Need some help with orchestral/hip hop music.

[BlackPanther]

I'm bout to start on Chipp's Orchestra/hip hop track. I'm usin EWQLSO gold. Are there any tips as how I should approach the symphonic side? I use FL by the way, how should I group instruments, what plugin should I use(between EW's own plugin, or should I use Kontakt?) What type of processing should my instruments go through since it's gonna be a combination of of hip hop elements and orchestra instrumentation.

Thoughts would be greatly appreciate xD.

[Moseph]

I assume when you're talking about grouping, you're talking about combining instruments using submaster channels or something of the sort? If you group, group by type, generally. I usually create submaster channels for winds, brass, strings, and percussion. You might find that it makes levels and shared effects a little bit easier to control, or you might find that it's a waste of time.

The kind of processing to use depends entirely on what kind of sound you're going for. Orchestra samples usually sound pretty good with just reverb, but if you're combining the orchestra with hip-hop, you might want some compression on certain instruments to help them cut through the mix. Normally, you shouldn't need heavy EQ on orchestra samples, but you might need it mixing with hip-hop depending on how you want things to fit together. Panning is also something to consider. I think the EWQL samples are pre-panned to orchestra position by default. Normally when doing orchestra mixing, you'd want things to reflect the instrument positioning of a real orchestra, but since you're doing a hybrid of sorts, there might be reason to pan things differently. (Like you might want to put cellos and basses in the middle to match the default electric bass position instead of off to the right like a standard orchestra.)

[BlackPanther]

Ah cool a response! Yes you've answered my questions, I'm a bit confused about the top part though.

Right now I'm using the EWQL vst, which they call "Kompakt Instrument" and I see 8 slots to put the instruments in. When I go to select somethin for the second slot there's no sound I've tried it with Kontakt before and it does the same thing. What I've been doin if I'm just usin a few sounds from the library, I just create several instance of the vst and run each instrument through it's own vst. How do I go about grouping all the stuff together in a much simpler fashion. Is there anywhere on the web where I can read about it?

[Moseph]

I dunno. I don't use Kontakt/Kompakt or FL. It may be an input/output routing issue. Things in the second Kontakt slot may read MIDI input from MIDI channel 2, in which case you would have to create a MIDI track in FL that outputs on MIDI channel 2 to the VST. You might also need a synth track in FL that takes its input from whichever of the VST's outputs the second slot feeds through. Sorry I can't be more specific, but I don't know exactly how the signal routing in Kontakt and FL is set up.

Nothing necessarily wrong with multiple instances of the sampler, though. My VSL orchestra template has over forty instances of the VSL sampler running.

EDIT: There's also a possibility that the Kontakt/Kompakt sampler has only one stereo output and the second slot is used for stacking instruments to be accessed via keyswitch and not for playing multiple instruments separately. This is how the VSL sampler is set up, so you have to use different instances for different instruments.

[BlackPanther]

I didn't realize that there was an option to change the routing of the instruments. I guess it goes to the next output everytime I add one and I just change them all to one like the first instance. But, I'll probably end up just creating a bunch of instances of kompakt since you said that's fine. Thanks for the help Moseph.

[Moseph]

I didn't realize that there was an option to change the routing of the instruments. I guess it goes to the next output everytime I add one and I just change them all to one like the first instance. But, I'll probably end up just creating a bunch of instances of kompakt since you said that's fine. Thanks for the help Moseph.

It might save RAM if you minimize the number of Kompakt instances that are running, but that's about it.

[tweex]

It might save RAM if you minimize the number of Kompakt instances that are running, but that's about it.

There's no might about it, it will save an INCREDIBLE amount of RAM by keeping your instance number down.

Rashad, this is what we call mutli-timbral. Essentially, you create up to 8 different midi channels and they are all part of the same instrument (each kompakt instance is an instrument). You can put up to 8 different patches into the kompakt player. The output you're talking about is the midi output and yes, they automatically make each new patch go to the next available midi channel (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, etc). The idea is to put as many patches in one instance as possible and just route them to the different midi channels. You can have two patches routed to the same channel or you can them all be different. It really doesn't matter.

However, the thing here is that I haven't the slightest idea how to do this in FL. Logic, no problem, but FL is outside what I use. I'm sure someone else can explain it to you if you don't know how to do it.

[BlackPanther]

I'm sure I could figure it out, thanks Brian! The only problem would be, if I were to add the 8 instruments to one instance, routing the different patches to their own mixer track just through that one instance of Kompakt alone. I hope someone could shed some light on this issue.

[prophetik music]

tweek, i do that all the time. you create all the MIDI out channels in FL, set them all to port 1/channels 1-8, and then you click the little gear to the left of the X in the top right corner of the VST that you're trying to control via midi. one of the pages on that screen that comes up should have a choice to set MIDI in and MIDI out ports. set the MIDI in to 1, and you're set.

that's the only way to control aftertouch, mod wheel, and other non-standard-mapping controls in some VSTs, like Kontakt Player and a few others, as well.

[BlackPanther]

Yeah, that's how I was gonna go about that, but what about using effect processors outside of the plugin? Will I just have to make due with what's given within kompakt or is there a way to route the 8 different instruments to seperate mixer tracks in FL?

[AntiRellik]

Yeah, that's how I was gonna go about that, but what about using effect processors outside of the plugin? Will I just have to make due with what's given within kompakt or is there a way to route the 8 different instruments to seperate mixer tracks in FL?

It's possible to separate each channel into its own effects chain in the mixer. Click on the channel you want to route, press F9 to open the mixer and then right click an instance/channel in the mixer and in the menu select Link selected channels -> To this track but I don't think you can route each instrument within the VST to a seperate mixer though. I haven't tried hard enough to find a way or researched about it Each time I want to route different instruments to its own mixer track I just open another instance of EWQLSO, Kontakt or GPO. It has never bothered me though, but it would be useful if somebody knew a way to route it in the way you're saying.

[Nabeel Ansari]

I DOOOOO

Okay so in PLAY or Kompakt or whatever, you should have each instrument going to an audio output. (or two depending on if it runs in stereo) So you take those numbers and you click the Gear icon of the Fruity Wrapper (upper left) and click on Processing. There'll be a list, and naturally you click auto assign. Just make sure there are enough free mixer tracks after the one that Kompakt itself is routed to, because the numbers only symbolize OFFSETS.

So if I set them 0 1 2 3 4 like the default, and I had kompakt in mixer track 6, the first instrument goes to six, the second to seven, the third to eight etc.

And it won't matter if you move the physical mixer tracks around, because it'll still be routed to the same position (it's crucial to make sure those mixer tracks are free and you aren't going to be moving them around)

[BlackPanther]

Haha yeah zirc just answered that for me not to long ago. Had he not told me I woulda came back here for the answer, thanks neblix.