Computer Music Textbooks

[Meteo Xavier]

I don't think there's a book out there with the kind of advice you're looking for

Honestly Meteo, there is no book that is going to do what you want. At least I have never seen one and I've looked around quite a bit

not sure there is a bunch of books that will set you on the path.

I'm going to interrupt at this moment because I was about to touch on this anyway, and this is an excellent springboard to it.

This is a recurring theme I keep seeing among posts here, and it's one of the main reasons I keep challenging this idea that there are no books like this, it doesn't look like anyone's actually read a lot of them in the first place. Makes sense to me because they're $40-$100 each, but doesn't make sense to what you guys keep telling me.

In the last couple pages, I've listed more than half a dozen titles. Has anyone actually read them? Not looked over, not browsed through, read. It's ok if not, my point starting this topic out was to update and see if anyone had recently used a more modern book to dispel these long-held ideas. I just cannot believe so many guides on these little things exist throughout the internet, on a booming industry, and yet it's impossible to commit to paper and binding.

Edited January 22, 2014 by Meteo Xavier

[Nabeel Ansari]

If you think the FL Studio Bible will help you write music, by all means, go ahead and buy it.

[ShrackAttack]

I'm going to interrupt at this moment because I was about to touch on this anyway, and this is an excellent springboard to it.

This is a recurring theme I keep seeing among posts here, and it's one of the main reasons I keep challenging this idea that there are no books like this, it doesn't look like anyone's actually read a lot of them in the first place. Makes sense to me because they're $40-$100 each, but doesn't make sense to what you guys keep telling me.

In the last couple pages, I've listed more than half a dozen titles. Has anyone actually read them? Not looked over, not browsed through, read. It's ok if not, my point starting this topic out was to update and see if anyone had recently used a more modern book to dispel these long-held ideas. I just cannot believe so many guides on these little things exist throughout the internet, on a booming industry, and yet it's impossible to commit to paper and binding.

I can almost guarantee you whatever book you read is going to be very general and won't be very advanced. I've read the Complete Guide to Game Audio completely and a good bit of the Guide to Midi Orchestration (I skipped a bunch of the more useless information or stuff I already knew and went straight to the actual sequencing portion) and neither of them do what you want them to do from what I remember. The Game Audio one was a pretty good read though for when I was just starting out and didn't know what I was doing. But it mostly dealt with the business aspect from what I remember and how game audio is evolving, but I read it over 3 years ago so don't quote that .

Any kind of DAW bible isn't going to be any different than videos you can already find on the internet (and they will likely be worse). The only two books I can't speak for are the Hal Leonard ones and MIDI Sequencing Made Easy. Just as an example, I wouldn't be surprised if Argle's Reaper hints/tips thread is more advanced than the Reaper Bible.

Most of these books are made to help the masses get started. You are well past getting started and 95% of the information is going to be useless to you. You might find some random thing you never knew about, but generally they are worthless to you.

I wouldn't be surprised if you find more detailed books in the next 5-10 years, but I haven't seen any out yet as you're generally going to get more book sales if you write something that your average person can just jump into. That Guide to MIDI orchestration book certainly doesn't do that for orchestral music. It is basically just a starter course and it gives you ideas on what to do. Stuff like using expression, volume, breath, mod wheel, layering instruments, etc with a few chapters on orchestration for each section if I recall.

You're wanting someone to write a book on how to achieve that last 10% of quality/creativity in your music and I just don't think you will find it really. All the books I've seen out are how to get that first 50-90% down. That final 10% is usually up to you through a lot of hard work, trial and error, and repetition.

If you happen to find a book that is amazing, let me know, and I will give it a read too.

[timaeus222]

You're wanting someone to write a book on how to achieve that last 10% of quality/creativity in your music and I just don't think you will find it really. All the books I've seen out are how to get that first 50-90% down. That final 10% is usually up to you through a lot of hard work, trial and error, and repetition.

If you happen to find a book that is amazing, let me know, and I will give it a read too.

I said this earlier, but that's something that I started working on a few months ago, so there's something to look forward to. Probably won't be done for another two years or so, but eh, it's on the way, and I'm very excited to work on it with Chimpazilla.

That said, I actually haven't read any actual books on what I learned in the past two years and 9 months. It was either internet articles, experimentation, or the OCR Workshop Forums. The last textbook I read, or book of any sort, on music production was an old textbook from when my sister took music production in the early 2000's. I still have it, but it's definitely way too general for what you're looking for. It's certainly interesting, but you already know about half of it. The other half is like microphone setup, reverb, delay, EQ, etc., but in the sense of helping people get to grips with it rather than the kind of case-by-case application you want to know.

Lest I make the statement that OCR producers and composers have some killer studio chops in comparison to some pop music producers and composers (most pop artists got their fame by connections, marketing, and sheer timing, IMO). If any books are available that show you how to do what you want to do, they'll probably be written by one of us.

Edited January 22, 2014 by timaeus222

[Nabeel Ansari]

https://www.coursera.org/specialization/modernmusician/5

Here, Meteo. This may be of some use.

Lest I make the statement that OCR producers and composers have some killer studio chops in comparison to some pop music producers and composers (most pop artists got their fame by connections, marketing, and sheer timing, IMO). If any books are available that show you how to do what you want to do, they'll probably be written by one of us.

On the contrary, producers of pop music are not usually connected to the music itself. These artists have hired recording/mixing engineers, those who have been working with all sorts of mixing equipment over the last century. These people have much more mixing knowhow than many on OCR, who are mostly gamer-hobbyists (with the exception of our VGM composers and engineers) and have only really worked with their own DAW's in the context of remixing (and mixing to the point of "good for the judge's panel"), and may not even factor knowledge of acoustics and proper signal flow into their mixing. Mixing/engineering is a vast art form in itself, which is why it's a disconnected profession from composition. The move to the "project studio" (all-in-one, composing and producing tools alike) from the traditional studio (artists come at a set time to a dedicated recording building, the parts are recorded and the mixer mixes on a large console) has only become a legitimate option in the past couple decades, and then we saw the rise of home studio composers, who wrote music and also produced/mastered it.

This is a fresh approach to music, and saying people who do it this way are better than dedicated mixing/mastering engineers is not paying any respect to how old mixing music actually is. In fact, if you look at "bad" pop music, just listen to the production; it's very clean and well-done.

Edited January 22, 2014 by Neblix

[Meteo Xavier]

You're wanting someone to write a book on how to achieve that last 10% of quality/creativity in your music and I just don't think you will find it really. All the books I've seen out are how to get that first 50-90% down.

??? When did I say this? It's the first 50%-90% I want so I can go back and look for things to cover my gaps. Hard work and repetition don't do any good if you're missing parts from the first quarter of it. I was also sure I gave up on looking for a DAW bible.

And yes, I may find that Coursera thing useful. I confess some intimidation at it as I look at it, but I have bookmarked it all the same, and may see if it's available and within my budget come Spring.

[timaeus222]

On the contrary, producers of pop music are not usually connected to the music itself. These artists have hired recording/mixing engineers, those who have been working with all sorts of mixing equipment over the last century. These people have much more mixing knowhow than many on OCR, who are mostly gamer-hobbyists (with the exception of our VGM composers and engineers) and have only really worked with their own DAW's in the context of remixing (and mixing to the point of "good for the judge's panel"), and may not even factor knowledge of acoustics and proper signal flow into their mixing. Mixing/engineering is a vast art form in itself, which is why it's a disconnected profession from composition. The move to the "project studio" (all-in-one, composing and producing tools alike) from the traditional studio (artists come at a set time to a dedicated recording building, the parts are recorded and the mixer mixes on a large console) has only become a legitimate option in the past couple decades, and then we saw the rise of home studio composers, who wrote music and also produced/mastered it.

This is a fresh approach to music, and saying people who do it this way are better than dedicated mixing/mastering engineers is not paying any respect to how old mixing music actually is.

Okay. And I would be referring to people like zircon, bLiNd, Joshua Morse, and PrototypeRaptor (among others) when I say "killer studio chops". That said, I honestly strongly believe the judges panel definitely know what they're doing in both arrangement and production.

[Nabeel Ansari]

Okay. And I would be referring to people like zircon, bLiNd, Joshua Morse, and PrototypeRaptor (among others) when I say "killer studio chops". That said, I honestly strongly believe the judges panel definitely know what they're doing in both arrangement and production.

The Judge's Panel standards of production are actually not very high at all. Some wishy washy stuff passes through, and honestly, if they tried to make their production standards match professional standards, it would be impossible for game music lovers who didn't study music tech or have a job in it to get a mix on the site.

That's not to say OCReMixers don't have pro-level production (like I said, "except for our vgm composers and engineers"), but if you look at a lot of recent mixers, especially the newcomers, rising out of the mega man/sonic/whatever competitions and WiP forums (case in point: ME), they're learning everything in the context of feedback on a game remix (not in a professional industry context, where quality is a lot more cutthroat). It is true that a lot of OCReMixers can mix at a professional level, but a real mixing/mastering engineer, with big name projects under his belt, can mix like it's magic.

@Meteo: Coursera is free. Avoid the verified certificate business, just look at the course titles and sign up for them for free.

Edited January 22, 2014 by Neblix

[Argle]

Has anyone mentioned Mixing Secrets For the Small Studio? It's good, check it out. It only deals with mixing though.

[Meteo Xavier]

They have, and I will definitely be getting it. That was the best recommendation so far. What it looks like now is I will be getting that, that Hal Leonard Samples and Loops thing if I can find more info on it, and possibly the Game Audio Essentials by Aaron Marks if he gets back to me today. I contacted him on Facebook and he offered to send me sample sections of it for a preview.

Hopefully, and this was the other real goal of doing this topic, I will be able to digest them and be able to build something of a casual... umm... I don't know if I want to use the word "syllabus" or "curriculum", but something out of that to give other burgeoning computer musicians lacking better access to music knowledge a good head start to getting their shit together for doing this stuff.

[Garrett Williamson]

I figure I either need to hire a private instructor or mentor for improving my DAW music skill (tough luck finding that in East Tennessee), or I need to get back into computer textbooks.

come to Nashville. we've gotcha covered.

[Meteo Xavier]

I ain't driving 4 hours west for that every week.

[timaeus222]

The Judge's Panel standards of production are actually not very high at all. Some wishy washy stuff passes through, and honestly, if they tried to make their production standards match professional standards, it would be impossible for game music lovers who didn't study music tech or have a job in it to get a mix on the site.

That's not to say OCReMixers don't have pro-level production (like I said, "except for our vgm composers and engineers"), but if you look at a lot of recent mixers, especially the newcomers, rising out of the mega man/sonic/whatever competitions and WiP forums (case in point: ME), they're learning everything in the context of feedback on a game remix (not in a professional industry context, where quality is a lot more cutthroat). It is true that a lot of OCReMixers can mix at a professional level, but a real mixing/mastering engineer, with big name projects under his belt, can mix like it's magic.

That's true, though it just means they're being realistic and fair, IMO. After getting my first pass (which actually isn't posted yet), I looked into the production, and it actually did have some flaws, especially because I'm much more objective about my own music than I used to be, but the important thing is, it was surprisingly well-received by Larry, even with those flaws. I'm not going to say the OCR bar is low, but I'm also not going to say it's too high. They're high to beginners and intermediates, but not to those people who have figured out how to be objective with their own music. It actually made me reflect on which flaws I point out at certain times in anyone's music, including mine, are big or not-so-big deals. After that, I actually realized that not everything has to be perfect. If it nearly is, then great, and that's why I'm so picky, yet helpful in intention. Personally though, I do feel the judges, or at least the younger ones (who have a wider frequency range of hearing), like Vig and WillRock, are on par with those "real mixing/mastering engineers", using your wording, but being more lenient and humble about it so that it's not impossible to get a mixpost.

As you learn to mix, eventually it gets to the point where whether or not you dive into the extremes of bass and treble mixing (if you're a perfectionist), and how much, determines how much of an overall perspective you have about "high-level" producers because you start to hear more of a distinction between very subtle aspects of production. Sound design helps in that aspect of distinguishing subtle aspects of production too---in training your ears to like what could sound good to many people. It's kind of out there (I don't really want to call it "exclusive" or "obscure", per se), but if you get serious about the extreme ends of the frequency spectrum, you do get a clearer idea of who has more technical know-how or resources than who when you hear the subtle differences in treble and bass clarity because it would have to mean that they hear it too, and you just have to dial it down a bit to keep your reservations within the realm of what people [who aren't into that] know and to stay modest, basically. Those "real mixing/mastering engineers", I believe, are at that "level", and that "level" is what I believe those OC ReMixers with "killer studio chops" are at, because they're so detail-oriented and meticulous and picky and want to continually improve (like me, apparently, personality-wise; though I'm actually a nice guy), so that's why I think those OC ReMixers at least on par with those professional engineers.

However, although context usually matters, it's what you do with that context that actually matters. Using your example, people who take in others' feedback, whether from compos or workshop, just to get on OCR aren't necessarily heavily influenced by the OCR standards. If those people can step away from conforming to guidelines and get objective about their music, they can get a clearer perspective of what the bar truly is---a "level" where the average listener has no major issues with the music they're presented with. In a sense, and you're certainly right about this, the context of remixing for OCR is, in fact, a barrier to really becoming "professional", and you really only get past that barrier when you can critique your own music to continually get better objectively and of your own accord, like zircon once said on an OCR Talkback, rather than simply to get on OCR. Actually, if you look in the About page on my website, I go into detail on the progression of my music production experiences with months and who helped me and stuff, and eventually you'll see that I start to get independent with my learning; that's approximately when objectivity started for me.

I hope you guys don't take this as sort of a hierarchical statement about OCR; I'm just trying to provide a larger perspective for people to consider and contextualize. Not trying to be arrogant here, either.

Edited January 22, 2014 by timaeus222

[Garrett Williamson]

I ain't driving 4 hours west for that every week.

heh yeah I get it

[Meteo Xavier]

Aaron Mark sent me some samples of his Game Development Essentials: Game Audio book, or whatever it's called, and while I browsed through them and found a few useful tips, they are also more general "guidance" abstracts as opposed to solid information on how to do it. I'll probably get it anyway, or at least try to get a library to special order it, but not what I need know.

On the other hand, I was also able to browse through The Complete Idiot's Guide To Music Composition and, praise the Lord, it is FULL of solid, useful information that I was lacking. I didn't get a chance to really go through it, but man alive, I probably should've gotten that a long time ago.

I believe I will be drawing up an amateur syllabus thing once I get a chance to digest all this information, and either reformat this topic from my personal questing drama into showing off the texts and why they are useful, or at least do another topic on it.

[Argle]

If you read some of these books and can summarize what kind of useful information they provide, I'm sure that will be helpful to others.

[Meteo Xavier]

Undoubtedly. I gave an example from the MIDI Orchestration Guide earlier, but that was one of several goals I had for this topic.

[MockingQuantum]

I can certainly contribute some reviews/examples/thoughts in a little while here; I compulsively pick up computer music books when they're super cheap/used/whatever. Off the top of my head I know I have:

MIDI Orchestration Guide

Music Theory for Computer Musicians

Composing for Computer Musicians

Harmony for Computer Musicians

Dance Music Manual (I know that doesn't quite count)

And a small handful of other, more obscure books that I can't remember the titles of.

[Nabeel Ansari]

On the other hand, I was also able to browse through The Complete Idiot's Guide To Music Composition and, praise the Lord, it is FULL of solid, useful information that I was lacking. I didn't get a chance to really go through it, but man alive, I probably should've gotten that a long time ago.

Just had a look at it myself; I'm surprised you want this book, considering it's a straight-up music theory book and you seemed not so fond of my recommendation of learning music theory earlier in the thread.

Edited January 25, 2014 by Neblix

[Meteo Xavier]

What exactly did you hope to accomplish with a comment like that, 'blix? If all you wanted to say was "our other book recommendations are actually quite similar to this one", I have to wonder why you didn't just say that as opposed to something baiting for more argument.

Moving on.

I can certainly contribute some reviews/examples/thoughts in a little while here; I compulsively pick up computer music books when they're super cheap/used/whatever. Off the top of my head I know I have:

MIDI Orchestration Guide

Music Theory for Computer Musicians

Composing for Computer Musicians

Harmony for Computer Musicians

Dance Music Manual (I know that doesn't quite count)

I actually have the polar two, and the Dance Manual I quite like as well. Tell me about the middle three, please.