[JJT]

Originally Posted by Hausdog

How hard is it to phrase exactly what the song does well/poorly?

Depends on how well a judge knows the genre in question. I'm generally more comfortable critiquing jazz and solo piano arrangements than say, Tibetan throat singing. The less I know about a genre, the more general I have to be with my criticism.

How often do you "yes" mixes you dislike and "no" mixes you like?

I'd estimate that I like about 70% of the stuff I YES, and maybe 10% of the stuff I NO. There have been a few heart breakers for me, definitely.

What are some of your pet peeves that submitters do?

Probably my biggest pet peeve is when first time submitters write a fuggin' novel about the remix they threw together in FL in 6 hours. They write 4 paragraphs about playing the game for the first time at age 7. They mention the names of everyone who listened to earlier drafts. They thank God, and their parents. And after all of this they suck profusely. There's nothing that calls down the fire (as far as my votes are concerned) like a longass pretentious submission email.

Once you get a mix or two posted, feel free to write a ton, as Dave likes putting that stuff in the writeups. I do it all the time.

[Arek the Absolute]

Originally Posted by JJT

Depends on how well a judge knows the genre in question. I'm generally more comfortable critiquing jazz and solo piano arrangements than say, Tibetan throat singing. The less I know about a genre, the more general I have to be with my criticism.

I'd estimate that I like about 70% of the stuff I YES, and maybe 10% of the stuff I NO. There have been a few heart breakers for me, definitely.

Probably my biggest pet peeve is when first time submitters write a fuggin' novel about the remix they threw together in FL in 6 hours. They write 4 paragraphs about playing the game for the first time at age 7. They mention the names of everyone who listened to earlier drafts. They thank God, and their parents. And after all of this they suck profusely. There's nothing that calls down the fire (as far as my votes are concerned) like a longass pretentious submission email.

Once you get a mix or two posted, feel free to write a ton, as Dave likes putting that stuff in the writeups. I do it all the time.

Since you mentioned "write ups", what is your favorite "write up" that you got for a mix that was submitted?

[Liontamer]

Originally Posted by Palpable

Throwing in my own two cents here as a mixer rather than a judge: I didn't know about the judge decision forums until submitting my third mix here. The only thing I did was constantly check the front page for months. In the case of my first mix, I wasn't even aware it had gone up until months afterward because I had stopped checking! By the time I submitted my fourth mix (which was rejected) I had learned about the judge decisions forums, but I was essentially doing the same thing: checking every few days for a couple months. In that case, I got so tired of waiting that I lost interest in OCR completely.

I would love if we could e-mail mixers once their mix had completing judging, informing them of the decision, but there are at least a few problems with it I can think of. One is just remembering to do it, unless we can automate the process. Two is that sometimes the decision can be changed. In that case, when is the decision finalized such that we can tell the mixer what the decision was?

These are certainly some things I'd like us to think about. I think a lot of great potential resubmits fall by the wayside because the mixer isn't familiar enough with OCR or doesn't check back often enough. There was one rejected mix back in November that I absolutely loved that nevertheless had some major problems. I've thought about e-mailing the mixer just because I very badly want to see it completed, and I have no idea if he ever intends to go back to it, or is even aware it was rejected. More communication would be a very good thing, I think, if it's possible.

I would love to do that, and I've definitely thought about that, but have so much on my plate and have been content enough with our current system that I haven't taken the time to move an idea like this forward.

Keeping mixers in the loop is one aspect where our system really has no plan other than "they should follow the site", which is definitely not conducive to getting new people to become community regulars. Admittedly, it has worked for us so far, and honestly, it would continue to as is, because enough people become regulars. But contacting people regarding acceptances and rejections would be great.

That would also be yet another thing I'd have to be personally responsible for, since I maintain the inbox. IF we developed a form letter for notifying artists about acceptances and rejections, I would love to start doing that. I feel that kind of contact/updating is something that would only benefit the site, even though we'd have our share of complainers who would resent bad news.

[Palpable]

Originally Posted by Liontamer

IF we developed a form letter for notifying artists about acceptances and rejections, I would love to start doing that. I feel that kind of contact/updating is something that would only benefit the site, even though we'd have our share of complainers who would resent bad news.

Yeah, this is sort of what I was thinking. Maybe one form letter for NO, one for NO (resubmit), one for YES, with maybe some space for comments if we feel the need. (Of course, NO (resubmit) is an individual's decision, not a group decision, so maybe we'd have to be clear about what gets classified as NO (resubmit).) Getting people to resubmit is the most crucial part of this to me. A decent amount of stuff we get is close but doesn't make it.

[Kanthos]

Why not a form letter with a link to the Judges' Decision thread for that mix? That'd be less work than cutting-and-pasting comments into the e-mail.

[DragonAvenger]

From the sounds of it, it seems like you should get a judges secretary who could take care of such matters. Having a YES and NO basic email, and have the secretary post the link to the judges decision into the email.

And a question, to stay more on topic: Are there remixes that you find to me more impressive/creative than others? Like, changing the melody around is one thing, but do you find time signature changes or genre changes to be a bigger leap, per se.

[Liontamer]

Originally Posted by Palpable

Yeah, this is sort of what I was thinking. Maybe one form letter for NO, one for NO (resubmit), one for YES, with maybe some space for comments if we feel the need. (Of course, NO (resubmit) is an individual's decision, not a group decision, so maybe we'd have to be clear about what gets classified as NO (resubmit).) Getting people to resubmit is the most crucial part of this to me. A decent amount of stuff we get is close but doesn't make it.

Originally Posted by Kanthos

Why not a form letter with a link to the Judges' Decision thread for that mix? That'd be less work than cutting-and-pasting comments into the e-mail.

Yeah, I'm thinking more along the lines something that generally explains the next step in the waiting game for YESs, and very basic things about the reasoning for NOs, with links to read re: the standards, and also the ReMixing and Works forums. Then the only thing for the NO ones would be pasting in the Decision link. But there would have to be an general explanation of the judging process in the mail, it could just be "Hey, we finished your decision; the link is here."

Differentiating a letter between NOs and NO-resubmits might be a little dicey, but we'll mull it over.

[zyko]

Originally Posted by Hausdog

How often do you "yes" mixes you dislike and "no" mixes you like?

i think this is a pretty good question as it also ties into an earlier question concerning BRAND NAME authors.

as you can imagine, it can be a little difficult to entirely ignore who the author is. luckily for me, i hardly ever look at the thread very closely before clicking the link, in turn, completely surprising myself. so unless i already recognize the artist for being unique (i have a good ear for signature sound), i won't let who it is dictate my first impressions.

however, that can be a lot more difficult than it seems. i have rejected nearly half of the tracks that i've liked because my role here is dictated by the standards of the site, not by my own standards which, at most times, differ greatly. i'm definitely a sucker for raw, emotive music that is rough around the edges... much like my own. i've had a fair share of my tracks rejected from the site so im very familiar with where the line is drawn =)

i've also been able to effectively review and accept tracks that i would never listen to again. i pride myself on enjoying many different flavors of tea but even when it isn't my cup, i still can taste the goodness in it. bias is often where a judge prospect fails miserably.

as for brand name authors... well it is hard to reject music by a guy like mazedude or mustin. hell, recently, we rejected JJT's halloween mix... and we know he's one talented sucka. the dilemma in having a bar is that it has to be applied consistently and fairly. i learned this lesson as a parent of a toddler girl. not everything is cut n dry or black n white in judgement and this is why a judge of any capacity is such a unique position. when afforded the position to dictate, one has to dictate with a consistent authority. i'd hate to reject a mazedude track again as he's amazing but if it doesn't cut it, it just don't cut it.

Originally Posted by Hausdog

How hard is it to phrase exactly what the song does well/poorly? Sometimes, when I'm in the WIP forums, I'll really like something but not be able to deliver anything helpful beyond encouragement.

very hard unless i'm completely stoned. when something is pretty good, there is nothing to say short of gushing

admit it: it's much easier to rant and rave about something that has something to rant and rave about and verbosity comes natural to negative criticism. i do make a concerted effort to let up off the gas pedal sometimes as i can, inadvertently, start to rip a hole in places where one might not have wanted one.

the difficulty, i believe, stems from the desire to criticize in a fashion to inspire or instigate a motion towards refinement of either the specific piece or the artist, in general. seems elementary but it actually takes a considerable amount of manipulation... in other words, not everybody reacts the same to "NO:resubmit" (i know i don't ever resubmit hehe) so sometimes (and the trick is to know instantly when) it is more viable to just trash the thing into oblivion and try to light that fire underneath the artist to return with something considerably better.

sometimes something is so awful, you are left with not saying much. i try my very hardest not to judge the ones that need the most criticism because it can be quite difficult to dedicate that sort of effort when faced with a lot of voting. truth is, the easy out that i've seen other judges use in the past and that i've used, myself, is to refer the artist to the WIP forums. plenty of visitors there are more than happy to take their time to break everything down and they are usually full of great ideas.

Originally Posted by Hausdog

What are some of your pet peeves that submitters do?

not name their pieces. not end their pieces. not actually remix the track they claim to have remixed.


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hey nobody said this shit was easy =)

[Nekofrog]

Less of a question, more of a request. Most of you hate me from past history with the site, but don't let that reflect the way you judge my submission.


Dicks :P

[FR]

Form Letters: "Delivering NO's via e-mail to disapoint artists FASTER"

Kidding aside, How many judges are there and what is the "maxium capapcity" of judges? Are their an odd number of judges to avoid deadlocks? What font color do judges deliver no's in?

EDIT: My 100th post was making fun the judges(sorta) LOL.