Mario Theme Song - notnamed

[Nabeel Ansari]

Past tense, dude. He just said he took your advice (which I actually agree with for the most part, if I'm understanding you correctly: MIDI+soundfonts for recording; electric piano for live.)

Well that's hard to notice... I guess I read it too fast.

Yeah, that's basically what I'm saying.

Samples and Soundfonts for ReMixing, Piano for live. Don't record sounds from your piano unless it's actually A PIANO SOUND. You wanna do a piano solo, go for it. Record it and put it in your mix, but don't rely on sounds from your keyboard and do everything by hand (literally).

[Rozovian]

Samples and Soundfonts for ReMixing, Piano for live. Don't record sounds from your piano unless it's actually A PIANO SOUND. You wanna do a piano solo, go for it. Record it and put it in your mix, but don't rely on sounds from your keyboard and do everything by hand (literally).

A performance comes from playing instruments, not from writing notes. There are so many subtle things that a performed and recorded part does that you can't get otherwise without arduous velocity, timing, and length editing.

Stage-keyboards tend to have pretty good sounds (especially keyboard sounds like piano, electric piano and organ), but the process of editing them once they're recorded is a problem. It's best to work with midi for most part. That means that at a later stage, when the arrangement is complete, you can run the midi through the keyboard, make use of the high-class samples it uses by recording the audio, and then processing the audio to fit with the samples and soundfonts you've used in the arrangement.

neblix is right in that recording "sounds from your piano" isn't a good idea, but don't mistake that for recording a performance - which is a great idea.

And chessdude... there is an edit button.

[Nabeel Ansari]

neblix is right in that recording "sounds from your piano" isn't a good idea, but don't mistake that for recording a performance - which is a great idea.

And chessdude... there is an edit button.

Don't double post, Chessdude. Use the Edit Button.

Also, Rozo, That's basically what I've been saying.

Only use the keyboard if it's something you can't do on the computer, or if it's simply easier to do on the keyboard.

[chessmaster010]

Don't double post, Chessdude. Use the Edit Button.

Also, Rozo, That's basically what I've been saying.

Only use the keyboard if it's something you can't do on the computer, or if it's simply easier to do on the keyboard.

sorry about double posting, still getting used to this. I'm new to forums

[Gario]

Don't double post, Chessdude. Use the Edit Button.

Double post?! That ain't no 'double-posting', that be UBER POSTING, right 'ter!!

Yeah, even still, use the edit button .

I love midi, personally (I really don't see what people have against it other than the sample quality... I used to write for that medium all the time until I lost my program )... Even still, it's not OCR acceptable (even if it was the best midi EVAR!). Alright, on to the mix...

Drum work is nice (as so many others have pointed out), but the melody work isn't all that creative. The textures are pretty slick, however.

1:42 - 1:58, though, really caught me off guard as something pretty sweet. Write more melodies like that and you should be pretty wel off, in the remixing world...

...and switch from midi to soundfonts (or the like) . Good luck!

[Nabeel Ansari]

Double post?! That ain't no 'double-posting', that be UBER POSTING, right 'ter!!

Yeah, even still, use the edit button .

I love midi, personally (I really don't see what people have against it other than the sample quality... I used to write for that medium all the time until I lost my program )... Even still, it's not OCR acceptable (even if it was the best midi EVAR!). Alright, on to the mix...

Drum work is nice (as so many others have pointed out), but the melody work isn't all that creative. The textures are pretty slick, however.

1:42 - 1:58, though, really caught me off guard as something pretty sweet. Write more melodies like that and you should be pretty wel off, in the remixing world...

...and switch from midi to soundfonts (or the like) . Good luck!

What Gario is trying to say is that YOUR MIX IS TERRIBLE.

Nah I'm just joking!

There are some parts where it clashes a lot, though. If you make any changes, make sure you fix everything that is unpleasant (like said clashing) before showing it to us. I made a lot of people mad when I just made itty bitty changes and didn't fix what they told me a hundred times to do.

[Gario]

There are some parts where it clashes a lot, though. If you make any changes, make sure you fix everything that is unpleasant (like said clashing) before showing it to us.

Hey, wait a minute - I liked the clashing... it gave it flavor. That's personal preference, though (people tend to say my music clashes, too - but I do it on purpose 'cause I like the sound ) - it comes from writing choral music, I guess...

Do what you'd like, though - if you take out the clashes I won't cry (much ).

[Nabeel Ansari]

Hey, wait a minute - I liked the clashing... it gave it flavor. That's personal preference, though (people tend to say my music clashes, too - but I do it on purpose 'cause I like the sound ) - it comes from writing choral music, I guess...

Do what you'd like, though - if you take out the clashes I won't cry (much ).

It gives no flavor, it sounds unpleasant.

[Gario]

I'm getting a bit of deja vu, here... I remember having this discussion with Hoboka a while ago...

...but the way this guy is clashing, even if it wasn't intentional, is actually quite well done as far as sonorous clashing goes. Even during the minor inflections he manages to keep everything relative to the key.

I know it isn't perfect here, but clashes are actually quite nice, when well done. I hold that it gives the texture some depth and interest (without it, it would sound plain and boring, to me - it is in fact why I said the textures were good earlier).

You gave your view, Neblixsaber, and I gave mine, each according to his own listening experience (or 'opinion', which is what it is, when we come down to it). I'm giving him a different way of looking at the music; I'm not saying either one of us is right or wrong, in this case (it'll sound fine if he takes out the clashes, too - I personally would leave them in, but that's just me).

Just letting you know this isn't a 'right or wrong' scenario, guys .

[Nabeel Ansari]

I'm getting a bit of deja vu, here... I remember having this discussion with Hoboka a while ago...

...but the way this guy is clashing, even if it wasn't intentional, is actually quite well done as far as sonorous clashing goes. Even during the minor inflections he manages to keep everything relative to the key.

I know it isn't perfect here, but clashes are actually quite nice, when well done. I hold that it gives the texture some depth and interest (without it, it would sound plain and boring, to me - it is in fact why I said the textures were good earlier).

You gave your view, Neblixsaber, and I gave mine, each according to his own listening experience (or 'opinion', which is what it is, when we come down to it). I'm giving him a different way of looking at the music; I'm not saying either one of us is right or wrong, in this case (it'll sound fine if he takes out the clashes, too - I personally would leave them in, but that's just me).

Just letting you know this isn't a 'right or wrong' scenario, guys .

:\ But why you think they sound pleasant, I don't understand at all. Wrong notes, everything is booming in at once.

I apologized for my bad choice of words. Clashing is not the case at all... There's too much delay is the problem.

At certain parts the delay is overloading and all trace of a melody is gone, with no harmony.

[Gario]

:\ But why you think they sound pleasant, I don't understand at all. Wrong notes, everything is booming in at once.

I never said they sounded pleasant... they are terribly dissonant. If it sounded pleasant through and through, however, it wouldn't have held my interest nearly as much as it did. I like dissonance, if it is used properly (which it isn't here, to be honest) or if it creates a rich texture for the melody to fall on (which it does for this mix, IMHO). The delays may be creating the dissonance, but it perks my interest in the mix.

Writing and hearing consonant music is the first step in composing, and I commend you for hearing that some of the music of his isn't consonant. However, based on what type of music you enjoy (I personally am enthralled by late romantic/early modern music), you may develop a certain taste for certain other sonorities (such as the 2nd and 3rd of a minor or major scale being played simultaneously - in fact, it's a sonority that is dominant in the famous Final Fantasy Prelude ).

It's cliche, but it is certainly an opinion that I am thrusting forward, here. However, that opinion is formed through my experiences in music - I guarantee you if you listen to the choral music of Eric Whitacre or Morten Lauridson, or listen to the orchestra pieces of Mahler, Stravinsky or Shostakovitch you'd begin to develop a taste for those sonorities, as well.

Here, listen to what I did for the ORC119 - delays (actually, it's technically a damper...) create 'clashes' and 'dissonance' all over the place (in fact, one reviewer said he didn't like it, and he's a respectable remixer, here). That was completely intentional on my part, as I like the sonorious sound generated. I don't get on people's cases if they don't like the sound, as that's normal - I just like to present that as a viable way of writing music.

I'm not trying to derail the thread, Chessmaster010 - I just want to let you know what I thought the textures in your music here sounded like, to me .

BTW, your choice of words were fine, Neblixsaber - there was clashing and I knew what you were talking about... I just liked the clashing .

At certain parts the delay is overloading and all trace of a melody is gone, with no harmony.

I'm a bit confused on that, though - the delay actually creates the harmony, doesn't it?

[Nabeel Ansari]

I never said they sounded pleasant... they are terribly dissonant. If it sounded pleasant through and through, however, it wouldn't have held my interest nearly as much as it did. I like dissonance, if it is used properly (which it isn't here, to be honest) or if it creates a rich texture for the melody to fall on (which it does for this mix, IMHO). The delays may be creating the dissonance, but it perks my interest in the mix.

Writing and hearing consonant music is the first step in composing, and I commend you for hearing that some of the music of his isn't consonant. However, based on what type of music you enjoy (I personally am enthralled by late romantic/early modern music), you may develop a certain taste for certain other sonorities (such as the 2nd and 3rd of a minor or major scale being played simultaneously - in fact, it's a sonority that is dominant in the famous Final Fantasy Prelude ).

It's cliche, but it is certainly an opinion that I am thrusting forward, here. However, that opinion is formed through my experiences in music - I guarantee you if you listen to the choral music of Eric Whitacre or Morten Lauridson, or listen to the orchestra pieces of Mahler, Stravinsky or Shostakovitch you'd begin to develop a taste for those sonorities, as well.

Here, listen to what I did for the ORC119 - delays (actually, it's technically a damper...) create 'clashes' and 'dissonance' all over the place (in fact, one reviewer said he didn't like it, and he's a respectable remixer, here). That was completely intentional on my part, as I like the sonorious sound generated. I don't get on people's cases if they don't like the sound, as that's normal - I just like to present that as a viable way of writing music.

I'm not trying to derail the thread, Chessmaster010 - I just want to let you know what I thought the textures in your music here sounded like, to me .

BTW, your choice of words were fine, Neblixsaber - there was clashing and I knew what you were talking about... I just liked the clashing .

I'm a bit confused on that, though - the delay actually creates the harmony, doesn't it?

:/ No, and no.

The delay makes a bunch of different notes sound at the same time.

If I had note A on a strong delay, note B on a strong delay and note C on a strong delay,

And the melody was ABCBABCBABCBABCBA

It would just be A, B, and C all on every sixteenth step. They all go in the same spot, so instead of hearing and echoed melody ABCBABCBABCBABCBA

you hear (ABC)(ABC)(ABC)(ABC)

instead of an arpeggio it's just the three notes played at the same time (like your hand going up and down on a chord instead of playing each individual note)

I'll ask DS if dissonance can be used properly in an OCRemix. He'll give me a good explanation why it can/ can't be used.

Dissonance means "disagreeing sounds" so I don't really understand why you like it. It makes the remix bumpy and unpleasant to listen to.

It doesn't matter if it's used "properly" if it sounds unpleasant then nobody's gonna like the mix because it's unpleasant.

Tomorrow.

[SoulinEther]

... ORC119 ...

Dear Gario,

Please plug your music/remixes in random threads I happen to peruse more often.

Thank you,

SoulinEther

,,,

Dear chessmaster010,

Thank you for creating such a lively thread. I can already tell that you're going to go far in the OCR community! We should have a chess match at some point, because I suck!

Respectably,

Soulinether

P.S. Forgive me for not giving your work a listen, however, upon reading the critiques of others, I deemed it unnecessary as they've already hammered in the points I might have made... better than I would have.

[Rozovian]

Long debate on the dissonance, and what bothers me in the remix is something completely different.

Simple synth sounds and lack of processing and volume mixing is my biggest issue with this. From what I remember of the old version, this is much closer to an ocr-type remix, but the sound still needs work. If the sound would get better, perhaps the dissonance won't be a problem. When used right, dissonance can be awesome, and it's _not_ terrible here.

1:42-1:50 was pretty cool. If you'd do more stuff like that and fit some source melodies into it you'd have a great remix. 2:18 was another nice piano section, but once again not having much to do with source. Some people remix by throwing original sections into the source, which although cool doesn't get them on ocr. Willrock's had this problem with some of his works.

Oh and don't link to a list of files unless it's clear which one we should listen to. I saw four mario theme remixes in the list, not sure I listened to the right one. Link to the right one's download page instead.

[Gario]

Long debate on the dissonance...

lol, I know - I can't help myself... It's funny that I'm relatively indifferent on what Chessmaster010 does with that (it'll sound fine to me either way); I'm just talking so people on this thread can learn about something new, here.

Dissonance means "disagreeing sounds" so I don't really understand why you like it.

NOPE! I'm afraid your making a common error, there... don't feel bad, most people do when they talk about dissonance - it's what a teacher will tell you in order to keep the subject simple. Technically, 'dissonance' is when two sounds do not use a simple ratio when played simultaneously (an octave's wavelength is 2:1, a fifth is 3:2, a fourth is 4:3, etc...). The problem is that in the music today we don't use those ratios anymore - we now tune to something called 'equal temperament' tuning that is in fact only consonant at the octave.

Now, we get sounds that are close to being consonant, but technically we never use perfect consonance when sequencing music, so in reality it's perfectly fine to use sonorities (rather than 'chords') to harmonize our music... hell, we've been doing it for over 100 years, now, so there isn't any reason not to use dissonance (Ives' 'The Unanswered Question' was written in 1905 - believe me, the dissonance in that is incredible, but it's still one of my absolute favorite pieces of all time).

Point is, no one in this century really has listened to perfectly 'consonant' music because we've adopted to a system where we don't use those ratios, anymore. You'll need to trust me on this - I've spent enough time studying the subject to know what I'm talking about, in this case .

And the melody was ABCBABCBABCBABCBA... etc.

Alright, listen to the Aeris' theme in FF7 (particularly when she dies) - the beginning is completely based off of the sonority CGCDE simultaneously. Perhaps that's a better example than the prelude .

By the way, Chessmaster010, update it for us soon! We're dying of anticipation .

[Nabeel Ansari]

lol, I know - I can't help myself... It's funny that I'm relatively indifferent on what Chessmaster010 does with that (it'll sound fine to me either way); I'm just talking so people on this thread can learn about something new, here.

NOPE! I'm afraid your making a common error, there... don't feel bad, most people do when they talk about dissonance - it's what a teacher will tell you in order to keep the subject simple. Technically, 'dissonance' is when two sounds do not use a simple ratio when played simultaneously (an octave's wavelength is 2:1, a fifth is 3:2, a fourth is 4:3, etc...). The problem is that in the music today we don't use those ratios anymore - we now tune to something called 'equal temperament' tuning that is in fact only consonant at the octave.

Now, we get sounds that are close to being consonant, but technically we never use perfect consonance when sequencing music, so in reality it's perfectly fine to use sonorities (rather than 'chords') to harmonize our music... hell, we've been doing it for over 100 years, now, so there isn't any reason not to use dissonance (Ives' 'The Unanswered Question' was written in 1905 - believe me, the dissonance in that is incredible, but it's still one of my absolute favorite pieces of all time).

Point is, no one in this century really has listened to perfectly 'consonant' music because we've adopted to a system where we don't use those ratios, anymore. You'll need to trust me on this - I've spent enough time studying the subject to know what I'm talking about, in this case .

Alright, listen to the Aeris' theme in FF7 (particularly when she dies) - the beginning is completely based off of the sonority CGCDE simultaneously. Perhaps that's a better example than the prelude .

By the way, Chessmaster010, update it for us soon! We're dying of anticipation .

Forget it, Gario.

You don't understand what I'm trying to say here so just let it go. :/

What I mean to say is that dissonance is NOT used well here. It sounds unpleasant here as most accidental dissonance does.

That's my main point: THIS PARTICULAR REMIX does not sound good with this so called "incredible dissonance".

[Gario]

Forget it, Gario.

Alright - I was just trying to help you a bit. In time you may know what I was talking about (contrapuntally, your right, but I wasn't talking about that ).

It's my simple opinion, if I restrict it to this remix, so we'll agree to disagree .

[SoulinEther]

By the way, Chessmaster010, update it for us soon! We're dying of anticipation .

I have listened to it, and I'll admit that I agree. I have a strong feeling that the next update will be a lot better.

[Halt]

I'll remind him. I think he's been a bit busy lately