New Game: DAWs, Instruments, and More

[jacehunter22]

Hey guys, I finally decided to sign up for an account after all these years of lurking on the site (a decade... and a half... plus one. Getting Old <.<). I have a huge appreciation for all the remixers on this site - except Preenus ( yes you Snappleman and Virt ) because you destroyed my sound system with 'Full Mast' </3 *Insert crying face*.

 I've taken the plunge and started my own RPG but am at a crossroads for music development. I am trying to figure out which DAW to invest in. I need something that will be intuitive, have lots of plugin support/community, and handle live recording as well. Most of the reviews I've read point to Reaper for what I want. I'm looking into Studio One as a number of people have suggested that DAW as well. Only problem is Reaper has no instruments to go with it. 

What would you guys suggest for starting out my instrument library? I keep coming back to Komplete 11 Select but am concerned it will be overwhelming as well as not have specific instruments I am looking for. Does anyone have experience with the Komplete Select suite? I also want a really good drum kit as nothing beats a solid beat.

I'll be recording my guitar via mic as I have no line outs and a ton of pedals I'd like to use - any suggestions on interfaces to use? I was looking into the Focusrite line a few years ago. Has to be able to record vocals as well

The style of music I am looking for is Final Fantasy / Chrono Trigger with splashes of Megaman and electronic/industrial in spots. Nothing big band / big orchestra and nothing chiptune or retro 8/16 bit. Synth, strings, pads, etc..

TLDR Summary:

1. Suggested DAWs for VTS and Live guitar / vocals
2. Instrument Suite for starting out
3. Drum Kits people prefer
4. Guitar / Vocal interface suggestions

Thank you for any feedback! Any other suggestions for getting started that are more specific than in the getting started thread would be really appreciated!

[Kat]

For DAWs it's largely preference nowadays as they usually have the same features. FL Studio comes with a small selection of sounds even at the base level, and the $99 intro version is functional enough for most things. It also comes with free updates. You have to get one of the higher editions for recording, however, but when upgrading you only pay the difference. Cubase is a nice choice and my preferred DAW for recording(and it's really friggin stable), but only includes a small amount of instrument plugins. It's also fairly expensive and you have to pay for the updates(though these are usually big version changes, like going from Kontakt 4 to 5, for example).

For instruments, Kontakt itself comes with a nice enough library. If you don't have Kontakt already, it's well worth the cost simply for all the relatively cheap plugins that require it. I'd also suggest anything by Impact Soundworks. Great stuff at a great price. Celestia in particular has a lot of synth/strings/pads of decent quality with a good amount of sound design built in. Xpand!2 is an excellent choice at $99 and includes a TON of synth sound options(including drum kits, bass and lead guitars, synth orchestra and pads, etc). It may be the most cost effective option for what you want to do. You may also want to listen to some of the Super Audio Cart demos - it's geared towards a lot of older console sounds and it might just suit your needs.

For a drum kit, I'd suggest Drummic'a by Sennheiser. It's free and works with the free Kontakt Player. Sennheiser basically made it to demo their mics. While the site is in German, you can register pretty easily and get a registration code sent. Then just register Drummic'a with your Native Instruments account as usual and you're good to go. As an added bonus, having it registered to your account qualifies you for the crossgrade version of Kontakt(which is the same full product, but costs a lot less). ISW's Shreddage Drums is another good drum plugin and a step up from Drummic'a.

 

For interfaces, the Focusrite Scarlett Solo is decent and includes a line in for guitars as well as a mic line with 48v phantom power. There are some better Focusrite interfaces for slightly more, though, so it's more of a budget choice.

[jacehunter22]

Hey Kat, thank you so much for the suggestions. 

ESPECIALLY the crossgrade version of Kontakt. You just put nearly $200 back in my pocket (CAD booo....). 
I'm liking a lot of what Impact has to offer as well. Really appreciate all the help.

As far as the Focusrite Solo goes, I'm thinking I'll use that to start out - but I'm thinking I might need a MIDI keyboard / pad as well. Specifically looking at this little guy due to price. Thoughts on a starter keyboard? I cant seem to find a used MIDI keyboard for any less than this so why not - I travel a lot too for work so this would be a nice product to haul around.

Again thank you for the suggestions so far  

[Kat]

It depends on a few things, really. First thing to look for is whether the keys are weighted or not, as this will impact how you play it(and you want something you're comfortable playing). Fully weighted keys are the most realistic and aimed at piano-trained players. The weight varies across the board like a real piano and allows for easier realism and a better dynamic response. Semi weighted keys are evenly weighted and offer a somewhat realistic response. Unweighted keys use springs instead of weights for an overall heavier feel. They can feel sort of slippery and if playing fast passages it may seem a little uncontrollable. Unweighted will be the most cost effective, though, while fully weighted keys will be the most expensive. After that it's all about how many keys and what features you need. Most tend to come in 25/49/88 keys. Do you just need it for general midi input, or do you want knobs/pads/faders/wheels for better control while playing?

First and foremost I'd actually suggest checking out Guitar Center. While they closed their Canadian location(last I checked at least), the US locations ship to Canada and allows you to check out in CDN while adding all taxes/duty/etc.

That keyboard you linked is a synth-action(by it's description), meaning unweighted. The four-way knob is a pretty cool idea for a portable keyboard, and the addition of 8 knobs and pads will make up for only having 25 keys. If you want something specifically designed to be portable that's probably one of the best in my opinion. There are a lot of 49 key controllers at a similar price point, but none of them have the same features. I found the same one(in a limited red color) new and on sale at Guitar Center as well.

If you're willing to pay a bit more, the M-Audio Oxygen49 is more or less a direct upgrade. It has 49 keys(semi-weighted) and 8 knobs/pads, along with 9 faders and separate pitch and mod wheels. Also includes a port for a sustain pedal, and a code for Ableton Live Lite. It also automaps to most DAWs(but not FL Studio, if you go that route), making it relatively plug-and-play. Also allows for octave shifting and switching DAW channels via buttons on the keyboard itself, along with a play and record button.

[jacehunter22]

I've never been a piano player so I think Semi-weighted would probably feel good enough. But since I'll be dropping a few hundred on kontakt my purse strings are tight for the next few months. I can definitely afford an unweighted mini midi keyboard at this point plus the travel capability is a big bonus. For now I think I'll stick with the Mini's and move up down the line. Would you say using pads are more intuitive for playing percussion? The knobs and wheels are right up my alley as I like the thought of adjusting settings / pitch / instrument variables on the fly.

I just feel like controlling via mouse input is not really ideal for any of this... at all.

And yes Guitar Center did shut down in Canada. Only a few of their items still ship out here - most of which are not the midi controllers unfortunately.

[Kat]

I'd imagine the mini keyboard will serve you well. 25 keys is plenty in general. The main advantage to more keys is a greater octave range, and most minis will have buttons to switch between octaves at will. I can't really imagine going over 49 keys. Though I'll admit I'd love to own a Kontakt Kontrol S88, but 88 fully weighted keys are more than I need and $1000 too much.

Pads are definitely better for playing percussion, simply because an out-of-the-box VST might not have the percussion mapped to notes in a way that's convenient or intuitive for piano playing. Aside from that, they're very sensitive compared to the keys and more suited to playing drum beats or triggering clips/effects. 

Shame about Guitar Center, they've got some great deals. I only briefly browsed their shipping which mentioned both Mexico and Canada, but it looks like they're limited by the package's weight, too.

[Rozovian]

On 4 September, 2016 at 8:54 PM, jacehunter22 said:

I've taken the plunge and started my own RPG but am at a crossroads for music development. I am trying to figure out which DAW to invest in. I need something that will be intuitive, have lots of plugin support/community, and handle live recording as well. Most of the reviews I've read point to Reaper for what I want. I'm looking into Studio One as a number of people have suggested that DAW as well. Only problem is Reaper has no instruments to go with it. 

What would you guys suggest for starting out my instrument library? I keep coming back to Komplete 11 Select but am concerned it will be overwhelming as well as not have specific instruments I am looking for. Does anyone have experience with the Komplete Select suite? I also want a really good drum kit as nothing beats a solid beat.

The style of music I am looking for is Final Fantasy / Chrono Trigger with splashes of Megaman and electronic/industrial in spots. Nothing big band / big orchestra and nothing chiptune or retro 8/16 bit. Synth, strings, pads, etc..

Welcome to ocr.

Just about any decent DAW will have VST/VSTi support, so you'll be able to run the vast majority of plugins with that. There are lots of good free plugins, so starting with REAPER's unlimited demo and getting used to its workflow can be done without spending any money at all.

Komplete is excellent. I have a previous Komplete, and use something from there in just about every track I make. With my style of music, it's mostly FM8 and Battery, but for something fitting your jrpg-style intentions, I'd probably be using Kontakt a lot. I tried to figure out what exactly K11S contains, especially the Kontakt instruments, but can't find a page explicitly listing them. You get the "Factory Selection" with it, whatever that means. If it doesn't seem like you're getting the stuff you need from K11S, consider the standard K11. Also consider options from other developers, eg IK Multimedia and Magix. I use their stuff from time to time. But third-party libraries overwhelmingly focus on Kontakt, so if you're looking to expand your library later, Kontakt gives you a lot more options.

You say you're not interested in big orchestra, but you want to make FF/CT style music. You do realize a lot of that music is orchestral, right?

When it comes to the synth stuff, K11S should be fine, and there are plenty of good, free synth options available too.

[Kat]

4 hours ago, Rozovian said:

I tried to figure out what exactly K11S contains, especially the Kontakt instruments, but can't find a page explicitly listing them. You get the "Factory Selection" with it, whatever that means.

This page lists all the plugins and extras K11S includes. The Factory Selection is a selection of sounds from Kontakt's included library. If you're getting Kontakt 5 to begin with, you'll get the Kontakt Factory Library that includes everything from the Factory Selection and then some. I'd venture to say Kontakt's included library it perfect for starting out.

[jacehunter22]

Thanks for the reply Rozovian.

Like Kat mentioned the NI site does have a breakdown on whats in each package. I think the Select bundle wouldn't get me where I need to be. At this point I'm sold on Kontakt thanks to Kat and a bit of other digging around I've done. I know its not the easiest question to answer so thanks for both of your input. 

And yep I am aware that Chrono Trigger is a lot of Orchestra but I mean I want to avoid BIG BAND... trying to think of who does remixes that are similar... Either way I'm looking for that atmospheric feel but without going 100% orchestra if that makes any sense... 

[timaeus222]

20 hours ago, jacehunter22 said:

And yep I am aware that Chrono Trigger is a lot of Orchestra but I mean I want to avoid BIG BAND... trying to think of who does remixes that are similar... Either way I'm looking for that atmospheric feel but without going 100% orchestra if that makes any sense... 

So in other words you want a support orchestra. String beds, flute leads, etc., but not the whole thing.

[jacehunter22]

2 hours ago, timaeus222 said:

So in other words you want a support orchestra. String beds, flute leads, etc., but not the whole thing.

This is exactly what I'm trying to say haha.

I wanted to avoid people saying "Oh you need ____ instrument bundle" and it ends up being a full orchestra pack with no other instruments. I still want synths and guitars etc. 

[timaeus222]

Well, it's not like Komplete 11 Select is an orchestra and nothing else. There are definitely synths in there. I don't remember which ones, but surely at least one of them has enough features for you to make synth pads (which are pretty essential for atmosphere or, well, textural padding that fills in the soundscape). Massive and Prism, amongst other synths, are included, and those can definitely make synth pads. Prism actually sounds like it could be really good for physical modeling (synthesizing physical instruments), which can make for some really interesting acoustic atmospheres (bells, plucked instruments, etc).