*NO* Amnesia: The Dark Descent 'You Will Not Be Forgiven' *RESUB*

[DragonAvenger]

Original decision

Remix:

Remixer Name: Brent Wollman

Website: https://soundcloud.com/brent-wollman

UserID: 41181

Game arranged: Amnesia: The Dark Descent

Name of arrangement: You Will Not Be Forgiven

Individual songs arranged: Back Hall, Main Theme, Daniel Theme

Links to sources (in order stated above):

Here is this one again. I cut most of the vocal samples, and in the intro section, I added quotations of a more melodic source piece to make the source usage a bit clearer. I also added a new section in the middle. I wanted to touch this one up a bit more, but I can’t open the fucking project file. Ah well, I think it makes the cut anyway.

Sorry about how much of a pain in the ass this breakdown is…Here goes.

Source breakdown:

0:00-1:07 Main Theme, Daniel Theme (The Main Theme tune is pretty abstract, but it has some low melodic lines that I incorporated into the remix. I sprinkled little references to the epic melodies that show up in the Daniel Theme around 2:03. Listen closely at around 0:18 in my remix for an example)

1:07-1:55 Original

1:55-2:19 Back Hall

2:19-3:14 Main Theme, Daniel Theme (This part is supposed to be a reinterpretation of those same low lines from earlier. Note the melody that rises up at 2:50. That’s from the Daniel Theme)

3:14-3:25 Original

3:25-4:49 Daniel Theme (Clear examples from the section of the Daniel Theme that starts at 2:03)

4:49-5:25 Original

5:25-6:19 Back Hall

6:19-End Daniel Theme (Just the chords)

LT EDIT (8/3): I got a more detailed breakdown from Brent:

Hey... Sorry for picking such pain in the ass source tunes. Here is a more detailed source breakdown:

Menu Theme: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShUe_gB-pOY

The ambient intro was supposed to be a reinterpretation of the menu theme, but in practice I ended up really just recreating the vibe. Some of the droning bass parts sort of line up with the low bass melodies from the source tune, but I can't even really remember which parts go where. Later, at 2:19 in the remix, you can sometimes hear that nasty distorted synth match the melodic contour of the bass melody at 0:19 in the menu theme, but honestly that's kind of a stretch too. It seems that the only part where I really unambiguously use anything from the menu theme is the bass part that starts at 2:43 in the remix, which sounds like the bass melody at 0:36 in the source. Maybe there are more clear examples, but It's been so long since I did this stuff that I really can't remember.

Daniel's Theme:

Just in case the remix is still eligible even with such tenuous links to the menu theme, here are all the references I made to the "Daniel's Theme" source tune.

For clarity's sake I'm gonna call the cello part from Daniel's Theme that starts at 2:01 the "First Theme" and I'll call the one that starts at 3:11 the "Second Theme". These are the only parts from Daniel's Theme that I used.

The high melody at 0:18 in the remix corresponds to the Second Theme.

The melody at 0:38 in the remix corresponds to the First Theme.

At about 2:51 in the remix the whistle synth is playing that same melody from the First Theme.

These examples are kind of obscured. I was trying to keep these melodies in the background until they truly "arrive" at 3:26. at 3:26 you first hear the First Theme and it just repeats a while until 4:25, which is transitions into the Second Theme (though I think the rhythm is a little fucked up)

Back Hall:

The sections at 1:55 and 5:25 in the remix are supposed to have the chord progression from this source tune. I think my transcription is a little off. I'm not sure if it's close enough to count or not.

Summing up...

Any part in the remix that isn't mentioned here is original. I guess with the menu theme barely being represented in the remix at all, the whole thing may be ineligible. haha... my bad, I didn't mean to make this thing so hard to follow.

Edited December 15, 2013 by Liontamer
closed decision

[DragonAvenger]

Oof, I listening to this one a lot, and honestly I think there's just not enough in terms of connection for me to call it. I love the atmosphere you've got going on here, and overall the production is pretty solid. It's just stretched too thin in terms of being recognizable. Definitely hope to hear more from you though!

NO

[Vig]

I enjoy this piece but I don't know if I can pass it. I hear some relationships between the remix and the original, but it seems a little tenuous. I also think this remix lacks solid compelling transitions, which is crucial for such a sound-design centered track as this. I'm just not following. I think there are some awesome ideas. which are too spread out, and too sparsely elaborated.

NO

[OceansAndrew]

I really like the direction taken in this, and the removal of the voice samples makes it a lot less cheesy to me, and there are some generally fascinating textures and moods you have created here. I am hearing pretty much the same thing as the other judges, in that the piece is really impressive and well-constructed, but too much original material. I am really digging the style here, and the mood is really creeping me out, but i think the source is too overshadowed by the sound design.

No

[Liontamer]

Thanks for the more thorough breakdown, Brent, I appreciate it. I held this for my vote (sorry for the wait) because I wanted to understand what you did beyond "this is too liberal" and see just how close it was, or if it was WAY off the rails.

Well, the Menu Theme sounds really abstract at first blush, but it's really just 12 slow notes in pretty distinct 3-note patterns (if I have it correct, D-C-D#, D-C-E; E-B-G, E-B-G). Anything that sound like those note patterns should be pretty obvious. Instead, the "usage" of the menu theme if you can call it that, was more about the ambiance, like Brent said. That's unfortunate, because most of the stated usage of Daniel's Theme and Back Hall were there, so using the menu theme in a more straightforward and overt way would have put the source usage over the top.

Based on your breakdown, I was able to time out what I was willing to give credit for:

0:18-0:25 high melody = Daniel's Theme 3:11

0:38-0:48 melody = Daniel's Theme 2:01

1:55.5-2:17.5 = Back Hall

2:31-2:39 - slight but overt variation of D-C-E portion of Menu Theme melody was only recognizable usage

3:26-4:25 = Daniel's Theme 2:01

4:25-4:46 = Daniel's Theme 3:11

5:25-6:15 = Back Hall

6:19.5-6:25.5, 6:31.25-6:37.25 = Daniel's Theme chords - 2 notes of 4-note pattern are from Daniel's Theme 4:04-4:10

[did not count - 2:51 whistle synth = Daniel's Theme 2:01 (disagree, too liberal; notes are too different from source, unlike :38 in the mix)]

Of this 6:52-long track, I could make out source material from:

:18-:25, :38-:48, 1:55.5-2:17.5, 2:31-2:39, 3:26-4:46, 5:25-6:15, 6:19.5-6:25.5, 6:31.25-6:37.25 = 189 seconds or 45.87% overt source usage)

Brent knows the arrangement went a bit too liberal, but the track itself and its overall mood were great. You certainly don't HAVE to revise this any further if you're happy with it, Brent, but if you wanted it posted here, it wouldn't take TOO much more effort to get it passed, IMO. Adding more identifiable source usage of the menu theme (or any other source) during the original sections or wherever could seal the deal. Do your best to bump the source usage above and beyond 50% so that the VGM usage is dominant in the arrangement (per the standards), and you'd be good to go.

NO (resubmit)

Edited December 15, 2013 by Liontamer