Artist Profile Privacy Concerns

[Abadoss]

ur mom looks like a pirate hooker

I don't appreciate my mom being compared to Dustin Hoffman...

Was the 'er' necessary? Really?

[Kanthos]

It looks like a pirate hook...

Looks like something that'd be found in Patapon.

[analoq]

I think if you want to be able to give that information in an Artist Profile without the artist having a say, the only way is to put it in as part of the terms of an accepted submission. If an artist wishes their remix(es) to appear on OCRemix.org, that they must accept that certain information may be gathered and provided by the staff.

In my case I did genuinely offer the YouTube channel for my artist profile but on the (false) expectation it would not be extrapolated upon by site staff; had the (apparent) policy of the artist profiles been made clear to me I would not have volunteered a thing. So I do agree the profile policy, whatever it may be, should be available for everyone to review before they submit.

[djpretzel]

In my case I did genuinely offer the YouTube channel for my artist profile but on the (false) expectation it would not be extrapolated upon by site staff; had the (apparent) policy of the artist profiles been made clear to me I would not have volunteered a thing. So I do agree the profile policy, whatever it may be, should be available for everyone to review before they submit.

Not to beat a dead horse, but I think part of the problem with that is that there are artist profiles for composers, most of whom will never submit, so hinging inference of fields based on acceptance of the sub policy is problematic. Here's how it lays out:

1. Artist profiles are for composers AND ReMixers - and those special enough to be both.
   
2. We have a composer profile for Nobuo Uematsu. It is widely accepted that he is a he, although to my certain knowledge this question has never been directly asked of him, nor has he provided "concrete biological proof"
   
3. Nevertheless, Wiki and pretty much every biography I've seen refer to him as a him.
   
4. If we have to get individual permission from all artists to use "him" or "her", which is exactly the same as an icon, we can't even achieve parity with the most rudimentary of resources.
   

If you would like to indicate that you are female, please let us know, we'll make that change, assuming there's no overwheling or conflicting evidence to the contrary (your personal statement would trump the Youtube vids). If you would like to claim that neither "male" nor "female" accurately describe you, again, let us know and we'll make THAT change. But please, while I suspect your intentions are ideologically sound on some level, try to stay with us all here in the real world.

[analoq]

Again, I'm with you in the real world; suggesting my argument logically extends to seeking permission from composers is a misrepresentation. Though you've made great pains to crowbar the remixer profiles in with the composer profiles they are still fundamentally different in origin:

1. Composers have artist profiles by virtue of being credited for a composition in a video game.
   
2. Remixers have artist profiles by virtue of being credited with a remix on OCR.
   

The only way B can happen is by someone permitting their music to be on OCR. Comparing the artist profiles to third-parties like Wikipedia/IMDB is fair for composers but superficial for remixers because there is a relatively direct channel of communication between OCR and its remixers. Remixers are encouraged to volunteer personal information e.g. real name, etc. when they submit. Remixers are directly affiliated with the site whereas composers (aside from the very special ones) are not.

To further illustrate, I have a profile on VGMdb and while there is information there I would like omitted, it doesn't bother me as much because I have zero affiliation with VGMdb. As well, they list authors for each page and anyone can see I'm not one of them.

But because of my affiliation with OCR, there is no way for someone to know whether I had volunteered the information on my artist profile or not. That potentially gives my artist profile an authority it would not have in the absence of my affiliation.

The solutions I've been getting at are:

1. Have a policy for artist profiles amongst the plethora of site literature that remixers are encouraged to review before they submit.
   or
   
2. Cite specific sources for all information on remixers' artist profiles.
   or
   
3. Only display information that was explicitly volunteered by the remixer on their profile.
   

[djpretzel]

The solutions I've been getting at are:

1. Have a policy for artist profiles amongst the plethora of site literature that remixers are encouraged to review before they submit.
   or
   
2. Cite specific sources for all information on remixers' artist profiles.
   or
   
3. Only display information that was explicitly volunteered by the remixer on their profile.
   

I have to agree, that's a pretty real world, practical argument - good points.

The policy seems like the best course of action; it may make the most sense to have this be part of the existing Submission Agreement, if we can keep it concise enough that it doesn't clutter the overall document.

Let's see, I hate to just SAY that without tossing out some draft language:

"YOU agree that OverClocked ReMix will create and maintain an artist profile that includes personal information that YOU choose to submit as well as information from publicly available resources. Sex, birth date, and other fields may be inferred from these resources, but this information can be removed or modified by request if those sources are no longer available, are modified, or are inconclusive."

That's the best I can do in ten minutes. Thoughts?

[Abadoss]

"YOU agree that OverClocked ReMix will create and maintain an artist profile that will include personal information that YOU choose to submit as well as information from publicly available resources. Gender, date of birth, and other statistical fields may be inferred from these resources. This information can be removed and/or modified by YOUR request if those sources are no longer available, are modified, and/or are inconclusive."

Changed some of the wording. Very minor, but I think it might help a little. Feel free to alter.

[analoq]

"YOU agree that OverClocked ReMix will create and maintain an artist profile that includes personal information that YOU choose to submit as well as information from publicly available resources. Sex, birth date, and other fields may be inferred from these resources, but this information can be removed or modified by request if those sources are no longer available, are modified, or are inconclusive."

That's the best I can do in ten minutes. Thoughts?

So would my request to remove the sex from my profile be granted (or at least acquiesced) based on my claims of inconclusiveness? Whether it helps my particular situation or not, I am in favour of there being a policy and what I see so far seems pretty reasonable.

[Powerlord]

This is only vaguely associated to the topic at hand, but I noticed that sometime after the change to VBulletin I gained a custom title, listed after my name.

Like the artist profile complaint, there does not seem to be any way for me to remove this title.

[djpretzel]

So would my request to remove the sex from my profile be granted (or at least acquiesced) based on my claims of inconclusiveness? Whether it helps my particular situation or not, I am in favour of there being a policy and what I see so far seems pretty reasonable.

Well, you do only *seem* male in the Youtube video, but there's also the fact that I've been referring to you as a "he" this whole time without any objections, as have other people that hung out with you at meetups, etc. It's not great, but it is something. I don't see the point of removing the field unless you also insist that I go back and modify all mix writeups to remove any revealing pronouns, etc., as we essentially become our own "reference" otherwise. All that being said, if you want me to do all that, and you intend to keep all other publicly available resources similarly devoid of this information, yes... I'll do it. I'll just add that, as something approximating a friend, or at least someone who admires your music and contributions to the community, I personally would prefer you not request this change.

This is only vaguely associated to the topic at hand, but I noticed that sometime after the change to VBulletin I gained a custom title, listed after my name.

Like the artist profile complaint, there does not seem to be any way for me to remove this title.

That was Larry. He does that when he thinks someone title is important for other forumgoers to be aware of. If you PM him, he can easily remove of modify it - I'm sure he thought he was doing you a favor. It's not editable because it's "special" i.e. not everyone has it.