Final Fantasy VII (7) DS: Is it possible?

[djdexcat]

Let me start off by saying this: Years ago, I was too young and video game ignorant to have heard of Final Fantasy. Or even the Playstation. I keep on hearing about how great FF7 is, and I'm wondering if anyone thinks Nintendo might remake it, as it has for FFI through VI. Here are some possible (But not official) circumstances (Both for and against FFVII being remade).

Pro-remake circumstances:
-Nintendo has remade many FF games recently, and might continue
-The DS does seem to have the potential for this kind of game (And the ActImagine (Or whatever it is) videos should make the cutscenes look great!)
-We have already seen a DS remake (FFIII)
-FFVII is a classic. The fanbase might explode if there isn't at least a re-release.

No remake circumstances:
-The agreement Nintendo has made with Square (Or whatever the hell it is now) might not cover FF games not released for a Nintendo system. Or there's some other agreement with Sony.
-I'm not sure how a DS compares to Playstation. There may be hardware limitations, and I'm wondering if a multi-card DS game is even possible.
-Nintendo might have issues with some plot elements (It IS Nintendo, after all)... But I havn't played FFVII before, so this may just be noob talk.


So, is there the possibility of a handheld remake? And did I miss important information? What do you think?

(Note: I'm not really a 'forum person', so I might take a while to respond.)

[OverCoat]

Let me start off by saying this: Years ago, I was too young and video game ignorant to have heard of Final Fantasy. Or even the Playstation. I keep on hearing about how great FF7 is, and I'm wondering if anyone thinks Nintendo might remake it

Nintendo doesn't remake other companies' games :[

Also it's probably not possible. Too much content. FF7 has what, 4 discs?

[linkspast]

I think its still too "new" for a remix. of the game.
If Square was to let it get remade, they would most likely wait until a lot of the fan base is gone and FF20 is out...

Did square say at one point that FF7 was to be a 20 Year Project?

[Raziellink]

3 discs, OverCoat.

And i think that IF it is gonna be remade, it'll appear on the platform with the biggest audience. Like DS, or probably PS3 for it's superior graphics.

[FiremanJoe]

this may just be noob talk.

What do you think?

You answered your own question.

[GeckoYamori]

I didn't buy my DS for passive reading/cutscene watching.

[Gollgagh]

Also it's probably not possible. Too much content. FF7 has what, 4 discs?

Like the other guy said, 3 discs.

But that's actually because of the cutscenes. All of the story and battle data is stored on each of the discs. (This is what lets me play FF7 even though my first and second discs are mildly fucked up.)

[Kanthos]

I doubt they'd have enough space no a DS cart for all the data, particularly the 3D models, even without the cutscenes. Sure, they could remake the cutscenes by reusing the in-game models, but they still have too much other content in the game. Not to mention all the code needed for the various minigames. People wouldn't like the game nearly as much if a bunch of content had to be cut in order to port it, and it certainly wouldn't fit with Square-Enix's new trend of adding more to re-releases.

[BlackDragonSoul]

i heard rumors or it might be true that they will remake FF7 for the PS3. but i'm not to sure. i need to flow around the web and see what i can find....

[Back_Lit]

Considering the smallest DS cart is 1 Gigabit (128 meg) I think its entirely possible for them to shove the entire game onto 1 cart, thats with the removal of cut scenes though and replacing them with in game engine cut scenes. I'd expect 8 Gigabit carts to make an appearance at somepoint.

Is it possible? Sure. Is it likely? Probably not...

[atmuh]

oh god give it up with 7 already

[suzumebachi]

Why are you even discussing this? It's never going to happen. This kind of nonsense belongs on the GameFAQs boards.

[CE]

Why do people like this thing so much dammit. It's fucking archaic as far as RPGs go now a days, but still too young to have any nostalgia to allow it to be remade like FF4 or 3. Plus if it's coming out somewhere it's on the freaking PSP. It's practically decided already, everyone knows it'll come out sooner of later, it's just a matter of when, not if.

[DarkeSword]

I didn't buy my DS for passive reading/cutscene watching.


Oh come on! Phoenix Wright is a great game!

[Bahamut]

I didn't buy my DS for passive reading/cutscene watching.

There's the Gecko we all know and love - what happened to your main account btw?

[XCloud419]

its possible for a ff7 on the ds but come on, the remake has to be on ps3. i mean i got ff7 on psx and psp, why would i want it on ds? i'm waitin for a ff6 remix...that and chrono trigger(please chrono trigger at least on the gba!)

[Armoured Priest]

FF VI Advance is due out next month I believe. As for Chrono Trigger, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to see it redone ala FF Advance style for GBA (if not DS)

[Doctor Shaft]

FF7 just wouldn't fit on the DS. I know they remade FF3 to fit, but that was still a game based on 8 bit principles. FF7 was a fully 3D, including the concept. Everything.

Sure, FF3 has pulled off 3d models and cutscenes, but it has a style that's still very old school. FF7 does not carry that old school flavor. It was wildly different from, say, FF6 in terms of design. I just can't see myself enjoying that game on a DS, or even a PSP. Certain games just weren't meant for it. FF7 is more cinematic than previous titles. A lot of the newer FF's are.

Handheld consoles need games that don't have as much cinematic flair. AT least, that's how I like my portable games.

[Necrotic]

I can't believe so many people are mentioning FF3 in this whole discussion because there's absolutely nothing to compare between FF3 and FF7. FF3 for DS has fully 3D models and environments, and it did fine. FF7 had 3D characters and the occasional object, but completely 2D backgrounds. Yes, that's right. I have no clue what you people are talking about when you say FF7 is "fully 3D" but it wasn't in any way, shape, or form. The system could easily handle either method as has been shown. As people have mentioned, cutscenes would cause trouble. But then you have to consider the resolution of the DS screen, it's exponentially smaller, plus some of the more sophisticated compression methods that are constantly being developed. And, if you look at the tech. specs of the DS it's somewhere around or greater than a PS1 in power (though I have no idea how things like RAM would compare.) Nobody wins this discussion because all points are moot. The DS is limited yes. Companies get past those limitations, yes.

Like people have been saying (and this point is completely solid) the cutscenes add up, and a lot of the catridge space would probably be spent on them so I'd be hard-pressed to say it would be worth-while.

I don't even care about this discussion much, just the fact that people need to understand technology before they understand. An FF7 remake or port would be sweet though, but I could think of other games I'd way rather have moved over.


-Nick

[Gollgagh]

There's the Gecko we all know and love - what happened to your main account btw?

He accidentally locked himself out of it the other day.

Help him open it up, would you?

[Nario]

Why not make Final Fantasy VII look like a SNES game? Or better yet, why not make it 2D? Oh, whoops, too late. :P

Jokes aside (I'm actually interested in a SNES-version of FF7), I can see a FF7 remake, but I'm not sure on what handheld or console. It's possible for it to be on the DS, but not plausible. Nonetheless, I'd like to see it remade on anything than the PS3 because I won't buy that console with my life depended on it... Would that be suicide???

[Nekojin]

Possible? Yeah, of course. Wanted? Not so much. Let's focus on a good game in the series, like FFVIII.

[Bahamut]

Possible? Yeah, of course. Wanted? Not so much. Let's focus on a good game in the series, like FFVI.

Fixed .

[Hector]

I'll just make this one point, and that is that space and hardware capability are not a problem. FFVII was four cds, each cd is roughly 700mb so that is 2.8gb (roughly) that needs to be handled at the worst. Admittedly, the two cart sizes for the DS are 512mb and 1,024mb; but let us not forget the GBA slot. The problem with a multi-cartridge games has to do mostly with saves, so long as certain information is contained on a GBA game, information will not be a problem. And then there is the simple fact that more efficient coding can greatly reduce the space of the game. Square has had quite a few years to refine its techniques and so should be able to drastically reduce the size of a game like FFVII.

But now lets go back to the problems, a game that takes up 2-3 cartridges plus a GBA slot will be expensive and the graphical leap from upgrading to the DS from the PS will not be quite as great as many fans might wish for (FFIII had better graphics than FFVII, but not drastically better).

In truth, I'd prefer a console remake. I may not have enjoyed Advent Children much as a complete movie, but after seeing what they did for Aerith and Tifa, I don't think I'd settle for anything less.

[Gollgagh]

For the sake of reiteration:Like the other guy said, 3 discs.

But that's actually because of the cutscenes. All of the story and battle data is stored on each of the discs. (This is what lets me play FF7 even though my first and second discs are mildly fucked up.)

The only thing that made FFVII need three discs was the FMV's. Figure out how to do that with less space, and hey presto!

[atmuh]

This is gonna end up a pointless debate OMG THIS GAME SHOULD BE REMADE BECAUSE IT IS THE BEST FF EVAR!

To tell you the truth I really don't care. Porting is nice so I can keep FFVI on my GBA. Remakes are useless to me though.

[Ramaniscence]

I'll just make this one point, and that is that space and hardware capability are not a problem. FFVII was four cds, each cd is roughly 700mb so that is 2.8gb (roughly) that needs to be handled at the worst. Admittedly, the two cart sizes for the DS are 512mb and 1,024mb; but let us not forget the GBA slot. The problem with a multi-cartridge games has to do mostly with saves, so long as certain information is contained on a GBA game, information will not be a problem. And then there is the simple fact that more efficient coding can greatly reduce the space of the game. Square has had quite a few years to refine its techniques and so should be able to drastically reduce the size of a game like FFVII.

But now lets go back to the problems, a game that takes up 2-3 cartridges plus a GBA slot will be expensive and the graphical leap from upgrading to the DS from the PS will not be quite as great as many fans might wish for (FFIII had better graphics than FFVII, but not drastically better).

In truth, I'd prefer a console remake. I may not have enjoyed Advent Children much as a complete movie, but after seeing what they did for Aerith and Tifa, I don't think I'd settle for anything less.

So I've recently started working in Computer Animation and Maya and yadda yadda yadda. I can tell you right now that as far as models go, FF7 probably doesn't us anything over 1000 polys or so...if even that...and THAT'S in battle scenes. As far as walking around and shit that's a huge LOL. Those things are like MAYBE 200 polys. I'd say even saying THAT is pushing it.

I'd go as far as to say the game, sans-the world map and battle enviroments, was completely lacking textures. It only uses shaders except for the eyes, brows, and mouth (this is assuming PS was capable of using shaders, I really don't know. If it can't, it could just us 1px colored textures.) Whatever textures it DOES have are no bigger than 32px.

The background images for most of the levels are statics images and, my guess, are about 720x480 IF EVEN THAT. They could even be stretched to twice the size from 360x240.

So what does that say for FF7? It says that if you removed all the music or downgraded it from CD quality to something substantially less, and turned the CG cutscenes into FMV cutscenes, I'm willing to bet you could get that thing under 200MBs.

So is it possible? Well nothing's really impossible.

Is it HARD? Well, depends on how you look at it, but no not really.

Will it HAPPEN? PRETTY doubtful...at least anytime soon.


But what does this tell us is a BETTER candidate for DS port? MGS1

[Gollgagh]

And there we have it.

Thread ovar.

[Kanthos]

FF VII was only 4 CDs in the PC release, and that's because one CD of the 4 was the install CD that copied data that was duplicated on the other game CDs to your PC. It wasn't a game CD on its own. The PSX version is only 3 CDs and does everything the PC version did.

[Shivy]

The port of Resident Evil on the DS still had all the cutscenes in-tact, and was a near perfect port of a two-disc game.

[Gollgagh]

FF VII was only 4 CDs in the PC release, and that's because one CD of the 4 was the install CD that copied data that was duplicated on the other game CDs to your PC. It wasn't a game CD on its own. The PSX version is only 3 CDs and does everything the PC version did.

The horse is dead.

Stop beating it.

[Maco70]

The horse is dead.

Stop beating it.

Quoted for emphasis.

[CE]

Why do we want this thing on the DS again? Have you people not had enough of it? It's like those people who want to remake Ocarina of Time. Why? I say the more we try to push a classic, the less classic it becomes. With Advent Children, that meh TPS with Vincent, and the bajillion FF7 cameos (coughsephirothcough) do you still feel such a need to play a probably watered-down version with flimsy touch-screen addons?

And this goes for all of the so-called "classics" like Ocarina of Time and Metal Gear. The games are all masterpieces, but even a masterpiece becomes banal if you're force fed spoonfuls of it every day of every week.

[XCloud419]

Why do we want this thing on the DS again? Have you people not had enough of it? It's like those people who want to remake Ocarina of Time. Why? I say the more we try to push a classic, the less classic it becomes. With Advent Children, that meh TPS with Vincent, and the bajillion FF7 cameos (coughsephirothcough) do you still feel such a need to play a probably watered-down version with flimsy touch-screen addons?

And this goes for all of the so-called "classics" like Ocarina of Time and Metal Gear. The games are all masterpieces, but even a masterpiece becomes banal if you're force fed spoonfuls of it every day of every week.

I agree with you on the whole remake for metal gear(twin snakes) although very flashy, they just went OVER BOARD with the whole matrix like cut-scenes. i mean come on, snake ridin a missile like a skateboard? ridiculous.

[CE]

I agree with you on the whole remake for metal gear(twin snakes) although very flashy, they just went OVER BOARD with the whole matrix like cut-scenes. i mean come on, snake ridin a missile like a skateboard? ridiculous.

I actually liked that, to be honest. It felt somewhat like a MGS parody, and the Mantis fight scene was hilarious.

[Zero_Infiniti]

yea there's definetely a lot of dead horse beating going on around here...

but just to point out
I'll just make this one point, and that is that space and hardware capability are not a problem. FFVII was four cds, each cd is roughly 700mb so that is 2.8gb (roughly) that needs to be handled at the worst.

which actually each CD on the playstation was about 400mb (at least when i copied them to ISOs), take the fact that each CD probably has the exact same content on them except the few cutscene and i'm sure dialog changes (you know since [SPOILOERS]Aeris dies on the first disk[/SPOILERS] so you don't much need her information or related dialog on the next two disks...not to say its not there, but in a coding perspective). compressing the game would be too easy.

Admittedly, the two cart sizes for the DS are 512mb and 1,024mb; but let us not forget the GBA slot. The problem with a multi-cartridge games has to do mostly with saves, so long as certain information is contained on a GBA game, information will not be a problem.

you do know that a PS1 memory card was less than 64KBytes right? if you put it into your PS2, each game save was only 4KB, i'm sure it could be easily stored on the DS cart, and transfered via RAM...

its not an issue of the game fitting onto a DS Card. the issue is whether or not Nintendo and Squeenix will do it. the simple answer, probably not. you hardcore FF7 people need to get over it. yes i'd probably buy it too if they did, but until they do, i'm spending that $40 bucks on food and bills and other important things.

and a MGS1 port would be awesome! use the touch screen to select items faster too...but speaking of psycho mantis, how will you confuse him by plugging the controller into the second slot, or have him taunt you by reading your other namco saves off the memory card...looking back, i never used that trick to beat him, and i can't remember what i did to take him out. i think i just shot at him until i hit him...something like that...

[Penfold]

I actually liked that, to be honest. It felt somewhat like a MGS parody, and the Mantis fight scene was hilarious.

Yeah lol, Mantis. "I CAN'T READ YOU!" Considering that was my only exposure to the first Metal Gear Solid, I really enjoyed it.

Anyway, I can understand your stance on remakes. It becomes considerably less special if they remake it everytime new hardware comes out. While I'm not a FFVII fan (I really wanted to like it, but I just couldn't get into it), if Square-Enix decides to remake it to the DS or any other hardware, I doubt it'd be watered down. It is one of Square-Enix's biggest IPs, and despite supposedly not-so-good spin-off games (I never played Dirge of Cerberus, nor do I intend to, so I can't really judge it), I don't think they'd really jeopardize its success by making a crap remake.

[Eulogic]

I enjoyed Twin Snakes. I've always felt the Metal Gear Solid games to be somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

[Avatar of Justice]

The main reason I would like to see both Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy Tactics get a remake is because their original translations sucked. It could be a better game experience for both of those games if they had good translations. At least FFT is getting remade, although I'll never own a PSP with which to play it.

[Evilhead]

Simple solution:

1. Place PS1 FFVII CDs in computer.
2. Rip to ISO.
3. Convert to an eboot using Popstation.
4. Place on memory stick.
5. Play on your PSP with perfect framerate, textures, sound, etc.


You don't even have to pirate it if you have the original PS1 discs.

[Darth Lime]

Why do people like this thing so much dammit. It's fucking archaic as far as RPGs go now a days, but still too young to have any nostalgia to allow it to be remade like FF4 or 3. Plus if it's coming out somewhere it's on the freaking PSP. It's practically decided already, everyone knows it'll come out sooner of later, it's just a matter of when, not if. QFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Necrotic]

Simple solution:

1. Place PS1 FFVII CDs in computer.
2. Rip to ISO.
3. Convert to an eboot using Popstation.
4. Place on memory stick.
5. Play on your PSP with perfect framerate, textures, sound, etc.


You don't even have to pirate it if you have the original PS1 discs.

Intrigued! Please, tell me more.


-Nick

[Hector]

Zero_Infiniti, I just want to clarify one thing about why I think using the GBA slot would be important; its not so much containing for holding space but for design limitations. I don't think the DS is designed to allow you to remove a cartridge that is being played while the system remains on.

I have my DS setup to skip the loading screen and go straight to the DS cart (GBA cart has second priority). For a while I was playing a GBA game but had a DS cartridge in; so I'd quickly eject the game while turning the system on (you have a second after you hit power to do this). One time I was a tad late popping out the DS cartridge and my system did not appreciate it.

The type of memory used for RAM typically cannot hold any information when a device is turned off (there are exceptions depending on the hardware used). And even then, I'd question if the system's loading a game wouldn't overright the save file.

[sirusd]

Sure, it's a possibility. However, if Square is going to re-release FF7, it'll be on the PS3. The buzz created by that Tech Demo was huge. A fully remade FF7 would do extremely well on the PS3.

However, it's still just a mediocre game... I'd rather see a remade CT or FF6 any day.

[Evilhead]

Intrigued! Please, tell me more.


-Nick

The new firmware version 3.03 allows you to download PS1 games with your PS3 and play them on your PSP perfectly. If you install DarkAlex's 3.03OE-B custom firmware on your PSP, you can not only do this without the need for a PS3 (you can rip the games with your PC), but you can play ALL of the 1.5 homebrew software like the emulators, flash players, etc, as well as any of the newest PSP games. Here's more detailed info and links to the necessary software:

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=918340&topic=32973596 (http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=918340&topic=32973596)

[KyleJCrb]

Possible? Yeah, of course. Wanted? Not so much. Let's focus on a good game in the series, like FFVIII.

Hahahahahahahahaha! Oh man, that's a good one. You almost had me there, right up until you said "VIII". Ahahaha!

[Zero_Infiniti]

Zero_Infiniti, I just want to clarify one thing about why I think using the GBA slot would be important; its not so much containing for holding space but for design limitations. I don't think the DS is designed to allow you to remove a cartridge that is being played while the system remains on.

I have my DS setup to skip the loading screen and go straight to the DS cart (GBA cart has second priority). For a while I was playing a GBA game but had a DS cartridge in; so I'd quickly eject the game while turning the system on (you have a second after you hit power to do this). One time I was a tad late popping out the DS cartridge and my system did not appreciate it.

The type of memory used for RAM typically cannot hold any information when a device is turned off (there are exceptions depending on the hardware used). And even then, I'd question if the system's loading a game wouldn't overright the save file.

i haven't attempted to eject a cartridge from my ds while its on, but reguardless, they'll have to come up with something. having to manufacture a gba memory card would be kinda a waste considering that it would only be used for one game (even though it'd be mad cheap to manufacture you know they'll charge 40 bucks for it). granted they could make it universal, but then that's only for games released after the card, and if they decide to use them. if the cartridges hold up to 1 gig, that's a lot of information that can be stored and i believe that covers a majority of games that nintendo or 3rd party companies want to produce for the ds. in addition its not like the cards can't hold up to 2 gigs or 4 gigs within the near future. we already have digital memory cards that go up to these values (and possibly higher). its just a question of whether the ds hardware is set up to read from them or not.

[XCloud419]

Hahahahahahahahaha! Oh man, that's a good one. You almost had me there, right up until you said "VIII". Ahahaha!

8 is pretty cool, now 9...eh..i've seen better.

[The Monkey Bob]

Zero_Infiniti, I just want to clarify one thing about why I think using the GBA slot would be important; its not so much containing for holding space but for design limitations. I don't think the DS is designed to allow you to remove a cartridge that is being played while the system remains on.

I have my DS setup to skip the loading screen and go straight to the DS cart (GBA cart has second priority). For a while I was playing a GBA game but had a DS cartridge in; so I'd quickly eject the game while turning the system on (you have a second after you hit power to do this). One time I was a tad late popping out the DS cartridge and my system did not appreciate it.

The type of memory used for RAM typically cannot hold any information when a device is turned off (there are exceptions depending on the hardware used). And even then, I'd question if the system's loading a game wouldn't overright the save file.

Anyone that has bought the new Action Replay for the DS knows that the programmers can make it so you can take out the DS cart without the system freezing. I do it 3 times every time I use my AR. ¬_¬

[atmuh]

8 is pretty cool, now 9...eh..i've seen better.

I am quite possibly the only person I know that really liked IX.

LET'S START A DEBATE SO THIS THREAD CAN FINALLY GET LOCKED!!!

[Cáidh]

I am quite possibly the only person I know that really liked IX.

LET'S START A DEBATE SO THIS THREAD CAN FINALLY GET LOCKED!!!

I am of the opinion that Final Fantasy VII was, indeed, the greatest game ever to have graced human hands. VIII, IX, and X can kiss my hairy, scottish ass.


Unfortunately for the purposes of this dicussion, I am not truly of this opinion. I do, however, agree that this discussion ought to be ended.

[linkspast]

I am quite possibly the only person I know that really liked IX.

LET'S START A DEBATE SO THIS THREAD CAN FINALLY GET LOCKED!!!

i liked 9
.

[Arcita]

IX was one of my favorites. It made a lot of throwbacks to the oldschool Final Fantasies...

I don't really see FFVII on DS as a good idea. Whether we want it or not, however, a PS3 remake would make a ton of money. I'm personally for it. Imagine how great it would be not to have prerendered backgrounds, etc.

[XCloud419]

i really didn't like 9. i just couldn't play it anymore! Right now i'm hooked on 4 for the gba and its pretty sweet. i'm just gettin warmed up till 6 comes out next week! Yea YAY!

[q-pa]

Whether we want it or not, however, a PS3 remake would make a ton of money. I'm personally for it. Imagine how great it would be not to have prerendered backgrounds, etc.
Want leads to purchase, purchase leads to money. SquareEnix doesn't get a dime if (the collective) people don't want them to...

And all this back-and-forth has me wondering: Are Japanese FFVII fanboys as rabid as the American ones are?

[atmuh]

So guys I decided to start playing IX again today and HOOHAH it is such an awesome game. Definitely not anywhere close to IV, but worlds better than the rest. Yes I am 100% serious. I played VII and when I beat it I thought to myself...OK I'm done. I beat IX and thought to myself...wow.

A PS3 remake would not make a ton of money. Mass market will not buy a system because it has a favorite game remade on it. I don't care if YOU would; most people wouldn't. Square-Enix seems to be sitting back and seeing where this console war leads until they start developing more huge titles (with the exception of FFXIII and DQIX).

remakes need to stop being wanted though
go hack a psp if you want any of these games portable

[Bahamut]

Want leads to purchase, purchase leads to money. SquareEnix doesn't get a dime if (the collective) people don't want them to...

And all this back-and-forth has me wondering: Are Japanese FFVII fanboys as rabid as the American ones are?

Nah - my childhood best friend likes FF7 a lot, but he's not gaga over it. He has grown up with the likes of FF5, 6, Chrono Trigger, SMRPG, and all that other good stuff before they ever graced the US though (minus SMRPG, we got it first).

[Ramaniscence]

Nah - my childhood best friend likes FF7 a lot, but he's not gaga over it. He has grown up with the likes of FF5, 6, Chrono Trigger, SMRPG, and all that other good stuff before they ever graced the US though (minus SMRPG, we got it first).

I really doubt that they would've made Advent Children if FF7 didn't have the same appeal in Japan as it does here. In fact that much is OBVIOUS when you hear some of the stuff they say in "The Making of..."

[Bahamut]

I really doubt that they would've made Advent Children if FF7 didn't have the same appeal in Japan as it does here. In fact that much is OBVIOUS when you hear some of the stuff they say in "The Making of..."

Actually, I hear the US has FF7 fever far worse than Japan - Japan is more crazed about the Dragon Quest games than FF.