Liontamer Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 Original Decision: http://www.ocremix.org/forums/showthread.php?t=3057 Link to ReMix - Dreamstone Legend (may need to right-click and use Save As to get clean playback) Contact Information * ReMixer name - J.B.Garren * Real name - Jeremy B. Garren * Email address - jbgarren@mail.utexas.edu * Website - http://home.actlab.utexas.edu/~garrenjb/music.html * Userid - 22713 Submission Information * Name of game arranged - Chrono Trigger * Name of individual song arranged - Battle With Magus * Original by Nobuo Uematsu, Noriko Matsueda, Yasunori Mitsuda, SNES * Link to the original soundtrack (if needed) magusbattle.mp3 * Comments - Although I doubt anyone will recall, a much earlier version of this work was declined for submission two years ago. Looking back, I can see why, although I suppose that is simply the nature of experience. Having recently come back to it and spent time reworking it, the piece is now significantly different and significantly better. In this work I wanted to create tension and weight in between the dark descending theme typically associated with Magus and the more heroic theme that appears later in the original. One result of this is that the music never settles into a groove, but is in a fairly constant state of change up until the conclusion, perhaps like an actual battle. I suppose good wins in the end. The work often approaches full orchestral, although certain elements, (such as the much debated guitars), drag it back to a somewhat more electronic feel. Certainly there are plenty of Chrono Trigger remixes already out there, and already a few dealing with my source theme. Despite this, I have an invested personal stake in Dreamstone Legend, considering how much time and effort this project has sucked out of me. I may have gone through more versions of this song than any other I have ever crafted. In any case, I would like to finally call this piece done, so I hope you enjoy it. -J.B.G. ----------------------------------------------------------- http://snesmusic.org/v2/download.php?spcNow=ct - "Battle with Magus" (ct-224.spc) Really loved the tenseness and subtle evolution of the intro; very excellent. Some beats were added in at :45. I thought the fast strings at :47 were a bit exposedm as well as mixed too quietly, but we'll see if there are any differing opinions. The Slayer-ish electric guitar synth at 1:03 sounded a little annoying to start, but was worse 1:12 when it was given a more substantive role. I dunno who decided this was a good substitute sound for a real electric guitar, but, shit, it's always bad. It creates a big quality disparity compared with the other sounds. Even looking at your WIP thread, you knew it wasn't working right. So why would I think it works? The times that synth works the most effectively are when it's not used in the role of an authentic electric guitar. It's used fairly decently here, but it's not melodious, a lot of the velocities sounded very similar, and the sequencing felt too perfectly timed, leaving the sound very robotic-sounding. Unfortunate, given that the other parts were clicking so well. The piano at 1:57 had similar sequencing issues that exposed the sample. The soundfield felt somewhat cluttered and could be sharpened up with some EQ work, but it wasn't much of an issue. There were other, smaller details that might be covered in other votes. But the main crit from me: find a better guitar or other sound in place of that Slayer-ish stuff, make sure the sequencing is on point, and IMO you'd have this track clicking strongly enough on all levels. I'm not saying steal Niggasamples, but there's gotta be either a way to produce the synths better or find a more suitable sound. Big Giant Circles might be able to make suggestions on working with Slayer, or sounds similar to it, to achieve a better result. Solid base, J.B., don't be discouraged if this doesn't make it as is. This needs some fine tuning, but you've definitely improved your game since the last time I've heard your work. NO (resubmit) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big giant circles Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 Well, as I told Larry in IRC, I don't think this is slayer. I could be wrong, but it sounds sampled, not generated. At any rate, I personally am down (very down, in fact) with your orchestrations. I told Larry that while the guitar is a little on the "meh" side, I'm still fine with all other aspects of the song. I think it's a cool arrangement, and it's produced respectably well. The only times the guitar actually does detract from the song's quality otherwise, is during the parts where it's up high on the "neck". And the artificial harmonics really kind of, well, poop in your ears. Pretty much all of 4:30-ish and after. That kind of stuff either needs to go, or else needs to be pulled waaaay back. I'm totally cool with this as is, though. I don't think it's a heavy enough concern to throw a NO down, so YES. I just rained on Larry's parade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palpable Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 Definitely feeling this one through the intro. Great build-up and atmosphere. The drums were the first thing that seemed a little off, along with the guitar starting at 0:59, but I think my concerns are with the way they are produced. The arrangement had some very interesting ideas and you were able to sell them. Nice take on it. Things sound pretty cluttered when the drums and guitar enter the picture. Especially towards the end it gets hard to make out distinct parts; some EQ would help that. The hi-hats especially need some love because they eat up the space. Maybe pan them out more in addition to EQing them. The drums sound distant, and disconnected with the orchestral work. I think more prominence, less reverb on those parts would give your song a lot more energy. Guitar samples are on the weak side, but they didn't bother me that much. It's only when they are exposed every now and then (like at 0:59) that they bothered me. I don't think you necessarily have to change these. I really hope you don't call this quits now, Jeremy! It's seriously pretty close to complete and it's a solid arrangement. If you do feel like you're done with this song, I definitely encourage you to submit something new in the future. NO (resubmit) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zykO Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 i definitely don't remember your first submission. perhaps my memory fails me but it might have been while i was on hiatus (it always seems like i am) in any case, reading over the old decision, it seems like most of the things that were addressed still need to be fixed. for one, that guitar still sounds godawful... i mean, even for a synth guitar. the strings work well, the arrangement is neat and aggressive... your atmospheric, starcrafty sounding sections work suspensefully well but there is too much disconnect in the parts when you have all the rockin out. the drums are far, far back in the soundfield and the synth guitar just doesn't do the writing any justice at all. it is a lot closer probably than i'm willing to admit but i really doubt that my disapproval of the synth guitar is at all tied to my obvious guitar bias; this is awfully close - the guitar makes it hard to listen to this very seriously. get a better sounding synth guitar... get a real one. i dunno but it doesn't work. a little eq and mixing in the crowded parts and you're good to go. NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vig Posted March 1, 2008 Share Posted March 1, 2008 I love the orchestral writing. I think the arrangement is great. Most of my gripes are production related. The drums need to be louder, and the guitar needs more bite, 4kHz and up. I'm not thrilled about the guitar in general, but it's not a total dealbreaker. Right now the strings are out front, and the drums and guitar need more attention. Close, please resub. NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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