Liontamer Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Original Decision Link Contact Information Blackhole Erik McClure http://www.blackspherestudios.com 41173 Submission Information Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards 0² (Zero Two) - Jun Ishikawa (Resubmission) After several weeks of debate, I have decided to give this another shot. To quote my original submission, "I've heard several remixes of this famous boss battle song floating around on youtube, but one remix in particular caught my ear. It was called "Revenge of Zero Two" by fairuzonss, and it completely diverged from the original song, creating its own unique interpretation. Inspired by this, I tried to combine elements of both the remixes and the original song." In response to the judge critiques, I fixed the string timing, and to answer a common question, the strings are not supposed to sound particularly authentic, since I feel that is part of the charm of both the original and fairuzonss' remix. I humanized the second and third piano sections, and made a lot of subtle adjustments throughout the mix. The bass on the huge drum was cut down considerably to try and avoid muddying the mix, and the dynamics were very slightly adjusted. In short, lots of small changes, hopefully fixing several minor issues, but nothing drastic, since the judges didn't seem to think any major changes were necessary. Original Judge Decision Thread: http://ocremix.org/forums/showthread.php?t=32854 -- Sincerely, Erik McClure Source: "fairuzonss" Arrangement (not actually by fairuzonss; stolen, with true title & credit unknown): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OceansAndrew Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Hellz yes. I love this track and am really happy you decided to give it another shot. I think the string attack is much better now, and the realism of the sound isn't an issue for me, so that base is covered. The piano sounds more humanized, and thins overall are clear and full of energy. The compression is a touch too much, and the piano sound itself could be improved, but as a whole, the arrangement carries this. Nice resub. Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonAvenger Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Agreeing with Andrew. The fixes are great here, and while everything isn't sounding super real, I think it works as a whole. YES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halc Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 never heard the original sub, but I'm not totally sold on the production here. felt really stiff and mechanical to me (despite the writing being fine), and a tad overcompressed. the sounds are a little vanilla and lack realism. I'm prodding pretty hard, though; it's not bad by any stretch, and certainly shows some skill, but minor issues do add up. that said, you've picked an excellent source, and crafted a nice, energetic arrangement of it. the percussion definitely is a strong point. all in all, I think the arrangement makes up for the production shortcomings, so I'm comfy enough to call it a pass. biggest problem for me was the stiff sequencing, so hopefully we will see some improvement in your next sub! YES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palpable Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Dunno, still not entirely feeling this one. It's been a while since I heard the last version, but this seemed to have a lot of the problems I mentioned last vote. It's on the overcompressed side, there's not much room for the song to breathe. I'm not crazy about the fake string being used as a lead. I now understand that you weren't trying for a realistic string sound; in that case, I'd say it's not strong enough to use as a lead. Sorry, but I think that the fine arrangement is not making up for the production issues. NO (resubmit) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vig Posted October 15, 2011 Share Posted October 15, 2011 Wow the source gave me a headache. Three seconds in to your remix I can already tell I'm going to like it way more than the original. It sounds really clean. Love the clarity in the high end. Nice piano sound. Not loving the strings. Rather awkwardly written and mixed. Why is the most prominent part of the song a string part that plays nothing but half-notes? It sounds stapled on and really not...good. Listen, I love the groove and your general atmosphere, but you've really got to do something about your lead writing and probably that string sound. NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liontamer Posted October 31, 2011 Author Share Posted October 31, 2011 The opening beats sounded a little weak, but as everything came in, the textures filled out well enough. Wow, super rigid fakey piano, much in the style of a lot of Eastern arrangements. The strings are also not very realistic, but they have some nice body to them and the style is purposeful, albeit not pulled off as well as it could be. The production is nice overall and lends a nice spacey quality to everything. Weird instrument cameo at 2:35. What was the point of that? It just sounded dissimmilar to the mood of the rest of the song. Luckily there wasn't any more of that. I'm definitely on the fence here. The piano and string are so rigid, and the mechanical piano definitely sounded weaker around 3:10 for the finish, making me wish it hadn't have been brought back without some further refinement. Vig had me laughing about the string writing being nearly all super rigid half-notes. I like what I'm hearing and can definitely be OK with this being posted as is. I wanted to go YES, but deep down I can't justify it and feel comfortable with that with the execution as is. The mechanical strings coupled with the mechanical piano are a little too much for my blood, the strings being a lot more problematic than the piano. If everything hadn't come back for another go at 2:38, I probably could have lived with it, but it's not a short piece, so you really have to be comfortable listening to 3 1/2 minutes of super mechanical instruments and not be thrown off by it. Don't change a thing about the arrangement itself, just refine the articulations a bit. Even if the overall sound of the piano and strings is still the same, the articulations can be refined some in order to not stick out like a sore thumb as they're doing now. Since they're your leads and so prominent, it's difficult to get past. Good luck with the rest of the vote, and I hope we hear more from you either way, Erik, this is a solid arrangement. NO (refine/resubmit) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emunator Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 I remember when this one was first rejected, I sincerely hoped for a chance to hear it since O2's theme is in DESPERATE need of some mixing love, and fortunately this delivers! It's a production powerhouse with some absolutely beastly drum writing, and a very cool arrangement overall. I haven't heard the original submission so I'm taking this on an as-is basis, but reading over some of the older comments, this version seems to have almost the opposite problem with the strings. Now, they feel way too mechanical and sound way more like a synth lead than any sort of organic instrument. I can see why you'd choose to go with them instead of a bona-fide synth sound, since the string tone does fit with the epic soundscape. But, I'm not going to lie, it's definitely the weakest aspect of the track, as well. The piano feels fairly humanized and works for the track, but again the tone and sequencing is a bit unrealistic (and mixed a little quietly at times, too.) I've thought a lot about this, and in the end I feel like it comes down to a matter of personal preference - the unrealistic sequencing on the strings (and, to a lesser extent, the piano) still bothers me, but at least this seems to fix any timing issues that might have been present earlier. They don't sound bad in the mix overall, they just don't sound like well-sequenced strings, either. If the rest of the mix weren't rock-solid, I think I'd be inclined to go with a NO (resub), but because the soundscape, arrangement, and production is so amazing, I think the good parts of the song outweigh the weaker aspects. I'm gonna cite the decision on Ziwtra's 'Seasons' mix as a precedent, which also had a fantastic arrangement that featured even weaker-sequenced samples than this mix, but still made it past the panel okay. It's something to definitely watch out for and hopefully improve in your future submissions, but fortunately for everyone involved in the submission process, OCR's guidelines don't stipulate perfection from every mix Great work, I think people will enjoy this! YES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liontamer Posted April 26, 2023 Author Share Posted April 26, 2023 I'm sorry to Erik for ethering his track in the unending void of nothingness that is "What the fuck do we do with this?" as I know he was justifiably mad about this never going up, he likely assumed this was rejected after the fact, and I'm sure he's long since moved past enjoying this dozen-year-old piece; the disrespect he felt in how this was handled, without any urgency or communication, is 100% exclusively my fault. I'm listening through again a dozen years later, surprised that no fan or community ever had the piece of the puzzle on who actually made the "fairuzonss" arrangement this was based off of, and believe me, I definitely tried. My best guess is that it's a doujin scene piece that was lifted, but maybe a true Kirby music diehard has information that I couldn't find. Typically, when an artist bases their work off of another fan arrangement (in the case of this, the tempo, some of the dynamics & structure, some core beat-writing), it of course needs to stand apart enough from that initial rendition (which this version does), and we'd also like to obtain an OK from that other arranger and formally co-credit them, especially in this case where significant enough aspects of the initial arrangement were retained. But unless someone IDs who really made quote-unquote "fairuzonss' The Revenge of Zero Two", we just can't 100% close the loop on it, and the initial arrangement is still mainly known from its dishonest artist credit and title. (If the initial arrangement's true artist is uncovered one day, we'll reach out to that person and credit them accordingly.) Age notwithstanding, Erik's arrangement of an arrangement passed the bar at the time, and after unintentionally punishing him over a technicality that wasn't his choosing, we'll post it, and maybe we'll subsequently have the luck of also unearthing who was behind the original arrangement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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