anosou Posted December 7, 2008 Author Share Posted December 7, 2008 I have high hopes for Songbird, and I do support the idea of it playing VGM chiptunes. However, AnSo, one significant roadblock I see to the official Songbird team implementing chiptune support is that no chiptunes come from legal sources.Just as in WinAmp, if Songbird supports these formats in the future, I bet it will be from 3rd party plugins made on someone's free time. Dave brought this to my attention earlier too so I've e-mailed some of the winamp plug-in developers asking them to port or develop new plugins for songbird. If anyone of you guys want to do the same I would appreciate that A LOT! The biggest chance we have in making this real is getting the support from some seasoned developers AND showing that there is enough interest to make it worthwile. Also, it's not entirely true what you said. There are tons of programs to make chiptunes and the mod/tracker scene is bursting at the seams with them. The ammount of original, legal and free C64-tunes for example is just just huge. So, DO support the cause in both the feedback thread and via word of mouth. Tell your friends, hunt down developers and spread the word. I think it'll happen, when is a question of how many that are willing to commit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moguta Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 Ahh, you're completely right! I was thinking in my head that all videogame chiptunes are from ROM-rips, and had completely forgotten about the original chiptune scene. Somehow, I'm a little doubtful that this niche-use will convince Songbird devs, though. Honestly, I think that if Songbird gets enough nerd-popularity -- which it's already well on-course to do (I mean, hell, it's based on Mozilla) -- then chiptune support will eventually materialize. And probably also due to the continual prodding of a certain AnSo. I wonder what it takes, exactly, to make a Songbird input add-on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anosou Posted December 8, 2008 Author Share Posted December 8, 2008 Ahh, you're completely right! I was thinking in my head that all videogame chiptunes are from ROM-rips, and had completely forgotten about the original chiptune scene. Somehow, I'm a little doubtful that this niche-use will convince Songbird devs, though.Honestly, I think that if Songbird gets enough nerd-popularity -- which it's already well on-course to do (I mean, hell, it's based on Mozilla) -- then chiptune support will eventually materialize. And probably also due to the continual prodding of a certain AnSo. I wonder what it takes, exactly, to make a Songbird input add-on. As long as we get an optional plug-in or at least some serious attention, we're on our way! By the way, funny thing, I just read that the Songbird-devs are talking with Mozilla to make Songbird a sister-app to Firefox and Thunderbird. We're talking Mozilla Songbird here! Let's hope that goes through :3 Also, worth noting, these are stuff the developers are working at: http://wiki.songbirdnest.com/Roadmap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeSword Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 You don't need natively developed plug-ins. You just need a Winamp Input Plug-in Wrapper. That's how foobar2000 supports VGM formats; it just uses Winamp's plugins through a wrapper. If someone writes that, then you're good to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anosou Posted December 8, 2008 Author Share Posted December 8, 2008 You don't need natively developed plug-ins. You just need a Winamp Input Plug-in Wrapper. That's how foobar2000 supports VGM formats; it just uses Winamp's plugins through a wrapper. If someone writes that, then you're good to go. Good idea! Never thought about that. Though wrappers aren't the most stable if I understand it correctly.. Though imo, any way will do as long as I can play VGM formats in songbird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Pezman Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 I've tried songbird beta and found it to be a good app but I still prefer MediaMonkey. MediaMonkey runs on Windows platforms only. There's your first problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halc Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 i just downloaded songbird tonight and it has replaced. love it! much better than itunes as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverCoat Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 Winamp Input Plug-in Wrapper. XMPlay has one of those :3 Ironically, some plugins work better in XMPlay than they ever did in Winamp. Some don't though. I used NotSoFatso in winamp but XMPlay can't run it. NEZPlug is fine though [actually it sounds better IMO] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moguta Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 It seems that in order to make an input plugin in Songbird, you need to make a GStreamer plugin, since they rely on that media streaming library. If an API wrapper is possible, that would be nice, but somehow I don't think it would work so swell. I have heard a lot of plugin authors over on the Winamp boards state that they have to use messy "hacks" to accomplish certain things... hacks that I'm guessing try to jump Winamp's API altogether and access the core program. Plus native development gives the opportunity for a nice, clean start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anosou Posted December 8, 2008 Author Share Posted December 8, 2008 It seems that in order to make an input plugin in Songbird, you need to make a GStreamer plugin, since they rely on that media streaming library.If an API wrapper is possible, that would be nice, but somehow I don't think it would work so swell. I have heard a lot of plugin authors over on the Winamp boards state that they have to use messy "hacks" to accomplish certain things... hacks that I'm guessing try to jump Winamp's API altogether and access the core program. Plus native development gives the opportunity for a nice, clean start. I wholeheartedly agree, I'm also afraid there will be issues with winamp plug-ins running on Mac OS X and various Linux systems.. As I said, mail those developers and link them to songbird! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeSword Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 There's your first problem. That's not his problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anosou Posted March 11, 2009 Author Share Posted March 11, 2009 Songbird 1.1.1 was released during the night. A lot of improvements for stability has been made together with new features like Watch Folders, high quality MP3 music-store and various other stuff. Full release-notes can be found here: http://wiki.songbirdnest.com/Release_Notes/1.1.1 Go download it, discuss and don't forget to swing by this thread right here to support the addition of video game music formats to songbird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zephyr Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Just got it and set it up. I'm not quite used to it yet, but I really like the ease of use and having a multiformat mainframe for all my media. Open source stuff is great I'm loving having radio station support in the library, even though they don't make it terribly user friendly. I'm listening to ORMGAS right now ... I'm not a fan of the mini player however, it's not a smooth transition from small to big and it's too hard to switch compared to WMP. Really not a good complaint though. A 1st party integrated Now Playing bar would also be nice, but the add on works fine. It's weird playing playlists too, you can't just click "play playlist" you have to load up the playlist to get it onscreen then start playing the first song. I love the bio thing though. This will go places Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moguta Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Sweet! The main thing I was waiting for was ReplayGain support, which they have in this new 1.1 release. Gapless MP3 support is also nice. And not even Winamp has a "watch folders" option! (Winamp just has a "completely scan folders every X minutes" option.) Looks like it's finally time to try this sucker out & see if it can dethrone Winamp as my player of choice. (...assuming it gets VGM-format playback eventually) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brithor Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Downloaded it and liking it so far. Didn't know about it 'till I read this post, thanks AnSo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunarfall Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Downloading it, don't think it'll replace WMP though unless I'm blown away by it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anosou Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 Downloaded it and liking it so far. Didn't know about it 'till I read this post, thanks AnSo! You're welcome. It might not replace Winamp or iTunes yet but it's pretty damn close AND Open Source and multiplatform. Something Winamp is NOT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zephyr Posted May 2, 2009 Share Posted May 2, 2009 Hrmm, I've been using it for a while now and it just seems broken in so many ways, any time that I download a song and listen to it in Songbird, it saves it and adds it to the library, which I rarely want, and it adds a new one everytime that I download it, (mostly a problem with songs I only want to listen to once, like WIP's, which it saves duplicates of if I click the link again later). There's no way to see the current "on the go" playlist, and even with the "Now playing" add-on, it's completely broken, wiping out the playlist everytime you choose and album or artist. When pausing, then playing songs, it will play for 3 seconds before outputting any sound... it really doesn't manage playlists very well either. Maybe I'll come back for V 2.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aninymouse Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 I used Songbird for quite a while, but I found it severely inferior to even iTunes. Without any plugins, the UI is limited, but if you add in a lot of plugins it starts to bog down. My biggest gripe? Songbird will not keep track of the file paths of your songs! That's a pretty big deal for someone who has backups or external drives with duplicate files. Add in the myriad of technical glitches and bugs, and I had to drop it. All in all, Songbird just feels like an open source iTunes Light version. You know what I switched to? Foobar2000. All the functionality and so, so much more. Fully customizable UI/skins, comprehensive library with multitudes of sorting options, MINIMAL SYSTEM RESOURCES, the list goes on. Foobar! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anosou Posted May 3, 2009 Author Share Posted May 3, 2009 I used Songbird for quite a while, but I found it severely inferior to even iTunes. Without any plugins, the UI is limited, but if you add in a lot of plugins it starts to bog down. My biggest gripe? Songbird will not keep track of the file paths of your songs! That's a pretty big deal for someone who has backups or external drives with duplicate files. Add in the myriad of technical glitches and bugs, and I had to drop it.All in all, Songbird just feels like an open source iTunes Light version. You know what I switched to? Foobar2000. All the functionality and so, so much more. Fully customizable UI/skins, comprehensive library with multitudes of sorting options, MINIMAL SYSTEM RESOURCES, the list goes on. Foobar! Well, it's still a work in progress. Anyway, re: watching folders, that's implemented in the newest version. Since it's actively being developed I'm still sticking with it. Also, Foobar2000 ain't on Mac so it's not really the answer for everyone, is it? Keep in mind too that Songbird is very much about intergration with Social networks and "Web 2.0" stuff. The built-in browser gives it away! Anyway, I still haven't made the switch from iTunes but that's only because I'm waiting for flawless iPod support, my shuffle isn't recognized atm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalcyonSpirit Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 I tried Songbird out about a month ago. Essentially, I think it has potential but also has some issues that are keeping me from using it as my main player instead of WinAMP. The first is that it eats system resources. Not as much as it used to, but still, my laptop is aging and it can't handle having it open all the time like I do with WinAMP. Second, it's response time to commands can be rather slow, and sometimes it skips the end portion of the song in question and moves right to the next. Third, hitting stop doesn't just stop the current song, it resets the playlist back to the beginning (speaking of playlists, that function seems to be a little screwy as well). Finally, the mini skin needs work. I like having WinAMP in mini-mode and set to "Always on Top" so I can see it all the time, and I can do that because the mini mode for the MMD3 WinAMP skin fits within the window title bar for programs, so it doesn't really take up any space! tl;dr -> Needs improvement and better support before I'll use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aninymouse Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 Well, it's still a work in progress. And maybe one day it'll be worth it to me... but right now, Foobar is great. Keep in mind too that Songbird is very much about [ intergration ] with Social networks and "Web 2.0" stuff. The built-in browser gives it away! Yes, but not everyone cares about having their music playing application of choice integrated into their flickr or facebook or whatever the hell else you might use this for. I want a sleek program that plays music and helps me keep it organized, and nothing more. All that extra crap just bogs it down. I will say that I like the way Songbird allows you to effortlessly edit your ID3 tags, though. It's a bit more convoluted in Foobar. You have to keep in mind that Foobar is for advanced users only. Your kid sister won't like to use it because it is quite literally daunting to some people. Plus it's not pretty out of the box; you have to skin it to make it look nicer. Speaking of skins... check out a few! one two three four five Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anosou Posted May 3, 2009 Author Share Posted May 3, 2009 Yes, but not everyone cares about having their music playing application of choice integrated into their flickr or facebook or whatever the hell else you might use this for. I want a sleek program that plays music and helps me keep it organized, and nothing more. All that extra crap just bogs it down. I will say that I like the way Songbird allows you to effortlessly edit your ID3 tags, though. It's a bit more convoluted in Foobar. You have to keep in mind that Foobar is for advanced users only. Your kid sister won't like to use it because it is quite literally daunting to some people. Plus it's not pretty out of the box; you have to skin it to make it look nicer. Speaking of skins... check out a few! What I meant is, if you don't care about the intergration you'd do better with Foobar. Since Songbird aims at being broad it will never be as sleek or memory efficient as Foobar, no one's claiming that either. Just saying Anyway, needs more visualizers :/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trygon Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 You can only watch one folder? ...No 'import folder' option? And files outside of the solitary 'watched' folder show broken on the playlist. That's mindbogglingly illogical. Last I checked, don't m3u files have the full path included? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halt Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 One day, I got fed up with WMP, and Winamp's way of organizing shit. Anso said something about Songbird, gave it a try. Haven't looked back. I love the integration, add-ons and everything ;P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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