Chill Out, Doc (Ice Cap Zone/Green Hill Zone) (HIATUS)

[PixelPanic]

Criticism is much obliged!

(links removed)

Source:

Source 2:

This was originally just a fun little project in FL Studio until I thought of the name "Chill Out, Doc", at which point it became one of those "do it because you thought of a name" things. Not to say I don't have passion for the song, I love it to death. I'm hoping to get better response here, because Facebook has given me such criticisms as:

"nice drop"

"pretty neato"

"whoaaaA"

Edited October 8, 2019 by PixelPanic

[C7]

It's a good start overall and has plenty of potential to get somewhere, but so far you're staying as safe as physically possible, it seems. Yes, its easy to have the same chords repeat, but why not have them change every go around? Have the percussion change little-by-little and slowly evolve. You have a melody and some background stuff, but you need to take it and do something with it. Maybe write a counter-melody? At the moment it, unfortunately, sounds like basic fruity loops instead of something you've really put some heart into. So add more interested, make things sound less repetitive and hushed, and try to do some things to surprise yourself sonically (seriously, no pun intended). I think you'll be happier with it if you put some more spice and action into it--and don't loop those chords so much

[Rozovian]

Just wanted to say welcome to ocr and that facebook is totally the right place for music crits. Might as well give you a few production pointers while I'm at it. Fun post, more feedback.

The whole thing is too loud. Listen to the mp3, you'll find that some instruments disappear and the sound sounds unstable and uneven. This is because you're limiting the output (to prevent harsh "clipping", which is when the sound gets too loud to save accurately, ie over 0dB), so when a louder instrument comes in, everything else has to softer to make everything fit. Listen to the hihat, it can't stay the same level. Make everything softer, and you've solved this problem.

Some instruments sound really dry and stale. If it's a keyboard instruments, you can use the sustain pedal cc to add a touch of realism to it. Most instruments get a touch of realism with a touch of reverb, but it's so easy to add to too much so only use a little less than enough to hear that it's there.

Your fake guitar isn't fooling anyone. You can try for a more realistic sound by using an amp simulator and other effects, or you could make it a good synth lead instead of trying to make it sound real. A good fake-sounding guitar lead is usually better than a bad "real"-sounding one.

If the whole thing sound a bit messy, you can use EQ to separate tracks from each other. Find a lead instrument you wanna have in the foreground, give it a _slight_ boost somewhere that makes it sound good. Cut that same frequency from the other instruments a little. Do that with a few important instruments, and you'll have made the whole thing a lot cleaner. Just don't overdo it, 2dB is enough.

I'd suggest you first focus on individual track levels, but aside from being too loud overall, you seem to have the basic idea of putting background instruments further back and foreground instruments more upfront right. It's a bit hard to tell with the heavy limiting, but it at least seems like you know what you're doing in that regard.

There's some production things for you to consider, not gonna comment on the writing right now. I think there's a little more substance in that and what C7 said than you got on fb.

[Calum]

I agree with all the previous comments.

Perhaps it was the limiting which blew them away but the drums were so quiet! I was listening on laptop speakers but i still couldn't hear a trace of a kick drum anywhere!

Definitely work on smoothing the ends of phrases which sometimes suddenly drop out and moving away from that chord sequence.

[jordanrooben]

Yeah, production wise, there's not much more to be said. Work on it a bit and you'll have a good starting point. That's not to say there aren't good points though! I like the rythm you have with the arpeggios in the background, and (to my ears) the transition to and from the green hill zone theme was smooth and natural. There were however, two things that I think stood out in the mix. First was that the section of green hill zone sounded like the lead was hiding because it was so quiet. Secondly, the ending felt rushed. Other than that, the only obvious issue is that it's pretty static. Not much dynamics. Just look at the visual sound cloud gives yous (can't remember what it's actually called.) it's practically solid. But the big issue is definitely production. I'm looking forward to hearing a revised version!

[PixelPanic]

Revised edition

With this I think I have a better intro, better synths and better mixing all around. Also, a countermelody to keep you from being bored

The counter-melody was something I just kinda whipped together in English (making manuscript out of graph paper is pretty nifty) and threw in, with some tweaking to the rhythm of it. I think it keeps it coherent and locked in place, and also serves as a soft pairing for the harsh melody.

[PixelPanic]

Revised edition again (Mk IV)

This time around I worked on the composition itself. I realized everything was all mix-matchy and things popped out of nowhere. I discarded unnecessary syncopation and added more of a beginning.

EDIT: Oh geez, in the original post of Mk IV, I uploaded a version missing a complete instrument track. That was pretty careless. And it was a track I muted for a few drafts so I almost completely forgot. It was close.

[PixelPanic]

Cmon guys, I need some opinions and criticism. I am shooting in the dark as of this point and I need some direction. With no further criticism I can only assume it's finished in it's current state.

[PixelPanic]

Due to lack of further criticism, I am ready to put this as a finished track!

Finished version here

[PixelPanic]

Updated for Mod-Review

Really not likin 5 comments in a row bein mine :c

[Gario]

Ack, sorry for the lack of crits in here... It's probably Ice Cap Envy.

Let's see if I can help break up the non-responsive pattern, here.

Mod Review:

Alright, from what I gather the arrangement consists of the theme playing pretty close to verbatim, then there's some improvisation over the harmonies with the hollow sounding synth. When that second breakdown comes in you bring in a little Green Hill zone, which is pretty cool, actually, but there's really not enough variation or change to reach the level of interpretation required for OCR, as it stands. If you stick with this, my suggestion would be to break from the repetitive harmonies that the source provides from time to time, and possibly explore more of the possibilities of Green Hill Zone merging with the piece (that was a highlight of the track, for me).

The solos feel like they randomly meander - they need at least a little direction if they're going to work. The instrument that plays the little solo-esque sections is pretty weak. It's just hard to hear it play what it has to play, there. That guitar would've been more fitting for that sort of job, or at least another instrument that is more poignant.

Overall, the sample quality is incredibly dry and bland. They sound like presets of some sort that have nothing done to them to make them fill the space. While synth design and such would help a lot, some easier solutions are available as well - reverb and delay, for example, help make the instruments sound more 'full', when used in moderation (too much just makes a mess of things). Again, better samples could help, too - the guitar is particular is painful to listen to.

While I promise this will not pass OCR's panel, hopefully some of the things I said will help you out, regardless. Good luck.

[Rozovian]

Don't post so often, give ppl time to listen before you put a new version out there. Three updates in four days? Dude.

mod rev:

Vanilla sounds, repetitive and loop-y, mostly just a rehash of the source. The sounds you're using might work, but you'll have to use effects to advance the sound into something less midi-like and more professional. EQ separation, foreground-background separation with reverb, and some modulation effects (in this case, I'd suggest chorus on some of the backing tracks) can do this.

The drum writing is interesting, but doesn't stand up to being looped this much. It also doesn't agree with the countermelody rhythm, listen to some ska and see what rhythm ideas that can give you.

ARRANGEMENT / INTERPRETATION

- Too conservative - melody tweaks and some altered backings doesn't personalize it enough for ocr

PRODUCTION

- Low-quality samples - the aforementioned vanilla sounds, use more complex/varied sounds and/or apply effects to add complexity

- Unrealistic sequencing - loopy and mechanical

- Generic/cliche sound choices - sounds like a midi; see also low-quality samples

STRUCTURE

- Not enough changes in sounds (eg. static texture, not dynamic enough)

- Too repetitive

[PixelPanic]

Ack, sorry for the lack of crits in here... It's probably Ice Cap Envy.

Let's see if I can help break up the non-responsive pattern, here.

Mod Review:

Alright, from what I gather the arrangement consists of the theme playing pretty close to verbatim, then there's some improvisation over the harmonies with the hollow sounding synth. When that second breakdown comes in you bring in a little Green Hill zone, which is pretty cool, actually, but there's really not enough variation or change to reach the level of interpretation required for OCR, as it stands. If you stick with this, my suggestion would be to break from the repetitive harmonies that the source provides from time to time, and possibly explore more of the possibilities of Green Hill Zone merging with the piece (that was a highlight of the track, for me).

The solos feel like they randomly meander - they need at least a little direction if they're going to work. The instrument that plays the little solo-esque sections is pretty weak. It's just hard to hear it play what it has to play, there. That guitar would've been more fitting for that sort of job, or at least another instrument that is more poignant.

Overall, the sample quality is incredibly dry and bland. They sound like presets of some sort that have nothing done to them to make them fill the space. While synth design and such would help a lot, some easier solutions are available as well - reverb and delay, for example, help make the instruments sound more 'full', when used in moderation (too much just makes a mess of things). Again, better samples could help, too - the guitar is particular is painful to listen to.

While I promise this will not pass OCR's panel, hopefully some of the things I said will help you out, regardless. Good luck.

Thank you very much, but what about the guitar is "painful to listen to" (too unrealistic, too sharp(hurts the ears), ect)?

[Magellanic]

I can't speak for Gario but the guitar is unrealistic and lacking in life. Even for a sequenced part, there is very little humanisation. Some instruments you can get away with sampling/sequencing but a lead guitar is not one (IMO. I'm sure there are some sequencing geniuses who could fool a listener). Given the existing textures etc. I think you would be better off using a buzzy saw synth lead or if you really want an electric guitar, finding someone to play it for you. Keep it up and get some of this feedback implemented, its like gold dust

[Flexstyle]

<MODREVIEW>

Oooh boy, let’s see. First off, I’m not trying to be mean, at all, I promise—just trying to give the best feedback I can.

Anyways.

Let’s start with the drums. There’s only one pattern you really utilize throughout the entire song. Sure, you change it up a couple times with fills and whatnot, but the drums get REALLY boring. Also not helping your case is the fact that the pattern itself gets old after about the first two times through it—it’s very “busy,” meaning it’s got a lot going on in it (what with the breakbeat kicks and fill-esque hi-hats constantly going at it).

In fact, that’s part of what pulls this song down the most. In electronic music, you’d be surprised how much better a song is when you make it simpler, not more complex. You’ve got that busy bassline, those busy piano licks, and you’re still trying to fit in a lead melody. However, you’re not doing much with any of your riffs, and that makes the song very repetitive. I know the source itself is kinda repetitive, but you’re going to have to get past that with either super-clean production or some serious game-upping with the arrangement. I can skip to any point in the song on Soundcloud and it still sounds the same as where I was before. That’s not a good thing. It’s just the same mess the entire time.

Let’s move on into production—you’ve got a lot of things taking up space in the low-mid and the mid areas of the frequency spectrum. Your bass isn’t very deep, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing, since your kick has a lot of sub frequencies. However, it’s clashing with some of your other instruments. At about 1:18 or so, that secondary lead comes in, but it’s almost in the same exact frequency area as the bass is. All that together just creates a jumbled mess. In addition, your piano is taking up a lot of the same area as well.

Kick drum: It’s too long. What I mean by that is its bass frequencies are held for too long, and since you play a lot of fast fills with it, the low end gets cluttered by all those bass drum tails trying to find their space. The same kinda goes for your hi-hat sound. See if you can find a shorter one, preferably with less midrange sludge in it, and see if that helps.

The lead sound you’ve got playing the Ice Cap zone lead is messy, but not very inspiring. Elaboration: It also takes up some room in the midrange that maybe it could stand to let go of. Also, it sounds like a really fake electric guitar synth of some sort. I’d suggest playing around and seeing if you can’t get a better sound for your lead, and preferably one that doesn’t take up so much spectrum space.

Do you have some sort of compressor on the master track? The entire thing sounds squashed and muffled to some degree. Take that off and concentrate on getting the mix cleaned up before it ever hits a compressor (or a limiter).

I’m sorry, but this song is nowhere close to passing the panel, IMO. I suggest you take it back to the drawing board, since it’s got such a myriad of issues. Work on drum patterns and making them a little simpler, but with more variation over time. Watch for frequency clutter; a neat tip that I try to follow is ALWAYS cut off frequencies lower than about 120 hz if the instrument isn’t a kick or a bassline. Finally, expound on the source a bit more. Give it some life.

Please don’t get discouraged, and again—I promise I’m not trying to be mean, just honest.

</MODREVIEW>

[PixelPanic]

I can skip to any point in the song on Soundcloud and it still sounds the same as where I was before. That’s not a good thing. It’s just the same mess the entire time.

To be honest, this is possibly the most effective piece of criticism there is. The rest was most definitely extremely useful and will definitely be appreciated, but this kinda picked my feelings up. I know for a fact that I HATE repetitive music (excluding video game music because it is all looped 30 second songs, not 3:30 songs), and I was making it? Bleh. Some kind of negative motivation or something I guess, but thank you.

[Ryan Jobson]

Dont think of it as negative motivation man, just think of it as motivation. Period. I personally love it when I complete a song and share it with the world and then get a bunch of "swell - but you could have done this" or "gee willickers, but I think this part needs this..." or even "vomit - go fuck yourself and leave youtube" (this one obviously an immature troll.. haha). But in all seriousness, I take every piece of criticism and look forward to getting better, continuing to put that effort in to make my songs as good as I can so they can be enjoyed by myself and others. Keep working at it dude - we're all in the same boat here. We love making music and we strive to get better at it. Hold your head high - you're only going up from here

~Syllix

[Gario]

Thank you very much, but what about the guitar is "painful to listen to" (too unrealistic, too sharp(hurts the ears), ect)?

It's simply poorly sequenced + poor sample/synth choice for emulating a guitar. Painful = hard to listen to, in this case.

[PixelPanic]

Dont think of it as negative motivation man, just think of it as motivation. Period. I personally love it when I complete a song and share it with the world and then get a bunch of "swell - but you could have done this" or "gee willickers, but I think this part needs this..." or even "vomit - go fuck yourself and leave youtube" (this one obviously an immature troll.. haha). But in all seriousness, I take every piece of criticism and look forward to getting better, continuing to put that effort in to make my songs as good as I can so they can be enjoyed by myself and others. Keep working at it dude - we're all in the same boat here. We love making music and we strive to get better at it. Hold your head high - you're only going up from here

~Syllix

Well, negative motivation in the sense that the thing I'm doing is negative to me, but motivates me positively. I guess that's positive. I think.

[PixelPanic]

Current WIP as of 2/6/12

So, after hearing a lot of good response from the Green Hill Zone solo, I decided to make it a two-song mix, with Green Hill stealing the show half-way through.

I also dropped the faux-guitar in favor of a square-wave synth, because the guitar was more trouble than it was worth.

EDIT: I am aware of the non-scale tone in the bassline solo. It was fixed mere minutes after posting, and I didn't want to re-upload cause I'm lazy. It's a sixteenth note, we can all deal.

[PixelPanic]

Current WIP as of 2/10/12

Come on guys, I gotta get some crits, I think I've done all I can be happy with. Please criticize, don't just lurk or listen.

[Sengin]

I like the mix of ice cap and green hill, but I feel the track as a whole is missing something. It's hard to describe, but I'll give it a shot: the track feels cohesive for the most part, which is great, but it all sounds too similar, like I'm listening to the same thing for most of it. It needs more variation, maybe another instrument in some areas, and definitely a break from the traditional ice cap melody/bass line. Ice cap has been done to death around here, so it needs more to stand out (especially since you don't really play with the melody at all). Maybe more green hill, less focus on the unaltered ice cap melody?

[Zach]

at 1:07 when the song comes back, I would add some kind of cool funky bassline to the mix. I really feel like this song would be complete with a cool bassline added around here. Other than that, really solid.

[Arceace]

Okay, here's my impression of the whole thing. I like how you've changed it thus far, and it has come a long way since version 4 (the first version that I can recall hearing). The lead for the majority of the song is much better than before, and I like the improvement. I think you should try using the Fruity Parametric EQ2 to give it a boost in the higher frequency range. Right now it sounds like it's pretty far in the background, and I think the song could be improved if the melody was more up in front.

The pads (the long notes in the background) are good enough to keep the song interesting, and I hear quite a bit of variation in the song. They do sound a bit weak though, so it might be a good idea to come in with a stronger pad later in the song. It sounds like the majority of the song doesn't pick up past the introduction. That being said, they still do an effective job giving the "chill" atmosphere. I think that adding a more powerful pad later on will help give a sense of progression.

I have noticed quite a lack in the bass range, and I think the whole arrangement could have a better sound if the instruments and samples were distributed more. From what I hear, you have a lot focused on the mid/treble ranges. I would recommend trying to shift the instruments and trying different ranges, you may find a better range for something.

The drums sound like their being played with a cover on top. I think the kick and the snare could both use a little more volume and perhaps EQ-ing. One thing that you can try right off the bat is the fruity bass boost for the kick. I have noticed that it can help give the kick and bass instruments more power when necessary. The high hats are okay, but they could stand a little boost in the high-frequency range.

Of course, I am not sure of the style that you going for. If you’re going for a softer, chill out effective, it would help to give the sounds more power, but less volume.

Hope this gives you something to think about. I am certainly no production expert, so it may be a good idea to get more feed back as well. Just keep going at it and you'll eventually figure things out. Best of luck!

[PixelPanic]

Current WIP as of 2/13/12

Putting it up for Mod Review again to see what they can give me now.