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Cool/interesting chord progs, scales, cadences, etc.


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That's definitely true in classical theory, but in jazz theory, that's not the case at all. A lot of those add notes aren't resolved until the next chord or even at all, but in classical theory, at least as I understand it, a non-chord tone is usually resolved during the chord it is sounded with.

oh yeah absolutely. i have zero background in jazz theory though so i could not even attempt to speak to that. i was just responding to what i thought was a point about horizontal vs. vertical approaches to interpretation. i think that there are times when it makes sense to understand sonorities instantaneously, but it's also important to consider the bigger picture. otherwise we end up with an approach to music that is just stacking lego blocks on top of each other. :P

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Theory is theory, correct. But in Jazz you are actively using theory while you play, whereas in classical it is mostly an analytical tool. This is why I find most of the jazz guys are up way more on theory than a lot of classical guys. Now of course theres a lot of theory used in classical that jazz doesn't even touch but thats getting into some heavy stuff.

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in Jazz you are actively using theory while you play, whereas in classical it is mostly an analytical tool.

you keep saying this and i wonder what you mean by that. are you including just general notation practice in your definition of "jazz theory"? because realistically classical theory shouldnt be any less applicable to performance/interpretation than jazz theory.

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The big difference is of course improvisation. If you improvise sections in classical music (or any other genre), there is no real difference regarding theory.

Except that styles of music other than jazz are generally more accessible to people who use their own homebrew intuitive kind of theory.

Just noticed that the thread title contains "scales". What do you guys think about learning scales and their correlation w/ chords extensively?

Imho, it's a kind of double edged sword. It's a good tool like anything else in theory, but it seems a lot of players sort of become slaves to basing all their playing around scale runs. It's like a phase people have to go through, and some never quite seem to emerge from it.

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The big difference is of course improvisation. If you improvise sections in classical music (or any other genre), there is no real difference regarding theory.

Except that styles of music other than jazz are generally more accessible to people who use their own homebrew intuitive kind of theory.

all improvisation requires is an understanding of harmony and motive which is equally important in performing music which is entirely notated. (eg. fugues)

Just noticed that the thread title contains "scales". What do you guys think about learning scales and their correlation w/ chords extensively?

Imho, it's a kind of double edged sword. It's a good tool like anything else in theory, but it seems a lot of players sort of become slaves to basing all their playing around scale runs. It's like a phase people have to go through, and some never quite seem to emerge from it.

it can also be useful to think of scales not as predetermined objects but as a way to define the collection of pitches being used at any given time (eg. the diatonic collection, the pentatonic collection, etc.). an awareness of pitch and interval relationships at the abstract level can help you come up with both harmonic variety and a greater degree of coherence.

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it can also be useful to think of scales not as predetermined objects but as a way to define the collection of pitches being used at any given time (eg. the diatonic collection, the pentatonic collection, etc.). an awareness of pitch and interval relationships at the abstract level can help you come up with both harmonic variety and a greater degree of coherence.

That goes without saying, it's how scales should be used. It's just that there's always a phase of turning the learned thing into a fetish before you learn to abstract from it. And some seemingly don't progress much in the abstraction department.

I keep coming back to this indian music mantra: 7 years to learn it, 7 years to forget it, and then the playing really starts.

The numbers don't matter, but there is that general pattern of using newly learned stuff in a left-brained way that can be detrimental to your artistic expression, until it gets fully integrated into your language and you can use it only to get across what you wanna say.

It's really the same with learning all languages. You jerk off a lot with all them fancy terms before you realise substance is more important.

Maybe i keep repeating this cause it's a lesson for myself XD

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Anyone have any other interesting discoveries they want to share? I don't want the thread to be too cluttered up with theory debates, no offense :P

Sorry mate. I can get a little addicted to meta bullshit.

I'll post something interesting when i can remember any of it.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just a nice jazz progression which starts on C major, modulates to F major and back to C again.

Cmaj7(9) Eb7sus4(9) - Abmaj7(9) Dbmaj7(9) - Gbmaj7(9) Bmaj7(9) - Cmin7b5 F7(b9)

Bbmin7(9) A7(9,#11) - Abmin7(9) Db7(9,13) - Gmin7b5 C7(#9,b13) - Fmaj7(9)

Fmin7 Bb7(13) B7(9)

You can listen to it here: http://tindeck.com/listen/dgvo

I looped it 4 times, 2x two feel and 2x walking bass.

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