Ocarina of Time Orchestral Suite Part 2: Zelda's Lullaby

[FM]

People who are easily bored would do best to click back

So here's the deal: I've got two very different versions of this iconic tune kicking around in my head right now, and in addition to providing general feedback about both, I'd appreciate it if you told me which of these two you preferred. So. Here we go:

Zelda's Lullaby 1 - Romantic, Chromatic, Lush (trying to be anyway)

Zelda's Lullaby 2 - Meandering, Impressionistic, Block Textures

Also keep in mind that neither are finished, and they both kind of trail off at the end.

[Rozovian]

Zelda's Lullaby has been remixed a bit. It is iconic. Was interesting to hear your take on it.

The first version sounds like there's a second lead playing the first a few notes behind. The intro to the second version was much cleaner than that of the first, imo. Version 2 also sounds less sampled, there was some noises in the flute sample that I kept hearing in version 1. Overall, I prefer #2. Especially when the horns come in at the end.

So I suggest #2, but there's stuff in #1 that you could import and use in the final version.

Can't really help provide much more feedback than that, it's way beyond my orchestral skills. Would be great to have you on the Seiken Densetsu 3 project. Interested?

[Sil]

Sounds good. The first one reminds me of the opening of Mahler's 9th, or even Wolfgang-Korngold. I think it could use more drastic key changes in the Romantic tradition to avoid nasty pedal points, anything that could catch the listener completely off guard. For example, it ends right now in F major, so you could just restate the theme again in C# major, probably in the lower range (cellos, bassoons.)

The second one is giving me some Ives "Unanswered Question" vibes and I don't really know where it could go to give it some structure. Again, drastic key changes to unexpected keys might help, and pedal points might actually benefit you here. I'm thinking the kind of atmosphere you want to create should sound like those "nature" moments in Mahler's symphonies where strings are all sustained and flutes/winds/"off stage brass" go crazy in between. Again, thinking along the lines of Ives and Mahler, a trumpet solo might be effective here too. "Wrong notes" in the melody line also tend to create a neat atmosphere, and avoids any cheesy jazz chords that might pop up.

[FM]

Zelda's Lullaby has been remixed a bit. It is iconic. Was interesting to hear your take on it.

The first version sounds like there's a second lead playing the first a few notes behind. The intro to the second version was much cleaner than that of the first, imo. Version 2 also sounds less sampled, there was some noises in the flute sample that I kept hearing in version 1. Overall, I prefer #2. Especially when the horns come in at the end.

So I suggest #2, but there's stuff in #1 that you could import and use in the final version.

Can't really help provide much more feedback than that, it's way beyond my orchestral skills. Would be great to have you on the Seiken Densetsu 3 project. Interested?

Thanks, but I'm unfamiliar with that game.

Sounds good. The first one reminds me of the opening of Mahler's 9th, or even Wolfgang-Korngold. I think it could use more drastic key changes in the Romantic tradition to avoid nasty pedal points, anything that could catch the listener completely off guard. For example, it ends right now in F major, so you could just restate the theme again in C# major, probably in the lower range (cellos, bassoons.)

The second one is giving me some Ives "Unanswered Question" vibes and I don't really know where it could go to give it some structure. Again, drastic key changes to unexpected keys might help, and pedal points might actually benefit you here. I'm thinking the kind of atmosphere you want to create should sound like those "nature" moments in Mahler's symphonies where strings are all sustained and flutes/winds/"off stage brass" go crazy in between. Again, thinking along the lines of Ives and Mahler, a trumpet solo might be effective here too. "Wrong notes" in the melody line also tend to create a neat atmosphere, and avoids any cheesy jazz chords that might pop up.

Thanks, I always appreciate your feedback. I'll have to check out Unanswered Question, I haven't listened to Ives much past a few of his well known things.

Where are some of these nature moments in Mahler? I'd be interested in hearing those as well.

Did you get any cheesy-jazz chord vibe in what's there already? At one point when working on it, I messed around with making the texture more modern and dissonant but I didn't have much luck with that path.

[Sil]

Mahler seemed to be obsessed with the very opening of Beethoven's 9th where it seemed like he was "tuning the universe" as one would tune an orchestra: one long sustained note/chord. Mahler's version usually consists of a large open chord in the strings, with some violins and winds acting out nature sounds. A lot of composers have used this effect since, typically with string harmonics or other effects, like in the Ives. Mahler's most famous use of the effect is in the opening of his Symphony No. 1, near the end of No. 2, and some parts of 3 and 7. It just seems to be the perfect setting to create some bird calls or whatever. I thought that to enrich those long sustained chords you could add little motivic gestures in other instruments, similar to how Beethoven, Mahler, Ives do.

Not much differentiates jazz harmonies from impressionist harmonies, but there is a difference nonetheless. Typically it's the use of "wrong" sounding notes, like wholetone scales, chromatic harmonic movement, or distant keys (like moving from F major to C# major.) The Zelda lullaby itself is more jazz than it is impressionist because quite frankly it's too tonal. While 7ths, 9ths, 11th, 13ths are commonly found in impressionist music, if you use them all the time it's going to sound more like jazz. In impressionist music you usually aren't able to tell if you're in a major or minor key. Debussy's Nuages is a great example of this: full of "wrong" harmonies juxtaposed against each other.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=i3ch1GfmLkw