Wait a second... how are videogames fun?

[KWarp]

90% of the time I play videogames I am confused, frustrated, or disoriented. Where does this whole games = fun idea come from?

[atmuh]

wii bowling

[supremespleen]

wii tennis

[Dark Chocobo]

Zelda.

[Ab56 v2 aka Ash]

Same can be said about sports. Even if you lose a bunch of matches, it's the practicing, the challenge, and the experience that overcome difficulty and frustration.

[atmuh]

Zelda.
kinda

I'm not saying anything bad about Zelda games in general, this actually applies to all games, but how often can you sit back and say "wow this is FUN."

[Steben]

Zelda.
kinda

I'm not saying anything bad about Zelda games in general, this actually applies to all games, but how often can you sit back and say "wow this is FUN."
When I'm playing Elite Beat Agents.

YOU BET KID

[supremespleen]

Zelda.
kinda

I'm not saying anything bad about Zelda games in general, this actually applies to all games, but how often can you sit back and say "wow this is FUN."More like, wow this is cool, wow that is pretty, wow this is epic, wow midna is HOT.

[Bobwillis]

habit

[Zutnunzor]

Teamwork to achieve the utterly retarded.

To have that one moment, where everything goes right, as hundreds spectate upon your every movement, and you perform flawlessly under so much tension. Perfection.

And of course, to beat your friends and go "HAHA NEWBIE!!!!111"

[HalcyonSpirit]

As Ab56 said, part of it is the challenge and overcoming the obstacle. We, as humans, love to overcome anything that faces us. We want to be superior. What makes games fun is that you can show that you are superior at something without the physical effort required for other activities. It's easy, the task isn't too difficult, and you know that it is possible no matter what someone says.

Also, it gives us a chance to be someone else. We can imagine ourselves in a different life. That is fun to us, because we can do things that we normally couldn't do.

Oh, and Zutnunzor hit the nail on the head with that particular part of it. :lol:

[Kitsuta]

Is TV really all that entertaining? Are movies all that great?

It's called escapism. Games let us be other people, or at least in other situations, for as long as we play them.

That is their chief appeal - distraction. When we play games(or watch TV or read books) we don't have to think about our actual lives.








...Just kidding. Games are a way of using our brains in a relatively non stressful situation(unless you take them too seriously, in which case you suck). Even if you get frustrated and die 5000 times, there's no ACTUAL repercussions besides lost time. It's a good trade off, considering the "Victory is mine" feeling you get when you actually do well and the general entertainment and, yes, escapism value.

I don't think "fun" games are going away - it just depends on what you play. If most of the time you are frustrated, confused, etc you may want to consider playing some more laid back games, or just relaxing your standards. ...although I hardly think you'd be uptight about a game.

[Bigfoot]

Earthbound

[KWarp]

Seriously guys, this is a big issue. I've read books on gaming based on the assumption that games are fun. What if that isn't necessarily true?

Zelda.
Here's what I do most of time in Zelda:
-circling around the environment for solutions to dungeon puzzles/hidden items
-frantically attacking enemies and not hurting them half the time
-walking

Those things lead to fun, but they aren't often in themselves.

[Kitsuta]

Earthbound

No! Bad Bigfoot! We're talking about CURRENT games!

Or do you really want this to turn into a whinefest about how the games 'back then' were ten bazillion times better or what not?

[SilverStar]

Zelda.
kinda

I'm not saying anything bad about Zelda games in general, this actually applies to all games, but how often can you sit back and say "wow this is FUN."More like, wow this is cool, wow that is pretty, wow this is epic, wow midna is HOT.

You know.. for how many people love to say Midna is hot...

Just which Midna are you talking about? The little imp Midna who rides around on Link's back and bosses him around(eventually resorting to begging..), for 30-70 hours of the game, or the more human Midna you see for maybe 3 minutes in a cutscene at the end of the game?

Because, you know, if it's the first one, I can think of a couple signature memes that would fit, to describe it.

[Kitsuta]

Seriously guys, this is a big issue. I've read books on gaming based on the assumption that games are fun. What if that isn't necessarily true?

Zelda.
Here's what I do most of time in Zelda:
-circling around the environment for solutions to dungeon puzzles/hidden items
-frantically attacking enemies and not hurting them half the time
-walking

Those things lead to fun, but they aren't often in themselves.

Well, I don't really see why you are demanding instant gratification. You don't make money by the actual act of going to school - you make money afterwards by knowing at least simple mathematics. Same with games.

There does have to be a certain balance of grinding vs rewards, and games that fail at this are really annoying. Of course there are also games where the actual act of playing is in itself amusing. All I can think of are Wii games though. ;)

It's less of "is the act of playing this game fun" and more of "do I get good enough rewards from playing this game to justify the time I waste on it." That's why some people love MMORPGs while others despise them - it depends a lot on how tolerant people are of grinding.

[BlueMage]

Zelda.
kinda

I'm not saying anything bad about Zelda games in general, this actually applies to all games, but how often can you sit back and say "wow this is FUN."

Every single boss fight so far in Twilight Princess, I have thought to myself "Damn, that was fun ... I wanna go again :("

[Mustin]

Gears of War

[parasoul]

Gears of War

Gears of War is very fun...especially when you play it co-op with a friend and spend the entire time cussing at each other and complaining about who needs the ammo case more. Seriously though, Gears of War was very fun and the bitching made it more so.

Also, Wii Tennis...and SSBM...I'm still playing that...and Guitar Hero...

Perhaps OP is playing the wrong games.

[Evilhead]

Okami

Katamari Damacy

[The wingless]

90% of the time I play videogames I am confused, frustrated, or disoriented. Where does this whole games = fun idea come from?

My father once recommended me a book, whose title escapes me. After muddling through the first chapter, I put it down. My father returned some time later and asked for my thoughts on the book. I replied, "It's a pretty boring book." To which my father replied, "Could be. Or, you could just be a boring person."

The point is, the fact that these games quote: confuse, frustrate, and disorient you could simply be because you are a confused, frustrating, and disorienting person.

Ergo sum: maybe you're just a quintessential moron.

Seriously, what halfrate fuckwit cocksneeze dreamt up this flame-bait topic?

shut it down. SHUT IT DOWN, FOREVER.

[KWarp]

The Dirty little secret of gaming is how much time you spend not having fun. You may be frustrated; you may be confused or disoriented; you may be stuck. When you put the game down and move back to the real world, you may find yourself mentally working through the problem you've been wrestling with, as though you've been worrying about a loose tooth. If this is mindless escapism, it's a strangely masochistic version. Who wants to escape into a world that irritates you 90 percent of the time?
-Everything Bad is Good For You

wingless, you are the last person I expected to outright dismiss this idea. :?

[Bigfoot]

Earthbound

No! Bad Bigfoot! We're talking about CURRENT games!

Or do you really want this to turn into a whinefest about how the games 'back then' were ten bazillion times better or what not?

"Zelda" was mentioned, but that doesn't mean the current one :p

[Carci]

Wingless... PMS, hun?

[The wingless]

The Dirty little secret of gaming is how much time you spend not having fun. You may be frustrated; you may be confused or disoriented; you may be stuck. When you put the game down and move back to the real world, you may find yourself mentally working through the problem you've been wrestling with, as though you've been worrying about a loose tooth. If this is mindless escapism, it's a strangely masochistic version. Who wants to escape into a world that irritates you 90 percent of the time?
-Everything Bad is Good For You

wingless, you are the last person I expected to outright dismiss this idea. :?

I'm outright dismissing the initial post, which is vague, stupifyingly terse, and beyond all other things, is just plain infuriating.

Any topic that has the inmitigated gaul to demand a explanation into a phenominon we all get needs to be flamed.

What makes this post doubly insulting is that I've read that Everything Bad is Good For You essay. It's talking about World of Warcraft, and to a greater extent, MMORPGS. If you had put *that* in the topic and asked for some kind of discussion, well, that would've been find and dandy!

Instead, you became FUCKED... by ME.

I will punch you through these tubes, dood. Swear to Vishnu.

[Nec5]

You don't make money by the actual act of going to school - you make money afterwards by knowing at least simple mathematics. or not.

[Dhsu]

Glad you had this little epiphany, KWarp.

Now explain why it matters?

Edit: Wingless is right, it's a good idea to cite your sources *before* you get called out on it.

[Arek the Absolute]

damn wingless, calm the fuck down
you are reminding me of nekofrog, except you can get away with shit because you were former judge
fuck
*you know i love you, you sexy beast*

[The wingless]

yes. Heaven forbid we should call someone out on the intertubes.

By the way Arek... YOU ABOUT TO GET FUCKED TOO, AS WELL, ALSO!!

[I-n-j-i-n]

I think the question is pretty valid. Because in RPGs, I spend hours upon agonizing hours for that one moment of victory or satisfaction. Going through entire seasons of sports games just so that I get the satisfaction in the end. Playing a thousand volleyball matches for a swimsuit. Racing hundreds of tracks to unlock more track to race on.

But it's fun struggling through games. For some reason.

[Mustin]

The Wingless for the win.

Also, cocks

[Nec5]

We all live lives of quiet desperation. Video games allow us to achieve some sense of victory... Or we just like blowing shit up.

[Vig]

Videogames suck and are for people who can't get laid

Wingless is right; Videogames suck and are for people who can't get laid.

[Bigfoot]

I think the question is pretty valid. Because in RPGs, I spend hours upon agonizing hours for that one moment of victory or satisfaction. Going through entire seasons of sports games just so that I get the satisfaction in the end. Playing a thousand volleyball matches for a swimsuit. Racing hundreds of tracks to unlock more track to race on.

But it's fun struggling through games. For some reason.

Because it's always fun trying to go for that perfect achievement.


Like in DDR, everyone goes for a AAA ranking, and(especially on hard songs) you definitely feel accomplished.

[Vig]

Just a thought: The idea of enduring great hardship for some abstract or fleeting payoff is hardly foreign or unusual when observing human behavior.

[Arek the Absolute]

yes. Heaven forbid we should call someone out on the intertubes.

By the way Arek... YOU ABOUT TO GET FUCKED TOO, AS WELL, ALSO!!
cool

[Cyanide cr MK]

Theres nothing like pulling off a long agonizing juggle on your opponant, eventually ending in a super and turning that into an unblockable situation, allowing another long combo, possibly a reset , and a mixup, all set to your favorite music, ending a perfect round and continuing to juggle them after the match is over.

Sorry for the run on sentance, but its moments like that that make games fun.

Beasting.

Exploring worlds that arent available for us to explore in real life due to limited finances and crammed schedule.

There are a lot of reasons. If games weren't fun people wouldnt play them. If games weren't fun you wouldn't be sitting here during your free time looking at a screen typing about games.

Bla bla bla bla bla!!!!

[The wingless]

Just a thought: The idea of enduring great hardship for some abstract or fleeting payoff is hardly foreign or unusual when observing human behavior.

moreliek o kewl i get 2 be-cum a judge.

[Cyanide cr MK]

^^^^You're a funny man. Your songs are good too. 8)

[Vig]

Just a thought: The idea of enduring great hardship for some abstract or fleeting payoff is hardly foreign or unusual when observing human behavior.

moreliek o kewl i get 2 be-cum a judge.

No kidding.

[The Orichalcon]

I think the question is pretty valid. Because in RPGs, I spend hours upon agonizing hours for that one moment of victory or satisfaction. Going through entire seasons of sports games just so that I get the satisfaction in the end. Playing a thousand volleyball matches for a swimsuit. Racing hundreds of tracks to unlock more track to race on.

But it's fun struggling through games. For some reason.

It's important that the journey is as exciting as the destination. If you're just playing for one moment of satisfaction at the end of a game, you're playing for the wrong reasons.

[suzumebachi]

It's important that the journey is as exciting as the destination. If you're just playing for one moment of satisfaction at the end of a game, you're playing for the wrong reasons.

Or as CotMM once explained to me eons ago, you don't play golf for the green jacket.

[!Nekko!]

Endorphins

[JohnderriLLL]

I like video games because they make me angry and violent.

[KWarp]

Seems like Wingless says I didn't prepare the question well. I'll do so next time. >.>

It seems Steven Johnson has a pretty similar explanation to Raph Koster as to why videogames have mass appeal: videogames are full to the brim of readily available, clearly defined challenges and rewards. Rewards = feel good = fun.

Yes Dhsu, epiphany. :wink:

[GeckoYamori]

You're probably playing too many japanese RPGs.

[CE]

You're probably playing too many japanese RPGs.

Or MMOs.

Point is that different games have different appeals. Metal Gear Solid appeals for the characters and storyline and to a certain extent the stealth. The "fun" comes from another part of the game other then the gameplay (well, most of the times). Same could be told of Zelda, it's how the dungeons are made, the minigames, how cool the bosses are, etc.

Other games, like WarioWare, slap you with the "fun" from minute one. It's all about what the hell you're playing.

[supremespleen]

Zelda.
kinda

I'm not saying anything bad about Zelda games in general, this actually applies to all games, but how often can you sit back and say "wow this is FUN."More like, wow this is cool, wow that is pretty, wow this is epic, wow midna is HOT.

You know.. for how many people love to say Midna is hot...

Just which Midna are you talking about? The little imp Midna who rides around on Link's back and bosses him around(eventually resorting to begging..), for 30-70 hours of the game, or the more human Midna you see for maybe 3 minutes in a cutscene at the end of the game?

Because, you know, if it's the first one, I can think of a couple signature memes that would fit, to describe it.yiff yiff, if you know what I mean.

[Fire in the Hole]

Zelda.
kinda

I'm not saying anything bad about Zelda games in general, this actually applies to all games, but how often can you sit back and say "wow this is FUN."More like, wow this is cool, wow that is pretty, wow this is epic, wow midna is HOT.

You know.. for how many people love to say Midna is hot...

Just which Midna are you talking about? The little imp Midna who rides around on Link's back and bosses him around(eventually resorting to begging..), for 30-70 hours of the game, or the more human Midna you see for maybe 3 minutes in a cutscene at the end of the game?

Because, you know, if it's the first one, I can think of a couple signature memes that would fit, to describe it.yiff yiff, if you know what I mean.

They're actually talking about the giant Fused Shadow tentacle being. Hurrrrrrrr

I don't know what's wrong with you guys, but I had fun during every single second of Twilight Princess. Seriously, if you're getting worked up about it then you're playing it wrong. Stop taking the game so seriously and you'll have so much more fun than ever before.

[Bummerdude]

A fun game to me is a challenging, humorous and yet simple game, whether you're giving out commands to several characters or jumps up and down with an italian plumber. When you defeat a boss, solve a puzzle or somehow manages to get to the next level, the satisfaction that comes out of it is what makes me want to continue to play.

I don't know if that can be called "fun", but it works for me.

[JoeFu]

Why is tag fun? I hate running around, but tag was fun when I was a kid.

But still, if you don't think about it, it's fun.

I suck at basketball, but playing it is fun.

I like videogames, playing it is fun.

[Darth Lime]

Videogames are "fun" because you enter a realm where you can escape the pressures of "the real world" and enjoy a fantasic RPG or an exciting shooter or a pedal-to-the-metal race.

They are fun because it pleasures the brain by releasing endorphins. That makes us feel good.

Also, as many have said, they make us feel on top of the world, the king of kings, the almighty, the superior. I get this feeling when playing violent games such as God of War and Postal 2.

Not saying I am a violent person or not. I enjoy RPGs as much as the next guy but most of the time, I end up frustrated. But when I overcome an obstacle in my way, I celebrate. Beating a mission on Tony Hawks American Wasteland made me very happy. Slaughtering hundreds of Hades' undead soldiers and ripping of harpy wings in God of War makes me grin with anger. Games are fun to some, annoying to others and degrading to some politic ians. It our job as gamers to dispell those hateful remarks and show that games are more than just evil and vile things but joyous and wonderful creations that entertains you and helps hand-eye coordination.

/end rant

[Less Ashamed Of Self]

Videogames R fun,

[SP]

http://www.gamedev.net/columns/books/bookdetails.asp?productid=510

[KWarp]

http://www.gamedev.net/columns/books/bookdetails.asp?productid=510
Read like 5 times. :P

[Souliarc]

It's important that the journey is as exciting as the destination. If you're just playing for one moment of satisfaction at the end of a game, you're playing for the wrong reasons.

Or as CotMM once explained to me eons ago, you don't play golf for the green jacket.

i plae golf 2 driv the cart n skweal tirez

[Audity]

I found that playing games with a buddy is really that much more entertaining.

Oftentimes I think about a few games that I want to play, and don't want to play them at the moment. Playing DragonQuest 8 at someone's house while I was visiting for a couple weeks was really fun when compared to sitting there playing it by myself.

Unless it's a game I really just want to play through because I heard it's really good, I typically don't want to play a game. When you're at someone's house, it's way way more interactive. The concept of the first sentence of this paragraph can stem from the fact that many other people in the world are playing a popular game, so you can interact with other people easily, even online.

This is just my take on it from thinking for about 2 seconds.

[The Vagrance]

Personally, every game I love has to have "Damn that was badass" moments. Like in Halo 2 (damn near everything in it), or Madden (whenever you level someone or intercept or something), or Gran Turismo 4(Cutting off the other driver just before the finish), or in Final Fantasy XII (Despite not pressing anything watching my characters terrorize the enemies gives me a great feeling of accomplishment, and don't get me started on those quickening combos), or in Okami (That wheel thing is sweet), or even the simple things like in Oddworld: Stranger, whenever he goes into a full sprint and the controls allow you to cut corners and everything else. Things like that keep me coming back to a game, for that short, simple adrenaline rush.

[Drakonis GTR]

I would think that it is all about what you consider fun. If you like puzzles, then you'll find puzzle games fun. Like driving? Then you probably like racing games.

If I was playing a game where I didn't find it fun and there wasn't any other draw for me, then I would seriously consider NOT playing it. There are plenty of other games out there. I don't think there are any games out there that are so important that you HAVE to play them, even if they're as boring as watching paint peel.

Just remember that for every game you don't find fun, there is someone out there who enjoys it.

[A-RoN]

Seriously guys, this is a big issue. I've read books on gaming based on the assumption that games are fun. What if that isn't necessarily true?

Zelda.
Here's what I do most of time in Zelda:
-circling around the environment for solutions to dungeon puzzles/hidden items
-frantically attacking enemies and not hurting them half the time
-walking

Those things lead to fun, but they aren't often in themselves.

Games actually exercise my brain if they're diffucult. I think by saying that, if you want a game where you don't have to think or exercise the reflexes in your fingers and arms (or legs if into DDR), you will not find one, unless it's a freeware fan-game online. Go back to playing the first Super Mario Bros. Problem solved.

[Maxx]

FUN = getting a speeding ticket on the way home from work, then spending an hour or so after getting home just killing bacon on any GTA title. preferably GTA3.

sidenote,... this also includes the killing, maiming, burning, or fucking of any fag, old lady, redneck, pimp, hooker, or rescue worker on the scene at the time you smear the pig/pork/bacon/police officer/pedifile.

that is fun...but I like other games too.. :wink:

[parasoul]

Just remember that for every game you don't find fun, there is someone out there who enjoys it.

Except Superman 64.

[The Damned]

Superman 64 serves a very important purpose. It exists to make even the really bad games look a little better.

[Ero Elohim]

DISCLAIMER: This is not a joke post. The story within is completely true. Any similarities to persons living or dead is entirely coincidental.

I know a friend whose little brother believes Superman 64 to be the best game that exists.

[FuriousFure]

DISCLAIMER: This is not a joke post. The story within is completely true. Any similarities to persons living or dead is entirely coincidental.

I know a friend whose little brother believes Superman 64 to be the best game that exists.

oh yeah? thats nothing! my younger bro thought Army Men: sarges heros was awesome. O_O


and they're right. videogames are fun, it's all about solving problems. (literal or not) its the challenge that drives us.

[supremespleen]

DISCLAIMER: This is not a joke post. The story within is completely true. Any similarities to persons living or dead is entirely coincidental.

I know a friend whose little brother believes Superman 64 to be the best game that exists.

oh yeah? thats nothing! my younger bro thought Army Men: sarges heros was awesome. O_O


and they're right. videogames are fun, it's all about solving problems. (literal or not) its the challenge that drives us.believe it or not, some people like different things.

[Zeklan]

SSBM /endthread

[richter]

KWarp, I understand where you're coming from. I have very little patience and even less time to play video games, so I play games on easy when I can, and when I can't, I buy the strategy guide.

I knew when I began playing Twilight Princess that I'd miss certain things or get to a puzzle that would take me 20 minutes to solve, and I hate that shit, so I just cheat when I stop having fun.

Other than that, have you considered the fact that maybe you just don't like video games much? They're certainly not for everyone...

[Bongo Bill]

90% of the time I play videogames I am confused, frustrated, or disoriented. Where does this whole games = fun idea come from?

Because people didn't have a better word for the psychologically complex senses of accomplishment, immersion, puzzle-solvery, and other different forms of entertainment upon which games now rely almost exclusively.

[AbyssWyrm]

90% of the time I play videogames I am confused, frustrated, or disoriented. Where does this whole games = fun idea come from?

If you don't think video games are fun then don't play them. Go read a book or get a hobby or go outside or something, not that complicated.

Games at which I have actually said "Wow this is fun":

Super Mario Bros. 3
Yoshi's Island
Mario Kart Double Dash
Katamari Damacy
We Love Katamari
Super Mario RPG

Most of my favorite games are RPGs which I wouldn't necessarily call "fun," but that doesn't mean I don't enjoy them. (If it does mean that I don't enjoy them, then I would call them "fun." Please, let's not debate semantics.)

[Blake]

You guys think Nascar is fun? I don't either. But my dad is a huge Nascar fan, and he is in love with any racing game, especially Nascar. He says it's extremely fun because he likes racing, but to me it's just a simulated ride going in circles. But he doesn't get why I like adventure games or FPS's. Because I like being put in a position that is usually beyond this relatively mundane world, or just being put in a situation I find more interesting.