Demon's Souls (PS3 RPG)

[zircon]

Anybody else own this game? I had never even heard of it until recently, when I saw some very positive praise for it on multiple websites. I picked it up and was NOT disappointed. This is probably my favorite PS3 game and one of the best RPGs I've played... ever.

Demon's Souls is a generally single-player action RPG closest in concept to games like Nethack or Diablo. You're a single character who never has any sort of 'party', the game has a single town/safe zone which leads to all the levels, and you're fighting demons. It sounds generic but believe me, it's not. The combat is VERY engaging and the customization system is extremely unique. The atmosphere of the game is also wonderful and even though the individual plot elements have been done before, it feels new, and takes itself quite seriously (in a good way.)

There are two things particularly notable about DS. One is its difficulty. The game is unbelievably hard. As a veteran RPG player, I've probably died at least 40 times, and I haven't even beaten the second 'stage' yet (out of about 20.) The difficulty feels legitimate, too. From time to time you'll die to something completely unexpected, but generally, you don't die because of the game's controls, or because of a 'cheap' attack, you die because you're not skilled enough. In that sense, it almost shares more in common with true action games rather than RPGs. 8 hours into the game, I'm finding that 'farming' is not particularly useful, and it's more about making the right equipment/spell choices and simply playing better rather than accumulating tons of experience and plowing through.

The other unique aspect is the multiplayer. It's unlike anything I've seen. When you first start playing you'll notice ghosts fade in and out from time to time. These are actually other players, and you can vaguely see what they're doing, but not what is around them. So, if you see another player fighting around you, it would be wise to prepare for a surprise attack. You cannot talk to other players, except for leaving messages from a preset list, such as "Watch out for a trap ahead." Bogus messages fade away fast and you can recommend ones that helped you. Also, if a player has died nearby, you can touch their bloodstain and see the last ~5 seconds of their life (but not what was around them - just their position and actions.) This makes for a really immersive experience and the idea is to learn from the mistakes of others.

There is also a co-op and PVP system, but again, it's all very much immersed in the game lore. With particular items you can summon another player (random - you can't choose who) to your realm to help you with something, and you yourself can be summoned too. But with another item, you can actually *invade* the realm of other players, appearing to them as a black/red phantom. These actions have repercussions on the game itself as well as your character and theirs, and the fact that you can't communicate with anyone or even see their name/handle makes it all the more interesting.

Anyway, I'd love to talk tactics, character builds and so on, so... DS fans unite!

[Schwaltzvald]

Dude no offense but it's been out for a good while, heck there's still quite a few threads over at /v/ as well with players raging against particular sections, "Guts" vs practical builds and other things. There are a few of us on OCR that play Berse-I mean Demon's Souls. I've been playing it offline though for certain areas as I want to be able to get through then first without having to deal with invading phantoms of other players just yet.

You can get the best weapon you can think of but if I get close enough to you Zircon I will shatter and break anything and everything you can chuck at me.

Unless of course you're really good at using magic... otherwise...

edit*

When I say "Guts" build, I really do mean Guts build

And that won't save you from me.

Really, the Guts build is more often than not a GAR mode where you'd better think fast when you're facing heavy magic users. If anything so long as you're capable of casting an anti-magic field you're fucked. Heck I'll even admit my Scraping Spear tactics are not without flaws. It's meant to break your shit before I start mushing and stirring up your insides with the meat cleaver which drains your health as well.

[Gollgagh]

weird I thought we had a thread about it already

I've been debating hard whether to get this next or Bayonetta and I still haven't decided

[Schwaltzvald]

weird I thought we had a thread about it already

I've been debating hard whether to get this next or Bayonetta and I still haven't decided

Why not get both as I did?

Seriously though...

If you're really in a mode for "Berserk" combat, lots of deaths caused by nearly anything and everything, black phantoms invading your game when you least expect it (though you will get a warning that some one's invading you I forget), then DS is for you.

At the same time though, if you want over the top action with a faster pace of action with the death caused only by your weak reactions and slow thinking, slightly fan-servicy combat with taunts thrown in, torture techniques that require good button mashing on occasion. Bayonetta is for you.

I say get them both but if you can only get one, I'd say Bayonetta if you still feeling that DMC-ish itch. If you want the dungeon crawling feeling where you can't traditionally save, stakes being very high upon your survival then Demon's Souls is for you.

[Thin Crust]

I've also been debating if I should get it or not. But I've got darksiders coming in the mail so I don't know if I should do this one. Let's just ask: I wasn't the biggest fan of diablo and absolutely hated monster hunter. These are 2 games that I think are very similar to it by what I have seen. Is this an accurate comparison? If it is, I really wont pick this one up. Not even now that I just got over $6000 to finish up my senior year.

So Zircon, what's your psnID?

[Schwaltzvald]

Let's just ask: I wasn't the biggest fan of diablo and absolutely hated monster hunter.

Chances are you wouldn't enjoy it, even less so with the chance of other players invading your game. By the same token though you can summon blue phantoms who are other players in their soul form to aid you in combat. They can even aid you in fighting really tough bosses as well as black phantoms and once defeating the boss they are rewarded their own bodies back once again.

[LuketheXjesse]

My friend hated this game because it was too hard.

I would probably like it though.

[zircon]

Dude no offense but it's been out for a good while

Uh.. less than half a year is a "good while"? We still talk about HoN and TF2 which have been out far longer. There's no OCR discussion thread about it at all, so what's with the high-horse attitude? It's a cool game. I want to talk about it with people.

It's not really like Diablo at all in the play style, just the general idea, so if you don't like Diablo you might still like this. I also didn't enjoy Monster Hunter at all but as you can tell I love this.

[Bigfoot]

This game would probably be the reason for me to get a PS3.

[Thin Crust]

I guess I'll see if I can rent it somewhere. Hey zircon, you got a PSNID?

[Schwaltzvald]

Uh.. less than half a year is a "good while"? We still talk about HoN and TF2 which have been out far longer. There's no OCR discussion thread about it at all, so what's with the high-horse attitude? It's a cool game. I want to talk about it with people.

It's not really like Diablo at all in the play style, just the general idea, so if you don't like Diablo you might still like this. I also didn't enjoy Monster Hunter at all but as you can tell I love this.

I'd call it a good while and the only ones I've ever seen ever talk about HoN are those on these forums, seriously. TF2, mostly a lot of jokes along with some strategy threads elsewhere.

Nothing wrong with wanting to talk about it but last time it was attempted not many were around for it. I'm not aware of this high horse you speak of unless you mean me breaking your equipment with the scraping spear?

Would like to see it happen eventually >:J

Also the subject of DS did occur on the PS3 thread so yeah...

Curiously did you get the extra edition that Atlus throws in a game guide and sound track or just the retail copy?

Also some advice, and this took my by surprise, simply try breaking anything within your surroundings, even the least likely thing you'd expect to break from a swipe of your sword or strike from an axe, it may cause something good for you to come around, also get a bow asap...

I MEAN IT GET A BOW ASAP REGARDLESS IF YOU THINK YOU'LL NEVER USE ONE JUST GET IT.

[PriZm]

So, Andrew, would you like to discuss this game in a spoiler-free manner or are spoilers OK ?

[zircon]

I'm still pretty early on but just denote spoilers and it's fine.

I'm definitely looking forward to doing some PVP later on; I'm only just getting the hang of the combat right now (beat 1-2 and 2-1.)

[prophetik music]

i had it for a while, but i really wasn't into it as much as i'd hoped to be. the difficulty wasn't a big deal - i just got bored with replaying the same stage a bunch of times to figure out the best way to get through it.

[Schwaltzvald]

I'm still pretty early on but just denote spoilers and it's fine.

I'm definitely looking forward to doing some PVP later on; I'm only just getting the hang of the combat right now (beat 1-2 and 2-1.)

What ever you do, just save the souls you've collected until you find some real substantial equipment, or at the very least for ammunition like arrows; better yet you can use them along side certain items to upgrade your equipment instead.

Also what's your playing style? Do you prefer keeping things at a certain reach with a spear or go melee with fists flying? If you get real good at parrying the enemy, you probably could do without the shield for longer periods at a time. Sure helps with stamina to also switch out to no equipment when you really need to run.

[zircon]

I chose a Temple Knight so I'm basically a melee guy. I leveled up my Magic enough to get Water Veil which has saved me a few times in the numerous fire-based encounters early, and I also leveled up Faith enough to learn another Miracle (I figure this will be useful latear.) Unfortunately my MP is still awful so most of the time I'm walking around in half-heavy armor with sword/winged spear. My strategy for most enemies has been to bait their attacks and then get up close and personal. I have enough stamina and a good enough shield that I can repel most frontal attacks and then counter with my own.

Still not good at riposting yet... the risk/reward doesn't seem worth it.

[Schwaltzvald]

I chose a Temple Knight so I'm basically a melee guy. I leveled up my Magic enough to get Water Veil which has saved me a few times in the numerous fire-based encounters early, and I also leveled up Faith enough to learn another Miracle (I figure this will be useful latear.) Unfortunately my MP is still awful so most of the time I'm walking around in half-heavy armor with sword/winged spear. My strategy for most enemies has been to bait their attacks and then get up close and personal. I have enough stamina and a good enough shield that I can repel most frontal attacks and then counter with my own.

Still not good at riposting yet... the risk/reward doesn't seem worth it.

Oh wow I started with the temple knight as well before! Prefer going a winged spear and axe personally as that axe just bursts through their damn shielding. I also find it much easier to riposte with the axe for some reason.

Speaking of which, while you may not find it worth while on the mooks, it can really save your ass when you're dealing with stronger foes. Not just for quicker kills (and better chances of good loot imo) but also it practically makes you invincible from any other attacks while you're in that animation.

Sure as hell saved my ass from multiple knights... As for the MP on the temple knight, I see it as nothing more than utilitarian. Build up what you need and leave it at that. Though on them I'd go no further than say, 14 or 16.

[PriZm]

I started out as a thief and I was using massive armor and heavy swords until I discovered the beauty of purple flame shield + moon winged spear. I stayed away from magic for a good while for the simple reason that I had not discovered the people who teach magic in the nexus, so I cannot give good advice on this for the beginning of the game.

It seemed to me that heavy armor was not worth it, except on a single specific stage... The ability to roll fast and dodge attacks is much more useful for a melee character in my opinion and you will be pretty much impervious to damage if you learn the spell given by trading the 1-2 boss soul.

SPOILERS for stage 4-2

Also, the difficulty in this game is awesome and never cheap, except on a single occasion. If you free the knight in stage 4-2, he returns to the Nexus and begins killing NPCs. You cannot revive them, and it makes the rest of the game a hassle since you can't learn magic or store your items in the safe anymore. If you decide to free him, wait until you kill a boss and then go to the second story in the Nexus to find him and kill him as soon as possible.

[Schwaltzvald]

[zircon]

A couple things...

1. I had an epic PVP encounter today (my realm was invaded and I won.) I then had an incredibly annoying encounter with someone using the Shattering Spear. It's such a stupid weapon because I outplayed the guy (hit him more, dodged better, etc.) but he beat me simply due to attrition and I ended up having to spend about 8000 souls (a huge amount for me) just to repair my stuff. Really annoying.

2. I'm venturing around in 2-2 and finding it really annoying. Everything takes like 100 hits. Seriously, the big bug things in the tunnel must take at least 40 hits to kill. Am I missing something? There are NO shortcuts in the entire stage so if I were to die I'd have to spend literally 20 minutes getting back to the boss. Speaking of, it's a good thing I looked up a bit of info on the boss, because apparently he's next to impossible for melee characters without using gimmicks. What should I do about this?!

[Yoshi3gg]

Seriously, the big bug things in the tunnel must take at least 40 hits to kill. Am I missing something? There are NO shortcuts in the entire stage so if I were to die I'd have to spend literally 20 minutes getting back to the boss. Speaking of, it's a good thing I looked up a bit of info on the boss, because apparently he's next to impossible for melee characters without using gimmicks. What should I do about this?!

The bug things SUCK. It took me probably two hours to get through those stupid tunnels my first time through 2-2. There actually is a shortcut to the boss (although this is Demon's Souls, so it involves a lot of huge drops that will kill you if not aimed perfectly). If you turn right at the first fork in the stage, you'll eventually get to a pit that has ledges and platforms leading down, and hopefully some messages left by other players to guide you. Even with messages, there's a lot of trial and error the first time you do it, so if you want to try the shortcut, you might want to spend all your souls first.

As for Flamelurk himself, I play a pure melee character, and my first time through I couldn't do it without summoning other players to help. I really wish I had better advice than that.

[Schwaltzvald]

I had an incredibly annoying encounter with someone using the Shattering Spear.

For the sake of accuracy and for others to learn about the weapons, it's called the Scraping Spear and it's specifically designed to break your weapons among other things.

While this weapon's damage output is low compared to other weapons obtainable with similar effort, it is unique in that every hit that lands does 10 durability damage to each item the target has equipped. When the durability of a weapon or piece of armor is below 30%, its effectiveness decreases greatly. Because of the special effect, this weapon is very effective against players or NPC's that wield katanas, since it only takes 5 or so hits before their weapon durability is below the 30% point.

[PriZm]

Yeah the Scraping Spear is pretty gay. You really cannot do anything about it except hope that your opponent will be more... sportsmanlike .

As for the bugs in 2-2, your best bet is to use magic. If you are using a melee character without good attack spells, you may want to consider crafting a "Moon" type weapon (Moon Winged Spear is my favorite) because it adds magic damage to the physical stuff. They will still be resilient as hell, but with a decent character you might be able to kill them in like 10 hits by using heavy hits.

Regarding Flamelurker, I beat him with my melee character and the bad news is that he isn't even the toughest boss . Use Warding/Total Protection and Water Veil, as well as equip all the stuff you have that reduces Fire damage and you should be able to outlast him.

[zircon]

Hmm.. I don't have protection or warding. Just Water Veil. Oh well, gonna try it and see how it goes. I did pick up the Hand of God which I'll use for some magic damage. I also was a dumbass and upgraded my +6 Winged Spear to +7, not knowing that I needed exactly +6 to get the "Moon" upgrades. Ugh, now I have to start again with it.

[The Legendary Zoltan]

Does this game have tons or story and/or tons of items with tons of interesting descriptive text? Because it's been sitting at the store that's RIGHT next to my house, but it would be all in Japanese, and I don't know if I'm up for that study session. It does look awesome though. I still haven't played a From Software game that I didn't like yet. I really want to get it when I finish my other games.