EA got kicked medium style..?

[Schwaltzvald]

Turns out ever since the Spore DRM backlash, they decided to "scale back" on the DRM for Red Alert 3 (http://pc.ign.com/articles/908/908755p1.html)...

On another unrelated note, EA dropped its bid to buy up Take Two (http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/electronic-arts-drops-bid-take-two/story.aspx?guid=%7B04FD99E4-93FA-43A5-8CA6-08787827B4BC%7D&dist=hplatest)... :)!!

[I-n-j-i-n]

3 to 5. Geez, that is a WORLD OF DIFFERENCE.................................NOT.

[Avatar of Justice]

What amazes me about DRM is that Valve seems to have solved the problem ok. All Steam games inherently have a basic DRM scheme, but nobody complains about it and goes nuts over Portal and Team Fortress 2. Why can't other companies just do what Valve does?

[I-n-j-i-n]

What amazes me about DRM is that Valve seems to have solved the problem ok. All Steam games inherently have a basic DRM scheme, but nobody complains about it and goes nuts over Portal and Team Fortress 2. Why can't other companies just do what Valve does?

Because most EA games are on CDs where you are supposed to have pure and total control over the property while digitally downloaded ones gives off the illusion that it is more like a rental?

That said, I hate Steam too. DRM in all forms. That said, it's understandable why they do it. PC gaming is totally ravaged from piracy and DRMs are not solving the problem.

[RedFusion]

Wow. Respect for the Amazon.com community for voicing their opinion of DRM (an issue generally only discussed in gaming circles) quite profoundly on a website that primarily caters towards non-gamers.

But then again, I've always known to check Amazon.com for their generally good reviews of music.

[Drack]

Yeah, there's been a SPORE protest going on at Amazon, an organized review bombing.

Changing the installs from 3 to 5 is not a significant improvement. EA needs to change its DRM a lot more than this. I've started pirating stuff I already bought if the DRM scheme is too inconvenient, and if I were an RTS fan I would definitely consider it for this game.

I think the main reason people like Steam's DRM over others' is because downloaded Steam games just need a login/password, no cd keys. You can redownload form their FAST AS HELL servers whenever you want, install on as many comps as you want, and play on any of them (just not simultaneous multiplayer on one acct obviously). The only hassles are that sometimes the servers are busy, and you need an internet connection, patches, and the like. Oh and they need ports forwarded but don't allow you to DMZ your steam box.

[Bahamut]

Yeah, there's been a SPORE protest going on at Amazon, an organized review bombing.

Changing the installs from 3 to 5 is not a significant improvement. EA needs to change its DRM a lot more than this. I've started pirating stuff I already bought if the DRM scheme is too inconvenient, and if I were an RTS fan I would definitely consider it for this game.

I think the main reason people like Steam's DRM over others' is because downloaded Steam games just need a login/password, no cd keys. You can redownload form their FAST AS HELL servers whenever you want, install on as many comps as you want, and play on any of them (just not simultaneous multiplayer on one acct obviously). The only hassles are that sometimes the servers are busy, and you need an internet connection, patches, and the like. Oh and they need ports forwarded but don't allow you to DMZ your steam box.

There is one thing Steam offers as an improvement as well - I lost my HL2 Collector's Edition DVD, but once Steam identified that I registered an account before with a particular email address, they forced me to log on with my original account. Once I did, I found that I could redownload all of the games I got with my HL2 Collector's Edition for free, without any hassle. Steam is still pretty buggy, but if it offers such an improvement, I'm willing to go with a DRM scheme since there's no indication that it's intrusive in any other way. The version of SecuROM that EA is using contains just about all of the bad aspects of DRM rolled into one though, and is one that should be shunned by all intelligent/reasonable consumers.

As long as EA uses SecuROM for its big PC titles, I have no reason to even consider buying or playing them. There are more than enough companies out there who don't take a massive dump on their consumers out there to not care about a few missed games.

[The wingless]

that's my employer you're talking about, douchebags!!! I SHANT HAVE IT!

[PlastikBag]

While 5 installs is still lousy, I'm rather pleased that they're getting rid of the 10 day authentication cycles.

[EdgeCrusher]

I have yet to have one problem with steam. If I don't feel like finding the cd or dvd, bam, download it from steam. No hassle, no errors. So yeah, I approve of it.

EA's DRM though is retarded and needs to die in a fire.

[Shadow Wolf]

You just sit in your pregnant widowskin chair and mind your bloody business young man.



Where do you even get one of those? Ikea?

[Fishy]

Steam is just about the best format for buying games I know of. The only thing that might annoy people is you need the internet, but i don't know of anyone who has a computer but not internet access.

[Secret Agent Man]

Also note from the article that they also no longer require the CD to be used while playing, which, while it isn't solving the problem, is a slight improvement.

[atmuh]

i dont see why people dont like steam besides the fact that maybe its really terribly coded and takes up tons of resources but in terms of distributing games i find it excellent because as long as i know my login info no matter where i am i will forever own the game

also as ive said before if i like a game i will buy it regardless of any kind of drm

[Avatar of Justice]

Because most EA games are on CDs where you are supposed to have pure and total control over the property while digitally downloaded ones gives off the illusion that it is more like a rental?

That said, I hate Steam too. DRM in all forms. That said, it's understandable why they do it. PC gaming is totally ravaged from piracy and DRMs are not solving the problem.

I mean, DRM sucks. But if we must deal with it, I'd rather deal with Steam's. The only problem I see with Steam is how when the Steam server go down in the future, you will be screwed out of your copy. But the EA scheme is equally bad. I want to be able to play any game I buy FOREVER.

On an unrelated note, why do people consider having to have the CD inserted into the drive a burden? It's no worse than a console, and when I was a big PC gamer 5 or 6 years ago, I never even thought to be annoyed by it.

[atmuh]

On an unrelated note, why do people consider having to have the CD inserted into the drive a burden? It's no worse than a console, and when I was a big PC gamer 5 or 6 years ago, I never even thought to be annoyed by it.

its because never having to swap out is really nice
anyone that has a custom fwd psp or r4ds can tell ya that

[Hyperion5182]

I mean, DRM sucks. But if we must deal with it, I'd rather deal with Steam's. The only problem I see with Steam is how when the Steam server go down in the future, you will be screwed out of your copy. But the EA scheme is equally bad. I want to be able to play any game I buy FOREVER.

On an unrelated note, why do people consider having to have the CD inserted into the drive a burden? It's no worse than a console, and when I was a big PC gamer 5 or 6 years ago, I never even thought to be annoyed by it.

A lot of pc gamers today multi task. The real high end rigs can run a game on one screen a movie on the other. Now if you have one DVD drive (not that uncommon) you can only watch movies on that drive. Most games however are DVD only these days. This forces pc users to have two dvd drives. While that in itself wouldnt be so bad you cant find JUST a dvd drive. Typically adding a second one is a pretty nasty expense. Also they do die eventually. Replacement costs can be a pain in the ass especially with gamers who play such games alot.

Being able to play a game without having the physical disc in the drive saves time saves frustration and saves your optical drive. Supreme Commander does it and hell any game you can digitally download does it. (Now soon to include crysis) Back then it was a lot harder to operate with out a disc in the drive. Now its commmonplace to do so. To be forced to use a disc is very annoying. Especially ontop of the DRM.

[sgx]

its because never having to swap out is really nice
anyone that has a custom fwd psp or r4ds can tell ya that

Yeah I love downloadable games for 360, PS3 and PSP. Its great just turning on the system and browsing the list of games, seeing what I feel like playing at the moment. Especially for the PSP where you don't have to carry anything but the PSP. Sony should really go wild with the PSP Playstation Store, make the PSP 3000 cheaper, get rid of the UMD drive, and give it either a HD or 16+ GB solid state memory.

[Gollgagh]

Yeah I love downloadable games for 360, PS3 and PSP. Its great just turning on the system and browsing the list of games, seeing what I feel like playing at the moment. Especially for the PSP where you don't have to carry anything but the PSP. Sony should really go wild with the PSP Playstation Store, make the PSP 3000 cheaper, get rid of the UMD drive, and give it either a HD or 16+ GB solid state memory.

aw shit yeah, I would probably buy a whole new PSP for that.

[Blake]

i dont see why people dont like steam besides the fact that maybe its really terribly coded and takes up tons of resources but in terms of distributing games i find it excellent because as long as i know my login info no matter where i am i will forever own the game

also as ive said before if i like a game i will buy it regardless of any kind of drm

Also the steam servers are so reliable that downloading/installing barely takes any times.

[Bleck]

if you think drms are a problem then just pirate the fucking game

[Schwaltzvald]

if you think drms are a problem then just pirate the fucking game

Considering the audience here, you don't actually think we don't pirate stuff do ya..? :lol:

[Bahamut]

if you think drms are a problem then just pirate the fucking game

Problem is, you give the companies the impression that you'd possibly buy the game if it couldn't be pirated. The best solution to dealing with companies inserting DRM, or a particular kind, is to just not give any game with any of that crap any mindshare. That will give them the message pretty quickly.

[bladiator]

that's my employer you're talking about, douchebags!!! I SHANT HAVE IT!

Once again, wingless makes me happy to have an internet connection.

[The Coop]

that's my employer you're talking about, douchebags!!! I SHANT HAVE IT!

Well then you know. :-P



But in all seriousness, protecting your rights as an IP holder is one thing. Telling buyers they can only install their $50-$60+ game three times before having to go through jump through hoops to prove they bought it is another. And really, given the fact that the DRMs in question haven't had much of an effect in deterring piracy (and might actually be helping to inspire it in some ways), you'd think they'd stop pushing such a faulty (and often criticized) setup. Surely there are better resources at EA's disposal that don't border on punishing the buyers like their current DRM does.

[Dyne]

Turns out ever since the Spore DRM backlash, they decided to "scale back" on the DRM for Red Alert 3 (http://pc.ign.com/articles/908/908755p1.html)...

On another unrelated note, EA dropped its bid to buy up Take Two (http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/electronic-arts-drops-bid-take-two/story.aspx?guid=%7B04FD99E4-93FA-43A5-8CA6-08787827B4BC%7D&dist=hplatest)... :)!!
Yeah, "scale back"? Hah. This is E A. 'nuff said. At least, however, they've stopped trying to take over Take Two. I honestly don't believe EA should be allowed to buy up so many game companies. But I only say that because I think they're trying to push hard for their "one console world". Which is also a bunch of garbage. Sorry EA, but when you take choice away from your consumers, you risk not only alienating them, but also losing them forever to either another company who doesn't force their customers to jump through hoops just to play their games.

I wonder if The Game Overthinker will have a video on this, that'd be cool to hear his rant on it.

[RadioactivePancakes]

If I'm not mistaken, you can easily back up your games through Steam by just copying all the files in your steam account. Upon a reformat, just simply reinstall steam and paste all the files back and you can play again. Sounds pretty damn good to me.

As for Red Alert 3's 3-5 install limit...that's fine. I was still planning on buying this game regardless because I've been looking forward to it too much. I already own Spore. I usually would reformat my computer at least once a year but I guess that will no longer be the case.

Come to think of it...could anybody clarify that install limit? Does it get affected by simple reformats or is it only due to significant hardware changes such as memory and video card? What about changing a harddrive? Some people say reformats count and some don't. Any clarification on the matter would be appreciated.

[atmuh]

Problem is, you give the companies the impression that you'd possibly buy the game if it couldn't be pirated. The best solution to dealing with companies inserting DRM, or a particular kind, is to just not give any game with any of that crap any mindshare. That will give them the message pretty quickly.

this is so incredibly retarded the only reason i would do such a thing is if i didnt REALLY WANNA PLAY THE GAME


and by this argument ea doesnt give half a crap about the spore protests being that its already the fourth most dled thing on blackcats and i can only imagine how many dls its gotten from public places

[Bahamut]

this is so incredibly retarded the only reason i would do such a thing is if i didnt REALLY WANNA PLAY THE GAME


and by this argument ea doesnt give half a crap about the spore protests being that its already the fourth most dled thing on blackcats and i can only imagine how many dls its gotten from public places

They do give a crap cause they already upped the Spore install limit to 5 and announced so for Red Alert.

And your comment is far more retarded because you're willing to fuck over everyone just for one game, when there are plenty of others that don't shit on you like SecuROM does.

Of course, it's always like you to ignore the important parts of an argument and vote with the spoiled baby attitude of "I want something so I'll take it, screw everything bad that is associated with it."

Fuck brainwashed idiots.

[The wingless]

But I only say that because I think they're trying to push hard for their "one console world".

As part of the unwashed masses (aka, people not in the Industry) would it surprise you to know that if this actually happened, every game company the world over would weep tears of honey-joy? Costs of making games would go down significantly, the speed at which games are developed would increase, and overall quality would improve.

Taking choice from the consumer? Sounds like somebody is bashing EA because he heard the cool kid on the playground say the same thing. It certainly does not sound like a coherent thought.

[Darklink42]

The only thing about piracy that bugs people is the money, and honestly I think micro-transactions are easily going to start making up for that kind of loss. It's already pretty lucrative elsewhere.

I don't really know where to stand on SecuROM and other DRMs. Frankly, it just sounds like a really stupid way to give companies a feeling of security. It's not helping them (obvious both by comments here and real world evidence that people would rather pirate it to get around said feature than deal with it.) On the same token, people quickly get upset when they find out that companies are acquiring their personal information when they get a game. It doesn't matter how. As long as their is internet, there will be piracy. As long as there is piracy, we will have people trying to thwart them. In the end, the only chance companies have of really making profit out of it is either to go the route of Itunes or adapting creatively to make money through other means: episodic content, extra content transactions, etc. But the overall finger shaking won't stop because piracy can't be encouraged by big companies.

I agree though, that the best way to stop a company from doing stupid shit like this is to use the power of your wallet and by speaking out in mass. We are the ones that buy the games after all. The guys on Amazon did the right thing.

[The Coop]

As part of the unwashed masses (aka, people not in the Industry) would it surprise you to know that if this actually happened, every game company the world over would weep tears of honey-joy? Costs of making games would go down significantly, the speed at which games are developed would increase, and overall quality would improve.

And the console makers (and third-party accessory makers too) would weep tears of pain as they watched all the income they'd normally get from charging game makers for this and that, not to mention income by having exclusivity (you want our games? BUY OUR SYSTEM!), go right out the window :lol:

But I don't think we'll ever have an "all in one" console like what EA talked about in the past. There's too much pride involved with companies like Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo to ever be working together under someone else's console design. Each would always be thinking about what they'd add or do differently, and eventually, they'd build their own console again to make themselves (and possibly some game makers) happy (and richer).

[atmuh]

They do give a crap cause they already upped the Spore install limit to 5 and announced so for Red Alert.

And your comment is far more retarded because you're willing to fuck over everyone just for one game, when there are plenty of others that don't shit on you like SecuROM does.

Of course, it's always like you to ignore the important parts of an argument and vote with the spoiled baby attitude of "I want something so I'll take it, screw everything bad that is associated with it."

Fuck brainwashed idiots.

this is not one game
this is a PARTICULAR game that id been waiting for for years and that i built a computer specifically so id be able to play

youd better believe im gonna buy it

[OverCoat]

I mean, DRM sucks. But if we must deal with it, I'd rather deal with Steam's. The only problem I see with Steam is how when the Steam server go down in the future, you will be screwed out of your copy

Actually Valve has said that if they go under and Steam ceases to exist they will provide a utility to convert your games out of steam, or provide some kind of steam legacy app... I forget which, but they've got it covered.

Besides, I have played cracked versions of Portal and HL2 Ep 2 before, and they actually worked great! Of course, I promptly bought the Orange Box after finishing Portal, one of the few things that's impressed me so much I felt the need to give the developers their money, not to mention the Orange Box itself is an amazing bundle deal.

[Magewout]

As part of the unwashed masses (aka, people not in the Industry) would it surprise you to know that if this actually happened, every game company the world over would weep tears of honey-joy? Costs of making games would go down significantly, the speed at which games are developed would increase, and overall quality would improve.

That is highly doubtful. My prediction: if such a thing happens we'll get flooded by even more shovelware than now.

[Schwaltzvald]

Because if you don't like the terms on which something are sold, that makes it ok to steal, am I right?

If the price (which is actually fair in this case) and the strings that are attached to it (which is total bullshit which outweighs the price of the product)...


Then I say YES...

[The wingless]

That is highly doubtful. My prediction: if such a thing happens we'll get flooded by even more shovelware than now.

You'd be wrong, bitch. I'm in the game's industry. I WIN. ME. NOT YOU. ME!

[Monobrow]

this guy don't play fair

[Antipode]

Wingless, I think having multiple consoles incites competition, which can only improve such a massive industry. Having one console and one company at the head of everything means way too much power and control over something so big. It's the same reason I wouldn't want one company to own the movie industry.

[The wingless]

Oh, absolutely.

My argument was that it would be a godsend for game companies.

[Dark_T_Zeratul]

that's my employer you're talking about, douchebags!!! I SHANT HAVE IT!
They were my employers too at one point, and I trash-talked them even then.

[Pyrion]

What amazes me about DRM is that Valve seems to have solved the problem ok. All Steam games inherently have a basic DRM scheme, but nobody complains about it and goes nuts over Portal and Team Fortress 2. Why can't other companies just do what Valve does?

Stardock has Impulse (http://www.impulsedriven.com/). It's even less invasive than Steam, you can log on from multiple computers simultaneously (and you don't need to be logged on to play the games) without them bitching at you for it.

While that in itself wouldnt be so bad you cant find JUST a dvd drive. Typically adding a second one is a pretty nasty expense.

What the hell are you talking about? (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010100055%201036507747&name=DVD-ROM%20Drive)

[I-n-j-i-n]

I swear DVD players were actually freakishly expensive (at least $150 for a good one) a year ago. Now with Bluray drives starting to take over, nobody gives a damn about DVD players on PCs. I love it.

[Pyrion]

I swear DVD players were actually freakishly expensive (at least $150 for a good one) a year ago. Now with Bluray drives starting to take over, nobody gives a damn about DVD players on PCs. I love it.

No they weren't. They've been this cheap for at least the past 4 years. You just had to know where to look.