n]

Wow... from reading the SH4 reviews from a few sites already, it seems like the game will suck.. or atleast be the weakest SH game yet.

Oh well. Cheap scares? I'm there anyway.... That and escorting idiotic NPCs has been done already in SH2... except I need to do that a lot more apparently.

[ifirit]

Hey, is it true that there're only 4 or so days until SH4 comes out?

Actually, that is incorrect. So I feel that I must give out yet another...

Silent Hill 4 Update:
Silent Hill 4: The Room will be released in the US TODAY. So, go to the store NOW and get your copy. Especially, the Special Edition Version with the special US only soundtrack bundle.

For those people in the PAL section of the world (primarily Europe), fear not for you will also receive a special goodie with your purchase of the game. Piggyback, the most prominant game guide company in Europe, has just signed a deal with Konami to bundle a strategy guide with the PAL version of SH4. They are know for having high quality materials, so it should be a nice guide, to say the least. You can read (http://www.authorisedcollection.com/en/) more about it on the front page of their website. [/UPDATE]


As to whether or not the game is very good, I can't say yet. (My copy of the game ships today.) But, I like to trust the opinions of the people on the Silent Hill forums over those who write reviews on the game retailer websites, as I feel that they have a better understanding of the developers' views and intentions. I suggest going over to the Silent Hill Forum (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk) and checking out the Silent Hill 4 (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=11) forum (Spoiler-Free, of course). For those already into the mood to discuss SH4, you can check out the Alternate Silent Hill 4 (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=95) forum.

In addition to this, I thought I'd also give you a...

Silent Hill Movie Update:
Inadvertantly, Roger Avary has given away that he will be screenwriting the script to the Silent Hill Movie. He has apparently met with Samuel Hadida, producer of the Silent Hill movie, to discuss casting, crew and timing of the film. You can read what he posted in his online journal about the matter here (http://www.avary.com/rogeravary/journal/journal.php). Roger Avary has worked as a screenwriter for Pulp Fiction (http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0110912/) and as director on the following films: Killing Zoe (http://www.avary.com/killingzoe/killingzoe.html), The Rules of Attraction (http://www.therulesofattraction.com/) and Glitterati (http://www.therulesofattraction.com/). He has also worked on the television series "Mr. Stitch (http://www.avary.com/mrstitch/mrstitch.html)."

Though, I'm not exactly sure what the details of where the film production is along in the process, it seems to me that it is still in it's early stages. It will be interesting to see who they cast in this film. [/UPDATE]








Say, has anyone figured out what it says on www.sh2004.com?

[StarZander]

ifirit, get on MSN, right now! Please.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

well then, thanks for telling me about the 5 endings in SH1... but since I had the second SH game already I decided to take it up and start it.

I was thinking about talking about what i was going through at the current moment, but i think i'll just play through first before i bring anything up about my exprience. sort of a waste of time, sorry.

in other news tho, when was SH4 supposed to come out? sometime this month right? and is it just me or did the combat in SH2 take a drop compared to SH1?

[BocoDragon]

I've been going through a great deal of stress recently since even though I preordered SH4 early with the intention of getting the Yamaoka soundtrack, and the EB Games computer says I am eligeable for the soundtrack, the guy who works there stressed that no preorder item is confirmed necessarily.

Okay, a fair disclaimer that I might not get it..... But I went back, and a different EB Games guy stressed once again that NO PREORDER ITEM IS CONFIRMED. I MIGHT NOT GET IT. It's kinda creepin me out.... I really want that soundtrack. Aren't they supposed to give it to when WHEN you preorder? Will it ship with the game, or am I SOL? Argh. SH4's already putting me through grueling horror!

Here's a topic of discussion: SH4, PS2 or Xbox version?

Personally I am getting the PS2 version since it's my preferred console and controller, and because then the entire series is on one system (impossible with the SH3-less Xbox).

Surely the Xbox graphics will probably be (ever so slightly) better, and it will probably support in-game Dolby Digital while the PS2 version probably won't. But alas, I don't give a crap. They're probably perfectly identical in most respects anyway. Which version for you?

[Global-Trance]

Dude. If you don't get it, I'll give you (and anyone else that wants it) any Silent Hill 4 soundtrack. I have "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST", "Silent Hill 4 The Room: Inescapable Rain in Yoshiwara -Special Chapter-", and the USA version of "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST".

[BocoDragon]

Dude. If you don't get it, I'll give you (and anyone else that wants it) any Silent Hill 4 soundtrack. I have "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST", "Silent Hill 4 The Room: Inescapable Rain in Yoshiwara -Special Chapter-", and the USA version of "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST".

....Beautiful... :puppyeyes:

[StarZander]

Dude. If you don't get it, I'll give you (and anyone else that wants it) any Silent Hill 4 soundtrack. I have "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST", "Silent Hill 4 The Room: Inescapable Rain in Yoshiwara -Special Chapter-", and the USA version of "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST".

I suppose you only mean the mp3's then?

[Global-Trance]

Yea, I'm not a CD distributor.

[ifirit]

I've been going through a great deal of stress recently since even though I preordered SH4 early with the intention of getting the Yamaoka soundtrack, and the EB Games computer says I am eligeable for the soundtrack, the guy who works there stressed that no preorder item is confirmed necessarily.

Okay, a fair disclaimer that I might not get it..... But I went back, and a different EB Games guy stressed once again that NO PREORDER ITEM IS CONFIRMED. I MIGHT NOT GET IT. It's kinda creepin me out.... I really want that soundtrack. Aren't they supposed to give it to when WHEN you preorder? Will it ship with the game, or am I SOL? Argh. SH4's already putting me through grueling horror!

Here's a topic of discussion: SH4, PS2 or Xbox version?

Personally I am getting the PS2 version since it's my preferred console and controller, and because then the entire series is on one system (impossible with the SH3-less Xbox).

Surely the Xbox graphics will probably be (ever so slightly) better, and it will probably support in-game Dolby Digital while the PS2 version probably won't. But alas, I don't give a crap. They're probably perfectly identical in most respects anyway. Which version for you?

Well, you're right. Apparently, EBGames has had an overload of pre-orders coming in since it announced that the soundtrack would be coming with the game. So, I guess as a policy, they don't lock pre-orders. So, as far as I know, they just ship them as they recieve the go-ahead. Though, it is not guaranteed that you will recieve a soundtrack, if you ordered early, you'll probably get one. This will only affect those who pre-ordered a little late. (In case you still unclear about what the offer is; EBGames will ship a copy of the SH4 Soundtrack with your pre-order of SH4: The Room, IF supplies last.)

After visiting the Silent Hill Forum, it seems that those people who ordered from EBGames are receiving the Special Edition Soundtrack (US Release). So, that also means I'm going to have to find a copy of the Japanese soundtrack not bundled with the game. You can see more details here (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/showpost.php?p=173242&postcount=17) (for EBGames) or here (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/showpost.php?p=173483&postcount=28) (for GameStop).

As to the differences in the PS2 and X-box versions, early in the production of the game, Konami had stated that there would be significant differences in the two console versions. As to whether or not they followed through with this decision, I'm not sure. I really haven't heard of anybody whose bought and played the X-Box version say it was different. Just be aware of this.

I have a feeling that the PC version will be the same as the X-Box version, because of similar program designs and that every (next-gen) version previous to this has been the same as the X-Box version. And, if there are any differences in the PS2 version, you can just wait for the Playstation Greatest Hits version to come out with all the bonus features like "Restless Dreams" did.

You can read about the responses to the differences in X-Box and PS2 here (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=13288).

Dude. If you don't get it, I'll give you (and anyone else that wants it) any Silent Hill 4 soundtrack. I have "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST", "Silent Hill 4 The Room: Inescapable Rain in Yoshiwara -Special Chapter-", and the USA version of "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST".

What about "Robbie's Tracks," the special Japanese release of music relating to Robbie the Rabbit? I'm just interested in finding out what's on it as no one will tell me.

EDIT: For those who want a little taste of the story to SH4 (with little spoilers), I suggest checking out the prequel about "'He' and the Victims." It is written in Korean, but offers a partial English translation as well.

Korean - "He" and the Victims (http://ruliweb.intizen.com/ruliboard/read.htm?main=ps&table=gr_sh2&page=3&num=14467&find=&ftext=&left=)
Partial English - "He" and the Victims (http://ruliweb.intizen.com/ruliboard/read.htm?main=ps&table=gr_sh2&page=1&num=14512&find=&ftext=&left=)
Korean - Robbie's Trip to Europe (http://ruliweb.intizen.com/ruliboard/read.htm?main=ps&table=gr_sh2&page=1&num=14513&find=&ftext=&left=) (Don't ask why Robbie is wearing a tiara.)

EDIT 2: For those who are looking for some major spoilers, you can read more about the "Red Diary" translations from the SH4 website here (http://silenthillheaven.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7049). I haven't read it yet, as to not spoil things for me, but I know I'll be coming back to this later. So, I just wanted to post the link before I forgot it.

EDIT 3: New Robbie wallpapers have been added to the official SH4 website. You can find them in Room H of www.sh2004.com, or you can get them directly below.

Robbie 1 (Cinco de Mayo) (www.konamityo.com/sh4/dl/5_1024.jpg.lzh)
Robbie 2 (www.konamityo.com/sh4/dl/7_1024.jpg.lzh)
Robbie 3 (www.konamityo.com/sh4/dl/8_1024.jpg.lzh)
Robbie 4 (www.konamityo.com/sh4/dl/9_2_re_1024.jpg.lzh)

[Decrescendo]

I've only played Silent Hill 3, and I wasn't a big fan of it. It's a pretty cool concept, but I hate the movement. I have always been a big fan of Resident Evil and I guess I'm just used to that. I'm not saying that SH is bad, I'm just so used to RE.

[BocoDragon]

I've only played Silent Hill 3, and I wasn't a big fan of it. It's a pretty cool concept, but I hate the movement. I have always been a big fan of Resident Evil and I guess I'm just used to that. I'm not saying that SH is bad, I'm just so used to RE.

Now I'm confused... RE and SH both default to exactly the same control scheme....

Anyhow, I called EB and they're still not getting SH4 in until tomorrow September 9th. Luckily, I have two days off beginning tomorrow, though! :)

Thanks Ifrit for your detective work. I think I might still actually get that soundtrack considering what you said. I mean the computer did flag me for it, and it's such a high profile preorder freebee that Konami would make sure there were supplies for every store.

In any case, I just downloaded a torrent of the entire thing in MP3 anyway ;)

[Eccles]

Update:
My stories are progressing about as fast as an arthritic slug carrying heavy shopping. BUT! This week I have written three pages of stuff...so that's always a good sign.

[Global-Trance]

Dude. If you don't get it, I'll give you (and anyone else that wants it) any Silent Hill 4 soundtrack. I have "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST", "Silent Hill 4 The Room: Inescapable Rain in Yoshiwara -Special Chapter-", and the USA version of "Silent Hill 4 The Room OST".

What about "Robbie's Tracks," the special Japanese release of music relating to Robbie the Rabbit? I'm just interested in finding out what's on it as no one will tell me.

Don't worry. I'll get that too.

[BocoDragon]

I just got a call from the sexy girl who works at EB Games... Silent Hill 4's in!! I'm running downtown right now...

[Tranquil Chaos]

Got my SH4.

It's awesome. I'm about halfway through it, and I'm enjoying the shit out of this game....

[StarZander]

Damn you. Damn you all. Still a week until it's released here... And I don't have any money. If anyone spoils anything, I will personally bitchslap you to hell.

[flipsideshooze]

me and two buddies have religiously played the first three... they all come over... and we stay up all night to beat it...

our SH4 party is set for tomorrow... w00t!

[Weiss-Engel]

Got my SH4.

It's awesome. I'm about halfway through it, and I'm enjoying the shit out of this game....

Halfway through?!?!?! What, do you have a catheter and colostomy bag or something? My husband has usually taken several days to get through a SH game, even after completing it once already.

[Sefy]

Ok, this game has got a weird story, so, where I can read a good guide of the story of this city??

[The Instrument of GAWD]

I just got a call from the sexy girl who works at EB Games... Silent Hill 4's in!! I'm running downtown right now...

LIES! there is no sexy girl who works at EB Games!

[Tranquil Chaos]

Got my SH4.

It's awesome. I'm about halfway through it, and I'm enjoying the shit out of this game....

Halfway through?!?!?! What, do you have a catheter and colostomy bag or something? My husband has usually taken several days to get through a SH game, even after completing it once already.

I've only got roughly 5 game hours racked up...

According to the walkthrough Im about 70 percent done.

This is the first SH game I've had to stop playing because it was too long to do in one day. When I bought the day it came out, I was done with it that night. I love emersing myself in a silent hill game from start to finish in one go. It really sucks you in.

[ifirit]

Got my SH4.

It's awesome. I'm about halfway through it, and I'm enjoying the shit out of this game....

Halfway through?!?!?! What, do you have a catheter and colostomy bag or something? My husband has usually taken several days to get through a SH game, even after completing it once already.

I'm at the forest world 2nd time and I've only got roughly 5 game hours racked up...

According to the walkthrough Im about 70 percent done.

Please use spoiler code when revealing locations and places until the world-wide release of the game. Like this.

[color=white]Like this.[/color]

As such, I would like to impliment this as all spoiler code for this topic. It would be nice if OCR had a spoiler code set up for these forums, but there isn't. So, we have to make up our own.

It's not that I'm trying to moderate this topic, but it helps to set a standard to use and to avoid ruining an experience that is dependent on not knowing what happens next. I just want to look out for those people new to or unaware of the series.

As such, I will be going back through my posts and editing said spoilers. Enjoy.

[Night10194]

It's good to see people being considerate about the spoilers. I have to wait until the 21st to get SH4, and I'm really hoping to go into it without knowing much.

[mecca\]

I've tried so friggin hard to get into the SH series, it's touted as storyline of the century, and the whole life/death/pleasue settings of the 3 which so many people scream about persuaded me to get 3, I'm about 3 hours into it and there is honestly about 6 lines of dialogue (i'm just out of the sewers and am in some construction building or apartments). The monsters are really shit (other than pyramidhead from the 2nd one) and look like someones tried too hard to make them look irregular and the puzzles are mediocre and uninspiring. I'm going to work through the 3rd one just to see what all the fuss is about, and most probably will be getting 4, because curiousity will get the better of me.

If anyone has any resources on the storyline or can give me a webpage with the entire story dissected for reading it'd be good, other than that I'm currently stuck with SH3 and Splinter Cell2 to play until something more enjoyable (*cough* Fable *cough) comes out.

[Raenok]

I friend just got SH4 yesterday.

I have a question (Note: Spoilers).

It concerns about these "Victims" creatures somone posted a while back. Do you eventually fight them? My friend played up to the lower levels of the Ashfield Subway, there were these creatures that climbed out of the walls, and you could not kill them. Are these the "victims", or are they something different?

(End spoilers.)

[RaenDarc]

Yes, the things in the subway were the "Old-type Victims" You'll see the "New-type Victims" later, they're quite a bit harder to get around.

[ifirit]

I really hate to be a stickler about this, because I figured you guys would have figured it out by now, but please, PLEASE use the spoiler code that is in place for revealing information about SH4. Again, the code goes like this:

[color=white]Spoiler Information[/color]

I will continue to insist upon this until the world-wide release of the game (10-1-2004) [Australia will not receive the game until that first week of October]. It becomes important that you recognize this, as to help keep this thread from regressing to innane babble about your personal completion rate or needless questions about where to find some item.

If you are just too eager to discuss SH4 or too lazy to use the VERY simple spoiler code, I suggest you direct your inqueries, remarks, comments, ect. to one of the Silent Hill forums, particularly, the Alternate Silent Hill 4 (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=3a21a84973e221043f2f1f857c37819 d&f=95) forum on the Silent Hill Forum (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/). (Spoilers need not be marked there.) Other forums are listed below:

Silent Hill Heaven: SH4 Forum (http://www.silenthillheaven.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=7&sid=d4e65eff2a63a421989225ad30f1f18c)
Silent Hill Forum: Alternate Silent Hill 4 Forum (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=3a21a84973e221043f2f1f857c37819 d&f=95)
Central Silent Hill: SH4 Forum (http://www.black-helix.com/is/speaking/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)


If you are in need of simple explanations on the control scheme, monster information, character bios, item retrieval, ect., please look at one of the sites listed below:

Official Silent Hill 4 Website (http://www.sh2004.com)
Silent Hill Genesis Presents The Room (http://www.frozentears.net/matter/sh4/)
GameFAQs: Silent Hill 4: The Room (http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/ps2/game/919554.html)
Central Silent Hill: SH4 Section (http://www.black-helix.com/sh4/)
The Silent Hill Network: SH4 Section (http://www.silent-hill.org/?game_id=4&homepage=1)

[Night10194]

SH3 was the worst in the series, and honestly, had the crappiest story...if you can find 1 or 2, try those, instead. Trust me, you'll be happier.

[Deathtank]

does anyone know when the pc version will come out?

[StarZander]

does anyone know when the pc version will come out?

Well, here in sweden it's being released on the same dat as the PS2 and XBOX version. Which is on the 16th.

[ifirit]

In case anybody has missed out on the information regarding the soundtracks (plural) to the Silent Hill 4 OST, I've got things listed below.

The Japanese version of the Silent Hill 4: The Room soundtrack is know as the "Limited Edition Version" of the OST, because it includes and additional disk with a series of tone poems written by Akira Yamaoka and performed by Ichiryusai Teisui. These are spoken in a very old dialect of Japanese, so translations are hard to find. (Sort of like trying to translate the work of Shakespear into other languages: one, it's hard; two, it won't be a very accurate translation.)

The Soundtrack released in the US and North America is known as the "Special Edition Version" of the OST. It includes 13 tracks not found on the Japanese OST, which includes 6 remixes of previously released material.

Limited Edition Silent Hill 4 Soundtrack:

- Disk 1
01. Tender Sugar
02. Waverer
03. Fortunate Sleep - Noone disturb her dead
04. Melancholy Requiem
05. Confinement
06. Drops of Shame
07. The Suicidal Clock Chime
08. Silent Circus
09. Traversing the Portals of Reality
10. Into The Depths of Self-Discovery
11. Cradel of Forest
12. Resting Comfortably
13. Nightmarish Waltz
14. Pulsating Ambience
15. Your Rain
16. The Last Mariachi
17. Wounded Warsong
18. Underground Dawn - Never Come
19. Fever Chill
20. Remodeling
21. Room of Angel
22. Waiting for You ~Live from Heaven's Night~ (Unreleased Tunes)
-Disk 2

Kyodan "Impenetrable Rain of Yoshiwara"

01. Ichikotsu (1st Excess)
02. Tangin (Cut-off Gold)
03. Hyoujou (Flat-tone)
04. Shozzetsu (Win and Give Up)
05. Shimomu (Nothing Exists Lower)
06. Soujou (Twin Tone)
07. Fushou (Wild Duck Bell)
08. Oushiki (Yellow Bell)
09. Rankei (??? Mirror)*
10. Banshiki (Crossing the Board)
11. Shinsen (God Hermit)
12. Kamimu (Nothing Exists Higher)

* Unfortunately, this word cannot be translated into English as there is no equivalent.

Special Edition Silent Hill 4 Soundtrack:
01. Room of Angel
02. Melancholy Requiem
03. Cradel of Forest
04. Sliced
05. Fortunate Sleep - Cat Scratchism Mix
06. Mayhem I
07. Sunrise
08. Resting Comfortably - Nasty Mix
09. Nightmarish Waltz
10. Lifetime
11. Last Movie
12. Tender Sugar
13. Your Rain
14. Two Evils
15. Underground Dawn - EEE Mix
16. Memories II
17. Tender Sugar - Empire Mix
18. Waverer - Slide Mix
19. Your Rain - Rage Mix
20. Waiting for You ~Live From Heaven's Night~

Also, an interesting thing to note about the Kyodan tracks is that the title correspond to the months of the year, depicting a different month in the story of Yoshiwara. (Starting with November and going in chronological order.) However, the names can also stand for the twelve note of the musical scale. (Beginning with the D major scale and going up the scale.) In other words:

01. Ichikotsu = D Major Scale = November
02. Tangin = D# = December
03. Hyoujou = E = January
04. Shozetsu = F = February
05. Shimomu = F# = March
06. Soujou = G = April
07. Fushou = G# = May
08. Oushiki = A = June
09. Rankei = A# = July
10. Banshiki = B = August
11. Shinsen = C = September
12. Kamimu = C# = October

(My thanks goes out to Rasen from the Silent Hill Forum, who worked to bring these translations.)

There is also a special soundtrack (http://www.konamistyle.com/customfactory/sh4t/index.html) that includes "Robbie's Tracks," which was also released in Japan only. Unfortunately, I am unable to find any information regarding this soundtrack. If anyone is willing and able to obtain any information on this matter, please let us know.

And that's about it. Have fun.

[ubernym]

Spoiler Information

I can't even see the spoiler color. How is this going to help if you cant see it?

[Firedrake]

Teehee... (http://www.meantimeprod.com/short_films/silent_hill_movie.html)

[StarZander]

Teehee... (http://www.meantimeprod.com/short_films/silent_hill_movie.html)

Old, but cool nonetheless.

[Firedrake]

Anyone here read the SIlent Hill: Dying Inside comics? I've just finished reading them myself. The artwork, done by Ben Templesmith, who did 30 Days of Night, works well for the Silent Hill universe, in my opinion. I wouldn't say it's a bad comic book adaptation, but it isn't fully accurate, and it all feels rushed near the end. It's also very "comic-book" too, as it features substantial amounts of gunplay. One of it's major flaws though is it's lack of subtlety, something which made the games great, as well as truly introspective humanity. It also becomes kind of campy once the whole gothic punk teenager crowd is involved, but overall, I'd say it's decent and doesn't rape the franchise.

[Eccles]

I've picked up 1, 4 and 5.
I liked the artwork in the first one...but the way the fourth and fifth are drawn doesnt really grab my attention.

I also don't like the way some of the scenes are done. Like the bit in the gun shop...subtlty can work well if you do it right (Eg: the ear scene in Resevoir Dogs) but in Dying Inside it was like
"OH SHIT!"
*red smudge*
"OH SHIT! LOOK WHAT IT DID!"

Which, to me, showed the fact that the artist/writers were rather unimaginative...and I agree with you, the ending is far too much of a "Wait...WHUT!?" affair.

But overall the three volumes were worth the £9 I paid for 'em...

[ifirit]

According to Silent Hill Heaven (http://www.silenthillheaven.com/) and IDW Publishings (http://www.idwpublishing.com/), there were two different people who illustrated the Silent Hill "Dying Inside" (http://store.idwpublishing.com/product_info.php?products_id=222) comic series. Ben Templesmith did the artwork for the first and second issues, and then, Aadi Salman who picked up the artwork from then on out (Issues #3-5). Scott Ciencin wrote the story for the entire series (so, you can blame him for an abrupt ending). Also, for those who purchased the comic online when it first came out, recieved autographed copies (by Ben Templesmith) with an added introduction.

However, if you remember, Konami issued two licences to IDW Publishing for the Silent Hill Comics, and the second series has already been announced. "Among the Damned" (http://www.idwpublishing.com/?path=titles&view=issue&id=215&IDWid=578f85e16c912fd7aaf476190c51b8c9) is set to be distributed for November 2004. Again, Scott Ciencin will be writing the storylines, with cover artwork by Ashley Wood and interior artwork by Shaun Thomas. The story is about a soldier who is suffering survivor's guilt which leads him into Silent Hill. (IDW stole my Silent Hill plot! I want my royalties!)

Personally, I liked what I saw of the ComX Comic Novel, which was completed, but never released. Silent Hill Heaven's Graphical Novel section (http://www.silenthillheaven.com/Site/SH1/novels.php) has all the information regarding this (I believe that the staff even has a copy of the comic), including the "Dying Inside" series. Of course, they cannot release the ComX version to the public, as they could get sued by Konami for it. However, you can check out the preview pages below:

ComX Preview Page #1: In the Shadow of Charred Fury (http://www.silenthillheaven.com/Site/SH1/Images/silent_hill_TP04_copy.jpg)
ComX Preview Page #2: Dead End (http://www.silenthillheaven.com/Site/SH1/Images/silent_hill_TP08_copy.jpg)
ComX Preview Page #3: Devil's Lyric (http://www.silenthillheaven.com/Site/SH1/Images/silent_hill_TP15_copy.jpg)

EDIT: All posts are now spoiler-marked. :wipes brow:

[Eccles]

I picked up my copy of SH4 today (the bastards didn't gimme my free stuff, but what're you gonna do?)

The telephone has become my mortal enemy. I *know* they put an easter egg in there...I know it...but I haven't been able to find the right number to make it work.

I've tried Jenny's number (867-5309) and that didnt work. I've tried the ISBN from Thriller (apparently Jackson hid his phone number in the ISBN) and that didnt work. I've tried the tech support numbers, I've tried the barcodes for all four Silent Hill games...
Ideally the solution would be to wait a month so that people who are freaks like me but have more patience than me can try out all ten million combinations and find out what it is, but I dont wanna...

And now, a little on the psychological aspect of the game.

The main monsters are, of course, the people. 'Victims' as the game calls them.
One of the reasons these monsters are so scary is the fact that theyre human, but at the same time totally inhuman.

One reason they're scary is the way they don't move. They glide, slowly and effortlessly towards you, not thinking about what to do. Yes it's pretty scary to see something lurching towards you (See: Pyramid head) but to see something that could very well kill you without even trying...that's where the horror lies.

It's like with the Daleks...the Daleks scared people because they were so cold, calculating and emotionless. Take these and you have a wonderful recipie for horror, but take into account the fact that you *cannot* escape them and they're absolutely terrifying.

Also the way they move...they look like theyre marionette's being strung along by something...of course this is pure speculation from me since I havent found anything out yet (I've just got to the Prison if anyone cares).

[StarZander]

I like how they've put the bunnies from SH3 i the game. The one in Eileens room creeps me out, but I like the floating heads of the dolls/suits that you can se in the air when you look out the bedroom window.

[StarZander]

Wow, did that game dissappoint me. Frustrating, tiresome and oh so repetitive. If they make a SH5, then I might just throw up. I'm too tired and too depressed over this game now, to write something big about it.

[RimFrost the Tourianist]

Silent Hill 4 is a gargantuan step backwards.
I played it for 2 or 3 hours and it let me down so much i almost vomited out of boredom, and why in the name of FUCK did Konami include 1st-person view and a RE type itembox i will never know..and ONE savepoint !!?? :vomit: :vomit:

Youll be better off playing SH2 and SH3 instead !

[Tiamat570]

I'm guessing some of you SH fans like me already know this site, but I for some reason don't like the idea of 'skimming' through 38 pages to check it hasn't been posted before, so here it is regardless,

http://www.shfanfics.tk/

Has 3 stellar fanfics which, as many have said, capture the mood of the Silent Hill games excellently, far better than the comics IMO.

[Lasakon]

The poor baby. (http://www.avary.com/rogeravary/journal/journal.php)

[ifirit]

Sadly, I have to agree with the consensus on Silent Hill 4. The biggest fault with this game stems from a single element in the design: the real-time weapon change menu.

The producers (Team Silent) made 1 really bad mistake with the game: they decided to include the real-time weapon change system. In order to include this option into the control scheme, they had to use the square button and directional pad. Well, this removed the 3-D control scheme (or tank controls as people sometimes refer to it). By doing so, they had to create a 2-D control scheme with the left analogue stick, which was difficult to manage considering that the levels were tightly spaced and required more camera shifts than any other game before it. This made walking and running (especially running) hard, to say the least. Changing the movement design to 2-D also required that they include an auto-targeting system, since control is so very hard to do manually. Well, this was done rather poorly as it doesn't allow you to switch between targetted enemies. This makes fighting really, really, "I couldn't beat 'Easy Mode'" really frustrating. Seriously, I cannot play that game without screaming at the terrible combat controls.

Also, the real-time weapon change doesn't really save you very much time in actual gameplay. Though it looks nice on paper and makes programming and load times much quicker, it distracts the player and at times still makes them pause the game and search through the menu anyway; defeating the purpose all-together. Since this scheme was introduced, they had to limit the number of items in your inventory so to not confuse the player and take even more time to shuffle through the on-screen menu. This, in turn, required that the dated item-box system be placed and thus the frustration of item retreival and maintainance reintroduced.

The single save box also adds to the tiresome nature of the game, as you have to re-enter the tunnel to return to the room, which requires loading; go to the living room, which requires loading; and access the memory card, which requires loading in addition to the time it takes to save. And then, you still have to return to the actual gameplay, which requires more loading time. (Going back to the portal, entering the portal, ect.)

To think that all of these frustrating gameplay elements came from a single feature that Konami was too determined to include, but failed for them to see how much it hindered the game. I applaud the idea that you wanted to try something new, but it took too much time to manage, too many elements away from the game, and ultimately, too much fun away from playing. Know when to cut your losses, Konami.

I'm going to strip this thing of all its content, so that I never, ever have to play this attrocite ever again. Good day. :Storms out:

P.S. I'll discuss the story-line at a later time. This story was the weakest of the series, but did provide more information that allows retrospection on the last few games. So, it's not a complete loss.

EDIT: The poor baby. (http://www.avary.com/rogeravary/journal/journal.php)
That's reassuring to know that the movie has a production member that is just as devoted to the series as its fans. Go Christophe! Anyway, leave the guys alone, you fan-boys. :Pulls out steel pipe to fend off the masses:

At least the movie should be good.

EDIT2: I'm guessing some of you SH fans like me already know this site, but I for some reason don't like the idea of 'skimming' through 38 pages to check it hasn't been posted before, so here it is regardless,

http://www.shfanfics.tk/

Has 3 stellar fanfics which, as many have said, capture the mood of the Silent Hill games excellently, far better than the comics IMO.

In all my searches through the Silent Hill websites, I've not come across this little gem. I think the works are very good at capturing the style and atmosphere, but could have taken more liberties than it had.

I'll try reading them again.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

well then, last night i just finished SH2. was it just me, or was that game a friggin' tear jerker?

anyway, with the first and second SH games beat, i'm free to go off and buy SH 3 and 4, but from the sounds, they're not as great... that won't stop me from buying them tho, but it will hold me from doing it right away, i still got Shinobi and Devil May Cry to beat yet.

I would like to post something relavent about the plot or characters of this series, but i've only beaten the games once each and it's too early to talk about such things.

EDIT: all this talk of the soundtrack reminded me. i'm not sure if anyone remembers the trailer to SH4, but there was a song in it that caught my ear and i was wondering if it was on the soundtrack? all i know is it has lyrics: "It was always you that I despisied." and "I don't feel enough for you to cry."

[Juste]

The song is called Room Of Angel and the OST is easily found on soulseek.

[Night10194]

SH2 was, indeed, a tearjerker. Did you get the Maria or the Leave ending?

[The Instrument of GAWD]

SH2 was, indeed, a tearjerker. Did you get the Maria or the Leave ending?

I got the "In water" ending. I'll visit that game again and get the rest of the endings eventually tho.

The song is called Room Of Angel and the OST is easily found on soulseek.

thank you sir. good luck with the sanity issues as well (your sig)

[M@]

Warning – mild spoilers.

Oh, I don't know. SH4 wasn't up to the hype, that's for sure, but I think people are giving it more stick than it deserves. I’ll start with the controls, something everyone seems to dislike. Me, I instantly switched to configuration 3, which allocated square to be used for cancel/run ala past instalments, which helped me ease into the new item swap system by assigning circle to this task, which once operated the flashlight. Configuration 3 was the more logical default option, in my opinion, as fans of the series needed not to become familiar using circle for cancel/run and square for item switching, halving the amount of new things to learn. Having played MGS alongside SH in the past, the switch to 2D movement wasn’t so much a shock either. The only problem here I similarly encountered in Devil May Cry, that sudden switches of camera, of which MGS had little, would rocket Henry in the wrong direction should I neglect to move my thumb in time. In fact, the main problem I encountered with regard to control that few have mentioned, was the function of L2. In the past, this has been used to let the player move the camera a little, usually by way of swinging it around a touch with the right analogue stick as to get a better look around. Now the camera transposes instantly behind Henry’s head when L2 is pressed, and the right analogue stick serves to perform the original function independently, only with less freedom of movement. As I was used to almost permanently using this feature in past games, its new execution took some getting used to, and often left me disorientated.

Battles, I feel, were not as hard as people are letting on. I played first in easy mode, and met few problems other than getting stuck around downed ghosts, which, due to their undying nature, were solidified unlike other enemies and became unavoidable obstacles if downed in the wrong place. This was more of a design flaw than a combat issue, and Eileen sure as hell took advantage of this to frustrate me. In the pet shop for example, she was sandwiched between Cynthia, Jasper, and some other victim for some time, and I was not too impressed. I felt the new charge gauge could have been tweaked though, to have more than two attacks per melee weapon. Considering the size of the gauge, varying degrees of damage could have been issued dependant on the charge, as opposed to ‘some’ as it fills or ‘lots’ when it’s full. Hell, gently or fiercely pressing the attack button performed this task in past instalments, in less time, too. This gauge could be easily exploited to render Henry near invincible, too, as enemies could not damage him during a powerful attack. All that need be done is to execute an attack as an enemy does, and your attack takes priority, damaging the enemy when their faster attack should, logically, damage you. Some bosses would have been nice, too.

Also, how many of the weapons were actually useful? Some had imagination; the spade was fun, as were all of Eileens’ weapons – if not a little kinky. However, an absurd amount of golf clubs and some bladed weapons, many of which were redundant, are hardly innovative. It was nice to step back from the mundane Handgun – Shotgun – Hunting Rifle / Good – Better – Best routine, but I didn’t bother with the pistols at all, as having to carry separate rounds was a terrible hoax, and coupled with the need to run back to the item box should you run out, a step beyond backward. SH isn’t supposed to be realistic, it’s supposed to be fun! The item box I can agree, hands down, was a mistake. On the other hand though, I found portals to be liberally scattered throughout the areas, so the need to go back was hindered less by a huge trek, but more by loading screens. Mind, play with your analogue sticks during these and watch what happens. Simple, yet amusing. More fun than watching footprints appear.

The story isn't too bad either. In fact, I enjoyed how the 'main' SH story revolving around The Order was branched out from Dahlia/Alessa into something glanced over in SH2. It would have been nice to hear Frank mention James though. I know we all want to hear more from that guy. Hrm, that’s all I can think of for now, but I’m sure more defences will come to me soon, heh.

[StarZander]

I was thinking last night, and even though the games in the series are going way downhill, there has been one splendid constant throughout the games, that hasn't deteriorated or anything. It's just as great as it was in the first game; The music.
When I beat SH4 I was so sick of it, that I didn't think I'd play it again for months. But I was listening to it's OST yesterday, over and over, and I felt like playing the game again, just because of the great music.
This fact comforts the idea of Akira Yamaoka coproducing the SH movie. There is still hope.

[Night10194]

I will admit I'm not terribly far into the game yet, but I'm enjoying SH4 a great deal. It certainly beats SH3. I'm a little unhappy with the ghosts, but I can deal with 'em, and the controls...they're a godsend! FINALLY pushing the stick one way, moves me THAT way! God, did I ever hate the tank controls. Now I can dodge and move much more easily then ever before, and so far, the atmosphere, story, and such seem quite neat. Again, better then the abyssmal (in relation to 1 and 2) failure that was 3...

[M@]

I tend to believe that 3 was a knee-jerk response by Konami to the fans of the fist game that complained about the second being unrelated to its predecessor. That said, I still enjoyed it, my only major complaints being that it was insultingly short, and that the reuse of Brookhaven Hospital and surrounding area seemed a tad lazy on the developers' part.

[Eccles]

This fact comforts the idea of Akira Yamaoka coproducing the SH movie. There is still hope.
Seeing as how he produced SH4, this news somewhat irritates me now.

On SH4 (Spoilars ahoy!)
Like most games I play, I once again found myself directing the game in my head; coming up with little snippets of "I would have done that better" or "If I were in charge, I would've done it this way..."

One thing I found myself complaining about again and again was the pace of the game. There's almost no character development throughout.
Example (spoilers):
"Hey, I'm the fanservice character. But I'm dead now."
"Hey, I'm the token nutjob. But I'm dead now."

Another thing I would have done would be to edit the way the monsters (specifically the victims) look and behave.
Look at the victims as they fly along...the way their legs are slightly bent at the knee suggests that their model was sitting at the time of creation. Frankly I would have thought they would have been scarier had their legs been straight and it looked as though they were hanging from a noose of some description.

The nurses. I would pretty much totally overhaul the nurses.
Their model is fine, but that's about it. For starters I would have them lurch about more rather than the confident swagger they seemed to have. Secondly I'd have them recoil in some way when you hit them...that really REALLY irritated me about them; when I hit a monster with neck severing force I want to see them recoiling in immense pain, not just sliding back a little.

Thirdly I would take out that stupid STUPID burping sound they made as you hit them. The team didnt even TRY to disguise the fact that it was a burp. The hospital was ruined enough as it was, but the burping nurses just ruined it.

On the same vein...am I the only person who thinks they let the teaboy design the hospital and everything in it?
The nurses suck (as described above) the maniac wheelchairs suck, some of the puzzles are stupid and the only things that redeemed it were the giganto-head and the cameo of a mannequin from SH2 (if you look out the window in one of the cells on the second floor there's a mannequin stood there. I can't say which room since that floor is randomly generated every time).

And they didnt put Harry in it! I mean what the hell's up with that? He's been in all three so far, so why not the fourth!?
(Yes, I get so worked up over the smallest of things).

Things I did like:
Pushing monsters down the stairs and watching them take other monsters with them.
This one bit when I was on the rooftop of the building across from Henry's appartment I smacked a gorilla round the neck with the bat and it rolled down the stairs, crashing into another gorilla and taking it down too, killing them both.
I paused and I laughed my ass off for about ten minutes...and soon after this became my tactic. Camp at the top of the fire escape charging the baseball bat and using it to drive any attackers down the stairs before crying "Yeah, take THAT you big gorilla bastard"

I dont have any qualms at all about the real-time item selection since it's cheatable. Just hit select to pause the game and open up the item help thing, position the cursor over what you want, hit select to unpause then square (or whatever your designated button is) to equip.
The only waiting time you have is for Henry to shrug his shoulders as the weapon appears.

The way you didnt need a radio like in SH2. I cannot have been the only person who did this...just turn the radio off and let the music guide you.
Take the hospital for instance...normally you had a quiet howling of wind or a gentle sine wave. When a nurse came by, you had the evil clangings of the "Ashes and ghost" track. It got louder and quieter as the monsters got closer and further away and it stopped when all the monsters had been vanquished.

I didn't find NEARLY as many cameos in this game as the others.
Eileen has a Robbie the Rabbit doll on her bed (I swear that rabbit is a psycho bitch...he's going to murder me in my bed and I know it!)

Robbie's head sometimes floats by outside your window (over the hotel, around that kinda area)...though I gotta gives props to Starzander for finding that one.

There are posters from SH3 littering the subway. Those for "Fruity Rouge" and "Havocs business daily" are the most obvious ones, since they appear the most.

The bit with Richard in the appartment (when you get there you'll know the bit) is a reference to that scene from the film "The Green Mile."

I'm pretty disappointed they didnt do anything with the TV. I would have loved to see a Ringu reference or something like that bit from Poultergeist.
"Theyre heeeeeeere...."

Thoughts (SPOILAR!!1)
Weren't two of Sullivan's victims little girls? You find an article about it in Blue Creek and there's a question about it on the Trick or Treat show (both from SH2)...
So why aren't there little girl enemies? Or at least little girls parodying that bit from the Shining "Come play with us Danny...forever and ever and ever" *DEADED*

Not about SH4
My SH stories are coming along nicely. I've come up with another idea (bringing my total to 5)...and I'm kinda writing that, but it's not going to be a story, but a comic done by me or one of my friends (who cares if I can't draw well...it's the story that matters, AM I RITE!!!?1!1/)

I'll put out some stuff just as soon as I'm good and ready, alright?
^_^

[DarkPoinko]

I think I'm about halfway through SH4 by now, and so far it's been an okay experience, but a few of my gripes are like some that the others have posted, there's not enough puzzles, the puzzles that are there are too easily solved, lack of big, giant bosses, etc.

I do, however, like the real-time inventory, since it's easier to just scroll through the inventory and use it right there, without having to stop and look and everything and navigate a pause menu. Having to go back and get stuff out of the chest as you need it is a real pain, especially since there's so many pointless weapons in the game. I've only used the pipe you get at the beginning the bat, and now the axe, I haven't had much need for anything else(though I'm sure the fact I'm playing it on Easy right now is helping to contribute to that).

SH4 has some of the most amusing enemies I've ever encountered in a Silent Hill game, so far. The bat/mosquito things at the beginning are great fun, if you wind up and land a shot on one of them with the pipe. I think I got a good 15 feet off of one of those. The giant leeches are fun to step on and smack against the walls, almost makes me wish there was a paintball mode in SH4. The burping nurses made me laugh, but I miss the real creepy, terror-inducing monster desings, like the mannequins from SH2 and the sloth children from SH1.

I don't miss the radio, but I miss the flashlight. That was part of the SH charm right there. And if they bring back use of the radio, I'd think they'd have to cut out a lot of music in the game, because, as Eccles pointed out, you can just be guided by the music. If you turn off the music, then you only have the radio to tell you that a monster is nearby. But I guess the monsters make enough sound now that you wouldn't need it anyway. Blagh.

As far as a Silent Hill game, it's decent enough, and I think it's pretty cool they were able to bring something that was of almost no story importance at all from SH2 and buiild a history and plot from it, but it just isn't in the same league with 1 and 2. I'd like to see a return to that type of storytelling in the SH games.

[StarZander]

I must say I really miss the flashlight, or really the need for it. This game has been way too bright. Every area has lights, and it just ruins alot of atmosphere. It is SUPPOSED to be dark in most places! I read a preview of the game, right after E3, and they complained alot about the lack of darkness. I can see what they meant now.
The lack of a radio didn't really bother me. I never really notice it anyway.

They should have made it like the "Born from a wish" scenario in SH2, where you didn't have a flashlight nor a radio. But it was still dark, and the music didn't change every time you met a mannequin, so they freaked me out a few times there, popping up, when the camera shifts, since they're so silent.

Something else I didn't like about SH4, was the lack of significance of the main character. In the previous games, the main character was on a quest to find someone or something inside all the madness, or they were the actual reason for the madness, or both. But in SH4 it's like Henry just happened to be there and thought to himself "Hmm, mosters are coming out of the walls, and I'm being teleported to various areas through my bathroom wall. Let's check this out, there's nothing good on TV anyway." and he just doesn't seem to care about anything that he does throughout the game. He hardly ever says anything, and when he does, he sounds like a moron. The fact that he was the last sacrament didn't make him one bit more interesting.
Henry is no hero. He is just a passer-by who had nothing better to do at the moment.

[M@]

And they didnt put Harry in it! I mean what the hell's up with that? He's been in all three so far, so why not the fourth!?

Harry was in SH2?

I'm pretty disappointed they didnt do anything with the TV. I would have loved to see a Ringu reference or something like that bit from Poultergeist.
"Theyre heeeeeeere...."

I think Ghost-Cynthia is pretty much a reference to The Ring in itself, with the hair and the crawling and whatnot.

Weren't two of Sullivan's victims little girls? You find an article about it in Blue Creek and there's a question about it on the Trick or Treat show (both from SH2)...
So why aren't there little girl enemies? Or at least little girls parodying that bit from the Shining "Come play with us Danny...forever and ever and ever" *DEADED*

The doublehead enemies are supposedly representative of the twins in question, as detailed in the victim files on the official website.

[Eccles]

Harry was in SH2?
SH2+3 SPOILERS! (but not really)
He turned up in the UFO ending and abducted James. Also, it's worth pointing out that James is in SH3...he's having a tea party with Harry and an alien in the UFO ending just before Harry wigs out and blows up Silent Hill)

I think Ghost-Cynthia is pretty much a reference to The Ring in itself, with the hair and the crawling and whatnot.
Well yeah, but that's not the TV.
Half-way through the game it'd make perfect sense to do something weird with the TV like show that video or have the hand woft out of it...
(When you get that far, you'll understand why)

The doublehead enemies are supposedly representative of the twins in question, as detailed in the victim files on the official website.
Hmm.
So why weren't they all floaty like everything else?
Why turn them into a big-ass demon that flaunts the laws of physics like they were the speed limit.

[StarZander]

The doublehead enemies are supposedly representative of the twins in question, as detailed in the victim files on the official website.
Hmm.
So why weren't they all floaty like everything else?
Why turn them into a big-ass demon that flaunts the laws of physics like they were the speed limit.

Maybe the victims that fly around, were sacraments 12+? Since the first 10 were killed differently, and were in a different phase of it all. Or maybe just for fun.

[M@]

Harry was in SH2?
SH2+3 SPOILERS! (but not really)
He turned up in the UFO ending and abducted James. Also, it's worth pointing out that James is in SH3...he's having a tea party with Harry and an alien in the UFO ending just before Harry wigs out and blows up Silent Hill)

Ah... Having the original PS2 version, I've only seen the 'Dog' ending. I’ve seen the UFO ending in 3 though. That song rules!

]I think Ghost-Cynthia is pretty much a reference to The Ring in itself, with the hair and the crawling and whatnot.
Well yeah, but that's not the TV.
Half-way through the game it'd make perfect sense to do something weird with the TV like show that video or have the hand woft out of it...
(When you get that far, you'll understand why)

I've gotten that far and get what you mean, and agree, but there're probably loads of references they could have put in from that point in the game onward. It took me a game or two to figure out that taking the Doll isn't too great an idea, too.

Damn kids. Get out my wall!

[ifirit]

Silent Hill 4 Spoilers

I'm beginning to see what the complaints are about Silent Hill 4, but from the majority of issues, it seems that this game lacks the level of detail and motif that the previous games involved.

Again, my biggest complaints were the lack of character involvement and development. The two biggest characters that stood out in my mind were Gasper and Richard. Eileen had some development, but not really enough to understand what was going through her mind. I know that in Henry's description, it says that he is a reserved person, "who does not show his emotions," but there was almost no reactions or connections between himself and the characters, (particularly, the victims who pleaded again and again, to save them).

As to the monster designs, the Old-type victims will attack you using only two types of attack. And that's by trying to take your heart and causing your life to decrease by being close to them. (An interesting point I want to make when people begin discussing the story.) The New-type victims, however do use varying attacks to confront you.

Victim 16 - uses its hair to trap you, making you unable to move until it claws you.
Victim 17 - is unaffected by the use of Saint Medalions and Holy Candles, as the fire protects it. (Putting the fire out makes it vulnerable to other attacks.)
Victim 18 - Floats incredibly high out of the range of your malee attacks and then "cannonballs" toward you as a counterattack.
Victim 19 - Uses arhythmic timing and teleportation to attack you. (You can glitch the game by facing your back to a wall and getting the ghost to teleport into the wall, trapping it and saving you a Sword of Obidience.)

There are also some variations in the Old-type victims, though only slight.

Victim 04 - Uses a shovel to attack you instead of stealing your heart. This is a clue as to the identity of the victim.
Victim 10 - Will continue to attack you even when you use the Sword of Obidience.

Another interesting thing to notice is that there aren't a total of 19 victims in the game. Part of this is due to the relationship between the ghosts and some of the other characters. Victim 15 is not a monster for obvious reasons.

As to Victims 7 & 8, from the way they are designed, they look like they are trying to float by having no feet, but since were underdeveloped in their real life, maybe their ghosts are also underdeveloped (unable to have the same types of physical [metaphysical?] properties as the rest of the ghosts). You should also notice that the "Bottoms" are merely the New-type version of Victims 7 & 8. I'm not sure yet what that means in terms of the story, but it is interesting to note.

To find out more information on the identities and background information regarding the "Victims," check out the link in the Translated Memories (http://www.translatedmemories.com/) site, here (http://www.translatedmemories.com/files.html).

EDIT: Looking back at the picture of the "Abstract Daddy" in SH2, I see now that there are two figures inside the frame. It looks like there is one is on top of the other, if you know what I mean. I guess I never saw that before. :slides away:

EDIT2: Harry was in SH2?
SH2+3 SPOILERS! (but not really)
He turned up in the UFO ending and abducted James. Also, it's worth pointing out that James is in SH3...he's having a tea party with Harry and an alien in the UFO ending just before Harry wigs out and blows up Silent Hill)

Ah... Having the original PS2 version, I've only seen the 'Dog' ending. I’ve seen the UFO ending in 3 though. That song rules!

Pick up the Greatest Hits version released on the PS2. Should be only $20.

[I-n-j-i-n]

I'm beginning to see what the complaints are about Silent Hill 4, but from the majority of issues, it seems that this game lacks the level of detail and motif that the previous games involved.


I don't think that's quite it. It's just that the dogs, the ghost and the other enemies are EXTREMELY ANNOYING when you have to go on escort missions (SH4 players know what I'm talking about), and you get so few bullets in the entire game. That, and pipes seem to do a lot less damage than they did in the older games. Definitely annoying since most monsters tend to fly at you far away from your melee attacks. That, and the melee attacks are usually weak to begin with, even when you charge up your attack to full.


The art, the graphics are all well done, except the storyline, the atmosphere and the gameplay are just attrocious and seem to me made hastily.

I'd say the game is still pretty creepy in overall atmosphere, but as a game that you PLAY and INTERACT with, it is awfully flawed.

No surprise, since SH4 was made back in June to cater to the Japanese holidays there.

[ifirit]

Anyone need an explanation of the "21 Sacrements," the ritual, not the ending (though, I'd be willing to discuss that, too)?

[StarZander]

Anyone need an explanation of the "21 Sacrements," the ritual, not the ending (though, I'd be willing to discuss that, too)?

Post it anyway.

[ifirit]

Well, I finally got around to posting this after a long weekend of work and homework. I've found out several things about the game, and I have some answers to the strange questions from the game, so enjoy and discuss. This is another long one, so grab yourself a drink or snack, if you'd like.

Silent Hill 4 Spoilers

First, is understanding the ritual of the 21 Sacraments, which is entitled the "Decent of the Holy Mother." (The full text is found in the basement of the "Wish House" after the fire.)

Here is the original text:
"The Descent of the Holy Mother -- The 21 Sacraments":

The First Sign
And God said,
At the time of fullness, cleanse the
world with my rage.
Gather forth the White Oil, the Black
Cup and the Blood of the Ten Sinners.
Prepare for the Ritual of the Holy
Assumption.

The Second Sign
And God said,
Offer the Blood of the Ten Sinners and
the White Oil.
Be then released from the bonds of the
flesh, and gain the Power of Heaven.
From the Darkness and Void, bring
forth Gloom,
and gird thyself with Despair of the
Giver of Wisdom.

The Third Sign
And God said,
Return to the Source through sin's
Temptation.
Under the Watchful eye of the demon,
wander alone in the formless Chaos.
Only then will the Four Atonements
be in alignment.

The Last Sign
And God said, separate from the flesh
too, she is who is the Mother Reborn and
he who is the Receiver of Wisdom.
If this be done, by the Mystery of
the 21 Sacraments, the Mother shall be
reborn and the Nation of Sin shall be
redeemed.

Under the first "sign," the person performing the ritual of the 21 Sacraments must perform the standard offering of the white chism and blood in the obscidiene (sp?) goblet while speaking the words of the cult's bible. However, the 21 Sacraments requires the blood of 10 "sinners." I believe that the blood is used to cleanse the conjurer. In other words, that this is simply a preparation for the actual ceremony. Using blood as a method of cleansing is seen in certain Native American religions, particularly those of the Aztecs, who used human sacrafice for everything.

Walter also needed to go through this cleansing ritual. Therefore, Walter Sullivan killed 10 people he deemed as "sinners" and offered their blood as the cleansing rite. The hearts of the 10 Sinners were needed to obtain the most amount of blood. (Probably so that Walter could cover his body with their blood as these rituals sometimes call for.) These "sinners" were choosen by Walter as mostly random people from places he was familiar with, such as the college he was attending, the buildings across from South Ashfield Heights, and his hometown. With exception to the first victim, Walter did not know any of his victims (at least there are no connections saying so).

Under the second "sign," the conjurer is to perform the "Holy Assumption," which would free him from his physical body and he would obtain divine powers. After preparing his body with the rite of the 10 Sinners, the conjurer must kill himself. (I will discuss some disreprency about how Walter killed himself and where.*) As a soul without a body, the conjurer has to travel beyond the Darkness and Void, through Gloom and into Despair who is also the Giver of Wisdom. After traveling through these, the Giver of Wisdom would prepare the final rite, the Receiver of Wisdom.

What the second rite entails is that Walter must kill himself and then his spirit makes a journey through the "netherworld" and the dark aspects of the soul. Unfortunately, Walter didn't travel through them, but removed them from his path, i.e. killing the people he believed represented these things. So, four new victims were discovered as a result. Walter only vaguely knew these people, or at least knew about them, from the translated Victim files on www.translatedmemories.com. Also, by doing this, the ritual allowed Walter to create his "world" within and without the Lord's world. This is the alternate universe, in which Henry travels through. However, it is hard to tell if the "world" hasn't already consumed the apartment.

Under the third "sign," the conjurer must bring four Attonements in alignment so that the final rites may be performed. This means returning to the origin of the rituals calling, i.e. the place where the ritual was first performed. He must overcome Temptation and return to the Source, being Watched while passing through the Chaos. By doing this, the final rites will be ready for sacrafice.

Again, Walter kills four more people in order to perpare the final rites. Again, I don't believe that Walter had to kill these four victims: Cynthia, Jasper, Andrew and Richard. It seems that Walter believes that he must continue to kill people in order to complete this mysterious ritual. One thing though, unlike most of his victims, Walter knew and had met these victims before. (If you read the story of "He and the Victims," which I posted earlier on page 36, you'll see their first encounters.) These had great personal meaning to Walter, which may have been why he didn't kill them out right, or maybe he was just toying with them. Either way, the rites were completely and he just needed to finish the final two rites.

Under the fourth "sign," the conjurer must offer the sacrafice of two important people: The Mother Reborn and he who is the Receiver of Wisdom. After this is done, the "Mother" will be reborn and the "Nation of Sin" will be redeemed. This suggests that the ritual is used to revive a world once lost, thought not guaranteed.

Walter attempts to kill Eileen by beating her up. Eileen accounts that the younger form of Walter Sullivan helps her, but doesn't completely stop the attack. Henry was lucky, but Eileen's life still hung in the balance. He had to keep her safe from Walter, but if he doesn't his control on her would begin to surface. By the end, where you meet Walter at the very center of his being, Eileen has fallen completely under his control. If she dies, she will die in St. Jerome's Hospital. Although Henry is unaware of it, he too is under Walter Sullivan's control. Henry is tied closely to his apartment and as the demons and ghost begin to "haunt" it, they begin to take his life, as is what happens when you approach the haunted items around your apartment. So, if you fail to purify your room, you too will die.

Unfortunately, what happens after the completion of the 21 Sacraments is beyond me. I can't say for sure what happens besides allowing Walter's younger self to enter "the Room." However, from the news report on the radio, it seems that something similarly must have happened in Silent Hill. We'll see.

Walter Sullivan's Body:
*As I mentioned above, Walter had to kill himself in order to perform the "Holy Assumption." However, there is a problem in the timeline and events of the story in SH4 and the article in SH2. From the superintendent's diary, we see that Frank has a dream about the "man in the long coat." He says that he saw him going up to Rm. 302 with a bloody bag, a heavy tool and a bowl. We later find that Walter was going into Rm. 302 to perform the Holy Assumption. However, in the gossip magazine James finds (nice twist, by the way, Konami), it says that Walter's body was found in his prison cell after stabbing himself with a spoon. It's hard to say whether the superintendent dreamed that he saw Walter or if he actually did, since the writing is a little ambiguous. Also, from Joseph's notes, we see that he tried to find Walter's body at the graveyard in the forest of Silent Hill. The grave had been dug up and no body was inside. Though the numbers 11121 were painted on the inside, I don't believe that Walter rose from the grave to go to Ashfield, since he had not performed the Holy Assumption yet. I'm still unsure whether that was Walter in the prison, or if that was someone else (falsely accused).

"Skinning Mike":
I'm sure everyone is trying to understand what the heck happened to Mike when Richard Braintree "skinned" him. From the audio tape, it's hard to say what happened exactly. However, I was able to find the translation to the page containing Richard Braintree's bio in the "He and the Victims" storyline. (Thanks to excuse17 on the Silent Hill Heaven forums for the translation.) It translates as follows:

Richard Braintree

"Hey, Richard's gone nuts again"
"He lost his temper this time"
"Next time would be more fun"
The residents of South-Ashfield Heights enjoyed talking about him.
He was famous for his short-temper.

It was the most terrible when Mike, the resident of room 301,
ran against Braintree in his shoulder at the corridor of the apartment.
Mike didn't mean for it happen, but he just ran into him, unfortunately.
At the time Richard was more moody than usual.
He yelled "Who the hell do you think you are?!" and dragged Mike into his room, Room 207, by grabbing the collar of his shirts.
"Not again" said the crowd of the apartment, and they went to Room 207 to see what was going to happen anyway.
Suddenly, the door opened and stark-naked Mike came out of the room.
Right after that, Richard came out of the room, holding Mike's shirts and jeans soaked in blood.
"How do you like that, you sick little freak? You had it comin' to you!" said Richard.
Mike run away from him.
Richard threw away Mike's clothes and said "These clothes are disgusting. Get 'em outta my sight!"
Then, a middle-aged woman in the crowd said, "I know...It'll be perfect to wrap his body in," and she took the jeans.
"Hold it! Hold it... I think I'll keep that one for myself..." said a drunk, and he took the shirts.
After that, Richard took a look at the crowd and noticed a little kid among them.

"You!! You snoppin' around again?!"
"Get your ass outta here before you really piss me off!" said Richard.

Apparently, Richard took Mike into his room, beat the crap out of him (which explains why his clothes were soaked in blood [they weren't literally soaked in blood, just bloodied]), and then "stripped" him naked while throwing him into the crowd gathering outside his door. I'm sure it was a demeaning and humiliating experience for Mike, so he ran away. Richard Braintree apparently kept Mike's underwear, as you find it in the Alternate Apartment Building in Room 207. :? (I guess Mike wasn't the only "sick little freak," now was he?) Mike's jeans went to the old woman whose cat had been killed by the gun-enthusiast, which she used to wrap its body in. I forget what happens to Mike's shirts. Mike later recants in his diary about how they were his best clothes.

That explains the story well enough to me. It was completely different from what I thought happened. I find this version much more creepy, fun and amusing than my idea, so it's going out the door...naked. :P

EDIT: If you're interesting in reading the rest of "Another Crimson Tome," which includes the "He and the Victims" story and the "Locations" descriptions, check here (http://translatedmemories.com/tome.html). (This is only a partial translation, but will be completed soon. You can read the non graphic translations on the Silent Hill Heaven forums (http://silenthillheaven.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7049).

[StarZander]

*bump*

We can't let this glorious (well, it was in it's younger days) thread just die out. We need to get some theories going here! SH4 didn't leave room for many though.

[Eccles]

THATS BECAUSE IT SUCKS LOL!!1

[The Instrument of GAWD]

oh, cool. glad this was revived, i'm near the end of SH3 (i think).

--Possible Spoilers?--
this time i'm predicting that the ending will be altered by the choice i had in the confessional and i didn't give Douglas his note book back yet.(just predictions, i'm playing without a walk through... first time around at least.)

i can understand how SH3 bothers some people, but i'm liking it. it doesn't give me the sense wide open lonely spaces as the other two before it did, and instant death moments didn't exactly sit well with me (took me three trys to figure out the roller coaster one).

after SH2 i was starting to think that none of the games were connected to each other, but i was kinda glad that this one did, and i sorta like Heather now as well.

--End--

[StarZander]

THATS BECAUSE IT SUCKS LOL!!1

Quoted for emphasis on LOL

[ifirit]

oh, cool. glad this was revived, i'm near the end of SH3 (i think).

I decided to revisit the games in the past week or so, after finishing SH4. (You know, to develop some theories about the connections to the games.) And, out of all the games, I've really enjoyed playing SH3. It's true that there are some weak points in the game, but overall the experience is true to the series, creepy in its own special way and does a great job of character development, unlike some games (SH4).

As to the issue of posting new theories on The Room, I'm unhappy with the direction that the developers pointed us, but since I'm having trouble stating anything right now, I'll just propose questions.

Silent Hill 1, 2, 3, Possible Spoilers
Silent Hill 4 Spoilers

1.) We know that Ashfield (and South Ashfield) is about a half-day's drive away from Silent Hill, what does that mean in terms of distance and actual time?

2.) What is the actual timeline of the series now that we can gage the time passed between SH2 and SH4? (Use the articles about Walter Sullivan's suicide from SH2 and Joseph Schieber's article on the Wish House investigation from SH3 as reference points.)

3.) If the events from the 21 Sacraments Ending are similar to those that occurred in Silent Hill many years ago, what really happened in Silent Hill? Were the mysterious deaths of the construction crews, during the tourist development era, part of another 21 sacraments?

4.) If the 21 Sacraments is successful twice, does that mean that there are additional Alternate Silent Hills around? What does this mean in terms of the characters and who is drawn into these alternate dimensions?

5.) Was Henry's room already in Walter's Alternate Dimension? Should we start refering to this as Alternate Ashfield, since it is somehow different from Alternate Silent Hill?

6.) Although we don't know how far the drive to Silent Hill was from Heather's apartment, do you suppose Heather lived in Ashfield as well? (I haven't verified it, but I've heard a rumor that you can see Heather walking the streets of South Ashfield from Henry's apartment window.)

7.) Is Henry dreaming? Why or why not? If it is a dream, does that mean that the other "Victims" are still alive? Are the portals enterances into other people's dreams?

8.) Why does Walter's body appear as a form of God? at the end of the game? Is this another premature birth, or is it the "Devil?" What is the significance of jumping into the black liquid? If you are actually going into the deepest part of Walter, is Henry in Walter's dream, or is he actually inside a part of Walter himself?

I hope to hear some of the responses to these questions, since I'm a little confused as to how they all tie together.

[Eccles]

THATS BECAUSE IT SUCKS LOL!!1

Quoted for emphasis on LOL
What?
I'm allowed to say Lol...

oh, cool. glad this was revived, i'm near the end of SH3 (i think).

--Possible Spoilers?--
this time i'm predicting that the ending will be altered by the choice i had in the confessional and i didn't give Douglas his note book back yet.(just predictions, i'm playing without a walk through... first time around at least.)
--End--
You'd think so, wouldn't you? Well you're kinda right.
There're only 3 endings in the game...Good, Bad and UFO (Which is the best VG ending ever).
It pretty much gets explained to you halfway through the final dungeon how to influence the games ending...but I wont ruin it further.

[StarZander]

6.) Although we don't know how far the drive to Silent Hill was from Heather's apartment, do you suppose Heather lived in Ashfield as well? (I haven't verified it, but I've heard a rumor that you can see Heather walking the streets of South Ashfield from Henry's apartment window.)

Heather lived in Portland. Not Ashfield. They say this in SH3, didn't you ever notice?

[ifirit]

6.) Although we don't know how far the drive to Silent Hill was from Heather's apartment, do you suppose Heather lived in Ashfield as well? (I haven't verified it, but I've heard a rumor that you can see Heather walking the streets of South Ashfield from Henry's apartment window.)

Heather lived in Portland. Not Ashfield. They say this in SH3, didn't you ever notice?

Common mistake. Heather grew up in Portland before Harry shot the "crazy occult guy". She moved after the incident. The name of the town where the first half of the game takes place is unknown. Many people overlook this fact and assume that it takes place in Portland. Now, stop doubting my information!

[StarZander]

6.) Although we don't know how far the drive to Silent Hill was from Heather's apartment, do you suppose Heather lived in Ashfield as well? (I haven't verified it, but I've heard a rumor that you can see Heather walking the streets of South Ashfield from Henry's apartment window.)

Heather lived in Portland. Not Ashfield. They say this in SH3, didn't you ever notice?

Common mistake. Heather grew up in Portland before Harry shot the "crazy occult guy". She moved after the incident. The name of the town where the first half of the game takes place is unknown. Many people overlook this fact and assume that it takes place in Portland. Now, stop doubting my information!

Alright alright, I shouldn't doubt you, but we all make mistakes. I've seen you do it too :P

But okay, here's a question...

Alessa was one of the children from Wish house, and she got her powers, but did she have them since birth, or did they evolve throughout her years at that place, just like with Walter?

Also, about Alessa... She seems to be a neverending cycle of rebirth (like a phoenix) because when she dies, she is reborn. She is both the mother, and the child of god, right? Been a while since I played SH3, but I think that's how they said it. But... Did this cycle begin with Alessa? Or were there others like her before her? And if not... Why did it begin with her?

[ifirit]

Silent Hill 1, 3, 4 Spoilers

There are several things that you are asking at once. First off, a correction, Alessa was born with special powers (Heather stated so in the car ride to Silent Hill). Walter gained his divine powers from the Holy Assumption, which occurred after his "death." The Wish House orphanage did not develop any special powers in any of its children (as far as stated in Silent Hill 4). Now, as to whether Alessa's powers came innately or from the god born within her, is a different discussion altogether. Also, Alessa grew up in the Gillespie residence, not the Wish House.

With regard to the cycle of reincarnation, this only occurs with the person who has god within them. In SH1, Alessa/Cheryl had god within her, thus Heather was able to be reincarnated from her/them. In SH3, god was transfered to Claudia, so the obvious conclusion would be that Claudia would bear the next reincarnation. However, something happened when Heather "aborted" god. I'm not sure if this weakened god's power, or if it prevented Claudia from being able to achieve reincarnation, but I assume the cycle stopped there. (Can't say for sure, but I think that is the case.)

I am pretty sure that the cycle of rebirth began with Alessa, as Heather explains that it was Dahlia first tried to summon the god by offering her daughter as sacrafice. It is also likely that this is true since it wasn't until just before the construction of the resort that the cult became active, revived from the ancient Native American beliefs as stated in the Lost Memories. As I've stated before, there is a difference between the religion of Silent Hill and the cult of Silent Hill.

Also, the cult has gone through several incarnations itself over the years. There was a small cult that appeared in Silent Hill at the beginning of the twentieth century that mysteriously disappeared (as stated in SH2). The second rebirth came during Dahlia's time, when the area was still just a small mining town. This cult reached a small peak then quited down during the construction of the tourist resort. The older members kept the cult a secret, while the younger members simply moved on to other things (as stated by Lisa). As an attempt to bring happiness back to the people who were losing jobs and the youth, the older members attempted to "bring paradise into the world" by bringing god into the world.

In this era of silence among the cult, whose numbers were cut down to the extremely devoted, they raised new children (Alessa, Claudia, the Wish House, ect.) However, after Dahlia's house burned down, Alessa had been lost and the attempt to bring god into the world failed (seemingly), the remaining few members of the cult scattered, with exception to the Wish House, which still operated directly until the cult's influence. Seven years after that, god awoke breifly and it sparked a revival among those who were aware of this event. The Wish House then became the central base for the cult.

It was here that Claudia spent the rest of her teen years. Claudia seemed to be the one who continued pushing the cult further and recruited Vincent to increase the cult's status and members. This was the third revival of the cult. The cult had three sects which made up it's members: the Holy Mother sect, the Saint Ladies sect, and the Vatiel sect. I know that the Vatiel sect was created some time between the arrival of Harry to Silent Hill and Claudia's taking over of the cult. (The Holy Mother sect ran Wish House. I believe Dahlia belonged to the Saint Ladies sect, though I could just be guessing.) It was under the oversite of Claudia that the persuit of the Holy Mother was founded. It was during this search that the cult gained enough status as to invoke the investigation by Joseph Schieber.

Walter Sullivan lived through most of this. He grew up during the time when Dahlia ran the cult up until just before Claudia took over. At that time, Walter had turned 18 and was no longer allowed to stay at Wish House, so he went to college. It would be 14 years later that Henry enters the picture. Only a short time after the events of SH3.

So, in conclusion, Alessa's cycle of reincarnation ended with Heather (which could have been carried on by Claudia). For the most part, it seems that the story of the cult in Silent Hill ends at the death of Claudia. It is possible that the story may have picked back up, if you believe that the 21 Sacraments Ending is the true ending of SH4. But, if you're like me, then you think that Walter failed and that is the end of the story. Until the next reincarnation of the cult comes back around.

[StarZander]

I'm not sure if that made me less, or more, confused. But I'm hoping for less.

The part where Heather "aborted" god, she swallowed whatever was in the pendant that she got from Harry. What was this pendant, and what was it that she swallowed? Where did Harry get this? (sorry for just adding questions, but I haven't played the games for a while, so I don't remember enough at the moment, to add to a discussion)

[ifirit]

Silent Hill 1 & 3 Spoilers

As you may recall, Heather uses the pendant to retreive the red jewel inside. She swallows this jewel, whichs prompts the following "puking" scene. Because of the research from the various books found all over the Alternate Chapel, we can assume that the red jewel was actually a piece of crystralized Agalophotis, a substance used in the exercism of demons and possessions.

The pendant itself is just an ordinary pendant made of silver. It does closely resemble the Saint Medalions from SH4, which have a picture of a mother and child engraved in it. As far as we know, there is nothing special about the pendant itself.

With regard to how Harry obtained the small sample of Agalophotis, it depends on who you ask. Some people, like myself, believe that it was just the same sample of Agalophotis from SH1 that you retreive, but are supposed to use on Cybil when she was possessed. But, if we assume that Harry doesn't use it on her, he will still have the sample on him after the Good Ending, which eventually crystalizes over time. Others, like DDE, believe that Harry did use the sample on Cybil to save her, but that Harry somehow also was able to obtain a secondary sample of the plant that is used to produce Agalophotis, and created the crystized sample himself. I doubt this theory since it requires a belief that Harry knows more than he should. Still, it's up to you which you believe.

[Vilecat]

About SH1/3 ending...

If you follow the story to SH3, in SH1 it'd mean that Harry didn't save Cybil but kept the Aglophatis.

... But i've been wondering for a while, if in SH1 Harry would've used the Aglophatis to save Cybil, and since in SH3 there's an ending where Heather doesn't use it and becomes possessed or something (kind of meaning if her dad wouldn't have been able to save any of that red stuff), what could happen? =P

[StarZander]

About SH1/3 ending...

If you follow the story to SH3, in SH1 it'd mean that Harry didn't save Cybil but kept the Aglophatis.

... But i've been wondering for a while, if in SH1 Harry would've used the Aglophatis to save Cybil, and since in SH3 there's an ending where Heather doesn't use it and becomes possessed or something (kind of meaning if her dad wouldn't have been able to save any of that red stuff), what could happen? =P

Didn't ifirit just cover all that? :whatevaa:

[Masa_and_Mune]

i have not

[ifirit]

About SH1/3 ending...

If you follow the story to SH3, in SH1 it'd mean that Harry didn't save Cybil but kept the Aglophatis.

... But i've been wondering for a while, if in SH1 Harry would've used the Aglophatis to save Cybil, and since in SH3 there's an ending where Heather doesn't use it and becomes possessed or something (kind of meaning if her dad wouldn't have been able to save any of that red stuff), what could happen? =P

Actually, that is an interesting alternative to the two theories above. It is possible that if you believe that the Good+ Ending is basis for Silent Hill 3, then it is possible that the resulting ending is the Game Over (God is Born) ending, since there would be no Agalophotis to save Heather from Claudia.

Therefore, you would also have to consider that the true ending of Silent Hill 3 is that God? is born from Heather and that Claudia's dream becomes realized. Unfortunately, it's hard to say what happens after that, since in every previous encounters with God? resulted in it trying to kill the main character. This being said, it is possible that the god born from Heather would then try to kill Claudia.

Unfortunately, Team Silent did not give the players enough information to determine what would happen after the birth of God?. We just have to imagine the results. Therefore, if you want to believe that God? then creates paradise and all mankind is saved, then do so. There is nothing to really say that that doesn't happen.

As an extra idea to note about the series, I don't believe that the 21 Sacraments creates another God?, but creates another Holy Mother to birth God?. So, it just creates another host for it to exist in this world. An if you are considering what happens if you perform the ceremony several times, consider the case of Alessa and Cheryl. All it does is divide God?'s power between the hosts. I think then that this is why the Crimson Tome refers to the Sacraments as being "Herecies," since it divides God?'s power and brings it into this world unaturally.

As mentioned in the "Origins," god decided to be born between two people, not the other way around. So, though it is possible to bring god into this world, people should not, and that is why the religion created the Crimson Tome to counter any attempts to defy the natural order of things.

I need to stop now, this is becoming too much of a dogma, and less about general metaphysical ideas. I guess this is the reason why I didn't like the direction that the producers were taking the Silent Hill series.

i have not
Who are you? Are you trying to take my identity?

[Eccles]

Here's one that's been bugging me.

In the opening video (the one you see before you even begin to play the game) you see a ghost floating about in a room with a table/chair set. Later on you find that this is an actual ghost in an actual room in the game...in fact, it is the room in which you find your first sword of obedience.

What I'd like to know is why do they show this ghost? He serves no purpose to the game at all...he's just another regular run of the mill ghost...

[Ramaniscence]

I've played SH4 for like...30 minutes, max, because I just got it, but there's already something I don't understand.

Dude's been locked in his room now, for 5 days.

He has recurring nightmares, where his house is COVERED with rust, and blood, and faces on the walls.

His phone don't work, his TV don't work, all he's got in his fridge is chocolate milk and white wine.

So this guy's on the verge of insanity. He's gotta be. His got a 2 room apartment and nothing to do for 5 days straight.

So he's sittin' here, the door's shackled shut, he looks out the peep hole, and BAM, hot neighbor girl, sittin' outside his door, talkin' to herself.

What does he do? Just sits there. Nothin' big.

Now, I'm thinkin', I've been locked in my apartment for 5 days, and it's turning into Suvivor: The Room, and I see someone outside, why don't I...

BANG ON THE FRICKEN DOOR AND GET SOME ATTENTION.

I mean SERIOUSLY? What kind of person would just SIT THERE and watcha rescue attempt walk away?

[StarZander]

I've played SH4 for like...30 minutes, max, because I just got it, but there's already something I don't understand.

Dude's been locked in his room now, for 5 days.

He has recurring nightmares, where his house is COVERED with rust, and blood, and faces on the walls.

His phone don't work, his TV don't work, all he's got in his fridge is chocolate milk and white wine.

So this guy's on the verge of insanity. He's gotta be. His got a 2 room apartment and nothing to do for 5 days straight.

So he's sittin' here, the door's shackled shut, he looks out the peep hole, and BAM, hot neighbor girl, sittin' outside his door, talkin' to herself.

What does he do? Just sits there. Nothin' big.

Now, I'm thinkin', I've been locked in my apartment for 5 days, and it's turning into Suvivor: The Room, and I see someone outside, why don't I...

BANG ON THE FRICKEN DOOR AND GET SOME ATTENTION.

I mean SERIOUSLY? What kind of person would just SIT THERE and watcha rescue attempt walk away?

He tried this in the game. He bangs and shouts with all his might, but they can't hear him, even though they're just outside his door.

[Ramaniscence]

I've played SH4 for like...30 minutes, max, because I just got it, but there's already something I don't understand.

Dude's been locked in his room now, for 5 days.

He has recurring nightmares, where his house is COVERED with rust, and blood, and faces on the walls.

His phone don't work, his TV don't work, all he's got in his fridge is chocolate milk and white wine.

So this guy's on the verge of insanity. He's gotta be. His got a 2 room apartment and nothing to do for 5 days straight.

So he's sittin' here, the door's shackled shut, he looks out the peep hole, and BAM, hot neighbor girl, sittin' outside his door, talkin' to herself.

What does he do? Just sits there. Nothin' big.

Now, I'm thinkin', I've been locked in my apartment for 5 days, and it's turning into Suvivor: The Room, and I see someone outside, why don't I...

BANG ON THE FRICKEN DOOR AND GET SOME ATTENTION.

I mean SERIOUSLY? What kind of person would just SIT THERE and watcha rescue attempt walk away?

He tried this in the game. He bangs and shouts with all his might, but they can't hear him, even though they're just outside his door.


Hmmm, he didn't try it then, I guess I either missed it, or haven't gotten to that part.

[Eccles]

Yeah, if you look through the peephole it shows him trying to bang on the door and shouting for help...

[ifirit]

Here's one that's been bugging me.

In the opening video (the one you see before you even begin to play the game) you see a ghost floating about in a room with a table/chair set. Later on you find that this is an actual ghost in an actual room in the game...in fact, it is the room in which you find your first sword of obedience.

What I'd like to know is why do they show this ghost? He serves no purpose to the game at all...he's just another regular run of the mill ghost...

Silent Hill 4 Spoilers

Actually, if you look carefully, that ghost in that scene is Victim 1 (or 01121). Though, Victim 10 (the victim DDE is refering to) seemingly doesn't have much influence on the game, Victim 1 is quite important and has quite a substantial role in Walter Sullivan's life. They showed Victim 1 in beginning as a representation of the idea that you will be haunted by ghosts.

What I would have liked to have seen is more usage of the distortion that they used on Victim 1 in the opening (specifically in the scene mentioned by DDE), where the victim's arms and legs get stretched out and pulled in the opposite direction. That would have made some of the ghosts a lot more unnerving.

Again, since this game was completed hastily and did not incorporate all the information that the developers wanted, it is important to work in conjunction with the website and the supplemental materials provided to really understand the nature of the game. Please check out translatedmemories.com (http://www.translatedmemories.com) to learn more about the victims.

[Eccles]

Actually, if you look carefully, that ghost in that scene is...
I would have looked, but I was too busy going "UH OH IT HAVE BEGUN TO MOVE!" and running as fast as my badly animated legs would carry me.

[ifirit]

It seems that nobody is really interested in discussing SH4 theories and plotlines. I've had dozens floating through my head. So, I'm just wondering, does anybody else have any ideas, or do you not care?

Right now, I've got theories about the portals, the concept of Nowhere, connections to all the previous games, monster appearances, so on and so forth.

Anyway, it feels like things have become rather stagnant around the SH circuit, with little new info, media and material floating around. I guess things are approaching that saturation threshold.

Well, to keep things lively, I'll provide a...

Silent Hill Movie Update:
According to Roger Avary, as he wrote in his online journal (http://www.avary.com/rogeravary/journal/journal.php), the Silent Hill Movie script has been completed. There have been two reviews by Christophe Gans and Nicholas Boukhrief. So, a final "first draft" has been written. Avary still complains about some of the little details of the script, but it's good that they are taking so much time to consider the story and make sure it is good.

Now that the script is finished, this allows Davis Films to proceed with the pre-production of the film. And Avary inadvertantly released the shooting schedule start, which will be in February, 2005. This suggests a release date by around this time next year. (w00t!) So, things are looking rather good for the Silent Hill Movie. Although, the details of the script have not been mentioned, I think that the story will be entirely new, and not a remake of the first game. I'm not sure how you feel about it, but I'm relieved. This will be more interesting than just a remake.

Also, as an added bonus, Roger Avary recorded many parts of his trip to Paris to write the Silent Hill script and is compiling a documentary for the DVD. From what he has written in his journal, it should be interesting, none the less.

[The_Waiter]

Alright, I'm going to be honest, feel free to stop me if this has already been done (I only read about the first 6 pages of the forum, couldn't go through all 42 ;) )

Something that I have seen no one really note about the SH games is the usage of the alternate worlds, or rather, the subtle change of alternate world usage. In SH1, Harry often felt the change of the world around him from misty Silent Hill to Nightmare Silent Hill, also accompanied by bloody rain. It happened often, and as soon as it began the gamer is immediately like CRAP.

In SH2, James rarely runs into this nightmare world, (I think he does only once, maybe twice, haven't played the game in a few months -- I know right after the hospital where ***SPOILER*** Maria is killed the first time by Pyramid Head, ***END SPOILER*** And I think in the hotel later. However, though these two are both kind of like SHAZAM! reality shifts, but it IS obvious that the world is gradually getting darker entirely towards the end (the prison, etc. etc.)Not only this, but I think he only actually experiences the change from misty Silent Hill to dark Silent Hill in the hospital.

IN SH3, in my opinion, everything was completely changed in regards to the dark world. Also, Heather/Cheryl/Alessa never experienced the reality shifts. It wasn't so much the entire realities changing, but more certain rooms were really dark and sketch, other ones weren't. The same thing applies to SH2 where the game more gradually goes into the dark reality in entirety...

SH4 I'm leaving out of this because it's a significantly different game for more reasons than just the reality shift, and I'm not saying the other games were the same; more just that SH1 had a gamer feeling one way while playing it, I guess a more suspenseful feel to the game, especially because the periods of nightmare silent hill lasted longer and longer as the game went on. SH2 and SH3 had a similar feeling in regards to the reality shifts.

It's honestly only the dark world in SH1 and the ones in SH2 that freak me out, otherwise they seemed kind of tame in comparison.

So what do you guys think? Agree, Disagree?

[StarZander]

Alright, I'm going to be honest, feel free to stop me if this has already been done (I only read about the first 6 pages of the forum, couldn't go through all 42 ;) )

Something that I have seen no one really note about the SH games is the usage of the alternate worlds, or rather, the subtle change of alternate world usage. In SH1, Harry often felt the change of the world around him from misty Silent Hill to Nightmare Silent Hill, also accompanied by bloody rain. It happened often, and as soon as it began the gamer is immediately like CRAP.

In SH2, James rarely runs into this nightmare world, (I think he does only once, maybe twice, haven't played the game in a few months -- I know right after the hospital where ***SPOILER*** Maria is killed the first time by Pyramid Head, ***END SPOILER*** And I think in the hotel later. However, though these two are both kind of like SHAZAM! reality shifts, but it IS obvious that the world is gradually getting darker entirely towards the end (the prison, etc. etc.)Not only this, but I think he only actually experiences the change from misty Silent Hill to dark Silent Hill in the hospital.

IN SH3, in my opinion, everything was completely changed in regards to the dark world. Also, Heather/Cheryl/Alessa never experienced the reality shifts. It wasn't so much the entire realities changing, but more certain rooms were really dark and sketch, other ones weren't. The same thing applies to SH2 where the game more gradually goes into the dark reality in entirety...

SH4 I'm leaving out of this because it's a significantly different game for more reasons than just the reality shift, and I'm not saying the other games were the same; more just that SH1 had a gamer feeling one way while playing it, I guess a more suspenseful feel to the game, especially because the periods of nightmare silent hill lasted longer and longer as the game went on. SH2 and SH3 had a similar feeling in regards to the reality shifts.

It's honestly only the dark world in SH1 and the ones in SH2 that freak me out, otherwise they seemed kind of tame in comparison.

So what do you guys think? Agree, Disagree?

Well, this is probably something everyones notices, but we haven't talked about it very much. I'm not so sure what there is to say about it, but the realitychanges in SH4 were practically non-existant. It totally lacked darkness! It was just weird and sucky all the way.

[Sentora]

I dunno, the hospital and Chapel Alternate worlds creeped the shit out of me the first time. All that blood running down the walls...Especially that damned Mirror in the Hospital.

*Spoiler*

Did anyone else think that the image was going to walk out and ran the hell out of that room the first time they saw it?

[StarZander]

I dunno, the hospital and Chapel Alternate worlds creeped the shit out of me the first time. All that blood running down the walls...Especially that damned Mirror in the Hospital.

*Spoiler*

Did anyone else think that the image was going to walk out and ran the hell out of that room the first time they saw it?

I really liked that room. At first I didn't notice the stuff happening in the sink and in the mirror, but I revisited that room later on to check if I missed something, and then I noticed it. So cool that your reflection freezes eventually, and it's all covered in... whatever. Too bad I died from it. :P

[ifirit]

You know, we haven't discussed the alternate worlds in quite a long time. And truthfully, it's a rather difficult subject to handle, since the idea keeps changing after each game.

Unfortunately, the interpretation of the alternate world depends on your interpretation of the actual world of Silent Hill. (I have some views on that that will differ from other people, so it doesn't make mine correct. Or even complete.)

Anyway, the alternate world seen in the first game boils down to one of four things: Alessa's subconscious interpretation of Silent Hill; the alternate reality created by the power Alessa welds, the physical deconstruction of Silent Hill resulting from the growing power of the god inside Alessa; or the true form of the town awakened by influence of the cult. These four forms from the first game stem from the four interpretations of the reality of Silent Hill (Misty Silent Hill). A) The Silent Hill seen is not the real Silent Hill, only an interpretation created from Alessa's memories. B) Misty Silent Hill is the true form of Silent Hill, i.e. Silent Hill exists on the plane of reality that we call this world. C) Misty Silent Hill is the real world, but is directly affected by the alternate reality of Alternate Silent Hill. D) Misty Silent Hill is not the real world and not a memory, but a false interpretation of reality. (This is the most complex of the theories and would require a great deal of time to explain.)

The first form says that Silent Hill is a world created by Alessa's (good) memories of the real Silent Hill. This might explain why there are so many inconsistancies in the Misty Silent Hill. Alessa's memory doesn't have the entire picture, only pieces and parts. Which explains why there are holes and chasms in the town. Thus, the Alternate Silent Hill is just the influence of Alessa's bad memories of Silent Hill. The visions of people being sacraficed. The dark and cold space of her hospital room. The fire that put her in that room in the first place. All the nightmares that haunted Alessa for many years, reborn into physical existance.

The second form is more existential than the first because it suggests that there are actually alternate planes of reality. That Misty Silent Hill and Alternate Silent Hill exist on entirely separate planes of reality. Though it might only be that there are just two planes in existance, this theory still leaves open the idea that there are multiple, if not infinite dimensions of reality. Only that by being in Silent Hill, and present during the influences by the god, is Harry able to travel between those realities. This form is the only one that really can fit into an overall picture that ties the games together, though I feel it is the most generic form.

The third is very similar to the second form, in that both ASH and MSH are on different planes of reality, but the two are connected together and as one changes, so does the other. This means that the alternate dimension is creating all the distrubances that are occuring in Silent Hill. That the monsters, ghost town, holes, and disturbing decor are all just influences of this Alternate Silent Hill. I don't really like this form either, but it connects to the second game better than any of the above.

The forth form is the most complicated to explain, since it would just take a long time to explain. This theory stems from texts found in Silent Hill 2 about the town's history and religion, from the dogma stated in Silent Hill 3 and from small hints and influences in Silent Hill 1. What it suggests is that Alternate Silent Hill is the world created by the old gods of Lake Toluca. And that with the reawakening of the god inside Alessa, these old gods are becoming awaken as well, and that their "world" is beginning to appear in our own. This is something that I am piecing together and is still a work-in-progress, so it might have a lot of loose ends. Still, it's something to think about.

While I could go on and post more about the other games, I'll leave that up to you guys to discuss, since I'm more interested in what other people think. Although, I will say that the entire game of Silent Hill 4 takes place in the Alternate World. There are some small details to help you understand why, but know that in that game, the definition of Alternate World changes dramatically.

[Sentora]

That's an interesting theory, Ifirit. You never disappoint. Would that mean that Vatiel, who we discussed earlier in the thread as some sort of Gatekeeper of the worlds, would have an even darker connection to Alessa? That she is the 'Gate' he's been protecting? Or possibly Alessa is his successor and like him, is a gatekeeper as well?

Just random thinking there. It would be pretty messed up to consider Alessa being a 'Gate' that the Gods enter into this world by being 'Born'

[The Instrument of GAWD]

Since the alt. reality of Silent Hill has been brought up; I was thinking about the sirens that go off when the reality shifts. I've only heard them in SH1 and 2, and although it might not be anything at all, I thought I'd bring it up.

[m1lesteg]

Ok, everyone. Apologies in advance for the foolish post among all these intellectual interpretations.

I have had minimal Silent Hill experience. I played Silent Hill 1 way back when it first came out briefly, up until that crazy winged creature broke into, I believe, a restaurant. I played the SH4 demo through, and enjoyed it, not to mention it was incredibly freaky.

It's been enough for me to want to go out and play a Silent Hill game through. My question is, which should I start with? I know logically I should play SH1, but let's assume I will only play one SH game ever and just want to play the "best" one. Which would you guys recommend picking up?

Sorry if this has been brought up earlier, but 40+ pages is a bit much to read, especially when I won't get most of what is being said.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

Ok, everyone. Apologies in advance for the foolish post among all these intellectual interpretations.

I have had minimal Silent Hill experience. I played Silent Hill 1 way back when it first came out briefly, up until that crazy winged creature broke into, I believe, a restaurant. I played the SH4 demo through, and enjoyed it, not to mention it was incredibly freaky.

It's been enough for me to want to go out and play a Silent Hill game through. My question is, which should I start with? I know logically I should play SH1, but let's assume I will only play one SH game ever and just want to play the "best" one. Which would you guys recommend picking up?

Sorry if this has been brought up earlier, but 40+ pages is a bit much to read, especially when I won't get most of what is being said.

I personaly would suggest SH2. It doens't have any real connections to the other games, and it's got a feel to it that the others don't... that and it's a Friggin' Tear Jerker.

[StarZander]

Since the alt. reality of Silent Hill has been brought up; I was thinking about the sirens that go off when the reality shifts. I've only heard them in SH1 and 2, and although it might not be anything at all, I thought I'd bring it up.

We've talked some about the sirens before aswell, and they are pretty significant, since Harry comments on them himself in the game. I don't think we had any ideas of where the sirens came from, but you always heard them during the transitions. From what I can tell aswell, they were only present in SH1 and 2. I wonder why they stopped...

Ok, everyone. Apologies in advance for the foolish post among all these intellectual interpretations.

I have had minimal Silent Hill experience. I played Silent Hill 1 way back when it first came out briefly, up until that crazy winged creature broke into, I believe, a restaurant. I played the SH4 demo through, and enjoyed it, not to mention it was incredibly freaky.

It's been enough for me to want to go out and play a Silent Hill game through. My question is, which should I start with? I know logically I should play SH1, but let's assume I will only play one SH game ever and just want to play the "best" one. Which would you guys recommend picking up?

Sorry if this has been brought up earlier, but 40+ pages is a bit much to read, especially when I won't get most of what is being said.

Well, it's hard to say. Either SH1 or 2. SH1 and 3 are connected, and SH2 and 4 are connected. SH1 has lesser graphics (that you shouldn't care about, but I don't know what kind of person you are), and has a different kind of atmosphere than SH2. SH1 has a more straight-out story, that's exciting and at times confusing. Very good. SH2 has a story that leaves alot of questions unanswered at first, but then it all comes together beautifully, and I must say that SH2 is my personal favorite. But that's me. They area actually equally good, just in slightly different ways.

[m1lesteg]

SH1 has lesser graphics (that you shouldn't care about, but I don't know what kind of person you are), and has a different kind of atmosphere than SH2.

Just for the record, graphics aren't an issue for me, though I would imagine the improved graphics of the newer SH games makes for a scarier experience, just because that's what better graphics do...though I suppose a game like SH where you can't really tell what anything is anyway it wouldn't matter.

I think I'll pick up SH2:Restless Dreams for XBox. It's like 5 bucks more than PS2 version, and the extras are worth it, right?

[ifirit]

I think I'll pick up SH2:Restless Dreams for XBox. It's like 5 bucks more than PS2 version, and the extras are worth it, right?

If you are refering to the "Greatest Hits" version of SH2 on the PS2, then no. The two versions are exactly the same. If not, there is a PC version of SH2 that also has the special features in it. The X-Box version is not the only one with the extras.

Silent Hill Spoilers

Since the alt. reality of Silent Hill has been brought up; I was thinking about the sirens that go off when the reality shifts. I've only heard them in SH1 and 2, and although it might not be anything at all, I thought I'd bring it up.

There is another misconception about the use of the air-raid sirens in Silent Hill. It's true that you do hear them in both SH1 and SH2, but in SH2, the sirens are not used in the transition between the Misty and Alternate realities. That siren only plays during the Red Pyramid Thing fight in the Blue Creek apartment building.

With regard to Silent Hill 1, it is still debatable whether or not the sirens have any significant role. Personally, I believe the sirens have no effect on the story. Since ONLY Harry hears them (please note that this is plural), who's to say that they're only in his head? Since the sirens are a part of the Alternate reality, it depends on what version of the Alternate reality you believe in.

If you look at the idea that suggests that the reality of Silent Hill is all in some person's head (this theory just being a more general form of the Alessa's Memories theory), then what you see, hear, feel and even think (as you see with Harry) can be affected by the person or by some external being.

Keeping this into consideration, you may see the sirens as a warning that Cheryl is subconsciously sending her father (since as DDE says "Cheryl is Alessa, Alessa is Cheryl"). You may think it's just Harry subconsciously sending himself a warning that danger lies ahead. You might think that the sirens are the cries of Alessa as she births god a little more, whenever the Alternate reality appears. You may believe that the sound is the song of the "old gods" in Silent Hill. You might even believe that they are the influences of the UFO's from the fifth ending. Yeah, go ahead and believe whatever you want. If you believe in that, then fine. But you won't get away with what you did. When I find you...

Anyway, in SH2, the sirens are used to drive away the Red Pyramid Thing, and allow James to continue his search for Mary. Whether of not you believe that all the events take place in James' mind, or if the are actually occuring, will affect the direction you take that interpretation in. I think that the "song of the old gods" playing as way to drive away the Red Pyramid Thing is a fun little diversion, but you might not get too far with it.

Ultimately, dropping out the sirens from sequel games suggests to me that they don't really affect the story of the series and were just a scary little trick to make you wet your pants every time you heard it. This is my reasoning as to why I believe the sirens are not important.

EDIT: Okay, so there are sirens in the long hallway from the Silent Hill Historical Society to the Toluca Lake Prison, but those are more fog horns than air-raid sirens.

[Lasakon]

It has now been confirmed the soundtrack to the movie will be made up entirely of Akira Yamaoka's soundtracks.
Hopefully this doesn't change.

[UnforgivingEdges]

Okay, where to start where to start.

First off, I started reading this thread from the beginning, got about 10 pages in and said screw it.

Secondly, I was a Silent Hill virgin up until a couple days ago when I borrowed SH3 from my friend, and to put it in internet terms, it rockzors my sockzors. I've never experienced a survival horror game that was both fun to play (like Resident Evil) and freaky as hell (like Fatal Frame) and I must say SH does a damnn good job, especially because it deals with psychological fear, which scares me the most.

I'm planning on buying SH2 and getting SH4 for my birthday; SH3 grew on me and impressed me a lot. I haven't been freaked out playing a game like this, well, ever really.

I'd also like to add that I find the music AMAZING. I listened to the SH3 soundtrack that came with the game; I am quite pleased. I'm hoping to pick up the SH4 soundtrack, even if the only good song is the theme from the trailer. If the SH2 music is good, I'll prolly get that one too.

In any case, a couple things I noticed today while playing SH3 (and forgive me if this has been brought up before; I didn't read the whole damn thread):

*possible spoilers?*


Douglas's car seems to be from California, seeing as the plates are the same design, and if I'm not mistaken, say California on them. Now while I thought this was pretty cool, I was shocked even more when I found out that there's a Toluca Lake in the town of Silent Hill. There's a town called Toluca Lake in California as well.

While I know that Silent Hill has no exact location in the U.S. (as far as I know anyway), it's pretty interesting that there were 2 CA references within like 5 minutes of each other.

Check it out. (http://maps.yahoo.com/maps_result?zoomin=yes&name=&ed=jwFMdep_0TqqMwS3E2KCyXhRColWEM33bqrOMlXR1TPCnR7 WmdhJ0W4EMR90_67rQDrVCmYw9FMMZWnyKD.A4aZMCw--&state=CA&csz=Toluca+Lake%2C+CA&ds=n&uzip=91602&mag=10&desc=&country=US&dma=803&cat=dine&resize=s&rezoom=0&.intl=us&compass=&pan_x=0&pan_y=0)

I might have to take a visit to Silent Hill. If I can find it on the map :P

[Monobrow]

UE wrote:
I'm planning on buying SH2 and getting SH4 for my birthday; SH3 grew on me and impressed me a lot. I haven't been freaked out playing a game like this, well, ever really.

You should really try to play the first SH game as well, because 3 is a continuation of its story-line. SH will always be my favorite, although I love how psychological 2 is. But anyway, it is easy to get past the sub-par graphics (nowadays) in the original game in no time, and it still will probably scare you shitless. The details that went into that game, and all of the references to the entire horror genre are just plain amazing.

So anyway, just thought I would mention the original...because it really is an essential game to play if you really want a great introduction into the world of Silent Hill.

[Monobrow]

Here's a question for you...I don't know if this has been mentioned yet but...

*SPOILERS*



In SH2, everything in James' version of Silent Hill has to do with water...Of course, when reality shifts and we enter a slightly darker version of Silent Hill (alternate), it is of course, raining...Just like in SH1....But there is more. The lake, the Blue Creek apartments, the huge amounts of water damage everywhere, the well and flooding in the prison, the basement flooding in the hotel, the water hallways of the labyrinth...The "water" ending. Anyway, I just wondered what you all think the water means. And why is it exclusive only to James? Angela experiences fire, which is pretty damn cool as well...but anyway...It's pretty interesting...

[UnforgivingEdges]

UE wrote:
I'm planning on buying SH2 and getting SH4 for my birthday; SH3 grew on me and impressed me a lot. I haven't been freaked out playing a game like this, well, ever really.

You should really try to play the first SH game as well, because 3 is a continuation of its story-line. SH will always be my favorite, although I love how psychological 2 is. But anyway, it is easy to get past the sub-par graphics (nowadays) in the original game in no time, and it still will probably scare you shitless. The details that went into that game, and all of the references to the entire horror genre are just plain amazing.

So anyway, just thought I would mention the original...because it really is an essential game to play if you really want a great introduction into the world of Silent Hill.

Eh. I read the plot and all of its nuances, so I understand the story and everything. I might play it one day.

[StarZander]

SH3 grew on me and impressed me a lot.

Holy shit, what?

SH3 is, easily, the worst of the series, in my opinion. Just wasn't nearly as fun to play, and it wasn't nearly as creepy-ambient as the others.

I have to partially agree with this. SH3 was quite a disappointment to play, after playing the first two games. But the worst in the series is SH4. It's almost worse than the early Clock Tower games. But... yeah, I strongly suggest playing SH2, and SH1 if you're not a graphicswhore, because they have an atmosphere that is unbeatable.

About all the water in SH2, I think we talked about it earlier in the thread... But I'm not entirely sure, but it's an interesting subject. Don't have time to discuss it at the moment though. Our good friend ifirit will probably be along soon, and add his magnificent two cents.

[Pallad]

But the worst in the series is SH4.

I don't understand all the hate toward SH4. Mind you, I haven't read through all of this thread, but I'm certain it's been discussed before--but I want to toss in my two cents.

I had two primary gripes with SH4--and that was the lack of bosses, and the ghosts. Those two flaws, though, are relatively minor in my opinion, and certainly not enough to ruin the game for me.

SH2 is the best in the series, without question, though I haven't gotten around to playing the first one yet--just because I haven't been able to get my hands on a copy.

Apparently Jonesboro, Arkansas is the home of all the ten dollar copies of Silent Hill 1; they're all over the place.

[Attim]

The big gripe I have with SH4 is going back and forth between the worlds and Room 302. That was very annoying for me.
Another thing that bothered me was how there are only two main factors in the game that determine the game ending. In part one and two, there were so many things that determined the ending and I really liked that.
And another thing was that we have to visit the same worlds twice and there wasn't enough of the hospital world. Those have always been my fave worlds in the SH series!

One thing that I liked about SH4 is the hauntings in the Room. That was very cool! Not only that, but I did like the ghosts very much, even though they were annoying at times.
I also like the fact that Eileen can help you fight, that was awesome.

[Cuddly PyramidHead]

Another thing that bothered me was how there are only two main factors in the game that determine the game ending. In part one and two, there were so many things that determined the ending and I really liked that.
There were only 2 main factors that determined what ending you got in Silent Hill as well.

[Navi]

Another thing that bothered me was how there are only two main factors in the game that determine the game ending. In part one and two, there were so many things that determined the ending and I really liked that.
There were only 2 main factors that determined what ending you got in Silent Hill as well.

...chainsaw?

[ILLiterate]

Hey never saw this thread before but its pretty damn sweet.

Silent Hill's always been one of my favorite games for two reasons...
1.This game ACTUALLY scares me, none of the cheap "OMG SOMETHING POPED OUT" scares just like...wow the monsters are so fucked up sometimes its crazy
2.The MUSIC and SOUND EFFECTS are beautiful. Im currently working on a Silent Hill 2 remix for Promise(link in my kinda-sig)and I just love every second of it.

You guys think that they should do SH like there staring to do RE...give you more action and control(but still keeping the shit-my-pants-factor the same)?

[ifirit]

Here's a question for you...I don't know if this has been mentioned yet but...

*SPOILERS*



In SH2, everything in James' version of Silent Hill has to do with water...Of course, when reality shifts and we enter a slightly darker version of Silent Hill (alternate), it is of course, raining...Just like in SH1....But there is more. The lake, the Blue Creek apartments, the huge amounts of water damage everywhere, the well and flooding in the prison, the basement flooding in the hotel, the water hallways of the labyrinth...The "water" ending. Anyway, I just wondered what you all think the water means. And why is it exclusive only to James? Angela experiences fire, which is pretty damn cool as well...but anyway...It's pretty interesting...

Silent Hill 2 Spoilers:

Though this topic has been brought up before, I've never really felt like it had been addressed properly. In part, due to the ambiguous nature of the game, and also due to my inability to provide a satisfying answer on the subject. (There is also the fact that some of the evidence gets misinterpreted.)

Anyway, I'll try to summerize the connections that water has on the town of Silent Hill and the concept in general. Water is apparent in Silent Hill for two reasons, though obvious: 1) Silent Hill was established very close to Toluca Lake, 2) Water is a symbol of both life and death, which Silent Hill 2 deals with; unlike fire, which is used to only symbolize pain, death and destruction.

With regard to James, in the end of the game, he is caught between choosing to continue his life or end it. Although, he may have different reasons for doing either, after realizing the truth about Mary, he must choose one or the other.

In the many instances that James encounters water, it never really interacts with him, until near the end. The view of Lake Toluca in the beginning is at a far off distance. The water logged apartment complex is guarded by the Red Pyramid Thing. The shoreline in Rosewater Park is almost invisible in the fog. In each case, James is always never actually gets close enough to reach the water, which symbolizes his choice to live or die. So, until the after the fight with Eddie, James never contemplates his choice. He doesn't reach the a point for which he should consider it.

Therefore, as James rows across the water towards the Lakeside Hotel, this actions symbolizes his attempt to weigh the option. He asks himself, "Is this journey worth continuing, after everything that's happened?" It is only when he reaches the other end of the shore that he makes his decision, in the Lakeside Hotel.

As such, the water has enveloped James before the final fight. The rain is seeped into the hotel and drenches everything around him. The time for James to make his decision is very near.

Therefore, in the endings watch how the developers use the visual of water. Obviously, in the "In Water" ending, the entire view is in water, meaning that James has choosen to use water for death. In the "Rebirth" ending, water becomes a symbol of life, as James travels across it to perform the ceremony that will bring Mary back to life.

Watch each ending and determine for yourself what water means for James, and for you since you become so involved in his role.

EDIT:
SH3 grew on me and impressed me a lot.

Holy shit, what?

SH3 is, easily, the worst of the series, in my opinion. Just wasn't nearly as fun to play, and it wasn't nearly as creepy-ambient as the others.

Even though, many people disagree with me, I really liked Silent Hill 3. I thought it had the best atmosphere since it combined the harsh darkness of Silent Hill 1, with the soft ambience of Silent Hill 2, while adding some new things in the mix. Had I not already been jaded by the continuation of certain motifs in the Silent Hill series, I might be inclined to call it the best atmosphere of any horror game.

But, I won't.

Though, the story has several major holes in it and doesn't quite end appropriately, I like it's character development and the attention to detail in the characters motions, speech, and actions. And as I write this, I realize now how much the experience of the game is shaped by your ability to tune into these subtleties. Which probably explains why whenever I try to explain the story, people go "hmmm....", but once they've played it go "ahhh..."

Anyway, for people who like strong character development over tightly written storylines, I think Silent Hill 3 is a good recommendation. Silent Hill 2 offers a really great introduction into the series, but is also misleading as to the nature of the rest of the games. Silent Hill is awesome to play by yourself, in the dark, at the wee hours of the day, but is considered dated in terms of visuals, though its style is difficult to beat. (Any game that uses a software's limitations in new and creative ways is always a good game.

EDIT2:
Another thing that bothered me was how there are only two main factors in the game that determine the game ending. In part one and two, there were so many things that determined the ending and I really liked that.
There were only 2 main factors that determined what ending you got in Silent Hill as well.
Actually, there are 2.5 factors that contribute to the game ending that you get.

Silent Hill Spoilers

Although, one of the factors is whether or not you save Cybil, the other is whether or not you save Kaufman AND if you discover the secondary Agalophotis vial in the motel. That is why I say there are 2.5 factors in which ending you get.

Though, if you go to the trouble of saving Kaufman in Annie's Bar, you are most likely to complete Kaufman's side quest, it is possible to just skip finding the Agalophotis vial and continue through the game. But, you won't get the Good or Good+ ending.

Still, the point is valid that there are not very many contributing factors that control which ending you recieve at the end of the game as compared to SH2 and SH3.

EDIT3:
You guys think that they should do SH like there staring to do RE...give you more action and control(but still keeping the shit-my-pants-factor the same)?
According to some early rumors on Silent Hill 5: Shadows, the developers are considering downplaying the action elements of the series in place of stronger atmosphere and tougher puzzles. One rumor went so far as to say that the game will not include the ability to fight AT ALL.

Truthfully, I hope that this is not the case and that these are just rumors. However, at the same time, I don't think that high action elements really belong in this series as it messes with the pacing and the way the player views the atmosphere. If too much attention is directed at trying to survive the moment, often the player doesn't have the ability to let his/her mind wander into the depths of the surroundings.

It's a delicate balance between knowing when to intimidate and when to let yourself be intimidated. If you press too hard, the game may appear "unimmersive," while if the game presses you to much, players will eventually feel bored or frustrated. It's when developers know this difference and utilize it efficiently that great games are developed.

EDIT4: Has everyone figured out how to get the four endings in Silent Hill 4: The Room? Has anyone beaten "One-Weapon Mode?"

[Monobrow]

UE wrote:
I'm planning on buying SH2 and getting SH4 for my birthday; SH3 grew on me and impressed me a lot. I haven't been freaked out playing a game like this, well, ever really.

You should really try to play the first SH game as well, because 3 is a continuation of its story-line. SH will always be my favorite, although I love how psychological 2 is. But anyway, it is easy to get past the sub-par graphics (nowadays) in the original game in no time, and it still will probably scare you shitless. The details that went into that game, and all of the references to the entire horror genre are just plain amazing.

So anyway, just thought I would mention the original...because it really is an essential game to play if you really want a great introduction into the world of Silent Hill.

Eh. I read the plot and all of its nuances, so I understand the story and everything. I might play it one day.

That really isn't enough...And you will be missing out...Oh well.

[ILLiterate]

Wow the original Silent Hill was a pants staining game. As soon as that damn flying thing came through that window right at the start I was scared as hell, more afraid of what wasnt there than what was...great :wink:

[NecromancerMondo]

I love the Silent Hill series. Except for 4, I've heard that one sucks, I have yet to play it. The first Silent Hill's alternate world seemed more frightening then it's sequals'. I think the sound had something to do with that.

[Cuddly PyramidHead]

I love the Silent Hill series. Except for 4, I've heard that one sucks, I have yet to play it.
o ok thanks for the insight there

[StarZander]

Thank you ifirit for your insight. We always love to read it. And it seems this thread is alive again! Woohoo!

SILENT HILL 4 SPOILERS

On the note of getting all the endings in SH4, from what I have heard the two factors on getting the endings are if Eileen walks into the pool of blood during the final bossfight or not, and if you have cleansed your apartment from all the haunting spirits and stuff. I missed the part where they explaiuned that though, so the whole place was really freaky. Pretty cool though.

I have yet to find the willpower to go through this game again, though. It was too boring. Too tedious. Baah.

[ifirit]

I love the Silent Hill series.

If you love it so much, why don't you marry it? (http://www.gabe-e.com/marry/php/list2.php?type2=577)

[StarZander]

I love the Silent Hill series.

If you love it so much, why don't you marry it? (http://www.gabe-e.com/marry/php/list2.php?type2=577)

Noooo! Pyramid Head isn't single anymore. And I bought him all these human sacrifices...

[RimFrost the Tourianist]

I love the Silent Hill series.

If you love it so much, why don't you marry it? (http://www.gabe-e.com/marry/php/list2.php?type2=577)

I love Maria from SH2 (forbidden love hurts so much)

i tried sending her an email but she won't respond :cry:

[ILLiterate]

Speaking of marrage you know if they accept gay marrage they have to accept all marrage? That means, for you slow ones, you WILL be able to marry you favorite videogame characters

Anywho whats your most frightening moment in SH history? For me its just seeing the monsters, there all so scary and the way that the meat handed character moved in SH3...wow

[StarZander]

Anywho whats your most frightening moment in SH history? For me its just seeing the monsters, there all so scary and the way that the meat handed character moved in SH3...wow

Walking into that first alley, in the first SH game. A moment to remember.

[Carousel Nightmare]

Anywho whats your most frightening moment in SH history? For me its just seeing the monsters, there all so scary and the way that the meat handed character moved in SH3...wow

I agree with StarZander...yep.

[Monobrow]

Walking into that first alley, in the first SH game. A moment to remember

Ditto...After my first time playing up to that point, it took me a couple of years to pick up the controller and try the game again.

Here are some others that almost are equally as scary for me.

1. The fourth floor button in the elevator in the hospital in SH...and the added supersticious correlation between the number 4 and death, especially in Japanese culture.
2. Jumping down the holes in SH2 in the prison and labyrinth: The well, the gated hole, the wax/shoe hole, the body dumping hole, the elevator ride, and your own grave...I think that's all of them...fucking mind warp I tell ya.
3. Encountering Pyramid Head in the Labyrinth, especially right before you meet up with Angela again. I sure as hell didn't expect that...Damn AI...
4. The teacher's lounge in Midwich school. The picture on the wall, and the reality of it when you enter the alternate school.
5. The mirror storage room in SH3.
6. The god damn clock tower music in SH.

I haven't played four yet...so eh...
There's many more, but I think I will stop here.

[Carousel Nightmare]

I remember another one that scared me was the Mannequin in Silent Hill 2 that was wearing Mary's clothes and had the Pocket Light in the blouse...I guess it wasn't exactly "scary" but it freaked me out..

[BocoDragon]

Even though, many people disagree with me, I really liked Silent Hill 3. I thought it had the best atmosphere since it combined the harsh darkness of Silent Hill 1, with the soft ambience of Silent Hill 2, while adding some new things in the mix. Had I not already been jaded by the continuation of certain motifs in the Silent Hill series, I might be inclined to call it the best atmosphere of any horror game.

But, I won't.

Though, the story has several major holes in it and doesn't quite end appropriately, I like it's character development and the attention to detail in the characters motions, speech, and actions. And as I write this, I realize now how much the experience of the game is shaped by your ability to tune into these subtleties. Which probably explains why whenever I try to explain the story, people go "hmmm....", but once they've played it go "ahhh..."


I completely fell in love with SH3. I'd be tempted to put it above the other games in the series but that would be like choosing a favorite of your children. I absolutely agree that its strong point is the subtlety of the characters. People like you and I found something very interguing about playing as this cool young chick against the forces of hell, but you know that some people might just not get it. Their loss entirely :)

Oh, and what "major holes" in the plot do you speak of? Do you mean actual inconsistancies or just the usual SH vague-ness about what is really happening?

SH1-3 are all masterpieces for different reasons.

SH4 is original and wierd as hell, but it just didn't try very hard to be very scary, and it made some dumb design choices.

I think the reason there's so little dialogue on it is because it really doesn't capture the imagination in the way that the first 3 did.... It almost didn't try to. Little character development, and the storyline was a rather standard supernatural serial killer yarn. Is this Nightmare on Elm Street? It was good, yes, but not really outstanding. Just "another installment". Something this series had never seen before.

[StarZander]

I remember another one that scared me was the Mannequin in Silent Hill 2 that was wearing Mary's clothes and had the Pocket Light in the blouse...I guess it wasn't exactly "scary" but it freaked me out..

It looked freaky at first, when you came in and just saw the light... then the mannequin holding the light. But the part that startled me the most there was that when you took the light, a mannequin enemy rose up immediatly. Wasn't prepared for that.

[Carousel Nightmare]

I remember another one that scared me was the Mannequin in Silent Hill 2 that was wearing Mary's clothes and had the Pocket Light in the blouse...I guess it wasn't exactly "scary" but it freaked me out..

It looked freaky at first, when you came in and just saw the light... then the mannequin holding the light. But the part that startled me the most there was that when you took the light, a mannequin enemy rose up immediatly. Wasn't prepared for that.

Yeah, that's a better way of explaining the scary. :)!!

[ifirit]

Oh, and what "major holes" in the plot do you speak of? Do you mean actual inconsistancies or just the usual SH vague-ness about what is really happening?

Silent Hill 3 had holes by having certain inconsistancies in the storyline. Though we learn that Heather is Alessa and Cheryl reborn, there is little indication from Heather about either Alessa's or Cheryl's feelings or memories from that time. I always thought that Heather would have had greater insight into the story and about the workings of the cult than the story revealed.

Also, there are some little things like the question of Vatiel and the reason for its appearance, why Claudia has "special powers" (as quoted by Vincent), why the alternate world was visible to Douglas and Vincent, ect. I could understand if there was a vagueness about the answers, but Konami failed to even address these questions at all. Though, we do learn a lot about the series from number 3, there are so many direct questions the game avoids.

SH4 is original and wierd as hell, but it just didn't try very hard to be very scary, and it made some dumb design choices.

I think the reason there's so little dialogue on it is because it really doesn't capture the imagination in the way that the first 3 did.... It almost didn't try to. Little character development, and the storyline was a rather standard supernatural serial killer yarn. Is this Nightmare on Elm Street? It was good, yes, but not really outstanding. Just "another installment". Something this series had never seen before.

Silent Hill 4: The Room is a completely weird game in itself, however, the entire game was designed around a single motif idea: Fear within comfortable surroundings. As a result, they created light sources in every part of the game, which were only reserved before to highlight certain aspects in previous games.

They tried to reaffirm the "body shock" (A term developed by Diabolical Dr. Eccles.) element of Silent Hill 1, as well some other smaller elements from Silent Hill 2 (i.e. non-player character escorts, undefeatable enemies, and long streches of corridors, hallways, holes). The greatest successes were in the subtle touches added to the game. Since the element of light is introduced in the game, the developers used the concept of shadows to freak you out.

My favorite part is the wheelchair monsters (though DDE would disagree), because if you use the lighting at just the right angle, you can see the ghost riding on it. (Very creepy and funny at the same time.) The use of shadows in the Water Prison were also nicely done, since you did get that feeling of being watched while in the cells. (I never like to be those rooms for more time than I need to.) Also, take notice of shadows that may appear in Henry's apartment room, as sometimes they will appear or appear differently.

Another strange twist is that in the building world, though you appear to be going constantly downward as you progress through the level, you are in actuality teleporting between different parts of the Hotel South Ashfield and Fusielli Restuarant, which is across from the South Ashfield Heights apartment complex. This small piece of information adds to my theory that all of SH4 takes place in Nowhere.

[BocoDragon]

Good insight into SH4 Ifrit.

But I personally believe that SH3 has no plot holes, exactly, and everything you mentioned does fall under the realm of "vagueness". It is a trademark of this series to just not tell you very much about what is "really" going on, which obviously serves to heighten the sense of the unknown.

It has been touched upon before in this thread, but I'm a firm believer that these games are 100% subjective dreamlike experiences. I have no desire to figure out the "rules" governing the wierdness. I have no desire to place the events of SH on a timeline. It's why, even though I'm probably as big of a fan of these games as posters like you and Eccles, I have not posted story theories in this thread, etc, because I believe it is the subjective appeal and connection to the characters that drive the interest of this game.... not necessarily the actual story.

I mean... What causes the terror? Is it drugs? Did you die? Aliens? Is Maria good or is she bad? Should you kill yourself? Depending on how you play these games, it can be all of these things. Apparantly the story never really matters, it can end in any way. It's the emotions of the experience that matter the most.

There are undeinable motifs and hidden messages in these games, which deserve to be studied. But it will also kinda never really add up to anything... :)

It's always a great read when you guys post something though :D It is great to see the unique Silent Hill fandom at work. Definitely an intelligent bunch, I'd say.

[Carousel Nightmare]

I've played through Silent Hill 4 once, and I need to know, does Henry's shirt actually get dirty? I don't know if you all already brought this up or not, so I felt like I'd ask...

[ifirit]

But I personally believe that SH3 has no plot holes, exactly, and everything you mentioned does fall under the realm of "vagueness". It is a trademark of this series to just not tell you very much about what is "really" going on, which obviously serves to heighten the sense of the unknown.

It's not vagueness. "Vagueness" is whether or not you can tell if something is one thing or another. In the cases I mentioned above, there is no answer. There is nothing to compare one thing to another. Being vague would mean a case like: "the monsters are really people. I'm just joking." They might be, or they might not be; that is subjective.

A case where the material might not be considered "vague" is where the developers create a notion about a certain topic as being the central idea of an event or give you no information at all, creating a hole in the story. Though, the developers try to lead you astray by dropping in certain distractions, they ultimately either give you something to determine what the whole story is about or nothing at all (such as the case I mentioned above).

It's not that the games are always vague, or that the story has some sort of multiple dimensioning to it. The stories weren't developed to have a single story in mind or any story for that matter, but as the series continues, the direction that Konami is leading us is towards a single storyline. So, knowing what the difference between a subject being vague and non-existant is of importance to decifering the story, and ultimately understanding those experiences and emotions.

Knowing what to feel may be just as subjective as determining whether or not something is a "dream-like experience." Should I feel sad that Alessa was killed, or overjoyed? Does Dahlia make me feel safe, or stalked? Because if it's all just a dream, then why feel anything? (*Inspires interesting SH4 theory idea.*) Why even take the series under consideration if you know that it doesn't really matter anyway? It does, and it should. But, I guess the point is to balance it out.

We should know when and where it's important to consider the make-up of the games. Thinking too much might lose your audience, and thinking too little invites unanswerable questions. But, I'll provide one extreme, because there are too many people providing the other.


P.S. Saying that "I'm a firm believer that these games are 100% subjective dreamlike experiences," qualifies as a theory about the games. So, that right there creates a paradox in your thinking. :P

[The Instrument of GAWD]

Walking into that first alley, in the first SH game. A moment to remember

Ditto...After my first time playing up to that point, it took me a couple of years to pick up the controller and try the game again.

Here are some others that almost are equally as scary for me.

1. The fourth floor button in the elevator in the hospital in SH...and the added supersticious correlation between the number 4 and death, especially in Japanese culture.
2. Jumping down the holes in SH2 in the prison and labyrinth: The well, the gated hole, the wax/shoe hole, the body dumping hole, the elevator ride, and your own grave...I think that's all of them...fucking mind warp I tell ya.
3. Encountering Pyramid Head in the Labyrinth, especially right before you meet up with Angela again. I sure as hell didn't expect that...Damn AI...
4. The teacher's lounge in Midwich school. The picture on the wall, and the reality of it when you enter the alternate school.
5. The mirror storage room in SH3.
6. The god damn clock tower music in SH.

I haven't played four yet...so eh...
There's many more, but I think I will stop here.

**Possible spoiler**

SH3, when your in the building before getting to Heather's appartment. The room with all the bloody mannequins with the missing heads except for one, you look at, turn the corner to pick something up and then there's a scream-ripping sound-dropping sound. You go back to check it out and the one mannequin lost it's head... that made me piss myself almost.

[BocoDragon]

But I personally believe that SH3 has no plot holes, exactly, and everything you mentioned does fall under the realm of "vagueness". It is a trademark of this series to just not tell you very much about what is "really" going on, which obviously serves to heighten the sense of the unknown.

It's not vagueness. "Vagueness" is whether or not you can tell if something is one thing or another. In the cases I mentioned above, there is no answer. There is nothing to compare one thing to another. Being vague would mean a case like: "the monsters are really people. I'm just joking." They might be, or they might not be; that is subjective.

A case where the material might not be considered "vague" is where the developers create a notion about a certain topic as being the central idea of an event or give you no information at all, creating a hole in the story. Though, the developers try to lead you astray by dropping in certain distractions, they ultimately either give you something to determine what the whole story is about or nothing at all (such as the case I mentioned above).

It's not that the games are always vague, or that the story has some sort of multiple dimensioning to it. The stories weren't developed to have a single story in mind or any story for that matter, but as the series continues, the direction that Konami is leading us is towards a single storyline. So, knowing what the difference between a subject being vague and non-existant is of importance to decifering the story, and ultimately understanding those experiences and emotions.

Knowing what to feel may be just as subjective as determining whether or not something is a "dream-like experience." Should I feel sad that Alessa was killed, or overjoyed? Does Dahlia make me feel safe, or stalked? Because if it's all just a dream, then why feel anything? (*Inspires interesting SH4 theory idea.*) Why even take the series under consideration if you know that it doesn't really matter anyway? It does, and it should. But, I guess the point is to balance it out.

We should know when and where it's important to consider the make-up of the games. Thinking too much might lose your audience, and thinking too little invites unanswerable questions. But, I'll provide one extreme, because there are too many people providing the other.


P.S. Saying that "I'm a firm believer that these games are 100% subjective dreamlike experiences," qualifies as a theory about the games. So, that right there creates a paradox in your thinking. :P

All I know is, filling in too many details would ruin the atomosphere and subjectivity of the game, and obviously Konami knows this. What do you think?... Are the details of the storylines that they've left out (including your "plot holes") unintentional goofs that they should've filled in but didn't? No, it's clear they knew what they were doing. Things were intentionally ommitted. (again, for "vagueness". That's a nice rebuttal on the term, but you know what I mean..... "vague" means "not too specific". Period.)

Furthermore, are these details going to be revealed in a sequel or some sort of clumsy creator release? (like the RE series "Wesker's Reports"). If they are smart, no. I think they fully know this: The magic comes from not revealing too much.

(yes, I'm aware of SH Lost Memories. Luckily it doesn't attempt to give new storyline... it just collects everything in the games thus far.)

The flip side of that coin is that there's very little to actually decipher. There are metaphors, themes and motifs to discuss (Yes Dahlia, for example, represents negative feelings.... Don't you have good and bad figures in your dreams?), but the storyline itself.... Is not gonna add up to anything. This is not MGS.

So point out that my non-theory is a theory unto itself. Okay. But you know what I mean. ;)

I like the story theories. From people who are invested in the gameplay and understand the sensibilities of the game, like yourself, it's pretty neat. But, I wonder if it misses the point of why the games are so special, that's all. Are we gonna ruin the magic by discussing the town Angela grew up in, or the make of Harry's car? Discuss all you want, but the real appeal of the games lies somehwere else (IMHO)

We don't have to argue, btw. :) I totally see your point. I'm just pointing something out, that's all.

[UnforgivingEdges]

I just received a perfectly pristine, original release copy of Silent Hill 2 in the mail today for PS2.

Got me some winter vacation entertainment.

EDIT- Mine is the 666th post in this thread. DUN DUN DUN. I feel Silent Hill slowly converging around me as we speak.

[ifirit]

It's time for another edition of...

Silent Hill Movie Update: (W00T!)
For those of you who have been following Roger Avary's online journal, a recent meeting between the development team from Davis Films met with representatives from Konami to discuss and collaborate on the upcoming movie. This is a little bit of old news, but Konami also released a preview trailer highlighting the basic plot-line of the movie. The trailer itself has nothing new in terms of visuals (Remember, filming begins in February), however, there is some new audio.

Although, the Silent Hill movie will not be a remake of the original Silent Hill game, it will be a reinterpretation.

Movie Plot (possible spoilers)
The story focuses on a mother looking for her lost child in the town of Silent Hill. The woman, Harriet (--> Harry), is unaware of the danger lurking in Silent Hill as she searches for Sharon (--> Cheryl), her daughter. She'll meet several strange people and discover a shocking truth. [/Spoilers]

Konami is still hosting the video file of the meeting and part of the trailer (though video quality is low). If you cannot access the file, try again later; the files are running off Konami's main bandwidth.

Silent Hill Movie Preview (Broadband) (http://www.konami.co.jp/ja/tv/news/0572/br.html)
Silent Hill Movie Preview (DSL/56k Modem) (http://www.konami.co.jp/ja/tv/news/0572/na.html)

----

I also found an awesome remix of "Melancholy Requiem" from SH4. It was made by James Madison (not the president) and can be found here (RAR file) (http://usuarios.lycos.es/colinasilenciosa/inventario/melancholy_requiem.rar) or off of my page (MP3 file) (http://www.angelfire.lycos.com/scary/pyrokinesis/media/index.html).

----

I just wanted to mention that in January, I'll be visiting southern California and I plan on taking the Silent Hill Tour: San Bruno, Toluca Lake, ect. I'll be taking a lot of pictures and hope to get them uploaded when I get back. But, if you want some scary pictures to tie you over, try these places:

Visions from the Underworld (http://www.orchy.com/underworld/)
Entrances to Hell (http://www.entrances2hell.co.uk/index.html) (Less than serious)

This one's my favorite: Fog at the Rest Stop (http://mjm.gd-kun.net/aaa/trip5b.jpg)

[cluthu]

Some of the other mixes (Laura's Theme) on that page are pretty good too. He has some wallpaper, as well.

Click here. (http://usuarios.lycos.es/colinasilenciosa/inventario/)

[The Instrument of GAWD]

This is a bit of irrevelence; I started to play SH3 again after beating it once. I got the Beamsabre and Sub Machine gun w/infinite ammo, guess that means I gotta kill everything with a gun now. Also unlocked all (thanks to Game FAQs) all the costumes. WTF is up with the Transform one, lol. Sorta makes me miss Sailor Moon.

[ifirit]

This is a bit of irrevelence; I started to play SH3 again after beating it once. I got the Beamsabre and Sub Machine gun w/infinite ammo, guess that means I gotta kill everything with a gun now. Also unlocked all (thanks to Game FAQs) all the costumes. WTF is up with the Transform one, lol. Sorta makes me miss Sailor Moon.

I'll bite.

As you may have read on GameFAQs, certain weapons are obtained based on how you defeat the final boss, the time to defeat certain bosses and which difficulty you beat the game. All in all, it's based on your game ranking. The Infinite Sub-Machine Gun is obtained by defeating the final boss with a melee weapon (note that I said "defeated," that doesn't mean that is the only type of weapon you can use). The Beam Saber is also obtained when you defeat the final boss with a melee weapon on Normal or higher difficulty. There are other weapons that you can unlock, but nothing really beats the I.S.M.G.

However, when you play an Extra New Game, you will be penalized if you use a special weapon, like the unlockables. However, to view all the endings, there is a certain unlockable weapon that you have to use. As to finding all the different costumes for Heather, a different costume is unlocked each time you beat the game (assuming you get a high score each time). Some are displayed on the ranking screen after you finish the game, others are found in magazines and other read-able materials in the game.

Yet, not all the costumes codes are found in the game; certain codes were obtained from various gaming magazines which published the codes for their respective costume, though, personally, they all looked about the same and added nothing exciting to the mix. The real reason for having the costumes there were to act as incentives to unlock the ten ultra-hard survival difficulties, with the Raiden costume acting as the final reward for beating the tenth difficulty level.

But, what the most exciting things about the costumes for SH3 are, are obtained from the PC version of SH3, where you can manipulate and create you own costumes for Heather. I've posted a link to the plug-in and costume editor here before, but I'll do so again, because I'm waiting for the programmer to add the character model editor, so that you can change the skin on Heather. This means that you can replay the game as one of the other characters, i.e. Claudia, Vincent, Douglas, monsters. :wink, wink:

As far as the Princess Heart costume is concerned, it's just a joke idea, but it actually is the only costume that helps you out in the game. The Princess Heart costume acts to maintain Heather's stamina as she runs and uses weapons, meaning that she will not tire as quickly (but still only marginally). If you combine it with a certain weapon, the effects can be substantial.

There is also the rumored "Underwear Costume" which can be unlocked from the Start Menu screen. It is somehow connected to the legendary "Konami Code."

[StarZander]

But, what the most exciting things about the costumes for SH3 are, are obtained from the PC version of SH3, where you can manipulate and create you own costumes for Heather. I've posted a link to the plug-in and costume editor here before, but I'll do so again, because I'm waiting for the programmer to add the character model editor, so that you can change the skin on Heather. This means that you can replay the game as one of the other characters, i.e. Claudia, Vincent, Douglas, monsters. :wink, wink:

If, and when, this happens, I'm going to get it just for that, and play as Pyramid Head. That would rock.

[ifirit]

Look like I forgot to post the links to the SH3 modification tools. Oops. Well, here they are:

Overall link to all modification tools for the Silent Hill games (http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/silenthillmodifications/links) (Please note that inorder to view certain materials, you must be a member of Yahoo! Groups.)
Forum discussion with the log of SH3 Costume Mod. Tools (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=8836&page=1&pp=15) (Tools provided thanks to SolidSnake313.)
Another forum featuring character modeling for SH3 (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=15885) (This is an independent project, where the artist is doing everything by hand.) (Only pictures available.)

----

Speaking of Metal Gear Solid, there is apparently several references in "Snake Eater" refering to SH3, and Silent Hill in general. I'm going to get this game soon and find them for myself.

[Monobrow]

I just received a perfectly pristine, original release copy of Silent Hill 2 in the mail today for PS2.

Got me some winter vacation entertainment.

EDIT- Mine is the 666th post in this thread. DUN DUN DUN. I feel Silent Hill slowly converging around me as we speak.

Oh noes!

[UnforgivingEdges]

Someone should archive this thread. It would be a shame to lose it and all of the information/theories.

*Turns on playstation to play SH2*

EDIT- Also, it's probably been talked about and discussed at great length somewhere in the anals of this thread, but what's up with white vans in the town of Silent Hill?

There are white vans everywhere, appearing more so than any other type of car parked in the town. Also, at the beginning of Silent Hill 3, there's a white van blocking the exit from outside the mall in the alley behind the bathroom. When examined, Heather says something like "How did someone park this here anyway?" because it's wedged in so tight between the brick.

Anyways, I'm sure I'm not the only one that sees the damn things everywhere.

Also, as I have been reading through this thread tonight, a lot of the links posted are now dead. On that note, does anyone have a link handy for desktop wallpaper of some of the cooler images from the series, such as Valtiel and the hanging sisters?

Also, while we're on the subject of cool pictures that look like Silent Hill:

http://www.greatestcities.com/4942pic/477/CP14477.jpg/DU-Hochemmerich-nebel.jpg
http://www.photodelos.com/Cheaha/33a_Tony-Fog-Boardwalk.jpg

[StarZander]

Also, it's probably been talked about and discussed at great length somewhere in the anals of this thread, but what's up with white vans in the town of Silent Hill?

There are white vans everywhere, appearing more so than any other type of car parked in the town. Also, at the beginning of Silent Hill 3, there's a white van blocking the exit from outside the mall in the alley behind the bathroom. When examined, Heather says something like "How did someone park this here anyway?" because it's wedged in so tight between the brick.

Anyways, I'm sure I'm not the only one that sees the damn things everywhere.

Actually, I never ever noticed these vans, and we've never talked about them either. I can't really see anything special about them though. It is interesting that they are everywhere though. Are there no markings on them?

[Stan Tuna]

I'd guess ambulance.

Because I'm an ignorant peasant.

[Eccles]

Also, it's probably been talked about and discussed at great length somewhere in the anals of this thread, but what's up with white vans in the town of Silent Hill?
It's a simple sprite to reuse over and over and over. It's the same reason every room in Midwich Elementary has the same drawings on the walls.

Anyways...about the abundance of light in Silent Hill 4...I really didn't like it. Whereas the first three games promoted creeping about in the dark to make sure nobody saw you the fourth had no creeping, no hiding, nothing like that...just out-and-out running like hell (because killing the monsters was too much of a chore).

Some of the creepy things they did with the light could have worked but only if they put more effort into it. Like the custodian in the tower (For those who dont know, when you enter one room you hear thunderous footsteps and you see the shillouette of a person walk past the door)...it would have worked if there had been something there when you got out of the room. But the fact there was nothing made it more of a "oh..." moment than anything else.

I should probably get round to finishing four. I got to the forest the second time round and I'm supposed to be assembling the doll...I just thought "oh to hell with that" and gave up. It really did spectacularly fail to hold my attention even with the cameos and giant heads and whatnot.

[BocoDragon]

Eccles is not alone... It seems almost every Silent Hill fan regards 4 not as awful, just quite meh :|

RE: The current plot of the SH movie

It kinda worries me that they're just flipping the plot of the first game. I want the movie to be an independant entry in the SH mythos, not just a rehash. But I guess, in a way, it still fits the bill, since these are at least different characters in the roles.....

[UnforgivingEdges]

I beat Silent Hill 2 today.

All I can say is wow. The game had so many layers of meaning, and the plot was amazing....wow.

This is going down as one of my favorite games of all time. Despite being rather generic, James Sunderland is one of the best, most well-rounded characters in any story in any sort of medium (books, movies, games). I am absolutely blown away.

[ifirit]

White Vans:
I have also noticed the types of cars in the Silent Hill series, and also the white vans. However, in terms of vehicles used in the games, the most common are mini-vans and sedans. Those things were everywhere. Still, it doesn't really appear to me that any of those vehicles are important to notice, other than their placement. Most were placed along side the roads and in ditches as if they were abandoned. As with the general vagueness of the town of Silent Hill, it seems strange that people would simply abandon their cars on the street.

In terms of the ambulance, it only appears three times in the series: Alchemilla Hospital Parking Lot, Brookhaven Hospital Parking Lot, and the St. Jerome Ambulance in front of South Ashfield heights. Only in SH4, does the the ambulance play more of a role than simple background.

I could go into details about how the automobile represents a person's personal freedom, and that abandoning it is symbolic of each character's mission in Silent Hill, but it seems rather unimportant to me.

SH4 Ambience:
I agree with DDE on this one. Konami had a really great potential to create a new and terrifying experience with the use of lighting in SH4 by having independent light sources in the game, but they failed to utilize it fully. Though, there were some really great effects created, like the prison cells, the possessed wheelchairs, and apartment hauntings, most of these were subtle features and little stood out in your mind.

I'm hoping that if enough noise is made about this, but with the correct direction, we might see more substantial advances in lighting and shadow in the following games.

Silent Hill Movie Plot:
I have my doubts too about the prospects of another crappy VG movie, but I'm trying to stay positive since the film has a good production team. And I try to think of the movie like I would a remix, especially since that is how the Gans and Avary used the influence (they basically played SH1 over and over again as they were writing the script). So, the movie has some heavy influences from the game, but hopefully the creators are taking liberties with their interpretation as it transitions itself to film.

Silent Hill Dead Links:
It's true that many of the links posted in this topic have long since died, mostly due to too much traffic, resulting as a burden to the webmaster, or from lack of interest. It's a shame too, since there were so many great tidbits of information that were highly valuable to understanding the series. Although I have managed to save most of the material myself and archive many of the hidden reference material, I've never had the time to devote to a website.

But, there's good news everyone! A brand new Silent Hill website has opened up for Silent Hill 2. Letter From Silent Heaven (http://www.igotaletter.com/) is a beautiful, flash-oriented website that not only looks pretty, but also has archived the most rare and secret materials from the game.

Check it out now!

[CIaude]

I read some of the Silent Hill comic the other day...

[ILLiterate]

Wow Letter From Silent Heaven is amazing...a great achievement in fanboy/girl sites

[Firedrake]

I read some of the Silent Hill comic the other day...
Yeah, they're pretty shit.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

I've been playing SH2 reccently for someone, and I realized something durning the sequence where the Hospital changes. I'm not sure but it kinda looks like it's a first person view of James being dragged out into the courtyard.

Trying to figure out what the deal is with Stanly Coleman in SH3... I'm sure that could've been mentioned here before, guess I'll look around.

[UnforgivingEdges]

I've been playing SH2 reccently for someone, and I realized something durning the sequence where the Hospital changes. I'm not sure but it kinda looks like it's a first person view of James being dragged out into the courtyard.

I got the impression that he was looking through the eyes of Mary as she was being rolled on a gurney through the hospital (both because the view is that of a ceiling rolling rapidly by, and also her voice calling his name) that served as a sort of mind trance intermission of sorts for him to be transported to the Other hospital.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

I've been playing SH2 reccently for someone, and I realized something durning the sequence where the Hospital changes. I'm not sure but it kinda looks like it's a first person view of James being dragged out into the courtyard.

I got the impression that he was looking through the eyes of Mary as she was being rolled on a gurney through the hospital (both because the view is that of a ceiling rolling rapidly by, and also her voice calling his name) that served as a sort of mind trance intermission of sorts for him to be transported to the Other hospital.

Ah, that makes more sense. Great insight in this thread, thanks.

[ILLiterate]

http://www.vgmix.com/song_view.php?song_id=2645 I've finally finished my Silent Hill 2 remix and I'm very pleased as it is my 1st fully finished remix. I hope all of you SH fans like it :wink:
(Little sidenote to Ifrit:Compaired to what you wrote on my WIP thread you'll probably want alot more from it but I do think this is the best I could do)

[ifirit]

Bump.

[StarZander]

Bump.

[Monobrow]

I've been playing SH2 reccently for someone, and I realized something durning the sequence where the Hospital changes. I'm not sure but it kinda looks like it's a first person view of James being dragged out into the courtyard.

I got the impression that he was looking through the eyes of Mary as she was being rolled on a gurney through the hospital (both because the view is that of a ceiling rolling rapidly by, and also her voice calling his name) that served as a sort of mind trance intermission of sorts for him to be transported to the Other hospital.

I'm pretty sure that this is also a sort of nod to the movie, "Jacob's Ladder", (don't want to spoil the movie for you, so that is all I will say). The Silent Hill team seems to really use a lot of material from this movie in their games.

I always thought of SH as a sort of tribute series to the horror genre, compiling some of the best horror concepts ever created into one series. And the product is breathtaking, to say the least. But now SH has evolved into its own new special horror concept, revitalizing the horror genre in its own unique way.

Hopefully the movie will continue this.

[Kiyosuki]

No other game series has ever given me a bad dream (SH2). I think far more so than any other survival horror game, SH series plays with your own fears and insecurities on a level to where you never really feel like you have the upper hand in anything. (The one exception being Princess Heart in SH3. Then its just funny. XD)

I think out of the series SH2 is the real masterpiece here. Not even the other SH games felt as inclosed and paranoid as that game felt. Every monster had a purpose and representation in James' mind, every event had something to do with him, and eventually..the game even makes you question your trust in your own character. That alone I think made SH2 the kind of game it ended up being. Also, much of SH2 I personally think is a big metaphor for suicide. Everything James goes through is associated with his anxieties in life, and if you think about it..all the ugliness of Silent Hill and its horrifics and its intense feeling of lonliness could very well represent James' own life, all of it could be relieved with the release of death.

Maybe I'm looking into it too much but the fact there's so many interpretations of the games storyline just shows how much of an experience it was, and also the key to why its arguably one of the scariest games ever made. (For me..it certainly was the scariest because of how well it integrated your own paranoia into the game.)

The first game was very scary but I could handle it, third game was EXTREMELY warped in places (God those bloody smiling Bunnies at the fair send shivers up my spine..as did the sounds in the Subway, the sheer lonely panicy feel of the sewer systems..man.)But I was able to brave it because I was genuinly interested in finding out more about SH1's storyline. Human curiousity can cancel out a lot of things..
And 4 had some ingenius concepts but as some have said here, the game wasn't even close to its full potential.

But SH2 stood by itself. There was no curiousity at the story, only growing distrust of your own main guy..and growing dread of the world around you.

I had to play the Prison area of 2 very, very slowly...its almost embarassing but well..fear tends to be doesn't it?

Personally, I think the most ingenius thing about the Silent Hill series..is the way Konami does its main characters. I think the central key to making a game scary is your main character. If you played ...Devil May Cry..with a regular average joe, it'd be scary as hell wouldn't it? But you play as badass Dante..so you're not afraid anymore, you wanna kick ass!
Resident Evil has been scary at times, especially the first/REmake where no matter how badass your character was, you felt totally disadvantaged no matter what you did. But your character's are relatively fearless and sporting a mastery of an enormous arsenal of insane weapons that you *know* will hurt the bad guys..a lot. Basically..you may be normal, but your still pretty badass.

But in Silent Hill, your characters who are as normal as you csn get. You never feel totally professional with your weapons, your character shows signs of paralyzing fear at times, they get tired, and even worse..you may be able to use weapons..but your never 100% sure weither its even really doing anything real..of imagined.

Harry was kind of a putz, a lovable putz but a putz. James was interesting and sympathetic..but also strangely vulnerable as well as almost questionable, and Heather feels so fragile and delicate, as well as lost.

IMO one thing that goes to Silent Hill 4 not being that scary, is Henry Townsend is actually kind of badass in a normal "your tough next door neighbor" kind of way. He has no real connection to the events happening around him, nor any reason to really feel guilty or paranoid about anything that happens to him, he's just a sturdy guy that was at the wrong place at the wrong time (and wants to save the girl. XD) That single handedly brought down a lot of the horror factor because I believe if you have real, honest faith in your character, you don't feel as vulnerable.

[Kiyosuki]

I'm sorry..I gotta ask one thing..

In Silent Hill 4..

SPOILER

In the Hospital, was anyone else extremely freaked out by the giant Eileen head that just stares at you? I mean...wtf is up with that? lol. I had braved a lot of stuff in the Silent Hill series but for some reason, that head made me pause and put down the controller for a sec. There was something just so..random and freightening about it. Just imagine going about your business, then suddenlly you go into a room..thats being blocked by a giant head that looks like your best friend, that just states at you menacingly..that'd make me wet my pants 100%.

So I gotta ask, do you guys think it represented something? Or was it just there for random scare sakes? Its something I've thought about even a month after beating the game. I'm assuming its Walter's power "taunting" Henry's concern for Eileen, but is there something else?

[The Instrument of GAWD]

SPOILERS AND RANTINGS

Hah, I got SH4 for X-Mas, and I'm in the Subway -2nd time-. First thing that crossed my mind was "oh goodie, i have to go through all these damn places again?" Still what I'm thinking, cause that's where I stopped for the time being.

AND WTF IS UP WITH THE ROOM?! MAN! I go into the kitchen and the shoes hurt me! Go to the save book and the windows hurt me! GOD DAMN!

Alright, the adrenline from playing has started to settle. About the room, I put a candle near the hole in the washer/dryer room, but it was gone when I came back. Is it something I did/didn't do? Oh yeah, I didn't pick up the doll the long haired dude left behind either... Instinicts (and something I thought I heard before) told me not to.

I know I could look this up at GameFAQs, but I'd rather not touch that until I beat it... And I wanted a reason to bump this thread... And ya know, post count +1.

P.S. yeah, still alittle excited from the game... <__<; >__>;

[Midvalley The Horn Freak]

AND WTF IS UP WITH THE ROOM?! MAN! I go into the kitchen and the shoes hurt me! Go to the save book and the windows hurt me! GOD DAMN!

The room becomes possesed when you go to the hospital world. You have to use a holy candle in the area where the hauntings are taking place and place a candle in the area. Make sure you watch the candle burn out too so that it clears the haunting. There's still a chance the haunting will come back, but if you watch the candle burn out, it makes sure that it doesn't stay there when you return to your room. Also use the radio to tell if your house is haunted if you don't see anything. It will emit static if there is a haunting.

[Midvalley The Horn Freak]

I think out of the series SH2 is the real masterpiece here. Not even the other SH games felt as inclosed and paranoid as that game felt.

There was a lot of elements in the other Silent Hills that made the games feel paranoiac. The sounds that would que in certain areas, going into the morgue in Silent Hill 3 and seeing all the dead bodies, hoping that they wouldn't move. (not to mention when one of them says Heathers' name) Going back into your room and not knowing what's going to be haunted next in Silent Hill 4. Silent Hill 1 was probably one of the most paranoiac game because no one really knew what to expect. It was the first of it's kind. I remember the first time I had to venture out into the fog and couldn't see more then 10 feet in front of me made me a little paranoid. Then on top of that, being able to hear the monsters but not being able know where their at made me very paranoid.

Every monster had a purpose and representation in James' mind, every event had something to do with him, and eventually..the game even makes you question your trust in your own character. That alone I think made SH2 the kind of game it ended up being.

Every monster does serve a purpose in the Silent Hill games. The reason why the monsters of Silent Hill 2 were much more clearer in their purpose was that the focus was mainly on James. In Silent Hill 1 the focus was on Harry and Cheryl. In Silent Hill 4 the focus was on Walter Sullivan. Silent Hill 3 was focused on Heather so that's why a lot of monsters are much clearer (i.e. numb bodies representing the fetus inside of Heather and the Split-Faces representing the two lives Heather had). I don't believe trust in a character effects the game play in terms of it being scary. I trusted James all the way until I found out what he did but I was still frightened my most of the game. I trusted Henry and was scared just the same. It's more about the games elements and what the game does to try and scare you more then it is about whether you can trust the main character or not.

Also, much of SH2 I personally think is a big metaphor for suicide. Everything James goes through is associated with his anxieties in life, and if you think about it..all the ugliness of Silent Hill and its horrifics and its intense feeling of lonliness could very well represent James' own life, all of it could be relieved with the release of death.

That's a very good interpretation of the game. I had never really thought of it in that light before.



The first game was very scary but I could handle it, third game was EXTREMELY warped in places (God those bloody smiling Bunnies at the fair send shivers up my spine..as did the sounds in the Subway, the sheer lonely panicy feel of the sewer systems..man.)But I was able to brave it because I was genuinly interested in finding out more about SH1's storyline. Human curiousity can cancel out a lot of things..

true, but curiosity also makes you want to continue and find out the answers. Just from the beginning, Silent Hill 1 made the player want to continue and find out more about the town and why it acts the way it does. Silent Hill 3 made the player want to find out why Heather is so special and why is the town calling to her. Silent Hill 4 made the player want to find out why is Henry being trapped in his room, why can't he get out, why does his room act the way it does and what is the deal with the room. Silent Hill 2 made me want to know why a dead person is sending letters to the main character and that pretty much about it. I was scared by Silent Hill 2 but it never made we want to go the extra mile into the wee hours in the morning to find out more. I got it for Christmas one year and didn't finish it until a week later yet I rented Silent Hill 4 and beat it a couple days, same with Silent Hill 3 (I used a Walkthrough on them all :oops:). The drive and motivation wasn't there for me to continue. If there is nothing to be curious about then what is the point of playing a game. It's like if you went to a movie and knew why everything was the way it was from the beginning it would be one boring movie.


But SH2 stood by itself. There was no curiousity at the story, only growing distrust of your own main guy..and growing dread of the world around you.

The was curiosity in the game. Why is it that his wife sent him the letter? Why can't Laura see any monsters and also why is she in the town. If the only people that appear in the town are people that have some kind of deed that would catch the towns interest such as Angela or Eddie's past, what is it that Laura did. The only other person that this applies to would be Cybil in Silent Hill 1.

I had to play the Prison area of 2 very, very slowly...its almost embarassing but well..fear tends to be doesn't it?

heh, that's how I have to play all the games :oops: . I never liked scary movies or games but for some reason I always play Silent Hill games. I think I'm addicted to the storyline.

Personally, I think the most ingenius thing about the Silent Hill series..is the way Konami does its main characters. I think the central key to making a game scary is your main character. If you played ...Devil May Cry..with a regular average joe, it'd be scary as hell wouldn't it? But you play as badass Dante..so you're not afraid anymore, you wanna kick ass!
Resident Evil has been scary at times, especially the first/REmake where no matter how badass your character was, you felt totally disadvantaged no matter what you did. But your character's are relatively fearless and sporting a mastery of an enormous arsenal of insane weapons that you *know* will hurt the bad guys..a lot. Basically..you may be normal, but your still pretty badass.

That's true to a extent. Yeah you do feel a little more secure with some with a background with weapons and training but there is still a fear in the game. RE was still a very frightening game when it was first released because it had something that even Silent Hill uses, the element of surprise. When you first played RE and the dogs break through the windows in the hallway, that had to scare the crap out of you because it was something you weren't suspecting. Silent Hill does the same with noises, the hauntings from 4, the fog, or other situations (Borley House anyone?)Or in Silent Hill 4 in the Hospital world when the false ceiling drops down, I thought I was screwed. Also the wash room in 3 was something that I didn't expect and the more I stared in the mirror the less I took notice in my world until it started to reflect into the world I was in. On an off-hand topic, I wonder how Devil May Cry would fair as a Horror game...It has the bad camera angles for it :D

But in Silent Hill, your characters who are as normal as you csn get. You never feel totally professional with your weapons, your character shows signs of paralyzing fear at times, they get tired, and even worse..you may be able to use weapons..but your never 100% sure weither its even really doing anything real..of imagined.

The characters in RE were still effected by their surroundings like the main characters of Silent Hill were. When the Tyrant breaks out of the glass in the end of RE 1, Jill freezes up and doesn't break out a grenade launcher and opens fire but cowers in fear for a bit. They were all human and shared the same feelings with the Silent Hill characters, they just didn't show it as much because the game was based more on survival with horror on the side, while Silent Hill is well balanced if not more emphasis on horror.

IMO one thing that goes to Silent Hill 4 not being that scary, is Henry Townsend is actually kind of badass in a normal "your tough next door neighbor" kind of way. He has no real connection to the events happening around him, nor any reason to really feel guilty or paranoid about anything that happens to him, he's just a sturdy guy that was at the wrong place at the wrong time (and wants to save the girl. XD) That single handedly brought down a lot of the horror factor because I believe if you have real, honest faith in your character, you don't feel as vulnerable.

While Henry may have been the bravest in the bunch (I think he ties with Harry) I don't think he ranks as bad-ass status nor do I think his toughness effects the game any. He was left with no choice anyways, it was either cower in his room and wait for his turn or it was take action and try to save himself. Harry had to look for his daughter, Heather was first trying to save her own life but then she was out for vengeance and information. James on the other hand, was the one who really didn't have to go to Silent Hill. Yeah he got a letter but he could have ignored it and gone on with his life, if he was living one at all. The point I'm trying to get at is that all the main characters with the exception of James had no other alternative, they had to continue with their path no matter how frightening or trying it was. It wasn't really a matter of whose tough and not but rather who was stuck and who wasn't. Also The fact that Henry is an innocent man with no dark past, no guilt and no connections to Silent Hill other then visiting it once gave the game a different kind of fear. Instead of just asking the question what? gamers instead asked the question why? Why am I a target? Why are innocent people (with the exception of DeSalvo) being targeted? Why can't I do anything to help people? Why can't anyone hear me? Why is my room acting this way? Despair was a theme of the game and fear can derive from despair and hopelessness. It also gave the feeling of paranoia because you were always wondering whose next and when is it going to be me? I just don't see how honesty and trust in a person can effect fear in a game. As I had said before, I trusted James up to when I found out what he did just as much as I trusted Harry, Heather or Henry and I was scared by all the games all the same.

[Kiyosuki]

Yeah I don't think Henry was exactly badass either, I made a poor choice in words.

Its very hard to describe..but he doesn't feel as "vulnerable" as the previous 3 main characters felt. I suspect maybe its because the other 3 had some kind of deeply intertwined connection to the events happening in the game, connections which made you feel a little helpless to an extent. You questioned weither Harry was in a repeating hell or not because of the new game scenerio, James a victim of his own self pity and anger, and Heather being connected to the center of it all. Henry feels literally..more like the random guy who just got caught up in it. He has no psychologically scarring vulnerabilities that help Spawn silent hill, nor does he have some kind of liability caught up in everything. He has no connection to the entire Silent Hill history aside from Walter targeting him for the 21st Sacrament. He's just there, and he wants to save the girl. :D

I don't know how to describe it exactly, but to me Henry felt the least vulnerable of all the characters. Almost like a third party.

On the RE characters. Maybe its just me, but generally the tenseness I feel when playing a RE game is more along the lines of being chased, rather than sheer paranoia that makes Silent Hill so hard to play. Part of that is even though a character like..Jill for example does show signs of being a little in over her head, she still has certain cut scenes that give you the impression that she's much more cut out for this kind of thing than someone like James or Heather. The first RE was definitely freaky but that was because it really was the first time any of us played anything like that. But as RE's gone on that initial shock has sort of waned as your charcter's just get more and more armed to the teeth with weapons that could make God cry. XD Although I do think RE4 is a huge step in the right direction from what I've seen, I so can't wait for that. Its more a cosmetic thing with the SH character's, but the little things like your character's tending to have poor aim futher in range, breathing after a period of walking and the fact in all cut scenes they never really feel like they have the situation under control I thought was just an ingenius design detail.

And yeah, the atmosphere in SH is definitely in part of the fact it only emphasizes things, rather than spell it out. Perfect example is when James finds the room with the TV running, and the dead guy in the chair. Aside from the fact camera hacks have helped you see that its him, when first playing you had no idea if it was actually him. You just assumed..that uncertainty is why even a relatively tame in comparison game like SH4 still gives me the creeps when playing. Silence is a sound too.

So the general word is that people didn't like Silent Hill 4 that much compared to the previous ones. I can sort of see why, although I did like it a lot still. (Still much more sophisticated than your typical Survival Horror outing.)

But I'm curious, what do you guys think could of been done to the game to have made it more of a successful experiment? The idea's behind the game are definitely very good, but the main thing I keep hearing is that it didn't meet its potential. In your opinion what could of helped it reach that? And I've played the whole thing so don't worry about Spoilers.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

James finds the room with the TV running, and the dead guy in the chair. Aside from the fact camera hacks have helped you see that its him, when first playing you had no idea if it was actually him.

Really? That was James dead in the chair? I thought it was a random person... like Eddie.

I'm curious, what do you guys think could of been done to the game to have made it more of a successful experiment? The idea's behind the game are definitely very good, but the main thing I keep hearing is that it didn't meet its potential. In your opinion what could of helped it reach that? And I've played the whole thing so don't worry about Spoilers.

Right off the top of my head, I think they could've done with out the chest and limited carrying space. That's a reason why I started to like SH over RE.
Saving was fine tho.

I felt that The Room itself could've been alittle more interactive, perhapse I say that because it reminded me so much of Shenmue. I mean things like, scurrying through closets, cupboards and drawers with more of Henry's comments on such things, but that would probably make it more boring.

The Ghosts could've been alittle less of a pain in the ass...

Meh, anyway, I suppose this would be the best place to post this.

http://quizilla.com/users/Twardz/quizzes/Which%20Silent%20Hill%20hero%20are%20you%3F

Lemme know what ya get, k?

[Kiyosuki]

I are like Henry. XD

Hurray for mentally stable people! lol



Spoiler I really gotta remember to do this..

And yeah, although when playing your not supposed to really know for certain who's in the chair. I suspected from first playing that it was James, but I never really completely knew. But a few months ago someone camera hacked SH2 so you could see certain things, and the guy in the chair is definitely a dead James. Perhaps its a metaphor saying that a large part of James died in that room 3 days ago..

[Eccles]

Spoiler that pertains to the semi-spoiler in the previous posrIn the making of Silent Hill 2 DVD the games director said that the guy in the chair was James (as is the dead guy at the end of the alleyway that you get a key from)...and that they did this for two specific reasons. The first was to save rendering another man, but the second, more important one, was to represent how James' nightmares are coming true (about Silent Hill and himself)

[Arigeitsu159]

***Possible Spoilers****

Okay, so I've kept Eileen pretty much in good health throughout the entire game and she tends to walk relatively slow during the final battle with Walter..., but has anyone come up with a sure fire way to kill him quickly? I mean, for a nutjob, he sure has a body of steel... come on, I unload 36 revolver bullets in the guy and he's still standing. I take him out with the shovel because that weapon seems to stop his attacks when fully charged, but in the end... Eileen still ends up dead.

If someone could tell me how they've pulled it off thus far, I'd appreciate it.

Either that, or direct me to a site that has video files of the endings, that'd be appreciated as well seeing as how seach engines weren't helful.

[M@]

If I remember correctly, until you pull all the spears from the bodies surrounding the arena and stab them into the bigger body after feeding it the umbilical cord, Walter is invincible.

[Arigeitsu159]

If I remember correctly, until you pull all the spears from the bodies surrounding the arena and stab them into the bigger body after feeding it the umbilical cord, Walter is invincible.

I do that, but the guy still takes forever to take down. I had the game in Hard Mode when I battled him, but dang, I've never seen a final boss take so much damage before biting the dust.

[Kiyosuki]

Daddy! Look a SPOILER.

Oh my poor Ch**** Anyone who complains about this spoiler's gonna get some BUSTED HEADS!

Alright Dad! Your the coolest!

The damage rating for Eileen is really odd..

I know your supposed to keep her safe, but there are lots of times where I've really put her in a lot of danger (for the sake of helping me fight), fights that look like she'd end up getting really fucked up, but she ends up walking away without a scratch and ends up walking really slowly just fine at the end.

Like one time I took Walter on, and she helped me and took a direct blow from him. I thought she was finished but low and behold, she's just as healthy as when I first got her and in the end, ended up walking snail like pacing at the end. Does this happen to anyone else? Its like...her just being you you constantly helpes her keep her sanity and health. The only times she's ever gotten more cursed is when I left her alone, she's pretty much with me all the time now usually. It was actually more of a challenge to get Eileen's Death or the 21 Sacraments endings to get her to die..

It was pretty awsome having both Eileen and Henry whacking away on Walter too. :D

[ifirit]

Silent Hill 4 Spoilers

Walter is tough to beat, but one method for beating him involves running around toward his back while keeping you distance. You should have tried to save all your revolver bullets for this fight, especially since there aren't any other boss battles.

When he aims his gun at you, try to be at his side, so that he has to turn around to face you. As he turns, unload two or three shots (three if you are quick enough). And then run towards his back again. Wash, rinse, repeat until you've run out to ammo. It usually just takes a couple of hits from a malee weapon to kill him after that.

Another method involves using the golf clubs. They are quick and deal good damage. Unfortunately, they break during the fight. That's why you would have to take several with you to fight. The irons deal much more damage than the woods, and the 9-iron is my favorite. If you hadn't been collecting golf clubs in the game, or used them all up. You can usually pick up more from dead "Gumheads."

You still need to get Walter lower his guard during the fight. I suggest you try running behind him, but in a much closer range. Be careful, because he will counterspin if you get too close. Since, the golf clubs have long range, you don't have to stay too close. You can usually make three hits before Walter counters. Hitting him while he charges up his malee weapon will also allow you to do some damage without being countered, but make sure you don't get hit.

The Walter fight is simply a matter of how efficiently you can play the game. The less damage you take, the more time you have to deal damage and not bother healing. So make sure to dodge as much as you can. (R1 and L1 buttons help while arming your weapon.)

EDIT: To understand the workings of how Eileen recieves damage and understand what requirements are needed for the Eileen endings, please check this thread. (The Definitive Eileen Thread [Spoilers]) (http://www.silenthillforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=14989)

[cfG-21]

Ok, I’ve heard some interesting theories, so I’d like to present my own views on the overall plot of Silent Hill.

Firstly, we must consider the town of Silent Hill to be alive. Not alive in the traditional sense you would apply to people or animals, but it has a presence. A consciousness. Silent Hill is composed of two sides, good and evil, light and dark, etc., just like a person. This presence has a name, as we find out in the first game: Samaael (spelling?). Although the Paganist cult that inhabited Silent Hill in the old days worshipped Samaael as a god, we can through playing the game realize he is a malevolent entity. Further, he wishes to be made manifest on earth. We know he nearly achieves this with Alessa however many years ago that was. Alessa is chosen for one of two reasons, either of which could be true. The first reason takes into account Alessa’s eternal sickness and pain, and Samaael takes advantage of her weakened state and seeks to enter her soul. The second possible reason, and one that I personally prefer, involves something special about Alessa’s soul. Some quality about it catches Samaael’s attention, and he slowly infects her (hence the disease). Fortunately for humanity Dhalia kills Alessa, and her soul escapes. I’m borrowing from Eccles’s theory here, in regards to immense pain causing the soul to wander even after the body dies. Now then, Alessa’s soul eventually settles into a new form: Cheryl. We can infer this because of the opening movie. There is a scene in which Harry and his wife lift up a baby Cheryl in what seems to be a graveyard. I’m thinking that Harry is not blood-related to his daughter and rather found her. Thus we have Alessa’s new form, or perhaps Alessa has simply been reborn. At any rate this “special soul” now exists again, and Samaael wishes to possess it to further his goal. It seems in addition to the “special soul” Samaael’s power naturally attracts people who are “guilty” or simply unbalanced. These guilty ones end up either succumbing to Samaael’s power or fighting against him. Jump a few years later, and we have the events of the first Silent Hill. Harry is drawn to it, Cheryl becomes Alessa, is taken by Samaael, and Harry defeats Alessa/Samaael and escapes. One point up for argument is whether Samaael was in total control of Alessa. It is quite possible that she had some control and was able to suppress the power of Samaael. I think this could easily account for the “nightmare” and “normal” versions of Silent Hill to trade places as time passes. So, Samaael is defeated, but not killed. Perhaps he cannot die.

A short time later (we assume, since we get no concrete dates on this), Samaael has regained some strength and once again calls out to people. He does not know who he needs to help him, so three people respond: Angela, Eddie, and James. Although each has individual reasons for returning (Angela wants to find her mother and/or confront her father; Eddie feels the need to return, possibly to repent for the dog slaying and the numerous other murders he likely committed; and James returns to find Mary). It certainly is an active reach for people, as Eddie says “this town called you too!” In addition, a little girl is drawn. Laura is there perhaps to fill the need for the “special soul.” It is clear that Samaael’s power is not fully in check, as all of his “guilty” candidates spiral out of control into their own tortured minds. Angela lives in fear of imagined father-monsters and eventually submits to the flames of her mind; Eddie feels guilt for killing people and in his paranoia thinks James insults him and attacks; and James searches for his dead wife, eventually realizing he killed her, then fights a demonized version of her as his mind spirals down into itself (hence James’s preoccupation for holes).

And so, later after that…Silent Hill 3. Samaael has returned to power, and the story starts over again. I haven’t played much of SH3 so I can’t offer theories on it. But perhaps this is all wrong and I totally missed the boat on the old SH plotline. But it is interesting, no?

btw i have not read much but at this point i would like to point out that sammael is satan. check out this link on this online encyclopedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samael. Ironically silent hill is mentioned also.

Quote formt he site. "Samael is an important figure in Talmudic and post-Talmudic lore, a figure who is accuser, seducer, and destroyer. Legends referring to Satan refer equally to him, such that Samael is often taken to be the true or angelic name of the Devil, as opposed to the epithet Lucifer or the job title Satan (Adversary).

Samael is etymologized as "the venom of God," since he is sometimes identified with the Angel of death. But the name could also be derived from that of the Syrian god Shemal. Samael is also identified with the Choronzon entity of the Elizabethan ceremonial magician John Dee, and of Aleister Crowley."

also check out the silent hill article on this online encylopedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silent_Hill

Lastly i would like to point out that the worship of idols before europeans took over and the cult that the lady in silent hill has are different but they influence the game. The cult that she has is satanic from a different branch from the popular satanic branches in the us. It is beleived it stems from the jewish mysticism known as kaballah (no i am not saying jews are evil and yes i am christian and not anti-semite). My friend had a copy of the kaballah which and had a symbol of a pentagram but it was facing up and not down like the satanists do. Basically there have been cults derived from it and there are incantations in it in which they call upon angels just like that one lady wants to call on that demon to be born out of that young girl. for info on that check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaballah

[cfG-21]

ntw another supposed angel metatron is mentioned in the series (good angel on the side of God)

[cfG-21]

the other angel is metatron mentioned by some stone that you get. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metatron

not trying to sound like a nerd or anything but just letting epople know

[ifirit]

Silent Hill 4 Easter Eggs:
For those of you who are interested in the hidden items from the game (or those who have already started collecting their own easter eggs), I'm starting a list of some obvious and not-so-obvious easter eggs hidden in "The Room."

Egg #1: Robbie the Rabbit Plushie
Location: Eileen's Room (via peephole behind cabinet)
Description: A stuffed toy.
Reference: Silent Hill 3 - Lakeside Amusement Park Mascot
Image: http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_caps_105 (Thanks to Maskrider for the image and a great website.)

Egg #2: Robbie the Rabbit Balloon
Location: Ashfield Heights Apartment Complex (via windows in Rm. 302)
Description: A pink balloon floating with string attached.
Reference: Silent Hill 3 - Lakeside Amusement Park Mascot
Image: http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_2pass_extra_2 (Thanks to Maskrider for the image.)

Egg #3: hospital.co.jp
Location: Hospital World (aka St. Jerome's Hospital) - Operating Room
Description: Web address for medical supplies and services. (Address appears on cylinder tanks near door.)
Reference: http://www.hospital.co.jp
Image: http://www.geocities.com/jonnsmithy/url.jpg (Thanks to JonnSmithy aka SlavaOzonov for the image. Image is geocities, so image will not always be available.)

Egg #4: Rabbit
Location: Rm. 302 - Front Door (after using the "Keys of Liberation")
Description: Not really an easter egg, but the chains on the door form an outline of a rabbit with the peephole acting as the eye. (I note this because Konami did this with several textures in the game, trying to make something look like something else, i.e. the face on the wall in the intro, the demon on the wall in the storage space, ect.)
Reference: White Rabbit - Alice in Wonderland
Image: http://www.geocities.com/jonnsmithy/rabbit.jpg (Thanks to JonnSmithy aka SlavaOzonov for the image. Image is geocities, so image will not always be available.)

Egg #5: Midwich School Bus
Location: Ashfield Heights Apartment Complex (via windows in Rm. 302)
Description: Vehicle that randomly passes on the street in front of the apartment.
Reference: Silent Hill 1 - Midwich Elementary School & bus (though the bus in that game was the "short bus").
Hint: The bus randomly appears throughout the game, however, it appears more often while visiting "Prison World" the first time. In order to view the writing on the bus, try watching during a cut-scene of the street, i.e. Cynthia outside subway, ambulance scenes, ect.

Egg #6: Toliet Clog
Location: Rm. 302 - Bathroom Toliet
Description: Running gag in the SH series
Reference: Silent Hill 2 - Safe Combination Clue (In order to retrieve the clue to open the safe, James fished it from the toliet.)
Image:Image 1 (http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_sh2ref_1) / Image 2 (http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_sh2ref_2) (Thanks to Maskrider for the image.)

Egg #7: Chainsaw (Idle)
Location: Second Gameplay - After obtaining Chainsaw
Description: Idle animation for the Chainsaw; funny to watch
Reference: Silent Hill 2 - James Chainsaw Idle Animation (Henry does not scream like James.)
Image: http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_chainsaw_001 (Thanks to Maskrider for the image.)

Egg #8: Channeling Stones
Location: Game Cheat
Description: Remains from a scrapped UFO Ending. The items can be placed in your inventory through a GameShark, Action Replay, or other game hacking device. The codes are listed below.
Reference: Silent Hill - UFO Endings (most specifically with Silent Hill 1; the channeling stone was the item used to unlock the UFO ending when used in the targetted locations.)
Code (GameShark for PS2):
Master Code:98368157 7848D201
2816ED40 F7427A65
2816EDD8 A1269A6B
2816EDED 6DC8C42B
2816ED03 01E23EE5
2816EDF7 B1C37A65
2816ED54 A1A774EA
2816ED01 DB137AF1
Item Code (Slot 1):28474265 FCE87A65
1847426F 0CA57A56
1847426A 0CA57A4A
Additional Info: The channeling stone was originally supposed to be a dirty stone that you can wash to reveal the channeling stone, but since the UFO ending was scrapped before the game was completed, it still shows up in the inventory, but is not washable. In addition to the channeling stone, there were two more items that were never released in the game, but the code still exists: the crimson oil and the special key. Images are below.
Images: Channeling Stone (http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_chstone_1) / Dirty Stone (http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_dirtystone_1) / Crimson Oil (http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_redoil_eng) / Special Key (http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_spkey_eng) (Thanks again to Maskrider for the images.)

My theory is that there were supposed to be a large amount of endings as Akira Yamaoka stated during the production of the game. However, somewhere along the line, they were too pressed for time and scrapped the projects, despite the fact that they already began coding for those endings.

Anyway, this is not the definative guide to all the easter eggs in the game, or even the secrets, but I wanted to start to spread the word about them. If anybody has something else they want to add, feel free to.

[Kiyosuki]

When I looked in the peephole and saw Robbie pointing at Henry, that seriously freaked me out..

Its really too bad they didn't put in the UFO ending, its such a long standing tradition. Plus since it seems like the character's keep collecting in them (Like how Its Harry in the first one, then its James and Harry in the second, then its Heather, James, and Harry in the third.) So much potential for enormous comedy having all these characters acumulate after a while, especially if the ending is done in a funny art style like Silent Hill 3's. :D

Oh well.

[Tranquil Chaos]

I was never interested in the UFO endings. Always thought they were stupid.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

**SPOILERS**

Hah, I finally beat SH4 last night. I had to reset it afew time before I figured out I was suppose to go in the hole were Walter's body was. That pissed me off, I didn't think it was accessible. I also had to reset once durning the last fight, upon figuring out how close you had to be to use the imbibical cord. I only reset cause Eileen was turned into hamburger.

The ending I got "Mother"... I really didn't understand it... unless it just meant that Eileen was alright (besides from being reccently knocked bloody) and that The Room was bloody and rusty the whole time and Henry was actually dreaming when it looked normal? I could continue on saying that I would believe that Eileen somehow conceived Walter... After all, they called her the Holy Mother and the ending is called "Mother"... I dunno, this is just my half assed speculation...

On a different note, this one took me alot of time to finish; 10 hours. I believe that it took me 17 hours to finish SH1 tho'. Anyway tho, this exprince was a rather nerve racking one, I started to feel rather anxious torwards the end. Mainly becuase of the back-and-forth-ism, but the BGM and the atomsphere did alot too. There was a point where I was thinking "what if that happen to me?" Of course it probably couldn't, but you can't help but to think that because The Room seems like any other appartment that I've seen.

Alright, that's enough of me...

[Kiyosuki]

Major Spoiler:

The Mother ending makes the least sense out of the 4 endings I think, but in my opinion what I think it is, is a way of telling you that although you escaped (As Henry), in a way Eileen didn't, as the evil left by Walter still infests the Room and will eventually infest the rest of the building again. Basically a way of saying that you didn't escape the danger really. Another thing it could mean is that in order to finally put everything to rest, you had to not only save Eileen but also erase any indication of Walter/young Walter's existence there, which meant purifying the room as much as you could. So in escape..you do literally escape, the soul of young Walter is finally put to rest and the curse of Samael and all the cult's evil is lifted from the building, thus you have nothing holding you there anymore, and nothing will come after you, you're free. Where as in Mother, maybe Eileen says she can go back to her apartment because the evil is still there, and its drawing her back, and will probably draw Henry back for Eileen's sake. In other words, you're out of the red now, but its only a matter of time until the Room beckons you or another again..

Eileen seems so unnaturally calm with the idea of going back to that dreadful place (Hell, even if It is purified, if I was in my right mind I wouldn't even step foot in there again!) So naturally..maybe she's not thinking totally like herself..maybe since you didn't erase Walter's presense in the room..his mission will eventually continue after a while.

So really..

21 Sacraments: Your ultimate failure, you lose not only your life, but your love's life and the eventual lives of countless people.

Eileen's death: You escape yourself by erasing all ties to the room, but its a bittersweet and ultimatly "James like" situation that you'll probably be scared for life with. In a way..you don't escape because of the grief.

Mother: You save Eileen but you didn't take care of the curse, so it may come back to haunt you again...

Escape: You truly escape, the curse is lifted and can never again touch you, you saved Eileen, and the two of you can move on away from the horrible events and continue with your normal lives. You are teh Hero! XD

[ifirit]

Just wanted to give you guys a little...

Silent Hill Movie Update:
With filming beginning in just a few short weeks, tension is mounting about who will be cast in the upcoming film. Although every Silent Hill forum has at least one thread about "who will be cast in the Silent Hill movie," who actually gets picked it up to anybody's guess. However, Roger Avary (http://www.avary.com/rogeravary/journal/archive/2005_01_01_journalarchive.php#'110468482106898266' ) is shooting for a certain young actress to get a part in the movie. (Though who gets picked is out of his hands, which means we'll all find out together.)

What's most interesting about this entry (which seems plastered all over the internet), is that he hints at there being nurses in the movie. This adds further suggestion that the movie will be live action acting as a reinterpretation of the first game.

Well, for now the feelings among many of the online posters is projected in their anthem: Don't f**k it up. Won't you join the bandwagon?

[Arigeitsu159]

When I looked in the peephole and saw Robbie pointing at Henry, that seriously freaked me out..

What part of the game do you see that part? I never saw that.

BTW, I read your analysis of the endings and thought they were pretty interesting... particularly, the "Mother" Ending, since I thought the ending itself didn't make much sense. Thanks for sharing. :)

[StarZander]

Just wanted to give you guys a little...

Silent Hill Movie Update:
With filming beginning in just a few short weeks, tension is mounting about who will be cast in the upcoming film. Although every Silent Hill forum has at least one thread about "who will be cast in the Silent Hill movie," who actually gets picked it up to anybody's guess. However, Roger Avary (http://www.avary.com/rogeravary/journal/archive/2005_01_01_journalarchive.php#'110468482106898266' ) is shooting for a certain young actress to get a part in the movie. (Though who gets picked is out of his hands, which means we'll all find out together.)

What's most interesting about this entry (which seems plastered all over the internet), is that he hints at there being nurses in the movie. This adds further suggestion that the movie will be live action acting as a reinterpretation of the first game.

Well, for now the feelings among many of the online posters is projected in their anthem: Don't f**k it up. Won't you join the bandwagon?


I can't recall if you've posted this but, the guy who is designing the creatures/monsters in this movie is Patrick Tatopoulos, who has made several great monster design in previous movies (i.e. Godzilla, Independence Day etc.) and he is quite skilled. But I think it will be a challenge for even him to create the twisted creatures that frequent the SH games. But if anyone can do it, it's probably him.

[Kiyosuki]

When I looked in the peephole and saw Robbie pointing at Henry, that seriously freaked me out..

What part of the game do you see that part? I never saw that.

BTW, I read your analysis of the endings and thought they were pretty interesting... particularly, the "Mother" Ending, since I thought the ending itself didn't make much sense. Thanks for sharing. :)

When Eileen is beaten and after the first journey through the alternate Apartment, when you look in the hole the bunny doll on the chair just points at you. Its really unnerving, mostly because that thing gives me the creeps. I hate dolls..

[Arigeitsu159]

When I looked in the peephole and saw Robbie pointing at Henry, that seriously freaked me out..

What part of the game do you see that part? I never saw that.

BTW, I read your analysis of the endings and thought they were pretty interesting... particularly, the "Mother" Ending, since I thought the ending itself didn't make much sense. Thanks for sharing. :)

When Eileen is beaten and after the first journey through the alternate Apartment, when you look in the hole the bunny doll on the chair just points at you. Its really unnerving, mostly because that thing gives me the creeps. I hate dolls..

Ah, the bunny... I see. Didn't know he had a name. :) Yeah, it was sort of funny/creepy the way it pointed at you after Eileen got carved into.

[Eccles]

Alright, ladies and germs...It's been a while.

The "Andrew thorley was bored in college one day" troupe proudly presents its latest presentation of an andy thorley presentation:
SILENT HILL 1: THE SIM CITY 2000 MAP (http://home.comcast.net/~andydthorley/silent_hill.sc2)

I had to take certain liberties with the map...The mountain, for instance, is there because Harry slides down it at the beginning of SH1...and there are several roads that werent there in the original (but these are only here because in SH1 they taper off into nothingness and I couldnt have that)...oh, and I put in a power station and power cables (cause, y'know, the residents are gonna be pretty pissed if you dont have power).

I've put in several notable landmarks...Alchemilla is on there...so is the SHPD station and Midwich Elementary, but the rest of the map is empty so you can develop it how you see fit.

Enjoy!

[Aetherius]

It amuses me how the first 8 pages are so unbelieveably crazy-wrong in their theories...

mostly, because...All of SH1 is explained in SH3, yet people still theorize, contradicting the explanations, even after playing the game....silly children.

And...SH4 rocks my world, yo.

[ifirit]

It amuses me how the first 8 pages are so unbelieveably crazy-wrong in their theories...

mostly, because...All of SH1 is explained in SH3, yet people still theorize, contradicting the explanations, even after playing the game....silly children.

And...SH4 rocks my world, yo.

Silent Hill 1 and 3 Spoilers

That's because in Silent Hill 1, there is a scape goat that prevents the story of SH1 from being entirely concrete and wholly contained. Silent Hill 3 is a "what if" sequel to Silent Hill. What if Harry had escaped from Silent Hill with the infant Cheryl/Alessa.

Nothing from the first story is definitive. Nothing from any sequel is definitive. The only things we derive from the games is the personality of characters, the characteristics of the town, and the nature of the religious happenings the revolve around the story. What we hope to conclude from these things is an accurate depiction of the plotline and the basis for future stories.

Not to really pick at you, Aetherius. It's just that there are certain conditions that apply when declaring a certain story aspect to present. What the aim of this thread is to establish a basic understanding of the Silent Hill world in the way that Konami presents, but to allow people to develop ideas, reasonings, consequences, fan-fictions, ect. from a standard basis that everyone understands. Otherwise, we go through having to explain the same things over and over again everytime we bring up a topic. (Unfortunately, agreeing on a set basis is difficult if people often disargree about an issue.)

Hopefully, those who regularly read this thread have established that basis and can offer some enlightenment into a one of their favorite aspects.

On that note, maybe some people can tell me who Stanley Coleman is (really) and why he created a fascination with Heather. Do Leonard and Stanley represent different personalities for the same person? If so, what about the Leonard fight?

EDIT: Although, I haven't been able to check out Eccles' SimCity reconstruction of Old Silent Hill, I appreciate his efforts to such projects. It remains evident that as people's skills in programming improve, we will see much more fascinating recreations and interpretations of media we love. Projects like this (http://home.comcast.net/~andydthorley/silent_hill.sc2), the SH3 skin mod project (now dead), and Letter from Silent Heaven (http://www.igotaletter.com/), really make being a fan of SH as exciting as ever.

EDIT2: For those who have wanted to listen to any of the music to Silent Hill, but don't have the soundtracks or would just like mp3 versions of their favorite (or not so favorite songs) check out The Sound of Silence (http://www.silenceisbroken.com/soundofsilence/index_.html), a recreation of Dustfungus' work from Silent Hill Media. As a recreation, it is not entirely complete in terms of Dustfungus' work, but it does have practically every song from the games. The audio quality is slightly worse than Dustfungus', but is much higher than anything else you can find.

Please remember to not download copies if you do not own the game and/or official soundtrack. Also, don't waste bandwidth.

With regards to the track names of the "Complete Soundtracks", like everyone before this guy, these are NOT official names of the songs. The names are arbitrary, based off the location where the music was recorded. We don't want another "Mothes" flame war. (Mothes... geez, what were you guys thinking?)

EDIT3: Well, seems IDW Publishing is taking full advantage of the Silent Hill license since Silent Hill: Dying Inside (http://store.idwpublishing.com/index.php?cPath=2_27_40&osCsid=caf7163acd241045f9c449ed3a475eaf) was released. The additions to the Silent Hill graphic novels series now include:

Silent Hill: Among the Damned (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932382585/ref=pd_sbs_b_2/002-3830005-2248851?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance)Story: Scott Ciencin
Artwork: Shaun Thomas
Publisher: IDW PublishingSilent Hill: Paint It Black (http://store.idwpublishing.com/product_info.php?cPath=2_27_40&products_id=332&osCsid=caf7163acd241045f9c449ed3a475eaf)Story: Scott Ciencin
Artwork: Shaun Thomas
Publisher: IDW PublishingSilent Hill: The Grinning Man (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932382666/ref=pd_sbs_b_2/002-3830005-2248851?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance)Story: Scott Ciencin
Artwork: TBA
Publisher: IDW Publishing

-- Among the Damned: This novel, which quickly sold out at IDW, is still available at Amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932382585/ref=pd_sbs_b_2/002-3830005-2248851?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance) as a bound collection. You can buy it with Dying Inside for a cheaper price.
In a gripping tale of bone-chilling horror, writer Scott Ciencin (Silent Hill: Dying Inside) follows a young soldier suffering from survivor's guilt into the darkened confines of Silent Hill. There, he will meet a doomed soul that will change his life forever... or end it.
(I still say IDW ripped-off of my own Silent Hill fan fiction.)

-- Paint It Black:
Available from IDW on February 28, 2005. This will be a single book release. Additional details available at Amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932382658/ref=pd_sbs_b_1/002-3830005-2248851?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance), which is priced cheaper than at IDW Publishing.
Painter and semi-professional slacker Ike finds his dark muse in the mist-enshrouded, monster-infested reaches of Silent Hill. Then the sexy, survivalist-trained, gun-toting cheerleader Cheryl and her teammates arrive to rock his world. Creatures attack, cheerleaders disappear, and the gloves come off! Will anything survive?(What?! Cheryl?! Cheerleaders?! ...I dunno.)

-- The Grinning Man:
This one was mentioned earlier in IDW's roster of graphic novels for Silent Hill around the time "Among the Damned" was announced. Though no information is listed on IDW's website currently, it is also planned to be a single book release. Additional details available on Amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932382666/ref=pd_sbs_b_1/002-3830005-2248851?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance).
For ten years, State Trooper Robert Tower has patrolled mist-enshrouded Silent Hill and never seen its nightmarish demonic creatures. But now the gun-slinging, double-barreled terror known as the Grinning Man has arrived. Horror is unbound and innocents caught in its explosive crossfire. For Tower, it's going to be a hell of a last day. (This one seems kinda interestin'. Might give some insight on the nature of present day Silent Hill.)

All stories have been/will be written by Scott Ciencin. Though, I have yet to get a copy of the graphic novels for myself, other people have complained about Ciencin's writing style. JTLYK

EDIT4: In a spurt of just-looking-for-the-most-obscure-crap-I-can-find, I managed to find some details (http://www.ncsx.org/2003/ncs070703/ncs0707m.htm) about the "Limited Edition" version of Silent Hill 3, which included an art of some rare concept art of SH3 entitled "Sketchbook." I'm really interested in finding out more, but it seems that it was a promotional item released with the game, so copies will be difficult to find. If anything turns up, I'll post about it.

EDIT5: For those of you who have heard of Broken Notes, a fan-arranged version of the Silent Hill Soundtrack, the website (http://www.brokennotes.com/) is now back online! Get all your favorite remixes of the SH soundtrack, separated by album, artist and now including UNRELEASED MATERIAL!!! This is a real treat, but the best is just ahead as Broken Notes II is scheduled to be released fairly soon.

Wow. New EDIT highscore!

[FinalGamer]

Woah, I didn't know so much stuff was on about Silent Hill! Hey, where is this SimCity reconstruction? Can I see it?

[ifirit]

Hey, where is this SimCity reconstruction? Can I see it?

Check the first EDIT in my post above yours (click the word this). Or go back one page and look near the bottom.

[Eccles]

I like how you called it programming ;)

[Monobrow]

Just thought I'd post here with my new sig, just for the hell of it. Me loves honeyc...I mean Silent Hill.

[Cryptic^writings]

silent hill is my fav horror game
i havent finish the silent hill 4 yet
i like the 3rd one the best
silent hill 4 didnt look like silent hill at all
we only hanging around inside the apartment
i miss walking around the silent hill town like silent hill 1 & 2 :P

[RazorVayne]

umm, does anyone know where I could get a hi-res image of Heather from SH3? It's a piece of official artwork where she's leaning against a wall, without the orange sleevless shirt that she usually wears.

I had it a while ago but I don't know where it disappeared to.

[StarZander]

umm, does anyone know where I could get a hi-res image of Heather from SH3? It's a piece of official artwork where she's leaning against a wall, without the orange sleevless shirt that she usually wears.

I had it a while ago but I don't know where it disappeared to.

You mean this?

http://ps2.cgame.cn/ps/Html/yj/qtz/UploadFile/2004718104243112.jpg

This was used for the cover of the soundtrack for SH3. The american version, I think. Maybe the japanese.

[RazorVayne]

umm, does anyone know where I could get a hi-res image of Heather from SH3? It's a piece of official artwork where she's leaning against a wall, without the orange sleevless shirt that she usually wears.

I had it a while ago but I don't know where it disappeared to.

You mean this?

http://ps2.cgame.cn/ps/Html/yj/qtz/UploadFile/2004718104243112.jpg

This was used for the cover of the soundtrack for SH3. The american version, I think. Maybe the japanese.

That's exactly the one. Thanks!
Heather's flippin hot in that image!!

[The Instrument of GAWD]

http://ps2.cgame.cn/ps/Html/yj/qtz/UploadFile/2004718104243112.jpg

EFFING SWEET. Too bad her eyes are all red, would make her look helluva lot better. I guess that's her charm; she doesn't use make-up and she still looks nice.

[Kiyosuki]

Yeah I totally agree, Heather's one of my favorite female character designs in all of gaming because she looks so natural and real. I mean, who here hasn't seen a girl who looks even a little bit like her in real life? She's not sporting a graceful feminine build but at the same time she's not exactly unattractive, just not the type who regularly butter's up her own appearance 24/7. She has some bags under her eyes just like many of us end up having around those ages (And its a cool detail too considering she hasn't been sleeping well lately in the story) Hell, although I imagine her being a mostly good girl, we can't overrule the possibility that maybe she's doing a little teenage experimenting with some leaves. :lol: Its all these little details that tell you so much about a character, its something I always felt SH was one of the games that really did wonderfully. Harry's contemporary, casual look. James' somewhat unkept appearance, Henry's neat and youthful look, and Heather's "in the middle" kinda appearance. Not a social outcast type, but not the most popular girl type either, just kinda drifting along.

Its not that alone that makes it great, its in comparison to 90 % of female character designs out there, its quite a departure. I'm glad that rather than make an overly busty and bubbly main character just because she's female, they stuck with the Silent Hill motif and made a very middle of the road, realistic character design. Plus her vest just looks awsome. :D That is a very nice picutre. It shows this quality she seems to have where she's kinda not the most feminine girl around, but she's still a girl/young woman kind of thing. Its the same thing Aya Brea's design has..

[The Instrument of GAWD]

Damn you Kiyosuki. Thanks to you and that picture, I'm gonna be day dreaming way too much about Heather... :oops:

[Kiyosuki]

Heh, I'm sorry. I didn't mean it that way. To be honest, even though i think her character design is really cool, I don't find Heather particularly attractive. Her model is pretty yes, but she's very errie looking at the same time. But you see thats whats cool about her design to me, she was designed to be an interesting looking Silent hill character, not just another piece of eye candy for the guys. ^^; I mean, they could of made her look like Mary, or Aileen, but instead they didn't concentrate on making her cute, they wanted to make a design that was fitting of that fact she's a pretty important character in the story. I like that kind of mentality behind character design. I mean, don't get me wrong, I like an attractive or alluring lady just as much as the next guy, but I like balance too. I like a mix of different kinds of character's and I think it becomes redundant if too many are too pretty or cute, or alluringly dressed etc. Heather stands out among SH's female character's cause of that I think..

[Brand New Retro]

Only played the first one but thought it was 10 times scarier than Res Evil/Alone in the Dark etc.!

Great game.

[RazorVayne]

Heh, I'm sorry. I didn't mean it that way. To be honest, even though i think her character design is really cool, I don't find Heather particularly attractive. Her model is pretty yes, but she's very errie looking at the same time. But you see thats whats cool about her design to me, she was designed to be an interesting looking Silent hill character, not just another piece of eye candy for the guys. ^^; I mean, they could of made her look like Mary, or Aileen, but instead they didn't concentrate on making her cute, they wanted to make a design that was fitting of that fact she's a pretty important character in the story. I like that kind of mentality behind character design. I mean, don't get me wrong, I like an attractive or alluring lady just as much as the next guy, but I like balance too. I like a mix of different kinds of character's and I think it becomes redundant if too many are too pretty or cute, or alluringly dressed etc. Heather stands out among SH's female character's cause of that I think..

well, if konami didn't try to make her a an all-out extremely cute girl that you'd wanna bang over and over, then they've failed. Bacause to me, Heather's an all-out extremely cute girl that I'd wanna bang over and over!

I'M HOOKED ON HEATHER MASON AND I DON"T CARE IF THE WORLD KNOWS IT!!! goddamnit, I've fallen for another fictional character. why does this always happen?

[ifirit]

Silent Hill 2, 3 & 4 Spoilers

I think Heather's look is called "Heroin Shiek" (though you might say it's Heroine Sheik [pun intended]). It's the fashion idea where people are made to look like drug addicts because it exposes a sense of frailty that is alluring to power-addictive or dominating people. Another way to look at it is that they mar their looks in order to hide the beauty or attributes of the person. This fits in quite well with the Heather's character, since she was hiding her true form and gets stripped of her attractive qualities thoughout the story (i.e. affection, concern, modesty, etc.)

However, Heather has not been the only character to be given flaws as part of her attractive nature. With Maria, the programmers kinda took the opposite direction as opposed to Heather. They took a person who wasn't exactly beautiful, Mary (who I find rather homely), and tried to make her look more attractive. They gave her more contemporary hair and clothing, a more liberal attitude, but they did not change her figure. She still has the roll of belly fat that Mary had, her face is covered with blemishes (although Maria uses make-up to cover them up), and her hairline is raised due to Mary wearing her hair up so much. With Maria, she choose style over substance (in terms of appearance). Her look is only superficial in terms of improving Mary's image, but that might be James' fault.
http://www.xbox.com/media/games/silenthillrestlessdreams/sim-silenthill2restlessdreams-0010.jpg

With Eileen, she was cute from the beginning. She was purposefully made to look very pretty, because they had plans for her appearance later on in the game. Without getting into too much detail, she was beat up because the designers wanted her look to be ruined, that they wanted gamers to look at the brutally deformed body of her's and be repulsed by her image. Unfortunately, I don't think they succeeded with that concept. I think Eileen's look changed slightly during the process. Since, she was one of the main characters, and a female lead, they didn't want have people too repulsed to look at her. So, they left her fairly good-looking. Or maybe it's just my imagination and she looks pretty compared to everything else in the game. Personally, I like to think that they at least tried to make you feel repulsed at looking a woman with deep cuts, bruises, and broken bones, yet attractive in a creepy, disturbing way.
Eileen Image - High Res (http://gamescreenshots.gamesurf.tiscali.it/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=17543&size=big&sort=1&cat=1065)
Eileen Image2 - Spoiler (http://gallery.felixmcli.org/gallery/sh4caps/sh4_caps_173)

Cynthia was just plain out bootylicious (I'm sorry, I'll never use that word again). Though, I think the developers wanted to go in the same direction as Eileen with her, seeing as how she is stabbed to death with blood covering her body and the entire room.
Cynthia Image - Spoiler (http://gamescreenshots.gamesurf.tiscali.it/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=26794&sort=1&cat=1065&page=4)

The point is that I think the ladies of SH4 were made to look a little over the top for two reasons: 1) internal pressure to have a selling point for the game, 2) to make the gamer feel they were so unattainable that their deaths would be easier to handle.

[Kiyosuki]

You know those are really good points. I don't know if the designer's would even really be thinking this deep about it all, but maybe they do.

With Eileen, she was cute from the beginning. She was purposefully made to look very pretty, because they had plans for her appearance later on in the game. Without getting into too much detail, she was beat up because the designers wanted her look to be ruined, that they wanted gamers to look at the brutally deformed body of her's and be repulsed by her image. Unfortunately, I don't think they succeeded with that concept. I think Eileen's look changed slightly during the process. Since, she was one of the main characters, and a female lead, they didn't want have people too repulsed to look at her. So, they left her fairly good-looking. Or maybe it's just my imagination and she looks pretty compared to everything else in the game. Personally, I like to think that they at least tried to make you feel repulsed at looking a woman with deep cuts, bruises, and broken bones, yet attractive in a creepy, disturbing way.


Yeah, but with most who have played SH4 that I've spoken to, they weren't repulsed by Beaten-Eileen(c) at all, they tended to be very sympathetic and protective at that point. I think its because in relation to all the other character's, Eileen was really the most normal of all the female character's. She had a cheerful attitude, liked to hang out with friends, was cute, she wasn't pompous or bitchy in any way. She was a very likable person who really didn't deserve to be hurt at all, so when she is I think rather than have the effect of repulsing the player, I think it had the opposite effect combined with her personality and looks. This person didn't deserve any of this..I'm gonna make sure she's not hurt anymore! And you go into kickass mode a little. Thats how I felt too. :lol:

[Monobrow]

Silent Hill 2, 3 & 4 Spoilers

I think Heather's look is called "Heroin Shiek" (though you might say it's Heroine Sheik [pun intended]). It's the fashion idea where people are made to look like drug addicts because it exposes a sense of frailty that is alluring to power-addictive or dominating people. Another way to look at it is that they mar their looks in order to hide the beauty or attributes of the person. This fits in quite well with the Heather's character, since she was hiding her true form and gets stripped of her attractive qualities thoughout the story (i.e. affection, concern, modesty, etc.)

However, Heather has not been the only character to be given flaws as part of her attractive nature. With Maria, the programmers kinda took the opposite direction as opposed to Heather. They took a person who wasn't exactly beautiful, Mary (who I find rather homely), and tried to make her look more attractive. They gave her more contemporary hair and clothing, a more liberal attitude, but they did not change her figure. She still has the roll of belly fat that Mary had, her face is covered with blemishes (although Maria uses make-up to cover them up), and her hairline is raised due to Mary wearing her hair up so much. With Maria, she choose style over substance (in terms of appearance). Her look is only superficial in terms of improving Mary's image, but that might be James' fault.
http://www.xbox.com/media/games/silenthillrestlessdreams/sim-silenthill2restlessdreams-0010.jpg



Very interesting ifrit...I completely agree with what you said about Heather...Here's what I've always felt about Konami's characters, and the way they portray then. The one major thing with Konami's SH characters I have noticed throughout the series is just how every day and human they look, even when they are trying not to look so. They have flaws, and they are all vulnerable. The thing that attaches people to the SH characters in general is just how vulnerable and human they really all are. Take Mary/Maria for instance.

Mary is a representation in Silent Hill 2 of not just "homeliness" (though she certainly is homely), but of "girl next door/loving wife/earthy" woman that would make an ideal wife. She has an angelic presense in the home video, wears cotton pink, puts her hair up, and doesn't seem to care all too much about how she looks, which is what probably drew James to her in the first place...Her attitude towards life, the way she carried herself. She was the epitome of "good", "nice", and had a carefree and calming nature before she got the disease. Konami made sure you saw this. They made sure that Mary's presence, even if she turned out to be some ghastly ghost bitch from hell, was always a bitter-sweet and even strangly comforting reminder that she was there somehow, and was James' loving-but-dead wife. She wasn't made up, and that is exactly why most people probably didn't feel threatened by her letter...they just didn't understand, and were confused for most of the game...searching for her to find answers to why the hell James was there.

Maria on the other hand, she was the one that most people distrusted. Even James had a wary nature (albiet a bit lusting) towards her. Konami also made sure that most people looked towards Maria with a bit of distaste, because she wasn't "real" (on many different levels) in comparison to the real Mary. She had a mask of makeup on, she seemed contrived from the start. Protecting her was an annoyance, like she was using James, they even made sure she was always in the way by having her follow you around. She pleaded to be taken care of, yet her nature begged otherwise...like she was some how "taking care" of you, in a not so nice sense...She begged to be...well, not slapped around, but certainly no knightly and moral guy would go for her.

Yet, before the elevator, you had become at least mildy attached to her personality, and you certainly didn't want what happened to her to actually happen...Suddenly the game tone changed, and James realizes what he has lost...and in that, he realizes that he didn't do his job, and that the sleazy clothes and attitude were just a strange and contradictory cover for Maria's character, and she did need his help, she was telling the truth. Which reminds James all over again of his loss of Mary in the first place...Maria's real and suddenly huge vulnerability hit their mark dead on, even if a bit too late for her...and gave the player the resolve to continue on to the prison and labyrinth, after the seemingly endless hospital.

So Mary isn't the bad guy, Maria isn't exactly the bad guy...Who is the bad guy? James?...After some subtle, and less than subtle hints, you start to realize that what James is going through is very and horrifically personal...and horribly twisted. Jame's personality gets darker, more resigned, and without having any answers from Maria, the player numbly continues through the game with a sense of dread and confusion...yet enough resolve to want to finish and figure out...well why he is there...What did he do to deserve this? ?

When I first played SH2, I thought of James as a sort of Harry clone, in his vulnerability, in his less than telling personality...but as the game progressed, he didn't seem so vulnerable, he seemed more and more able to do impossible things that just didn't make any sort of sense. But while Harry, for most of the game of SH1 seemed strong and resolved (albiet confused), James seemed numb and "not quite right". Harry is the dad lifting a car up for his kid to climb out from under after a car wreck. He's the type of guy that will do extraordinary things out of love and a need for survival. Which is probably why Heather commented in SH3 about his self-realization that he was the "strongest man in the world"...So when you find him murdered...it feels like it is a different Harry, not the original Harry Mason...a more embittered guy...not as confused...more cynical...Konami seems to want it to feel this way...Yet, when you read his memo pad...you also finally realize who he was behind the super-human-yet-vulnerable guy in SH1...he just loved his daughter...he still didn't understand everything entirely...but he was selfless enough to live with everything and take care of Heather for almost 20 years. James is different.

In an act of what his psyche felt was self-preservation, James murders his wife. He isn't willing to take the torturous feelings her living in her agony cause him. His corrupted solution, and following denial in a way, are just a twisted base (and all too human) reaction to pain. He looks like a bigger man than Harry in build, in how he carries himself...but it takes the entire game to get to the point of how he really differs and that he is freakishly shattered inside.

When you finally get to 302, you can only really feel a numb anger and sadness towards him. The reflection shot in the men's room in the beginning of the game tells it all. You look at him so much differently the second play through.

I think though, that it is really cool how James finally takes a stand in his last Pyramid Head fight...he finally gets his resolve to end it and confront his demons...and that is exactly what the town needed from him. Maria dying all over again is horrible, but becomes inconsiquential...and no longer holds power over James. It is like the town throws her in there as a desperate afterthought.

This is why, if you get the Maria ending, it feels as if James is settling on second best, and everything is still bitter-sweet, (heavy on the bitter)...Nothing feels resolved.

Moving on...Laura isn't the sweet and innocent kid...she's a brat...she calls Eddie real names I've heard bratty kids call people. Lisa is nice and in need of someone to help her, yet the way they designed her made the player and James feel a tad "mistrusting" of her, in the same way as Maria, and for good reason. Claudia had that mad-woman-with-a-british-accent thing going, but she still looked like some pasty middle-aged woman that had just slapped on a black dress...she vaguely reminded you of Dahlia (though a little bit...calmer and more freakishly ethereal)...and was exposed to be a semi-real person, unlike Dahlia (who is just a crazy old bitch) Eddie and Angela? Well we've all seen/know people like them in looks and personality, and even in story. (except they probably haven't killed anyone yet)

My point is? (if I even really have one) These characters are all too human...Even pouty-lipped Heather and BOOTILICIOUS Cynthia (sorry)...You can bruise them up, give them a lot of make up, give them freckles and blood stains, leather jackets, etc... but overall...they have this really human quality to their design added onto or even despite all of that and a personality that not many other games can give a player. No matter what they look like, Konami knows how to combine looks and story to really show just how vulnerable and human each character is.

Enough white text? Whew that was long...
Yay Silent Hill.

[Firedrake]

Various Silent Hill wallpapers made by a bloke I know from other forums.

http://img20.exs.cx/img20/7834/Agony2.th.jpg (http://img20.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img20&image=Agony2.jpg)
http://img62.exs.cx/img62/8025/Agony_aged_lights.th.jpg (http://img62.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img62&image=Agony_aged_lights.jpg)
http://img129.exs.cx/img129/5886/wallpaper7.th.jpg (http://img129.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img129&image=wallpaper7.jpg)
http://img129.exs.cx/img129/5297/wallpaper-blue.th.jpg (http://img129.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img129&image=wallpaper-blue.jpg)
http://img62.exs.cx/img62/3310/Angela_fire.th.jpg (http://img62.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img62&image=Angela_fire.jpg)
http://img62.exs.cx/img62/351/God_andsecretlights.th.jpg (http://img62.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img62&image=God_andsecretlights.jpg)
http://img62.exs.cx/img62/4185/God_evil.th.jpg (http://img62.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img62&image=God_evil.jpg)
http://img90.exs.cx/img90/9660/gardenofdecay0ir.th.jpg (http://img90.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img90&image=gardenofdecay0ir.jpg)
http://img90.exs.cx/img90/4464/insectsandangels6bd.th.jpg (http://img90.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img90&image=insectsandangels6bd.jpg)
http://img90.exs.cx/img90/888/temptation0gg.th.jpg (http://img90.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img90&image=temptation0gg.jpg)
http://img105.exs.cx/img105/572/oldbones4cx.th.jpg (http://img105.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img105&image=oldbones4cx.jpg)
http://img105.exs.cx/img105/8249/thebookoffrozenmemories0pk.th.jpg (http://img105.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img105&image=thebookoffrozenmemories0pk.jpg)
http://img134.exs.cx/img134/1366/wallpaper0bw.th.jpg (http://img134.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img134&image=wallpaper0bw.jpg)
http://img114.exs.cx/img114/3749/blood7uf.th.jpg (http://img114.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img114&image=blood7uf.jpg)
http://img172.exs.cx/img172/1715/newhhwallpaper1ws.th.jpg (http://img172.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img172&image=newhhwallpaper1ws.jpg)

Also, music videos (Be sure to Right-click, Save as, otherwise Angelfire will disable them):
Restless Dreams (http://www.angelfire.com/mo3/restlessdreamsvideo/Restless-Dreams.wmv)

Inner Fears (http://www.angelfire.com/mo3/inner_fears_video/Inner-Fears.wmv)

Sweet Sugar (http://www.angelfire.com/moon2/heavensnight2k4/Sweet-Sugar.wmv)

Walter (http://www.angelfire.com/freak2/waltermusicvideo/walter.wmv)

BONUS! Ambient music that works for Silent Hill-esque scenarios by a guy named Walking 0. (http://www.global-metoikos.com/skindeep.zip)

P.S. Bump.

[Loli-Khan]

That's some hot shit, man.

[Firedrake]

Danke. Just figured this thread shouldn't die.

[StarZander]

Danke. Just figured this thread shouldn't die.

It won't. It's immortal.

[ifirit]

Firedrake, I just finished watching all three videos and I enjoyed watching them. Are you Heaven's Night? Anyway, if you are, I have to ask where you got the Silent Hill 4 material in "Sweet Sugar." I've not seen some of that before. It's really incredible, since none of that was actually in the game.

I especially liked the editting done for "Restless Dreams." It flowed very well with the music of choice. The music choice for "Walter" was a perfect choice as it reflects both the melancholy and freakish nature of the game. I like Evanescence, too. What's the name of that song?

Well, congrats on making some nice music videos.

EDIT: Another site to add to the Silent Hill Multimedia Family. The Interactive Silent Hill Map (http://www.silenthill.co.za/map/) is a flash version of the maps from the games, with information from the translated Lost Memories book published by Konami as well as other tidbits of information. It's not entirely complete, but might be one day. Enjoy.

EDIT2: Might as well throw this one at you as well. Premonition (http://www.silenthill.co.za/premonition) has a short description of the Silent Hill Female leads. Could be more complete in detail, but still a pretty flash to look at, with some surprises. ;)

[StarZander]

I like Evanescence, too. What's the name of that song?

Evanescence - Even in death

[The Instrument of GAWD]

--CONTAINS SPOILERS--

well, I've been playing SIlent Hill 3 again. Something grabbed me when I was listening to the phone call between Heather and the one guy who's wishing her a Happy Birthday. He said that Stanly Coleman wasn't alive anymore (or something) and he's now known as #7. What I thought was, maybe he meant that he was the seventh victim of Walter... but then again, Walter wasn't present enough in 3 for this to be true huh?

Anyway, I'm playing through 2, 3, and 4 again since I finished RE4 twice. Trying for the Rebirth ending in SH2, Possesed ending in SH3 and it's too early for me to determine which ending to go for in SH4(just got out of Prison World for the 1st time). You can guess how awkward it is to switch from RE4's controls back to SH's, lol.

As for those videoes Firedrake posted: I'll get to those... but it'll probably take a long while... I'm betting they're pretty effing big...

EDIT: oh, wow, they're not effing big after all! I'll check em out after this damn BT download finishes.

[ifirit]

--CONTAINS SPOILERS--

well, I've been playing SIlent Hill 3 again. Something grabbed me when I was listening to the phone call between Heather and the one guy who's wishing her a Happy Birthday. He said that Stanly Coleman wasn't alive anymore (or something) and he's now known as #7. What I thought was, maybe he meant that he was the seventh victim of Walter... but then again, Walter wasn't present enough in 3 for this to be true huh?

Not really, since victim #7 was Billy Locrane (the little boy who was mentioned in "Trick or Treat" along with his sister). Also, according to the conversation, the voice says "he's underground now" which doesn't necessarily imply that he's dead. Also, from the tone of the voice when Heather refers to it as Lenard, he freaks out very similarly like a person who is often mistaken for someone else. To me, this implies that the voice is a split-personality of Lenard Wolfe, and that Stanley Coleman is also a split-personality of Lenard's as well. Going back up, you see that "being underground" might refer to the basement since that is where Lenard is hiding.

Who knows why Lenard was committed to the hospital exactly, or if his personalities existed before he was committed, but for one thing, we can see the Lenard is quite unbalanced. For what it's worth, Heather doesn't really know what to think about him.

[Tranquil Chaos]

Check out the morgue. The body labeled #7 whispers heathers name on the way by.

Stanley? I think so...

[UnforgivingEdges]

Check out the morgue. The body labeled #7 whispers heathers name on the way by.

Stanley? I think so...

That was always my impression, too.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

Hey Firedrake. I dunno if it's just doing it for me, but when I start downloading one of those videos, it's stops before it can reach 100%.

There was a sig here, it's gone now.

Clever, lol.

Guess that's another connection SH2 makes with SH4. Henry never went to that part of Silent Hill, where James was. Could it have been a place that Joseph (that was his name right? the guy that lived in 302 before Henry) went to?

I suppose it's time I do some looking around other then pestering people (mainly ifirit) here.

[Kiyosuki]

Well also, Henry was arguably far more mentally stable than James. Henry is just a normal guy in the wrong place at the wrong time, where as James is in his situation because of his own frail mentality. Those holes were always a metaphor for his psyche, so maybe Henry didn't go there..because he didn't have to.

Henry is probably the most mentally balanced male character in the whole series..

[StarZander]

Well also, Henry was arguably far more mentally stable than James. Henry is just a normal guy in the wrong place at the wrong time, where as James is in his situation because of his own frail mentality. Those holes were always a metaphor for his psyche, so maybe Henry didn't go there..because he didn't have to.

Henry is probably the most mentally balanced male character in the whole series..

That's one of the things I really dislike about SH4. In all the other games, the main character had a special significance to the story/plot, like Harry had picked up Cheryl as a baby, and now they were back there and the town kindo f has its revenge on him while he's looking for Cheryl. In SH2, the connection got pretty clear at the end. It's all about James there. In SH3 Heather is the key to everything, as she's the baby Harry got home with him at the end of SH1, but... in SH4 Henry just happened to live there. He's nothing special, he seldom says anything, and just one day saw a hole in his bathroom wall, and thought to himself "Maybe I'll go through here and beat the shit out of some freaks of nature that appear for no reason. The TV isn't working anyway." so I just really hate Henry.

[Kiyosuki]

Well he climbed through the hole because it was the only way he'd be able to retain his sanity from being stuck in the room for so long. :D

It would of been cooler if Henry was stuck in the room for a much longer period of time, (say two weeks) and started to slowly lose his mind as well as health because of lack of food/water etc. So when the hole appears he has to escape in order to not only keep his life but also his very mind. You could throw in hallucinations and everything, that would of been creepy as hell.

Its really amazing though how much of a difference the character's background made on the games overall scare factor. For some reason, playing as Henry was less freightening than the other three because of the fact he was very normal. There's something that clicks inside of you when you feel like your character is truly tied to whats going on around them, and if its something horrific then that just makes the experience of playing as that character even more freightening. Harry feels like such a pawn in a bigger game, Heather has no clue whats going on inside of herself and feels so frail, James you just don't trust at all, however because of the fact he has no connection to the events at all other than being one of the Sacraments, and his normal mentality, Henry feels much more like a hero battling evil than something lost in wonderland (of hell).

Now for some reason I like Henry as a character, there's something about the "poor shmuck who was in the wrong place at the wrong time hero" type of deal that always hit a chorde in me. Its why I like characters like Leon Kennedy, Ryusei, etc. They're heroic because of they're own initiative, not big prophecies or obligation or anything.

But for Silent Hill maybe it wasn't enough for the main character. Although I think the central problem was the enviornments itself and not so much Henry.

[StarZander]

I would have liked the idea that Henry was going mad in that apartment, and all his "adventures" later on, was all just in his mind. That he never actually left the apartment. He just sat down in a corner and thought he did it all. But that might not have made any sense, since there is no reason to connect the town of Silent Hill to this. Unless his apartment was located in Silent Hill itself.

[Kiyosuki]

Ohhh!

Like, Henry will go unconscious or go to sleep, and you'll go to the other worlds..

But..then stuff starts to happen outside, like Eileen talking about this happening, and that happening..making Henry wonder weither it was a dream or not..thus challenging his mentality even more. XD

Now thats interesting. See, if we have a character who's perfectly normal, and has no inner demons like Henry, we gotta challenge that to its full extents to get his full potential out.

[Meteo Xavier]

The only thing I couldn't figure out about the Silent Hill games (note: I've only played 3 and 4) is how the monsters fit into the story of the game. In RE, the monsters were the whole threat, they were the conflict in the story. In Silent Hill, (IMO) they just seem to be thrown in there to slow the character down, they don't seem to fit in the storyline at all. Am I just missing something?

[Kiyosuki]

The only thing I couldn't figure out about the Silent Hill games (note: I've only played 3 and 4) is how the monsters fit into the story of the game. In RE, the monsters were the whole threat, they were the conflict in the story. In Silent Hill, (IMO) they just seem to be thrown in there to slow the character down, they don't seem to fit in the storyline at all. Am I just missing something?

You should really go back and read some of this post sometime, you couldn't be further from the truth. :D

Believe it or not, the monster's in 1, 2, and 3 actually have psychological reasons for being there, even officially. Like the monster's in 1 all represent Alessa's anxieties and fears, in 2 the monster's are all elements of James psyche and things his subconscious is trying to tell him, and in 3 its a little more vague, but its been said that the monster's are there as representations of all the things Heather finds putrid and undesirable, or which she fears in order to fuel her hate.

Not sure about 4 though..they're probably things derived from Walter's warped views but nothing official's been said.

[Tranquil Chaos]

At the beginning of SH4, Henry says he's been trapped in his apartment for something like 2 weeks.

[StarZander]

At the beginning of SH4, Henry says he's been trapped in his apartment for something like 2 weeks.

I thought he said "the last few days, it's been like this" or something?

[ifirit]

Silent Hill 4 Spoilers

The only thing I couldn't figure out about the Silent Hill games (note: I've only played 3 and 4) is how the monsters fit into the story of the game. In RE, the monsters were the whole threat, they were the conflict in the story. In Silent Hill, (IMO) they just seem to be thrown in there to slow the character down, they don't seem to fit in the storyline at all. Am I just missing something?

Like Kiyosuki said above, the significance of the monsters in the game are much more apparent than you may see at first. Though the particular reasoning for the appearance of the monsters in Silent Hill depends on your views pertaining to the game's plot or story, the presence, shape and behavior of the creatures are all derivative of the central character.

Now, with reference to SH4, though you play as Henry, the central character of the game is Walter Sullivan. (I think that goes without saying, but hear me out.) Since finding the first hole, we continually assume that the world in the hole is not exactly the real world. As Henry says "I know that if you die in the this world, you die in the real world, too." This statement suggests that Henry not only knows that he isn't really in the portal, but that if he dies there, he'll die for real.

Thus, his mission in the game to truely "wake up." Thoughout the game, you traverse the portals of reality (I like song titles; plus, I said since Akira Yamaoka was producing the game, the song titles would have a much greater signicance than before) to find a way to escape the confines of The Room. What the twist is, and this is the tricky part, that Henry never really wakes up in his room at all. He is propetually stuck inside Walter's Universe. So, you have to ask yourself, "Is this real, or not?"

Does Henry ever truely escape the prison that Walter has created in Henry's mind? Does performing the rituals in Another Crimson Tome really allow Henry (and Eileen) to escape the Alternate Reality? Depends on your point of view, and the ending you believe is the true ending.

Anyway, on the subject of the monsters in the various "Worlds." Let's first look at the ghosts. We learn from the websites and from the game itself that the ghosts are the victims of Walter Sullivan doomed to spend eternity haunting the world "within and without the Lord's world." We can see how these creatures relate particularly to Walter and to Henry, through his interactions with the characters.

But, what about the other monsters in the game, the ones that can actually die. Dogs, patients, wallmen, hummers, ect., why do they exist there? Quite simply, they are the products of the twisted and overactive mind of Walter Sullivan. We can see some of this when Henry travels through to the "Hospital World." Since Henry uses a different portal to reach this world, he sees Walter behind what should be "closed doors." Walter is deforming and changing something in his world because that is what he thinks about after years of psychological abuse and scarring, and because Walter himself cannot escape his own "world."

Think about the kid in highschool who was often constantly bored in class. So bored, that he would sometimes do the most random things to keep himself occupied. Think of the wierd and sometimes disturbing drawings he would create just to pass the time. Walter is a lot like that. The creatures in this world are his creations and they take a life of their own. This might explain why they often attack each other, especially the Sniffer Dogs when another creature dies.The whole thing is like some sort of twisted version of the Story of Creation.

And Walter said, "let there be life," and so it came to be. (Sick.)

At the beginning of SH4, Henry says he's been trapped in his apartment for something like 2 weeks.

Very clearly in the introduction, the story says, "Henry has been locked in his room for 5 days." However, if you consider what I said before, how do we really know? How does Henry know how long a day is if what he sees outside the window might not be real? A valid point to argue, but not really more significant to the story than discussing the point of whether or not Henry is dreaming or not. Because in the 21 Sacraments ending, it says, "The body of a young man was discovered in the Ashfield Heights Apartment Complex Rm. 302. It is believed to be that of it's owner, Henry Townsend. However, it has been deformed past identification."

Truth be, Henry may have never left the apartment at all, or it could all be a dream that passed over a single night. It's hard to really say.

It would of been cooler if Henry was stuck in the room for a much longer period of time, (say two weeks) and started to slowly lose his mind as well as health because of lack of food/water etc. So when the hole appears he has to escape in order to not only keep his life but also his very mind. You could throw in hallucinations and everything, that would of been creepy as hell.

I believe that was the original intention of the developers in the initial production of the story. But, again, I think that the short deadline affected the execution of the game. From interviews with the Producer Akira Yamaoka, he seems to really have wanted to drive that issue home with gamers. But with the game be created from start to finish in less than 12 months, fine-tuning on the plot and character development took a backseat to meeting the dealine.

Not to say that this is a bad game by any means, exactly the opposite. (I'm still impressed they managed to do it while creating a unique and scary experience.) This game looks to have been in pre-production for a while, which is probably why development on it started immediately after SH3 came out. However, like I've said before, the stress of having to get it out so soon likely didn't give the developers enough time to really tighten every bolt, hammer every nail, or paint every corner.

Yet, the issue at hand (whether Henry seemed emotionally and physically effected by his imprisonment) did creep its way into the game in a slight less obvious way. The hauntings of The Room were designed to be notifications that maybe Henry isn't quite feeling well. They first start out as being simple sounds or noises (knocks, static, telephone rings). Then they build up to be accidents that freak you out (shower, dryer, fan), but don't really affect him physically. Ultimately, they break out into life-threatening attacks on his life (the ones that need holy objects to repel.)

I see this as symbolic to Henry's mental state. Since, I think The Room is a metaphor for Henry's mind, it seems fitting that Walter would attack him there. I also relates to how Henry gets "headaches" while visiting the "worlds." The hauntings in the room are causing Henry physical pain by effecting his emotional state. (Sort of like the whole concept of psychological terror; you effect someone physically, i.e. fear, by applying a psychological simulus, i.e. the sounds of someone breathing heavily, or the sounds of someone crying.) Things that would effect his emotional state more so would be watching other people die, being helpless to protect someone, or even having an attempt on his own life. Compound these things with a sense of having no escape, and I'd say Henry is a lot more than simply unresponsive. It could be that he's just blown a fused and doesn't want to feel anything. However, ultimately he can't ignore it.

I think I'll stop here. That's a lot to think about for right now. Congraduations for making it this far. Here's a cookie (http://www.brokennotes.com/melancholy/melancholy.html). (It's the new Broken Notes album.)

EDIT:
Silent Hill Movie Update:
Some more news has been released about the plot to the Silent Hill movie. According to a letter printed on Don Carmody's website (http://www.doncarmody.com/Pages/silent_hill.html) (which was promptly removed), he gave out the synopsis to the script.

Silent Hill Movie Spoilers
I am not kidding. The synopsis gives away the ending!!!
El productor de la película de Silent Hill, Don Carmody, ha hecho pública en su página web una supuesta y vasta sinopsis del argumento del film.

Es un completo spoiler para todo aquel que no conozca el juego que dió origen a la saga; para el resto, básicamente no es más que el argumento de Silent Hill 1 sustituyendo al mítico Harry por una mujer llamada Rose.

Teneis una rápida traducción del texto en la ampliación de la noticia.

TRISTAR
Producer - Toronto
Director – Christophe Gans

Una mujer desesperada por salvar a su hija moribunda se encuentra atrapada en una realidad alternativa mientras la busca en un peligroso mundo lleno de demonios.

Rose no puede aceptar el que su hija Sharon se esté muriendo a causa de una fatal enfermedad. A pesar de las protestas de su marido, escapa intentando llevar a su hija a un curandero. Por el camino, acaban viajando a través de un portal que las conduce a la espeluznante y desierta ciudad de Silent Hill.

Sharon desaparece allí, y Rose persigue por toda la ciudad a lo que ella piensa que es la silueta de su hija. Pronto se dará cuenta de que Silent Hill no es como cualquier lugar en el que haya estado antes. Está habitada por varias criaturas y una oscuridad viviente desciende transformando -literalmente- todo lo que toca.

Ayudada por una policía llamada Cybil, que ha sido enviada para traer a ella y a su hija de vuelta, Rose buscará a su pequeña mientras descubre la historia de la ciudad y se da cuenta de que Sharon representa sólo al peón de un juego más complicado.

Para salvar a su hija, Rose hará un pacto con un demonio de aspecto infantil, y permitirá así que las fuerzas de la oscuridad tomen la ciudad y destruyan a todos aquellos que intentaron acabar con el mal. Al final salvará a Sharon, pero pagando un alto precio.

Since this is the only known (actual) reproduction of the letter, though in Spanish, it is the most accurate. However, you can find other synopses on the net. Here are a few.

Warning - Links Contain Spoilers
I am not kidding. The synopsis gives away the ending!!!
Empire Online (http://www.empireonline.co.uk/site/news/NewsStory.asp?news_id=16555)
Movies Online (http://www.moviesonline.ca/film1226.htm)
JoBlo (http://www.joblo.com/index.php?id=6602)
Film Rot (http://www.filmrot.com/articles/news/005561.php)

[Meteo Xavier]

Speaking of psychological abuse and such, does anyone know where I can find good information, articles, examples, etc of psychological abuse? Or for that matter, abuse towards mental patients?

Reason I ask is because a friend and I are working on a story of our own that deals with the subject at hand, its about a mental patient who wakes up in the hospital one day to discover that the hospital is completely devoid of anyone but himself, but the hospital itself shows very few signs of any kind of conflict, the power still works, water and food are available, but the hospital is completely locked up, so he has no real means of escaping. At the same time, as he sits around in the hospital trying to investigate the matter and find a way out, his perception of reality keeps changing, and so there are a lot of scene transitions somewhat like those found in this game.

And the whole point of this story is to really exploit the psychological damage he sustains from brain damage and an abusive hospital in a realistic manner. I want to be careful with it so I don't just slap some "psychological thriller" together that everyone else seems to be doing nowadays. I want it to be good, but I have little knowledge and experience in the matter (which is surprising to most people, I should say).

So any help or direction or interest would greatly help me out. Thanks.

[StarZander]

One thing I would have liked to know more about in SH4, is what Henry experienced whilst being in Silent Hill. If you look at the pictures on the walls of his bedroom, they are of places in SH. It's been a while since I've played SH4, but if my memory serves me right, then he took those photos himself. Right? If so... maybe something happened when he was there?

[Kiyosuki]

Does Henry ever truely escape the prison that Walter has created in Henry's mind? Does performing the rituals in Another Crimson Tome really allow Henry (and Eileen) to escape the Alternate Reality? Depends on your point of view, and the ending you believe is the true ending.


OH! Maybe thats what the Mother and Escape endings mean!

In Mother, maybe the room is all messed up, and Eileen (and possibly Henry) don't leave because Henry hasn't cleared out all the demons out of his mentality, so maybe they find themselves bound to the room..thus Walter's Dream. If we're going on this way of thinking. Maybe its the games way of telling you that the game is going to go in a cycle, and maybe...just maybe..Henry will follow the same fate as Joseph.

And in escape, you actually do escape by leaving the room and everything associated with it behind (hinted by Eileen's statement about "finding a new place" Obviously, the happiest ending.

[ifirit]

Speaking of psychological abuse and such, does anyone know where I can find good information, articles, examples, etc of psychological abuse? Or for that matter, abuse towards mental patients?

Reason I ask is because a friend and I are working on a story of our own that deals with the subject at hand, its about a mental patient who wakes up in the hospital one day to discover that the hospital is completely devoid of anyone but himself, but the hospital itself shows very few signs of any kind of conflict, the power still works, water and food are available, but the hospital is completely locked up, so he has no real means of escaping. At the same time, as he sits around in the hospital trying to investigate the matter and find a way out, his perception of reality keeps changing, and so there are a lot of scene transitions somewhat like those found in this game.

And the whole point of this story is to really exploit the psychological damage he sustains from brain damage and an abusive hospital in a realistic manner. I want to be careful with it so I don't just slap some "psychological thriller" together that everyone else seems to be doing nowadays. I want it to be good, but I have little knowledge and experience in the matter (which is surprising to most people, I should say).

So any help or direction or interest would greatly help me out. Thanks.

Try checking out the major publishers of medical and neurological journals. The National Institute of Mental Health and National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke are two major publishers of journals.

However, like most published journals, you'll need a subscription to the journal to read it. Some universities and schools though have subscriptions available to students via their databases, but again it depends on the school.

If you're not looking for something scientific, and simply stories (fiction or non-fiction), then I just suggest googling "psychology + articles + abuse + patients." You'll usually find something written by someone out there. You can also go the library to check out books published about abuse in mental institutions.

For what it's worth, I did a short google search and came up with this (http://www.mental-health-matters.com/articles/list_alpha.php). (An extensive article listing of things from trama to violent parents to issues with ADHD and treatments.)

One thing I would have liked to know more about in SH4, is what Henry experienced whilst being in Silent Hill. If you look at the pictures on the walls of his bedroom, they are of places in SH. It's been a while since I've played SH4, but if my memory serves me right, then he took those photos himself. Right? If so... maybe something happened when he was there?

According to the descriptions Henry gives about the photos over the course of the game, Henry didn't see anything strange about the town. It's true that he did take the majority of the photographs himself, but he did so on his last trip to Silent Hill which was after his graduation.

One thing you also have to consider about Silent Hill is time and specific loaction in the town. Depending on where exactly the time that Henry would have seen Silent and the other events in the series, depends on whether or not the town would have already been "cursed." Also, you have to consider what section of the town is affected. Does the curse extend to simply Old Silent Hill, maybe the Business District, could it have gone as far as the Tourist section by the Lighthouse, or maybe it extended to Paleville and South Vale maybe even farther than that and has traversed to the outskirts of the woods beyond Lake Toluca and past the Observation Point. Who knows?

Anyway, the point is Henry doesn't see anything wrong with the town when he's there. The sky was clear, the sun was shining and the trip couldn't have been more pleasurable.

If you really wanted to you apply that same kind of logic to James and Mary and even Harry who all vacationed in Silent Hill before the events of the game took place. What about them?

EDIT: For those who are checking out the new Broken Notes album, also check out the other Remix Projects: Intermission (http://www.brokennotes.com/intermission/intermission.html), Fan Soundtrack (http://www.brokennotes.com/fansoundtrack/fansoundtrack.html), and Artist Singles (http://www.brokennotes.com/singles/singles.html). Intermission is a collection of various VG Remixes not just Silent Hill. Fan Soundtrack is the ReMix Project of the entire Silent Hill 1 soundtrack while Artist Singles contain uneditted files produced from the Fan Soundtrack. I have a sneeking suspicion that they are familiar with OCR and that maybe they visit here often.