The Forest of Melancholy [DKC2][Forest Interlude x Mining Melancholy]

[NyxTheShield]

(Yes, i know i submitted another piece for mod review recently, but i am kinda stuck with that now for now)

Link: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/93823550/The%20Forest%20of%20Melancholy.mp3

Name: The Forest of Melancholy

Sources: Mining Melancholy and Forest Interlude, both from Donkey Kong Country 2

Comments: I consider this one pretty much done arrange wise, maybe a non looping ending ending could be done (But i kinda like loops hahahaha), aside from that i think did arrange, blend and mix both pieces together pretty fine.

[Skrypnyk]

Oof. This has waaay too many ideas going on, sometimes all at once. The first two things that struck me when this first started playing how mechanical and stiff the flute melody is, and how flat and lifeless the bass is.

Then 0:40~ hits and erupted in chaos. There's no focus on anything, everything is just playing what it wants, how it wants.

@ 0:59~, you have some pretty sounds, nice pads, I like the delaying arp synths, but this mix has no idea what it wants to be. Is it ambient? Is it trying to be breakbeat? What is it that you're trying to do? 1:36~ is a rather sloppy transition.

The more I'm listening to this, the more I want to enjoy it, but the lack of direction and strong idea make it difficult. There is certainly potential here, it just needs to be more refined.

[NyxTheShield]

Oof. This has waaay too many ideas going on, sometimes all at once. The first two things that struck me when this first started playing how mechanical and stiff the flute melody is, and how flat and lifeless the bass is.

Then 0:40~ hits and erupted in chaos. There's no focus on anything, everything is just playing what it wants, how it wants.

@ 0:59~, you have some pretty sounds, nice pads, I like the delaying arp synths, but this mix has no idea what it wants to be. Is it ambient? Is it trying to be breakbeat? What is it that you're trying to do? 1:36~ is a rather sloppy transition.

The more I'm listening to this, the more I want to enjoy it, but the lack of direction and strong idea make it difficult. There is certainly potential here, it just needs to be more refined.

I find weird that you find the flute mechanical, i

t's a real flute O-o (Or better said, a recorder lowered one octave)

It didn't explode with "chaos" at 0:40, it builded up until that point, then the 2 sources enter. I don't see it as chaos, you can clearly recognize both sources, the blend between them and notice all the instruments used clearly.

Also, i don't get what are you trying to say about the remix not knowing what it want to "be", the mix is what it is.

[timaeus222]

I find weird that you find the flute mechanical, i

t's a real flute O-o (Or better said, a recorder lowered one octave)

It didn't explode with "chaos" at 0:40, it builded up until that point, then the 2 sources enter. I don't see it as chaos, you can clearly recognize both sources, the blend between them and notice all the instruments used clearly.

Also, i don't get what are you trying to say about the remix not knowing what it want to "be", the mix is what it is.

Though I can't listen to this right now, I think I can figure out what he meant, and maybe you can take another listen and see if you notice these issues this time.

- I'm guessing the flute playing itself was just stiff, as in, it was stilted, or it could use more natural phrasing. If in fact it's actually a real recording, it's already realistic, but the performance was probably just too lacking in natural flow. Maybe find a youtube video of a solo flute performance and listen to how it sounds, paying close attention to slurs, pitch bends, hard/soft blowing, long phrases, etc.

- I'll look into this some more later, but I'm guessing the dynamics didn't portray what you intended up until 0:40 and there is midrange clutter or something at 0:40.

- As for the mix not knowing what it wants to be, that just means the remix is combining incompatible genres, or the structure is strange in that it shifts between an unexpected sequence of genres. Skrypnyk did mention a lack of direction in the arrangement flow.

Edited January 23, 2015 by timaeus222

[Bowlerhat]

Just chipping in really fast: if you 1-up a flute with an octave, then you get a piccolo, not a recorder. There is a distinct difference between a piccolo and a recorder. So if you lower a recorder with one octave, then you don't get a real flute. Which explains why the flute doesn't sound like a flute, but more like an ocarina. Furthermore, after listening to the mix, Timaeus was right about the performance lacking a natural flow. I do like the harmonic choices you made, though. I think the arrangement is pretty cool!

[timaeus222]

Okay, now I'm actually listening to it (looks like it's an old one you've done before).

Yeah, the flute is indeed mechanical, because the notes are detached. Whether you recorded it for real or not, it sounds too stilted as I mentioned earlier, and it's just how you chose to play it that makes it sound stiff. As for the bass, I do agree with Skrypnyk, it doesn't sound like it's contributing much to the soundscape, and it sounds plain with no distinct articulations. It's as if it's a sine wave, but not quite.

At 0:40, I agree again with Skrypnyk that too many things are going on at once. I hear the piano on the right, the flute on the left, the piano on the left, the bass in the center, the metal percussion on the left, the hi hats, snare, kick... wow, that's a lot. I think the pianos need more rhythmic synergy in the partwriting to sound more cohesive and in agreement with each other, and the flute can be more centered at that point (automation?) to let the left piano come through more.

At 1:36, by "sloppy" transition he probably meant the retuned metal percussion; it sounds too artificial. Also, I see what Skrypnyk means by breakbeat. The drum pattern at 1:39, for example, has a lot of snare fills in a row, and is in the style of breakbeat (not to mention it raises the energy of the track, even though there's ambience at that time as well). If you took those snare fills out and made it more plain, it could sound more downtempo and less conflicting in the amount of energy conveyed.

[NyxTheShield]

Okay, now I'm actually listening to it (looks like it's an old one you've done before).

Yeah, the flute is indeed mechanical, because the notes are detached. Whether you recorded it for real or not, it sounds too stilted as I mentioned earlier, and it's just how you chose to play it that makes it sound stiff. As for the bass, I do agree with Skrypnyk, it doesn't sound like it's contributing much to the soundscape, and it sounds plain with no distinct articulations. It's as if it's a sine wave, but not quite.

At 0:40, I agree again with Skrypnyk that too many things are going on at once. I hear the piano on the right, the flute on the left, the piano on the left, the bass in the center, the metal percussion on the left, the hi hats, snare, kick... wow, that's a lot. I think the pianos need more rhythmic synergy in the partwriting to sound more cohesive and in agreement with each other, and the flute can be more centered at that point (automation?) to let the left piano come through more.

At 1:36, by "sloppy" transition he probably meant the retuned metal percussion; it sounds too artificial. Also, I see what Skrypnyk means by breakbeat. The drum pattern at 1:39, for example, has a lot of snare fills in a row, and is in the style of breakbeat (not to mention it raises the energy of the track, even though there's ambience at that time as well). If you took those snare fills out and made it more plain, it could sound more downtempo and less conflicting in the amount of energy conveyed.

I will try to record thw the recorder again then, i really don't find anything wrong with it, but if 2 people said that then maybe i am high lol

The flute it's 100% centered, i may have moved a knob at exporting though, going to check it.

As the transition at 1:36, the previous 40 seconds were to tone stuff down, we came from a part with heavy percussion, to a chill section 40 seconds long, if i didnt add the first drums back at 1:36, then you guys would have complained that part was just a fill, i had to choose one way.

[timaeus222]

As the transition at 1:36, the previous 40 seconds were to tone stuff down, we came from a part with heavy percussion, to a chill section 40 seconds long, if i didnt add the first drums back at 1:36, then you guys would have complained that part was just a fill, i had to choose one way.

Yeah, but you could have done it with a cleaner way. Retuning that percussion in that way sounded like if the same thing were done to vocals, you would get that "slow motion" feel that hip hop producers have used so much. It may appear to sound like a comment based on taste, but I'm not making it based on taste; I'm considering how artificial the tuning is and how it could have been more gracefully accomplished, volume-wise (no offense to you, of course). As it is, the dynamics jumped up from a low point to a high point, and after the transition lowered a little bit from that high point, which seems strange since I would expect it to go from low (previous section) to high (the fill) to higher (next section). I think a smoother way to transition would be to use the hi hats to foreshadow it, and then a snare fill.

Edited January 24, 2015 by timaeus222

[Skrypnyk]

A couple of clarifications:

Listening to the 1:36~ transition again, it doesn't sound as bad as I probably made it out to be. However, here's a section in which you 'should' do something different, have some sort of build, some climatic point to shake the listener a bit, but all you end up doing is throwing the metal drum loop, rev crash and a little arpy synth on top of what's been playing for the last minute and a half. That's sloppy. That's boring. That doesn't keep my interest in the song. Filter the pads out during the 1:20~ section! Mute the bass! Play different notes or something! Excite me!!!

To say this mix 'is what it is' is a cop out to my question. I'm asking you 'What are we having for dessert?' and you're serving me a bowl of brown mush. I don't know what this brown mush is, it isn't tasting like anything I'm familiar with, and I don't want to keep eating it to find out, so what are you serving? What is it that you're trying to present?