Dafydd Posted February 3, 2008 Share Posted February 3, 2008 ...in order to be worth buying? I don't need anything fancy, I just want to be able to record something from my mic and not have to boost the recording afterwards (since that boosts the noise as well), and I want the pre-amp not to add any noticable noise itself (the noise I'm talking about seems to be coming from the computer itself, since it's there even when recording without a mic connected). Do I really need to cough up several hundreds of dollars for something like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moseph Posted February 3, 2008 Share Posted February 3, 2008 Are you thinking about a stand-alone mic preamp, or a recording interface with a built-in preamp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dafydd Posted February 3, 2008 Author Share Posted February 3, 2008 I don't know, just something where I plug the mic into one end and the other end into the computer, as a means to record stuff. What's a recording interface and what are they for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoozer Posted February 3, 2008 Share Posted February 3, 2008 I don't know, just something where I plug the mic into one end and the other end into the computer, as a means to record stuff. What's a recording interface and what are they for? Audio interface, a sound card that's geared towards music production as opposed to games. They come in several shapes - PCI cards (M-Audio Audiophile 192) or break-out boxes (Firewire, USB or proprietary connection). The way you say it you want something like that. Something like this has a preamp built in: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/MobilePreUSB-main.html Preamps can have a nice character, but if you just need something that does the job, an audio interface is fine. Going from characterful preamp > audio interface is a better idea anyway, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dafydd Posted February 3, 2008 Author Share Posted February 3, 2008 Actually, I have both an X-Fi and an Audiophile 2496 in my machine and they both totally suck when it comes to recording. They cause noise even when there's nothing connected to them - nothing in the mic jack. Equal amounts. I even bought the 2496 specifically for being able to record stuff, and was very let down to realize it sucked as bad as the X-Fi (even though I only paid $70 for it). I'd rather not buy another Audio Interface, considering I already have 2 of them. Especially if a lone pre-amp is cheaper than the combo. So, how much do I have to pay to get a servicable one of those? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fray Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 How much noise are we talking about here? While the audiophile is superior to the X-Fi, noise shouldn't be an issue with either of them, unless you're using the builtin preamp. But the Audiophile doesn't even have a preamp -- just line level inputs. Either your computer is screwed up or you're confused as to where the noise is coming from. Edit: it could also be that both soundcards are picking up noise from your case itself. If so an external audio interface might be the answer -- one where the A/D and D/A converters are outside your computer case in a breakout box (this is the case for any firewire or USB interfaces). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
po! Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 if you just want low noise levels, a inexpensive preamp should be able to give you that. but if you want good (like "prosumer" level) sound quality you do have to spend hundreds.. there's no way around that. for example http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/ART-DMPA-Pro-2-Channel-Mic-Pre-with-Digital-Outs?sku=180629 http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Focusrite-Platinum-TwinTrak-Pro-Channel-Strip?sku=188218 thats what i'd consider good.. low-end class A preamps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dafydd Posted February 4, 2008 Author Share Posted February 4, 2008 Edit: it could also be that both soundcards are picking up noise from your case itself. If so an external audio interface might be the answer -- one where the A/D and D/A converters are outside your computer case in a breakout box (this is the case for any firewire or USB interfaces). I thought it might be because of disturbance from inside the computer, too. The M-audio picks up my mic like I was wispering in the other room - the volume is really low, and so when I try raise the volume in the recorded sound file, I raise the noise volume as well. To sum it up, in order to get the X-Fi and the Audiophile to record something that ends up as a sound file with a given volume, the end result has equal amounts of noise (the X-Fi because its built-in amp sucks, the Audiophile becaues it doesn't have one, which necessitates post-recording amplification). A USB recording device might be the answer, but I doubt they're cheap either. Like I said, I'd rather not have to buy another sound card, because I already have plenty of them. I used the same mic with a laptop that had a SigmaTel built-in sound chip, and the sound was wonderful in comparison. In order to use my computer to record stuff, I need something to amplify the signal from the mic before it reaches the computer, and without adding noticable amounts of noise or hum to this signal. Is there really no way of doing this without paying several hundreds of dollars? It's like buying a whole new frickin' computer. If I don't get any good suggestions soon I'm going to have to record sound using my handycam. Yes, it has better sound than the audiophile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moseph Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 You can get a mic preamp for pretty cheap. http://www.zzounds.com/item--ART127, for example ($40). I have no idea how good they sound, but something like this might be what you need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fray Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Ah okay. Yeah, I think a reasonable "prosumer" preamp will probably be fine. The ones po! linked are definitely better, but the ART in Moseph's post or a Presonus TubePre will be a hell of a lot better than the builtin one on the X-Fi. Trying to jack the volume up after recording an unamped mic is totally unacceptable as you've found -- that's not even an indication that your card is picking up any noise from your case. It just won't work. If you were thinking of getting a mixer anyway, most mixers have pretty competent builtin preamps for the price. Behringer Euroracks for example. It won't have "OMG TUBE WARMTHZ", but they're reasonably quiet. And yeah I think all the inexpensive tube-driven gear popping up lately is getting a little overblown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
po! Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 If you were thinking of getting a mixer anyway, most mixers have pretty competent builtin preamps for the price. Behringer Euroracks for example. It won't have "OMG TUBE WARMTHZ", but they're reasonably quiet. And yeah I think all the inexpensive tube-driven gear popping up lately is getting a little overblown i'm currently using a Behringer Eurorack. if you're mostly concerned with noise it's fine, but the sound quality isn't good. after all mine has 2 preamp channels and 4 mixer channels, plus aux sends + phantom power + EQ, all for about 70 bucks. yea, it's low noise and gets you the sound, so it meets the absolute MINIMUM requirements... basically it's the cheapest, lowest-end you can get with that feature set Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiesty Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 It all depends on what your looking for. With cost, you can sacrifice quality but gain inputs etc. for a good price. However, if you dont really need that many inputs, and your concerned with quality, definatley go with an mbox. Digidesign makes some pretty tight shit are basically the industry standard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunahorum Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 i use the line in and digitally preamp. I guess there's not much dynamic range since it converts analog to digital at low levels, but it sounds all right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fray Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 i use the line in and digitally preamp. I guess there's not much dynamic range since it converts analog to digital at low levels, but it sounds all right. Maybe you can sometimes get away with that if your mic has a particularly hot output signal -- not all mics are created equal in that regard, some need more preamp than others. I think you're sacrificing a lot of quality doing things this way, because you're right -- when you make a digital recording at low levels, you effectively reduce the bit depth. Play around with a bit cruncher effect and you can hear what lowered bit depth does to your sound: at around 12 bits it's still pretty reasonable but not as clear. At 8, it's obviously degraded. Anything less than 5 or 6 and it sounds totally trashed. And that's only if you're not picking up any noise from the rest of your hardware. Point being, max -- if you care, you could get a lot better sound out of your mic even with a relatively cheap preamp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dafydd Posted February 5, 2008 Author Share Posted February 5, 2008 Just to clarify, since some of you seem to be missing the point - I'm not interested in a whole freaking mixer. I just want a pre-amp, with one input jack (for the mic) and one output jack (USB or audio, I don't care, as long as I can plug it into my computer), one that doesn't add noticable amounts of noise or humming as it amplifies the signal. I'm not rich and don't intend on spending money on stuff I don't need, like several channels, EQ and stuff. It's not for live playback, just for recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fray Posted February 6, 2008 Share Posted February 6, 2008 Just to clarify, since some of you seem to be missing the point - I'm not interested in a whole freaking mixer. Ok, then just buy a preamp. Several models ranging from $40 up have already been mentioned. It's just that if you needed a mixer anyway, which you don't apparently, they usually come with semi-competent preamps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunahorum Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 Ya for a mic it's too low for good bit depth Works hella fine for my amateur stuff. Pre amps are for pros with impeccable sounding music. Also if I really absolutely need a good recording, I run the mic into the guitar amp and a line out from amp into sound card on computer. But for guitar it works awesome. Get -15db straight into the jack with no preamp. (hardly any noise too hehe no preamp add noise) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoozer Posted February 7, 2008 Share Posted February 7, 2008 Expensive pre amps are for pros with impeccable sounding music. If you want something cheap, you could as well take a small mixing desk. Those have preamps too - and equalizers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dafydd Posted February 7, 2008 Author Share Posted February 7, 2008 Keep in mind I want to get away with as small an investment as possible. I'm only recording one thing at a time and can do the equalizing and all that stuff later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steffan Andrews Posted February 10, 2008 Share Posted February 10, 2008 ...in order to be worth buying? More expensive than a Behringer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dafydd Posted February 10, 2008 Author Share Posted February 10, 2008 There's a piece of advice. I'll avoid Behringer. Too bad though, they had something like what I wanted - a simple amp box. But if it's not good... then I won't get it. So, is there anything slightly better without being three times the price? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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