How to do popular EDM?

[Meteo Xavier]

I am finally looking to take a break from music after the last things I have my name on are done, and after that break, I am looking toward expanding (or perhaps narrowing) into more popular genres of electronic music for remixing here and doing other albums. Specifically, I'm looking at trying my hand in trance, drum and bass and progressive house.

I've pretty much got all the tools at my disposal, except for a shitload of DnB loops I want to get my hands on and cut, what I don't yet get are the way the tracks are built. I'm a composer, not really a producer (yet), and as I study the genres as ad nauseum music advice states to "listen to the kind of music you want to make", I find that I really have trouble coming up with the same kinds of stuff. I can do the beats and the bass, there's millions of tutorials on those, but after that, I'm stuck.

I'm hoping this to not be a topic where I get all my answers right now, I'm hoping this to allow me to go on for a while and let me post questions as I go along. I'd like to learn to do stuff like PrototypeRaptor, Ben Briggs and, yes, Deadmau5. And before I get a lot of posts going offtrack asking "Why stick to a genre? Just do what you love and call it good." I've been doing that for 4 years now, I want to shift focus.

I guess my first question goes back to my background as studying videogame music than popular music. Exactly how much melody can I get away with in EDM? I almost can't compose anything unless it has a really strong melody, epic chords and improv section. Even as I try, to me it still comes out sounding like VGM and I can't tell if I'm doing it wrong or if I'm doing it right.

I asked Neblix on the subject some time ago and he told me that heavily melodic dance tracks are actually some of the most popular and well liked ones of the crop. This does me good, but I have to wonder why then there are millions of dance tracks that have weak melodies or none at all? How can I focus on them just being good club-bangers as opposed to not being repetitive drivel?

Sometimes I genuinely can't tell the two apart.

This is kinda what I hope to actually do:

Thanks ahead of time!

[zircon]

I guess it depends on what you define as 'popular' - I'd say that drum n' bass is definitely NOT popular, relatively speaking. Deadmau5, Tiesto, Swedish House Mafia, Skrillex, Madeon... that's the popular stuff right now. Abrasive synth sounds, 4x4 drums, 130-140bpm. Check out the Sirius XM "BPM" and "Electric Area" stations for a good blend of stuff that's being played right now in clubs and dj sets.

[GallenWolf]

Check out Melodic Dubstep? Miracle by Blackmill is my first stop.

[Meteo Xavier]

I guess it depends on what you define as 'popular' - I'd say that drum n' bass is definitely NOT popular, relatively speaking.

Well those Monstercat tracks have been a pretty decent hit for people, and I'd probably get a lot more hits myself doing that than fantasy-ambient tracks.

Also, NO DUBSTEP. Ever.

[Meteo Xavier]

Ok, so nobody ever really answered my first question and it's one that's rather pressing for me, so I'm going to try it again.

One of my biggest problems in doing EDM, and most styles that aren't videogame oriented, is that my music style revolves so much around melody and moving (often dramatic) chords that I almost can't do anything that doesn't focus on melodic content. Most EDM I hear features next to no melody and focuses almost entirely on production and accompaniment.

My rather awkwardly phrased question is: how much melody can I get away with in commercial EDM? I've heard from at least several people that say melodic electronica is actually some of the most popular, but there is still a lot of popular tracks out there that are so repetitive that I literally get lost in their tracks (and not in a good way). I get lost in my own compositions trying to recreate it and it almost never works. I don't want to turn off listeners who might think "eh, it just sounds like videogame music, off", but I can't figure out why people are drawn to unmelodic tracks in the first place.

Can anyone help me out here? How does this work?

[lazygecko]

It's really no different from how songwriting in average pop music is done. Use a handful of chords (mimic the most cookie cutter progressions if you're feeling extra cynical) and 2-3 melodic phrases.

[SonicThHedgog]

I guess it depends on what you define as 'popular' - I'd say that drum n' bass is definitely NOT popular, relatively speaking. Deadmau5, Tiesto, Swedish House Mafia, Skrillex, Madeon... that's the popular stuff right now. Abrasive synth sounds, 4x4 drums, 130-140bpm. Check out the Sirius XM "BPM" and "Electric Area" stations for a good blend of stuff that's being played right now in clubs and dj sets.

just want to add the range 120-128,129 since alot of electro is in that range for dj's.

dont mind me people, just lurking

*swims away*

[Meteo Xavier]

It's really no different from how songwriting in average pop music is done. Use a handful of chords (mimic the most cookie cutter progressions if you're feeling extra cynical) and 2-3 melodic phrases.

I've been sort of experimenting with that as well and its been mixed so far at best. It's so bare that I can't figure out what people get out of it, and thus I am unable to proceed.

What I'd REALLY like to produce is pretty much represented by East New Sound is these videos:

That's a lot closer to what I could do than most other EDM, but I run the risk of listeners dismissing it or being disinterested because it doesn't sound enough like what they actually want.

I'm just trying not to repeat what happened during the first run of my ESPERS album when I did it my way and no one would touch it because it was either "too new age" or "too ambient", or not enough of either (this was especially bad when trying to send it out for review). Music takes me a long time to do, and I'm tired of spending my time and resources doing music no one wants to listen to.

[Meteo Xavier]

Just wanted to take a moment to express how much I appreciate ocremix's music forums compared to KVR. I asked the same basic question there and all the responses are "DERP TYPO LOL!" "Hey, let's focus on a different part of your post that has nothing to do with your question and leave your question unanswered instead."

Same thing every time I post a question on KVR. KVR fucking sucks.

OCR fucking rules!

[anterroir]

Music takes me a long time to do, and I'm tired of spending my time and resources doing music no one wants to listen to.

Well then - stop doing it ! Either you're doing it with heart and passion in your very own style or you're playing the corporate whore that does what everyone wants without any thought of your own feelings about it. It's that simple.

Personally - I'm doing the first - of course you have to grow and get your stuff together -> it's no excuse for a bad mix or bad writing, but besides that I'm giving a fuck about what others want - it's MY music -> the expression of MYSELF

*so get of the guetta train and grow some b****

[Meteo Xavier]

Would you like to see my b**** and then determine if they need to grow still? (The answer you're looking for is NO)

I've put $4,000 and 10 years of life into this venture - I didn't invest that much to quit now. Why would I even quit? I just wanted to know if I can still do highly melody-driven songs in contemporary electronica genres. What does that have to do with being a corporate whore or not? I already did 3 albums the way I wanted to and only one of them actually went anywhere (thanks mostly to the good graces of OCR).

Maybe some pretentious artists can claim they don't need listeners to make their music ventures worthwhile, but I'm too honest for that. I would like a fanbase of my own. Doesn't have to be a huge one, but I would like that the things I create become significant for others. Whores don't put out creativity, they just put out.

[anterroir]

Please don't take my words as an offence it was more meant as a "shake up", as you have to be aware for yourself what you really want.

Cater something for a broad audience without the "special" you portion or develope your music into a direction you can live with and no part of you is ashamed about it ... as for the fan base - you - yourself has to be "real" (nothing put on) - it's of no use trying to wear a hat that doesn't fit.

[Meteo Xavier]

I'm already doing that - what does that have to do with whether or not I can have highly melody-driven content in commercial EDM? My question is on composition, not music direction.

[DarkSim]

In answer to your original question - you can get away with loads of melody in EDM. Just listen to Drive Hard by PrototypeRaptor, or The Ecstasy of Life by DDRKirby. They're both hugely memorable EDM tunes with 4x4 beats, but have strong melodic hooks to them. The general trend is away from melody into more rhythmic music for clubs, but that's not to say it doesn't have a place.

And just to touch on anterroir's point - it's generally a bad idea to make music just because you want fans. You should make music that you like to listen to yourself, and if other people do as well, that's cool. If you don't want to admit liking popular music like David Guetta or deadmau5, then don't make music just because you think it'll make you popular - at least admit to liking it first! That way when you do get fans and try changing styles, they'll hate you for getting all experimental!

[noTuX]

I know this is easier said, than done, but just do it! Take what you know so far, put something together, and listen to the feedback the community gives you. That's basically what I did for my Sonic 3D Blast remix (that somehow got YES'ed).

Are you trying to make original EDM, or some VGM remixes? If you're going for remixes, then you will definitely have to find a way to incorporate more melody into your EDM, or at least use original songs to do not have much of a melody.

I'm in a very similar boat, since I am trying to expand from chill/jazzy/hip-hop remixes. Ideally, I would like to be able to combine a bunch of different styles to make stuff that people don't really expect, but at the same time, I don't want it to sound like a mess.

Maybe get with remixers that have a style that you would like to learn, and see what they do. Even better, do a collab with them.

[Ryan Jobson]

Listen to a lot of music in the genres that you want to start making.

Write a couple of pages in a journal every morning - whatever is in your head, just get it out.

Write one song a day. This is for practice. You're not going to spend hours tweaking "dat bass patch" or anything. If you end up with a song that you really want to finish, go ahead, get to the mixing stage and work on the bass (and everything else) and finish it. Writing a song a day you are training yourself to not hesitate. That's also what the journal writing is for.

Have you read the book The Outliers, by Malcolm Gladwell? Spend 10,000 hours making said genre of music and you'll excel in it.

Then there is the internet and shitloads of tutorials and articles. Squeeze those in as well.

Basically man, you need to have a goal or plan in mind. Stick to it. Work hard, practice, and you'll get better at making the kind of music you want to make. I'm not sure if you're doing it to make money or for pleasure... but whatever you do, it'll take time.

If you've been making music for the past few years you should already know you can't expect to be spoon fed anything. Hopefully you take all of the comments you get, combined with your own research, and you should soon have a goal in mind to know what it will take to "get good" at making EDM. It will take time.

Cheers