OCR04564 - Final Fantasy VIII "Existence Still Denied"

[Liontamer]

What did you think? Post your opinion of this ReMix.

[CJthemusicdude]

What an experience!  I didn't realize how long this was until I finished, it uses the time well!  Superb. 

Edited May 17 by CJthemusicdude

[The Vodoú Queen]

On 3/24/2024 at 3:23 PM, CJthemusicdude said:

What an experience!  I didn't realize how long this as until I finished, it uses the time well!  Superb. 

Thank you so much for your comment, CJ! :) Unfortunately, not long after your listening to it I went back and listened myself, and it's come to my attention that this version is not the one originally attached to the e-mail submission for ESD. I had actually went back and redid the vocal mixing and production on all the other elements across the board, in the spirit of making it be beyond its album incarnation and more for the OCR front page.

...I hope at some point, some day, that updated, re-tuned version will come to light on OCR, but for the moment I'm glad you really enjoyed the album version of ESD. ^_^; If it does, I hope you revisit this tune as well. ♡

[The Vodoú Queen]

Oh, snap!!! It's updated, @CJthemusicdude!!

Thank you so much, @Liontamer! ♡

[CJthemusicdude]

I have been summoned!  Honestly, I'm glad I was because my original review was weak sauce.  I couldn't really tell you the differences between this version and the one I heard originally, so this is basically a fresh review.

In my quest to review as many OCremixes as I can, I found myself defaulting to giving a positive review to each and every review.  I know how much of a difference even a small review or comment can make, and I wanted to be that positive force that encouraged others to make music!  However, I have a very long and personal relationship with the FF8 soundtrack.  And the Extreme is one of my favorite boss themes of all time.  It is a soundtrack I am deeply familiar with and I'll be completely honest, I am not a fan of this remix.  My original review was glib because I didn't say what I wanted to say.  So my apologies to you for not leaving a genuine review.  You are going to get one now though, definitely the longest review I've ever done on this site! (So far).  I will try to be as constructive as I can with this review, and keep in mind this is all subjective opinion.  I very much applaud and appreciate what you've done here and the clear care and passion you put into this.

I'll start with what I enjoy.  The transition to the spoken work/rap section from 6:00 to 6:24 was my favorite part of the track, those wood blocks were FIRE.  The rap section and the spoken word bits in general were very cool.  The intro soundscape was very enjoyable, specifically the first 30 seconds. and the usage of the FITHOS LUSEC WECOS VINOSEC source was very well done.

On to my criticisms.  My first one is the pacing of the remix.  In my original review I mentioned that it uses the time well.  Upon further review, I do not think that is not the case.  Even though I think the intro is very cool, 3 minutes to ramp up into the energetic portion of the song is way too long, it could have been it's own remix and would have been great but in the context of a single remix it overstays its' welcome.  I think a good minute could have been cut from the intro.  Even though I enjoyed the rap section, it was way too short and felt very out of place, it really felt like it should be its' own remix as well.  The long length of this remix doesn't really give me a good chance to latch onto anything in particular and kind of causes the whole remix to wash over you like a fog.

My second criticism from a musical standpoint is that in the "Tension and Release" aspect of music, there was too much tension and not enough release.  To start, after the song-length intro. We get to some energetic stuff starting at 2:52.  That part was very cool, like many of the transitions in this remix.  The rhythmic chanting voices, that super cool Buzzy bass.... the strings that come in at 2:58 were weak, but not a deal-breaker... but then it just kind of... shifts to 3:04 - 3:15.  After all that build up and a cool transition it just kind of flops.  I felt musically blue-balled, and it wouldn't be the last time.

My favorite part of the original source is that epic climatic section that dives right into the somber piano/harp.  It kind of encapsulates everything that makes the Extreme such a good boss music and a great representative of Ultimicia.  However in this remix, I didn't get any of that.  I felt like I got played at 5:04 and 5:26 and once again at 8:34.  From a creative standpoint, I appreciate the subversion of the expectation, but as an enjoyer of the source, it felt incredibly unsatisfying.  

Production is a bit off as well.  Everything felt kind of flimsy.  Some of the lead synth instruments really needed some protein.  (Especially that lead that comes in at 3:58.)  The drums barely had any presence (Especially the snares) and tended to be very repetitive.  The end result is that a lot of this remix doesn't really pack any sort of punch.

Again, I hope this review doesn't discourage you.  There are things I liked about this remix and would probably like more if this remix was chopped up into more cohesive regular sized remixes.  Keep making cool music! 😄

[The Vodoú Queen]

Hey there.

That's a fair take, and I understand if and when people have a strong reaction to a beloved song or OST of theirs, and SeeDs/FFVIII is no exception. I'm...a bit upset by this, honestly, but you respectively are entitled to your opinion and feelings, and I'm sure you won't be the first or last in this regard. My music--as is obvious even on the Judges' Panel--is seemingly very...divisive...be it because of how I went about producing and mixing it or the composition itself. At the time, I was pretty chuffed and proud of this remix...given when it happened, the work it took, and the final result...but I'd be remiss to say that this amongst other things kind of hits me in a way where currently I have to disassociate my emotions from my logic brain...and all I can say is this:

Thank you for your honesty in the end, and all I can do is apologize that this version of the Extreme doesn't resonate with you. Quite a few of my remixes, even if or when they make it past the bar, has that issue. Perhaps it's "growing pains", as people call it. This track was a first for many things for me: 100+ track mixing, in-depth vocal mixing that isn't just ad libs here or there or chopped loops, rapping to my own musical shit, etc. By no means is any of this an excuse to have what may in fact be a...less-than-stellar remix, and people will say I'm being harsh on myself in behind your retuned review, but I digress.

It is what it is. ...I'm unsure if I'll ever come back to this and do a re-cut / deep-cut and change it drastically as I get better at this game, but again, I'm very sorry to you and anybody else who just couldn't or didn't vibe with this. I chose this track and the other sources I sewed into it because they, too, deeply resonated with me, as both a casual listener and as an artist. FF8 in particular is the dark horse / black sheep and underrated game of the series, and I chose SeeDs as my first jumping off point because at the time I felt brave enough to do so and I like the game and OST, despite its flaws, and equally my own flaws and trepidation to dare try. I...don't know. Be that as it may, I'm glad I did, I'm sad it didn't work for you, and I'll...just have to try harder and better next time.

I, and I'm sure the rest of us here, appreciate your hard work in reviewing our tracks and being real with yourself in this instance to just tell it like it is to me. I'd rather have a genuine reaction than a falsehood to my work. People doubting it and me are inevitable and I'll just...try again to pick up the pieces and continue onward. I'm not letting another creative writing or art pursuit flop happen again. . . This is about as genuine and positive I can be in this moment in response to ya. . . :) And it's not a reflection on you, but on myself in how poorly I look at my OWN work and person.

Introspection is a bitch.

Thanks again. I'll take all of your points and do what I can with them on future projects or further revisions to past ones. Take care of yourself and speak soon. o/

Edited May 18 by The Vodoú Queen

[The Vodoú Queen]

Also, FWIW, you are right in some regard on the length alone that it was too much of a slow-roll and overambitious to a fault. ...I don't know. It was a darling I wasn't willing to kill, considering some background circumstances / context behind this remix from the album itself that hits pretty close to home. ...It was a vision indeed, but not without its flaws.

I'll just do better next time.

Edited May 18 by The Vodoú Queen