Inv1ctus Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 ok so i dont know if im allowed to do this or not, but im posting my song thats currently being judged right now. Game: Final Fantasy 10 Song: People of the North Remix name: The Wisdom of Gagazet The reason i am posting this song, is after getting a lot of input on this site, i think it might be rejected after understanding the standards of the judges. Since that may be the case, i was hoping to get some input about the song so i can preemptively start working on it. I know ive got 2 other mixes in the works, but this song really takes precedence. If you listen to it i think youll understand why. Ok that being said, to me this is not just any song, and requires a little bit of background explanation. When i first heard this song i always loved it. In fact it burned itself into my memory quite permanently, to the point where i made up counter melodies to it in my head. It came to the point where i had to re-make it. Originally i remixed this as a drum and bass song a few years ago. However, it seemed like such a powerful song, that it needed to be more. Ive slaved over this song for a long long time, and its probably the best song ive ever written, or will write. Ok, this part you wont understand (well maybe if you hear the song). It makes me feel one with the universe. It makes me feel connected to everything. Its almost like my piece of enlightenment. It makes me love this world and all in it. It makes me want to wish happiness for every person on this planet. It makes me want to pick up those who have fallen on the walk of life and carry them the rest of the way. To stand triumphant and awestruck together at the crest of the first horizon. Ok, im sure that sure that sounds really fucking cheezy to some people but i dont care. I have infinite emotional attachment to this piece. ANYWAY, the reason it is here, like i said, is it could probably use some work. IE, my usual EQ, bass and velocity problems. So, if anyone has specific gripes on what i should work on, please do. I want this song to be perfect in every way. It simply has to be. The Wisdom of Gagazet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephfire Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I recall feeling similar affection for this source tune. It led to probably the best remix I'll ever do, and I can only hope the same for you. It's a bit late for me to write in length, but I'd personally love to hear a bit more reverb on some of the strongs in there. Not much, just a pinch. They feel a tad dry. Same with that rapid high piano a minute or so in and especially the string stabs that follow after. The piano after 4:00 is a bit "shrill" too. The percussion, however, is really nice. I wish I could manage nice subtle percussion like that without going overboard. Good luck with the judges. Sorry I'm not being much help. It's getting late here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Intro- The beginning string sample is extremely exposed because it's by itself. Nothing past this point really has to do with technical sound, cuz I'm listening on crappy headphones: Once more instruments start coming in, it gets a lot better. The ethnic drums add a crap load to the feel. The violin detaches are perfect. So far, up to 1:16, very high energy. The piano is a good add-on. Finally, the chord change I've been waiting for at 1:32. It sounds good. The bass and violin parts don't sound very connected in what they play. Try to carefully overlap the notes so everything sounds more legato. I know you're thinking "I don't really want legato in this type of mood", but it will add to the epic soaring feeling. If you add slow crests in the bass dynamics at this part between softs to highs and back again, it will really bring the soaring feeling out and make things sound a lot more connected. 1:55- Just realized I don't have any gripes with percussion yet. Good use of it. Once you get into the non-percussion breakdown, there is too much space between points of focus. Keep the listeners focus constantly moving from one thing to another before it gets too bored focusing on one thing. 2:55 does a good job of it, but that idea doesn't really expand. If you 1.break some parts off into rounds and move the round intervals closer and closer together, 2.combined with a much softer dynamic at somewhere before 3:00 with a roaring crescendo into 3:11, and 3. add a long timpani build, I bet people would appreciate that nice mini-climax before it goes back into the low intensity string detache section at 3:14 There is a lot of stuff going on, and it's awesome. I can feel your energy and hard work in this piece, but I think you can achieve a much better intensity of work-> intensity of output efficiency ratio with a lot more "exaggeration" of dynamics, if that's even possible. With this being a pretty linear but intense arrangement, it's easy to get worn out from the constant high dynamic. Give the listener a few more lows with more counterpoints, or harmonies- anything to keep the listener's focus and to maintain the intensity. This is just a baseline critique. Hopefully a few more people will pitch in with a lot of technical nitpicks to help you achieve the caliber of song you're looking for. Keep it up, because it's pretty good right now. I'm not sure about OCR standards. However, if you take take into consideration mine and others' future critiques it will be more than worthy of a spot on OCReMix. On the flip side, take this critique with a grain of salt. A lot of these things might actually affect your arrangement, and if you're happy with your arrangement and don't want to change anything, then don't. However, dynamics and such really do help a lot as far as intensity. Good luck and I'd love to see updates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inv1ctus Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 thanks blake, that was an awesome and valuable critique!!! i really appreciate the level that you went into everything. ill definitely be carefully reconstructing the song with those thoughts in mind. Hmm.... i almost feel like i should email the judges and ask them to take it off the to be judged list, since i obviously want to keep working on it, and feel it could be a better piece. Should i ask them? will they? If i get it in enough time can i give them this one instead? (although i am not even gonna think about rushing this) another point i want to bring up is, i want to make this piece as egoless as possible. What i mean by that is, i dedicate this piece to the feelings i listed previously. What that basically means is i want to make it as perfect as possible, so the listener experiences nothing but pure bliss, and i dont want my urge to be a posted remixer to get in the way of that. Now that i think about it i should probably ask to have it taken down regardless of their decision will be, because i think i can do better. thank you as well sephire, its really cool that we both happened to mix the same piece, im gonna have to go check yours out now ill see about integrating more reverb, which is a good point since it is an orchestral piece, it'd better have the grandness of an orchestra hall. The piano i think is one of many things that needs the nice touch of velocity management so that will be project number next. lol thanks guys! i honor and respect both of your opinions greatly, having listened to your music here at ocr (although your words speak for themselves regardless of your music) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I have no doubt that if you go into #ocrwip on IRC, you can get some valuable criticism. Just explain your story. Personally I would try to contact Larry (Liontamer), because he really hunkers down and is an extremely good song reviewer. He is also a judge. I am positive that he can give you advice that can both keep you perfectly within the submission guidelines and accomplish your objective of making a really good song. I don't think it would be that big of a deal if you asked them to hold it in queue while you change things up, as that's what I did with a couple of my ReMixes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beoulve Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 This is great Davidicus! I think Blake pretty much covered the stuff I noticed and more. Very solid work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inv1ctus Posted November 1, 2007 Author Share Posted November 1, 2007 ok thanks for all the input guys ok, its freaking 3:00 am and i should really be dead, but i wanted to post this update. I worked pretty hard on it today and i think i made some progress. Changes made: Timpani rolls throughout note dynamics exaggerated softer piano, and slightly different ending string bass is a little more analogous to match the cellos slightly different counter melodies slightly more reverb The Wisdom of Gagazet v1.3 enjoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephfire Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 That's a really strong improvement. The mixing sounds much better than before and that reverb has added a lot. The dynamic range feels a bit wider now, which is good. The low energy "breaks" really help to reinforce the epic parts that follow. If anything I'd personally like to hear that piano do a bit more in the softer sections. It may or may not work for this mix (so feel free to abandon this tip) but the area around 3:15 could sound really nice with some subtle piano worked in (similar to 4:15ish). Just a thought. May not sound right. Be assured that your late night session was worth it. You may not have changed that many things, but it sounds worlds better than before. Good work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Wow this is a pretty big improvement. Great stuff. I have a tiny gripe and it's the build up to 3:11. Try taking out the first note in the 3:11 section and replace it with the second one (so it's just one note), so it lets the listener know right away that that progression is being resolved. Because when I listened to the buildup to 3:11 and then 3:11 I was a tad bit confused about the progression, since your basses are playing a 2 then a 1. Just have it play a 1 for the first note and it could eliminate that confusion, and let the person focus on the resolve. Then just leave the rest to 3:45 the way it is. But some awesome piano riffs wouldn't hurt, especially if the riffs got gradually more complex and crazy, corresponding to the building tension 3:11-3:46. I'd recommend placing a higher string chord further back, maybe a 2nd and a 5th, four measures from 3:46, that just rips out from nowhere to really add to the buildup. That swell has the right idea at 3:45; try to prolong it from somewhere further back, and that combined with some piano love would just lead some to a sonic orgasm. The rest is great. I'm impressed at the improvement between the first version I listened to and this one. Nitpick: I think the piano is a little thin. But it doesn't really take anything away. Keep it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozovian Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 This is without having heard the first version, so it's a fresh perspective in that sense. There's some notes that get lost in the slow attack of the string in the intro. The third note in the remix sounds really out of place, sample-wise. I wouldn't use that sample there. Also, it seems panned to the center while the others are more to the left. It's not a big deal, but when it's solo, it bothers me. You've got great drums here, tho they could use a little more bass when there are no other low range instruments playing. Before 1:30, the short notes on strings should build up, rather than cool down. You can cool down, but when the timpani roll comes in, let the strings join in. Really! Nice break at 2:30. Feels natural and overall good. The slow strings are holding the whole remix back a bit. Try switching to a solo horn or something. 3:48, nice change in rhythm... followed by another break. It feels a bit uncalled for, as it didn't get intense enough before the break. Still, it's still playing smoothly, so it's just a matter of personal taste. The whole remix has a bit of an anti-climactic feel. It builds up to... a break. And then into... another. And finally... a cool ending, in the calmer sense of the word. I'd say it could pass the judges evaluation, but I'd prefer a grande finale, a really intense section somewhere. Even as it is, it's a really good piece of music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hy Bound Posted November 2, 2007 Share Posted November 2, 2007 This is really nice and fits incredibly well into the description you made of the source. I really enjoy how natural and flowing and rolling the orchestra feels. There are some parts at about the 2:10 where you use a pitch-shifting technique that sounds pretty unnatural; I would tend to shy away from those if I were you. I can't really comment on the actual mastering or anything because I have to listen to this on shitty laptop speakers, but from what I can hear, the samples used are kinda meh, but you have done a pretty good job of making them sound better than they were. I'd say that if you upgraded your samples a tad, this song would be fit for a filmscore. The only other minor quibble is that towards the end it gets somewhat repetitive. Its quite a good build, but tends to get a bit stale, I would suggest maybe some arpeggios on a harp or something to break up some of the monotony and give it a bit more drive in the later stages of the build up. However, I think this could definitely pass if you fixed some of the little bits I talked about; not necessarily the upgraded samples though (thats just a personal opinion and hope, since the arrangement is so good). All in all its awesome and you are sexy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inv1ctus Posted November 2, 2007 Author Share Posted November 2, 2007 bwahahahah just look at all this great input! so many improvements to make! so little time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inv1ctus Posted November 3, 2007 Author Share Posted November 3, 2007 ok guys! i thoroughly invested myself in your input to better the song. I hope i was successful. The changes are subtle, but hopefully noticeable. Ok guys this is the moment of truth...Is my piece ready to actually be judged? Yea or nay? o_O im not gonna bother listing the changes this time... there are a ton of little things here and there. The Wisdom of Gagazet v1.4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beoulve Posted November 3, 2007 Share Posted November 3, 2007 Well, I certainly can't help you improve, it's so damn good! I say it's definitely good to go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephfire Posted November 3, 2007 Share Posted November 3, 2007 Gotta go to work now. Will edit post later with feedback. Edit: I love this. I can't think of anything else to suggest. You've got YES material here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inv1ctus Posted November 3, 2007 Author Share Posted November 3, 2007 Gotta go to work now. Will edit post later with feedback. lol kinda thought that was funny since im reading this on my work break Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sephfire Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Unless someone else can think of a good suggestion for changes, submit this sucker. I'll be pretty surprised if they don't YES this. You done good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inv1ctus Posted November 4, 2007 Author Share Posted November 4, 2007 right on sephire! that made my day maybe ill try and have one of the judges swing by first just in case Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avaris Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Hey dude this song has a great feel. IMO the only thing and this might be more of a personal preference is the reverb. Maybe cut back on the reverb on some of the intruments so the sounds are bleeding together as much. You are def goin for a specific type of sound so the amount of reverb sounds good. Compositionally and arrangement wise this is a really good song. Great execution on different parts. I really like the build ups around 3:00. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inv1ctus Posted November 4, 2007 Author Share Posted November 4, 2007 ok guys i went ahead and submitted it again with permission from liontamer. wish me luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Revoredo Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 it says "NOTICE: No servers are currently available with the requested data on them. Please retry your request in a moment." . I've already tried 10 times. Why don't you try hosting it on putfile? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beoulve Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Good luck! But, I don't think you need any luck, you've got the skills! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Haha wow, this sounds so much more polished than the first version I listened to. This really sounds awesome. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Revoredo Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Sounds pretty cool. Reminds me to Bart kepka.. that dude had some awesome mixes here on OcRemix. I'm really diggin this and is kinda orgasmic at times. Plus, you've got very good samples (the flutes, and some drum hits) , but i think you haven't been "as" careful with the selection of "all" the samples... maybe you could choose a more realistic shaker sound, and a more realistic piano preset (That piano is too bright to be real). And well, maybe a "more realistic" string patch... but that's only production stuff.. Talking about music itself, this is 10 out of 10. (PS : it would be a good idea that you get a good sample library, like East West Quantum Leap Gold, or such... ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Themaister Posted November 11, 2007 Share Posted November 11, 2007 Hey =) I really like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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