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PROTO·DOME
08-14-2009, 08:46 PM
This thread has probably been done before but I'm curious now. It would be cool to know what all the good bits and bad bits were about them all.

EDIT- As techy as you want, I wanna know everything! ^o^

tweex
08-14-2009, 08:55 PM
I've never been able to say this, so I'm gonna enjoy it. IN BEFORE LOCKED!!!

PROTO·DOME
08-14-2009, 09:12 PM
I've never been able to say this, so I'm gonna enjoy it. IN BEFORE LOCKED!!!

Oh whut?! Really? But this is because I wanna know... *sob* Ah well... They seriously do not approve?

Kanthos
08-15-2009, 12:31 AM
This would be a favourites thread.

There's no one DAW that is the best; there are some that are the best at a particular thing (and perhaps some that aren't the best at anything), but any opinions you get will just be people saying what their favourite is - moreso, saying which DAW they use. I've tried only two DAWs in detail: Cubase and FL Studio. I greatly prefer Cubase, but can't really fairly compare it to Sonar, Logic, ProTools, etc.

If you're looking for advice on what to buy, the best anyone can give is that you try out as many demos as possible, so you're making an informed choice based on the features that most interest you.

PROTO·DOME
08-15-2009, 12:44 AM
It was more a conversation I was having about the merits of different software. I was all pro FL and thought it was wrong of me to criticize the others without first knowing what were the pros and cons of each one.

DusK
08-15-2009, 02:29 AM
I'd also like to know the pros and cons of other DAWs, as all I've ever used is FL Studio as well.

Hy Bound
08-15-2009, 03:19 PM
Ok:

FL Studio: Great for beginners and is able to be used by more than beginners. It has a pretty decent assortment of built fx and synths and is expandable through VST instruments and fx. Zircon and a number of other use it. Probably easiest to get help around here for.

Reason: My personal favorite "learner's" DAW. Doesnt have VST support, but has a great and diverse number of synths, samplers and fx. However, can basically be used as a VST instrument for other host applications.

Cubase: I've personally never used this, but many people seem to either love or hate the work flow. I liken it to FL Studio, but i know the people who use it that wont appreciate it. Its used by more "pro's" than FL Studio, but I havent really been able to see why. Somebody else should probably comment about this one.

Ableton Live: My DAW of choice. Its based around more of a DJing/Live electronic music slant, but the Arrangement part of the program is no slouch. Uses VSTs, and has a very respectable amount of onboard FX. The only problem I have is that the MIDI abilities aren't quite as great as other programs and if you don't buy the "suite" version, there arent synths or much in the way of sound-making instruments out-of-the-box.

Logic: If you have a mac, I would personally go look into this one. I came pretty close to buying a mac for this DAW. It has a lot of functionality in the way of recording, out-of-the-box instruments and workflow enhancements. The only downside I've found is that its mac-only and I've heard it has some pretty decent bugs... I would personally rank it above the the previous DAWs, but thats a totally subjective opinion.

Pro-Tools: The "Industry Standard" DAW. If I had the money, I would buy this in a second: great MIDI workability, great onboard FX, the attached hardware makes it much more reliable and able to use more instruments and fx. The downsides are the high cost of entry, the fact that I've heard some bad things about the customer service and the pompous douche associations...
Overall, though, this is objectively the best DAW, if you have the money.

LuketheXjesse
08-15-2009, 03:25 PM
Reaper - it's awesome and it's also free (http://www.ocremix.org/forums/www.reaper.fm) (sort of).

Moseph
08-15-2009, 03:42 PM
Pro-Tools: The "Industry Standard" DAW. If I had the money, I would buy this in a second: great MIDI workability, great onboard FX, the attached hardware makes it much more reliable and able to use more instruments and fx. The downsides are the high cost of entry, the fact that I've heard some bad things about the customer service and the pompous douche associations...
Overall, though, this is objectively the best DAW, if you have the money.

Has Pro Tools significantly improved its MIDI functionality recently (as in within the past 4 years)? When I used it in school, at least, there wasn't even a multi-track layered MIDI view -- you had to look at each track individually. We always went to Digital Performer if we needed to do MIDI.

Harmony
08-15-2009, 04:50 PM
Cubase: I've personally never used this, but many people seem to either love or hate the work flow. I liken it to FL Studio...I've used it a few times and I think it's the polar opposite of FL Studio (see how subjective this stuff is!). I've been a Sonar user since it was called Pro Audio 9 and every time I use Cubase, it's like driving a different model of the same car...very intuitive from a Sonar standpoint. I've also used FL Studio for a while and it certainly presents a different way of thinking about music making that other sequencers.

Anyway, SONAR: Excellent interface, plugins, and workflow for audio recording, mixing and mastering. Some of the included plugins could use an update (Logic's FX plugins blow everyone elses out of the water, IMO), but they are definitely a good start. If you're a beginner looking to learn a software that will help you, say, record your band, this would be a better choice that, for example, FL Studio. On the other hand, I don't think SONAR is as easy to use as FL Studio for electronica. That opinion has nothing to do with the piano roll view, because I honestly think that SONAR's is equally as capable as FL Studio's. However, the way that FL handles automation, the included plugins, the step sequencer, and the program's interface are all superior to SONAR's in terms of that musical style.

big giant circles
08-15-2009, 06:29 PM
Naw, for absolute beginners wanting to record audio for say, a band, I'd recommend something like Sony Acid Music Studio. It's got the integrated "Show Me How" interactive tutorials--it's the next best thing to having someone right here pointing to the buttons you need to click on screen to learn the basic functions. It also comes with a healthy amount of loops. Plus, at ~$69 US, it's one of the cheapest options there is.

Otherwise, yeah, FL is good, but it's pretty unique. My problem is that since I learned on FL, everything else seems backwards when I suppose in actuality FL is the black sheep as far as linear recording and sequencing goes. But with FL9, it looks like they're starting to bridge the gap a bit, while still keeping FL unique (and familiar to those who already know it).

Harmony
08-15-2009, 06:40 PM
Naw, for absolute beginners wanting to record audio for say, a band, I'd recommend something like Sony Acid Music Studio. Ok, yeah I agree. My brother uses Acid and feels like it's a lot easier than SONAR because ALL he wants to do is record the band. And fortunately for him, I think that's all that Acid can do well. So I should qualify my recommendation of SONAR for beginners looking to record. It's a great all around program that's suited to recording a band and doing other stuff; you won't be limited by it. But if you are only looking to get your band's next chart topping single into a computer, and are content to leave the heavy musical editing and fancy FX processing to someone else, then SONAR would probably be overkill.

big giant circles
08-15-2009, 06:42 PM
Pro-Tools: [stuff]
Overall, though, this is objectively the best DAW, if you have the money.

I'm inclined to disagree with that. I've heard (from pros that use it daily) that it's phenomenal for audio editing and recording, but that for sequencing/composing blows. So for people like me and zircon (and lots of others, I'm sure), it would be about as useful as a wet toaster.

Also, this should pretty well sum up the discussion:

Zircon: FL is the best!

Hy Bound: Live is the best!

Harmony: Sonar is the best!

OverCoat: ReNoise is the best!

Analoq: Logic is the best!

Tweek: ProTools is the best!

Snappleman: You guys are all morons, Cubase is the best!

?: Acid is the best!

?: Digital Performer is the best!

?: Energy XT is the best!

Epitaph: Reaper is the best!

?: Reason is the best!

Random Idiot: Garageband is the best!

Me: Microsoft Sound Recorder is the best! :<

Help me fill in the blanks, guys!

LuketheXjesse
08-15-2009, 06:51 PM
Epitaph: Reaper is the best!

DusK
08-15-2009, 06:54 PM
I didn't know Snappleman uses Cubase. Hmm.

big giant circles
08-15-2009, 06:55 PM
I didn't know Snappleman uses Cubase. Hmm.

looooooooooooooool

PrototypeRaptor
08-15-2009, 07:46 PM
This thread has probably been done before but I'm curious now. It would be cool to know what all the good bits and bad bits were about them all.

EDIT- As techy as you want, I wanna know everything! ^o^

A DAW is a very personal choice. The one you pick will largely depend upon how you are going to work. I myself see DAWs as nothing more than glorified sequencers because I use all my own vsts - nothing "built in."

So I judge DAWs primarily on their piano roll/notation strength as well as mixing and playlist abilities. Basically how well they perform as an "arranger."

And, despite many haters, I find FL to have the best damn piano roll in the biz - and working with the playlist is a treat compared to say, Reason. (shudder)

The fx routing is a bit strange, but they're improving upon it greatly in the new betas.

Keep in mind this is mostly midi work; I don't know if I'd recommend FL to someone recording lots of live tracks.
I think I liked Reaper the best for that.

Just remember, it all comes down to 1s and 0s - no one DAW will sound better than another simply due to the engine...it's the built in effects/instruments that are better.
So go buy synth squad and omnisphere and don't look back!

kidding, kidding...

my 2c

Harmony
08-15-2009, 07:48 PM
Help me fill in the blanks, guys!Well, you just about covered it. Except you didn't note the common criticisms.

FL is for n00bs.
GarageBand is for n00bs with Macs.
Logic is for the wealthy elite. And nobody likes the wealthy elite.
Sonar is for people who want Cubase, but can't find a torrent for it.
Cubase is for people who want Sonar, but also want people to know they paid for it.
ProTools is for studio snobs.
ReNoise is for people afraid to abandon old technology.
Live is for DJ's who think they can produce.
Acid is for people too lazy to learn anything else.
Reaper is for poor people. (after 30 days it's for poor people who like stealing software)
Reason is for people who refuse to think outside the box.
Energy XT is for people who aren't hung up on making "good music".
Microsoft Sound Recorder is for...um...well...it's pretty awesome actually.

I guess we've found our winner.
:tomatoface:

big giant circles
08-15-2009, 08:14 PM
Well, you just about covered it. Except you didn't note the common criticisms.

FL is for n00bs.
GarageBand is for n00bs with Macs.
Logic is for the wealthy elite. And nobody likes the wealthy elite.
Sonar is for people who want Cubase, but can't find a torrent for it.
Cubase is for people who want Sonar, but also want people to know they paid for it.
ProTools is for studio snobs.
ReNoise is for people afraid to abandon old technology.
Live is for DJ's who think they can produce.
Acid is for people too lazy to learn anything else.
Reaper is for poor people. (after 30 days it's for poor people who like stealing software)
Reason is for people who refuse to think outside the box.
Energy XT is for people who aren't hung up on making "good music".
Microsoft Sound Recorder is for...um...well...it's pretty awesome actually.

I guess we've found our winner.
:tomatoface:

hahaha, I nominate Brandon for president of the Workshop forum. That's one of the greatest posts I've ever read :D

(although, most DAWs are sitting at $500 now--Live, Cubase, Logic, & Sonar--so I suppose the only thing that makes Logic for the wealthy elite is the fact that the computers that run them cost 3x more than the PC's that run the others.) :)

Harmony
08-15-2009, 08:34 PM
hahaha :) For Logic, I did think about the expensive Mac platform, but for some reason I also thought Logic was a lot more expensive itself. Has it come down in price, or was I just dreaming that it was close to the $1000 mark at some point?

big giant circles
08-15-2009, 08:53 PM
Yeah. Logic 7 was $1000, but then they released Logic Studio (which included Logic 8, Main Stage, and Soundtrack) for $500--pretty amazing deal! Cubase 4 was also $800, but then they released Cubase 5 at $500. It's really amazing how cheap this stuff is now. Seems like the business model for music software has changed in definite favor of the home artist. Pros on the other hand, are taking a pretty huge hit for this. Probably regretting the thousands upon thousands of dollars they invested in a bunch of hardware that has been replaced by an easier and more flexible software program.

LuketheXjesse
08-15-2009, 09:08 PM
I say get Reaper because it's cheap.

Not to mention absolutely AWESOME :o

DusK
08-16-2009, 02:04 AM
looooooooooooooool
Well, most rock artists I know use ProTools, so I kinda always figured he used something like that. I never bothered to check his profile, because... well... I'm lazy. :-P

Hy Bound
08-16-2009, 03:34 AM
Live is for DJ's who think they can produce.
:-(

I honestly think that most people find whatever they use first/what they use now is the best. So i guess the best thing you can do is try the demos for every single DAW you could possibly think of... Yeah... That'll do it.