mixing in surround sound

[prophetik music]

anyone know how to do it? the project is in FL studio currently, but it's just audio files so i'd be happy to export and open in a different editor.

i honestly have no idea how to achieve this, or how to even start.

[SenPi]

I think sonar can do this. I remember a while back I briefly looked in to it, and read something about sonar being able to do it. I would assume instead of just Left/Right they also have Front/Back.

[prophetik music]

there's a template in fl to do it but i have no idea how to make it work.

[Hy Bound]

Usually you have to have specialized plug-ins to work in surround. I know Waves has some amazing editors if you want to go the 'spensive route.

Honestly I'm not as knowledgeable on the subject as I'd like, since Ableton doesn't technically support it. However, I'm pretty sure you can create aux buses for the 5 channels that are output to the 1/2, 3/4, 5/6(mono) outputs on your sound card that can be mixed between. The problem with that is the fact that you'll need a 5.1-enabled soundcard or audio-interface to make any kind of sense of it.

Again, I'm not terribly knowledgeable about it, but that seems like the possibilities.

[Zephyr]

Okay, so I'm not sure how surround sound works, but I'd imagine that there's a separate audio track for each speaker. If this is the case, then it's actually fairly easy to set up. All you have to do is set aside 1 mixer track for each speaker in the surround sound set-up, then route the FX channels to each speaker accordingly. To explain a little more in-depth; route your instruments to their own effects slots as usual, then using the little yellow arrows near the bottom of the FX slot, route for example the piano track into whichever speaker track you want it to sound in. Make sure to disable it's routing to the master track, it'll go from the speaker 1 track to the master track. In this way, you can route 1 track to each of the speaker tracks and by using the send amount knobs control the amount going to each speaker. If someone is walking by the screen or something and you want footsteps to fade from front speakers to back, all you need to do is hook up an automation clip (hooked up with the send amount knobs) with one link inverted to do a flawless crossfade between speakers.

This was probably pretty confusing but hopefully you can get started with it, keep in mind i have zero experience with surround sound . When you're done you would just export each speaker seperately and would then need some sort of program to mesh them into a surround sound audio file of some sort.

[dannthr]

Well, when you mix in stereo, you don't have two tracks, necessarily, typically your mix is several stems/channels that are each "mixed" between the two stereo output channels.

The same goes for surround. You'll need to mix each audio channel you have between the 5 outputs keeping in mind your bass channel cut-off frequency.

So if you have a rock band with two rhythm guitars, a lead guitar, a singer, a bass, and a drum--you'll want to mix each of your 6 audio sources to the 5 channels respectively--depending on your desired spatial orientation in the mix.

You will need to output your mix to a surround encoded audio format for user playback.

You'll probably need to setup a 5.1 master channel, if possible, and you may need to purchase licenses for surround encoding formats depending on what your goals are (there are a few selections).

[rig1015]

Hey Prophet Of Mephisto,

I've been slammed pretty hard on this forum before because I a newer poster; but about surround sound... I used to teach Surround Sound, ADR, and Post Production and my technical institute. Are your going for a traditional 5.1? How many outputs do you have from your Mixer/PC? The other million dollar question is, is this for a DVD Reel? For fun, just to make a AC3 mix?

Most of the consumer brand stuff I've ever played with (FL, Sonar, ACID Pro, Logic) is not really ready for anything like REAL surround sound mixing, but then again I'd bet that 70% of homes don't even have their surround sound system setup correctly.

If you want the cheapest home setup you are going to have to get at least 6 outputs from your computer through some interface to the speakers. I pay out the ass for all my gear so I use a Digidesign XMON with my D-Controller, but you can use any interface so long as you can isolate each of your outputs.

Once you have your needed outs you can the go about telling your DAW (whatever App you use) to use each output correctly. The cheaper the DAW the less likely this will be a do-able process. Normal film I/O settings are 1) L, 2) R, 3) C, 4) Sub, 5) Ls, 6) Rs. Making sure you have 5 speakers and a Sub (6 total) that you can plug each output into, you can now get 5.1 out of your machine so when you mix in your DAW you really hear each speaker firing off in the area correctly.

As for mixing they are your ears buddy.... took me two weeks on my first 5.1 project to learn proper surround mixing. If it is for Post (audio to visuals) attention to details if it moves it makes a sound. If it is a band then my best suggestion is to make us feel like we are in the middle of the concert.

Sadly there is no real EASY way to do "Surround". I have a ProTools HD1 rig and if you needed to learn how to configure the I/O for surround sound editing I could show you how to do that... but I haven't found a "cheap & simple" way to do this accurately on any other DAW.

These might feel techy but they are required reading for Post Production

Here is the AES guide

And Hollywoods guide

Hope it helps.

Edit:

PS

Mono is your BEST friend when working in surround.

[prophetik music]

it would be simply for fun, really. my internal soundchip has six channels (or eight, don't remember which, but six is all that matter, right?).

i've got true surround sound, fo sho.

i'll have to sit down and play with it some more, i guess.

[rig1015]

Don't let the links I dropped to the manuals scare you off from your idea, or your idea to actually do it. If your soundcard does 5.1 see if your DAW can actually use it to send out audio specifically to each channel. A lot of times what happens is it says 5.1 etc. but it just has a built in AC3 decoder and outputs for all 6 speakers (lame). So be sure not to trip on that, I did. A buddy of mine who rewires graphics cards into DSP cards got two quad sound cards to work as a 7.1 system but the LFE was all weird.

Surround Sound mixing is really cool once you get your head around it, *rimshot* but the problem with it is media outlets... how many iPod come with 5.1 headphones? How many car CD players will recognize a AC3 formatted file? I use it pretty much only for authoring DVD's, and doing post production work because a general audience has no real understanding / appriciation for ALL the work you'll put into the surround song... *sighs* it sucks... I know.

Learn it though... you'll love it. Need help? Ideas? Feel free to PM me.

PS

At least you won't have learn to mix for an array.

[dannthr]

but then again I'd bet that 70% of homes don't even have their surround sound system setup correctly.

I think it's a lot more--like more than 90%.

[rig1015]

Yeah I'll agree with 90% ... I thought I had my system done up pretty well... until I learned the AES' standard.