Earthworm Jim - use your head remix 3rd rendition

[HoboKa]

I suspected that there'd be issues like that that Hewo hadn't discerned. And that's fine that you're frank - I'll see what I can do with those issues. Thanks for listening

[HoboKa]

http://www.fileupyours.com/view/218181/EWJ_Whip_Yer_Head_Boi_VerA8.mp3

Took Halc's advice and did some tuning as requested. Not sure if it's quite what he wants, but I hope its in the right direction.

[SoulinEther]

the dominant rhythm i'm hearing in the bass is (forgive my rhythm notational ignorance) 1 2 2.75 3.25 3.5 4 4.5. I think I heard you break down the first beat to make 1 1.5 in one section - I would consider trying it for the main rhythm as part of the progression of the piece, perhaps even going to 1 1.25 1.5 (since you have 16th notes all over this, I think it fits). It's not a huge change but it might help.

You might want to consider a "solo"/new melody/new rhythm (perhaps a combination of those) instead of the same 16th note pattern between 2:58 and 3:15 - I can hear something else work there to add interest.

[HoboKa]

the dominant rhythm i'm hearing in the bass is (forgive my rhythm notational ignorance) 1 2 2.75 3.25 3.5 4 4.5. I think I heard you break down the first beat to make 1 1.5 in one section - I would consider trying it for the main rhythm as part of the progression of the piece, perhaps even going to 1 1.25 1.5 (since you have 16th notes all over this, I think it fits). It's not a huge change but it might help.

You might want to consider a "solo"/new melody/new rhythm (perhaps a combination of those) instead of the same 16th note pattern between 2:58 and 3:15 - I can hear something else work there to add interest.

I'm not sure I'm following you on the rhythm thing, but I get your second crit. I can definitely find some form of melody to make it more interesting at the 2:58-3:15 segment.

Can you clarify your first crit a bit more? Sorry I'm pretty nubby at breaking down music theory myself =p

And thx for critting ^^

[SoulinEther]

I'm not sure I'm following you on the rhythm thing, but I get your second crit. I can definitely find some form of melody to make it more interesting at the 2:58-3:15 segment.

Can you clarify your first crit a bit more? Sorry I'm pretty nubby at breaking down music theory myself =p

And thx for critting ^^

sure. let's see if i can express this graphically (i'll try to keep my pants on but i make no guarantees )

.... .... .... .... <- four beats, divided up into four (each . would be a sixteenth note)

right now, in the bass in the intro, you have

X... X..X .XX. X.X.

I am suggesting that you eventually divide your first beat up:

X.X. X..X .XX. X.X.

and possibly:

XXX. X..X .XX. X.X.

I suggest these because I like how the first one has a sort of repetition (or something) of X.X and the second one.. maybe just because.

I think I've seen Gario use a better system.. something like 1e&a2e&a3e&a4e&a. Or maybe that's something I've heard. Idk.

[hewhoisiam]

I suspected that there'd be issues like that that Hewo hadn't discerned.

Ack! My pride!

*dies*

Anyway. I'm hoping halc comes back and explains my explanation here, of his, erhm, suggestion. I don't mean to sound simplistic, but I think when he's saying to change ever other or ever 4th bar he means simple changes to the melody that happen over and over again. If the melody is a 2 bar section, and you change every 4th bar, you actually have a new melody section that's 4 bars long. And the changes don't have to be the same each time.

What it feels like has happened to yours is you add more, quicker. Which in my mind is the same strategy of adding more sounds that you were doing, but it's still the exact same thing as far as notes and progression. This last update may be a step in the wrong direction to be honest, because when you were progressing slower, new things seemed more interesting than they really were. This feels like the same progression scheme repeated more, which actually ADDS repetition. Best example of this is the piano chords you added around 0:43. I think the sound great TBH... But when they show up early, then show up again, then show up again... They lose the effect they had in V7 of being all new and interesting... The little things like that aren't as noticeable. (not saying it can't work, just that I don't think it's what he meant. really want him to weigh in on this though and explain)

While I'm clarifying junk, my last suggestion about the bass sound wasn't to change anything you had in the bass section, but add another bass part entirely. I was actually thinking of a pad playing low notes to fill in the sound subtlety. Sort of like when you listen to rock or metal, you have to really listen to hear a bass part (most of the time, it plays pretty close the the guitar) but when it's not there, you notice the missing lows. (psst! Someone else should weigh in on this opinion. hint hint wink wink)

I'm going to shamelessly point to my example here http://compo.thasauce.net/rounds/view/ORC127 where I took the basic melody and raised the last few notes of the second repetition. (on a side note, go enter these competitions! Great practice!)

Another fine example of a changing melody is in the song metamorphic rock here on OCR, it's sixto and darkesword, so the bar is set kinda high. But it's sonic 1 marble zone theme, which is a short repetitive source and a good example of what he does to keep it from being too repetitive.

@SoulinEther: My system I use for visually explaining things is usually reserved for drum stuff... But it's to put the entire count out (usually in 16th notes) and then X where I think stuff is and goes)

1 e & a 2 e & a 3 e & a 4 e & a

x----------x-------x----x------x-----x--

And <3 more opinions! Now I don't feel like I'm monopolizing HoboKa for fun and profit. Though I still plague him with my walls of texts posteses... (part of my master plan was to suggest that he do my taxes for me at some point...)

[HoboKa]

Ack! My pride!

And <3 more opinions! Now I don't feel like I'm monopolizing HoboKa for fun and profit. Though I still plague him with my walls of texts posteses... (part of my master plan was to suggest that he do my taxes for me at some point...)

Or...you can "trick" me into collabing with you

On a serious note; I like your crits and agree that my track does feel that it's sort of falling apart.

I'm a crappy learner and often need some1 to kinda watch over my shoulder and guide me along. That's one reason why doing this music stuff over the internet doesn't always benefit me.

I mean, it took me 3 years or so to finally see what you guys were trying to tell me =p might take me another year or 2 before I can finally get something that the J's will like. With that being said, I intend to keep on plugging away at this mix until A) I get soooo incredibly sick of it i'll puke just by turning on the flp. life decides to be a bitch again and I'm unable to keep up with my debt C) Both A and B.

Thanks for the crits so far guys - and your patience with me ^^

[HoboKa]

Sorry about the 2x post...

Alright.. so what I'm gonna do is actually un-do what I did on the last update and re-evaluate ever1's crits and re-try it. Don't expect the next update to be great though, because I feel that I'm a bit over my head with this new set of crits.

[SoulinEther]

Sorry about the 2x post...

Alright.. so what I'm gonna do is actually un-do what I did on the last update and re-evaluate ever1's crits and re-try it. Don't expect the next update to be great though, because I feel that I'm a bit over my head with this new set of crits.

no pressure

[hewhoisiam]

Well, finish this one... Then, I did promise Gario a Laguna mix if you want to hammer out the details of trying to collab that. Could be pain... Could be cake. I know we use different DAWs. We'll see.

[HoboKa]

Well I tried to change things up - but I ended up drawing blanks for almost 2 hours - no real decent ideas took hold. This track has grown old on me...but has lasted longer than a lot of my other half-assed ideas. I might go back to it later. Anyways, I'll keep the files hosted for a while longer for ppl to DL. Thanks for your comments everyone!

[Gario]

First, if this track is 'old' then go pick a Dynamite Headdy track soon, else we might not be able to do it.

Second, indeed I have used the 1e&a system, SoulinEther, but only because Hewhoisiam reminded me of it's existence - all credit goes to him . Another alternative is the boom-a-chick-a method (one-a-chick-a-two-a-chick-a... etc.), since we're one the subject.

Third, if you want to join ORC, click my sig (don't worry, bro, I'm working on one for this round). Don't worry, Hoboka knows of this compo - he currently holds the record for the fastest submission ever (what was it, 8 hours?).

Now that I've ranted, let's look at the remix, shall we? Even if you don't continue, it can still be helpful, I'm sure.

You've changed a shitload since I last heard it... and for the better, mostly. I like the variety that you've given this song. It's not too bad - for the most part you keep me interested through the whole thing, so good job (the previous track I heard didn't do that for me).

I like the sense of space, overall. It fills out nicely, giving my ears something tasty to eat.

Some of the synths are still incredibly cheezy, but at this point it's all personal taste, so if you like them keep them. The 'live' instruments add a nice element to it all.

The only real complaint is that you really don't explore too much outside of the source melodies, harmonies and form. That is a killer, with this source, but you've managed to make it work alright despite this.

While I'm sure everyone in here is being helpful, but for the last two crits they seemed to be a bit... specific. I know it's all a good intention, but remember - this IS Hoboka's song, so critiques that fundamentally try to recompose the music will hurt more in the long run than more general statements. Gotta give the guy some room to compose, here.

Don't worry, I still love you guys . And Hewhoisiam, indeed, owes me a Laguna remix. Better hurry, though - March is already halfway over!

[SoulinEther]

I still love you guys

yeah well i don't love you anymore :'( haha. no. i just threw an idea out there to act as a point of nucleation around which his creative juices could form new ideas.

[HoboKa]

This thread should be locked. I'm not really willing to work on this track anymore, especially since there's too many crits to sift through and too much to alter - not to mention that I'm feeling pretty sick on top of that.

[Gario]

RIP, WIP.

May you slumber peacefully with all the other unfinished mixes on here .