HoboKa Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 SOURCE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_Ny2TkWJwY UPDATE 2 http://www.mediafire.com/?tzjeryjbnnq -EQ/production improved, still a lot of loose ends to tie off -Definitely varied up the sounds and the drums -Other various tweaks UPDATE 3 http://www.mediafire.com/?yqjtyvw3fhw -changed a lot of stuff -implemented much of what Hewo and Gario suggested -have an ending now -better dynamics -better production all it needs is a broader spectrum of opinions...preferably constructive ones. Help me get this track posted!! UPDATE 4 http://www.mediafire.com/?3doyizgoqgw -mainly touch ups here and there -mostly crits addressed by Hewhoistheone on this update. UPDATE 5 http://www.fileupyours.com/view/218181/EWJ_Whip_Yer_Head_Boi_VerA7.mp3 -huge changes -edited out 2 segments and replaced them with something much better (imo) -more production tweaking -more beef, with a side of coleslaw. -and yes, took Hewo's crits in mind - I may have forgotten to tweak 1 or 2 things he wanted me to do. UPDATE 6 http://www.fileupyours.com/view/218181/EWJ_Whip_Yer_Head_Boi_VerA8.mp3 -mainly addressed Halc's crits here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gario Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 At this one again, eh? Well, it's clean and it definitely sounds like the source... unfortunately the source was something like 10 seconds, so it gets repetitive (which you know, I believe). There's really no variation in the instrumentation, either, so it compounds the repetitive nature of it all. Realize that this is going to be tough to remix... but if you're up for the challenge experiment with the theme a bit via augmentation/diminution, soloing, harmony changes, etc., because this will be too repetitive otherwise. Yeah, production is so-so, but you'll need to focus on the arrangement of this one, since it's so easy to get in a rut, with this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 9, 2010 Author Share Posted March 9, 2010 At this one again, eh? Well, it's clean and it definitely sounds like the source... unfortunately the source was something like 10 seconds, so it gets repetitive (which you know, I believe). There's really no variation in the instrumentation, either, so it compounds the repetitive nature of it all.Realize that this is going to be tough to remix... but if you're up for the challenge experiment with the theme a bit via augmentation/diminution, soloing, harmony changes, etc., because this will be too repetitive otherwise. Yeah, production is so-so, but you'll need to focus on the arrangement of this one, since it's so easy to get in a rut, with this one. I think I changed up the soundscape sufficeintly at 0:25, and I varied up the melody substantially at :40 until 1:12. Maybe if I do that more throughout the mix and vary up the drums/drum samples would help a ton. Then comes the production which is a totally different area...might need someone to sound upgrade me later. Anyways, I'll post an update shortly. I'll try my best to incorporate your suggestions. And nub question, what do you mean by augmentation/diminution? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 9, 2010 Author Share Posted March 9, 2010 http://www.mediafire.com/?tzjeryjbnnq Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 You going to finish it this time? (pot calling the kettle black, I haven't finished like anything, ever. Evereverever) Anyways, lets have a look. Erhm, first source. I'll see if I got it right this time: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_Ny2TkWJwY IMHO, you could stand to really establish the theme with all the instruments before you start soloing and building on the source. @0:25 the source plays some to about 0:40, then that subtractive lead plays. Let that play out a bit longer. I don't hear much in the way of panning. Maybe it's just me, but I picture the short repeating 16th note pattern panning around me when I hear this. That minimalist xylophone part at 0:56. Love that bit. The half time drum/bass thing really works there. I don't like it so much at 0:25. I'd start with it at 0:08 then use what you have at 0:08 at 0:25. Lots of ways and places to put solos in on top of whatcha got. I like 1:46 myself, lengthened out and solo'd up. Jus my preference. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gario Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 And nub question, what do you mean by augmentation/diminution? Augmentation is when a theme is stretched over a longer period of time, while diminution is when the theme is compressed into a shorter amount of time. They can be quite useful techniques if you need to vary the music, yet somehow keep it connected to the source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 Alrighty! Glad I did this track with patterns, so everything will be much easier to re-arrange. I'll definitely use your tips there Hewo - btw Gario, whats your thoughts on my latest update?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 http://www.mediafire.com/?yqjtyvw3fhw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 You going to finish it this time? (pot calling the kettle black, I haven't finished like anything, ever. Evereverever) To answer your question Hewo, yes I have finished tracks before. Many of which got NO'd, others I lacked the confidence to submit, and a bunch of original pieces that I obviously can't submit to the panel. (personally I prefer doing original works than remixes - I seem to get a better groove going). ...fuck I've been on this site forever, and I haven't been posted probably as of yet. Half of it's my fault for sucking/not listening to my betters hitherto - the other half is that super/duper high bar =p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I've got about 50 something incomplete works. Nothing good nuff to sub. Though, it seems like a good week to do something with Laguna's Theme... As for your next update, at 1:50 is a bit short to crit too much. The last link is VA2, right? It seems like you took stuff out, stuff I liked, like the piano... I do like the progression though. Ideas on length: That bass jumps right in, without much if any sort of lead up. When werkn with a short source, you can add a lot of length with an intro. I think one of the best examples of this is Collision by Malcos. Very short theme(sonic 1 final zone) drawn into 4:10. At 1:12, it feels like that descending pattern should really build to something rather than trail off. Solo, a new synth adding more body to the theme if you're repeating the theme, something. Where's my xylophone part in the update! I misses him greatly... That whole segment added a lot to the song. If you were to combine the new with the old... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gario Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Sorry - I was distracted and didn't listen to your update . Oh well, I'll give this one a stab, now that I'm here . The melodic variations help your cause out a lot. Now we're going to need to change up the harmonies a little... At least, hang out in one area for a longer/shorter time so the listener doesn't grab onto the harmonic pattern as easily (that's how I tried to handle the problem on the Laguna track, anyway - might work for you too). The instruments are a touch low-fi... I'm sure you know, but it needs to be said. The effects help them out considerably, though. I'd suggest introducing different sounds to take over the same jobs every once in a while; that'll keep the sounds you have fresh. Minimalist tracks can work, but I'm not seeing this one working as a minimalist song... Yeah, hewhoisiam is right that the track is a bit on the short side, so it'd be nice to hear more of the arrangement so we can hear how it flows (can't really comment on the structure much, as it is). Originally posted by hewhoisiamThough, it seems like a good week to do something with Laguna's Theme... MARCH IS LAGUNA MONTH!! Get something up here, dude... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 Huge apologies guys - that was the wrong file for the update...I'll host the actual one ASAP. Ver. 3 http://www.mediafire.com/?yqjtyvw3fhw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 I've got about 50 something incomplete works. Nothing good nuff to sub. Though, it seems like a good week to do something with Laguna's Theme...As for your next update, at 1:50 is a bit short to crit too much. The last link is VA2, right? It seems like you took stuff out, stuff I liked, like the piano... I do like the progression though. Ideas on length: That bass jumps right in, without much if any sort of lead up. When werkn with a short source, you can add a lot of length with an intro. I think one of the best examples of this is Collision by Malcos. Very short theme(sonic 1 final zone) drawn into 4:10. At 1:12, it feels like that descending pattern should really build to something rather than trail off. Solo, a new synth adding more body to the theme if you're repeating the theme, something. Where's my xylophone part in the update! I misses him greatly... That whole segment added a lot to the song. If you were to combine the new with the old... Disregard that file Hewo - wrong one. Whip yer head boi ver.A4 is the actual file - I changed the file link on the first post and in my most recent post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archangel Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I didn't listen to the early versions since it seemed a bit redundant, but the last version is pretty neat! I especially like the beats, they're very - hm, how should I say this in English - decisive? =D I don't know what else to say, actually. I'm not sure my headphones are all OK so I'd rather not comment on any mix-related stuff, I can only say that I found it a very enjoyable remix with enough variation to not make it repetitive. Good job, I hope you get posted! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 AH! I had thought that might be the case since we went A3 to A2... The crap I gotta put up with... MARCH IS LAGUNA MONTH!! Get something up here, dude... I guess I can is get a laguna something going, since I'm not in the competition this month. We'll see. Besides, I just got Sixto in a box and my first experiment with it made for a fairly cool, very short version of skullman's theme... Then I tried to mix in drillman and it, erhm. et iz not perty, it's like a medley with no transitions! Forget that one is in sharps, one flats, etc, etc, etc... Anyways, back on topic, the song: Oh, right off I hear you did the drum thing. Damn I feel important! And my piano is back! It's gonna be a good day... Might consider some slight dynamics on that bass/lead at 1:23. Sorta ease back into things and build up before 1:40. I see 2 equally neat ways to go with it, either start quiet and end loud at 1:40 build up style; or start where you are and get quieter just before 1:40 to really pop that out. At 2:13 you go back down to that half time feel in the drums, but it's a more intense part in the song than before and it wasn't long ago you did the halftime trick. I think making the hats stand out a bit more or some ghost notes in snares and toms will leave you the half time 'feel' but keep some of the intensity that's lost there. At 3:03 it all fades down to that xylophone and airy synth. I think the piano playing some chords there similar to 2:30 may be a better fit than the synth. Or both, or make the ending a bit longer then drop the synth later. I dunno, but it seems a bit too abrupt of an ending as is, and the synth feels lonely. Major improvements all around though. Good stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 12, 2010 Author Share Posted March 12, 2010 thx for comments archangel and Hewo. I've written down your crits for tonight when i come back from work. Expect an update tomorrow. There's 1 thing that u forgot to mention which I shoulda addressed. 2:24-2:30 the transition there doesn't feel as cohesive as I want it to be...how can I improve it?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 I don't think what you've got is too bad. If you wanted to bring in something with the snares, I might try the repeating 16th note pattern, panned hard from left to right or something like that. Especially since the piano is taking over the part shortly after. This entire section here (2:13-2:30) Really feels like good contrast to the normal energy of the track. If you wanted to add to it, consider using something to echo at 2:15, 19 and 23. The xylophone maybe really quiet over that subtle synth from the end? You don't wanna lose the contrast, but you don't want your break there to sound like it's not a full sound, which is kinda what it's doing now. Another even more radical option occurs to me: Kinda like what I said before, you can build up to 2:30, or you can get quiet just before 2:30. If you don't like the sound of that snare build, try fattening up the sound there and then dropping everything off quiet like, then bam! with the full glory of the all everything at 2:30. If my ramblings makes sense, don't forget to get other opinions on this too. These are just mine and might not be the majority >.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 12, 2010 Author Share Posted March 12, 2010 all points are good, albeit a bit confusing, but I understand the gist lol. I'm actually really tired tonight, so i may not have an update until late tomorrow or the next day. However, I will take all of your crits seriously (and i'll actually be able to USE them) since I have divided up all my tracks and patterns in a logical, user friendly way. As for the other opinions, that will be tough for me to accomplish which is why I posted this on the WIP board...it still kinda annoys me that us aspiring n00bs get on average 2-3 crits if we're lucky, and often the crits don't even come near to the J's standards (I guess i'm guilty for doing the latter as well ) Anyhoo, please more comments ppl - even if its brief like Archangel's comment, it helps a lot. Catch u guys later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 12, 2010 Author Share Posted March 12, 2010 http://www.mediafire.com/?3doyizgoqgw guess i found some energy to do some work tonight after all =D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 The echo thing I think has improved, but now it's the same thing basically 6 times in a row. I'd move the second one up one octave, and then you have creative freedom to do whatever with the 3rd one, or just leave the 3rd one off to really bring in the empty. I like the new end, my only complaint is that the snare squeak there isn't used anywhere else in the song. For the sake of togetherness, you may want to splash it somewheres else or change it in the end. Mmhmm, it's starting to get there, I can tell cause I'm nodding my head a lot. So, methinks it may be time to address some flow and development issues. I love the idea of the slow halftime bits as contrast, but to me they should be considerably sorter than the main theme bits. This is always the hard bit for me cause I tend to like everything. I think you can just add some repetition in some places and be fine, but structure isn't my strong suit. The bass lead comes in at 0:42 heavy, I'd like to hear that repeated one more time with the heavy lead before moving on. Especially since it feels like the piece brings in instruments every 2 repetitions. This feels cut short to me. 1:01-1:07 The low bit on the piano is great because it reminds me of the bass at the beginning, and you're just about to go into a nice quiet part. I'd like to hear it expanded a bit, but I'm not sure how that'd affect the flow. 1:57-2:12 is your gold! Everything comes together. I'd like to hear it a bit longer before moving on. Same thing at 2:30. Not a lot more mind you, but a little bit. I could see these additions pushing the song to around 4-4:30 depending. I'm hoping I'm giving advice so as to take out the choppy feeling. Anyways, hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 13, 2010 Author Share Posted March 13, 2010 Sweet...moar work 2 do...sigh. Well better that I iron them out now instead of making the J's go Q.Q as usual lol. Actually I like this whole editing/reworking business now Also...please ppl - even those who can't tell the difference between a guitar and a sitar, lend me your input. I'd like to hear your thoughts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 13, 2010 Author Share Posted March 13, 2010 just dig it at the front page...something weird happened with Mediafire and all new links in this reply box refuse to work for some reason. Maybe its Firefox being FireFail dunno. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted March 13, 2010 Share Posted March 13, 2010 Gettin to a point where I'm running out of things to say Can't say that's a bad thing with the head nodding continuing, and I caught myself humming this earlier... First thing I notice is the break/echo part is gone. I'll be honest with you, while I did like the part, I do not miss it in the new version. Kudos there. The snare changes to the squeaks at 2:22, sounds good, and mixes things up there nicely. The drums quiet a few places around 2:42, works nicely to sort of bring things down since the old quiet break/echo part is gone in about the same spot in the song. At 0:59-1:15 the mix might be missing some low end noise. We have that nice big thick lead sound, then it's lost. The piano really helps losing low sounds not be noticeable in places when it's playing lows itself, but in other places where there's no piano or lead it kinda sticks out as thin. A subtle bass part might help even out the mix some frequency wise where you don't really want a booming bass sound of your lead but still want that fullness. That's really all I got, that one bass thing. Running outta crits, so I think it's getting close. As Nathan Explosion would say 'It's gettin nice and heavy' Just gotta shamelessly bump this thread to get someone else to give some input... Where's Gario when you need him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoboKa Posted March 13, 2010 Author Share Posted March 13, 2010 I do not intend to change my bass samples as of yet, since it took me a helluva long time just to find the right combination of sounds and filter effects...I don't want to risk undoing that work haha. As for the EQ/production issue itself it's probably a matter of tightening up my frequencies...also I realized that I did this entire thing without a master limiter...kinda amazed that my track didn't explode with clipping issues. And thanks for sticking around the entire time Hewo . You're a gentleman and a scholar. If you need me to help or even collab, lemme know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halc Posted March 13, 2010 Share Posted March 13, 2010 alrighty the bassline from the source is established as the groove from the get-go, and there's no variation to be found until 2:44 (aside from the pad breaks and piano section at 1:00, where it's not present). as more instruments are layered in, they just follow the same groove. change up the rhythm every other or fourth bar, add some unique fills or an original melody on top. it's not engaging enough - it needs something to keep the listener interested. 2:39 is a nice change of pace, but after it breaks down it just builds right back up to how it was, with a different groove. maybe try to introduce some more new instruments there to keep it fresh. 3:45-4:02 - good texture here, this is my favorite part of the song; it doesn't seem so grounded by the bassline during this section. cool drum choices, and the piano sounds nice. also, i feel like there's some headroom for volume. one thing to stress is that i think you need to find some new sounds or try out some different styles. i get this bland feeling from your music (hate to put it that way), and i don't think your sound choices in general are the most accessible to the average listener. hope i haven't been too direct with my crits - seems like you've got the chops but some things just aren't quite clicking yet. you can only improve, so keep working at it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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