darkmaster987 Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 I don't want to sound like some sort of P2P activist here, but the original purpose of systems like torrents was to prcevent censorship from people who believe they have the power to decide what we have the right to listen to. And as much as I hate to say this, the numerous "purges" that have happened on this site are a form of censorship. You might say "they're crap", and sure some of them are, but the fact remains that they were considered *enjoyable* enough (if poor from a technical point of view) to be posted on here in the first place, and that plenty of members here weren't happy with some of the removals. I know personally enjoyed some of the deleted tracks more than some of the recent ones I've seen on OCR. Bittorrent lets you select the files you want to download, and if people don't want those specific tracks, they can easily choose not to download them. It's just the idea of not offering people that choice that really grates with me - as long as they're not hosted on this site, they're not using your bandwidth, so this amounts to deliberately going out of your way only to deny people the ability to disagree with you. :/ Yeah I know this isn't exactly new, but until today I'd always assumed that all the songs that had ever been on OCRemix were still available through the torrents. Sadly not so. And yeah this is a rant post....sorry bout that, but alot of this kind of stuff on the net lately has really been getting on my nerves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenogu Labz Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 In this case, it's not a matter of censorship; it's a matter of standards. OCRemix only posts mixes of high quality, and sometimes, a mix makes it through that they later decide doesn't deserve to be on, for whatever reason. The artists are still free to submit their mixes to other sites: Remix ThaSauce, OLR, and many other resources are there for that. Think of it as a designer clothes shop. If a high-end, famous clothes designer suddenly came out with a brand of perfectly ordinary jeans, what would everyone think? Obviously, they're not as high-quality as everyone assumed. VG music fans can trust that any mix posted by OCR is guaranteed to be of the best quality there is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollgagh Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 well it's not even that they're being re-evaluated by today's standards they were tested under the standards of the time period that they were released and still found wanting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkmaster987 Posted January 10, 2010 Author Share Posted January 10, 2010 True. Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with the standards here other than the technically-oriented ones, and i'm glad I don't have to wade through piles of shit like on NG and youtube. but since torrents are p-to-p, we're talking about files that aren't actually on the site, I'd like to be have complete choice over the files O download. TBH I think i've had a little too much to drink tonight. I might well be wishing I hadn't started this topic by tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollgagh Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 btw if you do want the missing files, a good number of them can be had on Doulifée's OCRemoved site: http://www.doulifee.com/Storage/OC_Removed/ wait, you're an '05er you should know that already Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyleJCrb Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 Sorry man, but OCR here is a dictatorship, and whatever the judges and djpretzel say goes. If they want certain songs removed due to standards issues, then it is completely their call to do so. If you want the removed remixes, I suggest you check out OCReMoved. Edit: DAMN YOU GOLLGAAARRRRGHHHH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollgagh Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 Edit: DAMN YOU GOLLGAAARRRRGHHHH lol 2fast4u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zircon Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 We've only removed a small number of mixes, and it wasn't because "we didn't like them", it was because the mixes did not meet site standards - the things that separate us from rapidshare or tindeck. Furthermore, as Gollgagh said, we've re-evaluated mixes based on the standards of the time. These include mixes that: * Were not actually remixes of game music. * Were ripped off from other artists / arrange albums. * Directly sampled the original for the majority of the piece, etc. The remixes that we removed should have never been accepted to begin with, and yes, that is our call to make, not the public's. The judges panel and djpretzel are the sole people who determine what gets posted and what doesn't, and have the authority to re-evaluate previous decisions and, under extreme circumstances, overturn them. Edit: Wow 6 posts above me while I was writing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoadiePC Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 Could I make a suggestion? Perhaps if someone were able to compile the OCRemoved stuff into a master list, and(based on the size), divide it up into some manageable torrents, there could be an update made whenever a bunch of older ReMixes are phased out. For example(and bear in mind, I'm speaking off-the-cuff, so my numbers are pure speculation), say there's 150 currently OCRemoved tracks, we create three(possibly date-oriented) torrents, and label them OCRemoved series 1 through 3. When the next full set of 50 hits, just compile it into series 4. Obviously, it'd have to be a balance between one HUGE update made less frequently versus micromanagement, but I feel some sort of arrangement could be made. I can also say this: I know I'd seed, and I KNOW that sorting through older, long-forgotten ReMixes could be one helluva nostalgia trip. ...Not even getting into the reduced bandwidth on the sites currently hosting said removed ReMixes... Let's face it; one of the major issues OCR has always faced has been hosting SO MUCH CONTENT. Between manageability & navigating the site, the darkest shadow in the corner has been the cost of transferring all that data--I'd assume that as OCRemoved's library grows, that concern is very likely to carry over. As someone else mentioned, if someone doesn't want a certain Remix from a torrent, they uncheck it. no big deal. That said, I don't see any reason(aside from manpower cost initializing the project) not to consider something like this. I've already had a decent flood of ideas for this, and I would be willing to help out in any way I can. I'd happily do the initial seeding, or perhaps ID3 tag editing to prep a torrent, but I don't want to step on any toes--If someone with the authority does green-light this, please let me know if I can help. But I'm playing a backseat driver here. I don't run any of those sites, and while I can say I'd do my part, It'd likely be up to the people responsible for them to get the ball rolling. Hopefully, with the help of some of OCR's staff, there could be some communication regarding recently discontinued Remixes, and a way to keep the older stuff alive. --kind of Offtopic: Did anyone else notice that the band Rednex has teamed up with a certain torrent site to OPENLY release their next single? The statement that they released on the subject is an interesting read: http://www.rednexmusic.com/info/RednexLovePirateBay_2010-01-07.pdf I hope I'm not bending/breaking any rules with the address above, there's no link to illegal content, but if someone thinks I shouldn't link directly to it, please let me know and I'll remove the link. The reason I post the link about Rednex is simple: not ALL torrenting is illegal, and we might be able to help change the negative stigma attached to torrenting if we consider it as a low-cost alternative to expensive webhosting. That, and my personal beliefs, aside, I feel the benefits to an idea like this are huge, not to mention at a minimal cost--and the OCR lurkers(like me!) would be able to give back to a much-loved community in our own way. any thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeSword Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 I don't want to sound like some sort of P2P activist here, but the original purpose of systems like torrents was to prcevent censorship from people who believe they have the power to decide what we have the right to listen to. Um, no. The "original purpose" of BitTorrent has nothing to do with censorship or societal issues of rights vs. privileges. The purpose of BitTorrent was to more efficiently distribute large amounts of data to a large group of people. And as much as I hate to say this, the numerous "purges" that have happened on this site are a form of censorship.No.Could I make a suggestion?Perhaps if someone were able to compile the OCRemoved stuff into a master list, and(based on the size), divide it up into some manageable torrents, there could be an update made whenever a bunch of older ReMixes are phased out. For example(and bear in mind, I'm speaking off-the-cuff, so my numbers are pure speculation), say there's 150 currently OCRemoved tracks, we create three(possibly date-oriented) torrents, and label them OCRemoved series 1 through 3. When the next full set of 50 hits, just compile it into series 4. Obviously, it'd have to be a balance between one HUGE update made less frequently versus micromanagement, but I feel some sort of arrangement could be made. any thoughts? No, we're not gonna do that. We officially don't distribute the removed tracks because they've been removed from the OC ReMix library. It's not a question of bandwidth, and it never was. Remixes were removed for various reasons, most of which were that they should not have been posted to the site in the first place under the guidelines that existed at the time they were posted (zero arrangement value, direct sampling, etc.). The number of removed remixes will not grow. We don't post stuff that shouldn't be on the site; many judges make sure of that. And if a remix is accidentally posted when it shouldn't be, it's removed within 30 minutes (this is rare to the point where it's practically never). We also don't have any further "lockdowns" planned. Anything posted to the site since the last lockdown is as good as gold. If you want to download removed tracks, you can search around for them. People run sites where you can find them. But you won't get them here. They're not part of this site's catalog of remixes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinewav Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 While I can see where you're coming from, I wouldn't say that purges were a form of censorship at all... it's not like djp went around actively trying to remove those files from the internet. It's pretty well known around here that you can get them all at OC Removed, and the staff knows it and accepts it. It's less censorship, and a more a very minor form of disassociation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyleJCrb Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 ...Not even getting into the reduced bandwidth on the sites currently hosting said removed ReMixes... If you want to make and maintain your own torrent of OCReMoved remixes, I'm sure they wouldn't mind that. Just don't expect any official recognition of the torrent by OCR. As for hosting: Consider for a second that many webhosts these days offer unlimited bandwidth, even for shared servers. Sure, they do have a problem if you're using too much bandwidth too quickly, but unless you have huge bandwidth needs, (which I'm fairly certain Doulifee's site does not) then hosting the OCReMoved archive is not a major issue (hell, I will gladly host it myself if Doulifee is having bandwidth or site space issues). Bandwidth and space have become cheap and plentiful. It's really a non-issue these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverCoat Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 I don't want to sound like some sort of P2P activist here, but the original purpose of systems like torrents was to prcevent censorship from people who believe they have the power to decide what we have the right to listen to. is that your final answer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poke'G Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 If you want to download removed tracks, you can search around for them. People run sites where you can find them. But you won't get them here. They're not part of this site's catalog of remixes. Wait, does OCR even have a master list of the removed on the site today? Seeing that the songs were once hosted at the site, it seems really poor form to not have a page (not forum topic) acknowledging it. I agree that OCR doesn't need to post or distribute them any longer, but to not leave up some point of mention just feels like the admins and judges are sweeping the issue under a rug. That just doesn't strike me as professional at all. ... Never mind, I found the ReMix Changelog. The chain of discourse really made it sound like this didn't exist. No problems here anymore, save maybe having a link to that page in the music drop down menu, rather than having to dig through the FAQ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Damned Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 I find it funny that he speaks of how OCR is censoring the removed remixes, yet there are two posts telling him exactly where to get said remixes, and those posts haven't been removed or edited. Mind you, I've been told I have an odd sense of humor, but those people are dead now, so it's alright. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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