Super Smash Bros. Brawl

[TheCatPhysician]

Man, I've just read some of the past few pages and, I've got to say, I really am sad to hear so many of you guys arguing about how to play Smash and what is or isn't fun.

I got to the Digipen Institute of Technology in Redmond, WA. About 850 gamers (a good portion of which consider themselves "hardcore") under one roof. You wanna talk competitive? MLG has nothing on these people; they play for money, while some of these guys play for limbs.

Every Friday some of the Seniors host Smash Club, where, as I'm sure you can guess, people get together to play Melee. About 35 - 40 people every week cram into a small classroom made to hold about 25 people, just to play Smash. You wanna know how they play?

Every way conceivable.

The casual guys play all sorts of crazy themed matches. The hardcore competitive players play no items on a few select stages. We make up event matches and time each other. We play in no specific way. Whatever floats our boats at the time, that's how we play.

There is NO right way to play Smash; that's not how the game was made.

You wanna know the truth? When it comes to pure skill, if you REALLY want to find out who is the most skilled at their character, you CAN'T have items on, because items interfere with your display of mastery of a character's moveset and how well you can utilize those moves to counter any other player.

You want to have fun? Play any way you want. Items are there to make things chaotic. That's their function. Not to make the fighting engine any deeper, not to provide complements to fighting styles; they exist for pure randomness.

That's it. End of story.

--Jack Kieser

It is funny how people keep on seeing that there was an argument about items, then think they are bringing something new to the table with "there is no right way to play the game" when that's EXACTLY what I've been saying the whole time. I had to reiterate the point a million times just for it to get acknowledged by like one person.

I'm glad that you agree with me though; it's just dumb that you assume that everyone in the argument was trying to say that their way is the only way to play. That was Atmuh. I argued AGAINST that.

[Wolfstan]

lol you guys are pretty funny.





No, really.

[FuriousFure]

so guys what do you think of this idea? (taken from the wii thread)

"now thats an interesting idea... having your mii as a unlockable character in SSBB. like they all would have the same attacks across all consoles. it would just look like your mii."

i mean maybe there could be different attack sets just on how tall you have made you mii.

[Theory of Nonexistence]

so guys what do you think of this idea? (taken from the wii thread)

"now thats an interesting idea... having your mii as a unlockable character in SSBB. like they all would have the same attacks across all consoles. it would just look like your mii."

i mean maybe there could be different attack sets just on how tall you have made you mii.

That would be sweet! Seeing me kicking the shit out of Samus or Link.

[chrono26]

i like the idea of having random miis pop out of item boxes so you can pick em up and beat the spit out of the other players with em. or throw em across the level.

[G_D]

Soren? FREAKING YES! A mage would be sweet.

http://www.fireemblemempire.com/media/gallery/albums/uploads/artwork/fe9/normal_soren.jpg

I still would like to see Ephraim from FE: Sacred Stones, or Hector from the first one. If we're going for people with weapons, let's diversify a little, 'k?

EDIT: Where the heck was I *just* reading a list of characters??? I'm so lost...

EDIT 2: Ah, somehow I wound up way back on page 44. Does anyone else have this problem where if you click on "Last Page" to get into a thread, it takes you to the middle page, while showing that you are on the last page, and then shows that there are more pages than there really are? (to clarify, when I came into this thread today it showed the content from page 44, it showed that I was presently on page 88, and it showed that the last page was numbered over a hundred)

[linkspast]

Hey the title changed.

[Pi_R_[]ed]

So, as to bump this thread, might I bring up a request? Lets get back to characters we want to see, or something like that.

Diddy Kong - With Peanut Gun (and Jetpack?). Hate to see him as a DK clone.

Bomberman - With a history full of nintendo games, I can't see why not. Bombs away, and so on, and so forth...

Jack - Not everyone will get this one. Harvest Moon. Another series with a Nintendo-laden back-catalog. I mean, C'mon, he's got pickaxes, hammers, scythes...

Krystal - From Starfox, with her magic staff.

Megaman - As long as he isn't a Samus clone, I'll be satisfied.

Crono - I can only pray

Banjo-Kazooie - I can only pray harder


... I've got a few more I can't remember right now. Thoughts? Who do you want to see?


On another note, it's been months. Does anyone know what they're saying in "A Main Theme With Emotion" yet? It's latin, so we would just need someone to translate ...right?

[Theory of Nonexistence]

Aiai from Super Monkey Ball would be interesting. (I think that's his name...)

Lizzie, George, or Ralph from Rampage.

Would Joanna Dark from Perfect Dark be qualified?

Another idea I had that probably wouldn't work but would be very interesting: Slime from the Dragon Warrior series. I dunno even know if that would be qualifiable but seeing as DW started out on Nintendo I figured it would be worth mentioning.

[Pi_R_[]ed]

Another idea I had that probably wouldn't work but would be very interesting: Slime from the Dragon Warrior series. I dunno even know if that would be qualifiable but seeing as DW started out on Nintendo I figured it would be worth mentioning.

I could see it as a trophy, if they're even still doing that...

[Theory of Nonexistence]

gawd, I can't wait for this game...is there a release date yet? or release date FOR the release date? T.T

[FuriousFure]

B.o.B. from the SNES game with the same name
(he's perfect b/c he's got a smash attack and super power ups. and up-B move simular to game & watches up-B in ssbm.)

Crono would be sweet. fo' sho

Mii's either in item form or major playable character

Paper Mario or Pixelated Mario

Captian Omar and his legion of Pikmon

Ash Katchum who would act like Peaches turnip attacks but only throw pokeballs. Except he would only have 6 in keeping with the games

got some more but im outta time.
whatcha think?

[chrono26]

Orpheus from battle of olympus as long as he's not a pit clone. billy cohen from resident evil zero, pico from f-zero, maybe ridley or a cool space pirate to get some more metroid charecters in there, and....poo! from earthbound....idk this game just needs come out already.

[Mr.Roboto]

As much as I doubt it,some Metal Slug characters would be awesome.I mean all they have to do is do exactly what they did with Snake,take away any actual fire arms and simply replace them with explosive weapons.(Rocket Launcher,Grenades,Iron Lizard,Etc.)

Perhaps I hope too much..but boy,that would be a literal fuckton of awesome.

[Penfold]

Another idea I had that probably wouldn't work but would be very interesting: Slime from the Dragon Warrior series. I dunno even know if that would be qualifiable but seeing as DW started out on Nintendo I figured it would be worth mentioning.

If Square-Enix and Nintendo work out some IP sharing for Smash Bros, a slime would be a cool addition in whatever capacity, especially given the recent Dragon Quest Heroes: Rocket Slime game for DS.

Anyway, my wiishlist (sorry, had to say it) of added characters would probably be:

-Crono

-Capt. Olimar

-A metroid as an item

-Titania, Ike, Soren, any Laguz, or any one cool character from Fire Emblem: Path of Raiance (Sothe is supposed to be pretty hardcore in the new one, so I guess he wouldn't be a bad choice).

-A character from Advance Wars, especially from Dual Strike (dunno who, since there doesn't seem to be that one, particularly iconic character)

-Elebits as an item

-A Chocobo as an item

-Maybe either Simon Belmont from Castlevania or Jonathon or...whatever the girl's name is from Castlevania: Portrait of Ruin.

Having Capt. Olimar seems somewhat possible, same with maybe a FE:PoR character, but I doubt the rest of my list (fun to dream though).

[Azul v2]

As little anime as possible, please. Some of us don't like anime and don't want to see a plethora of anime characters in the game.

[Penfold]

As little anime as possible, please. Some of us don't like anime and don't want to see a plethora of anime characters in the game.

Who said anything about anime?

[Red Shadow]

Captian Omar and his legion of Pikmin


yes .

[Geoffrey Taucer]

wishlist:
-Marina
-Olimar
-Crono
-Locke
-Terra
-Anybody from Earthbound
-NOBODY FROM FF7, GOD DAMNIT. IF CLOUD EVER SHOWS UP IN A SMASH BROS GAME, I WILL THROW A FUCKING TANTRUM

[Jabberbox]

If Square-Enix and Nintendo work out some IP sharing for Smash Bros, a slime would be a cool addition in whatever capacity, especially given the recent Dragon Quest Heroes: Rocket Slime game for DS.

Anyway, my wiishlist (sorry, had to say it) of added characters would probably be:

-Crono

-Capt. Olimar

-A metroid as an item

-Titania, Ike, Soren, any Laguz, or any one cool character from Fire Emblem: Path of Raiance (Sothe is supposed to be pretty hardcore in the new one, so I guess he wouldn't be a bad choice).

-A character from Advance Wars, especially from Dual Strike (dunno who, since there doesn't seem to be that one, particularly iconic character)

-Elebits as an item

-A Chocobo as an item

-Maybe either Simon Belmont from Castlevania or Jonathon or...whatever the girl's name is from Castlevania: Portrait of Ruin.

Having Capt. Olimar seems somewhat possible, same with maybe a FE:PoR character, but I doubt the rest of my list (fun to dream though).

we all know that chrono in a smash bros would be godly, but what would you do if you pass a screen, and see chrono fighting... sephiroth.
(at least I would cry in jou, just the thought of such a thing existing)

[ILLiterate]

I'd love to see Bionic Commando (already perfect with the extending arm), the ExciteBike dude (he could have a weird mechanic where he can make jumps pop up out of no where and other crazy stuff) and a mix of every shoto with Ryu as the main one (color swap would give you the ability to be Ken, Akuma, Dan and dare I say...Sean?)

[BigBoss]

Lucas from Mother 3.

He was actually supposed to replace Ness in Melee, but the delay and indefinite postpoing of the American release changed that.

[KP9000]

-NOBODY FROM FF7, GOD DAMNIT. IF CLOUD EVER SHOWS UP IN A SMASH BROS GAME, I WILL THROW A FUCKING TANTRUM

This I gotta see. Cloud, Tifa, and Aerith on the wagon, please.

Anyways... Yeah, I'd like to see these:

Anybody from Golden Sun (GBA)
Beatrix from FFIX (Fat Chance)
And anyone from FFVII. *waits for tantrum*

[Brithor]

-NOBODY FROM FF7, GOD DAMNIT. IF CLOUD EVER SHOWS UP IN A SMASH BROS GAME, I WILL THROW A FUCKING TANTRUM

Well I wouldn't like ANY Final Fantasy character in the game, there are plenty of better characters to choose from.

[Paratha]

Any of these would make a truly EPIC game:

Phoenix Wright
The King of All Cosmos
GENO
The Postman from Majora's Mask
Magikoopa

Not that I expect to see any of these. BTW I heard that Cheese Weapon is a secret character. Well, until now, that is...

[atmuh]

all they need is Mr. Resetti

[Escariot]

No character wishlist...


A lot of people at my school hate items. I'm fine either way, but I think that items add a lot of fun to the game.
I've always played SSBM (multiplayer, at least) with no items on FD... Makes for an even and level playing ground for everyone... Sure, the level gets old sometimes, but my friends and I stay relatively competitive...

[FuriousFure]

let sleeping dogs lie. no more item talk!

Begone foul one!

[KWarp]

Played Smash Melee in anime club yesterday and in free block today. That game never gets old with new people.:mrgreen:

Brawl character wishlists = stupid

[atmuh]

Played Smash Melee in anime club yesterday and in free block today. That game never gets old with new people.:mrgreen:

Brawl character wishlists = stupid

not if they include Mr Resetti

[Penfold]

Brawl character wishlists = stupid

lol, nothin' wrong with wishing, Mr. Wii rumor guy :-P.

Btw, not familiar with a Mr. Resetti; what game?

[Azul v2]

Who said anything about anime?

Um, pretty much any Final Fantasy character mentioned within the last 40 pages. Those = anime. Also characters from other similar RPG games. No thanks.

I second the Magikoopa. That would be awesome.

[Toadofsky]

I've played against and as Magikoopa in MUGEN, I'll only say, WOW. He can kick the tar out of anyone...

[linkspast]

lol, nothin' wrong with wishing, Mr. Wii rumor guy :-P.

Btw, not familiar with a Mr. Resetti; what game?

I think he was the Gopher thing in Animal Crossing... If you tried to reset w/o saving he would yell at you. I think.

[Penfold]

Um, pretty much any Final Fantasy character mentioned within the last 40 pages. Those = anime. Also characters from other similar RPG games. No thanks.

I second the Magikoopa. That would be awesome.

lol, so are you annoyed at Roy and Marth being in the game? Their character designs, by your definition, are sure as hell "anime." Hell, I could argue so is Mario or pretty much any other character in Smash Bros already. Point is, the term "anime" is a damn broad one. If you're just saying you don't want JRPG characters in it, then I'd suggest saying that instead of using a term that doesn't apply itself well to the opinion you're trying to state (then again, maybe you like Smash Bros but hate the character designs, which is valid I guess...to each his own). Anyway, you're welcome to your opinions, but I'd suggest a clearer way to say it.

EDIT: I think he was the Gopher thing in Animal Crossing... If you tried to reset w/o saving he would yell at you. I think.

Cool. I always kinda wanted to play those games, but never really got around to them. Thinkin' I'll get Animal Crossing for Wii whenever that comes out.

[G_D]

You know, if we're going to go back to this list-making of desired characters, we may as well try to do it with some sort of organization. This list is from earlier in the thread. Add to it, instead of creating your own lists. If this list continues to be used, I'll add games for each character later (or someone else can, I don't care).


Black Knight
Bowser
Baby Bowser
Captain Falcon
Crono
DeDeDe
Donkey Kong
Dr. Mario
Ephraim
Falco
Fox
Ganondorf/Aghanim
Hector
Ice Climbers
Ike
Jigglypuff
Kalas
Kirby
Link
Luigi
Lyn
Mario
Marth
Metaknight
Mewtwo
Mr. Game & Watch
Ness
Lord Pent
Pichu
Pikachu
Pit
Princess Peach
Ridley
Roy
Samus/zero Suit Samus
Snake
Sonic
Young Link
Wario
WW Link
Zelda/Sheik

Count: 41 Characters

Key:
Black are characters from SSBM.
Blue are known 1st/2nd party additions.
Red are known 3rd party additions.
Green are 1st/2nd party suggestions.
Orange are 3rd party suggestions.

[atmuh]

I think he was the Gopher thing in Animal Crossing... If you tried to reset w/o saving he would yell at you. I think.

heck yes he was
reset without saving and BOOM this dude starts yelling at you
and the more you do it the longer the rant lasts

[Ray Falling]

What's interesting is how some of you pick the most impossible characters to be in the game.
Sure it's all fine and well if you liked the character of a particular game, but characters like those of FF6/7 don't belong in a Smash Bros. game. No matter how you look at it.

The characters should be Nintendo ICONS, 3rd party people are lucky to even be there.
Other suggestions like characters from the Cube FE are just silly. I love the game to death but none of the characters have had enough history to build up a solid fanbase and are not universaly recognized.
Roy and Marth have some of that, but probably the most in Japan. I'd say we're lucky to have a European version of Smash at all, I don't think any of us knew Roy and Marth unless they imported back in the day.

Also, Magikoopa? It's not even a unique character, it's just one more of another, like Goombas.
If yer gonna say Magikoopa, at least say whats-her-name, the hag from Paper Mario, Kammy Koopa? She has character, but she's just not right for the game fighting style wise.

It's not about which character or which game you like, it's about who is universaly recognized and who translates well into the Smash mechanics.

[Azul v2]

lol, so are you annoyed at Roy and Marth being in the game? Their character designs, by your definition, are sure as hell "anime." Hell, I could argue so is Mario or pretty much any other character in Smash Bros already. Point is, the term "anime" is a damn broad one. If you're just saying you don't want JRPG characters in it, then I'd suggest saying that instead of using a term that doesn't apply itself well to the opinion you're trying to state (then again, maybe you like Smash Bros but hate the character designs, which is valid I guess...to each his own). Anyway, you're welcome to your opinions, but I'd suggest a clearer way to say it.

Yes actually. I hated the people who always played Roy/Marth. Sorry that you are so offended by someone who dislikes anime. Fine, JRPG, if thats what you want. No Roy or Marth. No generic RPG fighters (that probably means no beloved Crono as well).

[Penfold]

Yes actually. I hated the people who always played Roy/Marth. Sorry that you are so offended by someone who dislikes anime. Fine, JRPG, if thats what you want. No Roy or Marth. No generic RPG fighters (that probably means no beloved Crono as well).
I'm not offended that you dislike anime, I just see it as an odd blanket statement. I study film, so I may well have a different perspective on visual arts as you, but I've enjoyed every Studio Ghibli film I've seen (each is quite literally a great piece of art, in my humble opinion) and these films are clumped into the same category as the more generic, unoriginal Japanese animation by the broader term "anime." What I'm saying is often times worthy works are written off by "anime haters," and the opposite can be said for "anime lovers" (just assuming some generic show is great because it's "anime omg!!!!!11"); I think both cases are unfortunate because they are both cases of people having such strong predetermined opinions about something. Many "anime haters" I've known have often come to that notion that "anime sux" because they simply don't care for the people who devoutly love anime. Anyway, I find it unfortunate for someone to stop themselves from appreciating anything from a certain medium because of stereotypes or implications it carries with it. My final thought on it is "anime," just as much as any other worthy storytelling medium, carries with it its own benefits and pitfalls, and there isn't any one piece that is representative of what that medium has to offer.

Anyway, like I said, you're welcome to your opinions; it doesn't affect me what you think or believe, so how could it offend me?

[Theory of Nonexistence]

What's interesting is how some of you pick the most impossible characters to be in the game...

It's not about which character or which game you like, it's about who is universaly recognized and who translates well into the Smash mechanics.


Mr. Game and Watch.

A lot of people didn't know he existed until Melee came out and those who did probably would've never thought he would fit into a game like Smash Bros. Of course, he still sucks, but still.

Also, the Ice Climbers. More widely known than Mr. Game and Watch, but before Melee, less probable to hold their own up against, say, Link. There are ways to make anything kick ass.

Other suggestions like characters from the Cube FE are just silly. I love the game to death but none of the characters have had enough history to build up a solid fanbase and are not universaly recognized.

No suggestions are silly. We're not talking about who we think will be in the game. We're talking about who we want to see in the game. Whether it would work or not, it would still be pretty cool to see Mr. Resseti using a rant attack(similar to Jigglypuff's singing) and smashing everyone with his lethal pickaxe or the Postman from Majora's Mask speeding across the stage and throwing razor-sharp letters, making his opponents suffer from excruciating papercuts.

There are ways to make any character fight, whether it's legitimately kicking ass or comically causing pain and suffering. Basically like w/ Pichu. It's incredibly hard, at first, to win a match with Pichu, but once you get good w/ him/her, it's easy. Same could go for any other character we think up.

What I'm trying to say is, there's no such thing as a silly idea/suggestion. :)

[linkspast]

What I'm trying to say is, there's no such thing as a silly idea/suggestion. :)
the dot from pong.

[Red Shadow]

Mr. Game and Watch... he still sucks, but still.
this is fallacy

[dsx100]

I think we should focus on considering new characters that actaually have a chance at being in the game. I know so many of you guys want people that have no chance in hell of being in the game and I know it is just wishing but why even bother if it is guaranteed they won't be in the game. The creators already said any 3rd party character had to appear on a nintendo console at some point in time just to be considered. So this wishing for Final Fantasy VII characters is not going to happen and is completely stupid in my opinion. In fact I dislike the adding of 3rd party characters to begin with. This is suppose to be a Nintendo brawler.
Also the creators said the total amount of 3rd party cahracters in the game would only amount to 3 -1 including Snake. I will bet $100 that Sonic will be that second 3rd party character. It is so obvious because: 1. He was the most voted character on the official Smash Bros. forums, 2. Both Nintendo, Sega, and the Sonic Team expressed much intrest in Sonic being part of the game, 3. Sonic is an iconic character so he fits well into the game, 4. There have been many sonic games that came out on Nintendo consoles including many exclusives. So I think it is a given Sonic will be in the game but that is just my opinion.

[Oddllama]

I'm pushing for Plok.

[Broken]

this is fallacy

Quoted For ten char limit...I mean emphasis.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV0iHGXQgiY

[Oddllama]

COME OOOOOOON PLOK!!

[The Mutericator]

Yes actually. I hated the people who always played Roy/Marth. Sorry that you are so offended by someone who dislikes anime. Fine, JRPG, if thats what you want. No Roy or Marth. No generic RPG fighters (that probably means no beloved Crono as well).

Saying all anime sucks is like saying all movies suck - there's such a huge variety that you can't possibly hate all of it, unless you hate it for a really stupid reason (I.E. it's animated).

Seriously, that's sort of... pointless. I'll say I love anime, but I by no means love all anime (there are many I simply refuse to watch because of the few scenes of them I have seen and what I have heard about them). You, though, seem to honestly hate all anime which... as I said, is kinda pointless.

Also, I wholeheartedly agree with making a list of characters that actually have a chance of making it in (I.E. not from Final Fantasy). I would personally like to see Ganondorf in his Twilight Princess styling and one of the Hunters from MP: Hunters.

[Fire in the Hole]

What I'm trying to say is, there's no such thing as a silly idea/suggestion. :)

You're one of those buffoons who believes there's no such thing as a stupid question, aren't you?

I'll give you case in point: Master Chief.

[Thalzon]

It of course would never happen, but you can't possibly say that would not kick major ass. ;)

[BigBoss]

It of course would never happen, but you can't possibly say that would not suck major ass. ;)


fixed for great justice

[Thalzon]

OH GOD NOT A DIFFERING OPINION WHATEVER WILL I DOOOOOOo

[Fire in the Hole]

OH GOD NOT A DIFFERING OPINION WHATEVER WILL I DOOOOOOo

Kill yourself.

Please?

[BigBoss]

i was just kididng thalzon please dont hate me forever lawlawlalow

[Thalzon]

the last o was to allow the rest of the message to be in caps

Also *hugs* best friends 4evah

[HideousBeing]

how cool would Little Mac be?
I also second that postman from the zelda series -he would be great!:mrgreen:

[Antipode]

They're just starting to branch out - Snake is evidence of that. Do you think any Smash game in the future will ever be a GAME fighter instead of a Nintnendo fighter - characters licensed from many different franchises, different companies, all brought together in a game like this?
It's probably been suggested and shot down by lots of people in this thread, but just think about it. The idea of Nintendo franchises meeting together and fighting is an awesome idea alone - but there are so many more that they could include. For the sake of being realistic, they could oust many of the non-important Nintendo characters and replace them with some from other companies. I get the feeling that once Brawl comes out, it will still be awesome, but the idea will be somewhat stale. How many times can you just slightly edit the same characters for rerelease? (Don't get me wrong, I think Brawl will be incredible - it's just that an idea like this could totally breathe new life into it.) I think something like this could be a lot of fun for the game industry in general - every star character, licensed and included in a totally ridiculous fighting game. Who knows, could bring certain companies closer together.

Now for an actual realistic idea, as the above is likely never going to happen - it was just an idea I had bouncing around. In Brawl, I really hope they revamp the costume system. This has also probably been mentioned, but again, I don't really keep up with this thread. Instead of color-switching, I want to actually be able to change the costume my character is wearing - go from Biker, Wario Ware style Wario to yellow and purple Badass Wario. Change from TP link to cel-shaded link. Something like that. If they wanted to go all out, they could totally scrap the idea of clone characters and instead incorporate them into the costume idea - have each costume play SLIGHTLY differently. Switch from Mario to Dr. Mario to Sunshine Mario (with a FLUDD to use, of course) as a COSTUME, or for any of the Pokemon characters, each costume could be a different evolution of that character. Things like that. No clone characters and way more customization! Maybe even have a minor character editor screen to include in some way to outfit your fighters with different accessories, or maybe change colors there, so on. The less times two people fight using EXACTLY the same character, the better. Would be nice to have some personalization.

On a totally random note, it would be cool to have both Samurai Goroh and Waluigi in Brawl. That aside, I need a Wii really badly.

[HideousBeing]

I really hope that they don't implement the motion sensing techniques of the wii controller into the game. it would make real strategic playing kind of tacky. I wish this game would also be released for the gamecube.

Also, is SSBM supposed to be released this year?

[nohero]

I really hope that they don't implement the motion sensing techniques of the wii controller into the game. it would make real strategic playing kind of tacky. I wish this game would also be released for the gamecube.

Also, is SSBM supposed to be released this year?

Last I checked, SSBB is set to use Gamecube controllers instead of the Wiimote.



Also, Magikoopa? It's not even a unique character, it's just one more of another, like Goombas.
If yer gonna say Magikoopa, at least say whats-her-name, the hag from Paper Mario, Kammy Koopa? She has character, but she's just not right for the game fighting style wise.


Uhhh, Magikoopa WAS a unique character. Yes, it was the generic name for a set of enemies, but it was also the name of the antagonist in the Yoshi's Island games.

[SoloGamer]

Uhhh, Magikoopa WAS a unique character. Yes, it was the generic name for a set of enemies, but it was also the name of the antagonist in the Yoshi's Island games.
His name was Kamek (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamek), actually

[nohero]

His name was Kamek (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamek), actually

Oh yeah.
Damn, a fuckup like that really means I need to get some sleep.
Either way, I think he'd make a nice addition to SSBB.

[FuriousFure]

They've stated that its going be using a normal control scheme. Yeah this year.

Obscure characters are cool, first it's hilarious to beat someone with Mr. Game & Watch and his key and turtle and sausages. Secondly, it lets people know about Nintendo's past.

You guys haven't forgotten about all thoses gameboy pocket and color Game & Watch Gallery games, have you? granted they starred mario but you could change the visuals to back the the original look. Not as obscure as one might think.

Lists? how bout lists of what we don't need.

No MORE:

pokemon, enough is enough. no more playable characters

Moves options, complexity can get bad

More items, change some of them but keep the over all number of them that same

[KWarp]

Yeah let's throw in Cave Story characters while we're at it. :banghead:

I'll go out on a limb and predict Brawl will implement neato motion controls. Sakurai has had a lot of time to experiment and I would a useful control scheme. I doubt it would outright replace Melee's system, but rather add to it. New move sets, move combinations with buttons and swipes and the like. If I were Sakurai I would definitely experiment with those ideas.

[mattycat900]

doubt it.

More of everything with some changes to the basic formula will automatically make the game god in my oppinion

[HideousBeing]

They've stated that its going be using a normal control scheme. Yeah this year.

Obscure characters are cool, first it's hilarious to beat someone with Mr. Game & Watch and his key and turtle and sausages. Secondly, it lets people know about Nintendo's past.

You guys haven't forgotten about all thoses gameboy pocket and color Game & Watch Gallery games, have you? granted they starred mario but you could change the visuals to back the the original look. Not as obscure as one might think.

Lists? how bout lists of what we don't need.

No MORE:

pokemon, enough is enough. no more playable characters

Moves options, complexity can get bad

More items, change some of them but keep the over all number of them that same
We already know that there will now be crawling (being able to duck and move) and it looks like they're adding specials for each character. The specials look to be stimulated by some sort of item though, if you've seen the original teaser. Maybe this means you will be able to turn specials off?

[chrono26]

I'll go out on a limb and predict Brawl will implement neato motion controls. Sakurai has had a lot of time to experiment and I would a useful control scheme. I doubt it would outright replace Melee's system, but rather add to it. New move sets, move combinations with buttons and swipes and the like. If I were Sakurai I would definitely experiment with those ideas.

it's been stated that because of the fast pace of the game, motion controls will be unlikey. i hope that if they do decide to use the wii remote the controls wont be overwhelming and take away from the game expirience.

[bouncerboy15]

it's been stated that because of the fast pace of the game, motion controls will be unlikey. i hope that if they do decide to use the wii remote the controls wont be overwhelming and take away from the game expirience.
I'm pretty sure there WILL be use of the Wii-remote for playing, since it's required for every Wii game released. I don't think Nintendo should force new Smash players to buy GameCube controllers.

[BigBoss]

At the very least, they'll use the classic controller. Logic dictates that using the Wii Remote by itself, given what has been stated and the controls of the game itself, is impossible.

[chrono26]

I don't think Nintendo should force new Smash players to buy GameCube controllers.

classic controller

[Paratha]

What'd I'd really like to see in the game, more than new characters, levels, items, or even updated graphics, is a more balanced system. For example, being a Link player, it's annoying to get screwed by Sheik over and over again (a person who wrote up a Link guide on Smash Boards puts the matchup as 8-2). As much as I like the King of All Cosmos, this is really what I want to see. While the effects of imbalances diminish a little at higher, tournament play levels, at n00b levels (which, frankly, most players are at, including myself), these imbalances are frustrating.

Also, thanks for reminding me about Kamek. I was indeed referring to that specific Magikoopa, though it's been a while since I've played Yoshi's Island, so I forgot the name.

[Maco70]

Kill yourself.

Please?

STFU n00b.

[HideousBeing]

Heh, don't be so quick to underestimate link when against shiek. A good player as link can effectively harrass shiek with his long range attacks. bombs can be really helpful -when link is holding a bomb, shiek has a much harder time pulling off the dash attack- the bomb will stop shiek right away if he is hit when charging. Also, air dodges in a strategic direction, followed by a hookshot air attack are effective against shiek. Consider also, that link's spin attack responds quicker than many of shiek's attack's.
Just trying to help with a few suggestions.

Also, link is fortunate to have a shield that can block against shiek's needle storm when standing or crouching.

[FuriousFure]

What'd I'd really like to see in the game, more than new characters, levels, items, or even update graphics, is a more balanced system. For example, being a Link player, it's annoying to get screwed by Sheik over and over again (a person who wrote up a Link guide on Smash Boards puts the matchup as 8-2). As much as I like the King of All Cosmos, this is really what I want to see. While the effects of imbalances diminish a little at higher, tournament play levels, at n00b levels (which, frankly, most players are at, including myself), these imbalances are frustrating.

Well, first of all, I would agree that some imbalances are annoying. (marth and roy and their GATDANG ledge hogging move *over A* erg) but When you start balancing Characters too far in a game they all seem like the same character. i want the characters to be as unique as possible. (same with their usefulness with certain weapons, its all about knowing the characters and deciding which is right for you and foregoing some stuff to get other good stuff. which is why items are not needed to be removed to make the game balanced or "fair"

It's all about choosing a character and wheighing their pros and cons. My fav is Link, a little slow but pretty heavy for the speed he does have. His stab the ground and up B on land are his two best moves. But lets say sheik is amazing at beating link off... the stage. you should learn other characters to combat shiek. lets say Ganondorf, go learn his awesome move selection and next time you play a shiek, pick Ganondorf to whoop their ass because they thought you'd pick Link.

[Paratha]

I think it's possible to balance a game while retaining the uniqueness of each character. Case in point (working off of my limited experience with fighters): Guilty Gear. Each character is vastly different than the others, yet the game is considered to be one of the more balanced fighters out there.

[HideousBeing]

Ever considered that Rayman might be a third-party character included? He is supported by Nintendo on the Wii...
To add an idea, Foreman Spike from Wrecking Crew would be a cool character.

[King Matt I]

Well, first of all, I would agree that some imbalances are annoying. (marth and roy and their GATDANG ledge hogging move *over A* erg) but When you start balancing Characters too far in a game they all seem like the same character. i want the characters to be as unique as possible. (same with their usefulness with certain weapons, its all about knowing the characters and deciding which is right for you and foregoing some stuff to get other good stuff. which is why items are not needed to be removed to make the game balanced or "fair"

It's all about choosing a character and wheighing their pros and cons. My fav is Link, a little slow but pretty heavy for the speed he does have. His stab the ground and up B on land are his two best moves. But lets say sheik is amazing at beating link off... the stage. you should learn other characters to combat shiek. lets say Ganondorf, go learn his awesome move selection and next time you play a shiek, pick Ganondorf to whoop their ass because they thought you'd pick Link.

Ah, so THAT'S why Link always tries so hard to save her.

[chrono26]

To add an idea, Foreman Spike from Wrecking Crew would be a cool character.

hahaha that would be sooo awesome. that SoB. and there should be a wrecking crew level too.

[ILLiterate]

It's all about choosing a character and wheighing their pros and cons. My fav is Link, a little slow but pretty heavy for the speed he does have. His stab the ground and up B on land are his two best moves. But lets say sheik is amazing at beating link off... the stage. you should learn other characters to combat shiek. lets say Ganondorf, go learn his awesome move selection and next time you play a shiek, pick Ganondorf to whoop their ass because they thought you'd pick Link....that will not work, Ganondorf's recovery is obviously WORSE than Links unless you recover OVER them, which Sheik can just hit you back off the stage. Just picking a different character than you normally do won't help you either, no one is going to go "oh no he normally plays as Doc and now he's playing as Fox, I'm completely flabbergasted and I will instantly lose from the confusion that they're two different characters."

Basic point, that won't work. You have to check out your situation and exploit weaknesses. Some characters have less weaknesses. They are top tier.

In all seriousness, if you go up to someone who's actually GOOD in Smash, and you tell them that your main is Link, they will INSTANTLY think "noob". Link is always played by all the newbie kids. I have no idea why, he just is. I've never lost a money match against a Link because they aren't good enough to handle a Falco or Sheik or even a Doc. I haven't seen more good Links then I can count off the fingers of my hands. It's possible to be good with him, but it's hard, and if you ever play in tournaments you have A LOT more to deal with than a Fox or Marth.

[HideousBeing]

In all seriousness, if you go up to someone who's actually GOOD in Smash, and you tell them that your main is Link, they will INSTANTLY think "noob". Link is always played by all the newbie kids. I have no idea why, he just is.

I think it's because they use his spin attack as a real crutch. Ever listen to a "spin attack-trigger happy" noob play? You just keep hearing that sound over and over again. "Sss-yer-ahhhh!"
Sorry that sound is kinda hard to type.:???:

[Solid Krono]

Ah, so THAT'S why Link always tries so hard to save her.

I have to admit, I found that funny. Good eye sir.

[HideousBeing]

Can anyone give me a list (preferably in table format) that describes each of peach's veggies and the effectiveness of each?

[Flare4War]

Link can be formidable against any of the other characters. As someone before mentioned, noobs who over use his spin attack will get owned consistently. They under estimate is ability to kick in the air as effectively as Fox or Falco though he doesn't have the speed or height to his jump. Generally people don't realize how quick his ending blow attack is. If you know how to time it so his sword doesn't stick in the ground it's tremendously fast and versatile. Someone who understands links combo rhythm can compete with the best of them no problem.

Just keep at him. He owns.

[atmuh]

Can anyone give me a list (preferably in table format) that describes each of peach's veggies and the effectiveness of each?

www.google.com

www.gamefaqs.com

[FuriousFure]

...that will not work, Ganondorf's recovery is obviously WORSE than Links unless you recover OVER them, which Sheik can just hit you back off the stage. Just picking a different character than you normally do won't help you either, no one is going to go "oh no he normally plays as Doc and now he's playing as Fox, I'm completely flabbergasted and I will instantly lose from the confusion that they're two different characters."

Basic point, that won't work. You have to check out your situation and exploit weaknesses. Some characters have less weaknesses. They are top tier.

In all seriousness, if you go up to someone who's actually GOOD in Smash, and you tell them that your main is Link, they will INSTANTLY think "noob". Link is always played by all the newbie kids. I have no idea why, he just is. I've never lost a money match against a Link because they aren't good enough to handle a Falco or Sheik or even a Doc. I haven't seen more good Links then I can count off the fingers of my hands. It's possible to be good with him, but it's hard, and if you ever play in tournaments you have A LOT more to deal with than a Fox or Marth.


So you didn't like my hypothetical, huh? oh well, I tried. I was going for theme, you know. But I play a mean ganondorf and could probably be a shiek at same skill level. and Double Props for ignoring my first part of the sentence, completely misunderstanding the second part and then repeating the first idea in your rebuttle. you're the man now, dog


Anyhoo, the moral of my story was to get good at a few characters, mix thing up and the like. That way, if you run into a character that preys on your characters weaknesses you can easily switch to a different character THAT PLAYS DIFFERENTLY so that when they try to exploit those weaknesses, they might not be there to exploit.

[dsx100]

I to hate spin-attack abusing noobs. Link is my second best character (Kirby the first and C.Falcon the third) and I always own my little cousins with him. The first thing they think is that he is good and that will probably have a chance at winning with him. The first thing they do is abuse the spin-attack. They don't get that it is so easy to avoid and counter. However I do know this one guy that plays a real mean Link. He is constently using projectiles to keep you away until he decides to attack you. he utilizes the sheild a lot to. I can still beat him with Kirby on some occasions though.

[Broken]

Can anyone give me a list (preferably in table format) that describes each of peach's veggies and the effectiveness of each?

Try smashboards. Turnip guide (http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=79319)

[ILLiterate]

Anyhoo, the moral of my story was to get good at a few characters, mix thing up and the like. That way, if you run into a character that preys on your characters weaknesses you can easily switch to a different character THAT PLAYS DIFFERENTLY so that when they try to exploit those weaknesses, they might not be there to exploit.No need to get good with more than one character. If you're good with one of the space animals, you don't need to play with another character, they're so god damn good. Sure it helps to play with other people, but if you focus on one dude you'll be fantastic with him, other than being ok with two characters. If you're really good at the game you should know the weaknesses of the higher tier characters. (Also no matter what you said before, you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong, think of a better example next time)

I do know this one guy that plays a real mean Link. He is constently using projectiles to keep you away until he decides to attack you. he utilizes the sheild a lot to. I can still beat him with Kirby on some occasions though.
No matter how good he is with Link, what I'm trying to say is, he has SO MUCH MORE TO COMPENSATE FOR THAN A FOX PLAYER. Even with items it's hard for Link to deal high damage with most attacks, and not too many kill moves. Pretty much all of Fox's smash attacks can kill you when you're over or at 80%, not to mention most of his air attacks, and the attacks that don't easily set you up for being hit by a killing smash attack

[Ferret]

It sounds like EazyP likes fox just a little too much. Are you gay for Fox, Easy P? I bet you are. Fox hitting me with a smash attack at 80% doesn't bother me too much. It's the direction that matters. (I play Peach rather regularly and as far as she flies and can still recover, plus the MENACING forward+A air attack (crown slap pwnage!) means I'm used to characters who float easily. Fox is just too easy to toss off and counter.)

[BigBoss]

Fox hitting me with a smash attack at 80% doesn't bother me too much.


yeah uh that kills a player you nub

Fox, Sheik, and Marth have less weaknesses and are generally better characters than the others - as in, it takes much less work to be fucking awesome with Marth than it does to be fucking awesome with Jigglypuff. That's the basis for the tier system of any game - how good a character is.

[Ferret]

yeah uh that kills a player you nub


Uh...less than you'd think, actually. At any rate, Fox players soon start having extreme difficulty getting a chance to blast me off. They either mistime an attack or do something stupid like being feinted off the edge of the stage.

[HideousBeing]

Generally people don't realize how quick his ending blow attack is. If you know how to time it so his sword doesn't stick in the ground it's tremendously fast and versatile.

Being able to L Cancel well also makes Link's ending blow attack much more "available." By this I mean that if you can't L Cancel, this move is risky to attempt, because of the lag time if you miss. If you can L Cancel, then it's much more safe to use the move.

[chrono26]

fox is good but he's also an anchor. that guy falls faster than an anvil. but 80% or not, i'll mess you up with luigi and his flamming dragon punch!

[ILLiterate]

It sounds like EazyP likes fox just a little too much. Are you gay for Fox, Easy P? I bet you are. Fox hitting me with a smash attack at 80% doesn't bother me too much. It's the direction that matters. (I play Peach rather regularly and as far as she flies and can still recover, plus the MENACING forward+A air attack (crown slap pwnage!) means I'm used to characters who float easily. Fox is just too easy to toss off and counter.)I don't use Fox. For space animal purposes, I use Falco, he's much more my style (D-Air will destroy you, Pillar Combos are epic). The fact is that Fox IS the best character in the game.

Peach's F-Air isn't that good, takes a while to come out, and I'd rather use B-Air. The Foxes you play must be terrible Fox players because a good Fox player would just keep you off the stage as soon as he gets you off, or anyone for that matter. Peach does have a good recovery, but that doesn't mean anything when your enemy bats you off the stage with a B-Air over and over or edge hogs. Name what you'd do in a situation and I'd come back at you. For now I'll just say you try and get back on normally. Guess what? Shine spike. After 2 of those (pretty easy to hit the 2nd when you hit the first) you can't get back on the stage.

You should read Ken's Peach Theory, you know, the Ken who is the best person in the world in this game? Here's what he has to say...

"All peach players,(who main peach and are good) are either gay, Effeminate, metrosexual or a big fat white guy~"

If you don't believe me, look it up, it's his sig in Smashboards

chrono26: Fox's weight actually ends up helping it out than hurting him. He makes it back to the stage fast after jumps helping him combo. Even though he's heavy, he's the fastest character in the game. Even if he falls fast he has two EXTREMELY GOOD recoveries to get back on the level. The only disadvantage he gets from that is that people can chain grab him, and do some Fox only combos, which don't match up to a Infinite Shine combo, which goes until you die

SFC Ferret: It pretty much will kill you on all stages but ones with high ceilings like Kirby's Dreamland N64. It will kill you on most default tourney levels. Also, the Fox people you play are also probably crap

Also, Fox has the quickest move in a game, that also acts as a spike and projectile reversal. Yes, the shine. It comes out in 1 frame, something that makes a BIG difference in this game. That move itself sets up infinite combos to your doom.

The real fact is, this won't drastically change your game if you want to play the game for fun. I speak the game how it's played in tourney situations. 1v1. All that jazz. If you want to win, I won't blame you for picking Fox, I won't blame you for being cheap with him (My friend always loved Fox from Starfox, his favorite Nintendo game, so he plays as Fox no matter what, I can't say he's trying to win every game he just likes Fox). He's just the best character in the game, end of story

[Antipode]

I hope that when people get really into Brawl they won't start coming up with all these cute little names for moves they've invented ("wavedashing" and the like). It always seemed cheesy and pointless to me, especially because as far as I know the developers themselves didn't come up with the names and arguably didn't even know the moves existed (though I've heard otherwise from some people). Course, there's always the fact that I was never able to even DO any of those moves in Melee, so that probably makes me a bit biased.

Incidentally, how did everyone wind up calling Fox's Reflector move the "shine"? I first started hearing it from my friends who played smash and I had no idea what they were talking about.

[Murmeli Walan]

Incidentally, how did everyone wind up calling Fox's Reflector move the "shine"? I first started hearing it from my friends who played smash and I had no idea what they were talking about.

I think it's from the "shine" that flashes on him when he activates the move.

[atmuh]

shine is a silly name

[BigBoss]

Uh...less than you'd think, actually. At any rate, Fox players soon start having extreme difficulty getting a chance to blast me off. They either mistime an attack or do something stupid like being feinted off the edge of the stage.

suuure they do

[ILLiterate]

I hope that when people get really into Brawl they won't start coming up with all these cute little names for moves they've invented ("wavedashing" and the like). It always seemed cheesy and pointless to me, especially because as far as I know the developers themselves didn't come up with the names and arguably didn't even know the moves existed (though I've heard otherwise from some people).In Brawl the rolls look A LOT faster, so Wavedashing is possibly eliminated unless you have a character with a terrible roll (like Yoshi or Samus has now). Wavedashing was known of by the developers in the debug menu they have it listed as something along the lines of super ground slide or something like that. Also things like fast fall and such where in since the original game, as was direction influencing. Shine is just easier to type so I use it, also I like to use sex kick because it's just more fun to say.

All fighters have coined terms after a while, it's just players making the game more of their own :P

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Uh...less than you'd think, actually. At any rate, Fox players soon start having extreme difficulty getting a chance to blast me off. They either mistime an attack or do something stupid like being feinted off the edge of the stage.

You must play some really pathetic foxes.

[HideousBeing]

also I like to use sex kick because it's just more fun to say.

All fighters have coined terms after a while, it's just players making the game more of their own :P

I've never heard that one. Sex kick? Could this possible be referring to Zelda's f air and b air?

[Paratha]

"Sex kick" is the neutral aerial A.

[HideousBeing]

For those of you who have watched the second SSBB teaser, what's with the "surprise" at the end featuring Fox? Why is he portrayed like such a big deal? Also, has anyone noticed that he will apparently be always holding his gun in his hand in SSBB? This may change his fighting style...

[wormguy]

Yeah, hopefully they'll make Fox less of a whore in Brawl.

[FuriousFure]

Yeah, hopefully they'll make Fox less of a whore in Brawl.

Naw man, I want him to be MORE of a whore! I want me some Gay Space Beastiality


So how about Pauline, or Luigi's Mansion Luigi *marrriioo?*?

maybe yes?


how bout the originality of the characters from the SSB (n64) back?
you know, dolls coming to life, master hand is actually part of the story. or the unique entrances *Link comes down in a shaft of light, Mario- a pipe, Kirby- the superstar, Samus- her port thingy, Fox- arwing drops him off, Pikachu- a pokeball is thrown, Dk- a barrel, ect...* before each battle starts?

[Global-Trance]

The big deal about Fox is that I guess when they thought of Brawl they decided to reconsider the entire line-up of characters so all we knew who was going to be in for sure were the original four (Mario, Link, Pikachu, and Kirby) along with the newcomers.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

I hope they don't nerf Fox for Brawl the way they nerfed Kirby for Melee. In fact, I hope they de-nerf Kirby as well.

What they should do is, rather than making the best characters worse, make the crappy characters better. A game where everybody is as strong as fox or falco would be one hell of a game.

[Baleshadow]

or the unique entrances *Link comes down in a shaft of light, Mario- a pipe, Kirby- the superstar, Samus- her port thingy, Fox- arwing drops him off, Pikachu- a pokeball is thrown, Dk- a barrel, ect...* before each battle starts?

This is an excellent idea. I want these back.

[Dexie]

I just want two things in Brawl...

1) Little Mac as playable.
2) THIS (http://youtube.com/watch?v=FFtw7qW7Vcw) as Captain Falcon's super move.

[The Mutericator]

*Link comes down in a shaft of light, Mario- a pipe, Kirby- the superstar, Samus- her port thingy, Fox- arwing drops him off, Pikachu- a pokeball is thrown, Dk- a barrel, ect...* before each battle starts?

Better: Link teleports in Twilight-Princess-style as a wolf, then transforms into a human. Samus should come down like on an elevator shaft from all the 2D games (instead of the port thingy that didn't make much sense). Other than that, I agree.

And Snake's box should sneak out from behind one of the other characters. xD

[HideousBeing]

or the unique entrances *Link comes down in a shaft of light, Mario- a pipe, Kirby- the superstar, Samus- her port thingy, Fox- arwing drops him off, Pikachu- a pokeball is thrown, Dk- a barrel, ect...* before each battle starts?

I like this idea. I was upset that they didn't put these into melee. Everyone just sort of blinks in. Bowser should totally come in with his gyro-clown thingy. Zelda would be transported down in a pink diamond (from Oot) Ganandorf would just fly down, or maybe ride his horse from the distance like Captain Falcon's car in SSB (N64).

[The Mutericator]

I like this idea. I was upset that they didn't put these into melee. Everyone just sort of blinks in. Bowser should totally come in with his gyro-clown thingy. Zelda would be transported down in a pink diamond (from Oot) Ganandorf would just fly down, or maybe ride his horse from the distance like Captain Falcon's car in SSB (N64).

Yeah, let's see Zelda teleport in in that crystal, I definitely like the Clown Copter idea for Bowser, but Ganondorf... maybe an explosion? Ganondorf... I can't think of one for him, I'm gonna have to stick to your idea of riding his horse from the distance, then maybe pulling that light sword from his stomach. Falcon definitely needs to drive in.

[FuriousFure]

Yeah, let's see Zelda teleport in in that crystal, I definitely like the Clown Copter idea for Bowser, but Ganondorf... maybe an explosion? Ganondorf... I can't think of one for him, I'm gonna have to stick to your idea of riding his horse from the distance, then maybe pulling that light sword from his stomach. Falcon definitely needs to drive in.


How about He appears in a whispy fog like appearance. like strips of dark fog and smoke like his "dark enegy" come together forming some kind ball or shape and then dispells and ganondorf is kneeling or standing there ready to fight.

and what about Zelda? she should totally have her bow and light arrow going on, since she has used it in the past few games.

[The Mutericator]

How about He appears in a whispy fog like appearance. like strips of dark fog and smoke like his "dark enegy" come together forming some kind ball or shape and then dispells and ganondorf is kneeling or standing there ready to fight.

and what about Zelda? she should totally have her bow and light arrow going on, since she has used it in the past few games.

For Ganny-poo, I was trying to stick to things we've seen him do in the games, which... doesn't give me much to work with. For Zelda, I definitely want to see her using her bow and light arrows.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Bow and light arrows for Zelda could certainly replace her current front B.

[Dexie]

Bow and light arrows for Zelda could certainly replace her current front B.

Hm. Split Shiek into a different character, move Nayru's Love to down B, and make bow/light arrows into her neutral B? That way, she keeps all three of OoT's spells.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

I agree that shiek should be a separate character. Either that, or she should be taken out entirely.

[HideousBeing]

Hm. Split Shiek into a different character, move Nayru's Love to down B, and make bow/light arrows into her neutral B? That way, she keeps all three of OoT's spells.

That would be good. I also wish that most of Ganandorf's moves are recalled, and he is given his sword to fight with as a whole new style. I never liked him as a clone of Captain Falcon.

By the way, I noticed something interesting. In SSBM, the Pit trophy description reads "The head of Palutena's personal bodyguards, Pit traveled near and far to gather Three Sacred Treasures that would help him defeat the evil goddess of darkness, Medusa, and free Palutena, the goddess of light. Pit couldn't fly with his little wings; only the Wings of Pegasus let him take flight."...-Then it says, "Will Pit ever fight again?"
I read all of those trophy descriptions and I never caught that meaning. I should've known!:sad:

[friendlyHunter]

By the way, I noticed something interesting. In SSBM, the Pit trophy description reads "The head of Palutena's personal bodyguards, Pit traveled near and far to gather Three Sacred Treasures that would help him defeat the evil goddess of darkness, Medusa, and free Palutena, the goddess of light. Pit couldn't fly with his little wings; only the Wings of Pegasus let him take flight."...-Then it says, "Will Pit ever fight again?"
I read all of those trophy descriptions and I never caught that meaning. I should've known!:sad:

Sad face? 'Cause you didn't notice it and then tell everyone your "crazy" theory only to have it come true making you win 600 dollars from everyone who bet against Pit being in Brawl, and you save up the money to buy 10 copies of SSBB and then you get really good with Pit just so everyone who plays with you sees you playing with Pit and is reminded that you said Pit would be in Brawl before it was announced? Probably.


I'm hoping that there aren't any clone characters and moves (even Mario & Luigi with different moves would be great), it kind of defeats the purpose of, you know.... having a bunch of different video game characters. I totally agree, a Zelda with light arrows (and no Sheik) would be great, as would a completely new Ganondorf with moves from the games (big energy ball thing that you can hit back and forth!!). Hmmm, has Ganondorf ever had Ganon's trademark trident weapon in any games?

From the videos, I'm heavily impressed by what the gameplay looks like, but I can't remember seeing any projectiles in them... I'm hoping projectiles for characters like Samus become an important part of their repotoire - a B (or even A) move that shoots a weak very-short ranged beam would be, for lack of a better term, freaking awesome! Samus needs some rapid-fire shoot'em up action!! [Edit] AND a decent amount of morph ball action. If they make suited Samus CRAWL when you crouch and move at the same time, I'll cry. Not because of that, but I'm bound to cry about something one of these decades.....

[The Mutericator]

That would be good. I also wish that most of Ganandorf's moves are recalled, and he is given his sword to fight with as a whole new style. I never liked him as a clone of Captain Falcon.

By the way, I noticed something interesting. In SSBM, the Pit trophy description reads "The head of Palutena's personal bodyguards, Pit traveled near and far to gather Three Sacred Treasures that would help him defeat the evil goddess of darkness, Medusa, and free Palutena, the goddess of light. Pit couldn't fly with his little wings; only the Wings of Pegasus let him take flight."...-Then it says, "Will Pit ever fight again?"
I read all of those trophy descriptions and I never caught that meaning. I should've known!:sad:

Pit fandom has been around for long before Melee - in fact, I'm relatively certain he was rumored to be in it, a la Sonic. Nintendo has known about Pit's fanclub, too, so they probably would have taken note of it.

[FuriousFure]

I am against seperation of the two characters. but alterations are in order. in fact i think Zero Suit Samus is going to have the same kind of thing switching her gun from whip to blaster.

as for the entrances, theres a couple ones i couldn't think of, namely Dr.Mario and mewtwo (unless its a masterball -from the game)

Oh and the clapping scene at the end of the match. nobody is a good sport anymore, i guess...

[wormguy]

2) THIS (http://youtube.com/watch?v=FFtw7qW7Vcw) as Captain Falcon's super move.

Fuck. Yes.

[Wipomatic]

as for the entrances, theres a couple ones i couldn't think of, namely Dr.Mario and mewtwo (unless its a masterball -from the game)

Well, Mewtwo could teleport in maybe? And Doc could perhaps drop from the screen in a capsule? That's the best I could think of.

[linkspast]

Dr. Mario could come in, in an ambulance, maybe crash in to some part of the level...
I just had an idea. How about destructible environments. It could make things much more chaotic.

[Kureejii Lea]

I just had an idea. How about destructible environments. It could make things much more chaotic.

You say that like it'd be a new thing to the series. =P

[CE]

SONIC IN BRAWL SINCE HE'S IN A MARIO GAME!!!11

Seriously guys, Sonic would blow in Brawl, people should stop pining over it.

[The Mutericator]

SONIC IN BRAWL SINCE HE'S IN A MARIO GAME!!!11

Seriously guys, Sonic would blow in Brawl, people should stop pining over it.

Now where'd I put that dead horse macro...

Protip: if they can make Game and Watch, Ice Climbers, and Pichu worthwhile characters, they can make anyone a worthwhile character. Saying that a certain character would suck simply based on who the character is makes no sense, because we have evidence that Sakurai can turn ANY character into a worthwhile one.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Except that Pichu wasn't a worthwhile character. Nor was Game and Watch.

Ice climbers I'll give you.

[chrono26]

Nor was Game and Watch

hey hey hey, game and watch was SO worthwhile. nothing better then beatin up your friends by flippin burned sausage in their dumb faces.

[FuriousFure]

hey hey hey, game and watch was SO worthwhile. nothing better then beatin up your friends by flippin burned sausage in their dumb faces.

so true! its like Game & Watch turned into the Jigglypuff of the original, nobody liked him except the people could actually play as him and beat people. oh yeah!

Eat Torch, mofo!

[Fenrir]

Except that Pichu wasn't a worthwhile character. Nor was Game and Watch.

Ice climbers I'll give you.

I heartily agree.

[G_D]

2) THIS (http://youtube.com/watch?v=FFtw7qW7Vcw) as Captain Falcon's super move.

ROFL!

DBZ much?

[Global-Trance]

Actually... Game & Watch is quite a killer if played with brains. The problem with him is that his shield is practically non-existent... anyone with a good rushdown game will just decimate Game & Watch.

Edit: For Pichu: No matter how good anyone is with him, you shouldn't lose to him. EVER. You need to play smarter if you lose to Pichu.

For Ice Climbers: Grab Game / WD / Wobble :)

[DJ Tempora]

Edit: For Pichu: No matter how good anyone is with him, you shouldn't lose to him. EVER. You need to play smarter if you lose to Pichu.

Dude, I'm surprised that you would make a statement like that. I don't know if you're just being dramatic, but Pichu is still a challenge in the hands of a capable adversary. I'm sure someone moderately better than you, or someone moderately better than me, would have no trouble beating us with the small yellow rat.

And on another note, Ice Climbers own you all. Don't you fucking forget it.

[chrono26]

And on another note, Ice Climbers own you all. Don't you fucking forget it.

ice climbers are good as long as they stay plural. once you lose the girlfriend then you're screwed big time.

[Zaxter]

Playing 4-player and having all of the players choose Pichu is actually pretty fun. The little guy is stronger than I thought.

Also, hi, I'm new here.

[Red Shadow]

ice climbers are good as long as they stay plural. once you lose the girlfriend then you're screwed big time.
I am far superior with one ice climber.

In fact some times I make it a point to kill the tagalong off right away before a match truly begins.

[HideousBeing]

Dude, I'm surprised that you would make a statement like that. I don't know if you're just being dramatic, but Pichu is still a challenge in the hands of a capable adversary. I'm sure someone moderately better than you, or someone moderately better than me, would have no trouble beating us with the small yellow rat.

Completely true. A good Pichu player is able to well manage his percentage adding moves and utilize his lightning quick attacks to be all over an opponent. His small girth is a great asset as well. Ever tried taking Pichu with Ganandorf? Ganandorf is slow in the first place, and most of his moves go over Pichu's head, because he is so short. You have to aim his f power down to hit him. Even Ganandorf's d smash goes over him I think.

[BigBoss]

Even Ganandorf's d smash goes over him I think.

Ganondorf's B-Down does the same to Pichu as it does to every character.

Rape.

[ILLiterate]

No really, Pichu is a worthless character that no one should be able to beat you with. His kills moves are all slow and laggy, his air moves are mostly failures, and he damages himself. Not to mention the size really doesn't matter if you know how to play your character at the higher levels of the game

[Global-Trance]

You guys missed the part where I said IF YOU LOSE AGAINST PICHU YOU JUST NEED TO PLAY SMARTER.

[HideousBeing]

Ganondorf's B-Down does the same to Pichu as it does to every character.

Rape.

I meant his down smash A attack, but nevermind, I was wrong anyway.
Everyone thinks so horribly of Pichu, it's almost worth trying him out as a new best for me to see. I doubt he's that imbalanced.

[DJ Tempora]

No really, Pichu is a worthless character that no one should be able to beat you with. His kills moves are all slow and laggy, his air moves are mostly failures, and he damages himself. Not to mention the size really doesn't matter if you know how to play your character at the higher levels of the game


You guys missed the part where I said IF YOU LOSE AGAINST PICHU YOU JUST NEED TO PLAY SMARTER.



Again, I disagree with both of you. Pichu has many faults, but it's perfectly understandable to lose to him against someone of a higher skill level. Whether you play smart or not, Pichu is not so bad as to negate that.

Now if you're playing against someone of roughly the same skill level, I agree, you've got a problem there.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Pichu does have one thing going for him; a rediculously powerful up smash.

But this is not enough to offset his suckitude.

[ILLiterate]

It's basically the Link Vs. Young Link situation, just use Link (or in this case Pikachu, at least you don't damage yourself and he's better)

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Except pikachu sucks just as bad.

[ILLiterate]

Not really, Pichu is just about the 2nd worst character in the game, while Pikachu is middle tier :P

But yeah, sucks how bad some characters got nerfed in the switch

[Geoffrey Taucer]

I'll say again: they need to de-nerf kirby.

[BigBoss]

I'll say again: they need to de-nerf kirby.

Agreed.

And I'm better with Young Link than his older self.

[ILLiterate]

Older Link is a better all around character, just try him out with some new tips and I bet you'll be winning more matches. The biggest selling point is that his Up+B shoots you away, instead of pulling you into him, setting up for easier kills. If I'm correct, more overall damage and...well...just plain better.

[HideousBeing]

Question: What exactly does Marth say in Japanese when he performs his Fighter's Stance?

[Iggy Enigma]

What happened to Smash Brothers? In the first game, it was just fun. Now we have clones and overused franchises, psychos talking about "pro play" and unequal characters. I'm sorry, but sometimes I feel like Melee was just a moneymaking opportunity. I mean, Pichu? Young Link? Dr. Mario?? Are you serious? How are these seperate characters? (When the heck was Dr. Mario an iconic enough game to merit a Smash Bros char, clone or not?) And I know a lot of you won't like hearing this, but Marth and Roy were definitely in there just to promote Fire Emblem (which is funny, because FE is so good that it didn't need the promotion). Sure, Link can get away with using a sword, he's Link. But bringing in two characters with (relative) 6-foot wingspans is cheap. These five are characters that should have NEVER EXISTED. (Falco and Ganondorf, at least with their current movesets, probably shouldn't be in there either, but I'll be conservative.)
Even worse is all this inequality. I am so sick of everyone on earth playing as Fox/Falco, or Marth, or whoever else you guys consider good. In the original, everyone was about equal. Admittedly, a few like Falcon and Ness were somewhat better, but it wasn't outrageously imbalanced like it is today. I could play as Yoshi or Kirby (easily my two best, I whupped up on people with my signature Red Yoshi) and not get laughed at and subsequently clobbered.
The problem is, Brawl is already going to be no better. They already revealed a clone: Zero Suit Samus. I am pissed about her creation and I'm surprised more people aren't. What I can't understand is that you guys are actually clamoring for her and WW Link and the like; you want each character to have 3 or 4 different versions rather than some variety and originality? Don't sell us so short! I, personally, would rather see completely new people, but maybe I'm just a crazy person.
Oh, and as for Snake... Give. Me. A. Break. He does not fit in the game, the overall feel of Smash Bros whatsoever. What's he gonna do, sneak up behind Mario and slit his throat? Snake is in the game for one reason alone, and it begins with an $.
As a random final note, I'd also like more variety in the stages... having 5 Mario stages is kinda lame.

[chrono26]

you have to take into account that this game is basically made for nintendo fans. and there are japanese and american nintendo fans. they'll throw samus in there for the americans and fire emblem charecters in there for the japanese. and its not fair to say that melee was just a money making opportunity. it was obviously the best selling game so if they were in it for promotion and money why didnt they make 4 more smash brothers during gamecube's 6 year run?

[Hum4n After All]

I don't know about Snake being in Brawl for the money.
I mean Hideo Kojima begged for Snake to be in Melee.
But couldn't because the game was already at a certain point in which he could not be put in. So now Snake gets his break in Brawl.
Since Melee is the number 1 selling game for GC, what if Snake did make it in Melee?
Still would be a hit.

[JoeFu]

SSB is like the definition of pure fun.

The game is timeless and the franchise will live on to be a classic. Just for fun my friend and I popped in the original just to see it in action again. It was freaking fun. SSBM is also freaking fun. I have no doubt that SSBB will be just as fun.

I hope in SSBB they bring back the character specific introductions again. Seeing Samus walk out of a save pod, or pikachu flying out of a pokeball was freaking awesome.

[atmuh]

What happened to Smash Brothers? In the first game, it was just fun. Now we have clones and overused franchises, psychos talking about "pro play" and unequal characters. I'm sorry, but sometimes I feel like Melee was just a moneymaking opportunity. I mean, Pichu? Young Link? Dr. Mario?? Are you serious? How are these seperate characters? (When the heck was Dr. Mario an iconic enough game to merit a Smash Bros char, clone or not?) And I know a lot of you won't like hearing this, but Marth and Roy were definitely in there just to promote Fire Emblem (which is funny, because FE is so good that it didn't need the promotion). Sure, Link can get away with using a sword, he's Link. But bringing in two characters with (relative) 6-foot wingspans is cheap. These five are characters that should have NEVER EXISTED. (Falco and Ganondorf, at least with their current movesets, probably shouldn't be in there either, but I'll be conservative.)
Even worse is all this inequality. I am so sick of everyone on earth playing as Fox/Falco, or Marth, or whoever else you guys consider good. In the original, everyone was about equal. Admittedly, a few like Falcon and Ness were somewhat better, but it wasn't outrageously imbalanced like it is today. I could play as Yoshi or Kirby (easily my two best, I whupped up on people with my signature Red Yoshi) and not get laughed at and subsequently clobbered.
The problem is, Brawl is already going to be no better. They already revealed a clone: Zero Suit Samus. I am pissed about her creation and I'm surprised more people aren't. What I can't understand is that you guys are actually clamoring for her and WW Link and the like; you want each character to have 3 or 4 different versions rather than some variety and originality? Don't sell us so short! I, personally, would rather see completely new people, but maybe I'm just a crazy person.
Oh, and as for Snake... Give. Me. A. Break. He does not fit in the game, the overall feel of Smash Bros whatsoever. What's he gonna do, sneak up behind Mario and slit his throat? Snake is in the game for one reason alone, and it begins with an $.
As a random final note, I'd also like more variety in the stages... having 5 Mario stages is kinda lame.

who the heck are you and why are you an idiot

[Penfold]

What happened to Smash Brothers? In the first game, it was just fun. Now we have clones and overused franchises, psychos talking about "pro play" and unequal characters. I'm sorry, but sometimes I feel like Melee was just a moneymaking opportunity. I mean, Pichu? Young Link? Dr. Mario?? Are you serious? How are these seperate characters? (When the heck was Dr. Mario an iconic enough game to merit a Smash Bros char, clone or not?) And I know a lot of you won't like hearing this, but Marth and Roy were definitely in there just to promote Fire Emblem (which is funny, because FE is so good that it didn't need the promotion). Sure, Link can get away with using a sword, he's Link. But bringing in two characters with (relative) 6-foot wingspans is cheap. These five are characters that should have NEVER EXISTED. (Falco and Ganondorf, at least with their current movesets, probably shouldn't be in there either, but I'll be conservative.)
Even worse is all this inequality. I am so sick of everyone on earth playing as Fox/Falco, or Marth, or whoever else you guys consider good. In the original, everyone was about equal. Admittedly, a few like Falcon and Ness were somewhat better, but it wasn't outrageously imbalanced like it is today. I could play as Yoshi or Kirby (easily my two best, I whupped up on people with my signature Red Yoshi) and not get laughed at and subsequently clobbered.
The problem is, Brawl is already going to be no better. They already revealed a clone: Zero Suit Samus. I am pissed about her creation and I'm surprised more people aren't. What I can't understand is that you guys are actually clamoring for her and WW Link and the like; you want each character to have 3 or 4 different versions rather than some variety and originality? Don't sell us so short! I, personally, would rather see completely new people, but maybe I'm just a crazy person.
Oh, and as for Snake... Give. Me. A. Break. He does not fit in the game, the overall feel of Smash Bros whatsoever. What's he gonna do, sneak up behind Mario and slit his throat? Snake is in the game for one reason alone, and it begins with an $.
As a random final note, I'd also like more variety in the stages... having 5 Mario stages is kinda lame.

lol, feel better now?

[ILLiterate]

What happened to Smash Brothers? In the first game, it was just fun. 1.Now we have clones and overused franchises, psychos talking about "pro play" and unequal characters. I'm sorry, but sometimes I feel like Melee was just a moneymaking opportunity. 2.I mean, Pichu? Young Link? Dr. Mario?? Are you serious? How are these seperate characters? (When the heck was Dr. Mario an iconic enough game to merit a Smash Bros char, clone or not?) And I know a lot of you won't like hearing this, but Marth and Roy were definitely in there just to promote Fire Emblem (which is funny, because FE is so good that it didn't need the promotion). Sure, Link can get away with using a sword, he's Link. But bringing in two characters with (relative) 6-foot wingspans is cheap. These five are characters that should have NEVER EXISTED. (Falco and Ganondorf, at least with their current movesets, probably shouldn't be in there either, but I'll be conservative.)
3.Even worse is all this inequality. I am so sick of everyone on earth playing as Fox/Falco, or Marth, or whoever else you guys consider good. In the original, everyone was about equal. Admittedly, a few like Falcon and Ness were somewhat better, but it wasn't outrageously imbalanced like it is today. I could play as Yoshi or Kirby (easily my two best, I whupped up on people with my signature Red Yoshi) and not get laughed at and subsequently clobbered.
4.The problem is, Brawl is already going to be no better. They already revealed a clone: Zero Suit Samus. I am pissed about her creation and I'm surprised more people aren't. What I can't understand is that you guys are actually clamoring for her and WW Link and the like; you want each character to have 3 or 4 different versions rather than some variety and originality? Don't sell us so short! I, personally, would rather see completely new people, but maybe I'm just a crazy person.
5.Oh, and as for Snake... Give. Me. A. Break. He does not fit in the game, the overall feel of Smash Bros whatsoever. What's he gonna do, sneak up behind Mario and slit his throat? Snake is in the game for one reason alone, and it begins with an $.
As a random final note, I'd also like more variety in the stages... 6.having 5 Mario stages is kinda lame.
Lemme start off with an lol, ok now that I'm ready...

1. People where playing tournament smash and talking about it also, get over it, if people want to play a game competitively and talk about it they can

2. Clone, you might as well call Ryu and Ken the same character. Sure they look like their original guys, but play with them and notice they are the same BASE character, with different effects for people with different tastes

3. Don't even start on that shit. Every single fighting game has characters that are better than others, when you put in more characters you start to see how much better they are than the others. The game went from like 12 fighters to 25. Every fighter has a god tier and a mid tier and a low tier and everything in between, stop complaining. People don't all just play with the best characters on tier lists just to piss you off, they do it because they like the character

4. Oh wow. You don't even know if the game is good yet, IT'S NOT OUT AND NOT COMING OUT FOR A WHILE. Zero Suit Samus has been stated as having a completely different move set because she loses her missiles and guns and such. WW Link can also play very different from Link, you don't know.

5. Snake is in the game because Hideo called up his friend who happened to be the director of SSBM (also current director of SSBB). He said he really loved SSB and was wondering if somehow they could place Snake in it. Masahiro was all for it, but they where too far ahead in the developement process. He didn't think he would direct the next Smash game so he didn't make any promises. Now that he is, he was all for Snake being in the game, who wouldn't want another gaming icon in their game? Also, he's not going to do that stuff, as it is a "kid friendly" game. He's going to use explosives like C4's, grenades, and stuff like that

6. Mario is Nintendo's main character. In a game about Nintendo's main characters fighting, it's fitting that he has the most stages, and either way, they're fun for the most part

And while I'm on SSBB, which I'm not on very often, I love what they're doing. It's gotten much more into the "this is on the level of Street Fighter." It can still be that fun party game, but tournaments and the competitive scene are being heavily noticed as it seems, which should lead to less balance issues and such. Also using the Wii online service, the game can be patched up as needed, if needed. It won't be perfectly balanced, but it'll be damn good compared to SSBM

[HideousBeing]

The problem is, Brawl is already going to be no better. They already revealed a clone: Zero Suit Samus. I am pissed about her creation and I'm surprised more people aren't. What I can't understand is that you guys are actually clamoring for her and WW Link and the like;
Lol, take another look at the second SSBB teaser released: Zero Suit Samus is no clone; her move set is completely different from the original. Sakurai says after his character introduction for Zero Suit Samus, "And don't worry—you'll still be able to play as standard Samus, too." Meaning that they will most likely be separate characters!

[Iggy Enigma]

OK, fair enough. I knew I was going to get shot at from multiple directions. But I do feel better after getting that out there (in regards to Penfold) :razz:

I will concede you have some good points, EazyP. I suppose a fighting game is what it is, with inequality and tournament-talking. And it is true that I have no knowledge of what the new characters will be like. (WW Link and Z-Samus could be very different from their counterparts, I suppose you're right... though Samus fighting Samus bothers me, I guess it makes an interesting game.) I'm still mad about Marth and Roy, but I can let it go, cheap-shot swords and all. Switching them out would be cool... I mean, there's a lot of FE games, and many chars are somewhat similar... it would keep it interesting. (Lyn and Eliwood? Eirika and Ephraim? Anyone? Bueller?).

Buuut, I'm not giving up on two characters that I consider the epitome of worthlessness. It's fun conversation anyway.

Here's my legitimate argument against Dr. Mario: Luigi already exists. He is a Mario clone BUT he has always been similar in ability to Mario in every game he's been in. Yet with his funky moveset, he's really not a Mario clone at all; similar yet very different in playing style (Luigi is one thing I applaud the Melee creators on). All I'm saying is, regardless of how good Doc is as a fighter, when Luigi exists, do we really need another Mario double gumming up a character slot? Especially from a game that isn't quite "iconic"? (And no, I don't count Wario as a Mario clone at all, I'm sure he will be very different.)

And as for Pichu... Y-Link is noticeably different yet equal to normal Link. Pichu is just plain worse. And no one likes Baby Pokemon.

On an unrelated note, anyone else bothered by the fact that in Melee, Pikachu or even Pichu can defeat Mewtwo, which could never happen in the Pokemon world?...

[atmuh]

I'm still mad about Marth and Roy, but I can let it go, cheap-shot swords and all. Switching them out would be cool... I mean, there's a lot of FE games, and many chars are somewhat similar... it would keep it interesting. (Lyn and Eliwood? Eirika and Ephraim? Anyone? Bueller?).

if you were good at it you wouldnt have a problem with them

Here's my legitimate argument against Dr. Mario: Luigi already exists. He is a Mario clone BUT he has always been similar in ability to Mario in every game he's been in. Yet with his funky moveset, he's really not a Mario clone at all; similar yet very different in playing style (Luigi is one thing I applaud the Melee creators on). All I'm saying is, regardless of how good Doc is as a fighter, when Luigi exists, do we really need another Mario double gumming up a character slot? Especially from a game that isn't quite "iconic"? (And no, I don't count Wario as a Mario clone at all, I'm sure he will be very different.)

there are very distinct differences between the doc and mario
I guess let's yell at the creators for giving players even more of a choice of exactly what kind of character they want

On an unrelated note, anyone else bothered by the fact that in Melee, Pikachu or even Pichu can defeat Mewtwo, which could never happen in the Pokemon world?...

good god...

[TheCatPhysician]

WHAT?! People are angry that Pichu is in Melee?

Ok, not many people know this secret cheat for Pichu that makes him the awesomest character in the game, so I'll forgive you because you didn't know.

Here's the cheat:
1: pick pichu
2: hold left or right BARELY. Like, move the control stick the smallest possible distance you can but enough so that it will still register as a movement. You'll know when you do it right because Pichu pretty much turns into a terrible monster that will scare the crap out of whoever you're facing. One time, a level 9 even got scared of it. Also, when you do it make sure to do it for a long time for a better effect. See if you can do it all the way across Final Destination without peeing your pants.

[Flare4War]

They should pack as many characters in there as possible as far as I'm concerned, so long as they put time into making them all cool. Put Cloud and Tifa, for that matter Sephiroth, While they're att it put Ryu from Ninja Gaiden, and as many clones as they're willing to come up with. The more the better for all I care. As long as they're performing due diligence on each characters move and fighting style etc.

[atmuh]

They should pack as many characters in there as possible as far as I'm concerned, so long as they put time into making them all cool. Put Cloud and Tifa, for that matter Sephiroth, While they're att it put Ryu from Ninja Gaiden, and as many clones as they're willing to come up with. The more the better for all I care. As long as they're performing due diligence on each characters move and fighting style etc.

ahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Flare4War]

I Know Right!!

[Airwalker]

I believe the rule was that the character must have appeared on a Nintendo console once. There's been Final Fantasies on Nintendo, but I believe VII characters are out of the loop. In any case, from the same article I read many moons ago (http://www.joystiq.com/2006/06/05/sakurai-reveals-new-smash-bros-brawl-details/), the people making the man in charge was hoping for at least 2-3 non-Nintendo characters. (I included Snake...)

Oh... here are the three rules:

1.) They must have appeared on a Nintendo console.
2.) They must have originated in a video game.
3.) No anime/manga characters.

I'm hoping for an Advance Wars related character, personally.

[friendlyHunter]

Heh, I remember when I made a post saying many bad things about Melee in a SSB thread - many a Melee fan's pants became wet. (wetter?) I must say I don't agree with much of what Iggy said. I have high hopes for Brawl - I loved every gameplay element they showed in the video: the stage size, the characters' speeds, jumps, moves, hits, umm, dodges too maybe? And I can't complain enough about how Melee's graphics, especially compared to SSB's simplicity, are insanely cluttered and distracting (characters that are no more than a dozen pixels high, changing colour and suddenly appearing in different places all the time, behind a wall of flashing white smoke thingies, fire, explosions, AND the scoreboard - I just can't follow it. I must have the opposite of ADD... or maybe I'm drunk. Sometimes drunk?) Well, I'm glad to say Brawl looks to have SSB's simplicity back - now with good graphics! Full-bodied paths of smoke that last for more than half a second, awsome light trails behind swung blades, nice tight stages that don't zoom out the camera and turn the players into tiny dots, actually being able to manuever around small platforms without accidently jumping off the stage.... looks like Brawl has it all! Or, rather it awl.....?? lawl?

[HideousBeing]

Those of you wishing for FF characters to appear on brawl, you're going to be disappointed. It would be more realistic (and probably more what you want) to wish for a game -made by Square-Enix- in which characters from different RPGs of the company fight. If that game were made, and made well, it would sell insanely.
On a side note, I wonder if Wario's presence in Brawl will cause the game to be rated for "Crude Humor?" WarioWare games list "Crude Humor" as one of the reasons for their rating. The tentative "Wario Waft" may promise this rating reason included.

[FuriousFure]

Whats this thrird rule Bullshit? huh? I mean, no anime characters? Why the hell would that even matter?

All I know are the rules of third party and must have been on a nintendo platform. Making that kind of blanket statement makes you just look like a dumbass. way to go, dumbass.

Sonic, would not suck as a melee brawler, know why?

First, one would take Jiggly puff's or Yoshi's Spin add with Fox's or Capt. Falcon's speed multiply by making his jump an actual attack anding a low effect recovery and throwing in a few punches, kicks, and slide attacks and you got you self a pretty playable brawler.

and then wake from your Anti-Fun Commie visons and realize on how items can be updated and improved so much with sonic items

The sonic boxes could act as party balls exept hold only one effect/ item.

Invinciblity- not just StarMan any more

Rings- heals some of you damage percent

Shields- Protects you till someone pops it

Super speed- self explaintory

Not only that, SSBB could have Spring Items either as Classic Mario fare or as Sonic Sping Plunger things.

You'A throw them and they would stick in the ground, wall, sides, ledges. Imagen the barrel combined with a mine combine from the bumber in SSB.
so you want anyone thrown off the stage not to get back on?

Stick it horizontally on the side of the stage and you got a real hard trap. or place it on the ground so the just shoot up 20 (relitive) feet up in the air, helpless.

The possiblities are endless!

Oh and how about the idea of having *as a costume choice for the characters with tenure* the orginal polygonal character models.

So if you chose link or mario, you could choose the costume making it look like the N64 version. They would add in the new moves and stuff

[Flare4War]

Yeah, Sonic and Tails would be great additions.

[TheCatPhysician]

friendlyhunter, you sound like you're trying to get a reaction out of people and/or sound unique.

And I can't complain enough about how Melee's graphics, especially compared to SSB's simplicity, are insanely cluttered and distracting (characters that are no more than a dozen pixels high, changing colour and suddenly appearing in different places all the time, behind a wall of flashing white smoke thingies, fire, explosions, AND the scoreboarddoes anyone know what he just said? I honestly don't get it.

im not going to wet my pants because someone doesn't like my favorite game, but when you say it sucks for some reason that makes no sense at all, i just want you to clarify a little. just pick any one of the thousands of ssbm vids on youtube and show me where the graphics detract from the gameplay.

[bouncerboy15]

classic controller
Yes...but that's still forcing people to buy another controller.

[Triad Orion]

I'm hoping for an Advance Wars related character, personally.

(Scruffy the Janitor Voice) Second.

[The Mutericator]

friendlyhunter, you sound like you're trying to get a reaction out of people and/or sound unique.

does anyone know what he just said? I honestly don't get it.

im not going to wet my pants because someone doesn't like my favorite game, but when you say it sucks for some reason that makes no sense at all, i just want you to clarify a little. just pick any one of the thousands of ssbm vids on youtube and show me where the graphics detract from the gameplay.

It's called flamebait. Let it go.

[Brithor]

They should pack as many characters in there as possible as far as I'm concerned, so long as they put time into making them all cool. Put Cloud and Tifa, for that matter Sephiroth, While they're att it put Ryu from Ninja Gaiden, and as many clones as they're willing to come up with. The more the better for all I care. As long as they're performing due diligence on each characters move and fighting style etc.


Good god, please don't put any Final Fantasy characters in it.

[Oddllama]

They should pack as many characters in there as possible as far as I'm concerned, so long as they put time into making them all cool. Put Cloud and Tifa, for that matter Sephiroth, While they're att it put Ryu from Ninja Gaiden, and as many clones as they're willing to come up with. The more the better for all I care. As long as they're performing due diligence on each characters move and fighting style etc.
Let me also say that this is precisely the opposite of what I want to happen. Especially about the clones.

[!Nekko!]

They should pack as many characters in there as possible as far as I'm concerned, so long as they put time into making them all cool. Put Cloud and Tifa, for that matter Sephiroth, While they're att it put Ryu from Ninja Gaiden, and as many clones as they're willing to come up with. The more the better for all I care. As long as they're performing due diligence on each characters move and fighting style etc.

Yeah! Lets throw as much shit at the wall as we can! Some of it is bound to stick, right?

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7139/biggieqw5.jpg

[Global-Trance]

Question: What exactly does Marth say in Japanese when he performs his Fighter's Stance?

In a nutshell, it literally means "Hey everybody! Look at me!"

Seriously.

[chrono26]

Yeah! Lets throw as much shit at the wall as we can! Some of it is bound to stick, right?

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7139/biggieqw5.jpg

LMAO spidey wins.

[Brithor]

lol @ moon.

[Iggy Enigma]

It would be more realistic (and probably more what you want) to wish for a game -made by Square-Enix- in which characters from different RPGs of the company fight. If that game were made, and made well, it would sell insanely.


Amen to that, brother! I've been thinking that for a while now (I always imagine it in the style of Soul Calibur, though however Square would set it up would be awesome).

Also, I lol at !Nekko!'s image, because that seems to be what a lot of stupid people are hoping for. I'd like to see how the Moon would fight. "Drop Down From The Skies Attack: The most powerful attack in the game, but it takes three days (Wii clock) to connect." :razz:

I hate to reveal my ignorance, but is Castlevania from a third party? That is most definitely a game series worthy of a character. (Although he/she would most likely be using a whip, which is at least as evil as a longsword, but oh well...)

Speaking of which, I will speak no more against Marth and Roy. I just suck at the game. I admit it. It's fun, but I get my butt kicked a lot of the time.

[HideousBeing]

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7139/biggieqw5.jpg

Hah! Dampe would be awesome with his shovel!
Also, wouldn't Kuribo's shoe --> http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w169/HideousBeing/KuribosShoe.gif be a cool item for brawl?

[FuriousFure]

wouldn't Kuribo's shoe --> http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w169/HideousBeing/KuribosShoe.gif be a cool item for brawl?

Hella Yeah! that would be amazing! it was by far the best item in SMB3.

it would make the Brawler jump like yoshi (height) and only do damage if landed directly above the victim and send them flying like Falcons/Ganondorf/Ness's ariel down smash A. most times, it would smash them straight into the ground but if you are risky you could try to smash a recovering opponent which, if you missed, would spell certain disaster.

And, (yeah I'm not done, I like this idea) if you got hit from side it would knock The Brawler out and it would bounce a couple times around the stage for someone else to jump in.

Also making it so that the Player would be unable to deselect the item would be hiliarious

it would be awesome!

and if you need any other reason to be sold, imagine snake in a Kurbio shoe bounceing around the stage and then off the map,

You know, that inspires me! how about a whistle (SMB3) item that transports all the Brawlers to a different stage if used?

[Geoffrey Taucer]

Yeah! Lets throw as much shit at the wall as we can! Some of it is bound to stick, right?

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7139/biggieqw5.jpg

What? Nobody from Mischief Makers?

Fail

(though you made up for it by having the moon in there)

Win.

[chrono26]

hahaha i just noticed prof. oak. lol i take back spidey, oak wins.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

hahaha i just noticed prof. oak. lol i take back spidey, oak wins.

No, the moon wins.

N00b

[chrono26]

No, the moon wins.

N00b

whoa whoa, watch who you use the "N" word on. check the join date. and prof. oak would sooooo own the moon. what's he gonna do? crash into the earth? why dontcha juggle that!

[Cecilff2]

Insane home run distance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie39ySHnvD0&NR)

Also, the moon does win. Unless perhaps...someone picks those giants.

[linkspast]

whoa whoa, watch who you use the "N" word on. check the join date. and prof. oak would sooooo own the moon. what's he gonna do? crash into the earth? why dontcha juggle that!
only a noob directs people to his join date.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

whoa whoa, watch who you use the "N" word on. check the join date. and prof. oak would sooooo own the moon. what's he gonna do? crash into the earth? why dontcha juggle that!

Oh, fuck that. The moon would totally pwn prof. Oak. What's Oak gonna do against the moon? Throw pokeballs at it?

[Blake]

only a noob directs people to his join date.

Or perhaps fails to realize that poster was talking about the professor Oak's join date, as opposed to the Moon's late arrival.

[Zaxter]

Goomba would completely decimate every other combatant if they let him in.

[linkspast]

Or perhaps fails to realize that poster was talking about the professor Oak's join date, as opposed to the Moon's late arrival.

No, what you fail to see, is that the moon has been around for ever, he was just waiting for an awesome game to make his debut.

[Geoffrey Taucer]

I guess Pokemon did come out before MM... But the moon would still kick Oak's ass.

[G_D]

They need to put Navi in the game just so everyone can KILL HER. A LOT.

It would be a great stress reliever, kinda like fighting 3 Level 1 Jigglypuffs on infinite stock, with their handicap on 1 and yours on 9.

[Blake]

No, what you fail to see, is that the moon has been around for ever, he was just waiting for an awesome game to make his debut.

Touche :( 90

[linkspast]

Ok But Seriously these are pretty cool. compares SSBM with their origins. http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=CrappyCaptureDevice

Oh and Skullkid could be pretty awesome.

[Penfold]

They need to put Navi in the game just so everyone can KILL HER. A LOT.

It would be a great stress reliever, kinda like fighting 3 Level 1 Jigglypuffs on infinite stock, with their handicap on 1 and yours on 9.

"Hey! Listen!" (http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=42)

[RealFolkBlues]

Ok But Seriously these are pretty cool. compares SSBM with their origins. http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=CrappyCaptureDevice

Oh and Skullkid could be pretty awesome.

GET YE TO LAOS'S THREAD. That's link-worthy. Ouch. I didn't even mean to make that pun.

[chrono26]

Oh, fuck that. The moon would totally pwn prof. Oak. What's Oak gonna do against the moon? Throw pokeballs at it?

catch that bitch with a masterball ya

They need to put Navi in the game just so everyone can KILL HER. A LOT.

It would be a great stress reliever, kinda like fighting 3 Level 1 Jigglypuffs on infinite stock, with their handicap on 1 and yours on 9.

i concur

[AzureZeal]

Meh, I've always wondered how NiGHTS would play into the game.
And didn't the last list had the kitchen sink in it?

[dsx100]

I have seen that pic a million times but I must admit, it never really gets old.

On the side note, STOP!!!! requesting Final Fantasy VII characters. Enough is Enough already. I can even probably understand FF:CC but VII or any other main series characters have no place in SSB. VII is a playstation exclusive, this is and will always be a NINTENDO brawler. The addition of Snake doesn't change anything. Wishing for Cloud, Tifa etc. is pointless. It is much better to wish for a final fantasy fighting game. Until then play "Ehrgeiz: God Bless the Ring" if you can even Find It. The closest thing you will find to Final Fantasy brawler. There cast includes Cloud, Tifa, Vincent, and pretty much any other of your stupid beloved Final Fantasy VII Characters.

[HideousBeing]

Insane home run distance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie39ySHnvD0&NR)
Does this count?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK0X9mribh8
Or do you have to make sure it doesn't exceed 9999.9? lol

[Brithor]

I have seen that pic a million times but I must admit, it never really gets old.

On the side note, STOP!!!! requesting Final Fantasy VII characters. Enough is Enough already. I can even probably understand FF:CC but VII or any other main series characters have no place in SSB. VII is a playstation exclusive, this is and will always be a NINTENDO brawler. The addition of Snake doesn't change anything. Wishing for Cloud, Tifa etc. is pointless. It is much better to wish for a final fantasy fighting game. Until then play "Ehrgeiz: God Bless the Ring" if you can even Find It. The closest thing you will find to Final Fantasy brawler. There cast includes Cloud, Tifa, Vincent, and pretty much any other of your stupid beloved Final Fantasy VII Characters.


I love you.

[BigBoss]

I'm rpetty sure people stopped requesting Final Fantasy characters quite a while ago.

[Penfold]

And didn't the last list had the kitchen sink in it?

That's what I recall.

[friendlyHunter]

friendlyhunter, you sound like you're trying to get a reaction out of people and/or sound unique.

And I can't complain enough about how Melee's graphics, especially compared to SSB's simplicity, are insanely cluttered and distracting (characters that are no more than a dozen pixels high, changing colour and suddenly appearing in different places all the time, behind a wall of flashing white smoke thingies, fire, explosions, AND the scoreboard

does anyone know what he just said? I honestly don't get it.

im not going to wet my pants because someone doesn't like my favorite game, but when you say it sucks for some reason that makes no sense at all, i just want you to clarify a little. just pick any one of the thousands of ssbm vids on youtube and show me where the graphics detract from the gameplay.

Ah, sorry, looks like my rediculous sentence was too unreadable. Here it is in point form:

Characteristics of the players that make them difficult to follow:
- they are often a very small size on the screen
- they change colour a lot (on fire, punched by gannondorf, etc, etc)
- they often change direction suddenly and move very long distances in a short amount of time (dodges, rolls, jumps, a lot of moves, getting hit, etc)
- fast camera movement (zooming/panning) contributes a bit too

Things the characters are often behind, partially or completely blocking view of them for varying amount of time:
- flashing white smoke thingies (you know, the ones that appear whenever anything happens)
- fire and explosions, etc.
- the score display (damage percentage and number of lives)

I am genuinely curious: am I the only one in the world who has a problem following the gameplay when I play? I'm often losing track of which character/flying object I am, causing me to fall off the stage just often enough to make it really annoying. I also find it difficult to tell which way I'm facing in mid-air, and whether I'm "stunned" after a hit. In the original SSB, you could clearly tell when you were spinning and could not do a double jump, which direction you were facing, and whether you still had a B-up move left in you. In Melee - I haven't got a hot clue half of the time. The high falling speed in Melee accentuates this problem a lot - I have trouble playing with Falco, and surviving on the DK stage (the one with Cranky, and without the DK rap). Actually, my problem with that DK level is mainly because of the camera - the angle makes it difficult to tell exactly which part of the ledge you can grab onto, and it's hard to see the platforms that players aren't on. Anyone else notice ANY of this stuff?
Anyone?

I'm definately not saying SSBM sucks because of this - I am however saying that I liked the original a lot better in that particular aspect. And it looks like the developers have caught on - the Brawl videos seem to have that non-melee "feel" where the characters actually have some weight and girth, and don't keep zipping around huge distances like deranged mosquitos. Or somethin'

Also note, little I say here is completely serious - don't over-dissect anything I wrote! ;-)

[linkspast]

Nope your not the only one... In larger stages this bothers me more.
and I knew exactly what you meant

[Blake]

I used to have trouble following the gameplay of SSBM after playing SSB. Actually I used to be a little turned off by it, but after I grew used to it I highly value the fast pace. It only gives an advantage to those who pay close attention and know their character.

[Theory of Nonexistence]

FFVII characters are impossible to be in the game because it was a PS2 exclusive, but what about some of the original Final Fantasy games. like FFI-FFVI. All of those were on Nintendo, right? Especially from FFI. No real specific characters, but It would be cool to see a Red Mage in there. None of the others really seem like they'd be very original except for Black Mage and White Mage. Warrior would be too much like Marth and Roy (nothing really but sword attacks). Thief would be about the same but with weaker attacks and more speed. Monk would be like a Street Fighter character. What else...am I forgetting any jobs from FFI?

Black Mage could seriously kick ass with Fire, Lightning, Blizzard and such with some dagger attacks for melee combat. White Mage would be pretty unreasonable though. Moderate hammer attacks with possibly Aero or whatever was white magic offensive back then. The only thing I can think of other than that, though, is healing magic, which would make him/her almost impossible to kill.

Now Red Mage would kick some serious ass. Dual wielding swords while casting low level fire, lightning, and blizzard.

Just...throwing more ideas out there.

[HideousBeing]

What else...am I forgetting any jobs from FFI?
How about the black belt?

[Theory of Nonexistence]

How about the black belt?

Isn't that the same as Monk pretty much?

[Ero Elohim]

FFVII characters are impossible to be in the game because it was a PS2 exclusive, but what about some of the original Final Fantasy games. like FFI-FFVI. All of those were on Nintendo, right? Especially from FFI. No real specific characters, but It would be cool to see a Red Mage in there. None of the others really seem like they'd be very original except for Black Mage and White Mage. Warrior would be too much like Marth and Roy (nothing really but sword attacks). Thief would be about the same but with weaker attacks and more speed. Monk would be like a Street Fighter character. What else...am I forgetting any jobs from FFI?

Black Mage could seriously kick ass with Fire, Lightning, Blizzard and such with some dagger attacks for melee combat. White Mage would be pretty unreasonable though. Moderate hammer attacks with possibly Aero or whatever was white magic offensive back then. The only thing I can think of other than that, though, is healing magic, which would make him/her almost impossible to kill.

Now Red Mage would kick some serious ass. Dual wielding swords while casting low level fire, lightning, and blizzard.

Just...throwing more ideas out there.

Man, Aero? That wasn't in FF1. You need the most awesomely-awesome offensive White Magic spell ever put into an RPG: HARM. Yep. Almost as good as Dragon Quest's HURT. You have to hand it to those guys who worked in the 80's. They had some creative minds.

Also, you're forgetting the Thief/Ninja.

[cobaltstarfire]

Dragoons/Dragon Knights could be intersting, I guess...?

[atmuh]

for the love of god nintendo just tell us who's in the freaking game so all this can stop

[HideousBeing]

Isn't that the same as Monk pretty much?
I dunno, come to think of it, I don't even recognize the Monk from FF1. Maybe you played the GB version? I played FF1 on the NES, and the classes available were: Fighter, Thief, White Mage, Red Mage, Black Mage, and Black Belt.

[wormguy]

for the love of god nintendo just tell us who's in the freaking game so all this can stop

quoted for truth

[Czar Diego]

Kefka. .

[Trapical]

Yeah! Lets throw as much shit at the wall as we can! Some of it is bound to stick, right?

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/7139/biggieqw5.jpg

Lol, okay Sahasrahla from Link to the Past? He can't even moves! Granted he can hand out boots... Hmmm, possible winner over the moon?

[Theory of Nonexistence]

Man, Aero? That wasn't in FF1. You need the most awesomely-awesome offensive White Magic spell ever put into an RPG: HARM. Yep. Almost as good as Dragon Quest's HURT. You have to hand it to those guys who worked in the 80's. They had some creative minds.

Meh, yeah, I'm mixing the games up...I'm just thinking of the early FF as a whole (even though I said FFI...) I've been playing FFIII lately so that's where I got the aero as a white magic idea. And yeah, HARM kicked ass :p


Also, you're forgetting the Thief/Ninja.

It's up there. Read again.I mentioned the thief for a sentence. Ninja is basically an advanced thief so it wouldn't be much different. Only cooler and it would have the ability to kill pirates.

[Dexie]

FFVII characters are impossible to be in the game because it was a PS2 exclusive,

Firstly, it was a PS1 exclusive.

Secondly...not saying I'd want him in the game, but Cloud and Aeris were both in Kingdom Hearts: Chain of Memories on GBA...so, technically, they *could* show up in Brawl. :p

[The Mutericator]

Lol, okay Sahasrahla from Link to the Past? He can't even moves! Granted he can hand out boots... Hmmm, possible winner over the moon?

Yeah, Tingle.

[The Mutericator]

quoted for truth

But it's so much fun!

[Aninymouse]

Ah man... never fails. Someone links a Melee video on YouTube and I spend the next few hours just scopin' for good matches.

That 1233 guy is like my hero. His DK is the sexiest thing I've ever seen. Except maybe for that one guy that was actually insanely good with Mewtwo years back... Man, underdogs ftw.

[atmuh]

I like good Bowsers.

[Oddllama]

I like good Bowsers.
And I cannot lie.
Those Mario brothers can't deny.
That when a Koopa comes in and starts laying waste
With a fireball to your face
You're well-done.
Wanna go down, though
Cuz you notice that Peach was stole'
Deep in the castle she's waitin'
I'm hooked and Bowser's baitin'
Oh, Bowsie I wanna get past ya,
And take you out to pasture.
My homeboys tried to tell me not
But that lava you got
Make me so hot!
Ooh, spikey turtle shell
You say you wanna send me to hell?
Well abuse me, abuse me, cuz you aint that average Koopy

BOWSER CAME BACK

[Penfold]

And I cannot lie.
Those Mario brothers can't deny.
That when a Koopa comes in and starts laying waste
With a fireball to your face
You're well-done.
Wanna go down, though
Cuz you notice that Peach was stole'
Deep in the castle she's waitin'
I'm hooked and Bowser's baitin'
Oh, Bowsie I wanna get past ya,
And take you out to pasture.
My homeboys tried to tell me not
But that lava you got
Make me so hot!
Ooh, spikey turtle shell
You say you wanna send me to hell?
Well abuse me, abuse me, cuz you aint that average Koopy

BOWSER CAME BACK

:nicework:

I lol'd.

[Airwalker]

And I cannot lie.
Those Mario brothers can't deny.
That when a Koopa comes in and starts laying waste
With a fireball to your face
You're well-done.
Wanna go down, though
Cuz you notice that Peach was stole'
Deep in the castle she's waitin'
I'm hooked and Bowser's baitin'
Oh, Bowsie I wanna get past ya,
And take you out to pasture.
My homeboys tried to tell me not
But that lava you got
Make me so hot!
Ooh, spikey turtle shell
You say you wanna send me to hell?
Well abuse me, abuse me, cuz you aint that average Koopy

BOWSER CAME BACK

WOAH. I'm not sure what just happened, but I somehow think somebody just got served.

[Lotd2242]

Firstly, it was a PS1 exclusive.

Secondly...not saying I'd want him in the game, but Cloud and Aeris were both in Kingdom Hearts: Chain of Memories on GBA...so, technically, they *could* show up in Brawl. :p

There are only two possible ways that would happen. Either they put him in as he is, and he becomes more or less invincible as he Omnislashes his way around the screen/makes the game take forever thanks to subsequent mimics of Knights of the Round, or they'd have to nerf him so badly it wouldn't even be worth it. Plus even if they nerfed him, the Buster Sword would take up half the screen.

And then Aerith, well between being able to completely heal herself, she's got that wonderful Great Gospel which not only heals everyone but makes them impervious to damage for a while.

[Sir_NutS]

And I cannot lie.
Those Mario brothers can't deny.
That when a Koopa comes in and starts laying waste
With a fireball to your face
You're well-done.
Wanna go down, though
Cuz you notice that Peach was stole'
Deep in the castle she's waitin'
I'm hooked and Bowser's baitin'
Oh, Bowsie I wanna get past ya,
And take you out to pasture.
My homeboys tried to tell me not
But that lava you got
Make me so hot!
Ooh, spikey turtle shell
You say you wanna send me to hell?
Well abuse me, abuse me, cuz you aint that average Koopy

BOWSER CAME BACK

I admit defeat.

[The Mutericator]

And I cannot lie.
Those Mario brothers can't deny.
That when a Koopa comes in and starts laying waste
With a fireball to your face
You're well-done.
Wanna go down, though
Cuz you notice that Peach was stole'
Deep in the castle she's waitin'
I'm hooked and Bowser's baitin'
Oh, Bowsie I wanna get past ya,
And take you out to pasture.
My homeboys tried to tell me not
But that lava you got
Make me so hot!
Ooh, spikey turtle shell
You say you wanna send me to hell?
Well abuse me, abuse me, cuz you aint that average Koopy

BOWSER CAME BACK

Speaking of underdogs...

[Paratha]

Yeah, Tingle.

zomg Tingle in Smash. zomg. I'd probably use him all the time.

If the world goes to hell and Cloud is in Smash, he should be made the worst character ever. First, he should be the wheelchair-bound (unusually) messed-up Cloud. Not the other kind. Secondly, his battle routine would just be uttering random words, depending on what buttons you press. This would make people quiet down about putting FF characters in Smash for a while.

[BigBoss]

This would make people quiet down about putting FF characters in Smash for a while.

no it wouldnt stupid it would just make them do nothing but bitch bitch bitch

[ILLiterate]

If they did put him in, just make him a Link-ish character. Someone all the noobs use so their easy to identify, and it takes some actual skill to use him

[FuriousFure]

If they did put him in, just make him a Link-ish character. Someone all the noobs use so their easy to identify, and it takes some actual skill to use him

If Linky-poo is SOOOoOoo noobish, why oh why is he in the middle/ bottom tier? what are those tiers even showing?

as for Tingle, The moon, and The giants, they were in a smash bros already, they had thier chance and blew it.

Mario or Luigi should get to use their hammers from Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi: Parterns in Time.

Oh and is anyone else sorta fearing what Kirby's copying ability will utilize when swallowing Zero Suit Samus? Before he took on her helmet but now all she ghas is her *ahem* "curves" and the blaster/whip thingy.

Cel-shaded Kirby will be cool tho.

[HideousBeing]

Oh and is anyone else sorta fearing what Kirby's copying ability will utilize when swallowing Zero Suit Samus? Before he took on her helmet but now all she ghas is her *ahem* "curves" and the blaster/whip thingy.Lol! Zero Suit Samus Kirby will probably just where a tight blue jumpsuit like hers. Maybe he'll have the hair or ponytail too.
This brings to mind, wouldn't Meta Knight Kirby look a lot like Meta Knight himself? Meta Knight, behind the mask, is just a blue kirby after all. If Kirby donned Meta Knight's mask, he would be Meta Knight.

[FuriousFure]

Lol! Zero Suit Samus Kirby will probably just where a tight blue jumpsuit like hers. Maybe he'll have the hair or ponytail too.
This brings to mind, wouldn't Meta Knight Kirby look a lot like Meta Knight himself? Meta Knight, behind the mask, is just a blue kirby after all. If Kirby donned Meta Knight's mask, he would be Meta Knight.

well, well! I didn't think of that! but i had a dangerous thing called a idea. what if, bare with me please, if player one was Kirby and the player two was Meta Knight and so when Kirby swallows Meta Knight, Kirby become Meta Knight and Meta Knight loses his mask and becomes Kirby!

Now Player One is Meta and Player two is Kirby!

In Smash Bros, Chaos is the Name of the Game.

[friendlyHunter]

Paper Mario as a character! =D

And yeah, Kirby will definately get the Samus hair (if the move he steals is indeed a Zero-Suit-only move). MAN that would look weird.... but not as weird as "Cloud" Kirby, or "The Moon" Kirby. Quick, someone photoshop up a Moon Kirby!


And now, my little (big) rant on clone characters:

Let's consider Pikachu as a character in the Pokemon game and cartoon series'. He can do several different things with his electrical abilities - let's say 20 things. To turn him into a SB character, what you want to do is take a bunch of those things which are representative of the original character, and turn them into around 4-12 Smash Bros moves (B-moves, smashes, throws, etc.). Now you want another character: Pichu. What you want to do is start this process over from the beginning, picking things that Pichu does in specific, things that make Pichu special (note: I know very little about Pokemon). Now why on earth would one take the moves from Pikachu's character?? Time and money constraints, it's lazier, "because I can"... the list goes on! When I critisized clone characters here way back when, I got several responses saying that that aspect of character development was NOT rushed, and they did indeed make the best choice. I roll my eyes at you Melee "fanboys"! :roll: :roll: I'm not saying it was an awful choice (it's still fun, and there's more variety, etc.), but it defeats the purpose of fighting as specific characters when their moves have nothing to do with said characters.

Now lets use another example:
First you want to design Captian Falcon, a character who's potential fighting moves can come only from tiny tidbits of information given in a few racing games, and a character from a TV show. I'm glad to say they did an awsome job (though my only knowledge of the show comes from that awsome Falcon Punch video ^^).

Anyway, now you want to make Ganondorf, who's got nothing do with the Cap'n. Yet all his moves are exactly the same for some reason. Major corner cutting? Definately. Fun? Yep. Ganondorf? Well, he looks and sounds like him, and he's got some purple stuff....? but it's not Ganondorf, really. How would everyone feel if Sonic was in Brawl, but he only had Captain Falcon's moves? I dunno, I'd think being a cheap clone would be worse than not being included at all.

The main problem is that moves that fit in SSB's or Melee's fighting style may not fit in Brawl's. Others (Mario's cape swing, Peach's exploding butt thing) seem to have come way out of left field and don't represent the original character AT ALL (correct me if those two particular moves are actually in a Mario game, I'm a little curious ;-) ). I'm hoping they come up with all new move sets for the B-moves - all of them should be either replaced, or tweaked to fit both into Brawl's fighting style AND the original material. Some moves, such as Peach's vegetables and Samus' screw attack, fit very nicely into both the gameplay, and honouring the previous Mario/Metroid games - I couldn't complain if they kept these virtually the same. On the other hand, there are moves like Link's sword spin and Samus' charge shot - they're practically EXACTLY the same in SSB and SSBM, and yet you don't do anything close to that in any Zelda/Metroid games. Seems they've become Smash Bros. staples, but I won't be sad to see the spin attack and charge shot axed (or even better, changed to be a lot more like a Zelda/Metroid game). Call it whining (because it is, really), but I think the characters should get their moves from the games they came from.

Bottom line: I want to play with mostly new moves, not the exact same ones from two other games. Online play is yet another reason to do this: If Brawl's moves are all the same, pro Melee veterans get to use all their insane Melee skills in Brawl, and Melee newbs would come into Brawl unable to have a chance of winning a match. You can't have massive skill gaps in online play, unless you have a really good skill-matching system. Granted, I don't have a DS so I don't know what I'm talking about here ^_^. Same thing applies for single player - leveling the playing field by having new sets of moves will give single player a LOT more potential (won't be way too easy or way too hard). Sorry to bore you all. But c'mon, whining and being opinionated - that what this thread's all about, right?


[Edit]
well, well! I didn't think of that! but i had a dangerous thing called a idea. what if, bare with me please, if player one was Kirby and the player two was Meta Knight and so when Kirby swallows Meta Knight, Kirby become Meta Knight and Meta Knight loses his mask and becomes Kirby!

Now Player One is Meta and Player two is Kirby!

In Smash Bros, Chaos is the Name of the Game.
http://www.smashbros.com/en/characters/chara1/img/photo_l.jpg
Meta Knight's got a lot more than just a mask (and he has wings too, I think?) - even I'd be able to easily tell the difference ;p

[linkspast]

In Smash Bros, Chaos is the Name of the Game.

Hmmm I like the way that sounds.

"Super Smash Bros. Chaos"



EDIT: Friendly Hunter, watch these. they may provide some back story for some of the moves, Ie marios cape.
http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=CrappyCaptureDevice

[SoloGamer]

The main problem is that moves that fit in SSB's or Melee's fighting style may not fit in Brawl's. Others (Mario's cape swing, Peach's exploding butt thing) seem to have come way out of left field and don't represent the original character AT ALL (correct me if those two particular moves are actually in a Mario game, I'm a little curious ;-) ).

...

On the other hand, there are moves like Link's sword spin and Samus' charge shot - they're practically EXACTLY the same in SSB and SSBM, and yet you don't do anything close to that in any Zelda/Metroid games. Seems they've become Smash Bros. staples, but I won't be sad to see the spin attack and charge shot axed (or even better, changed to be a lot more like a Zelda/Metroid game). Call it whining (because it is, really), but I think the characters should get their moves from the games they came from.


Mario's cape swing comes from Super Mario World, in which he can attack enemies with his cape powerup.

Link's Sword Spin has been in every Zelda game since LttP

Samus can charge her shot in all Metroid games after she's found the proper powerup

[friendlyHunter]

Mario's cape swing comes from Super Mario World, in which he can attack enemies with his cape powerup.

Link's Sword Spin has been in every Zelda game since LttP

Samus can charge her shot in all Metroid games after she's found the proper powerup

Yeah, those three are pretty obvious, but in Smash Bros. they're clearly much different than they originally were. Link's spin attack is different because he spins so many times, and doesn't seem to really swing his sword - but I'll admit the goofy spinning like a top looks much more fitting when Link's in the air. Samus' charge shot in SB is so completely different from anything in a Metroid game, I won't even go into that. Mario's cape - they can make Link spin like Mario on steroids, but somehow Mario just does a lame little swing? The original cape damaged/killed enemies, and never reflected projectiles back (though it did deflect them into oblivion...). Ah well, who cares =P

[FuriousFure]

yeah, I'm not gonna quote ya cause there too damn much to sort it all out.

like that guy above me said,

Samus, Link, and Mario's moves are fully justified.

as for Ganondorf's? we've only seen him fight with a sword(s) but his dark magic aura is plausible. he's surrounded in that stuff in the games, at least wind waker.

and as for "clones" they're alright as long as they change enough of the factors of the game.

Luigi: Jumps higher,a little lighter, and has some karate chop action, also does a human cannon ball

Ganondorf: slower, heavier, more powerful. I do great as Ganondorf but don't like Capt. Falcon. it gives players more options so i'm not gonna complain about that.

Falco: stronger blaster, i don't know about speed, and is a bird instead of a fox

Pichu: smaller, faster, lighter, and pointless, but then again more options

anyways as much as I would like to see all characters be completely unique with everyone of there moves being directly related to their games. it wouldn't work so much for fun factor or playability for that matter. (ex.) Dr. Mario could only stand there throw a pill every so often and tap his foot I think

So quit your completely uneducated complaints, please.

[SoloGamer]

Yeah, those three are pretty obvious, but in Smash Bros. they're clearly much different than they originally were.

Ok, I was just clarifying because this part of your post:

yet you don't do anything close to that in any Zelda/Metroid games.

made it sound like you've never seen Link do a spin attack or Samus charge a shot in their respective games.

[HideousBeing]

In response to the whole deal about clones... I figure that having a character, even if it is a clone, is better than not having a character. The more characters the better. I'm sure someone agrees with me. Not to mention, all the clones are for more different from their "root" than they may seem. Get a good Fox player, and ask him why he doesn't play Falco. He'll give you a hundred differences. Really. Clones are hardly copies at all.
I like to think of it this way: If Ganandorf had different animations for his moves when he was created, most of you gripers wouldn't even have notice that he is based off of Captain Falcon. You're whining about similar animations, not similar move sets.

[Oddllama]

Complacency breeds mediocrity

[Rambo]

Complacency breeds mediocrity

Thank you, wise and gracious llama. :lol:

[Cerrax]

Yeah, those three are pretty obvious, but in Smash Bros. they're clearly much different than they originally were. Link's spin attack is different because he spins so many times, and doesn't seem to really swing his sword - but I'll admit the goofy spinning like a top looks much more fitting when Link's in the air. Samus' charge shot in SB is so completely different from anything in a Metroid game, I won't even go into that. Mario's cape - they can make Link spin like Mario on steroids, but somehow Mario just does a lame little swing? The original cape damaged/killed enemies, and never reflected projectiles back (though it did deflect them into oblivion...). Ah well, who cares =P

Yet you want all the characters to be balanced. If Mario's cape could do damage, then it would just be another simple attack and would lessen his variety. The cape as is, allows Mario to approach projectiles from a more agressive standpoint. He can also use the cape to turn an opponent around, opening up an opportunity for a back attack.

Then the spin attack. If it was more true to the game, then it would act like the spin attack in SSB. Problem is, the spin attack in SSB sucked. Very slow, and only did one hit. The new SSBM spin attack can deal multiple hits and has a powerful last hit that gives the same knockback as the original spin attack from SSB. Without it, Link would just be a slow semi-powerful character, and would be even lower in the teirs than he already is.

Samus's charge shot looks almost exactly like it does in metroid, so I don't know what your problem is with that one.

[ILLiterate]

Ahh...you guys give me so much work to do every day :P

If Linky-poo is SOOOoOoo noobish, why oh why is he in the middle/ bottom tier? what are those tiers even showing?
That's not a good place to be. A tier is a list that, in basic, says which characters in a game are the best to worst from the Top Tier to the Bottom Tier. It has a lot to do with how well these characters do in tournaments, their advantages, their disadvantages and how hard it is to play them.

Link is the "noob character" because when people play Smash, almost everyone will pick Link or Mario, because they're so recognizable and they like their attacks, especially the Link spin attack. It's VERY hard to be good with Link on the level of someone like The Germ (or the ghettoist white boy who plays Smash) (http://youtube.com/watch?v=ld4jb9Z9OYA). It's possible to be good with any character, even Pichu, the problem is someone who would play a character like Fox will just destroy that Pichu, just because Fox is THE BEST in the game, but not just that character, all of the top tier and the upper middle tier would as well

And whoever was saying that "Kirby would suck up Meta-Knight and become Meta-Knight!!!" no, you're wrong, that was dumb. Two completely different characters, Kirby would only have his neutral b move, and as we all should know, most neutral b moves are complete crap compared to the rest of that characters moves

[chrono26]

And whoever was saying that "Kirby would suck up Meta-Knight and become Meta-Knight!!!" no, you're wrong, that was dumb. Two completely different characters, Kirby would only have his neutral b move, and as we all should know, most neutral b moves are complete crap compared to the rest of that characters moves

i go whole matches with kirby and hardly ever inhale anyone. if i do its to interupt their attack or something like that. when you see little kids play they just suck you up over and over again and steal powers. thats not the smartest way to play kirby. and that germ guys is NUTS! with link.

[atmuh]

most neutral b moves are complete crap compared to the rest of that characters moves

pills and fireballs are fun : D

also yea I've played against some pretty good people in SSBM and fox and falco are just the best characters in the game, and I have NEVER seen someone good as Link, except in that video

I guess Link is a noob character because in a noob vs noob fight the sword spin is an easy kill move

[Aninymouse]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v153/ANinyMouse/1158464435214sy7.jpg

Kirby eated the moon oh noes!