World of Warcraft

[zircon]

According to several guilds I know, Razoregore and Vael are the hard fights in BWL. Nef is apparently a disappointment, and easier than Rag. Most other BWL fights appear to be easy from the people I talk with.

[Russell Cox]

According to several guilds I know, Razoregore and Vael are the hard fights in BWL. Nef is apparently a disappointment, and easier than Rag. Most other BWL fights appear to be easy from the people I talk with.

Yes, well, most everyone else says it's impossible to tank the new ED dragons with one tank tanking and we do it that way better than rotations. Ragnaros isn't a hard fight, no matter how much you'll disagree with me on that -- learning it and not being able to spend all the time in the world on him like you can Lucifron are two different things. If people have trouble with Ragnaros, they're never getting anywhere in Blackwing Lair and beyond until they hammer him out.

Razorgore is technical like Majordomo -- the 'hard' part is only in learning and executing your tailored strategy. The actual fighting of Razorgore is onpar with General Drakkisath in UBRS, except Razorgore occassionally throws out AoE fireballs for 700ish. Razorgore is slightly harder for the Alliance (horde has Earthbind totems and can kite cleanly), Vael is slightly harder for the Horde (Paladin's BoS ensures healers never get on the hate list until late for Burning Adrenaline).

Vael is a DPS burn fight; it's not hard at all. Like every single boss fight you figure out positioning, boost FR for his fure pulse, then go to town on DPS. The only reason it took people so long to beat him was the cockblock before patch 1.8 -- you only had one hour every 12 hours to fight him.

Broodlord is the third hardest fight in the instance, with Chromaggus taking the lead and Nefarian second, and even Firemaw matches Broodlord in stress factor. Broodlord's hate is very, very, very touchy the entire time. He hits with Mortal Strike for 4-6K non crit, and knocks back the tank which in turn reduces their hate by 75%. You do a tank rotation with at least four Warriors; if more than one dies it's game over -- once the surviving two get knocked back and lose that 75% hate healers and DPS immediately go topside; instant wipe. Hate is literally so shaky that wanding is literally the only way to go with him, and even THAT *WILL* pull hate if you take too long; Hunters are the main source of DPS on Broodlord because they can go balls to the wall and then FD -- if it gets resisted they stop and wait until they can perform it again.

Plus, you're still in the 'active' suppression room while fighting Broodlord, so you're dealing with respawning groups of whelps, Dragonkin, and Taskmasters (think mages with Warrior hits). Plus, the actual units reduce attack, movement, and magic speed by 80% so if the ROgues aren't on top of the units the tanks get slammed hard.

Chromaggus is... a bitch. It is a very fun fight, but it's incredibly difficult and *VERY* long, and yes I would rate him higher than Nefarian (which seems to be a pattern; Majordomo and Chromaggus are fights that take excessive control and really attentive crew and are before the final bosses, whereby Ragnaros and Nefarian are more encounters to entertain you that while are still hard, are more technical in nature than groundbreaking stuff). Healers are constantly dispeling magic, removing disease, abolishing poison, and uncursing -- AND they're trying to keep the tank alive during Affliction: Bronze, which is an AoE stun for 2-8 seconds with random timers. The types of breaths he uses really determines how hard he is; for the longest time he wasn't switching breaths and was only using Shadow and Frost. If you get Fire (Combustion with Conflageration) and Arcane (Time Lapse), it's damn near impossible to get past him that week.

Nefarian is most definitely hard due to the fact that you're essentially dealing with the opening of Razorgore event to a degree (but with mobs twice as difficult, and twice as many), as well as Onxyia +2. Depending on which classes are 'gimped' repeatably determines how much easier the fight can go for you -- you get Priest gimps a lot and the tanks are going to die because Druids and Shamans/Paladins alone can't keep the MT(s) up due to the massive damage Nefarian puts out. He's still touchier on aggro than Broodlord or Onyxia, and you're constantly dealing with the chance of enemies if Warlocks get gimped, plus at 20% you'll have to deal with 50+ 60 elite Constructs (remember how hard those fuckers hit in Scholomance? Yeah.).

So, yeah, Nefarian's easier than Chromaggus, but he's not easy at all. People were up to Broodlord by the first few days, and his first death didn't occur until 2 weeks after release of the dungeon even by the elite guilds, the drakes go by pretty fast though Firemaw is a bitch, and Chromaggus wasn't kill until the 6th or 7th week after launch. Nefarian fell the first time to Pacifist or Elitist Jerks the first time almost a month after Chromaggus went down (though, to give them credit back then you could only attempt phase 2 Nefarian (Lord Victor Nefarius > Nefarian) once a week). So yeah, 2 and a half, nearly three months before the final guy fell, whereas people were at Ragnaros within 3 weeks in MC, and he fell to Ascendent Sky a month and a half after release -- before Dark Iron gear came into play -- and some people want to say that a boss where most of the raid was still in blues is harder than one where most 1everyone in the raid has their tier set completed is harder? I don't think so.

[Russell Cox]

Post whoring:

http://mammae.org/images/1.9/1.9Loot_page1.jpg
http://mammae.org/images/1.9/1.9Loot_page3.jpg
http://mammae.org/images/1.9/1.9Loot_page4.jpg
http://mammae.org/images/1.9/1.9Loot_page5.jpg
http://mammae.org/images/1.9/1.9Loot_page6.jpg
http://mammae.org/images/1.9/1.9Loot_page7.jpg

Some of the new stuff the static guild we signed up for with a lot of other officers from their guilds to learn the instance before release. So, while Blizzard 'lied' in that they won't have sets in Ahn'Qiraj for classes, I think they meant full 8 piece sets. Each class has a 5 armor piece set, and a 3 piece set that includes a ring, weapon, and cape.

Also, take good, long look at the mace that boosts Druid attack power in animal forms -- think someone goofed up hardcore? lol.

[suzumebachi]

wow that 'unseen path' hunter set is extremely weak compared to the other sets. rogue cape gives +1% to hit, warrior cape gives +1% to crit, and hunter cape gives you... agility. my current cape is better than that piece of crap. though i'd like to see what the set does as a whole. that axe is lame as hell too. i could give a shit about 3 mana every 5 seconds.

where is the hunter armor set?

edit: that 1h mace is fucked up. that can't even possibly be right. it's got more DPS than the strongest 2H in the game. and not just a little more either.

[zircon]

According to several guilds I know, Razoregore and Vael are the hard fights in BWL. Nef is apparently a disappointment, and easier than Rag. Most other BWL fights appear to be easy from the people I talk with.

Yes, well, most everyone else says it's impossible to tank the new ED dragons with one tank tanking and we do it that way better than rotations. Ragnaros isn't a hard fight, no matter how much you'll disagree with me on that -- learning it and not being able to spend all the time in the world on him like you can Lucifron are two different things. If people have trouble with Ragnaros, they're never getting anywhere in Blackwing Lair and beyond until they hammer him out.

Razorgore is technical like Majordomo -- the 'hard' part is only in learning and executing your tailored strategy. The actual fighting of Razorgore is onpar with General Drakkisath in UBRS, except Razorgore occassionally throws out AoE fireballs for 700ish. Razorgore is slightly harder for the Alliance (horde has Earthbind totems and can kite cleanly), Vael is slightly harder for the Horde (Paladin's BoS ensures healers never get on the hate list until late for Burning Adrenaline).

Vael is a DPS burn fight; it's not hard at all. Like every single boss fight you figure out positioning, boost FR for his fure pulse, then go to town on DPS. The only reason it took people so long to beat him was the cockblock before patch 1.8 -- you only had one hour every 12 hours to fight him.

Broodlord is the third hardest fight in the instance, with Chromaggus taking the lead and Nefarian second, and even Firemaw matches Broodlord in stress factor. Broodlord's hate is very, very, very touchy the entire time. He hits with Mortal Strike for 4-6K non crit, and knocks back the tank which in turn reduces their hate by 75%. You do a tank rotation with at least four Warriors; if more than one dies it's game over -- once the surviving two get knocked back and lose that 75% hate healers and DPS immediately go topside; instant wipe. Hate is literally so shaky that wanding is literally the only way to go with him, and even THAT *WILL* pull hate if you take too long; Hunters are the main source of DPS on Broodlord because they can go balls to the wall and then FD -- if it gets resisted they stop and wait until they can perform it again.

Plus, you're still in the 'active' suppression room while fighting Broodlord, so you're dealing with respawning groups of whelps, Dragonkin, and Taskmasters (think mages with Warrior hits). Plus, the actual units reduce attack, movement, and magic speed by 80% so if the ROgues aren't on top of the units the tanks get slammed hard.

Chromaggus is... a bitch. It is a very fun fight, but it's incredibly difficult and *VERY* long, and yes I would rate him higher than Nefarian (which seems to be a pattern; Majordomo and Chromaggus are fights that take excessive control and really attentive crew and are before the final bosses, whereby Ragnaros and Nefarian are more encounters to entertain you that while are still hard, are more technical in nature than groundbreaking stuff). Healers are constantly dispeling magic, removing disease, abolishing poison, and uncursing -- AND they're trying to keep the tank alive during Affliction: Bronze, which is an AoE stun for 2-8 seconds with random timers. The types of breaths he uses really determines how hard he is; for the longest time he wasn't switching breaths and was only using Shadow and Frost. If you get Fire (Combustion with Conflageration) and Arcane (Time Lapse), it's damn near impossible to get past him that week.

Nefarian is most definitely hard due to the fact that you're essentially dealing with the opening of Razorgore event to a degree (but with mobs twice as difficult, and twice as many), as well as Onxyia +2. Depending on which classes are 'gimped' repeatably determines how much easier the fight can go for you -- you get Priest gimps a lot and the tanks are going to die because Druids and Shamans/Paladins alone can't keep the MT(s) up due to the massive damage Nefarian puts out. He's still touchier on aggro than Broodlord or Onyxia, and you're constantly dealing with the chance of enemies if Warlocks get gimped, plus at 20% you'll have to deal with 50+ 60 elite Constructs (remember how hard those fuckers hit in Scholomance? Yeah.).

So, yeah, Nefarian's easier than Chromaggus, but he's not easy at all. People were up to Broodlord by the first few days, and his first death didn't occur until 2 weeks after release of the dungeon even by the elite guilds, the drakes go by pretty fast though Firemaw is a bitch, and Chromaggus wasn't kill until the 6th or 7th week after launch. Nefarian fell the first time to Pacifist or Elitist Jerks the first time almost a month after Chromaggus went down (though, to give them credit back then you could only attempt phase 2 Nefarian (Lord Victor Nefarius > Nefarian) once a week). So yeah, 2 and a half, nearly three months before the final guy fell, whereas people were at Ragnaros within 3 weeks in MC, and he fell to Ascendent Sky a month and a half after release -- before Dark Iron gear came into play -- and some people want to say that a boss where most of the raid was still in blues is harder than one where most 1everyone in the raid has their tier set completed is harder? I don't think so.

Rag was bugged for awhile. he got a lot harder at Rag 3.0, so I'm not surprised people beat him early. Vael in addition was also made harder recently. Finally, Razoregore is going to be made more difficult for Horde as they are going to make the mobs unkitable - that's why my guild is trying non-kiting strats, which makes it tougher.

Also, Nefarian was beaten by DRAMA first on Shattered Hand. I would know as several of my IRL friends are in it and it was a huge deal. He was on instant farm status afterwords.. he's not that hard of a fight, apparently.

[GuitarNinja]

The "new" Paladins are no worse than the old ones, which were very powerful already. The only reason you'd complain about them is if you try to play them like a Warrior. They are combat healers in PvP, and, if you have BWL-level gear, can pump out fairly nice damage as a bonus. But they're at not Warriors first, Priests second.

I started the game as a Paladin, before my move to horde.

Aaaaand the paladin changes are in the wrong direction for the paladin. Due to their long life, more DPS is bad with out tweaking it so they die faster.

I'm not really happy with it, dusted off the paladin and ran around with the new holy/prot tree. I've never been a fan of the ret tree, it just doesn't do well in PvE.

As for the new instance, and how powerfull the weapons are, they have to be. AQ to be opened needs horde and alliance to kill the fith boss in BWL, and some other overly complex actions. Meaning folks are going to be in BWL gear, so they need upgrades to drool over.

Mind you, I'm in a group that is almost to Raggy, and we hope to be dieing to him by the 25th, so my information on things outside of MC is limited.

[Russell Cox]

Rag was bugged for awhile. he got a lot harder at Rag 3.0, so I'm not surprised people beat him early.

Err, how was he bugged? The only problems off the bat with his fight were lockout issues with raids, and the Majordomo and Ragnaros event would not complete, so you could never attack him and have to try again the next day. The lava surges hit for about 3-4K but it was rare it did -- they lowered the damage to around 700-1,000 and made them a hell of a lot more often. Wrathfire (ranged BOOM shot) would go off randomly, and they changed that so he doesn't do it unless there is no one in melee range. He resisted spells a shitload until they lowered resist rates for mobs 3 levels over and raised HP of bosses in MC; that was a double edged sword as he gained a good 10% HP but now that Mages and Warlock weren't being resisted over and over the health increase didn't amount to much.

The only real major bug occured when BWL went live, and it was Sons of Ragnaros spawning 10 seconds into the fight so you had them + him to deal with and it wasn't pretty (why the hell you'd do something as sensitive as Ragnaros on patch night I have no fucking clue) and even that was hotfixed the next day or day after that when they were messing around with the controller controls for Razorgore and latency issues.

So, where's the "ultra hard" Ragnaros 3.0? Onyxia is the one that got major, major buffs over time. She kept getting buffed even past the introductions of Lord Kazzak and Azuregos. Ragnaros has been ninja nerfed all along, and Dark Iron gear just made the fight easier.

Vael in addition was also made harder recently. Finally, Razoregore is going to be made more difficult for Horde as they are going to make the mobs unkitable - that's why my guild is trying non-kiting strats, which makes it tougher.

Uh, Vael has been made easier as the hotfixes were implemented. When he first went live the fire pulse was around 1-1.2K a second, Essence of the Red didn't activate half the time, you could only take him once every 12 hours, the explosion portion of Burning Adrenaline sometimes went off right away and caused an instant wipe, and he often went into evade mode for no apparent reason. No, he hasn't gotten harder as time has passed, he's just slowly gotten easier for people to wedge room into BWL.

The boss that has gotten harder is Broodlord; when he first went live his Mortal Strikes were like they are now (4-6K) but sometime about 3 weeks after release something fubared up and his MSs were only hitting 1-1.5K; they saw it and fixed that issue. Chromaggus was also a bitch before when his breaths were stuck on EZMOAD, and with people actually dealing with Time Lapse now he's a nightmare.

And I'd love to see who told you they're making Razorgore non-kitable. Not only are they wrong and there's been no report of a hotfix, but I've actually been IN Blackwing Lair on the test server. We couldn't get into AQ today on test servers due to that instance server having some major lag problem and we went into BWL to see what's changed and find out any nerfs -- nothing has, though it seems like the trash pulls after Firemaw are harder and the Foot Soldiers seem to be using Brood Affliction: Green more often. Sadly, the server or instance servers crash as we were fighting Ebonroc so I don't know any changes to his fight (though he seemed normal), Flamegor, Chromaggus, or Nefarian. Whoever got their information about Razorgore is wrong.

Who's DRAMA? I've never heard of them.

EDIT: Wait, I remember that debacle. Supposedly A) they climbed onto the terrain in the room and basically went into evade mode themselves and nothing could attack them and B) they logged out tons of members in Nefarian's chamber, so when someone died to the Risen Constructs, Corrupted Infernals, or a random Rogue that was nailed with Shadow Flame after teleport they just switched them out. Half the guild says "no we didn't" and I'm pretty sure I believe them (because nothing spells MMO like thousands of people shouting someone exploited on a kill they haven't done) but ironically DRAMA is the only guild I've heard being accused of exploits on a boss fight (though you hear it in battlegrounds all the time from whiney 12 year olds) and a hotfix was immediately applied that night after they killed it.

Anywho, lots of luck on Razorgore without kiting (this assumes you're taking out Hunter kiting dragons via aggro holding, which BOTH sides do). We tried it with the Priest Mind controlling Legos and using their special to slaughter the dragons while Rogue/Warrior/Mages kill the Mages, but apparently Priests freak out when they're not healing and have brain farts, so we scrapped that after a few semi-successul but sloppy attempts.

[zircon]

Don't base your opinion on Drama from forum posts. Shattered Hand is a messed up server; the main guild in competition with Drama, "Death and Taxes", are a bunch of assholes that will do anything to cover up their lack of skill, from allying with Horde guilds to get easy rank 14s, to having Horde players repeatedly wipe Drama raids on Kazzak (but letting in DnT raids), etc. For the record, Drama did not exploit at all. They got the first worldwide Nef kill legitimately. Most guilds got kills within 24 hours after. There was no hotfix for their strat.. that's total BS. They've had him on farm status since the second they first beat him, their strat has never changed. They are the #1 guild and deserve that status.

In regards to Rag, there were a few glitches where you could get him to not use his knockback abilities. I think one involved wiping before the fight so he wouldn't do it (or was it not submerging?) Anyway, I know that lots of guilds did it, and when they hotfixed him all of a sudden lots of guilds couldn't do the fight. Drama was one of the ones that could.

We're just trying Razorgore now - kiting IS involved, it's just not the traditional figue 8 shaman kiting. MCing legionnaires works fine, several guilds I know do that, but we're not doing it that way currently.

edit: Also, just talked to someone in Drama, they think that Ragnaros was ultimately a harder fight than Nef. It only took them 3 weeks to beat Nef, and longer to kill Rag.

[zircon]

Razoregore down ;)

[suzumebachi]

nice. we're currently working on hakkar now. we wiped our first try, but we managed to get him down to around 15%. unfortunately it was getting extremely late so the group pretty much disbanded after that. he's totally not as hard as you'd think though. hexxer is WAY harder.

[The Author]

Errr...


Sacred Charge and Fickle's Skinner acquired...


Ok ok, means nothing...

[zircon]

nice. we're currently working on hakkar now. we wiped our first try, but we managed to get him down to around 15%. unfortunately it was getting extremely late so the group pretty much disbanded after that. he's totally not as hard as you'd think though. hexxer is WAY harder.

Yeah, Hexxer is the hardest boss in the instance by FAR. From what we've done of him, we've concluded that you really have to have a good group composition to beat him; for example, lots of high damage melee classes to keep up the pressure, a few good hunters to take down totems and multishot shades, and at least one Warlock to curse the shades and take a bunch down.

But as for Hakkar.. how'd you wipe on him? He's really easy. Here's our strat for him.

Final Boss - Hakkar

This is an interesting fight. Positioning is a little tricky, so here's a map.

http://www.zirconstudios.com/Hakkar.PNG

Hakkar is the green ball. The MT (and ONLY the MT, along with a hunter/puller) is the red ball. Hakkar is pulled to him by the Hunter/puller, who then drops down to the rest of the raid (the white ball). Note that BEFORE the pull is made, the healers must all make sure they are in range of the MT and in line of sight. The MT should not move either.

Strat: Throughout the fight, "Sons of Hakkar" are pulled from the lower left and lower right platforms. It's usually a good idea to have TWO people on the lookout for sons to pull, eg. a shaman and a warrior w/ a bow. Start the fight with two sheeped near the main raid. One is killed at a time, and that leaves a poison cloud. The raid (except for the MT) must touch the poison. Hakkar does a life leech attack, and for every person that is poisoned, he takes damage. This is how the majority of damage is done to him. A constant stream of Sons must be pulled, so as soon as poison wears off, another one should be sheeped and ready to go.

To make the fight faster, a few (3 or so) ranged DPS classes like Hunters, Mages, Warlocks, or Rogues w/ good bows should go to the lower left platform (they are the yellow ball). They will be here as often as possible, leaving the rest of the raid to kill sons. HOWEVER, THEY STILL MUST RUN TO GET POISONED WHENEVER A SON IS KILLED! After getting poisoned they can run back to the DPS spot. As long as sons are getting pulled and the raid is getting poisoned every time they can, Hakkar will go down after 10-13 minutes. No one should be dying.

In regards to healing, this IS a long fight so Druids w/ Innervate are very useful. Everyone should pop potions and tubers whenever possible. In the space after a life drain and before the next son is pulled, people can bandage. All cooldown abilities should be used as often as possible because the fight is so long, and they may be usable several times - Innervate can usually be used at least twice in one fight. The MT requires quite a bit of healing and should be topped off at all times, as Hakkar has very powerful melee attacks. Even an MC-geared, Protection spec tank can take up to 50% of his health in damage per hit, so it is absolutely crucial that at least several Priests and several Shamans constantly throwing 1.5second cast heals on him.

The people who are not DPSing Hakkar in the lower left and not healing will be killing sons whenever they come up. One other thing to note; Mages are important for this fight to keep the sheep sgoing, so they do need at least one healer to watch them carefully.

[suzumebachi]

well for one thing, we were trying to avoid the poison as much as possible.. :lol:

anyways, the guild's started farming for tubers in felwood, as well as the crystal buffs in un'goro. any other cool goodies you can use in combat that don't share cooldowns with potions?

also, that songflower buff is hella awesome.

edit: just finished reading the 1.9 patch notes. time for the Argent Dawn Realm Dwarf Hunter tea party. Once again hunters get the nerf bat. And not a little one. Hunter pets can no longer attack while moving, and have had their movement speed normalized at 70%, thus making them entirely, utterly, and completely worthless in PvP, as well as MANY aspects of PvE. And considering my pet is about 25% of my overall DPS... this is a HUGE nerf. And I'm not even BM specced.

[zircon]

Between tubers AND ndb AND potions.. you should be fine. Combat pots FTW in terms of cheap stuff.

[suzumebachi]

omfg. now we're getting even more nerfed. now it's flare. they've lowered the effect radius, increased cooldown and mana cost, and added a giant flaming fucking smoke signal in the middle that screams "DONT STEP HERE ROGUES!"

do they put this in the patch notes? fuck no.

[Stalwart Jester]

now it's flare. they've lowered the effect radius, increased cooldown and mana cost, and added a giant flaming fucking smoke signal in the middle that screams "DONT STEP HERE ROGUES!"

Hooray!---erm, I mean, dammit, Blizzard just doesn't know when to stop, do they?

... ::cough cough::

<=== Rogue. <<;

[DarkMessengerIX|LOA]

my guild is really starting to piss me off

i've killed onyxia with other guilds plenty of times. wiping on her after being able to kill her so easily REALLY pisses me off. And thats not even the bad part- the bad part is that NOBODY wants to pull thier weight and step up to try ony after we wiped so many times. nevermind the fact that last time we attempted her, we got her down to 17%

the fact is, people arent willing to do onyxia unless it means a gain to them. nevermind the guild. i guarantee you that once we down her, everyone will be lining up outside the instance to do it. people wait for hours for MC because it might mean loot for them, but they dont want to step up for ony because they're scared to pay a repair bill. I'm 6/8 Giantstalker's and a striker's mark. My repair bill fully damaged is about 11G. if i can pay 11g every single day we attemnpt her, everyone else can pay half that much. lazy assholes better pull thier weight soon or bad shit will happen

[The Author]

my guild is really starting to piss me off

i've killed onyxia with other guilds plenty of times. wiping on her after being able to kill her so easily REALLY pisses me off. And thats not even the bad part- the bad part is that NOBODY wants to pull thier weight and step up to try ony after we wiped so many times. nevermind the fact that last time we attempted her, we got her down to 17%

the fact is, people arent willing to do onyxia unless it means a gain to them. nevermind the guild. i guarantee you that once we down her, everyone will be lining up outside the instance to do it. people wait for hours for MC because it might mean loot for them, but they dont want to step up for ony because they're scared to pay a repair bill. I'm 6/8 Giantstalker's and a striker's mark. My repair bill fully damaged is about 11G. if i can pay 11g every single day we attemnpt her, everyone else can pay half that much. lazy assholes better pull thier weight soon or bad shit will happen

I got some flak in my guild for a stupid reason related to loot. Hell, I still get bitched by that one druid. We did UBRS, I got Rend's main hand, I know, no biggy, and then the skinner dropped at the beast. We have no rule against getting more than one blue, and we have a rule stating that an upgrade is good for the guild. So I rolled on the skinner. I rolled a 100, and the druid, only other skinner, rolled a 92. Naturally it was mine. I asked twice if I could take it, they said ok, so I grabbed it.

Then they tell me I was greedy. It's kinda annoying that the people who support the "upgrading a guildy is good" rule don't like it when it applies to something they also want.

[zircon]

my guild is really starting to piss me off

i've killed onyxia with other guilds plenty of times. wiping on her after being able to kill her so easily REALLY pisses me off. And thats not even the bad part- the bad part is that NOBODY wants to pull thier weight and step up to try ony after we wiped so many times. nevermind the fact that last time we attempted her, we got her down to 17%

the fact is, people arent willing to do onyxia unless it means a gain to them. nevermind the guild. i guarantee you that once we down her, everyone will be lining up outside the instance to do it. people wait for hours for MC because it might mean loot for them, but they dont want to step up for ony because they're scared to pay a repair bill. I'm 6/8 Giantstalker's and a striker's mark. My repair bill fully damaged is about 11G. if i can pay 11g every single day we attemnpt her, everyone else can pay half that much. lazy assholes better pull thier weight soon or bad shit will happen

It's a common problem. A system where you can award point bonuses and/or penalties to people is helpful. Good players and a good leader are nice too. My guild was sort of lazy but once we got Rag for the first time, people are getting motivated. We now have a fighting chance at being one of the top Horde guilds on the server.

[GuitarNinja]

now it's flare. they've lowered the effect radius, increased cooldown and mana cost, and added a giant flaming fucking smoke signal in the middle that screams "DONT STEP HERE ROGUES!"

Hooray!---erm, I mean, dammit, Blizzard just doesn't know when to stop, do they?

... ::cough cough::

<=== Rogue. <<;

And the big red arrow that humps your head.

[The Author]

now it's flare. they've lowered the effect radius, increased cooldown and mana cost, and added a giant flaming fucking smoke signal in the middle that screams "DONT STEP HERE ROGUES!"

Hooray!---erm, I mean, dammit, Blizzard just doesn't know when to stop, do they?

... ::cough cough::

<=== Rogue. <<;

And the big red arrow that humps your head.


Hunters that go "wah wah nerf" make me laugh.

DoTs no longer break aspect of the cheetah/pack.

Priests and warlocks will no longer be able to stop you should you want to run away.

[zircon]

Yeah, Hunters are really an EXCELLENT class. They are not overpowered but on the verge of being there.

Right now, Priests need the most work, followed by Rogues.

[The Author]

Yeah, Hunters are really an EXCELLENT class. They are not overpowered but on the verge of being there.

Right now, Priests need the most work, followed by Rogues.

Priest I can see have a slight damage ability added for Holy and Discipline, with a bit more utility thrown in Shadow.

Rogues...

Well... rogues... we have a lot of very small and very annoying issues. Mainly how every time a cloth is buffed, it is made harder for us to kill them.

We are supposed to be caster killers but we have no defenses against them... that is probably my biggest issue.

The other is that at first, rogue had a roguish style. We were the assassins. Killers that went unseen. Then people complained about how dangerous a rogue was. And we got condemned to being "DPS in Leather."

I think blizzard, for rogues, has to solve some problems:

Raid/Group PVE utility.
Redefine our PVP role.
SOLVE THE ITEMIZATION IMBALENCE.
Stop the abusive nerfing because we used our abilities.

Seriously, some people complained that "a rogue killed them when they were at half life." I don't complain every god damned time a priest mind controls me and throws me in the lava. If we, as rogues cannot use our abilities, then warriors should not wear armor and mages should not cast spell.

As such, Rogues may need many small adjustments, but the class would benefit from a complete overhaul. If stealth cannot be our main weapon anymore, then give us mail, magic resistance, and some kind of group buff.

[Skilless]

Everytime I cast Inner Fire on my priest and I see that it has a buff time of 3 mins my eyes bleed.

I dont think priests need any work, we are very powerful as is when you are specced shadow. We melt faces in PVP. Its like Raiders of the Lost Arc.

[zircon]

I'll write a real response here in about 30 min.. after class ;)

[suzumebachi]

Yeah, Hunters are really an EXCELLENT class. They are not overpowered but on the verge of being there.

Right now, Priests need the most work, followed by Rogues.

they've nerfed the hell out of us in this last patch though. our pets have suddenly become pretty much worthless. they now have a permanent 70% movement speed (unless you're BM specced). this means that our DPS against anything that moves (such as rogues, priests, mages, paladins, warriors, shamans, druids, warlocks, running monsters) is reduced by 25-30%. that's a HUGE nerf.

BM specced hunters are getting nerfed even more. pets do LESS damage with Bestial Wrath ON than they do without it.

http://files.filefront.com/BMpeton19avi/;4402635;;/fileinfo.html
http://files.filefront.com/HunterPetsavi/;4395309;;/fileinfo.html

[zircon]

Yeah, Hunters are really an EXCELLENT class. They are not overpowered but on the verge of being there.

Right now, Priests need the most work, followed by Rogues.

Priest I can see have a slight damage ability added for Holy and Discipline, with a bit more utility thrown in Shadow.

Here are our problems.

1. Our primary defenses (Psychic Scream and Power Word: Shield) have been nerfed to the point of uselessness. The Fear only lasts for a short time, is on a long cooldown, and most classes can trinket out of it. Power Word: Shield is on a cooldown and now that it ignores armor, is a total joke. There are times when I will cast it and it will disappear in less than a second.

2. We are always the primary target in PVP and lack the defenses of other healing classes.

3. The Holy tree is next to useless. Most talents are total garbage, including the entire bottom half. For endgame, only about 3-4 talents are actually useful.

4. The Discipline tree has about 10 points worth of abilities that all Priests MUST have or else they are totally gimp. Other useful abilities are scattered around. The 31 point talent is garbage (same with the Holy talent).

5. We are the only casting class to not have any method of mana regeneration. Because we are not hybrids (unlike Shamans and Paladins) we are totally useless when we reach zero mana. Mages can Evocate, Warlocks can Life Tap, Druids can Innervate (or just shapeshift and do something else) etc.

6. Our main stat is supposed to be Spirit, which doesn't work in 95% of all combat situations.

7. Most of our spells are useless. Greater Heal has no utility out of 5/10 man instances, and even then, it is still rarely used. Prayer of Healing is good for basically one boss fight in the game. Renew is OK but Druids HoTs are better + more efficient, and you have to spec for it to be really worthwhile. We are reduced to spamming Flash Heal in most encounters.

8. We are the only class where if you spec for PVE you lose all PVP utility and damage dealing capabilities. Holy spec priests can barely heal better in PVP than a Shadow spec priest yet they are totally defenseless, have less damage reduction, and cannot do damage. WTF?

9. Paladins, Druids, and Shamans can all meet or beat the healing efficiency of a Priest. Shamans especially can match us with their Lesser Healing Wave which is basically identical to our Flash Heal. They also have better armor and DPS capabilities if need be.

10. We do not benefit from +crit gear unlike most clases. +crit generates more aggro and causes overhealing. Even in PVP, our damage comes from channeled spells and DoTs, thus all of our gear has to be stamina, +damage, or +damage/healing, which is hard to come by. You have to gimp yourself in some way to get it, or have full MC/BWL-level items that are very hard to collect.

Trust me, we have problems.

Rogues...

Well... rogues... we have a lot of very small and very annoying issues. Mainly how every time a cloth is buffed, it is made harder for us to kill them.

Priests have not ever been buffed. We have only been nerfed, and in your favor. As for Warlocks.. what, Death Coil? One skill doesn't make or break a battle, typically.

We are supposed to be caster killers but we have no defenses against them... that is probably my biggest issue.

You can trinket or Vanish out of most forms of caster crowd control on you. You can Kick our spells (possibly silencing us), stun us to interrupt (even through our "uninterruptable" abilities), cripple us so we can't run, double our casting time, hit us constantly so our spells don't go off, and stunlock us so we can't do shit. Oh, and you don't have a mana bar to rely on to do damage, so you can keep going indefinitely.

The other is that at first, rogue had a roguish style. We were the assassins. Killers that went unseen. Then people complained about how dangerous a rogue was. And we got condemned to being "DPS in Leather."

I have played a hell of a lot of PVP. Rogues are still unseen killers in AB, they are VERY deadly. Same goes for WSG. Two rogues coming out of nowhere with Saps, stunlocks, and blinds = bad news for flag defense.

I think blizzard, for rogues, has to solve some problems:

Raid/Group PVE utility.

You DPS. You are a DPS class. You are very, very good at DPSing. Too good, in fact. Rogues typically dominate damage meters in any MC-level guild. In my guild, that is certainly the case. You are the only DPS class with an instant aggro-reduction ability. This makes you very powerful. If you pick offense, and all you do is go on offense, you can't complain. You can also stunlock/sap mobs for CC.

Redefine our PVP role.

You can quickly assassinate healers, you can stealth defend an area or stealth assault an area, you can keep casters stunlocked.. and you can do tons of damage. What the hell is wrong with your role?

SOLVE THE ITEMIZATION IMBALENCE.

ROFL! What itemization imbalance? The fact that any caster has to spend tons of time building up an entire equipment set just to scale their spells up by 1% while you guys can get one or two drops and double your DPS in no time? Rogues have some of the best itemization of any class, particularly with AV and the Lobotomizer, which is ridiculously easy to get. Warriors have the same "problem".

Stop the abusive nerfing because we used our abilities.

Seriously, some people complained that "a rogue killed them when they were at half life." I don't complain every god damned time a priest mind controls me and throws me in the lava. If we, as rogues cannot use our abilities, then warriors should not wear armor and mages should not cast spell.

You guys have not received any serious nerfs.

As such, Rogues may need many small adjustments, but the class would benefit from a complete overhaul. If stealth cannot be our main weapon anymore, then give us mail, magic resistance, and some kind of group buff.

Stealth is still your main weapon. There are ways to get around it, just like there are ways to get around any class' main abilities. The fact of the matter is, there are ways to break stealth, but it's irrelevant if you DON'T KNOW THE ROGUE IS THERE.

[GuitarNinja]

[

Rogues...

Well... rogues... we have a lot of very small and very annoying issues. Mainly how every time a cloth is buffed, it is made harder for us to kill them.


We rogues don't need much, eviscerate needs a change, in MC and beyond the damage really sucks.

Also, I'd like to see a new opener.

What I'd really like to see is a larger choice of spec for end game for priests.

[zircon]

Eviscerate still hits pretty hard. Now you know how it feels to not have scaling damage ;) My Shadow Word: Pain has done the same for the last 6 months.

[GuitarNinja]

Eviscerate still hits pretty hard. Now you know how it feels to not have scaling damage ;) My Shadow Word: Pain has done the same for the last 6 months.

Well, I'd like to see minor tweaks, rogues for the most part are fine. Folks who want us to be buffed, I guess didn't play when the game first came out, and we were Jesus with DPS.

The rogue class, should be last for the patches if you ask me, and I play one. I hope they do Priests and Mages at once. When druids can become better at the whole healing thing, then the class that sorta has it in their name is recockulas.

[The Author]

I stated group PVP for a reason.

As soon as a rogue starts attacking one target in PVP, he ends up marked, DOTed, and feared.

If he is lucky.

If that does not happen then your server sucks for PvP.

Rogues have had constant nerfs, and it is apparent you have never played one to not see them.

Stealth, both in PVE and PVP has been nerfed to the point that versus some mobs (Dogs in BRD and ghouls in strat for example) you are safer unstealthed. In PvP now, at level 60, with 5 rank MoD, a hunter could still see me 20 yard away. I'm also a NE. 5 rank MOD should mean "nearly impossible to detect." It should not mean "hey a hunter" Mark, Sting, Pet, FD Ice trap.

It used to be that I could fall without breakin stealth, now I get 1 damage from falling I break stealth.

Mages used to be incapacitated when they were cheapshotted, now they can blink.

Weapon speed used to influence instant attacks, not it has been standardised for the worse.

If there is an AoE silence, I break stealth. If there is a slowing totem, I break stealth. If I resist a Arcane Explosion Rank 1, I break stealth. If a ennemy warrior uses a battleshout next to me, I break stealth. If a hunter uses multishot, I get hit and break stealth. If a shammy uses chain lightening, I break stealth.

Itemisation for rogues just plain suck. Fist weapons are non-existent until MC (I originally wanted to be a fist weapon rogue), good maces can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Good swords are rare in end game. When a rogue has Dal Rend, he will be stuck with those until MC is in farm status. The sword set in ZG is crappy for sword rogues, dal rend outdps it by a wide margin. And when Blizz will notice that, they will probably nerf it badly. Daggers, pre ZG, are worth nothing. The only good option has been nerfed by the attack speed standardisation. Our damage only marginally scales with gear. What we mostly gain is AP, but it is at the cost of HP. I almost lost 700 life since I left cadaverous for SC. And while, yes, we do gain some damage, 1 agility = 1 AP 1 str=1AP. Instead of warriors: 1 Str = 2 AP, or hunters 1 Agi = 2 AP. If we focus on agility gear, we end up like my rogue, 800 ranged SP (Because in ranged, 1 agi = 2 AP) and 600 melee AP. Rogue DPS increases basically only by the DPS increase of his weapon times 1.5. If he is lucky.

A good item usually has something like +13 agility +7 str. Meaning +20 AP, or +1.2 DPS.

A good item enchant (lets take Frozen Wrath on a level 60 item) is about +23 damage on frost spells. Frost bolt takes what? 1.5 second to cast? 2 seconds?

Even at a 3 second cast, that frozen wrath item will give a +7.6 DPS upgrade. That is damage not mitigated by armor.

Eviscerate, the best burst damage finishing move, is mitigated by armor and unmodified by attack power.

At level 56, with a gray mainhand dagger, and entirely naked, a rogue can do as much eviscerate damage as a level 60 in all epics, using thunderfury.

Speaking of aggro breaking:

Rogues Feint: 7 second cooldown, can be blocked, dodged, parried, missed, or resisted, melee range only.

Feint death (hunter skill) can only be resisted, usable at any range.

Priests, Fade, can only be resisted.

Mages, Ice Block, talent ability, cannot be resisted.

Vanish, 5 minute cooldown, needs a regent, needs the rogue to not have DOTs. Also, will increase aggro on stealth breaking mobs.

Funny story about how stealth increases aggro. In Strat, our hunter pulls a lone ghoul. I stand between the ghoul and the hunter, ready to cheapshot it to "protect" the mail wearing hunter. The hunter, which is currently attacking the ghoul, loses aggro to ME, a stealthed rogue. Many mobs will stop when running to the aggroer, whack me once, and then start running again, negating my stealth advantage. If I dont put myself in a good position, I will miss the first part of the fight. If I do, I get cheated out of my strenght.

Our energy bar. I cannot spam SS like mages can spam AE, simply because sinister strike uses up 40 energy a strike, meaning that it is instant, but that I need 4 seconds to restore that energy. Backstab uses 65. Meaning 6.5 seconds to regain that energy,

Recently, some good rogue builds had been made. They depended on weapon swap for a good ambush followed by a sword style combat. Now we have a 1 second global cooldown following weapon swaps.

Try playing a rogue, maybe you will read patch notes differently. Over the last year, we have been nerfed at every patch.

[ellywu2]

All rogues need is a new rank of eviserate. Personally, i say nerf them all the hell but thats just because no one likes being 2 shotted when sat down eating after a fight. Can't blame the players really, Blizzard just made a class which was designed to be an arsehole.
In all fairness, the new rank of feign was the right way to go in regards to raiding rogues. And stealth is still powerful. The thing is when you're in instanced PvP everyones expecting you because thats the whole point of it, to pvp. World pvp you're still the undisputed king of grief-i mean killing people unawares.

Hunters well...you know before 1.8 i was marks/survival and after 1.8 i was marks/survival. Through all the changes all i gained was around 1-2% crit and surefooted. I was doing well before the patch and i was doing well after the patch. The uberness of BW just clouds peoples vision somewhat in regards to hunters and overpoweredness. (If you want to see real overpoweredness play a warrior.)
But in fairness the test server speed issue, whilst casters might rejoice, looks like a bug to me. Otherwise blizzard just nerfed all the hard work it put into pets.

[suzumebachi]

don't be surprised if this "bug" makes it live :( :( :(

[zircon]

First of all, I do play a Rogue.

Second of all:

A good item enchant (lets take Frozen Wrath on a level 60 item) is about +23 damage on frost spells. Frost bolt takes what? 1.5 second to cast? 2 seconds?

Even at a 3 second cast, that frozen wrath item will give a +7.6 DPS upgrade. That is damage not mitigated by armor.

1. Caster +damage, like with Frozen Wrath, comes at the expense of ALL OTHER STATS. Unlike you guys, casters have to rely on mana. Greens with +spell damage are garbage. You have to build up a massive set of MC level gear; eg 8-10 or so pieces of gear before you start seeing changes.

2. It's not a direct addition. Only spells that take more than 3 or 3.5 seconds to cast (or so) get the full effect from the +damage. Frostbolts do not get the full effect. If I got a full suit of all BWL gear and Warlord's gear, my 1.5 second cast Mindblast would hit for about.. 200 damage more? For a FULL set of endgame, "godly" gear. So instead of 500 it would hit for 700. Of course, I would also lose spirit, mana per 5 seconds, maximum mana, resistances, healing power, etc if I took this set of gear. Wow, uber. Sorry, but casters take it UP THE ASS in terms of itemization. Rogues have it easiest of any class.

Our energy bar. I cannot spam SS like mages can spam AE, simply because sinister strike uses up 40 energy a strike, meaning that it is instant, but that I need 4 seconds to restore that energy. Backstab uses 65. Meaning 6.5 seconds to regain that energy,

That Mage AE? Yeah, it takes mana. And they don't gain it back in a few seconds like you. Nor can they do anything when they have 0 mana. You can still hit people, crit, and poison them when you have 0 energy (though you will only have 0 energy for a second or two!).

[The Author]

First of all, I do play a Rogue.

Second of all:

A good item enchant (lets take Frozen Wrath on a level 60 item) is about +23 damage on frost spells. Frost bolt takes what? 1.5 second to cast? 2 seconds?

Even at a 3 second cast, that frozen wrath item will give a +7.6 DPS upgrade. That is damage not mitigated by armor.

1. Caster +damage, like with Frozen Wrath, comes at the expense of ALL OTHER STATS. Unlike you guys, casters have to rely on mana. Greens with +spell damage are garbage. You have to build up a massive set of MC level gear; eg 8-10 or so pieces of gear before you start seeing changes.

2. It's not a direct addition. Only spells that take more than 3 or 3.5 seconds to cast (or so) get the full effect from the +damage. Frostbolts do not get the full effect. If I got a full suit of all BWL gear and Warlord's gear, my 1.5 second cast Mindblast would hit for about.. 200 damage more? For a FULL set of endgame, "godly" gear. So instead of 500 it would hit for 700. Of course, I would also lose spirit, mana per 5 seconds, maximum mana, resistances, healing power, etc if I took this set of gear. Wow, uber. Sorry, but casters take it UP THE ASS in terms of itemization. Rogues have it easiest of any class.

Rogues is the hardest to play period. I have played every class, heck, I even started a second rogue, just to test out if it was just because it was my first character, and no, the rogue class is overly complicated compared to "I win charge heroicstrike" comboes.

[GuitarNinja]

First of all, I do play a Rogue.

Second of all:

A good item enchant (lets take Frozen Wrath on a level 60 item) is about +23 damage on frost spells. Frost bolt takes what? 1.5 second to cast? 2 seconds?

Even at a 3 second cast, that frozen wrath item will give a +7.6 DPS upgrade. That is damage not mitigated by armor.

1. Caster +damage, like with Frozen Wrath, comes at the expense of ALL OTHER STATS. Unlike you guys, casters have to rely on mana. Greens with +spell damage are garbage. You have to build up a massive set of MC level gear; eg 8-10 or so pieces of gear before you start seeing changes.

2. It's not a direct addition. Only spells that take more than 3 or 3.5 seconds to cast (or so) get the full effect from the +damage. Frostbolts do not get the full effect. If I got a full suit of all BWL gear and Warlord's gear, my 1.5 second cast Mindblast would hit for about.. 200 damage more? For a FULL set of endgame, "godly" gear. So instead of 500 it would hit for 700. Of course, I would also lose spirit, mana per 5 seconds, maximum mana, resistances, healing power, etc if I took this set of gear. Wow, uber. Sorry, but casters take it UP THE ASS in terms of itemization. Rogues have it easiest of any class.

Rogues are easy mode, keeping agro down is simple, even more simple if you're a sword rogue.

Caster have it way worse then we do, I'd like to add that the mage MC set doesn't add much damage, but mostly mana, it's a huge give and take. Where as Nightslayer, pours tons of Agility, and some strength giving the rogue more crit, AP, and dodge. It buffs all out main needs with out much choice.

So, I agree.

[zircon]

First of all, I do play a Rogue.

Second of all:

A good item enchant (lets take Frozen Wrath on a level 60 item) is about +23 damage on frost spells. Frost bolt takes what? 1.5 second to cast? 2 seconds?

Even at a 3 second cast, that frozen wrath item will give a +7.6 DPS upgrade. That is damage not mitigated by armor.

1. Caster +damage, like with Frozen Wrath, comes at the expense of ALL OTHER STATS. Unlike you guys, casters have to rely on mana. Greens with +spell damage are garbage. You have to build up a massive set of MC level gear; eg 8-10 or so pieces of gear before you start seeing changes.

2. It's not a direct addition. Only spells that take more than 3 or 3.5 seconds to cast (or so) get the full effect from the +damage. Frostbolts do not get the full effect. If I got a full suit of all BWL gear and Warlord's gear, my 1.5 second cast Mindblast would hit for about.. 200 damage more? For a FULL set of endgame, "godly" gear. So instead of 500 it would hit for 700. Of course, I would also lose spirit, mana per 5 seconds, maximum mana, resistances, healing power, etc if I took this set of gear. Wow, uber. Sorry, but casters take it UP THE ASS in terms of itemization. Rogues have it easiest of any class.

Rogues is the hardest to play period. I have played every class, heck, I even started a second rogue, just to test out if it was just because it was my first character, and no, the rogue class is overly complicated compared to "I win charge heroicstrike" comboes.

I meant that their itemization is best.

But they are also the easiest to play. It's laughable. All of my PVE experience is spamming Sinister Strike and then Eviscerate. I apply Poisons periodically. I never have to worry about getting ganked by people near my level. Two people try to gank me? Gouge one, Blind the other, Vanish, Sprint. Low on Energy and in the middle of a fight? Thistle Tea, pop a potion or tuber, Evasion, use Blind (or Vanish and then go to cheapshot etc). Too easy. Levelling was a walk in the park.

[The Author]

Priest is the easiest:

I mean, I powerlevel my priest.

And she'S holy!

Any surprise, I can fear, then I can shield and cure myself.

I win!

[mecca]

My GM just started a contest for the first of us three rogues (at around the same lv) to reach 53 the fastest. The winner recieves full Stormshroud..which as you know is a pretty fucking good incentive to start levelling!

Anyway, I've just hit 49, and the other two are 50..any ideas where to level or what to do at this stage? I'm messing about in Un'Goro and the place near BRD (forget it's name now).

[metroixer]

I only read the first two pages of this topic,but has anyone tried runescape? It's a nice fre game if you're a cheap bastard (Like me :D). Although it does get boring after a while..

[ellywu2]

rogues? hard? rofl.

Itemization is greatly in favour of melee classes at the moment. + Spell damage..lol if you get MC +spell damage gear you are gimping yourself stamina wise. That is the reason you hear casters moan about getting 2 shotted (most of the time) It's because they have to make a choice, +spell dmg or +stam. Melee on the other hand well, they get both. Nightslayer and its tier 2 equiuvalent both pile on the stats, +crit +dodge +hit for a rogue. Now i'm not one who believes that propaganda video world of roguecraft but there is less of a choice with gear for a rogue vis-a-vis itemization. You wont be gimping yourself to the extreme with sensible gear choices, whereas a caster will. Another issue in the itemization arguement is the nature of spells themselves. They dont scale. Whilst yes, a rogues evis doesnt scale either, the same isnt true of ambush and backstab. With all the new pimp-as-shit melee weapons coming out its harder and harder for a caster to survive. A priests PWS can be knocked away in 1 hit for example. (Obviously 1.9 is addressing these changes and from what i hear its given casters a well needed boost.)

I'm not trying to devalue the rogue class. Whilst they may not be a hard class to play, they're not the godawful easy paladin.

Mecca, what server do you play on? Am i right in guessing its a EU server? also, try grinding green mobs, rogues damn well excel at that.

Also, Vael down :)

[The Author]

We're a melee class that has NO armor.

Any mage has more armor than a rogue. Where is our 30 minute buff/defensive mechanism?

[ellywu2]

Evasion, Dodge, Parry (to a limited extent.) are your armour. The ability to absolutely NAIL something down with stuns could be seen as something along those lines.

A buff yes, thats something which the rogue class is lacking.

[zircon]

My GM just started a contest for the first of us three rogues (at around the same lv) to reach 53 the fastest. The winner recieves full Stormshroud..which as you know is a pretty fucking good incentive to start levelling!

Anyway, I've just hit 49, and the other two are 50..any ideas where to level or what to do at this stage? I'm messing about in Un'Goro and the place near BRD (forget it's name now).

Heh.. Stormshroud ;)

Yeah, Un'Goro is a nice place at your level. You can still do Zul'farrak runs (instance near Tanaris). In a level or two, hit Western Plaguelands. Felwood may be good for you too right now.

[ILLiterate]

WoW Trial over...so...cold

I need to get it for christmas or something

[mecca]

Aye, I was grinding from 48 in the Eastern Plaguelands, believe it or not, further proof that rogues are the shit (hello flash powder). It's just a case of kidney shot, get up the combo points, ghostly strike, decrease armour, then keep hitting the "1" and "2" keys repeatedly until they die, maybe taking the odd potion and hitting evasion.

Anyway, onto the bit I want you all to read. I know some of you have short attention spans, so I'll space this out as much as possible. Ready? Stay with me here:

Firstly, I'm on Emerald Dream, EUR.

Next, from what I've read, is it true that WoW really only opens up at 60? I've heard so many different oppinions about the endgames, but from what I've seen so far in this thread, the level of tactics when in raids is unbelieveable, what is UBRS..40 man or something? It'd be a massive leap going from the usual five-man runs, can't wait :)

Also, what's a 'green' mob?

Heh..I got one of those red rubys and accidentally put it on the ah for 90s startup and 95g buyout..guess what, some schmuck bought it for full price xD

EDIT:A buff yes, thats something which the rogue class is lacking.

"I'll take 3 deathweed and a crystal vial please, vendor."

Buffs are disguised in the form of poisons..a 30% chance to hit an extra 120-200 with EVERY strike? I like those odds!

[suzumebachi]

a green mob is a mob who is more than two levels below you, but higher than 3/4 your level and thus yields xp while being much easier to kill.

as far as end game instances:

BRD- Blackrock Depths. lvl 52-58; 5-10 man. Lame as hell if you ask me. Not too many drops here either. The only reason I'd run it is to get the lvl 300 blacksmithing/engineering plans. However you will need to do this instance in order to get attuned for Molten Core. Lots of Fire Resist gear drops here also.

UBRS- Upper Blackrock Spire. lvl 57-60; 10-15 man. You can TRY 5 man up to rend, but you won't get much further than that. Blue class set items drop here.

LBRS- Lower Blackrock Spire. lvl 57-60; 5-15 man. It's essentially an easier version of UBRS, and where most of the Blackrock Spire questing is done. Blue class set items drop here.

Scholomance- lvl 57-60; 5-10 man. A twisted monastary type place, filled with lots of undead and their shadowy masters. You can 5 man it for some quests that give decent loot. Blue set items drop here also.

Live Strat- Scarlet side Stratholm. lvl 56-60; 5-10 man. Humanoid grind fest that's mostly done for money from selling righteous orbs. The drops here are generally pretty lame too.

UD Strat- Undead side Stratholm. lvl 56-60; 5-10 man. Undead infested city quarters. Actually a fun instance to run. Blue set items drop here, as well as a few other decent items.

DM- Dire Maul. lvl 59-60; 5 man. DM is comprised of several wings. There's a series of class quest books that drop here, as well as some pretty decent loot. The gordok suit is awesome too. :D

ZG- Zul'Gurub. lvl 60; 20 man. ZG is the most recent dungeon added to the game. It is said to be harder than MC, however my guild is currently working on clearing it. We've cleared 5 bosses so far, and we've yet to even attempt MC. It's still definately no walk in the park though. Lots of good drops here, including many epics.

MC- Molten Core. lvl 60; 40 man. MC is the introduction to the hardcore guild's endgame experience. It takes lots of strategy, lots of good gear, and erm.. lots of Fire Resistance. Tier 1 epic sets drop here, as well as tons of other awesome stuff.

BWL- Blackwing lair. lvl 60; 40 man. BWL is the current hardest instance in the game. It took months after it's initial release before it was finally cleared for the first time. Tier 2 epic sets drop in BWL.

Onyxia's Lair- lvl 60; 40 man. Onyxia's Lair is essentially a single boss fight instance. A few trash mobs up front, and boom you're fighting Onyxia. Onyxia is by no means easy either, but a good MC/BWL will probably be tackling her fairly regularly. She drops tier 2 epic helms, as well as a plethora of good fire resist gear.

AQ- Ahn'Qiraj. lvl 60; 20/40 man. Ahn'Qiraj is a new instance coming in 1.9, set to open after a few world events are completed. AQ will have two wings, one 20 man and one 40 man. I'm not sure about the difficulty, but I imagine it will be as hard as BWL if not harder. Looking at some of the loot tables for AQ floating around the web, seems to be some godly stuff to be found in AQ.


that should cover it.

yes i am bored.

[mecca]

Nah that was much appreciated..what's "Tier-2" epic? Currently I've got a [Gut Ripper]...is that the lowest tier then considering it was "only" 80g?

The Krol blade for instance, what's that, about 650g? Is that Tier 2? Are there two tiers in total? (Try saying that five times fast).

[GuitarNinja]

Nah that was much appreciated..what's "Tier-2" epic? Currently I've got a [Gut Ripper]...is that the lowest tier then considering it was "only" 80g?

The Krol blade for instance, what's that, about 650g? Is that Tier 2? Are there two tiers in total? (Try saying that five times fast).

I wouldn't worry about tiers of weapons, only armor. Attempting to remember all the weapon stuff is just blah.

Gut Ripper is a fine weapon, and will keep you till you get-

http://www.thottbot.com/?i=3780

Or

http://www.thottbot.com/?i=14900

[The Author]

Aye, I was grinding from 48 in the Eastern Plaguelands, believe it or not, further proof that rogues are the shit (hello flash powder). It's just a case of kidney shot, get up the combo points, ghostly strike, decrease armour, then keep hitting the "1" and "2" keys repeatedly until they die, maybe taking the odd potion and hitting evasion.

EDIT:A buff yes, thats something which the rogue class is lacking.

"I'll take 3 deathweed and a crystal vial please, vendor."

Buffs are disguised in the form of poisons..a 30% chance to hit an extra 120-200 with EVERY strike? I like those odds!

Any class can take care of any one mob 2 to 4 levels over. Heck, with my lock, I soloed a 20 elite when I was 18.

And about poisons, you forgot to read the label:

"Will not work on elementals, demons, undeads, and random creature with high nature resistance. Will take a debuff slot. Will cause extreme levels of aggro. Will disapear if you enter an instance. Possible side effects may include: Pissed off mobs, pissed off warriors, pissed off warlocks, pissed off raid leaders, and pissed off wallet.

Your local shady dealer is not responsible if you realise that in the high end game, only one boss will be made easier with poisons such as Mindnumbing. Also, we are not responsible if the act of poisoning your weapons will break stealth."

[The Author]

Rogues are not easymode.

To reach that level of damage, a rogue has to do much much more than just "spam SS for the win."

I have respeced 5 times so far, and depending on what items I have, I may have to do it again. Good rogues demand constant tweaking. Small readjustment in our strategies, and the best understanding of aggro since we always walk on that thin line between aggroing and doing nothing. Selecting enchants on weapons demand a good understanding of the group dynamics. We lack healers in the guild, so I have to go for self reliance enchants like lifestealing and crusader. This is done at the cost of better damage.


One could say healer is easy mode. All you have to do is stand around and throw healing spells. I seriously doubt all of you have studied carefully, spending almost an hours expirementing between various equipment sets. Selecting the offhand weapon and testing it can do a up to a 30 dps difference if you pick the right one. And sometimes, it means taking the less obvious choice.

Pop quizz:

best offhand between http://thottbot.com/?i=38570 Trash blade and http://thottbot.com/?i=5252 Hanzo sword for a sword specialist?

Same question but for a hemorage rogue?

These questions are how rogues get so strong. Thinking about every detail possible, evaluating all options, and doing hours upon hours of calculation and experimentation.

[zircon]

Yes, they do take skill, but they are comparably powerful and easy to play.

[The Author]

Yes, they do take skill, but they are comparably powerful and easy to play.

Every class is easy to play. But I have never questionned my equipment as badly as I do with a rogue. Every item you chose can radically weaken your character.

[suzumebachi]

gear dependency could be said for every class except for maybe shamans, druids, and beast spec hunters.

hunters can be the same way. except unfortunately for hunters, there's only 2 possible specs that are viable in end-game. 0/21/30, and 0/31/20. that's it. all other specs are going to be passed over for one of the above. the only point in going for beast mastery would be for PvP (however in the next patch not even that will be viable since pets can't attack players anymore). just like priests. shadow priests may be good in PvP, but when was the last time you saw a shadow priest in an MC group? druids probably have it worst though. if you aren't restore, you aren't going ANYWHERE.

[zircon]

Suzu, we have several non-resto druids that go to MC and even BWL with us. Moonkin is a great spec for the +3% crit aura, and they put out decent DPS too. Rogues love Feral spec Druids with the melee crit aura too, and we have a Feral spec Druid who uses all blue gear yet still makes it into the top 10 on the meters. I shudder to think of how much he'll do with a Herald of Woe and MC non-Druid set epics.

Also;

ZG- Zul'Gurub. lvl 60; 20 man. ZG is the most recent dungeon added to the game. It is said to be harder than MC, however my guild is currently working on clearing it. We've cleared 5 bosses so far, and we've yet to even attempt MC. It's still definately no walk in the park though. Lots of good drops here, including many epics.

It's not necessarily harder than MC; it's not as linear. MC bosses up to Rag are all straightforward. You can basically get 'em all on the first attempt, except maybe Domo and Garr. Hell, my guild did it and we're definitely no superstars in PVE. On the other hand, ZG requires a higher level of individual skill and strategy for each boss fight. Even trash mobs are harder than MC. However, it typically requires less gear and allows for a few more mistakes than MC. IMO anyway.

[suzumebachi]

yeah the trash mobs are definately harder in ZG. hell you could wipe a whole group on one giant berserker troll if you're not paying attention. and clearing the area before the spider boss is pure hell.

i've got a feral spec druid alt. he's awesome for solo PvE, but i got dropped from a freaking BFD (yes, BFD) group for not healing... apparently a priest and a shaman isn't enough healing for a 5 man group. -.-'

i've definately learned how to play hunter a lot better from my experience in ZG. i can DPS like mad now and not pull any aggro at all. when i get low on mana, i'll either stick to autoshot for a while, or FD, drink some water, turn off auto-growl and send my pet in to cover for me for a bit. i've saved the group from total wipes. on the snake boss i was the last person standing and got in the killing shot just in time to finish the fight. should have heard the cheering on vent. good times.

[GuitarNinja]

What I like about ZG is, to me, it's a better test of skill. Becuse it's smaller and tough, it's enjoyable to see how well one performs with a small group, with out five or so of your other class.

[Raenok]

I am currently a level 10 Orc Hunter on the Alleria server. I have some questions that need answering.

1.) I'm thinking of going to First Aid and Fishing. Would they be beneficial to my job?

2.) I'm looking for a pet around the Durotar area that has high damage, but can hold itself in battle. Would a Tiger do the job?

3.) What should I spend my Talent points on? I'm looking to be beneficial in PvP, PvE, and Instances.

I make post! For the Horde!

[zircon]

I am currently a level 10 Orc Hunter on the Alleria server. I have some questions that need answering.

1.) I'm thinking of going to First Aid and Fishing. Would they be beneficial to my job?

2.) I'm looking for a pet around the Durotar area that has high damage, but can hold itself in battle. Would a Tiger do the job?

3.) What should I spend my Talent points on? I'm looking to be beneficial in PvP, PvE, and Instances.

I make post! For the Horde!

1) First Aid and Fishing are secondary skills. Anyone can take them. Primary skills are things like Blacksmithing and Engineering. First Aid is useful for ANYONE no matter what class or level. Fishing.. not so much. It helps with Cooking (a secondary) and Alchemy, but otherwise not a whole lot.

2) Tigers are excellent all-around pets.

3) With Hunters it is totally up to you, really. A combination of Marksmanship and Survival would be a good bet.

[GuitarNinja]

I am currently a level 10 Orc Hunter on the Alleria server. I have some questions that need answering.

1.) I'm thinking of going to First Aid and Fishing. Would they be beneficial to my job?

2.) I'm looking for a pet around the Durotar area that has high damage, but can hold itself in battle. Would a Tiger do the job?

3.) What should I spend my Talent points on? I'm looking to be beneficial in PvP, PvE, and Instances.

I make post! For the Horde!

You can get both, but FIrst Aid will help a bit more in end game.

[mecca]

Which sites do you lot use for free WoW movies? Looking for things like yonder 'World of Roguecraft' etc, but most sites require signup and even premium membership .

[ellywu2]

I would say get a boar or bear probably. Generally i find them more useful in pve than a cat. Cats deal more damage, but dont have as much armour or HP as a bear. Another plus is that boars and bears eat anything! even summoned mage food which is nice ;)

this is a good site for info on pets
http://petopia.brashendeavors.net/

[The Author]

I would say get a boar or bear probably. Generally i find them more useful in pve than a cat. Cats deal more damage, but dont have as much armour or HP as a bear. Another plus is that boars and bears eat anything! even summoned mage food which is nice ;)

Boars will get a nice charge ability next patch.

[mecca]

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/6748/untitled8gw.jpg

..There goes me hitting 53 before the other rogue and getting that full SS award :(

[zircon]

Which sites do you lot use for free WoW movies? Looking for things like yonder 'World of Roguecraft' etc, but most sites require signup and even premium membership .

warcraftmovies.com

Learn2Click on the proper link ;)

mecca; don't worry. It's so easy to level that you'll be 60 in no time, and then stormshroud will be garbage. Even shadowcraft ain't that great.

[The Author]

Which sites do you lot use for free WoW movies? Looking for things like yonder 'World of Roguecraft' etc, but most sites require signup and even premium membership .

warcraftmovies.com

Learn2Click on the proper link ;)

mecca; don't worry. It's so easy to level that you'll be 60 in no time, and then stormshroud will be garbage. Even shadowcraft ain't that great.

Shadowcraft beats not having shadowcraft.

Unless you have 8 different specific blues that rarelly drop, it's safe to say SC will be a good bet.

But, still, Cadaverous armor, eye of rend, devilsaur leggings, devilsaur gloves, (or blademaster's leggings and gargoile slasher) shadowcraft bracers, and shadowcraft belt, is a good combo as well. (bracer and belt are BOE so you can buy them on AH...)

[mecca]

...completely missing the point here, which is that the game won't fucking install :D

[The Author]

Install again. That installer is a messed up piece of software...

Or if the install was completed and only the patch is missing, delete the patch content, defrag, reboot, done.

[mecca]

Install again. That installer is a messed up piece of software...

Or if the install was completed and only the patch is missing, delete the patch content, defrag, reboot, done.

Nah it's the installer for the actual game..i've tried everything from making iso's and mounting them to downloading the game itself..no luck :( If i give someone my login will you get me to lv53 plz?

[suzumebachi]

contact the WoW tech support. or something. are you reinstalling?

[mecca]

contact the WoW tech support. or something. are you reinstalling?

Aye, just reformatted, and trying to get back on track toward endgames (just saw a video of molten core..can't wait).

Still not seen Onxyia tho..i'm leaving that surprise for when I'm doing it myself :)

Really frustrating considering I've already paid and activated my subscription.

[The Author]

contact the WoW tech support. or something. are you reinstalling?

Aye, just reformatted, and trying to get back on track toward endgames (just saw a video of molten core..can't wait).

Still not seen Onxyia tho..i'm leaving that surprise for when I'm doing it myself :)

Really frustrating considering I've already paid and activated my subscription.

Onyxia is something.

The "instance" itself is straightforward. 4 mobs, 1 corridor, and then boom, dragon's room. Probably as big as the central island of Thunder Bluff. At that point, all hell breaks loose.


Molten Core is a longer run. My former guild only made it up to Magmadaar but even that can take a while.

[zircon]

Yeah. Onyxia is just a boss fight and that's basically it. MC is a dungeon.

[The Author]

My guild downed Hakkar for the first time yesterday. It was also the first time they got to him but I don't know if it was the first attempt or not.

I sadly was on the bench. I think I'll wait until that instance is on farm status before going there, they seem overly serious about it (up to yelling at some people on vent) and that is just bad karma.

[zircon]

Heh.. you don't need anything but a good tank and 8 healers (w/ consuambles) to beat Hakkar. You have have 11 other guys with green gear and still do it.

[The Author]

Heh.. you don't need anything but a good tank and 8 healers (w/ consuambles) to beat Hakkar. You have have 11 other guys with green gear and still do it.

Yeah, having been in MC, even if only to magmadaar, I know what the next level of gameplay is.

It's kinda like how I did UBRS before BRD. BRD seems a tad easy. I just don't like the whole "dammit when he spins you have to move out, gah blargh pissy" voice chat. It seems that the raid leader can only complain and when something goes well, he's like "see how I managed to pull when he lost aggro" and shit. It could also be that, you know, we did the damage that was needed... hunters should not pull aggro. EVER.

Even if the warrior loses it like in the spider boss's case. Hunters are at mage range, bring a boss there and you kill your casters. Anyway, I'll stick to finishing my SC (2 pieces missing, and it's not like I dont have equivalent gear (cadaverous armor and gargoyle slasher) I just want a complete SC and a complete rend set before I move on to bloodfang.

[zircon]

You need tough raid leaders to get things done. You can relax once you've killed the bosses. If this isn't the case, get a better raid leader. BTW, spider boss strat;

Start Positioning: Whole raid stands about 25 yards from the Speaker and her.

Strat: MT rushes in and tanks her where she initially stands. Offtank takes the speaker and DPS focuses on him first. Be warned that the boss will randomly spawn several spiders that get stronger every second they go without dying. For the first wave, all DPS should go on them. For subsequent waves, mages/hunters alone should be able to, though if one is really out of control, rogues can help. Once the Speaker is killed, the offtank must return to the group. All other melee goes in, DPS begins, etc. She has no significant attacks in this phase.

Spider Form: She randomly changes into a large spider. When this occurs, she nets AND silences everyone within melee range of her and drops their aggro. This means she will rush 20-25 yards to the caster group. This is why we keep a tank here, to pick her up the second this happens. DPS must stop here because the aggro list is clear. When the second tank has aggro, the whole caster group runs back to where the original MT is netted - in other words, the whole raid just switches positions. DPS needs to be careful in spider form as she can drop aggro at any second - she may do the net and charge thing several more times before she returns to caster form. Simply keep switching between the two tanks and holding DPS whenever this occurs.

Caster form (2nd time): Same as the first part of the fight, except she does a powerful drain life that heals her quickly. Priests, SPAM decursive. All other classes try to interrupt it as well. With lots of DPS piled on her as soon as the tank holds aggro, this boss goes down quick. One other thing to note is that there is a lot of poisoning going on. Shamans should be distributed throughout the four groups, using Poison Cleansing totems. Anyone else that can cure poison should as this is a healing-intensive fight as wel.

[The Author]

Well, like I said, when I joined, it was because they said they were a guild with a laid back attitude.

But as soon as we do that first pull, the guild leaders turn into psycho bitches from mars. As a rogue though, there is nothing really satisfying in ZG, so I guess I'll stick to UBRS and stuff like that. Once they can get relaxed with the whole "OMG ZG IS KINDA TOUGH" thing, I'll start running ZG again.

[zircon]

My guild is laid back also. But shit simply does not get done unless people take control and kick people into gear. Once you get through those initial tense points, then it's fine. If you're not willing to help with that.. well, that's pretty lame, if you ask me, and I'd wonder why you're in the guild to begin with.

[The Author]

My guild is laid back also. But shit simply does not get done unless people take control and kick people into gear. Once you get through those initial tense points, then it's fine. If you're not willing to help with that.. well, that's pretty lame, if you ask me, and I'd wonder why you're in the guild to begin with.

Because I'm ready to help with anything else. I just don't like the whole "you guys suck" aspect when we wipe that is followed by the "you guys should rock like I do" when we win.

[zircon]

Well, you need to find a new raid leader then. Or simply do it yourself. I led my guild in ZG from start to finish.. I'm not the GM either. No one else was stepping up, so I did it. Lots of positive reinforcement, staying calm, but being firm when I had to be. It's not too hard.

[The Author]

Well, you need to find a new raid leader then. Or simply do it yourself. I led my guild in ZG from start to finish.. I'm not the GM either. No one else was stepping up, so I did it. Lots of positive reinforcement, staying calm, but being firm when I had to be. It's not too hard.

I'm guessing that when it ain't the first guild only runs (seriously, this was the first Merry Band of Misfit run of ZG) they will be more relaxed. I still have things to gain from UBRS LBRS and DM, I might as well stick to these instances for now. Maybe when they will be used to it it'll go better.

But now this kinda makes me feel uneasy about Molten Core.

Oh and I believe that hunter and rogues make bad raid leader. We are self-relient classes, teamwork is not needed until much later in our careers...

[suzumebachi]

Our leader in ZG is usually one these people:
1) A Warlock and GM of Guild
2) Hunter and also a GM
3) Rogue and Officer of Guild
4) Either a Shaman (co-GM) or myself (Officer) when they're not available.

[zircon]

Just cancelled my subscription tonight, after playing some kickass WSG games and leading our "A-team" through ALL of ZG, completing it. We have now done all of the ZG content available. When I first decided to lead the runs we were wiping on the bat boss. We now have beaten not only the aspects, but Hexxer (first shot), Hakkar, the fishing boss, and mojo madness. All of it is on farm status. But this game simply takes up too much time for me.. I couldn't raid every single night. I gotta focus on school + music.

I may reactivate sometime, but not for awhile. I'll miss it. :(

[mecca]

I've currently got a vanilla WoW installation..I've seen some really awesome addons though, but don't want to go through a series of trial and error to get the perfect system.

Can any of you recommend the best addon for a rogue? I've seen stuff like Gouge countdowns, Kidney Shot countdowns etc..all look really cool, but I'm wondering if there's a specific one geared toward my class.

[zircon]

I wouldn't bother with the specific "all-in-one" mods. They are usually more trouble then they are worth. Here's what you want..

* CCWatch/Stunwatch - Shows progress bars for ALL of your stuns and CCs. Cheap Shot, Gouge, Kidney Shot, Blind, Sap.

* EnergyWatch (I think that's what it's called) - Shows an energy bar that reflects your regeneration. When it fills up, that's when you gain +20 energy. Useful so you can open a fight with Cheap Shot and time it so that you can BS immediately after.

* CooldownCount - Shows big yellow numbers over any of your abilities that are on cooldown showing how long you have until you can use them. Useful so you don't have to hover the mouse. Applies to trinkets, pots, and various other items too.

* ScrollingCombatText - Simply useful. Shows when you get hit (FF-style), when you get special abilities, when you get in combat, if you get buffed.

* SpellAlert - Lets you know when mobs/players are casting spells. Very useful for timing Gouges and Kicks. Essential for some boss fights too later on.

Those are all the ones I can think of.

[GuitarNinja]

I love Nurfed UI.

[GeckoYamori]

I have had the game for 2 days now. All OCR Euro players should hook up and have characters on the same server.

[mecca]

I have had the game for 2 days now. All OCR Euro players should hook up and have characters on the same server.

Not goint to happen. It would involve either restarting the game or being lucky enough to be allowed to migrate, not to mention leaving your guild and friends.

[Raenok]

As a Hunter, I feel obligated to maximize my damage output for both Ranged and Melee. My question is, should I train myself in a Two-Handed weapon to occupy me until level 20, or continue use Axes?

[GeckoYamori]

I have had the game for 2 days now. All OCR Euro players should hook up and have characters on the same server.

Not goint to happen. It would involve either restarting the game or being lucky enough to be allowed to migrate, not to mention leaving your guild and friends.

You can have more than 1 character

[ellywu2]

Which server are you on?

[mecca]

I have had the game for 2 days now. All OCR Euro players should hook up and have characters on the same server.

Not goint to happen. It would involve either restarting the game or being lucky enough to be allowed to migrate, not to mention leaving your guild and friends.

You can have more than 1 character

True saying :) I didnt think of that..what server?

[GeckoYamori]

I have a Night Elf Rogue on Balnazzar PVP. Name is GeckoYamori.

Keep in mind you can't have both Alliance and Horde characters on the same server (For PVP at least).

[aragornx45]

Hey guys...i've gotten a lot of requests to create a running list of who's on what server...I apologize for letting the thread run so long without doing so...

pst me with your character's name and server and i'm gonna add it to the first post.

[suzumebachi]

I'm on Smolderthorn Horde

I dropped my guild the other day. It had been coming for a while. I knew I would eventually quit unless something drastic was done about the way they did instances. They rarely did ZG, and when they did it was always the same group of people. There was a large number of 60's in the guild that never even got to try ZG. I recommended them to rotate people in and out after each boss so everyone would get a chance, but they would have nothing of it. Plus we had a lot of younger members who couldn't stay on very long and were generally just very unreliable. And when you have healers that will leave right in the middle of a boss fight... it gets pretty damn aggravating.

The last straw though was a guild 5 man LBRS attempt. The only reason I went was to tame one of the Bloodaxe Worgs in order to get Furious Howl Rank 4. I dismiss my old wolf when we get to the area just before Halycon. Two seconds later, the MT quits and so everyone leaves before I can even say anything. Needless to say I was furious. I /gquit right then and there.

Since then I've talked to 3 different guilds (Nightmare's Asylum, Blackgaurd, The Soulbound Brigade) about joining up with them and they all said pretty much the same thing: they all need hunters, but they won't take me until I've done the Onyxia key quest. Which, go figure, requires doing 5 man LBRS.

ok afk, shooting myself in the foot.

[SleazyC]

I'm on Smolderthorn Horde

I dropped my guild the other day. It had been coming for a while. I knew I would eventually quit unless something drastic was done about the way they did instances. They rarely did ZG, and when they did it was always the same group of people. There was a large number of 60's in the guild that never even got to try ZG. I recommended them to rotate people in and out after each boss so everyone would get a chance, but they would have nothing of it. Plus we had a lot of younger members who couldn't stay on very long and were generally just very unreliable. And when you have healers that will leave right in the middle of a boss fight... it gets pretty damn aggravating.

The last straw though was a guild 5 man LBRS attempt. The only reason I went was to tame one of the Bloodaxe Worgs in order to get Furious Howl Rank 4. I dismiss my old wolf when we get to the area just before Halycon. Two seconds later, the MT quits and so everyone leaves before I can even say anything. Needless to say I was furious. I /gquit right then and there.

Since then I've talked to 3 different guilds (Nightmare's Asylum, Blackgaurd, The Soulbound Brigade) about joining up with them and they all said pretty much the same thing: they all need hunters, but they won't take me until I've done the Onyxia key quest. Which, go figure, requires doing 5 man LBRS.

ok afk, shooting myself in the foot.
Hmm... it gets tough when you start wanting to run the higher end instances and no one else is motivated to do it. Just a heads up, Nightmare's Asylum is one of the top tier horde raiding guild and PVP guilds so it will be tough to get into but if you do you are sure to experience all the end game stuff first. I believe they were the first horde guild to clear to Nefarion in BWL.

[suzumebachi]

Yeah I've been doing a lot of PvP with both Blackgaurd and Nightmare's Asylum groups (or mixtures of the two), and beating the pants off Transcendance and Exo in both WSG and AB. Made 140k honor last night.

[zircon]

NA is absolutely sick. If you get into them, you'll probably be in the best guild out of any of us, by far. Feel proud!

[GuitarNinja]

I'm on Smolderthorn Horde

I dropped my guild the other day. It had been coming for a while. I knew I would eventually quit unless something drastic was done about the way they did instances. They rarely did ZG, and when they did it was always the same group of people. There was a large number of 60's in the guild that never even got to try ZG. I recommended them to rotate people in and out after each boss so everyone would get a chance, but they would have nothing of it. Plus we had a lot of younger members who couldn't stay on very long and were generally just very unreliable. And when you have healers that will leave right in the middle of a boss fight... it gets pretty damn aggravating.

The last straw though was a guild 5 man LBRS attempt. The only reason I went was to tame one of the Bloodaxe Worgs in order to get Furious Howl Rank 4. I dismiss my old wolf when we get to the area just before Halycon. Two seconds later, the MT quits and so everyone leaves before I can even say anything. Needless to say I was furious. I /gquit right then and there.

Since then I've talked to 3 different guilds (Nightmare's Asylum, Blackgaurd, The Soulbound Brigade) about joining up with them and they all said pretty much the same thing: they all need hunters, but they won't take me until I've done the Onyxia key quest. Which, go figure, requires doing 5 man LBRS.

ok afk, shooting myself in the foot.

I'm from Scarlet Crusade myself, and we really aren't that big. Horde is barely pulling three MC groups, and it's really killing some folks.

I can understand the pain, I'm pretty lucky to be in Raid Awesome.

[The Author]

Bloodscalp, Merry Band of Misfits.

In the next few weeks, we will have ZG on farm status, and we will start working on onyxia, we have 30+ level 60s, most of which who have the key. Seeing how we have a very good synergie and that most 60s have great gear (it's a policy to fill the extra spot with some lower level people if we have a good enough group, like brining 2 level 50s in a ten man scholo), Onyxia might fall before 2006.

Although that's me being optimistic.

Molten Core will be more problematic, seeing as most of us are casual... It may get easier when we get to the expansion. MC with a group of level 70s might work out better.

[The Author]

I just wish I get a bloodfang headpiece soon.

I wanna look evil.

[Russell Cox]

I love Nurfed UI.

Amen.

Heh.. you don't need anything but a good tank and 8 healers (w/ consuambles) to beat Hakkar. You have have 11 other guys with green gear and still do it.

*engage Hakkar*

[Raid] [Giaz]: K, brb in 10 minutes, going to take a shower. Lemme know what dropped.

Priests, for example, really need some work (though shadow priests seriously can kick ass in PvP). Their holy and discipline trees need... some major improvement, as many of the talents are lacking.

Do you see where I'm going with this? Blizzard made a game where their classes were fucked to royal hell. They still need balancing until everything makes good sense. Honestly though, rogues have little to whine about. You're upset because you were nerfed, not because you were made weak. Rogues are still incredibly powerful and generally easy to play, and they're still the top DPSers in end-game instances. Damage counters in my guild instance runs always show rogues at the top, specifically Jubastar, who does like, 1,200,000+ total damage in MC.

Attention whiney dumbass:

It's fine, learn2play.

There isn't anything wrong with Priests beyond stupid players -- they want to have everything but still bitch about parties dying. The power of a Priest is Fade, shield, and quick heals with the ability to drop bomb heals if need be. They team up solidly with Druids, who are bomb and HoT healers, and together each is greater than the 2 of the other classes. Priests want major +healing, instant regen, unlimited mana, and a lot crits, and that shit isn't going to happen.

Secondly, "classes all fucked"? Go play Final Fantasy XI to see some fucked up classes. World of Warcraft is not *perfect* but the balance between the classes started off a hell of a lot better than other MMOs and gets better every patch.

Learn2play.

Here are our problems.

1. Our primary defenses (Psychic Scream and Power Word: Shield) have been nerfed to the point of uselessness. The Fear only lasts for a short time, is on a long cooldown, and most classes can trinket out of it. Power Word: Shield is on a cooldown and now that it ignores armor, is a total joke. There are times when I will cast it and it will disappear in less than a second.[

2. We are always the primary target in PVP and lack the defenses of other healing classes.

Hint: You're a cloth wearer, and with Inner Fire your armor will exceed that of a leather armor class. Secondly, why are you trying to PvP alone? That's like hitting the can with the hammer, crying because it won't open, and then demanding the manufacturer make it so you can open the can with hammers.

The game is built around group PvP, not solo PvP. Two people in tandom will wreck more havoc than each going solo.

3. The Holy tree is next to useless. Most talents are total garbage, including the entire bottom half. For endgame, only about 3-4 talents are actually useful.

Wrong, nice try though.

4. The Discipline tree has about 10 points worth of abilities that all Priests MUST have or else they are totally gimp. Other useful abilities are scattered around. The 31 point talent is garbage (same with the Holy talent).

Again, wrong, nice try though. With this outlook it's no wonder you're quitting -- the attitude here and your comments about Ragnaros put off the aura that you're a shitty Priest. No wonder it took you guys so long to take down Rag, when it's the easiest one inside the instance aside from Shazz and Baron Geddon, if all your Priests share your outlook.

5. We are the only casting class to not have any method of mana regeneration. Because we are not hybrids (unlike Shamans and Paladins) we are totally useless when we reach zero mana. Mages can Evocate, Warlocks can Life Tap, Druids can Innervate (or just shapeshift and do something else) etc.

6. Our main stat is supposed to be Spirit, which doesn't work in 95% of all combat situations.

It's fine, learn2healrotate. 95% of combat situations? You get 3-4 healers on the MT, and do a rotation. It's not that damn complicated.

Secondly, your classes gets 1 mana per 3.33 spirit, whereas every other class gets 1 mana per 4 spirit. You have the highest *BASE* regen rate for mana while medding. Stop crying and learn2play.

7. Most of our spells are useless. Greater Heal has no utility out of 5/10 man instances, and even then, it is still rarely used. Prayer of Healing is good for basically one boss fight in the game. Renew is OK but Druids HoTs are better + more efficient, and you have to spec for it to be really worthwhile. We are reduced to spamming Flash Heal in most encounters.

Good thing you quit and don't go into Blackwing Lair then if you think Greater Heal is useless. Renew stacks with Regrowth and Rejuvenation fool and does more healing over the course of the spell than the former two, so yeah it's 'worthless'. Prayer of Healing is used in almost any fight where a C O M P E T E N T priest notices his group is all low on health and pops one off -- since it ignores line of sight it's perfect for almost every boss fight.

You are reduced to spamming Flash Heals because you are too lazy to learn how to properly play your class. Cry more, please.

8. We are the only class where if you spec for PVE you lose all PVP utility and damage dealing capabilities. Holy spec priests can barely heal better in PVP than a Shadow spec priest yet they are totally defenseless, have less damage reduction, and cannot do damage. WTF?

Get more dramatic, please? Yeah, if you go PvE you *REALLY* lose all PvP aspects since no one heals in PvP. Nope, no one.

Get a fucking grip.

9. Paladins, Druids, and Shamans can all meet or beat the healing efficiency of a Priest. Shamans especially can match us with their Lesser Healing Wave which is basically identical to our Flash Heal. They also have better armor and DPS capabilities if need be.

More garbage from a garbage Priest. The efficency of heals goes as follows:

Priest > Druid > Shaman > Paladin

Don't believe me? Go get a calculator.

Lesser Healing Wave? Lawl... They can cast that 6-7 times per mana bar, you can Flash heal almost 20 times with 6-7K mana with decent +mana regen. Yeah, it's really 'equal' :roll:

10. We do not benefit from +crit gear unlike most clases. +crit generates more aggro and causes overhealing. Even in PVP, our damage comes from channeled spells and DoTs, thus all of our gear has to be stamina, +damage, or +damage/healing, which is hard to come by. You have to gimp yourself in some way to get it, or have full MC/BWL-level items that are very hard to collect.

Wrong. Your Flash Heals benefit the MOST from +crit gear as you have a high chance of crits as it is, have a talent for +5% crit, and most of the gear tailored for Priests is loaded with +crit.

Secondly, overhealing does not generate more aggro, nor does a crit heal draw more aggro per point healed based on the fact it's a crit. You only draw aggro for the amount that you heal, not the full amount of the spell. If you healed for 900 and he's only missing 500 HP, you only get threat for the 500 that was actually healed, not the 900. Where do you get this bullshit?

You're not a fucking damage dealing class, get over it -- You're a H E A L E R. If you haven't learned that after hitting 60 I question your intelligence. You're a support class; use that knowledge to the fullest when PvPing, and perhaps you'll actually learn something. Find someone that CAN live long enough to decimate the opposition, and watch the HKs flow in. GGTHXKBAI.

Trust me, we have problems.

No, you don't. Learn2play.

[The Author]

Thank you.


...


*walks away before he gets burned for wanting more for rogues who actually wanna do rogue things instead of wacking ennemies and ranking highest damage.*

...


Surprised?

Lets see how me, as a rogue, is essencial to a group's survival based on my personal skills.


Maybe my leet mouse usage means that I hit SS better than the next rogue...

Maybe my build (which is a weird 17/31/3) hybrid makes me more powerful... oh wait, no, it makes me as good as any other 20/31 rogue...

Hey, maybe I have a real influence on how a fight goes. Kinda like how a good main tank makes a difference.

Oh wait no, I can't expose armor, rupture, or kidney shot. I cant use poisons. All I have to do is either hit SS or BS and use feint as often as possible. Any rogue can do that.

Seriously, what is the difference between a good rogue and a "easy mode rogue." The good rogue gets bored spamming SS as the only "viable" strategy for high end gaming.

My DPS does not make as much a difference in a fight than the proper tanking, or the proper healing does. Paladins suffer from the same problem. Their main trait (hybrid Melee/healing) is neglected to the point that they become buffbots backup healers. Rogues, the best melee/hindering/debuff, are stuck doing only damage. When a rogues goes in "No, you won't fight" mode, the ennemy is stunned, ruptured, and exposed while mind numbed and slowed. At that point, any ennemy is dead even if it has 90% life.

As soon as I walk in MC, all I do is "wait for signal, right click mob, then use feint/ss and eviscerate every 12 seconds."

[zircon]

Russell; wow, shut the fuck up. No need for the personal insults. All of the problems I've explained are not only WIDELY accepted on the Priest forums, but the CMs have acknowledged them and agree they all need fixing. I'm glad you know more about my class then me, the entire Priest forum, the CMs, and Blizzard.

Stop being such an asshole. Me quitting has nothing to do with my class, it has to do with wanting to pursue music and my schoolwork. As for Rag, our healing was never a problem. We just had a shitty strat. This was obvious because we went from wiping on phase 2 and losing 14 people in phase 1, to completely dominating him when we changed the strat with virtually no deaths.

[The Author]

Wait a sec...

Blizzard is actually responding to what your community says?


NERF PRIESTS.

Rogues believe that blue posts are a legend.

[Terrisare]

Wait a sec...

Blizzard is actually responding to what your community says?


NERF PRIESTS.

Rogues believe that blue posts are a legend.

If I could 2 shot casters I wouldn't expect to see many blue posts in my forum either :P

[The Author]

Wait a sec...

Blizzard is actually responding to what your community says?


NERF PRIESTS.

Rogues believe that blue posts are a legend.

If I could 2 shot casters I wouldn't expect to see many blue posts in my forum either :P

Yeah... about that...

We can 2 shot casters

When they are drinking

And have some cool downs

And are not geared in epic

And are stupid enough not to hit their "defense" button (Blink/Psychic Scream/Death Coil.)

...

Other than that it's "ambush oh damn I'm fear/he blinked away/WTF IT CANT DO ANYTHING."

Oh and most warlocks I know at level 60 have about 4000 life.

[Terrisare]

Wait a sec...

Blizzard is actually responding to what your community says?


NERF PRIESTS.

Rogues believe that blue posts are a legend.

If I could 2 shot casters I wouldn't expect to see many blue posts in my forum either :P

Yeah... about that...

We can 2 shot casters

When they are drinking

And have some cool downs

And are not geared in epic

And are stupid enough not to hit their "defense" button (Blink/Psychic Scream/Death Coil.)

...

Other than that it's "ambush oh damn I'm fear/he blinked away/WTF IT CANT DO ANYTHING."

Oh and most warlocks I know at level 60 have about 4000 life.

I was kinda kidding about the 2 shot part, but my point is that rogues aren't weak by any means. that's why they, mages, and shamans (my class) dont see a lot of blue, because we are in the least need of fixes. not that there aren't problems with the class, but other classes have it a lot worse.

[GeckoYamori]

Where can I mine something other than copper ore? I've checked Redridge and a bit of Duskwood (Both contested territories) but can't find shit.

[ellywu2]

Loch Modan

[Slut]

Ignoring the flamewars... I play on Maelstrom. I've got a level 24 paladin named Solitaire, and a level 9 thief named Kattara, both alliance of course. Feel free to PM me if you guys play there.

[The Author]

Wait a sec...

Blizzard is actually responding to what your community says?


NERF PRIESTS.

Rogues believe that blue posts are a legend.

If I could 2 shot casters I wouldn't expect to see many blue posts in my forum either :P

Yeah... about that...

We can 2 shot casters

When they are drinking

And have some cool downs

And are not geared in epic

And are stupid enough not to hit their "defense" button (Blink/Psychic Scream/Death Coil.)

...

Other than that it's "ambush oh damn I'm fear/he blinked away/WTF IT CANT DO ANYTHING."

Oh and most warlocks I know at level 60 have about 4000 life.

I was kinda kidding about the 2 shot part, but my point is that rogues aren't weak by any means. that's why they, mages, and shamans (my class) dont see a lot of blue, because we are in the least need of fixes. not that there aren't problems with the class, but other classes have it a lot worse.

Well, there are some serious problems with rogues in high end instances. Being a rogue should mean something more than just outputting damage. We don't have a good role, we're just doing some SS and some eviscerate. We do not have a real role other than being a high damage stat that does not depend on the skill of the player but simply on how well they press SS.

[Terrisare]

Wait a sec...

Blizzard is actually responding to what your community says?


NERF PRIESTS.

Rogues believe that blue posts are a legend.

If I could 2 shot casters I wouldn't expect to see many blue posts in my forum either :P

Yeah... about that...

We can 2 shot casters

When they are drinking

And have some cool downs

And are not geared in epic

And are stupid enough not to hit their "defense" button (Blink/Psychic Scream/Death Coil.)

...

Other than that it's "ambush oh damn I'm fear/he blinked away/WTF IT CANT DO ANYTHING."

Oh and most warlocks I know at level 60 have about 4000 life.

I was kinda kidding about the 2 shot part, but my point is that rogues aren't weak by any means. that's why they, mages, and shamans (my class) dont see a lot of blue, because we are in the least need of fixes. not that there aren't problems with the class, but other classes have it a lot worse.

Well, there are some serious problems with rogues in high end instances. Being a rogue should mean something more than just outputting damage. We don't have a good role, we're just doing some SS and some eviscerate. We do not have a real role other than being a high damage stat that does not depend on the skill of the player but simply on how well they press SS.

imo, that's the price of owning face in PvP. in this regard, rogues and shaman are quite similar. both classes are extremley powerful in 1v1 PvP, and also quite good in group PvP. rogues are also excellent grinders, I've spent far less time taking my rogue alt to where she is than any of my other characters. however, neither are that important in endgame PvE, with rogues just doing damage, and shamans being healbots/wipe prevention. I wish I could do more in 40 man instances, but every time that I go to battlegrounds, Im thankful for the class that I picked.

[suzumebachi]

you could say all classes are like that in end-game (except for MTs and maybe feral druids).

mages: pyroblast, fireball, fireball, fireball, wand, wand, wand, wand, wand, wand, repeat
hunters: hunter's mark, aimed shot, multishot, feign death, repeat
warlocks: shadow bolt, shadow bolt, shadow bolt, shadow bolt, life tap, death coil, repeat
shamans: totem, totem, totem, totem, heal, heal, heal, heal, earthshock, repeat
warriors (non MT): enrage, battleshout, rend, heroic strike, heroic strike, heroic strike, repeat
rogues: sinister strike, sinister strike, sinister strike, sinister strike, eviscerate, repeat
priests/druids: heal. repeat unto infinity.

[Skilless]

Next person who asks me to make them water is gonna get sucker punched in the throat. (priest)

priests/druids: heal. repeat unto infinity.

You forgot to add the part where the people repeatedly yell 'heal!' over and over while you are in mid-cast of a heal on that player and when someone dies you get bitched at non-stop for the rest of the time in that party. Other than that you've got priests down.

[Skilless]

Sorry for the double post~

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?FN=wow-priest&T=476457&P=1

I came across this while reading the WoW forums. It's a PvP vid of a Shadow Priest. Was this any of you guys cause the 3rd song in is KRool Intentions by Protricity. It made my day when I heard it. Just thought I might share that with you guys.

[zircon]

mages: pyroblast, fireball, fireball, fireball, wand, wand, wand, wand, wand, wand, repeat

Actually, in high end instances, it's more like:

Frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, Evocate, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt. It's horrendous (yes, I've played one).

[The Author]

mages: pyroblast, fireball, fireball, fireball, wand, wand, wand, wand, wand, wand, repeat

Actually, in high end instances, it's more like:

Frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, Evocate, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt, frostbolt. It's horrendous (yes, I've played one).


My firemage friend does as much damage as a frost mage in MC using firespell on anything but elementals.

The higher base damage of fire means that when it hits, it makes up for the resisted spells.

[Solid Krono]

I have a question, one of my friends wants to get the 10 day free trial. I googled it and found a few sites that said it had it for download (if you subscribe to the site), but I didn't see anything about the trial on the WoW site. Could you give me some info on it?

[zircon]

Seriously though, WTF are you talking about? I never whined about Priests

His post was addressed to me, even though I wasn't 'whining'. Priests aren't broken, but they're not perfect. :roll:

[The Author]

Which is why I wish Frost Mages had a bit more work. They need more skills; they've only got Frostbolt, Frost Nova, Cone of Cold, and Blizzard, and you don't use the second pair often.

Arcane Missile

Arcane Explosion


And...
well...


That's it.

Oh and improved blizzard rush. 2 or 3 frost mages, a group of mobs:
Mage 1: Blizzard (gets aggro)
Mage 2: Blizzard (+crit +slowed mobs and so forth)
Mage 3: Blizzard
Mage 1: (swarmed) Frost Nova, blink, Ice Block (removes aggro) Restart blizzard.
Mage 2: (swarmed) Frost Nova, blink, Ice Block (removes aggro) Restart blizzard.
Mage 3: (swarmed) Frost Nova, blink, Ice Block (removes aggro) Restart blizzard.

Fight over.

[zircon]

It depends on the context. Prayer of Healing is great in theory, and it's essential for some fights in BWL, but I personally haven't found all that many uses for it. In most encounters you don't have a lot of people getting hit at the same time. In PVP it is not useful because typically you won't be in range of your entire group, making it more efficient to simply Flash heal them, not to mention you can see a PoH coming a mile away because it takes so long to cast.

I suppose the main complaint that most Priests have is that for someone who is supposed to be the "master of healing", we really aren't. Thorough analyses have been done on our healing efficiency and power, as well as our ability to chain heal, and it has been proven that both Druids and Paladins properly specced can beat us in both those areas. Shamans can come close. Our primarily healing tree (Holy) has 4 offensive talents, a useless one (Holy Nova), 2 relating to Greater Heal (which is really not used often no matter what people want to tell you).. etc. It doesn't make any sense; other healing classes have more useful talents and get more "bang" per talent point.

[Stalwart Jester]

I just wish I get a bloodfang headpiece soon.

I wanna look evil.

Seconded. Next week I'm invited to try and down Onyxia, if I get my key fast enough. I wanna try for a BF headpiece. :roll:

[The Author]

Yeah, next week, the guild is gonna start farming trash mobs in MC.

Apparently, ZG will be on "farm status" sooner than expected, as a run can be done in 2 evenings.

[Slut]

GoUP, I want to play with you sometime. :(

[The Author]

GoUP, I want to play with you sometime. :(

Bloodscalp, Jannael.

Or look for my alt guild Chains of Oblivion.

[Arek the Absolute]

LFM MOLTEN CORE PST
Seriously though, could use some ocr people for.....CHOGALL!
Come on now...you guys know you want to join chogall. It is new and pretty and such and such.

[Slut]

GoUP, I want to play with you sometime. :(

Bloodscalp, Jannael.

Or look for my alt guild Chains of Oblivion.

Oye, damn ye, I'd have t' start all over again. Unless we can transfer characters now. Horde or Alliance?

[The Author]

GoUP, I want to play with you sometime. :(

Bloodscalp, Jannael.

Or look for my alt guild Chains of Oblivion.

Oye, damn ye, I'd have t' start all over again. Unless we can transfer characters now. Horde or Alliance?
Alliance.

[Slut]

Ah hell, all my old characters are on medium population servers, so I can't move them. :(

[Terrisare]

I suppose the main complaint that most Priests have is that for someone who is supposed to be the "master of healing", we really aren't. Thorough analyses have been done on our healing efficiency and power, as well as our ability to chain heal, and it has been proven that both Druids and Paladins properly specced can beat us in both those areas. Shamans can come close. Our primarily healing tree (Holy) has 4 offensive talents, a useless one (Holy Nova), 2 relating to Greater Heal (which is really not used often no matter what people want to tell you).. etc. It doesn't make any sense; other healing classes have more useful talents and get more "bang" per talent point.

honestly, the arguement that other healing classes are as good as priests is BS, because with the exception of druids, they aren't. I know from my experiences with my shaman that I could never come close to healing like a priest.
-mana pool. yes, I know that mana pool is based on gear, but where is all of the best casting gear? that's right, cloth. a shaman COULD roll on some good cloth gear, then enjoy never doing an instance again
-healing spells. the biggest arguements that priests make is that their flash heal and our lesser healing wave are identical, which is true. however, to say that the classes are equal based on a comparison of two spells is rediculus. its like saying that since earth shock is better than fire blast, shaman are better nukers than mages. priests have far more healing options than shaman could dream of, including, heals over time, good AOE heals (yes, I'm counting prayer of blessing, which has saved parties many times), and better large heals
-PW:F. this isnt an issue in raids, but in terms of 5 man groups, the extra HP that priests give upfront is crucial
-Fade. once again, not as big of an issue in raids, but essential in 5 man groups. when a priest gets aggro, they have this great tool to save themselves. shaman get nothing besides mail armor and shields, which may sound nice, but dont keep you alive for very long against multiple lvl60+ elites
-PW:S. another common complaint is shaman and druid's Nature's Swiftness giving them an instant heal every 3 minutes. PW:S is essentially the same thing, as preventing damage is the same thing as healing it then having it be attacked away. the difference? ours is on a 3 minute cooldown, whereas yours is on a 30(15 with talents) second cooldown PER PERSON. I know that PW:S ignores armor, but the fact still remains that you get a far better *oops* button than we do, and you dont need to spec into healing to get it.

sry for the long-windedness, but priests that complain about other classes as well as they do (minus the druid, which is a better healer in some situations if specced right) is just silly.

[HamsterCorp]

My NE warrior can hit things a lot and happens to like doing so.

I love my skills. They're all so fun.

[zircon]

I suppose the main complaint that most Priests have is that for someone who is supposed to be the "master of healing", we really aren't. Thorough analyses have been done on our healing efficiency and power, as well as our ability to chain heal, and it has been proven that both Druids and Paladins properly specced can beat us in both those areas. Shamans can come close. Our primarily healing tree (Holy) has 4 offensive talents, a useless one (Holy Nova), 2 relating to Greater Heal (which is really not used often no matter what people want to tell you).. etc. It doesn't make any sense; other healing classes have more useful talents and get more "bang" per talent point.

honestly, the arguement that other healing classes are as good as priests is BS, because with the exception of druids, they aren't. I know from my experiences with my shaman that I could never come close to healing like a priest.
-mana pool. yes, I know that mana pool is based on gear, but where is all of the best casting gear? that's right, cloth. a shaman COULD roll on some good cloth gear, then enjoy never doing an instance again
-healing spells. the biggest arguements that priests make is that their flash heal and our lesser healing wave are identical, which is true. however, to say that the classes are equal based on a comparison of two spells is rediculus. its like saying that since earth shock is better than fire blast, shaman are better nukers than mages. priests have far more healing options than shaman could dream of, including, heals over time, good AOE heals (yes, I'm counting prayer of blessing, which has saved parties many times), and better large heals
-PW:F. this isnt an issue in raids, but in terms of 5 man groups, the extra HP that priests give upfront is crucial
-Fade. once again, not as big of an issue in raids, but essential in 5 man groups. when a priest gets aggro, they have this great tool to save themselves. shaman get nothing besides mail armor and shields, which may sound nice, but dont keep you alive for very long against multiple lvl60+ elites
-PW:S. another common complaint is shaman and druid's Nature's Swiftness giving them an instant heal every 3 minutes. PW:S is essentially the same thing, as preventing damage is the same thing as healing it then having it be attacked away. the difference? ours is on a 3 minute cooldown, whereas yours is on a 30(15 with talents) second cooldown PER PERSON. I know that PW:S ignores armor, but the fact still remains that you get a far better *oops* button than we do, and you dont need to spec into healing to get it.

sry for the long-windedness, but priests that complain about other classes as well as they do (minus the druid, which is a better healer in some situations if specced right) is just silly.

PW:S is next to useless. When mobs hit for thousands of damage at a time to heavily-armored tanks w/ shields, what is -960 damage gonna do? I'll take an instacast, large heal any day of the weak. I'll also take the ability to get extra mana regeneration through totems.

I realize you've played a Shaman but are you Resto-spec with lots of gear like Cauterizing Band, Shard of the Scale, Aurastone Hammer + Zulian Defender, Tooth of Gnarr, etc? The shamans in my guild were extremely good at healing.

[Terrisare]

PW:S is next to useless. When mobs hit for thousands of damage at a time to heavily-armored tanks w/ shields, what is -960 damage gonna do? I'll take an instacast, large heal any day of the weak. I'll also take the ability to get extra mana regeneration through totems.

I realize you've played a Shaman but are you Resto-spec with lots of gear like Cauterizing Band, Shard of the Scale, Aurastone Hammer + Zulian Defender, Tooth of Gnarr, etc? The shamans in my guild were extremely good at healing.

first of all, I guess you're talking only about 40-man instances, where the case of shaman healing as well as priests becomes much stronger. this is because, as we already discussed, most classes end up becoming whitewashed down to one or two abilities over and over and over. this isn't so much of a shaman vs. priest thing as a thing over the way endgame instances are run. in 5 through 15 man instances, however, priests clearly top shaman.

the shaman that I play is not soley resto specced, but im deep enough (21 points) to where I do get quite a bit of benefit. Im not decked out in the top healing gear, but when my guild does MC, I swap out my normal hp/mana and put in the (blue) +healing stuff that I have. and non-holy priests still outheal me. Im sure that some shaman who are 35 points into resto with incredible healing gear might come close to or even top some priests, but average shaman vs average priests isnt even a contest, even in 40man where the shaman have more of a chance to catch up.


on another note, I have quite a few alts, all around lvl 20, but I want to focus on one and really start to level him up. Im trying to decide between my orc warrior and troll priest. the reason I narrowed it down to those two is that Im sick of having to beg to get into groups over the heads of millions of other shaman. so, out of those two, which would you guys pick?

[zircon]

In 5 man groups it's even less of an issue. I've done plenty of instance runs (not on my Priest of course) where the only healer was a Shaman or a Druid and it was fine.

At the Priest forums, people take this kind of stuff very seriously and have really analyzed Shaman v Priests v Druids v Paladins thoroughly. The results are depressing. Like I said, you guys aren't QUITE as good as us, but you're not very much worse considering all the extra support talents you get, reincarnation, mail + shields, shocks, various totems, etc.

[Malaki-LEGEND.sys]

Well I've tried to gain some assistance from their billing support line(who were very nice and helpful, btw) and back and forth between mom's card, so I guess this is the next best place to ask.

Have any of you ever had a problem with your credit card not being able to be processed? I must have been going back and forth like this for hours, but I still haven't gotten anywhere.

Anyone have any decent ideas?

[suzumebachi]

i've never had that problem, but if you still can't get it sorted out you can always get a pre-paid 60 day game card. they're like $28 at walmart last i checked.

anyways i now understand what people mean when they say paladins are overpowered... they most definately are.

i've begun my big grind to rank 11.

i essentially refuse to play AB now without a good group going in. in PUGs i've seen 1 paladin and 1 warrior hold a point against 5 horde. the paladin has a freaking counter for everything we do against them. they get out of snares, they cleanse my mana drain poison (WHY CAN IT BE CLEANSED!!?!?), and they can shield and heal the hell out of the warrior. it's god damn ridiculous.

not to mention the fucking elves and their shadowmeld. track hidden is the most useless skill ever, and now flare is getting horribly nerfed, so i basically have no way to counter elves anymore.

[zircon]

Paladin DPS will never approach that of a Warrior, but it's still pretty good if you're properly equipped. I've seen Paladins with BWL shields and Deathbringers and they are frightening.

[Cadmus]

I HATE every 13 yr old Paladin who waits until I'm deep in a fight with an ogre, then attacks, I turn to him and get him to 1/10 life no problem, full shield heal, and kills me.

Yeah yeah, everyone whines about pvp, but come on. Unbeatable. At least let me be able to shield bash interrupt pw:s.

[Terrisare]

I have a (often exaggerating) friend who plays a hunter, and he told me today that Bliz is planning to remove the stun on hit side effect from Aspect of the Cheetah. I find this really hard to believe, as giving hunters a pretty much permanent 30% speed boost that's usable in combat with no ill effect seems absolutly overpowered. anyone else hear something about this, or is he full of crap?

[zircon]

I haven't heard about that. I do know that Paladins just received a bullshit talent that enhances their mounted AND running speed by I think 10-20% with no disadvantages.

[Terrisare]

I haven't heard about that. I do know that Paladins just received a bullshit talent that enhances their mounted AND running speed by I think 10-20% with no disadvantages.

its 8% for 2 talent points. second tier I think. but it doesn't stack with the boot enchant, so its not too big of a deal.

I found out about the AotC thing, it doesn't proc now on DOTs. my friend is such a moron.

[zircon]

Oops, my mistake. They do get a great selection of new talents though, no question about it.

[Rodin]

The paladin run speed buff doesn't really bother me that much, given that they are pretty much the only class with NO ranged attack power. Even with plate, hunters could smash them into the ground by kiting the crap out of them...it would just take a really long time.

[suzumebachi]

the aspect of the cheetah/aspect of the pack buff in 1.9 ONLY AFFECTS DAMAGE OVER TIME. it's about freaking time too. the way it was before, EVERY type of damage would put you into dazed, including each and every tick from a DoT.

normal attacks and direct damage spells will still cause dazed.

pallies need to die more. they're just getting harder and harder to fucking kill. an epic paladin isn't even worth the fight because you aren't going to kill him plain and simple. and now with 8% speed increase it's going to be even harder to get away from them.

[The Author]

If the pally goes for that talent that is rather deep in the paladin tree... (well, deep for a secondary tree...)


Lucifron downed in our first guild only run of MC. For over half the group, it was their first MC run ever, and we even were undermaned (35 I think) and we had a 59 and a 57.

I'm starting to think we might get to be one of the bigger guilds in Bloodscalp soon enough. Next week, or the one after, we might try Onyxia, and knowing us, we will down her.

[Rodin]

If the pally goes for that talent that is rather deep in the paladin tree... (well, deep for a secondary tree...)



Since when is 11 points "deep"?

Twenty points is deep. Even considering that, look at 95% of all hunter specs - they are some combination of 31/20 or 30/21.

I can see a LOT of pallies getting this, unless they go completely PvE spec.

[The Author]

If the pally goes for that talent that is rather deep in the paladin tree... (well, deep for a secondary tree...)



Since when is 11 points "deep"?

Twenty points is deep. Even considering that, look at 95% of all hunter specs - they are some combination of 31/20 or 30/21.

I can see a LOT of pallies getting this, unless they go completely PvE spec.

Since most pally specs are and will be:

10 10 31 in no specific order.

Oh and there was another update yesterday to pally talents on the forum. Have a look, it'll make retribution pointless.

[GuitarNinja]

If the pally goes for that talent that is rather deep in the paladin tree... (well, deep for a secondary tree...)



Since when is 11 points "deep"?

Twenty points is deep. Even considering that, look at 95% of all hunter specs - they are some combination of 31/20 or 30/21.

I can see a LOT of pallies getting this, unless they go completely PvE spec.

Since most pally specs are and will be:

10 10 31 in no specific order.

Oh and there was another update yesterday to pally talents on the forum. Have a look, it'll make retribution pointless.

Doubts it, they'll want consecration to aste their tiny mana pool on, which is now in the holy tree.

Hate what they did to the paladin class, taking away some healing for more DPS.

GG Blizzard.

[Solid Krono]

I don't know, I'm actually kinda excited by the way some of the changes look. Until I get to try them out I won't really know for sure, but I think I'll like most of them.

[GeckoYamori]

Lol, I have a level 12 Night Elf Druid. I was supposed to go to Aberdien (sp?), but I accidently took the wrong ship and ended up near Horde territory. After getting through some pretty tough territory I got to The Barrens (Starting area for Taurens), and tried to communicate with some of the low level characters to no avail. I caused a ruckus and everyone gathered around me, then some smart guys decided to attack me but I killed them all and got some honor kills.

[suzumebachi]

all i know is if you're horde, 'D C D' comes out as L O L to allies.

and i've seen more than one alliance guy say "U Lo Se" though im not sure what they type to get it.

the only other way i know of to communicate is through the gnomish mind control cap and then emoting whatever it is you want to say. i had some 60 warlock do that to me when i was around lvl 35 at nessingwary's camp and he was telling me to get the fuck out of stranglethorn. so i got some guildies to come push his shit in. fun times.

[mecca]

all i know is if you're horde, 'D C D' comes out as L O L to allies.


kek.

So I just got hooked up with a laptop...it can run WoW, but both PC's cant use the same account simultaneously :(

One of the good things (or so I thought) about buying lappy was being able to have both my kid brother and myself being on at the same time (there's mucho confrontation when it comes to our mutual WoW addiction).

Have any of you heard of a workaround for this? Lappy is connecting through ICS // Crossover cable. (No router).

KTHX!

[Rodin]

As far as I know, there is no workaround other than perhaps some illegal hacks that would allow it. Blizz doesn't want multiple characters from one account on at once, which is why you can't do this. You'll either have to get a hack (and risk getting banned), or bite the bullet and buy an extra account.

[suzumebachi]

yeah my brother got a second account and a second phone line so he could play at the same time as me.

[zircon]

Why would you need a second phone line?

[The Author]

Why would you need a second phone line?

Well, if he is on dialup, a router would probably kill their connection.

If he is on DSL or higher... simply so the bro pays more... I guess...

[beneath the sea]

Sorry to randomly bump this thread up without wanting to discuss anythin, but I was wondering if any of you could help me.

My CD-Drive is broken, the registry for the cd-drive is corrupt so I can't fix it in any way, not even buying a new one.

I want to play WoW again, but I have no way of installing it now. i tried downloading the free trial client but it refuses to download properly.

I was wondering if anyone knew any other sites that hosted the client or any other way I can get the game onto my computer.

Thanks.

[ILLiterate]

My weeks have never gone by slower without WoW...may Christmas come quickly so I can get a CD Key and continue my adventures

[suzumebachi]

is 1.9 out yet?

also, regarding the dude with teh CD drive problem: reset your bios back to defaults. if that don't work, format. and get a good virus scanner. and if that's a lame attempt at warez in disguise, ROFLMAO ZEDONG and uhh good luck with that kthx.

[The Author]

Yeah, I wish 1.9 would come out already, I want to respec my pally without paying...

[suzumebachi]

so no 1.9. anyways i witnessed one of the coolest threads in WoW history today, and i thought i'd reprise it all for you.

It started with:

To Blizzard with love,

All the players down in Azeroth liked Christmas a lot, But the Blizzard staff, who lived just north of Azeroth, did not.

The Blizzard hated Christmas the whole Christmas season. Oh, please don't ask why, no one quite knows the reason.

It could be, perhaps, that their shoes were too tight. Or maybe their heads weren't screwed on just right.

But I think that the best reason of all
May have been that their hearts were two sizes too small.

Blizzard staff: We must stop this whole thing!
Why, for one whole year, We've put up with it now. We must stop Christmas from coming, but how?

It came without ribbons! It came without tags!
It came without packages boxes, or bags!
And they puzzled three hours, till their puzzlers were sore.

Then the Blizzard staff thought of something they hadn't before!

"Maybe Christmas," they thought, "doesn't come from a store. Maybe Christmas, perhaps, means a little bit more."

And then the true meaning of Christmas came through, And the Blizzard staff found the strength of ten Grinches, plus two.

Ok Blizz, it's December 12, where's Christmas? I've been waiting patiently, I've been good all year. I would like to get into my Christmasee cheer. Where are my snowballs, my enchantments, and rings? My gift boxes, eggnog, ribbons, and things?

Did you really steal Christmas? Please tell me it's a lie! If you really stole Christmas, surely I'll die.

Please Blizzard if you have a heart, please tell us all when Christmas will start!

Just when you thought my poem was done, the players would like you to give this a run!

The 1.9 patch, what's the hold up? It's taking so long, did you spill your coffee cup? We would like to see it live on our servers, filling us with a mighty fervor.

Oh please Blizzard, tell us where's our 1.9 patch! I'm baking some cookies, and I'll give you a batch!

Sincerly,

Pika

My dearest of Pikas, sweet gnome clad in pink,
I'm saddened, appalled, nay, crushed that you'd think
We'd forget the best, merriest time of the year
And leave all of Azeroth bereft of cheer.

Rest assured, my dear Pika, the glorious Feast
Is coming for Humanoid, Undead and Beast
On the 15th of this month, just three short, scant days
So prepare to party in Winter Veil ways.

"But Cay," you might say, "The Feast is old hat!
"I saw it last year! Tell me, what good is that?"
Ahh, but Greatfather Winter is clever and kind;
There are all-new attractions and goodies to find!

So be not dismayed by the lack of Veil cheer...
It's around the corner, yes, coming this year!

Now regarding the patch we've been testing for you,
We still need some time, as there are tasks to do.
We encourage your feedback when testing the patch
So our own testing team can try your points, and match
The bug to reproducible known issue notes.
Your help is appreciated, and promotes
A better relationship from day to day;
But still, once again, I give no ETA.

;)

Not to be a poop, but, would be a nice gesture to put a Menorah in somewhere......!?!?!

My good Tauren Candya, I know that your heart
May sometimes in these times feel further apart
From those who celebrate now in other ways;
Remember, however, that December days
In Azeroth are spent in one giant Feast!
No menorah, no manger, and the only Priest
Is 60, Undead, lobbing snowballs at you;
It's a fantasy world, and within it are new
Adventures and holidays gone from real life.
To say otherwise brings upon all much strife.

It is Winter Veil, Candya, and so raise your glass!
A new year is coming, the old one will pass!
Kill Greenches, drink egg nog, get presents each night
For the Earthmother loves you, and so does the Light!

:)

so of course, a few more people got into the act.

Ah little Pika, it's a wonder to me,
Why you worry so much when a great travesty
Is set to decend upon our little heads
While we are all sleeping alone in our beds!
They come every year, from both far and wide,
And there's never a place for us Gnomes to hide!
They'll pull on our ears and tuck us away
Under their arms while their teammates will stay
Behind the start line while their ref make call
To start a ghastly run game of Gnomish Football!
But we must stay vigilant, and take what me may
And not let Rogue Gnomes stoop low and betray
Or intentions to combat the horror this year,
We'll make other races tremble with fear!
We'll pull out our swords, or wands and our guns
And rush into combat, hustle our buns!
We will start a war and we will do it right
And we'll be the champions that rise up that night!
We'll kick all the orcs through goal the posts,
And make those taurens into ancestral ghosts!
We'll give all the humans giant fat lips
And the undead will make extra graveyard trips!
Since we like dwarves, we'll distract them with treasure,
But beating the night elves will give us much pleasure,
And those nasty trolls with their big feet and tusks,
At the end of the day will be empty husks.
Yes this year it's time for the Gnomes to have glory,
and that, my dear Pika, is the end of the story.



Twas the night before patch day

Twas the night before patch day and all thru Ironforge
Not a creature was stirring, not alliance nor horde.
The lag was amazing, FPS down to one
No shopping the auctions, no fighting, no fun.

When what to my wondering eyes should appear?
An epic at auction! The perfect new gear!
A fair buyout price and stats that were sweet
I knew in a flash that I’d soon be quite l33t!

I bid and I ran to the mailbox with care
Just knowing my weapon soon would be there!
But first I lagged hard and fell into the pit,
WTF disconnected? OMG! That’s bull&*$%!

I tried to log in as I lurked on the boards,
And dreamed of the damage I’d do with that sword.
At “authenticating” so long I did wait
That I fell fast asleep – after all, it was late.

Those hours of grinding had left me braindead,
But visions of ganking still danced in my head.
When from my computer arose such a clatter,
I sprang from my nap to see what was the matter!

“OMG I’ve been nerfed!” was the cry that I heard
The hunters were moaning (shaman said not a word).
I laughed to myself and thought “tough break, chump”
I was secretly glad my own class got a bump!
When the pallies complained I said “sucks to be you”
And to all the rogues – “Learn to play, freakin’ newb!”

With joy in my heart I ran fast to the mail
To grab my new weapon and unleash all hell!
I clicked and Oh Noes! My very worst fear!
Empty mailbox – no message – and no purple gear!

I paged a GM and submitted a ticket
And waited all day in hopes someone would get it.
When what to my wondering eyes should appear?
A sparkly GM with uber-sweet gear!
His eyes how they twinkled! His whispers so merry,
He said “I’ve arrived to answer your query!”

“My gold is all gone! My weapon has vanished!”
I screamed at him, beginning to panic.
“We aware of the problem” was all he would say,
“I can’t help you out, but have a nice day.”

I threatened to cancel, to flame and to cry…
He just cut and pasted another reply.
I cursed and I broadcast my plight o’er the land.
The only result: for 3 days I was banned.

The lesson here kiddies, for young and for old:
When the lag-meter’s red, hang onto your gold;
And before you laugh at another’s bad luck,
Eventually you’ll be the one who gets %*&$ed!


makes me want to start an OCR christmas poem thread.

[Solid Krono]

Those are so great :lmassoff:

[mecca]

Just hit 53, went to BRD for the first time, looted some key off the bartender and ended up ruining the run for everyone :(

Still though, got my stormshroud gear sorted, looks fucking class :D

[Blake]

Christmas in Ironforge= Crazy shit. 50 people throwing snowballs at a summoned infernal= teh win :D

[HamsterCorp]

The Christmas stuff has made Ironlag even worse to be in.

[suzumebachi]

lol no kidding. orgrimmar is full of santa gnomes running around having massive snowball fights. i've noticed that snowballs have like a 1% chance of knocking people down. BUT if you're in a party with someone, it knocks them down 100% of the time. pretty hilarious watching a priest try to heal you while you're knocking him down with snowballs :D

Just hit 53, went to BRD for the first time, looted some key off the bartender and ended up ruining the run for everyone :(

Still though, got my stormshroud gear sorted, looks fucking class :D

how did you ruin it? you need the key to get through the door that Phalanx is guarding after you clear all the pissed off drunkards.

[weggy]

In the first winter event, they would knock anyone down if you hit them from behind.

[The Dennis]

I don't know if this fun little Christmastime trick works or not, but it did last year.

Party up with someone right before they go on a griff ride. RIGHT when they take off, snowball them. They'll fall off and warp right to where they were heading. :)!!

-Dennis-

[speculative]

I just restarted my account a week ago. Still getting used to things - don't even remember all the little skills I have available as a Warlock - I completely forgot about my healthstone at first for example! 8O

Hunting around in Un'Goro Crater atm. After getting a fortitude buff, was taking on lvl 54 tar lords at lvl 51. Fun!

The Xmas stuff has been fun, except for the clods clogging up the Xmas quest giver/vendor in IF. I like the city itself much better, but the intelligence level in SW seems several gradations higher. :roll: I griffon'd to SW from IF and there was no one hogging the vendor. Perhaps the lack of an AH in SW creates this situation...

Anyways, my character is "Arugula" lvl 51 Gnome Warlock on Earthen Ring. :twisted:

[SleazyC]

Anyways, my character is "Arugula" lvl 51 Gnome Warlock on Earthen Ring. :twisted:
Heh, I play on Earthen Ring as well -- Name is Meleganis, lvl 60 undead rogue.

[The Author]

Anyways, my character is "Arugula" lvl 51 Gnome Warlock on Earthen Ring. :twisted:
Heh, I play on Earthen Ring as well -- Name is Meleganis, lvl 60 undead rogue.

Dagger + Back = dead lock.

[Conan The Politician]

I've just started playing this game a few weeks back on Kalecgos as a warrior named Volkspanzer (lvl 32 for the time being). I was always afraid of the idea of getting the amount of money needed for a mount at lvl40, but I already got what I need :).

[mecca]

5 eggs for 50s? Just call me Paddy the Irish farmer :D

Seriously though..what's happening with these santa Q's? Apparently some moron got a Tauren Icebreaker..I think i'll just cash in on the mounds and mounds of morons who cant be bothered to get their own mats.

So I hit 54, and am fully kitted out in Stormshroud. I really want an Ebon Mask though..people just say they got it from a 'rogue quest'. Assholes.

GM offered me a loan for a Krol Blade if it's <1000..I always used to take the piss out of people who paid real money for mmo gold..I've never had such an overhaul in ideals and morals since I played WoW :P considering spending some of my xmas money on it..fuck the 360, I'd only end up visiting Azeroth on Christmas Day anyway :)

[zircon]

Don't waste money on a Krol blade, first of all. Dal'Rends set is very close and that's FREE.

In addition, screw Ebon Mask. In like 3 levels you can get a Ghostshroud which looks the same and has better stats.

[mecca]

[11:49] <meccagrinch> speaking of eggs
[11:49] <BennySanta> lol
[11:49] <meccagrinch> i just farmed 200 in westfall
[11:49] <BennySanta> i gad eggs for dinner
[11:49] <meccagrinch> got people to farm them for me, for 1s a pop
[11:49] <BennySanta> had* sausage egg & chips
[11:49] <meccagrinch> they go for 100 times that on AH :)
[11:49] <redstar1> lol
[11:49] <BennySanta> oh AH?
[11:50] <redstar1> love it when you rip noobs off
[11:50] <meccagrinch> heh
[11:50] <meccagrinch> its for that xmas thing in ironforge
[11:50] * BennySanta rips redstar1 off
[11:50] <meccagrinch> you get epics apparently from the santa char
[11:50] <meccagrinch> so people are buying them like mad
[11:50] <redstar1> lol i haven't been on in a while
[11:50] <meccagrinch> but cant be arsed farming them
[11:50] <meccagrinch> you need to give him cookies heh
[11:50] <BennySanta> how do u farm an egg
[11:50] <BennySanta> ?
[11:50] <BennySanta> lol
[11:50] <meccagrinch> which you need 5 eggs for
[11:51] <meccagrinch> world of warcraft benny :)
[11:51] <BennySanta> ...
[11:51] <BennySanta> im lost m8
[11:51] <BennySanta> like hard
[11:51] <BennySanta> im thinking of eggs as in egg & bacon
[11:51] <BennySanta> lol

[phantomINTELLECT]

Dawn's Edge X 2 and Dwarven Hand Cannon = 1337 Hunter

[GeckoYamori]

How much do you need in the cooking skill to make gingerbread cookies?

[mecca]

hmm (http://hackingsource.net/downloads/pafiledb.php?action=category&id=18)

[GuitarNinja]

Don't waste money on a Krol blade, first of all. Dal'Rends set is very close and that's FREE.

In addition, screw Ebon Mask. In like 3 levels you can get a Ghostshroud which looks the same and has better stats.

With the changes Dal'Rends is a better main hand weapon now, and the cloak from that quest is better for AB, and the Geddon fight.

[The Author]

Dal Rend's main hand, thrash blade off-hand until you complete the set.

After some playing and testing, it seems that thrashblade's proc gives a free main hand attack. Good DPS right there.


If you are ambitious:

Main Hand: Thunderfury
Off Hand: Chromaticaly tampered sword

Deadly. Looks weird on anything, especially on gnomes... I cant wait to see that guy with the updated bloodfang...


Oh, and for anyone who plays horde, (tauren specifically) and who has a good lootlink database, can you use dressing room to show what a tauren in updated bloodfang would look like?

I'm curious.

EDIT: Make it a warrior so that he can dual wield the two weapons I named ...

[zircon]

Thunderfury isn't very good, imo. Chromatically tempered sword has nearly 100 max damage over it. Think about the difference in sinister strikes. Thunderfury seems like more of a Fury warrior weapon, or a Paladin mainhand..

[The Author]

Thunderfury isn't very good, imo. Chromatically tempered sword has nearly 100 max damage over it. Think about the difference in sinister strikes. Thunderfury seems like more of a Fury warrior weapon, or a Paladin mainhand..

True, but the thunderfury procs once every 2 or 3 hits. And it's proc (I can't look it up right now) deals about 500 damage if I remember correctly. That's 166-250 extra damage every strike. The proc's damage and effect causes no extra threat, and well, DW two oversized swords rock.

[zircon]

Proc rate is about 30%, yeah, but they're apparently nerfing the attack speed debuff in some way. The damage is about 300.

[The Author]

Proc rate is about 30%, yeah, but they're apparently nerfing the attack speed debuff in some way. The damage is about 300.

Well, 100 extra damage right there. Unmitigated by armor, mitigated by nature resist...

Oh and the nerf is due to a programing mistake present in every "on attack" procs.

Basically, the proc damage would activate certain proc options like sword spec or lifestealing. In addition, it sometimes added extra damage due to heroic strike, which led to chains like "heroic strike, sword spec proc + heroic strike, thunderfury + heroic strike, random damage enchant (flaming for the proc rate) +heroic, sword spec + heroic, thunderfury + heroic, flaming +heroic" with all the heroic strikes ending up not costing any rage. Throw in a hand of Justice, and a Darkmoon fair card: Maelstrom, and you have an even deadlier chain proc. That's what they are removing. I think they should, on the other hand, increase damage enchants's proc rates because of the actual loss of power.

With my rogues I have seen horrible proc chains as well. But nothing causing as much damage as this one has.

[GuitarNinja]

The big problem is, if you can't controll your agro now, thunderfury is a weapon you should never touch. The proc pulls agro like mad.

[The Author]

The big problem is, if you can't controll your agro now, thunderfury is a weapon you should never touch. The proc pulls agro like mad.

It doesn't pull aggro.

[mecca]

FUCK SAKE.

Was grinding with a 60 in silithus.

Dwarven Hand Cannon drops.

I roll 57.

He rolls 59.

SON OF A FUCKING CUNT LICKING WHORE. I almost died from heart palpitations. So I made a post about it.

[The Author]

Will he use it?

Would you use it?

[Rodin]

I almost died frothing in anger over an incident that happened to me in Un'goro. I was level 54 on my hunter, and was trying to grind my way up to where I could do the endgame instances. While I was out there, a paladin requested help with one of the bug quests. Now, I had already completed this quest, but I thought I'd be friendly and help the guy out.

5 mobs into the dungeon, Deepfury Bracers drop. These are leather, but their stats are comparable to Beaststalkers. I immediately and excitedly roll on it, pointing out my level 42 green wristguards to the paladin as I do so.

He need-rolls, and wins, and bases his roll on "Hunters don't wear leather, and I can sell this".

:banghead:

[suzumebachi]

so like.. is 1.9 out?

[zircon]

Bliz explicitly posted it was not coming out today. If it is, Tigole is a liar.

[The Author]

Bliz explicitly posted it was not coming out today. If it is, Tigole is a liar.

Bliz had lied in the past.

Seriously it's today or in January.

[GuitarNinja]

The big problem is, if you can't controll your agro now, thunderfury is a weapon you should never touch. The proc pulls agro like mad.

It doesn't pull aggro.

Yes, yes it does.

The proc causes you to do more damage with a sudden burst do to the nature damage.

Thus agro.

[The Author]

The big problem is, if you can't controll your agro now, thunderfury is a weapon you should never touch. The proc pulls agro like mad.

It doesn't pull aggro.

Yes, yes it does.

The proc causes you to do more damage with a sudden burst do to the nature damage.

Thus agro.

Okay, let me rephrase that:

The debuff does not cause aggro.
It does not cause aggro like an AOE attack.
And it does not cause more aggro than if you had scored a crit. It causes less aggro than a crit actually. It basically causes the same aggro as a regular Dal Rend sinister strike hit.

If you cannot manage that kind of aggro, you suck as a rogue and should reroll as a priest.

[zircon]

Bliz explicitly posted it was not coming out today. If it is, Tigole is a liar.

Bliz had lied in the past.

Seriously it's today or in January.

As you can see, it didn't come out. If they say "the patch is NOT coming out" they are not going to surprise us. They only lie about releasing things early.

[The Author]

Bliz explicitly posted it was not coming out today. If it is, Tigole is a liar.

Bliz had lied in the past.

Seriously it's today or in January.

As you can see, it didn't come out. If they say "the patch is NOT coming out" they are not going to surprise us. They only lie about releasing things early.

All part of life, I guess...


Oh well, maybe the one after this one will be even bigger.

Maybe they will be able to cover 2 classes next patch since they probably won't add any notable content...

[mecca]

Will he use it?

Would you use it?

Yes, he'd use the 350g he gets from selling it to a hunter, and so would I.

[The Author]

Well, if you are friends with him and such, just ask him to split the profits.

When I farm with a friend we have these rules:

Roll on the first green, then alternate between people.
Roll on all blues, need if needed, greed if to sell.
If a purple drops and no one will use it, sell it and split the profit.

[BlackJackRatso]

Anyone with over 30 days of collected time on any file needs to...
1. Start a new file.
2. Play sothing else for a while.
3. Get a life (Adict)

[I mean this for all games even the ones I like]

[The Author]

Game has been out for over a year.

Lets say you have played for 12 months.

You have 30 days played. 30*24=720.

52 weeks in a year.

720/52=13.84 hours a week.

out of 7 days, that means less than 2 hours a day.



How long have you been sitting in front of the TV?

[BlackJackRatso]

Game has been out for over a year.

Lets say you have played for 12 months.

You have 30 days played. 30*24=720.

52 weeks in a year.

720/52=13.84 hours a week.

out of 7 days, that means less than 2 hours a day.



How long have you been sitting in front of the TV?

I don't watch TV as much as I used to but I would say at my worst 8 hours a day (sleeping was not a concern)

[The Author]

I play an average of 4 hours a night.

My parents watch TV an average of 5 hours a night.

They used to think I had a problem...

[BlackJackRatso]

I play an average of 4 hours a night.

My parents watch TV an average of 5 hours a night.

They used to think I had a problem...

Never rally though about using that concept...
Thanks

Now with 50mbps internet, you can guess that I live on the internet now. Kind of sad huh.

[The Author]

Work at home + internet banking + internet shopping = never leaving the house.

[BlackJackRatso]

Work at home + internet banking + internet shopping = never leaving the house.

Sounds like a fun way to live life. Might get lonely though.

But that what the boards are for.

[The Author]

Work at home + internet banking + internet shopping = never leaving the house.

Sounds like a fun way to live life. Might get lonely though.

But that what the boards are for.

Hence the high rate of virgin suicides.

[GuitarNinja]

The big problem is, if you can't controll your agro now, thunderfury is a weapon you should never touch. The proc pulls agro like mad.

It doesn't pull aggro.

Yes, yes it does.

The proc causes you to do more damage with a sudden burst do to the nature damage.

Thus agro.

Okay, let me rephrase that:

The debuff does not cause aggro.
It does not cause aggro like an AOE attack.
And it does not cause more aggro than if you had scored a crit. It causes less aggro than a crit actually. It basically causes the same aggro as a regular Dal Rend sinister strike hit.

If you cannot manage that kind of aggro, you suck as a rogue and should reroll as a priest.

Once again no.

Chance on hit: Blasts your enemy with lightning, dealing 300 Nature damage and then jumping to additional nearby enemies. Each jump reduces that victim's Nature resistance by 25. Affects 5 targets. Your target is also consumed by a cyclone, slowing its attack speed by 25% for 12 sec.

The proc does damage, thus causing threat, also with a debuff that increases your white damage, plus the debuff stacks. Thus a large amount of threat inscreased.

Look into the numbers if you want to rogue end game more effectively, since threat is just a numbers game.

[mecca]

Fuck, the OCR crew seem to know their stuff :)

So I just got kitted out with an ebon mask, and sold another star ruby for 70g on the AH (if you dont know how, you're probably the person who bought it).

I need to start saving for a nice dagger. Heartseeker is a (little) too expensive for me right now, as this 70g is all I have, but I'd like something to look forward to. Right now I have a Dire Nail found off Erikanus in ST, and the Blazing Rapier. As for my armour, I look evil as fuck, but my weaponry lets me down :(

So let's get to business: firstly I'd like some suggestions; I'm aiming toward agility as you would imagine, with something that has a nice proc if possible. I've been thinking about sacrificing backstab in the name of awesomeness and getting dual skullforge reavers..which look fucking sinful ;)

On to my next Q, which is wondering whether any of you follow some sort of guide or have a quality resource with tips on roguery with regards to endgames and being a more effective asset to a raid or group.

Many thanks.

[GeckoYamori]

What are the most common and essential interface add-ons I should get?

I got bored with alliance and made a Troll Mage on the Moonglade RP server. I think I made the wrong class choice again though, I just peeked at Shaman and it looks a lot more tempting.

[GuitarNinja]

What are the most common and essential interface add-ons I should get?


(( Depends, the biggest one is Titan pannel, and it does indeed rock.

http://www.curse-gaming.com/mod.php?addid=860 ))

[ILLiterate]

Yay, WoW for Christmas

Level 16 now, Tauren Shaman, Stonemaul PvP Server, horray

Any tips?

[D-Lux]

Yay, WoW for Christmas

Level 16 now, Tauren Shaman, Stonemaul PvP Server, horray

Any tips?

Barrens chat for the win.

[Solid Krono]

Yay, WoW for Christmas

Level 16 now, Tauren Shaman, Stonemaul PvP Server, horray

Any tips?

Don't run into my alliance chars I have on Stonemaul :lol:. But good choice, my friends who've playing shamans say they're really fun. Good luck with your quests.

[GeckoYamori]

So my friend bought me this game for Christmas, and is willing to pay for my account--just because he wants someone to play with. So I figure, why not?

I can't really play it yet, as I have to wait for my new computer to come in, but I've been looking around at stuff.

In Guild Wars, I played pretty much nothing other than a monk (heal-bitch). Is there an analogous class/race in WoW?

Priest is the class you are looking for. Druids are also good healers, though not as dedicated. They are more of a mix between all the different classes (Regular form = Spellcaster, Bear form = Warrior, Cat form = Rogue). Paladins are Alliance (blech) exclusive, and are basicly warriors with healing capabilities. The Horde counterpart is Shaman, which is a pretty balanced fighter/spellcaster with healing capabilities.

[Adun The Untouchable]

Gorefiend / Labworks / Tauren / Shaman

lvl 21 :cry:

[Triad Orion]

Azgalor/Dajoobe/Troll/Warrior/Lev. 25

A shout out to all the Horde players! Blood and thunder! :D

[zircon]

Priests are more hybrids than Paladins are. Paladins have very efficient heals and can fit that role quite well. They are NOT warriors with healing, they are healers with plate. They have terrible offense compared to any other class - Priests on the other hand can be one of the most powerful offensive classes, potentially.

[ellywu2]

Roll a warrior. Mortal Strike pwns even God himself.

[Triad Orion]

Priests are more hybrids than Paladins are. Paladins have very efficient heals and can fit that role quite well. They are NOT warriors with healing, they are healers with plate. They have terrible offense compared to any other class - Priests on the other hand can be one of the most powerful offensive classes, potentially.

Hopefully the next patch will give Paladins some much needed DPS for the sake of balance. Though, don't underestimate Paladin damage dealing potential... I believe it was Seal of Judgement that if used properly and with a bit of luck can really cause Pallys to bring down even some tough guys.
I might be wrong on the specific seal, considering I don't play Alliance most of the time.

But yes, as Zircon said, Priests speced in Shadow Magic are especially dangerous... they are infamous face melters in PvP combat. And they're always in high demand for groups, so playing a Priest is never a bad thing to do.

[zircon]

From what I've seen/read/heard, Priests seem to be the closest analogue to Monks, which is exactly what I'm looking for. I want to play a purely support/healing role, if possible, though I know WoW doesn't quite focus on teamplay the way I'm accustomed.

Paladins are pure support, not Priests. They have more powerful buffs and a wider variety, as well as more efficient heals. Priests might have more powerful focused heals but in terms of a support combat role, Paladins are superior in every way as far as I'm concerned.

[Stalwart Jester]

Argent Dawn/Colban/Undead/Rogue/Level 60

POWER TO THE FORSAKEN! :roll:

[weggy]

From what I've seen/read/heard, Priests seem to be the closest analogue to Monks, which is exactly what I'm looking for. I want to play a purely support/healing role, if possible, though I know WoW doesn't quite focus on teamplay the way I'm accustomed.

Paladins are pure support, not Priests. They have more powerful buffs and a wider variety, as well as more efficient heals. Priests might have more powerful focused heals but in terms of a support combat role, Paladins are superior in every way as far as I'm concerned.

I'd agree, except their stats really don't reflect that. They get a lot more melee stats like STR and AGI when they level up, wheres priests get more casting stats like INT and SPT. Sure you can layer on gear to change it, but theres a lot of wasted points otherwise. I really think Paladins shine as a tank who can heal if necessary.

Honestly, resoration druids are better healer's than priests anyway. Innervate and nature's swiftness are absolutely godsends. And Mark of the Wild is a fantastic buff. Thorns is also very nice for the tanks.

In my ideal party, there would be a warrior as primary tank, paladin as secondary tank/secondary healer, mage for DPS and crowd control, warlock for wipe prevention, damage, healthstones, and extra HP or crowd control, and finally a druid to wrap it all up as a healer.

[suzumebachi]

Smolderthorn/Chuckster/Tauren/Hunter/lvl 60

i haven't been playing much recently. i've kind of lost interest since my guild disbanded. i did start re-rolling alliance on skullcrusher though, so i might get back into it.

[HamsterCorp]

My main char is a 35 NE war on Silverhand named Kitsunii. I have a bunch of other random characters all under 15. Once free-range realm transfers become available, I plan on moving my main to a different server.

[HamsterCorp]

Uh.

Is there any way I can have my character run up to melee range on her own?
As far as I know, only if you're a warrior and using charge or intercept.

[Kiyosuki]

Warrior seems actually pretty neat in this game compared to others. The different stances to switch your attack style is very flexible. The only thing is that like Warrior in any other game, you supposedly have to make friends with Priests or other classes that can heal you.

[ellywu2]

60 NE Hunter/45 Human Warrior/Sunstrider EU.

[zircon]

Warriors are a cool class, yes. They're not typecast into tanks only. In PvP of course you have more flexibility than PVE, where you're either a tank or a dps (2h or fury). While making friends with a healer isn't a bad idea, between various consumables, Warrior abilities, and trinkets, you may be able to counteract many forms of impairment without having a healer around.

[ellywu2]

If you like big numbers, roll a warrior :)
Execute ftw!

[HamsterCorp]

Warriors are a cool class, yes. They're not typecast into tanks only. In PvP of course you have more flexibility than PVE, where you're either a tank or a dps (2h or fury). While making friends with a healer isn't a bad idea, between various consumables, Warrior abilities, and trinkets, you may be able to counteract many forms of impairment without having a healer around.
It saddens me to see all the people in the game that always say a warrior sucks no matter what unless they're using 2h. I'm guessing they've never actually played a warrior beyond doing what everyone said was the "uber" build or whatever, or they've just never seen a good warrior doing anything else. I prefer dual-wield, and trying to use a 2h is rather boring, just attack...wait...attack...oh I have enough rage for an ability now!

Where as dual-wield is more like attackattackabilityabilityattackcritcritattackexec ute.

[ILLiterate]

Yay, WoW for Christmas

Level 16 now, Tauren Shaman, Stonemaul PvP Server, horray

Any tips?

Barrens chat for the win.Indeed, Barrens chat is probably the best example of stupidity ever, how many times have I started an arguement over how Chuck Norris is better than Vin Diesel?

Anyways, almost lvl 20 now, much pwnt, I've only lost to rogues in PvP (cheap stealthy bastards) and I can't wait until I can Shadow Wolf ( no need for me to buy a mount )

[Julio Jose]

Anyone on Icecrown?

[suzumebachi]

ghost wolf is 40%

[ILLiterate]

ghost wolf is 40% Doesn't matter, anything is better than the time it takes to normally run around

[GeckoYamori]

Teleport is pretty decent too, usually I can keep up with any hunters in my party.

[[deltree]]

Uh.

Is there any way I can have my character run up to melee range on her own?

Have right click to move turned on in interface options and just right click the enemy.


Teleport is pretty decent too, usually I can keep up with any hunters in my party.

Just watch out and don't teleport in front a tree or something like I'd always seem to do.

[zircon]

Warriors are a cool class, yes. They're not typecast into tanks only. In PvP of course you have more flexibility than PVE, where you're either a tank or a dps (2h or fury). While making friends with a healer isn't a bad idea, between various consumables, Warrior abilities, and trinkets, you may be able to counteract many forms of impairment without having a healer around.
It saddens me to see all the people in the game that always say a warrior sucks no matter what unless they're using 2h. I'm guessing they've never actually played a warrior beyond doing what everyone said was the "uber" build or whatever, or they've just never seen a good warrior doing anything else. I prefer dual-wield, and trying to use a 2h is rather boring, just attack...wait...attack...oh I have enough rage for an ability now!

Where as dual-wield is more like attackattackabilityabilityattackcritcritattackexec ute.

Two words: Mortal Strike. Most powerful melee ability in the entire game, hands down. Massive, instant damage with a ridiculous debuff that screws up anyone from healers to flag carriers.

Fury warriors can be powerful too, but you need to have SICK weaponry for it to be effective. I'm talking Thunderfuries, Deathbringers, Brutality Blades, Chromatically Tempered Swords, that kind of thing. I know lots of Warriors in my guild who switched to fury (they are MC geared or better) and they went back to MS/2h. Fury is more of a PVE spec, ultimately, I think.

[GuitarNinja]

Handy link fer the rogues, no longer do I need to do the math in my head.

http://www.sk-gaming.com/wow/rogue/

[Triad Orion]

Warriors are a cool class, yes. They're not typecast into tanks only. In PvP of course you have more flexibility than PVE, where you're either a tank or a dps (2h or fury). While making friends with a healer isn't a bad idea, between various consumables, Warrior abilities, and trinkets, you may be able to counteract many forms of impairment without having a healer around.
It saddens me to see all the people in the game that always say a warrior sucks no matter what unless they're using 2h. I'm guessing they've never actually played a warrior beyond doing what everyone said was the "uber" build or whatever, or they've just never seen a good warrior doing anything else. I prefer dual-wield, and trying to use a 2h is rather boring, just attack...wait...attack...oh I have enough rage for an ability now!

Where as dual-wield is more like attackattackabilityabilityattackcritcritattackexec ute.

Two words: Mortal Strike. Most powerful melee ability in the entire game, hands down. Massive, instant damage with a ridiculous debuff that screws up anyone from healers to flag carriers.



I dream of the day my Warrior will be high enough level to throw down the Mortal Strikes on anyone who gets in his way. Right now though, I've gotta fight my way through Hillsbrad, which is the equivilant of the hazing grounds in WoW. That's more than enough to worry about with all the gankers hanging around around there...

[Rodin]

Hillsbrad? Pssh. You either like dying, or are being very foolish.

Barrens has quests right up through level 22-24ish. Stonetalon Mountains will take you through about 25, Ashenvale through 30. Thousand Needles is 25-35ish.

It is possible to continually quest, on both factions, without ever setting foot in Hillsbrad. Unless there's a particular quest reward that you just have to have, I highly recommend leveling in a different zone.

[ILLiterate]

I say, if any of you are Herbalists and are Horde, a great way to get gold pretty fast at new low-ish levels is to farm stranglekelp in Merchants Coast (right on Ratchet). Easy to find, and somehow sells 6.5g for 20 packson, very quickly, constantly, at Auction House

Easy street from now on :D

[Raziellink]

Draenor server, 56 Orc warrior, 18 Undead Warlock

Victory...or death! :)

[TristorTrucido]

Does anyone else have the problem that every time a new patch comes out, a checksum fails somewhere and the game has to be reinstalled?

[The Author]

World of Warcraft Client Patch 1.9.0 (2006-1-3)
The Gates of Ahn'Qiraj

The Gates of Ahn'Qiraj will house two massive, unique dungeons -- the Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj, a 20-man raid dungeon, and the Temple of Ahn'Qiraj, a 40-man raid dungeon. As players delve deeper into the mysteries of Ahn'Qiraj, they will discover revelations of the Silithid infestation and their shadowy masters, the Qiraji. Players will have to complete a world event of massive proportions before they can open the Gates of Ahn'Qiraj on their realm.

Linked Auction Houses

Players will now be able to buy and sell goods with greater effectiveness using the Linked Auction House system. Auction Houses in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff will now share the same pool of Horde player-created auctions, and Alliance players will find the same to be true when visiting Ironforge, Stormwind City, and Darnassus Auction Houses. This system has been expanded to support the neutral Auction Houses as well. Tanaris, Everlook, and Booty Bay will all be linked for players of both factions to access. In addition, the "Looking for Group" and "Trade" channels have been unified among the corresponding cities, meaning, for example, that you can trade your goods or look for groups in Ironforge while in Stormwind.

Multiple Battlegrounds Queues

Players will be able to enter multiple battleground queues. No longer must you make the hard decision of which queue to join -- when queued for all three, you can join the first one available or hold out for that particular battleground which you've really got your heart set on.

Soul Shard Bags

Tailors now can make soul bags to hold soul shards. The smallest is a 20-slot bag, the recipe for which can be purchased in Gadgetzan. The recipe for a larger bag can be found in Scholomance, and one for an even larger bag can be found in Molten Core. In the main UI, these soul bags will display how many shards they contain. So long as the soul bags have room, any soul shards a warlock creates will automatically go into the bag.

Raid Calendar System

The raid-lockout system has undergone a significant change. The new system will have all instances reset at a certain server time, regardless of when you were actually saved to the instance. The reset schedule is as follows:
Molten Core: Every 7 Days, resetting during weekly maintenance.
Blackwing Lair: Every 7 Days, resetting during weekly maintenance
Onyxia: Every 5 Days
Zul'Gurub: Every 3 Days
Temple of Ahn'Qiraj (40-man): Every 7 Days, resetting during weekly maintenance
Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj (20-man): Every 3 Days
All resets will occur during off-hours, when the least amount of raids are active.

Important Note for Mac OS X Users

The minimum supported Mac OS X revision for WoW will be changed in a post-1.9.0 patch, from 10.3.5 to 10.3.9. If you are running 10.3.5 - 10.3.8 and need to get the free update, you can use Software Update or you can click here for the direct download. This change will make it easier for us to release future updates to the game, for example to support upcoming Mac models based on Intel processors.

General

* All Disorient effects have been renamed Incapacitate effects. This includes Gouge, Sap, etc.
* All Confusion effects have been renamed Disorient effects. This includes Blind, Scatter Shot, etc.
* Food and Drink are now in separate categories, so you can only have one food effect and one drink effect on you at a time. The only effect should be that foods that used to stack with each other (you could have two food effects on you at once) no longer will stack.
* On-next-swing abilities will no longer cause multiple weapon procs on a single swing.

PvP

* Several civilian NPCs, who previously would assist non-civilians, will no longer do so.

Druids

* Bear and Dire Bear form - Effects that lower armor will now lower armor by a percentage of the druid's full armor, rather than just base (caster form) armor. However, Enrage will still only remove 75% of base armor.
* Omen of Clarity - Special attacks will no longer consume their own clearcasting state. All melee attacks will now be able to trigger the clearcasting state.
* Nature's Grasp - This spell can now trigger from special melee attacks. It will no longer be possible to cast Entangling Roots at no mana cost immediately after Nature's Grasp procs.
* Nature's Grace - The Nature's Grace buff will now appear on the player upon completion of casting, before the travel time of the spell. So, Wrath crits will now benefit the casting time of the next spell cast.
* Insect Swarm - New icon.
* Improved Starfire - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc.).
* Omen of Clarity - This spell now works correctly with Bash, Rip, Ferocious Bite, and Demoralizing Roar, granting a decrease in the cost of the ability. Ferocious Bite will still use the entire energy bar to generate additional damage.

Hunters

* Arcane Shot - This spell can no longer trigger twice in one shot off of the Paladin's Judgement of Wisdom.
* Aspect of the Pack and Aspect of the Cheetah - Periodic damage will no longer trigger the Dazed effect.
* Aspect of the Wild - Radius increased. Tooltip updated to display radius.
* Improved Concussive Shot - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc.).
* Tame Beast - The hunter will now turn to face the target during the taming process.
* Bestial Wrath - Damage bonus reduced, duration increased.
* Unleashed Fury - Damage bonus increased.
* Pet Changes
o Turtles can now eat raw and cooked fish.
o Turtles can now learn Shell Shield, allowing them to reduces all damage taken by 50% for 10 sec.
o Hunters can now tame Sons of Hakkar. Sons of Hakkar are in the Wind Serpent family and will know Lightning Breath (Rank 6).
o Boars can now learn Charge, an ability that allows them to charge to an enemy, immobilize that enemy for 1 second, and add a large amount of Attack Power to the boar's next attack.
o Gorillas can now learn Thunderstomp, an ability that causes high threat area Nature damage.

Mages

* Impact - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc.).
* Netherwind Regalia - The 8-piece set bonus will now proc immediately upon completion of casting the spell, before travel time on the spell. This will allow the proc to affect the next spell cast as intended.
* Arcane Concentration - Blizzard will now be able to gain a Clearcasting state from this talent.
* Blast Wave - Will now show spell data in the talent page.

Paladins

* Due to significant talent changes, all Paladins' talent points will be refunded and can be respent. Training costs for all talent spell/ability replacements have been significantly reduced.
* Paladins can now learn Greater Blessings for the following spells:
o Blessing of Might
o Blessing of Wisdom
o Blessing of Kings
o Blessing of Sanctuary
o Blessing of Salvation
Greater Blessings will cast the associated blessing on all raid members that share the same class as the target. For example, if you cast Greater Blessing of Might on a warrior in your raid, all warriors in the raid party will receive Blessing of Might from you. Additionally, Greater Blessings have an increased duration of 15 minutes. These blessings require twice as much mana as the single target version, as well as a reagent. Paladins can purchase these new Greater Blessing spells from their class trainers.
* Seal of Fury - The seal and judgement have been removed and replaced with a new self-buff, Righteous Fury, which will increase threat from holy damage.
* Seals and Judgements - Added or increased damage per level so that these spells keep pace between replacements.
* Judgements - Judgements that place a debuff on their victim will now all have their duration refreshed when the judging paladin strikes the victim with his or her melee swings. All these debuffs have had their duration decreased to 10 seconds. In addition, Judgements that place debuffs can no longer be resisted.
* Seal of Righteousness - Now does holy damage on every swing. It can now proc correctly as well. The Judgement effect has been renamed "Judgement of Righteousness" to differentiate it from the Seal damage in the combat log.
* Judgement of the Crusader - The holy damage bonus has been decreased as part of rebalancing paladin damage (which is still increased overall).
* Seal of Command - The proc will occur more often, but will only do 70% of weapon-swing damage.
* Judgement of Command - Instead of placing a debuff on the victim, this spell now does immediate damage. If the victim is not stunned, they only take 30% of the total damage. The damage on this Judgement was increased significantly.
* Judgement of Wisdom - Arcane Shot will no longer cause this to proc twice on one shot. Channeling spells can now trigger this proc as well.
* Vengeance - Special ability critical hits can now trigger Vengeance.
* Judgement of Righteousness - The damage of this judgement was increased significantly. This judgement can now trigger procs.
* Holy Shock - Now heals friendly targets and damages enemy targets. Mana cost reduced. Bonus from spell damage and healing items increased.
* All Seals and Judgements have had their bonus coefficient from plus spell damage re-evaluated. Some holy damage effects had no coefficient before and now have a coefficient.
* Vengeance - Clarified the tooltip to indicate procs will not trigger Vengeance.
* Summon Warhorse - Mana cost reduced.
* Summon Charger - Mana cost reduced.
* Consecration - No longer displays a debuff icon on targets in the area of effect.
* Updated Aura tooltips to be more clear (include radius, fix grammatical errors etc...).
* Judgement - Range increased, cooldown decreased, mana cost decreased. Using Judgement will now initiate melee combat.
* Exorcism - Now usable on Demon targets in addition to Undead targets.
* Holy Wrath - Now usable on Demon targets in addition to Undead targets.
* Seal of Justice - Mana cost slightly increased. The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...).
* Seal of Righteousness - Damage bonus from +Holy damage items increased, mana cost slightly increased.
* Seal of Command - Damage bonus from +Holy damage items increased.
* Seal of the Crusader - Mana cost slightly increased.
* Seal of Fury - Removed and replaced with Righteous Fury.
* Seal of Light - Mana cost slightly increased.
* Seal of Wisdom - Mana cost slightly increased.
* Seal of Command - Mana cost slightly increased.
* Hammer of Wrath - Missile speed of the flying hammer increased.
* Divine Protection, Divine Shield and Blessing of Protection - Targets of these spells will now receive the "Recently Shielded" effect, preventing another of these three spells from being applied to that target for one minute.
* New Spell: Righteous Fury (level 16) - Increases the threat generated by the Paladin's Holy attacks by 100%. Lasts 30 minutes.
* Blessing of Sanctuary - Now causes Holy damage to the attacker when the blessed target blocks an attack in addition to the current effect.

Priests

* Martyrdom - This talent will now trigger on melee special abilities as well as on melee swings. The tooltip has been clarified to indicate this ability only works on melee strikes.
* Mind Blast - Threat raised on ranks 7, 8, and 9. Incorrect data had been entered in those spells, resulting in less threat generated than designed.
* Blackout - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...).

Rogues

* Mace Specialization - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...).

Shaman

* Lightning Shield - This spell will now proc when the shaman is struck by elemental attacks.
* Stormstrike - Earthbind and Stoneclaw totems will no longer use up charges of Stormstrike.
* New Spell - Tranquil Air Totem. Creates a totem that reduces the threat caused by nearby party members by 20%.

Warlocks

* Searing Pain - Increased damage on all ranks of Searing Pain.
* Infernal and Doomguard - Increased armor 10% and damage 30% on both pets.
* Soul Link - This spell can no longer be partially dispelled off the warlock. In addition, Soul Link can no longer be used on non-demon pets.
* Hellfire - Victims of Hellfire are now able to resist properly. Warlocks continue (as designed) to be unable to resist their own damage.
* Curse of Shadow and Curse of the Elements - These curses can no longer cause resistance to become negative. To compensate, both curses now increases the damage taken from the appropriate schools by a percentage.
* Summon Felsteed - Mana cost reduced.
* Summon Dreadsteed - Mana cost reduced.
* Pyroclasm - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...).

Warriors

* Execute - Improved Execute and other discounts to the Execute ability will now correctly convert the resulting extra rage into damage.
* Retaliation - This ability will no longer lose charges when the attacker is behind the warrior.
* Sword Specialization - Special attacks now properly trigger the chance to gain an extra attack.
* Sweeping Strikes - Whirlwind and Retaliation will now correctly consume the charges from Sweeping Strikes.
* Bloodthirst - The damage component has been increased to 45% of attack power.
* Enrage - The talent will now grant 5/10/15/20/25% extra damage when enraged, instead of 8/16/24/33/40%.
* Mace Specialization - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...).
* Improved Revenge - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...).

Racial Traits

* Troll Racial Abilities
Troll Berserking
o Is now triggered off any critical hit on you, including spells and ranged attacks.
o Melee/ranged haste bonus and duration reduced.
o Now adds spell damage in addition to the haste bonus.
o Berserking now ability requires a small amount of mana, rage, or energy (depending on your class) to activate.
Throwing Mastery
o Trolls now also receive a bonus to Bow weapons in addition to Throwing weapons.
* Orc Racial Abilities
Blood Fury
o Now applies a healing effectiveness debuff on the user instead of the attack power penalty. The healing debuff is applied immediately upon using the ability.
Hardiness
o Resistance is now applied to just Stun mechanics.
* Gnome Racial Abilities
Escape Artist
o Casting time lowered.
* Dwarven Racial Abilities
Stoneform
o No longer snares the user.
o Armor bonus increased.
o Duration lowered.

Items

* All of the Tier 2 Class Armor sets have been updated with new art.
* The following weapons and shields have been updated with new art : Perdition's Blade, Obsidian Edged Blade, Gutgore Ripper, Core Hound Tooth, Aurastone Hammer, Drillborer Disk, Staff of Dominance.
* Many of the pieces from the Tier 2 Armor sets have received updated statistics. The armor sets with the most extensive changes include the Netherwind, Nemesis, and Judgement sets. Other sets received fewer revisions, or none at all.
* Slimes have been latching on to more valuable items and they will now be dropping better loot than they used to, including coin drops and special bags.
* Drop rates of Darkmoon Cards 2-8 (Portals 2-8, etc..) have been reduced. Ace drop rates have been increased.
* The drop rate of Shadowcat Hides has been increased.
* The Lifestealing enchantment now does shadow damage rather than fire damage.
* Manna Biscuits now have two separate spell effects so they stack correctly with other food and water.
* Well Fed buffs from special foods will no longer stack with each other.
* The enchanter-made wands are now correctly flagged as Bind on Equip.
* Silithus air elementals have a slightly increased chance of dropping essence of air
* Stormshroud Shoulders have been fixed to be a superior item and have had the stamina on them slightly increased as well.
* Whistle of the Black War Raptor was changed to Bind on Acquire.
* The Runed Stygian Belt is no longer Unique.
* Bandages will now appears as "Consumable" in the auction house.
* Jadeanar humanoids and demons in Felwood and Winterfall Furbolgs in Winterspring can now drop Runecloth.
* Winterfall Furbolgs will not drop Winterfall Firewater as often.
* The Seal of Wrynn, Nogg's Gold Ring, and Talvash's Gold Ring have been improved to be superior items.
* All Giants in Azshara now drop cash and items appropriate for an elite creature.
* The attack speed slowing effect from Thunderfury has been reduced to 20%, and no longer stacks with other such effects such as Thunderclap.
* The Reckless Charge ability of the Goblin Rocket Helmet and Horned Viking Helmet is now considered a disorient instead of a sleep effect.
* Flamewaker Legplates and Sash of Whispered Secrets improved to have the proper stats of an epic item.
* Broken Silithid Chitin is now marked as a poor item.
* Albino Crocscale Boots now has the appropriate geometry attached.
* Darkshore Grouper now has an appropriate sound when moved in your inventory.
* The effect of the Freezing Band is now considered a Freeze effect.
* The Force Reactive Disk's and Cloak of Fire's effects will no longer gain a benefit from effects that increase spell damage.
* The Insightful Hood and Southsea Head Bucket will now cover hair properly.
* The proc ability of the Halberd of Smiting can no longer cause another proc.
* The Glimmering Mithril Insignia will no longer make a player immune to Death Coil.
* The Goblin Mortar's stun effect now has a description.
* Six Demon Bag tooltip changed to note that the target must be in front of the caster.
* The Fiery War Axe is now in fact, Fiery.
* The Abyssal Plate Gauntlets are now Bind on Equip.
* Items with the Frost Blast ability will now deal the correct damage listed.
* Gauntlets of Shining Light is now spelled correctly.
* The Pure Elementium Band now has a sell price.
* The Mendicant's Slippers now have the proper amount of stamina for the level of the item.
* Arcanist's Bindings had more resistances than proper for the item, and these were removed.
* Alcor's Sunrazor is now Bind on Equip.
* Transforming Thunderstrike and Shadowstrike will no longer consume additional copies of the item that might be in the inventory.
* Added a note to the tooltip for the Healing and Mana Draughts available in Alterac Valley that informs the player they are only usable in Alterac Valley.
* Incorrect amounts of abilities such as Attack Power, Increased Fire Damage, or Increased Healing Damage were being applied to all random item property world drops. Two handed weapons such as Staves had much lower amounts of these abilities, while ranged and one handed weapons had too much. All further drops of these items will have the correct amounts, but previously dropped items will not be affected by this change.
* The Shardtooth Meat quest item can no longer be fed to a Hunter pet.
* Blue Dragon Card - This trinket will no longer proc from non-combat abilities.
* Shield Spikes - Shield Spike damage will no longer occur on ranged blocks.
* Halberd of Smiting - This weapon will no longer proc multiple time off one swing.

Professions

* An Alchemy recipe to Transmute Heart of Fire into three Elemental Fires has been added at the Friendly level of the Thorium Brotherhood.
* Epic items that are level 51 and above will now disenchant into a Nexus Crystal. Also items that normally disenchant into Large Brilliant Shards have a very small chance of disenchanting into a Nexus Crystal. New more powerful enchanting recipes that require these Crystals can be found in the new Ahn'Qiraj content.
* Enchanters can now turn some of their dusts and shards into magical oils. These oils when applied to weapons add a temporary bonus to magical damage or mana regeneration that stacks with permanent enchantments. The lower levels of these recipes are found on normal enchanting vendors. The higher level versions are found on special vendors and are rewards for high Zandalar faction.
* The Enchanting Trainer in Cenarion Hold in Silithus sells some of both new types of enchanting formulae.
* Schools of fish have appeared around the world that can be fished from a few times before being fished out. These schools tend to contain valuable fish types such as Oily Blackmouth or Firefin Snapper. In some places, wreckage can be fished from for even better rewards.
* The cooking trainers around the world sell the recipe for Sagefish and Greater Sagefish. These two fish types can be found in schools in inland areas and provide health and mana regeneration as well as additional mana regeneration for 15 minutes after eating.
* Engineers with skill 250 or greater, who have completed Umi Rumplesnicker's 'Are We There Yeti?' quest line, should seek her out again in Everlook.

Quests & Reputation

* The Timbermaw Furbolgs have received a faction revamp!
o The Timbermaw Furbolg faction is now named "Timbermaw Hold."
o Certain named Deadwood and Winterfall Furbolgs are now giving more positive Timbermaw Hold faction when killed.
o Old quests have been revised, and several new quests involving the Timbermaw Furbolgs have been added.
* Reputation caps for killing monsters now happen at the end of a level, rather than in the middle of it. For example: if reputation gains for killing a monster were previously capped at the middle of the range for Friendly on a monster, then they are now capped at the end of Friendly.
* Reputation is now its own category in the chat window; you can change the color of reputation gains and losses as reported in chat without it affecting other miscellaneous information.
* All Alliance versions of the quest "Heeding the Call" now give uniform reputation increases.
* Warlock quests that teach imp summoning now all uniformly award reputation increases for respective racial factions.
* Spells now may have a casting requirement of current reputation with a faction.
* All versions of the quests "A Donation of Wool," "A Donation of Silk," and "A Donation of Mageweave" have had the level of the quest raised so that higher level characters performing them will be able to receive the full reputation gain. The minimum level requirement for the quests have not changed, though the amount of XP gained when completing any of these quests will be different than from before. Mageweave will continue to give more XP than Silk, and Silk more XP than Wool.
* The Alliance version of the quest "Centaur Bounty" now gives Stormwind faction for completion.
* The Horde version of the quest "Centaur Bounty" now gives the same amount of XP as the Alliance version (which means it was increased).
* The quest "Zaeldarr the Outcast" now gives an Argent Dawn reputation increase upon completion.
* A bug with the reputation system has been fixed that was preventing some awards to Horde and Alliance factions from being shared properly amongst all member factions of the team.
* The quest "Ledger from Tanaris" now gives a reputation reward for Gadgetzan upon completion.
* The quest "Supplies for Nethergarde" now has an additional reward of increased Stormwind reputation.
* Fixed typos in both quest versions of "All Along the Watchtower".
* Fixed typos in both quest versions of "Lessons Anew".
* A kobold has been moved away from Piznik so that it won't keep evading in the quest "Gerenzo's Orders".
* Fixed typos in the quest "Signets of the Zandalar".
* Fixed typos in the quest "Rotten Eggs".
* The cleansed plants of Felwood have been modified:
o There is no longer a gossip option to interact with them; simply right click on the plant to receive your buff or fruits.
o The amount of items you get from plants has been adjusted.
o A corrupted whipper root plant was bugged to require one fewer plant salves than intended to be cleansed; it's now fixed to require the salves just like the other whipper roots.
* Fixed two bugs where Pratt McGrubben in Feathermoon Stronghold was not offering to re-teach Wild Leather Shoulders and where he was not properly teaching Wild Leather Leggings.
* Fixed typos in both quest versions of "Power over Poison".
* The level of the quest "Piercing the Veil" has been increased from 3 to 4, bringing it in line with similar quests.
* Sayge's Dark Fortune of Damage buff now only increases damage from a randomly determined range of 1-10%.
* A coin reward has been added to the quest "Worth Its Weight in Gold".
* Vahlarriel in the second part of the quest series "Vahlarriel's Search" now has something to say when returning with the pendant.
* The level for the quest "Parts for Kravel" has been raised to bring it in line with the other quests of the Kravel series.
* You now need fewer Scorpashi Venoms to complete the second quest of the "Reagents for Reclaimers Inc." quest series.
* Baron Revilgaz now should be a little more vociferous.
* Fixed a bug with the Horde Hallow's End quest "Ruined Kegs" that allowed the Alliance to interact with the keg.
* Hallow's End Pumpkin Treats should no longer be on the same timer as combat-oriented potions. Really.
* Xabraxxis' Demon Bag will now last slightly longer in the world once he is killed (3 minutes, up from 2).
* The reward for the quest "An Audience with the King" " Seal of Wrynn - has been improved.
* The reward for the quest "Gnome Improvement" " Talvash's Gold Ring " has been improved. XP and reputation rewards for the quest have also been increased.
* The reward for the quest "Nogg's Ring Redo;" "Nogg's Gold Ring" has been improved. XP and reputation rewards for the quest have also been increased.
* The Horde Quest "Material Assistance" should no longer auto-launch an incorrect (deprecated) quest.
* The quest "Galen's Escape" now gives an additional coin reward upon completion, as well as an increase of reputation amongst the player's factional team.

Raids & Dungeons

* Noxxion in Maraudon now has the correct immunities.
* Noxxion is now social and will bring friends if pulled past other creatures.
* Abyssal Templars are no longer marked as Humanoid.
* Twilight Stonecallers in Silithus should now aggro properly.
* Gordok Reavers and Warlocks now have a slightly larger radius for detection and "call for help."
* Drop rate of Dark Runes in Scholomance has been reduced.
* The Altar of the Deeps in Blackfathom Deeps will now give players the Blessing of the Deeps.
* The abomination event in Stratholme was been reworked with new technology to insure there are no more premature resets.

User Interface

* The Guild UI has been significantly improved. Now when you click on a guild member, it will open up a side panel with all the information about that member including their note and officer's note.
* There is now a Guild Info panel for each guild. That panel allows a guild to enter long term information and messages about the guild that is too long for the message of the day. The guildmaster can use the guild control panel to determine who has access to change the text in this panel.
* Options have been added that allow raiders to not display their base party UI when the Raid UI is up. Also, you can choose to only display effects on players that you can dispel or ones you can cast. This is all in the interface options pane.
* A "tip of the day" feature has been added to loading screens within the game.
* Under Video Options there is now a slider to control the detail of spell effects. Lower settings can help to improve performance.
* Auction buyers/sellers will now receive a detailed invoice of the transaction.
* The casting bar has been brightened back up, it was appearing darker than intended due to a bug.
* A new option has been added to Interface options, "Sticky Targeting". When this is turned on, you will not deselect your current target when you click on empty space.
* A new interface option, "Detailed Loot Information" has been added that defaults to 'on.' If you turn it off you will only see the roll and Need/Greed option of the player who won the item rather than information for every player.
* Open bags that are in your bank will now have a bluish background to them to allow easy differentiation between inventory bags and bank bags.
* The Friends List and Guild UI will now display when a person is AFK.
* It is now possible to use the dressing room UI to model items that are being rolled for in the Group Lood/Need Before Greed Popup window.
* Add-ons, Macros and Keybindings can now be saved on a per character basis, so you can have different characters load different add-ons/macros/keybindings.
* The Ignore command will now ignore emotes.
* The Interface Options Pane has been split up into a normal panel and an advanced panel.
* In the initial loading screen there will be a tip displayed. This can be turned off from the interface options menu.
* Any time an item is distributed using the "Master Looter" system and the item is quality epic or above there will be a confirmation dialogue to confirm that the item is going to the correct person.
* Key bindings can now be saved either globally or on a per character basis.
* Add-ons can now be saved either globally or on a per character basis.
* In addition to the set of macros shared by all characters, each character gets an additional 18 macros available to them.
* Added the ability to link enchanting recipes in chat.
* Optimized UI event handling in raid situations.
* Optimized UI layout engine to improve loading times.
* The game will no longer accidentally load UI files that are dropped loose into the top level installation directory.
* The EquipCursorItem() script function uses slot numbers consistent with the rest of the inventory functions. Any macros which use this function should be updated by adding one to the slot number used currently.
* New TOC entry for dynamically loadable add-ons: ## LoadWith: Addon1, Addon2, etc. - Indicates that your add-on should be automatically loaded after ANY of the add-ons specified on the LoadWith line are loaded.
* The 8th return value from GetItemInfo() is no longer be localized, instead is one of a number of INVTYPE_* tokens.
* A new 9th return value from GetItemInfo() is the inventory icon for the item.
* debugprofilestop() will now return sub-milisecond (floating point) values.
* Added Texture:GetTexture() which returns the filename (without extension) of the file for the texture.
* Added FontString:SetNonSpaceWrap(true|false)
* Added Frame:GetFrameType() which returns the type of a frame.
* Added Frame:IsFrameType("typeName") which returns true if the frame is of type typeName, or a subtype of typeName.
* New 8-param form of Texture:SetTexCoord(ULx, ULy, LLx, LLy, URx, URy, LRx, LRy)
* Parent frame scales are cumulative instead of overrides.
* Textures and FontStrings now have IsVisible() and IsShown() functions with the same semantics as the frame functions of the same name.
* Added Button:SetFont(), which works like the equivalent FontString function.
* Added ScrollingMessageFrame:SetFont(), which works like the equivalent FontString function.
* Special honor awards show up in the combat log.
* Druids can preview different weapons in the dressing room while in moonkin form.
* The Disgusting Oozeling will share its disgusting aura with you even while you are PvP enabled.
* Emotes show up in the chat log file.
* Combat messages no longer show up in the chat log file.
* Resurrection spells will return pets to life with the appropriate amount of health and mana.
* Talent improvements to buffs will persist across instance boundaries and logging out.

World Environment

* Elven NPCs in Scholomance will now animate properly.
* Players should no longer be able to walk on steep terrain.
* Players should no longer be able to move slowly through some locked doors and gates.
* Nida Winterhoof in Thunder Bluff now sells Flowers for the sensitive Horde player.
* The Short John Mithril's chest in Stranglethorn Arena will now display an effect when it is being opened so its harder to open the chest unnoticed.
* Night Elf food vendors have changed their supplies slightly.
* Chests in Maraudon have been disabled for good.
* In Wetlands, Bluegill Murlocs will now be more plentiful and several other Bluegill camps have been thinned.
* All mount sounds, when standing still and pressing spacebar are now all in place.
* Tauren males now use their off-hand attacks animation.
* The Zeppelin's propeller from Under City should now animate properly.
* Flight Paths
o New flight paths added between Ironforge and Chillwind Point. Also, between Chillwind Point and Light's Hope Chapel.
o Fixed a problem with the flight paths between The Crossroads in The Barrens and Zoram'gar Outpost in Ashenvale.
o Fixed the flight over Yojamba Isle from Booty Bay in Stranglethorn to Sentinel Hill in Westfall.

Bug Fixes

* Fixed a bug that caused Crimson Templar to be doing much more damage with it's fireball attack than intended.
* Fixed a bug that could cause Guard Slip'kik to move while trapped in ice.
* Fixed a bug that caused Azure Templar, Earthen Templar, and Hoary Templar to be resistant to Fire.
* Fixed a bug that would cause Time Lapse to cause hate reduction even if the target resisted the effect.
* Fixed a bug that allowed pets to be targeted by "Wild Polymorph" during the Nefarian encounter.

[mecca]

Rogues get no changes and remain nerfed. GGWP Blizz.

[The Author]

Rogues get no changes and remain nerfed. GGWP Blizz.

Minor but important buff to rogues... the changing in classification of certain debuffs means that diminishing returns will be less annoying, like the mace spec/cheapshot overlap which was kinda annoying.

[piccskick06]

Rogues get no changes and remain nerfed. GGWP Blizz.

Maybe because in Battlegrounds, a rogue beats everyone in there even if they're 4/5 levels below a magic user (ie priests, warlocks, mages).

[Skilless]

Everytime a patch comes out for me, it says Im behind a damn firewall when I dont have one. The patches go extremely slow. 2 episodes of ATHF down and Im at 3%.