Liontamer
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Posts posted by Liontamer
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The production job on this is really disappointing. The piano sample in the intro is too artificial to be this exposed. The use of some sort of organ synth approaching the end at 4:15 has the same problem as the piano; sounds artificial/GM-ish as well. The bassline was pretty uninspired as it usually just played along with the Day the World Revived melody. The drumwork also was bland, and I have to believe that there could have been ways to retain the fairly downbeat, melancholy feel while being more creative with those areas. All of the instruments possess too much reverb and no sharpness. The Eastern style instrumentation in the background is decent I suppose, but suffers from the same aforementioned problem every other instrument has.
Crono's vocals & harmonization are a sincere effort, but the delivery is too amateur-sounding and rough, while the levels on them are too low relative to the music itself. At several points with these lyrics, I also had little to no idea what Crono was saying. Little vocal tricks like 1:41 (where he tries to harmonize himself singing "you") & 2:23 (with "me" and "you" at the same time) don't function well at all. That's simply a byproduct of too much vocal reverb and not positioning the lyrics properly in the first place.
Everything combines for a fairly spotty, unpolished sound, so while the rearrangement idea is worthy to me, the execution needs to be refined drastically. Nothing but a production overhaul and more finesse in the delivery could get this passed.
NO
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The stuff used here is pretty cool, but all of the sounds mush together; way too much reverb during most of the track. The piano opening with the various sound effects was nice, but things didn't sound sharper once you had the strings and other parts come in. Once you hit 1:04 with the percussion being introduced, the reverb issue was glaringly obvious. I felt the cliched drumwork clashed with the ambient style you were going for.
The horn sample brought in at 1:35 was overbearing in comparison to the other sounds, and probably should have been toned down or replaced with something else; I felt it clashed with the rest of the atmosphere as much as the drumwork did. Pull back the strings as well and let the piano handling your Ms. Pac-Man arrangement stand out more. Not terrible or anything, but the arrangement felt rather aimless to be honest, and this certainly has a lot that would need to be addressed. Definitely create more separation & clarity for your sounds at the very, very least.
NO
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Admittedly, I had trouble tracking down the actual source tune to this, as I couldn't connect any of the SID or MOD tracks I heard to this track, so someone else may have to check that out. Videogame Orchestra has a lot more remixes at their site that are genuine mixes, so I suppose I have to take their word on this, though I'm hoping this isn't just an electronic cover-style mix. I believe that it is though from seeing their website's list of "remakes" and listening to the structure, but this could be a better straight arrangement track with some remastering.
This one was a lot stronger than the rest of the material on their site, which are essentially all remakes, only a lot sparser-sounding. I'm sure some of the sound choices here will bother others, since there are plenty of shrill ones to be found. It didn't bother me too badly, but it was certainly a negative. A small way to add a bit more creative activity would be by using the SID sounds more as beats when they're under the melody. This was some quirky, enjoyable electronic stuff with a decent groove that primarily suffers from a lack of sound balance, IMO. The melody didn't sound strong in a proverbial vacuum and didn't have enough presence over the SIDtune effects or synth-percussion work, while the bassline was pretty good but obscured as well. The SID stuff dropped down at 2:17, but was then too low to add any depth to the rest of the music. 2:01 uses another iteration of the melody except with a slightly different balance of the sounds, so I felt there could have been a measure more development considering there were only 3 minutes to the whole thing. Cool work with a lot of interesting sounds, a serviceable groove and genuine energy, but not there yet.
NO
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Yeah, I played this last semester on VGF. Not bad, but I'm with DS on this one. The overall groove is decent. The intro indeed took too long to build up to the start of the melody. Gotta have to get to your synth addition at 1:27 a lot sooner. The lead's rather thin which isn't a DQ, but nothing melodic jumped in to compensate for that.
Around the 3 minute mark of the 4:42 song, things haven't really been moving or developing with the actual "Forest" theme being used here, so this ultimately fails at being a strong arrangement idea.
I'm genuinely Looking forward to Infy's Arkanoid mix "Galway is God" eventually being revised and possibly submitted here, as that has a lot more promise that this. Decent beats are here in this mix, but it essentially plods along for the 4+ minutes without using the source theme in any dynamic way.
NO
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The synths are generally flat-sounding and obscured by your beatwork and bassline at times. I would have liked to heard some more variation with the cymbal as opposed to its role as a quarter-note beatkeeper. By around the 2:30 mark, I also was wondering where the change in the groove would come. Almost on cue at 2:41, we get a decent change-up, though the same problems exist where the beatwork and bassline are too dominant over your other sound choices. The move over to this second half was also pretty abrupt with no real transition made aside from the lead synth elements dropping out and the key changing (2:34-2:41). The last 15 seconds where the keyboard and generic cymbal shot closed the track didn't help at all, so find a more creative resolution that's a more comfortable fit with the style of the track instead of switching instruments in non sequitur fashion.
The mix is actually really catchy (hopefully isn't just the source material verbatim, but DarkeSword would be the best judge of that), but there needs to be some more creativity and variation presented here once you lay down the groove. Take a look at your bassline and percussion and explore some unique pattern ideas, and thought out transitions. Meanwhile make sure your various synth levels are balanced where they need to be; the melody and even the countermelody shouldn't be rivaled so much by the beatwork. Samples could use attention as well as suggestions via the ReMixing & WIP forums, since the flat delivery for your various melodies distracted me from noticing the average development here until I took that closer look. Keep at it, bro!
NO
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I'm really not hearing the Metroid in this aside from the intro bassline & Dan Owsen in-game voice samples either. And I may catch flak for this, but this is flat-out shitty-sounding d'n'b, and I'm generally a nice guy. There's NO organized structure or cohesion here and the distorted sound choices are awful. Submit a viable rearrangement idea and give your music some discernible direction.
Total. Garbage. And I'll absolutely stand by that.
EDIT: There's nothing wrong with remixes that abstractly handle a game's source material. I think some of Children of the Monkey Machine's work & zykO's River City Ransom acid mix "i n d i g o" are great examples of that. Shnabubula's "Red Spiders" was also another good example of something that was structured in an unorthodox way, yet manged to tie back well to the source material.
With that said, I don't think it's much to expect any submission to have more than the most tenuous of tenuous connections to the source material, which I believe this mix is a case of. The panel has also turned down "River City Rap" by the Crazy Crackaz All-Stars & zykO's "the anti-ignorance" along similar lines. Even though it was posted under different times, DJ Seith's Water Warning mixes are more overtly tied to their Sonic source material than this here is tied to Super Metroid. On the whole, this doesn't even sound inspired by Metroid, and Edgen Animations' recently rejected Halo submission at least had that kind of vibe going for it when we felt that it didn't relate enough to the source theme.
Though it wasn't implied against me, I'm not against the d'n'b genre. Though I didn't like the style of this piece as it relates to d'n'b for my reasons above, my problems with this track as d'n'b function primarily on a game music rearrangement level. When Ari says the track loops 37 times or whatever, he's overgeneralizing, so I don't wanna get lumped in that. But what I'm hearing is essentially the bassline and breakbeats dropping in and out at various times & combinations with a few short quasi-transitions, no apparent structure and little viable development ideas as a rearrangement over the course of the 5:58 and minimal reference to "Theme of Super Metroid" at best (despite that track being required to be the foundation of the work in order to pass the submissions guidelines).
If this functions well as an atonal, abstract d'n'b/electronica piece on account of these subjective aspects I've said, then more power to it as an original work though I personally felt it didn't accomplish this. But I'm judging this on whether it's a worthy Super Metroid rearrangement, and on that level it's total garbage when factoring everything into account. If I'm somehow missing the bigger picture on this actually being a Super Metroid arrangement, I'd be more than happy to reconsider my vote. But the way this is structured has jack shit to do with Super Metroid and that kind of submission is exactly what we're not looking for.
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The intro's not too bad, but you can tell that this won't be engaging from the outset due to how far in the back the vox sounded. Percussion just keeps the beat, but doesn't offer anything beyond that to add depth to the piece. EQing is mostly the low-end the whole time, so nothing sounds clean. 2:56 of a 4:04 track was the significant "development" within the mix as the lead changed, but we're still treading water with the same stuff here with a little more volume on the vox in the background. Abrupt drum & CYMBAL SHOT ending (
). Nothin' spells lovin' like a generic, non sequitur finish. The overall delivery was incredibly flat.NO
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Not bad, if only because the source material is pretty cool. This isn't an improvement on that though on account of the terrible sounds used. The opening drum beat just plods around for over half a minute, and the original section coming in at :36 is too minimal to really add anything creative arrangement-wise. It essentially follows the melody verbatim, which doesn't necessary disqualify it, as "Magnet Man Goes West" did that moreso than this one, but MMGW at least overhauled the sound along with some more creative original sections inspired by the work, and that's what this needs. Practically no development over the 4 minutes either, and that's just not gonna cut it. Pretty boring/uninspired.
NO
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Source: http://www.alpha-ii.com/snesmusic/spcsets/ts.rsn - "Ever Green"
First Version: ftp://35.9.117.16/Terranigma_Blue_OC_ReMix.mp3
I thought the production could have sounded sharper, otherwise this was a great upgrade from the first version, incorporating a lot more composition ideas and sounds while keeping true to the spirit of the first remix, which was an arrangement that was a lot closer in structure to the source material. Excellent piece overall. If someone wanted to submit a new version of an old mix, this is a prime example of how you'd create something that's a significant arrangement upgrade, not just a production upgrade. Easy YES.
I believe the only reason this is here in on account of the replacement/addition debate. As has always been my stance, I believe we should primarily honor the request of the mixer (if they have one), whether that's addition OR replacement. ziwtra doesn't mind either way, as he told me on IRC soon after he finished this one. But he did also mention to me that it might be interesting for fans to be able to compare the first version with the second, so with that said I'm in favor of this one as an addition as Youngjin might be slightly leaning in that direction.
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I promised to make a show previewing season 3 of VGF that would highlight some tracks released during the summer, and I had a break in between some classes, so I took 20 mins to set up a playlist and went to work on VG Frequency #29.99. Free of charge, enjoy 91 minutes & 63MB of complete crud. In all seriousness though, this past summer has had some pretty notable work from all around, and this was a good chance to play through a handful of 'em. This saturday's show premiere of Season 3 will feature even more summer cuts, a lot of high quality material I couldn't manage to fit in today. In the meantime, give me an hour and a half of your time, DL the show, and enjoy today's playlist:
Larry Oji - WMRE (Emory University Student Radio; Atlanta, GA)
"VG Frequency" - Wednesday, September 1, 2004 / 12 - 1:30 PM
1. SgtRama - VG Frequency "Eat A Bumper" Bumper
2. Setsuo Yamamoto, Makoto Tomozawa, Yuki Iwai, Yuko Takehara & Toshihiko Horiyama - "Stage Select 1" [Megaman X OST]
3. Arkimedes - Lufia 2 "Ticking Clocks" [VGMix2 #1853]
4. DarkeSword - Secret of Evermore "A Whisper and a Shadow" [The People's Remix Competition 16 / VGMix2 #1500]
5. mv - "Green Ashes" [http://mv.vgmix.com]
6. Ork Estral - "Funny Crinkle Flakes" [http://nigel.has.it]
7. DistantJ - The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening "Windfish Enigma" [VGMix2 #1550]
8. Setsuo Yamamoto, Makoto Tomozawa, Yuki Iwai, Yuko Takehara & Toshihiko Horiyama - "Chill Penguin Stage" [Megaman X OST]
9. GrayLightning - Shining Force 1 "Armageddon" [OC ReMix #1233]
10. Lix - Final Fantasy 5 "The New World (Remember Free)" [http://www.levolution.info]
11. Unknown - "Sand in the Eye" [CompoST 7 / SoundTempest]
12. ABG - Final Fantasy 11 "Recollection (Dynamis Mix)" [VGMix2 #2063]
13. Setsuo Yamamoto, Makoto Tomozawa, Yuki Iwai, Yuko Takehara & Toshihiko Horiyama - "Storm Eagle Stage" [Megaman X OST]
14. Star Salzman - "Something Magic" [http://www.starblast.org]
15. qaid - "breaking windows to let the sunlight through" [breaking Windows EP]
16. Adhesive Boy - The Legend of Zelda 3 "Devout Hyrulian Guttersnipe" [VGMix2 #2042]
17. Jared Hudson - "A Summer Dream" [http://www.hudsonstudios.net]
18. Disposer - Megaman 2 "Deep Forest Dance" [VGMix2 #1660]
19. Setsuo Yamamoto, Makoto Tomozawa, Yuki Iwai, Yuko Takehara & Toshihiko Horiyama - "Armored Armadillo Stage" [Megaman X OST]
20. Protricity - Zombies Ate My Neighbors "Neighburgers" [OC ReMix #1202]
21. Mark Vera - Laser Squad "Mission Recalled" [Laser Squad Nemesis OST / OC ReMix #1217]
22. zircon - Chrono Trigger "Calamitous Judgment" [VGMix2 #1594 / OC ReMix #1219]
23. Setsuo Yamamoto, Makoto Tomozawa, Yuki Iwai, Yuko Takehara & Toshihiko Horiyama - "Boomer Kuwanger Stage" [Megaman X OST]
24. Gecko Yamori & Kevin "Lorenzo" Sisk - Sonic the Hedgehog 3 "Madman Across the Marble Garden" [VGMix2 #2132]
25. zykO - Faxanadu "Sketch of a Potentially Contrived Memory" [VGMix2 #1938]
26. Setsuo Yamamoto, Makoto Tomozawa, Yuki Iwai, Yuko Takehara & Toshihiko Horiyama - "Flame Mammoth Stage" [Megaman X OST]
27. Setsuo Yamamoto, Makoto Tomozawa, Yuki Iwai, Yuko Takehara & Toshihiko Horiyama - "Stage Clear" [Megaman X OST]
Remember people, Saturday, 10PM to Midnight. Make sure to be there for the new season of VG Frequency. It's appointment television, minus the television.
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Are the revisions arrangement-centric or related to mastering and more importantly finding better samples, out of curiosity? From an arrangement perspective this seems pretty slick, but it falls into GM territory on the soundset...
At this point, since the arrangement is definitely strong, he'll just be adding back the reverb for the alto sax and piano which was present in the PRC19 version in order to thicken the sound up. Nothing in the arrangement itself is gonna be altered, and I think we'll have to work with the sample quality he's got.
Source: http://www.alpha-ii.com/snesmusic/spcsets/ct.rsn - "Black Dream" (ct-3-11.spc)
(EDIT: I've had the revised version a couple of hours after I posted the above, so I'll be voting.) Pretty interesting how this mix and Mythril Nazgul's "The 6th Omen" built upon different sections of the same theme. Like djp alluded to, this is a great rearrangement with weak samples. Overall, I felt that bladiator managed to rise above the MIDI construction of this piece with some intelligent rearrangement that really builds well on the source material and gives it a whole new feel thanks to the salsa-y Latin overtones.
I thought the velocities on the piano and sax needed to sound more humanized, but I know that Karl played those sections on a velocity-sensitive keyboard. Pretz pointed out to me that the weak samples here may very well have limited how well the velocities came off. djp also felt that the nature of the piano & horn fit well given the genre, and I honestly didn't have any real problem with the dynamics without that explanation. Note to anyone looking to bash us for sample-whoring, repeat after me: we're not sample-whores. But better samples would help manifest the dynamics input that's currently being obscured.
The bassline is at just the right level where it capably accentuates the flow, fills up the sound in the back, and doesn't sound either overbearing or obscured. I really wanted to hear more variation in the shakers and bongos, though that seemed to fit fairly comfortably with the genre as well. The winds at 1:52 for the last iteration of the melody got somewhat shrill though not particularly piercing; nonetheless, those should have been pulled back a bit. The reverb really helped thicken the overall sound of this to help the samples not sound as dry and exposed, and made this a much easier decision for me than when it had been taken out in the earlier version.
Pretty lively work, quality rearrangement, and rather more capable-sounding sample usage in comparison to, say, "Bottled Metro". Great job, Karl! I'm hoping you check out the ReMixing forum for some free soundfonts and various stuff along those lines. If you ever have time to replay the piano section of this mix on an actual piano (like you said you might), I'd be very interested in how it turns out. Meanwhile, very nice work considering what was at your disposal!
YES
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Bladiator is in the process of doing some minor revisions on the mix, so I request that you please hold off for a day or three for Karl to do his thing. That doesn't necessarily mean that this will bring the mix into YES territory, but I gave him some suggestions to use since he wrote the mix for PRC19 which he'll be trying to implement.
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As much as I hate to seem dismissive with the "it's a cover" rejection, it really is a straightforward medley cover with some easily observable yet overall minimal additions. Select Start's "Kraid's Hideout" had interpretive countermelodic additions to work along with the source material, and this doesn't have anything of the sort to bolster the mix with any truly unique ideas.
Prot's decision is pretty complimentary, and I wanted to say the same things he did. The playing is very quality and the production is excellent, but Zoast just need to add more ideas to this to make this a substantial arrangement/rearrangement. Even a solo piano piece tackling this material would need substantial additions to get the job done.
I've pimped some of Marshall's material for the VGF Pimp Section over the past summer, so I've heard some of his material, and I like his skills at the moment. So believe me when I say it's only a matter of time until he gets posted here. All things considered though, I agree with Prot's call. Getting a bit more creative via chord structure, variation, improvisation/original sections, support instruments, anything would place your own spin on things in a rearrangement sense.
If you don't plan on doing anything like that for this piece, Marshall, releasing your planned trilogy via VGMix as well as a prominent Zoast.com release would be a great idea and could attract attention in the same vein as Stemage's own Metroid rock album, Metroid Metal. This is truly an enjoyable cover piece, but there's not enough interpretation beyond the instrumental choice in order to get my YES.
NO
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Not sure why the mastering on this sounds so poor; nothing sounds sharp and all of the sounds crud together once several instruments and synths are doing their thing at once (notably from 3:15 until the end). The minimal-style break sections going from 1:26 to 1:59 really meandered a lot, so quite a few seconds could have been shaved off of that for a quicker transition. Otherwise add a bit more substance to those sections.
The electrosynth coming in briefly at 2:34 was terribly exposed and managed to clip/distort twice. There it is again at 3:15. It's really poorly used over the top of everything else. Not a bad idea arrangement-wise, could have been a little more creative tackling the melody, but the breakbeat approach was cool for a bit. The production or lackthereof ultimately doomed this one however.
NO
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DS has got it down. The guitar recording could sound sharper, you need some more separation in the sounds when other elements drop in, and things have to get interesting via variation/development in the composition.
By 1:31 of the 2:35 track (when you went into the second iteration of the main melody), I was wondering when the variation is coming and I realized it wasn't. Some additions happened of course (particularly for the last verse), but there was still basically no development. The percussion was also fairly unenergetic, and that doesn't enhance the guitar work here at all. Try to add some more personal style and creativity to everything once you lay down your basic gameplan.
NO
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Indeed, tighten this sloppy stuff up or go solo piano. Messy support the whole way through. The sudden transition into how the strings wound down near the finish at 2:31 was also a big "WTF?" GC/BE. I wouldn't mind a resubmit as well, but I don't have much faith in how it would turn out given how haphazardly this was assembled. Nevertheless Tao, keep at it bro.
NO
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The lead guitar work was alright (little too sedate for my personal tastes, but that doesn't affect my vote), but everything else here managed to bring this down. I didn't like the sound of some of the rhythym guitar work underneath the melody (started at :44, but 1:12-1:34 was an exposed example of this), since it didn't sound right in tandem with the lead. The bongos were decent, but the cymbal, tambourine, and (in particular) drum patterns were boring/plodding after a while; the percussion support could have used some variation in the beats or instrumentation at some point to keep things fresh. The string support in particular is pretty exposed moving from note to note, conflicting with the lead at 1:59 with an awkward note transition as well as several other points & needs to be significantly more humanized, and again the acoustic support chords from :44-1:34 also needed to be tightened up since they don't combine well with your lead guitar.
These issues I had though really sapped a lot of the potential out of this one and were enough for me to NO. This was a promising arrangement moving things over into an acoustic guitar setting (and not a mere cover), but figure out how to get those support instruments to properly accentuate the material and resubmit. Right now, they don't mesh well and drag the piece down. I didn't hear any off-notes in the Chrono's theme reference (those were fine as Prot said), and the second half was stronger than the first in terms of the notation IMO, but working on these issues would make this an easy YES with a resubmission.
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Flat and generic, not unlike many fashion show models. Flat/generic sounds all around, and the percussion in particular is weak. The decently used male vox at 2:05 was certainly a cool idea. Whatever spastic synth came in at 3:13 should have been left out, and its use right near the close of the track crudded the ending. Whatever the arrangement structure could have had going for it was undermined by the sounds. "Bleh" is my honest reaction. Unsalvageable.
NO
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My view is that if you're gonna use the original verbatim as the foundation, then the additions better be legendary. No chance here. Would have been an easy post on the site 4 years ago. Then we would have likely removed it.
More creative additions were there during the second half, but this is the original wearing a coat or some other terrible metaphor. Considering that stuff like FTC's own similarly structured remix of the same theme is available at R:K:O, you could post this mix there and see if anyone likes it, but I still don't see much merit in it by OCR's standards I'm afraid. It's just too reliant on the C64 source material itself carrying the track.NO
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Pretty cool, but while a concept (and I stress the word 'concept') like this could make a Square arrange album, there's not much chance for it here when the arrangement is basically the original. The execution would have to be amazing for a viable genre conversion mix.
Bad clipping at 1:57/3:13/4:12; hell, clipping probably everywhere listening on an expensive setup. What is up with that off-key support starting in around 2:05? It clashes terribly with what else is going on. Yeah, not enough instrumental clickage or sound balance in here, like DarkeSword said, and the very ending is exposed MIDI goodness. Another GC/BE mix. Good concept...you can finish the rest.
NO
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Yeah, I remember bLiNd did a MIDI-rip cover of this just for fun, and the sounds reminded me of that to some extent. There's not much energy and not much going on arrangement-wise here. The volume tricks with the lead around 2:27 were a cool idea but pretty awkward in their usage. Yeah, the transition at 3:08 was cool. Should have definitely played around with that sound more instead. Certainly a cool effort for nearly no experience, but this doesn't take the source tune in any new directions.
NO
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Cool ideas, but yeah, the production sucks. Hahaha. Sorry, but I gotta laugh when it says this is at 192kbps/48khz. A waste of a high encoding. Your voice could also use at least a touch of effects on it. Loved the "FUCK YOU!" up in there at 2:55 though. That's at least good enough for me to ask for a resubmit if you can get this to sound sharper, so I can hear "FUCK YOU!" again.
Vocals are often drowned out by the music, and we collectively might not accept something like that, but I'd own that up to the death-metal style, so I didn't mind, even though I prefer to understand what I'm listening to. Delivery is weak throughout. Nice ending. Well...nah, not really. Interesting, to say the least.
NO
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Good idea, bad execution. Production needs a huge overhaul so that this sounds nothing like what I'm listening to. Potential's there, but you need to tighten everything up and you'd obviously need someone else to produce this for you. The rearrangement doesn't deserve to get so easily rejected, but what else can I say other than that it sounds like a total mess?
NO
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Not in a particularly talkative mood while judging the weaker stuff from this batch.
What DarkeSword said. What Protricity said. What somebody else might say.
NO
VG Frequency: U Love VGM
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Wow, bro. I can't believe you quoted something from page 1 though. Yeesh. Alright, we'll see you folks around tonight, I hope.
Snag episode #29.99 (the season 3 preview show) over at my forum at Ormgas.com. Remember, click the pic in the sig to check out the stream. It requires RealPlayer/Media Payer Classic. IM me at Liontamer87 to join the VG Frequency chat room. Right? Right. It's good to be back.