hewhoisiam

:sleepdepriv:UPDATE: http://www.mediafire.com/?4nnhyzyxytz First things first, no. This is not the ending, not even close to the length I want. But I decided that writing an original ending would take quite a while, so this is the rest of it up to that point. And I took off the cop out ending. Changes: 1) Bass part re-written: My last bass part with the 16th notes and the 2 bass sounds (one was the popcorn synth, focus of animosity and debate) sounded cluttered, and I had intended the notes that were 'off' to be a half step lower to be something like wheel bends on the bass. But they just sounded erhm. bad8-O Putting them in the key/mode made them sound like they belonged there, but didn't have the effect I wanted. This bass part is pretty simple, I may change it again. As is, it gets boring. 2) Added back in a chord part that was in the original. This was going to have that 'popcorn' synth playing the part, but I canned the popcorn synth totally, and had a synth I liked still laying around... You know, combinations of squares I need to get in those round holes... I'm still trying to decide what to do to fill in some bass sounds. The bass now has some issues for longer notes as well that I want to work out, because the piece is not very bass intensive, except in those long notes on the breaks and decending paterns that need the tweaking. 3) Swells changed to be non static: This is where said dissonance came from, The popcorn synth was spot on with the chords (I still could never get it to do what I wanted though) As the swells get higher though, some of the low bass sound loses its edge. I may look into dropping down octives or doing something else with it entirley. I wonder how much I can abuse EQ to make it work. 4) Break tweaks: Changed various minor things with the breaks, added transitions, panning, and volume efects to try and make them more tense. 50/50 now, I can't decide if I want to change them again or leave them as is.

Speaking of which, where's my guitar solo HoboKa?

Just so we're clear, my snare drum NEVER sounded like that when I was in high school:nicework:

Nah, just gives me more buzzwords to look up:-P On a side note, I upgraded today from my skullcandy ear canal buds to some Sennheiser HD 280 pros. You could say there's a bit of difference8-O (for clarification, I use some nice 5.1 surround phones to listen to most of the music on here, but I output sonar to my stereo, since it's using a different audio card. YESTERDAY, I hammered out another bass part and moved the swelling chords to match the song progress, rather then having them static. Few other minor tweaks, mostly to the breaks. Today I'm doing something with the end. Which has become the most painful part of this:sleepdepriv:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrygian_mode

Thanks for the reply. Sorry if you misunderstood. 1) I have never had a song accepted to OCR, I've just posted 2 things here in the WIP section, as I learned the software and (some) music theory. I realize nothing is up to par with OCR standards, and have never submitted anything. I am here to learn, and to work with this as a hobby. Though I try to never do anything half-assed. 2) My skills are what I pick up here, and a basic high school understanding of music. (never took music theory) I have been a percussionist and jazz band drummer. (class of 04, so that's been 5 years ago) As far as knowing simple keys, I understand key signatures, but only really major scales, some harmonic, some minor. Phrygian is a whole new word for me, so no, I don't know what it means. (I'm actually looking up the meaning now) I had no idea. You almost seem insulted that I was clueless. (thanks for the post anyway:puppyeyes:) 'I' said C was all white keys, or 'no sharps no flats' because when I learned 'C MAJOR' on mallets (which is all white notes) it's C to C, no half steps, pretty straight forward. Ancient and lost, no. Ancient and lost to me, absolutely. I did know about C minor, which would have just a single half step off. I admire midi writers, for a few reasons. One of which is that they can use midi and write thing that sound a lot better than mine. The other is their ability to hear notes and know what they are. (I've run into a few people really good at piano that can do this. hear and recreate) It's fucking awesome! I CAN'T GOD DAMNED DO IT! I can't match pitch when it's in the same damn scale; much less follow key changes. So, I'm about 10-12 steps below your abilities. Thanks for the crits and key signature analysis. I'll do what I can to make something of it.

Okay, so I wasn't going to release this yet, but since we're talking about changing keys of the whole thing and the general sound. I re-wrote the bass part, which is still rough. But that popcorn thing you talked about is gone (tbh, it was toned down and all but gone before we had the 'dissonance' discussion:-P) This is w/o changing any keys yet. New bass part: http://www.mediafire.com/?5mcryohmnjm

I'd love to collab, but I'm using Sonar, and I'm not sure how to make a CWP file work in FL, or visa versa. If we can get something to work it sounds good though. As for that note: the note isn't overly long really, it's just the last voice to cut out. The usual last note is a high voice. (all your orchestra and band people do this) But in your rock type music, it's a grab bag for stuff like cut offs. So, very minor:tomatoface:

Okay, I did some with this, no update here yet. That 'popcorn' synth was a real bassy sound, right? It was written in a minor chord (well, mostly) and I simplified it when I re-wrote the bass part earlier. The lead is played on acid bass through z3ta, and is written in a 5th paralell. I did take the upper off, but it sounded very thin. I did put a 'octive' in, but there was too much space. I think the main lead works okay as is. The chords that you hear in the breaks are half steps off, and that's right from the source, and have that minor sound, same as the step downs in the middle. As far as J's posting on here... It kills the peer review side of things, because the judges opinions are considered right. I mean. DJP has a post here in the WIP forums I was looking at. Boss man came in and has the last post in the thread, no one posted after that. (though a lot of the theads die anyways it seems) I think J's opinions intimidate people. (I know I read the judge forum and try to pay attention to some of the critisisms there) I look at all the feedback I get, good or bad. I have to say it helps more if there's not sugar, but some people don't take criticism well. Sometimes people say less is more, but with my criticisms, more is more. I personally try to put what I'm saying into clear, moderatly punctuated sentances what says when the time I'm talking about is. And even then I'm wrong a lot The key of C has no flats or sharps. So it sounds very blah if you don't vary from it. I know this is written in some sort of ancient 'lost' key signature, but it is supposed to have a certain amount of minor feel to it. I'm sure it's a tipple word score key signature what has hyphens and stuff in it that I just haven't heard of yet. That is all, now get along again, goddammit:-P -H

The note isn't off key, but the echo of it comes back onto the chord part that's right after it. The note holds over and cuts off, then comes back as an echo. And it ends up running a little bit to long. It's the last voice to decay. Very minor, but worth pointing out. Picking nits hoboka, picking nits. Sorry about your legend of dragoon mix, I have that game lovingly decorating my game shelf right now. EDIT: And where's my guitar solo!

Wait a sec, if I remember right, didn't EWJ have that attack where he'd pull out hit worm-head and beat people with it? I only ever played the one on game boy:puppyeyes: Ah right, the song. Wait, only SOME of my vast... resoviour of knowledge and... (mostly) opinion is useful? I'm crushed! lmao. Again, I'm down to the nitty gritty nitty picky. Right right right, song. I'm getting there. Quick recap of things that I've said that are the same (I assume you're not changing these, you need to say that in yooos post, so I stop telling yooos about them) 1) Voices at 0:24 2) Oh yeah, no killer guitar solo? Pweese? Nit picks on drums: 1) The Ruff grace notes should be quieter. 2) Stick across snare at the beginning could be brought up a bit. 3) Some velocity changes on the 16th triplets and 32nds on the toms would give you a more realistic feel for those fast notes. Other stuff 1) There's a bad note hold over right at 1:35-1:37 The echo hold over is messing with the first chord a bit. 2) Cakewalk has a 'transient shaper' that would help the main lead synth at 1:00 tone down that hissing sound some. It sounds intentional and to me sounds good, but don't know if you'll catch crap from the next guy. I don't know if FL has anything like that, but you might consider it. (it sounds good now too, again I'd have to play with it to be sure; or just to play with it) I keep getting the feeling comparing Sonar to FL is like comparing apples to a 1959 chevy. Not even in the same ballpark, but anyway. That's it for now. I'll listen to this a bit more later. -H

I'll get crackin' in a bit. Math in the morning makes braining go bubye, a little cool down time is an order What you said about the chords makes sense (I know some theory, mostly from jazz band) And I know my flat scales at least (not as good at sharps, minors and harmonics) Right at the end of the thing where the huge build just goes into nothingness, in my current project I have 12 blank bars that are taunting me. (I'll get even and attack them with notes here in a bit) I'm not happy with the bass part as is, I originally liked that real throaty bass, but it's just playing quarters and my other bass is playing off beats. A bit simple for me, and is just not cutting it. Thanks for dissecting the key for me, I'm hoping I can make somefig out of it. :-POnce again, thanks for all the comments and criticisms

Mmhokay, class tomorrow (coming up stupid soon ), so this is my last bit for the night. As for commenting, I like to comment on one that people are activly working on instead of leaving a comment on lots of them (plus I lose my mind trying to keep track of more than 4 or 5 songs in progress at once. (I seem to remember... this very close to source, maybe J's won't like dis...) Lets see here. Okay, Ima listen to it a few times to nit pick. So that I can pick nits. (yeah, it looks like a lot, but it really isn't) 1) I've already mentioned that synth at 0:24. I'm hit or miss on this one, I've almost managed to talk myself into liking it:-P; but I still think it's in the same range as those high notes, which could end up in the way. 2) I hear more bass then before which is huge for me. Kudos there. 3) At 1:00 the lead synth comes in. One of the things I'm trying to figure out how to do is do like a gradual filter or effect with different intensity over several bars. (I've heard a few people do it, I hear it in techno type stuff a lot) I can picture something like that working well here; because it's the same thing 3 or 4 times there. Don't get me wrong, it's interesting and works well as it is now. I'm just thinking about what it would sound like with that effect. (and I'm trying to describe sounds in words again) 4) Build after the chords bit is great, after that the first idea comes back again. While it works well and sounds good, It's a 1 to 1 copy. You might consider a few very minor changes. Or that whole thing I talked about in 3. 5) The synth at 1:00 may actually be a touch too loud? 6) 2:28 I don't want those high notes back in right when that strong lead comes in. Ease up the volume over a note or 2 maybe. It's a bit too much all at once. *) It's getting to the point now to where I don't really have critisisims, more like 'oh oh oh! I wonder what this button does...' type suggestions Hope this helps -H

I like my criticism right between the eyes, as long as it's constructive. As far as sound goes, some Seinheisser cans come this week by the mail, I'm hoping it helps. And it's easier for me to criticize your synths HARDER because you have the whole key/sound/dissonance thing down. So I can hear what I complain about. That, and I'm not sure what key signature this is in, because the source is using that little half step off thing. >.> That's also why I havn't varied much from the normal bass line, those chords are pretty much it as far as me knowing the key of this thing. Erm, which part is this awful 'popcorn' synth. It may be the one that I keep changing and changing back for lack of anything better The first idea was to have this sort of dark dirty sounding Noirfair with the fast beat. Now the idea is 'I don't know what's next' I still want to get away from the source some more, and fix that cop out ending at the very least.

Have I mentioned I love that bass? This to me seems like it's headed the right direction. I like the changes to the drums at the beginning. A few more things I'm seeing: 1) A lot of sounds in this version are trying to really stand out at the beginning. Fighting for space. Specifically the high voice that comes in at 0:24 with the high notes that are already there seem to stand out more then in the last version. I don't know if going an octive lower would help, changing the synth or what; but to me it seems like they're both in the same range as is. 2) New synth at 1 min, I like it, not nearly as simple sounding as the old one, I think because of that it doesn't need such drastic panning as the old one did. Two birds with one stone. 3) At 1:36, the nice slow chords for a bit are refreshing. I don't know how much you're doing after this bit, the source is pretty long. But something should prolly come after those so that they build into something. I personally like the second half of the source more than the first and would love to see it in there somewhere (killer guitar solo in the original8-O) As is, the chord section comes and goes for 12 bars, the song picks up into that mellow part for another 12, then just kinda ends. (this is about where said guitar solo happens) Because of the solo in the origional, it seems like it's building even though it's just the solo doing the work. In your without the solo, the song seems to be in decline. Hope this helps -H

Update: http://www.mediafire.com/?yznchnzfz3a Did: Breaks, something different. Levels Misc. little things. left to do: Ending something Bass (maybe changed, dunno) Figure out the compressor Length too short Thoughts: I can't seem to get a sound I like in the break. I added bits, but it seems more like it took from the overall coherence of the thing. When it was basically the theme, it seemed much more like it went together. I'm just adding to my collection of failed things that I put in those 2 spots. That 'theme and direction' I liked earlier is now confused again. Needs a direction methinks. Or I need to keep a few of the ideas that I like, scrap and re-design the rest. Mayhaps in a new project:puppyeyes:

1 Open forums 2 Open mouth 3 Insert foot Posted the wrong source, it sounded close at the time, sorry about that. Anyways, let me hit on my thoughts with that synth. The song as is has all these high string type noises and the fun ascending and decending patern. Then the synth that comes in just feels bland as is. Of course, everything's my opinion, and it may be wrong. (not really, I mean I'm alwalys right, right?) I'm not really sure how to describe it (but I'm doing a lot of typing anyway) other then to say to me it sounds out of place. To go along with the music, I guess I'm saying something here should have some decay to make the attack seem stronger, rather then sound like a sustained note. Though the creative panning is fun. As far as what else to use, here's where my lack of experiance comes in to bite me. Bear with this next bit: I wonder if you couldn't layer a sine type sound or something on top of it, give it a long decay, but short quieter attack so that it makes the note louder at the begenning and shorter in the end with some echo. I'm refering to layering as making another track with similar notes to play at the same time, since I'm only half sure how to change the sound you have now. My other thought (lets try to use my new remix vocabulary; see if this sounds right) A subtractive filter on it to give it that more gruff sort of sound. I have this 'picture' of what I'm trying to say in my head, but I'm not thinking it's nearly so easy to come across in words. I do most of my stuff by mistake, so I'd prolly spend forever and a day listening to different presets to find my fix for it. Sorry I can't be more 'on target' with what I'm trying to say. -H

Would you please post the sources Hoboka! You make me sad I like what you have so far, it's early, so I'm not really going to go into stuff that I figure you'll catch and change anyways Something seems to be off at 0:35 with the bg synth, or maybe it's just me. Build up to 1:00 may be a bit on the loud side. Love the panning near the end. That bass 'funk' thing is great at the beginning. I wanna see it again much more prominent later in the piece (my selfish request here:-P) Not a huge fan of the synth 0:58. Just kinda boring to me, doesn't seem to fit in. I give this my seal of approval, look forward to more -H

Done in a + - an hour?! Well, like you said, you're going to work on it some more and know what's wrong with it I look forward to a longer closer to complete work. If you're basing it on something (and I don't think you are, despite all the good guesses in this thread so far) Get us a source so that we may taunt you properly, and/or work pieces to fit somefing. Good stuff!

Most of my stuff is on the 50/50 rule, 50% trial 50% error. So a lot of the things I'm saying I'd have to hear before I could really go yay or nay on. That being said, here are my first impressions: I like the intro the first time I listened to this, but when I re-listened, it develops too slowly for my taste. But the slowdown when the melody enters is done extremely well. Kudos there. At 2:00, after the melody, you use that warped rasp sort of sound, then at 2:13 go into a different melody/break. It seems to me like the transition almost shouldn't have that little warped segment, seems redundant and really takes away from the build at 2:13. I'd have to hear it another way to know for sure though, just first though. 3:10 is some just fun noises, then again with different fun noises at 3:25. I like these sounds, but they seem out of place here by themselves. I could see them used as background/fill type sounds earlier on in the piece to give them more of a place as lead instruments later on. They might do well in the intro actually. Flame of Darkness sounds better than the plural Flames of Darkness methinks. Unless there's some sort of story reason for the plural. Stupid pseudo-grammatical comment, couldn't resist.

HA! I remember those days! I was very much a 'hammer' kid. I had/have an assortment of things that make the square go into the hole real good. Well, in this case, I have them all at the end of the project (the midi's at least, got rid of the soft synths) Update: http://www.mediafire.com/?tx5tz40vgdx Changes: 1) Panned the bases to add some separation, added a sharper to bring out bass 2. 2) Played with levels and compressor (I added that shaper and the compressor started to eat a few of my parts ) May need to up the overall level again. 3) Changed the break at the beginning. I didn't want half time, this is swung 2/3rd time. (1 to 1.5 ratio) It works, but I'm not sure that it doesn't kill the flow. 4) Balanced and changed drum parts 5) Re-worked 'swell' levels 6) Took out 5th parallel and went back to original synth on the second melody 7) Stumbled on Adhesive Boy's rendition of Noirfair, puts mine to shame Checklist: 1) Do something with the end, other than 'fade out' end. 2) Too conservative, need to go steal things and use them. 3) Bass still seems somewhat simple in the middle, rework/rebalance 4) I've got to see how to work effects into just a part of a piece of the project. I can add them to tracks, but I can't fade them up and down the way I can use track envelopes for panning and volume. -H

Right, I've made about 10 different things to put in the hole at the begenning, it would be easier if I didn't like any of them. Thing is, I like all of them and none of them fit. They're all squares and I have a round hole. But they're pretty squares!

Good stuff, I did enjoy listening. Mhokey, lazy 'my first thoughts' type review here. (I still a noobie so ya know ) 1) Sounds a lot like the original in choices of leads. The drums are different, so is the bass somewhat, but overall, very close to the original with only the transitions to set it apart. 2) Pretty repeditive around 1:20ish, then shortly after it repeats the entire first idea. I'd say something should be done so it isn't just an exact 1 to 1 copy. A bit too much repetition for me in places, but then again, megaman music IS repetitive. 3) I like your high energy breaks, especially at the ending, but they're all pretty much the same type of build-up and sound, almost identical even. 4) Panning and EQ are really not my thing, but nothing jumps out at me; so that's good. That's all for now -He

To give you an idea, that wah wah wah WAH sound is in a folder named 'failed test place holder' I'm going to pan the bass and see if that doesn't bring it out (using 2 bases here actually) I'll play with it tonight and tomorrow. I did plan to work on it today already >.> got side tracked. I'm not understanding what about the parallel makes this sound bad I guess? Is this some 'the sounds clash' thing that I can't really hear? The piece is written in parallel, so I can take the top off of it; I figured it was there to fatten the sound a little bit. It's a 5 note difference, rather than the entire octave, so maybe that's it. I always thought of it as a sort of eerie sound.

Mhokey, I've been putting off the review on this (nothing personal) for a few hours now. Time to get down to business. I have to say I like what you have right now, I'm trying to put into words what I want to say, bear with The last bit, person preference or whatnot, it seems to me like the trumpet synth could use a few sharp dynamic changes to really bring it out, while not making it so front and center ALL the time. I do think the sound of the thing is much improved over the last version, so kudos there. As far as Gario and texture: I don't really understand what he's saying about texture, and I half see what he means about the mids being one big instrument. It just seems to me like there are too many middle sounds, not that the EQ is off or anything. Maybe an instrument change or somefig? Though you said you had something in the works for that, so I'll wait and see. (again, the disclaimer that I'm not the best at this sort of thing, I'm getting there slowley ) As for the very end, I want something to go with that cymbol hit. I like triplets with descending dynamics >.> personal preference. (what you have works. Just a thought ^.^ The ending 'all instruments in' bit may be a bit long. I could see a break at 2:27 working well in there just for some breathing room. I don't know if you're going for more length or no. But it could be a 2 birds with one stone kinda thing. That's all I got for now. I look forward to the updates. -H