djpretzel Posted November 28, 2004 Share Posted November 28, 2004 Extremely hard Techstep DrumNBass. Not for the faint of heart. • Contact Info ? rundll ? Richard Whitelock ? rich@brfuk.com ? www.rundll.co.uk • ReMix Info ? Judge Dredd VS Death ? Megacity Megasound ? The Musician was primarily Tom Bible. This song is kind of an oddity. As it was originally made by rundll and the version in the game is a remix by Tom Bible. So although it wasn't 'remixed' specifially from the original it is an alternate mix. I've been wanting to have it released on vinyl for quite a while now, although it would probably need re-engineering. In the meantime it's always nice to increase the number of people who hear it. Hence the submission to ocremix. It's been doing the rounds on other video game remix sites and features in lots of peoples hotlists on vgmix.com. It was made entirely in Reason beta 2.5. I have no idea how as I look upon the original reason rack with horror. My tip, don't make entire songs in Reason unless you have to. Contrary to popular belief there are no Guitars in this track. Some people hate the long intro. Other people love it. So it stays in for the nice extremist reactions it generates. rundll consists of myself and Paul Taylor. Paul Taylor is known on the UK gig scene as hardcrazydanceelectronica act nervous_testpilot (http://www.nervoustestpilot.co.uk). rundll are planning on releasing a lot more hard hitting drum n bass in the future. We are both also a part of the A Scholar & A Physician 'crew' and partake in their activities having played in various ASAP live shows and contributed to the free ASAP albums. My only main musical claim to fame really is that I instigated & oversaw the Super Mario Dirty Mix. So it's mostly my fault...mostly. Thanks Richard Whitelock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital Coma Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 Intro is long, but bearable. Here comes the techbeat, and it's kickin'. The mixing/processing here is impeccable. Now to check the source material and make sure you actually arranged something... As it was originally made by rundll and the version in the game is a remix by Tom Bible. So although it wasn't 'remixed' specifially from the original it is an alternate mix. eh? This is apparently a new game on PC, PS2, Gamecube, etc. These submissions that don't supply hard to find original material are a waste of time. Sent email. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liontamer Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 I coincidentally also sent an e-mail yesterday. I've actually talked to Rich thanks to Binster's help over at the VGMix chatterbox. He said it may be a little difficult to get a copy of the Tom Bible remix of this song. Hey, Rich. Dropping you my e-mail so you can provide me with the Tom Bible remix of MCMS used in Judge Dredd vs Death. Sorry if it takes a while to get it. We may still vote on it without the source, but technically don't wanna run into another scenario where we pass a remix that should have been rejected on account of not having the source tune to compare it with (e.g. Cyborg Jeff's F-Zero GX mix - http://vgmix.com/song_view.php?song_id=1214 - we later removed it).Sorry for the formality. In order for this reverse remix thing to work with our standards, it would help to hear how different Tom Bible's remix sounds from yours in the structure and composition. If his version isn't rearranged much, that could technically make your track not different enough from the track used in the game. I will certainly look around myself to see if anyone else might have any kind of audio rip of music from the game though. Lemme know if you turn up anything. Thanks! - Larry Because this song is actually the precursor to the source tune, there's a risk that the arranged version of this track used in Dredd vs Death is just a close cover of this I believe. While the sound quality and presentation is good, no one should cast a vote without having heard the source. Over the weekend I may try and see if anyone from the GamingForce Audio forums has a game rip copy of it, but don't have any ideas to get the source beyond that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liontamer Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Rich got back to me yesterday afternoon with the source tune, which I've tagged and hosted. Since I'm busy with finals, I have yet to thoroughly check it out and compare it to the submission. Nonetheless, I've made what I feel is a sufficiently informed decision on it. Believe me, I'll be getting back to it in depth at a later time to point out notable differences between the two tracks as well as things I liked about this one. The structure of run.dll's mix is obviously similar to Tom Bible's version. As far as remixes go, run.dll's mix is distinguishable enough from Bible's. If I had to make the judgement call on whether run.dll's version is a mere remix or substantial rearrangement compared to Tom Bible's version, I would say it's a remix and NO on those grounds. If you wanted to ignore everything below and save yourself the trouble, you could indeed cast a NO and it really wouldn't need more explanation than that it needs more rearrangement and less shared structure & samples. In this unique circumstance, however, the in-game music is the remix, while the submission here is the original track that inspired the game music. I'm gonna bring up this analogy early and leave you guys to run with it. If John Williams sent in a track one day saying "Someone used a remix of my work in 'Shadows of the Empire' on the N64, so I'd like to submit my original track as a remix," we would reject it. As far as I understand it however (and we could get verification if necessary), Rich & Paul's original track that they're submitting as a remix of Judge Dredd game music has not been used in any commericial ventures. Likewise, if we went the anti-Tetris route like Binnie has done before (and like I personally agreed with), you could argue that the in-game music is derived from work that wasn't created for a game and isn't technically identifiable as original game music, thus not being valid source material according to the site. Frankly, even though the book says we should reject, if we can be flexible on our standards and guidelines for Tetris, we can also be flexible on this even more unique situation, especially since it's almost certainly bound never to repeat itself. Believe me, I know the rules and understand that my vote's pretty much flies in the face of them. Even if you were able to accept this under a "Tetris exception", the arrangement itself may not be different enough to merit an admittedly generous YES. Nonetheless, I hope to at least promote a healthy dialogue for this vote, much like was done with "Sweet Games". Find someone else to NO this, please. YES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkeSword Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 If John Williams sent in a track one day saying "Someone used a remix of my work in 'Shadows of the Empire' on the N64, so I'd like to submit my original track as a remix," we would reject it. I don't think we would. That only makes sense if the original song Williams submitted was originally used in a Star Wars movie or other venue besides a video game. In this case, we have a song written by an artist that was never used in any kind of media venue like a movie, game, or music CD. The song was remixed by another artist, and that remix was used in a game. It's important to note that OCR's focus is to reinterpret and reinvent music from video games. In this case, the music from the game wasn't reinterpreted or reinvented, because this piece is the precursor. It inspiritive, rather than derivative (look at me, I'm making up words!). The question is, does the chronology matter? The piece itself is tightly done. Nice processing and a great, clean sound. However, to answer my own question, I do think that the chronology matters. I really hate rejecting things on the basis of policy, but unfortunately my vote here must be NO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zircon Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 Unfortunately, I too think this should not be passed, because as Darkesword said: In this case, we have a song written by an artist that was never used in any kind of media venue like a movie, game, or music CD. The song was remixed by another artist, and that remix was used in a game. I want to make it clear that in terms of arrangement, sound quality, and production, this is great. This is NOT a bad song at all. It is, however, in violation of the guidelines of OCR. NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zykO Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 i'd rather write a long review as to why i think this is good DnB the intro is ridiculous after the 2nd or 3rd listen but it is at least of good quality. very reminiscent of pendulum in that edgy, smack you in the face manner but more could have been done with the reese (or however you spell it) all in all, its solid but i'm afraid the reason that i'd RATHER write a long review than a short one is because inevitably, i have to get to the point that this does not pass because it is not an arrangement of a previously existing medium. its possible that whether or not a track is the derivative doesn't matter ... but i think it should. i don't agree with darke on this one. i honestly think if black sabbath came to submit paranoid, we wouldn't just accept it for inspiring the music in rock n roll racing. if your rebuttal addresses comparison of media, then allow me to remind you that whether or not the piece is released on a CD, in a movie, in a game, or not at all... it is equally copyrighted under all scenarios. in which case, it is, in fact, the same thing and not admissable sorry, rundll you guys rock but NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrayLightning Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 As zyko said, the intro is ridiculous. Everything else is high quality, however as the other judges noted it does not fit the criteria of OCR. NO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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