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I stated group PVP for a reason. As soon as a rogue starts attacking one target in PVP, he ends up marked, DOTed, and feared. If he is lucky. If that does not happen then your server sucks for PvP. Rogues have had constant nerfs, and it is apparent you have never played one to not see them. Stealth, both in PVE and PVP has been nerfed to the point that versus some mobs (Dogs in BRD and ghouls in strat for example) you are safer unstealthed. In PvP now, at level 60, with 5 rank MoD, a hunter could still see me 20 yard away. I'm also a NE. 5 rank MOD should mean "nearly impossible to detect." It should not mean "hey a hunter" Mark, Sting, Pet, FD Ice trap. It used to be that I could fall without breakin stealth, now I get 1 damage from falling I break stealth. Mages used to be incapacitated when they were cheapshotted, now they can blink. Weapon speed used to influence instant attacks, not it has been standardised for the worse. If there is an AoE silence, I break stealth. If there is a slowing totem, I break stealth. If I resist a Arcane Explosion Rank 1, I break stealth. If a ennemy warrior uses a battleshout next to me, I break stealth. If a hunter uses multishot, I get hit and break stealth. If a shammy uses chain lightening, I break stealth. Itemisation for rogues just plain suck. Fist weapons are non-existent until MC (I originally wanted to be a fist weapon rogue), good maces can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Good swords are rare in end game. When a rogue has Dal Rend, he will be stuck with those until MC is in farm status. The sword set in ZG is crappy for sword rogues, dal rend outdps it by a wide margin. And when Blizz will notice that, they will probably nerf it badly. Daggers, pre ZG, are worth nothing. The only good option has been nerfed by the attack speed standardisation. Our damage only marginally scales with gear. What we mostly gain is AP, but it is at the cost of HP. I almost lost 700 life since I left cadaverous for SC. And while, yes, we do gain some damage, 1 agility = 1 AP 1 str=1AP. Instead of warriors: 1 Str = 2 AP, or hunters 1 Agi = 2 AP. If we focus on agility gear, we end up like my rogue, 800 ranged SP (Because in ranged, 1 agi = 2 AP) and 600 melee AP. Rogue DPS increases basically only by the DPS increase of his weapon times 1.5. If he is lucky. A good item usually has something like +13 agility +7 str. Meaning +20 AP, or +1.2 DPS. A good item enchant (lets take Frozen Wrath on a level 60 item) is about +23 damage on frost spells. Frost bolt takes what? 1.5 second to cast? 2 seconds? Even at a 3 second cast, that frozen wrath item will give a +7.6 DPS upgrade. That is damage not mitigated by armor. Eviscerate, the best burst damage finishing move, is mitigated by armor and unmodified by attack power. At level 56, with a gray mainhand dagger, and entirely naked, a rogue can do as much eviscerate damage as a level 60 in all epics, using thunderfury. Speaking of aggro breaking: Rogues Feint: 7 second cooldown, can be blocked, dodged, parried, missed, or resisted, melee range only. Feint death (hunter skill) can only be resisted, usable at any range. Priests, Fade, can only be resisted. Mages, Ice Block, talent ability, cannot be resisted. Vanish, 5 minute cooldown, needs a regent, needs the rogue to not have DOTs. Also, will increase aggro on stealth breaking mobs. Funny story about how stealth increases aggro. In Strat, our hunter pulls a lone ghoul. I stand between the ghoul and the hunter, ready to cheapshot it to "protect" the mail wearing hunter. The hunter, which is currently attacking the ghoul, loses aggro to ME, a stealthed rogue. Many mobs will stop when running to the aggroer, whack me once, and then start running again, negating my stealth advantage. If I dont put myself in a good position, I will miss the first part of the fight. If I do, I get cheated out of my strenght. Our energy bar. I cannot spam SS like mages can spam AE, simply because sinister strike uses up 40 energy a strike, meaning that it is instant, but that I need 4 seconds to restore that energy. Backstab uses 65. Meaning 6.5 seconds to regain that energy, Recently, some good rogue builds had been made. They depended on weapon swap for a good ambush followed by a sword style combat. Now we have a 1 second global cooldown following weapon swaps. Try playing a rogue, maybe you will read patch notes differently. Over the last year, we have been nerfed at every patch.

Priest I can see have a slight damage ability added for Holy and Discipline, with a bit more utility thrown in Shadow. Rogues... Well... rogues... we have a lot of very small and very annoying issues. Mainly how every time a cloth is buffed, it is made harder for us to kill them. We are supposed to be caster killers but we have no defenses against them... that is probably my biggest issue. The other is that at first, rogue had a roguish style. We were the assassins. Killers that went unseen. Then people complained about how dangerous a rogue was. And we got condemned to being "DPS in Leather." I think blizzard, for rogues, has to solve some problems: Raid/Group PVE utility. Redefine our PVP role. SOLVE THE ITEMIZATION IMBALENCE. Stop the abusive nerfing because we used our abilities. Seriously, some people complained that "a rogue killed them when they were at half life." I don't complain every god damned time a priest mind controls me and throws me in the lava. If we, as rogues cannot use our abilities, then warriors should not wear armor and mages should not cast spell. As such, Rogues may need many small adjustments, but the class would benefit from a complete overhaul. If stealth cannot be our main weapon anymore, then give us mail, magic resistance, and some kind of group buff.

Hooray!---erm, I mean, dammit, Blizzard just doesn't know when to stop, do they? ... ::cough cough:: <=== Rogue. <<; And the big red arrow that humps your head. Hunters that go "wah wah nerf" make me laugh. DoTs no longer break aspect of the cheetah/pack. Priests and warlocks will no longer be able to stop you should you want to run away.

I got some flak in my guild for a stupid reason related to loot. Hell, I still get bitched by that one druid. We did UBRS, I got Rend's main hand, I know, no biggy, and then the skinner dropped at the beast. We have no rule against getting more than one blue, and we have a rule stating that an upgrade is good for the guild. So I rolled on the skinner. I rolled a 100, and the druid, only other skinner, rolled a 92. Naturally it was mine. I asked twice if I could take it, they said ok, so I grabbed it. Then they tell me I was greedy. It's kinda annoying that the people who support the "upgrading a guildy is good" rule don't like it when it applies to something they also want.

Errr... Sacred Charge and Fickle's Skinner acquired... Ok ok, means nothing...

Most of that content was found by sifting through databases. Also test realms are usually populated with hardcore gamers who probably have been farming BWL for a while and want to see the next challenge. The elite of all servers grouped into one spot, all wanting to complete the instance to have a strong strategy wor when it becomes live. I think that's why they went through it real fast.

Backstab rank 9 before a new SS rank...

Kinda primed about that 58dps swords... And that mace for druids on page 7 is abusively good.

AQ loot is being linked more and more: http://mammae.org/images/1.9/1.9Loot_page1.jpg change the pages to look around.

They need it. Paladins never seem to realize how overpowered they are, and Blizzard has just been giving them buffs 'til now. They're like warriors, with healing abilities that outdo any priest. If one level 60 Paladin can take on a level 56 hunter, a level 45 mage, a 43 druid, and a level 30 warrior all at the same time (trust me, I've seen this happen multiple times with slightly varying numbers), you definitely know you need a bit of fixing there. 'Sides, it's not just Paladins getting nerfs. Every class has been getting them lately... it's part of Blizzard's "balancing" campaign (though they did buff the hell out of hunters and druids in the process). Play a pally. A green mob can take up to one minute to kill...

Nope.

yeah' date=' it's almost up to 2 gigs of patches.[/quote'] ... ... I'm never gonna get to play this game The patches are worth it. The game has gained 3 high end dungeons (instances) a ton of new items, abilities, and npcs, 3 battlegrounds, and 1 new area entirely. Only complaint is that all of this is packed into MPQ files, and that unpacked, it would take about 12 gig... I would love to have a good enough computer to actually play it with everything unpacked.

yeah, it's almost up to 2 gigs of patches.

The official talent preview is not out yet.

Huzzah, one more is joining the cult.

That whole promotion is: Get someone to play and we give you a discount on your next couple of months. It's a great way to make more cash for them.

No. It's actually a level 70 item planed for burning crusade. It's a drop off of illidan. It's somewhere in the item sets on your wow files, if you know where to look, you can find it. Anyway, whenever I read about good rogue swords, all I hear is "Hunter swords. if I DW them with +15 agility, they will be great." To which I usually want to reply while screaming: "Just dual wield two letter openers with +15 agility."

Even items in developpment are crappy for rogues: http://wow.allakhazam.com/item.html?witem=18582 Ultimate one hander and the stat it buffs the most is intel. Freaking hunters.

Sword rogue. If only the hakkar main hand was 2.7 and not 1.7...

For my first ZG, we downed Snake dude, Bat girl, and Raptor mounted guy before I had to log off. Which means it was a good run, I got some good rep, and some DKPs. No rogue oriented drops, but hey, rogues... like blizz cares about them.

Yeah, it's a guild run. They used to get far in it, but that was teamed up with another guild. Tonight is more of an exploratory first run. If we get people signed up for it. (Have you looked at what I posted higher? I wanna know your opinion on the math I did concerning warblade versus Dal Rend.

I get out of work at 5. I finish eating supper at 6, 6:30... I get on, and then lets say I am lucky, and invites start at 6:30. By 7:30, we are ready to leave. At 8, we start the instance. At 11, I have to go to bed because I need to sleep because I don't want to sleep at work, just on the off chance that I actually have to do something.

... Why Blizzard WHY? Why do you make instances longer to make them "challenging?" It's not like we get rewards for the hardest parts: Getting a group. And it's not like most of the people who have a job can realisticly do ZG on a work night. Why do you make it so hard on us? I am tired of doing UBRS. I am tired of Strat. But I can't do a whole ZG run simply because you think it smart to make it be 4 freaking hours long. /cry.

Also, I posted this on my guild's forum, but I wanted your insight:

This information has been passed on to my guild, as we are to attemp ZG for the first time in a while (well, for them, I have never been to ZG...)