*NO* Sonic the Hedgehog 3 'That Freezing Feeling'

[Liontamer]

You know when something just pops into your head and it just doesn't wanna leave? That's exactly what happened. Once I was browsing through the Project Chaos thread and I noticed Ice Cap was still free after a long time. The original track just stuck in my mind, and I started to develop some ideas for it. The hardest part actually was to make these ideas into actual music.

So, after some time, here's what I got. A piano solo arrangement, a completely different pace from the original, and quick cameos of two other Sonic themes. I hope you enjoy listening to it as much as I did composing it.

Link: http://hetcenus.vgpiano.com/TFF.mp3

Remixer Name: Hetcenus

User ID: 22065

Real Name: Jefferson Elbert

E-mail: hetcenus@yahoo.com.br

Website: http://hetcenus.vgpiano.com

Song Name: That Freezing Feeling

Source Tunes:

Ice Cap - Sonic the Hedgehog 3 - Sega Genesis

Volcano Valley - Sonic 3D Blast - Sega Genesis

Scrap Brain - Sonic the Hedgehog - Sega Master System (soundtrack at http://www.zophar.net/vgm/sonic.zip)

Note: This track is part of the Project Chaos. Please, if it hits the panel before the project's release and gets accepted, hold it until the project is also released.

LT EDIT (9/10): I had no idea what the formal breakdown of the sources was, so I PMed Jefferson for the info:

Right, the themes... Ice Cap is the main theme, as you probably noticed. The other two themes only make quick cameos, so yes, my bad, I should have made it clear when they are used. So:

1) Half of the Scrap Brain theme melody is used as right hand line at 2:10 - 2:43;

2) This is even less clear. If you notice the second part of the Volcano Valley theme, both acts (under the chord progression Db, Eb C, Db, Db, Eb, F), there's a background lead that plays a wonderful melody (I think it definitely should be louder so people could notice it, I only did when analysing the MIDI XD), and I used this melody as the left hand, together with a variation of the Ice Cap theme in the right hand, at 2:43 - 3:15;

Just stating again that the Volcano Valley theme I used is from the Genesis version, the same as LeeBro's 'Blissful Eruption'.

Any further questions, I'm always here to answer.

[Malcos]

Oooh piano. As everyone knows, Icecap zone is a very popular tune and at OCR we have some very good ReMixes of it posted. Only a very different Icecap mix can make it through the panel. Not always easy to work out straight away what song is being played though, as it just flows from one theme to the next. Should so many tunes have been all put together? This is primarily an Icecap zone mix, but I can't hear the Icecap melody in here. That definitely is the issue for me. The chord structure in the beginning is similar to Icecap, but where is it's melody?

NO

[Liontamer]

http://project2612.org/download.php?id=61 - "IceCap Zone 1"

http://www.zophar.net/vgm/sonic.zip - "Scrap Brain Zone" (:37-:50 of the source, 2:10-2:43)

http://project2612.org/download.php?id=58 - "Volcano Valley Zone 1" (countermelody of :36-1:05 of the source, 2:43-3:15)

Even if you list your source tunes in order in the sub letter, it helps to explicitly state as such in the letter, otherwise it makes the track more difficult to evaluate. It's definitely difficult to figure out how you portioned out everything here. I'll have to follow up on it. Next time though, spell out how you used all of the source material.

Piano opening things up was pretty loud. Decently liberal arrangement of the base of the IceCap theme to intro things.

:58 gets into some delicate stuff, although like Malc, I was also wondering where the IceCap melody is. Anyway, "Volcano Valley Zone" came into play nicely at 2:10. That's about the only thing I recognize from what you've listed. I guess the SMS version of Scrap Brain is before, but I don't even recognize it here when listening to the original.

The stuff at 3:52 as an arrangement of IceCap is bordering on too liberal. Might not be enough Sonic 3 overtly in this one to even qualify for Project Chaos, let alone to be credited under that game.

Though it didn't simply sound poor, the piano sequencing/production was noticeably unrealistic. Unfortunately, the performance dynamics were choppy and rigid, so they need some additional refinement to achieve a more natural sound and flow; good job so far though. I'd love to hear JJT or zircon assess this one from a performance standpoint.

EDIT (9/10): Yeah, I definitely wasn't piecing the connections well when I initially voted on this one, my apologies. Thanks to Jefferson for the source tune breakdown, as well as Vig for making sure we had an opportunity to reexamine the arrangement.

I dunno why I wasn't connecting that IceCap arrangement; it's pretty apparent and very creatively handled to boot. The rhythm change completely threw me off beforehand, but now that I recognize it I love the interpretation there. Even the very beginning was itself an arrangement of the IceCap Zone's introduction.

The cameo uses of the other two source themes were extremely well integrated within the IceCap arrangement. On the arrangement side, the concept is definitely a strong pass.

However, looking back up top... ^

Though it didn't simply sound poor, the piano sequencing/production was noticeably unrealistic. Unfortunately, the performance dynamics were choppy and rigid, so they need some additional refinement to achieve a more natural sound and flow; good job so far though. I'd love to hear JJT or zircon assess this one from a performance standpoint.

I'm sure zirc will be able to better appreciate the arrangement side of this one with your additional info, Jeff. But the really crucial points he made below were regarding the performance quality. Stuff like the ending at 4:47 where it ends gently then has a REALLY fake pounding of the keys just sounded very unrefined. That's just the most glaring example.

Work on providing additional complexity for each hand's part in the mix, and hit the ReMixing forum far and wide to research how to achieve a more natural-sounding performance.

NO (refine/resubmit)

[Vig]

I'm hearing the icecap melody all through the second minute of the song, i dont know why you guys cant hear it. there it is again at 2:45.

guys.

there is ice cap all over this track.

The stuff at 3:52 as an arrangement of IceCap is bordering on too liberal.

what on earth makes you say that? it's fairly straightforward. I think if you find that particular section to be too liberal, you need to redefine your standards.

Are you guys sure you've heard the icecap theme before? cause really it's quite recognizable in this track.

I don't want to cause any trouble.

Just want to reitterate the fact.

I would normally vote NO because i find the performance to be completely flat, but i have to give it a YES because frankly the two previous votes are rather off-base and I'm unwilling to let this thread lock without hearing some more reasonable opinions.

[zircon]

I have to agree with Vig on the arrangement. There is definitely some Ice Cap in there. I recognize parts of the melody in about four or five different parts of the song, some more obvious than others, and the chord progression is present in its original or slightly varied form in a few spots too. However, with that being said, I think the arrangement is overly liberal. I wasn't hearing much of a connection to the two OTHER themes cited (aside from the brief cameo of the Volcano one). It feels to me like this is more of an original tune inspired by some Sonic themes rather than a ReMix which starts with the source and branches off from there (a rearrangement, which is what OCR is all about).

Now, that being said, if the technical side of the mix was really amazing, that might counteract the arrangement issue I have here. But that is not the case, unfortunately. The dynamics are very unrealistic. I don't know a lot of piano pieces written OR performed in this manner. Heavy playing is acceptable provided it is counterbalanced with material that is much lighter. I'm not hearing enough of that contrast here. There's also the problem of the sequencing, which is fairly mechanical in nature - especially in the left hand. This makes the heavy parts seem even heavier, and the soft parts seem plodding. That's bad.

Additionally, I don't find the writing for either hand to be really interesting. The left hand doesn't change much - it's just arpeggios in the same rhythmic pattern over and over, except towards the end where it gets SLIGHTLY more interesting (but still a reliance on arpeggios). I know it can be hard to write interesting left hand parts, but it IS possible. The right hand is also not really explored fully. It's typically playing only one note at a time, maybe two at most. What's the deal? Try exploring the use of chords in the right hand more, grace notes, trills, tremolos, rhythms outside the time signature... anything to make it more engaging. One note at a time in simplistic rhythms is very basic and very boring.

All things considered, I don't think this is all that far from our bar. You did some very nice arrangement of the Ice Cap theme. I was impressed. If you could ground more of the ReMix in the themes, touch up the production, and rethink the voicing in both hands, I think you'd have a very good shot of passing.

NO resubmit

[Liontamer]

Been a while. Malc & zirc should probably revote, given the new information we've had from the artist.

[DarkeSword]

While the arrangement is pretty interesting and quite liberal, sometimes I have trouble hearing the non-icecap sources. Only a few instances of Volcano Valley and Scrap Brain.

In any case, the left-hand arpeggios get really old really fast; left-hand part writing is really boring save for a few instances. The performance is also pretty flat, as Vig said.

NO

[Vig]

I'm hearing the icecap melody all through the second minute of the song, i dont know why you guys cant hear it. there it is again at 2:45.

guys.

there is ice cap all over this track.

The stuff at 3:52 as an arrangement of IceCap is bordering on too liberal.

what on earth makes you say that? it's fairly straightforward. I think if you find that particular section to be too liberal, you need to redefine your standards.

Are you guys sure you've heard the icecap theme before? cause really it's quite recognizable in this track.

I don't want to cause any trouble.

Just want to reitterate the fact.

I would normally vote NO because i find the performance to be completely flat, but i have to give it a YES because frankly the two previous votes are rather off-base and I'm unwilling to let this thread lock without hearing some more reasonable opinions.

Larry fixed his vote, and we've heard from some other judges. I'm satisfried. changing my vote to NO for aformentioned reasons.

Good start however, and I look forward to future tracks from you.

[zircon]

I reiterate my NO vote. While the source tune breakdown was helpful in connecting the other two originals, I still feel like the arrangement is on the "overly liberal" side. However, it's the rigidity of the performance and somewhat plain writing that pushes this one below our bar. I think that should be your first priority if you plan on resubbing this.

[Liontamer]

Project Chaos is out, so this vote is released. Since we couldn't ask for one beforehand (at the risk of having the track kicked off the project by Snap , I'd like to stress the panel consensus for a resubmission. This is very promising stuff, Jefferson, so definitely revist it down the line.