Gollgagh Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Getting way off topic here, but I agree that mouse/keyboard is the way to play FPSs. Controllers are doable, but if you can use your mouse well there is no comparison. You just point where you want to shoot. Analog sticks are just way less accurate, although you can get used to them to the point where you can play well. In the end though, it's just a preference. A friend of mine only uses controllers since he's no good with a mouse. I could go either way. Some PC gamers probably can't use a controller at all. For most consoles yes, But I read a lot about Sony saying the HD could be easily accessed, removed and replaced by the user with any standard 2.5in HD. I don't think they would support any issues cropping up with using bew drives, but I seriously doubt the warranty would be voided. They are after all touting it more as a computer than just a gamemachine. I'll see if I can get any links to verify this. It might be a simple task to replace the drive but there are lot of morons out there. How does Sony know if you spilled your Dr Pepper in there wile you were swapping the thing out? Basically if you open your machine for mods you are on your own if it breaks. Most of the time the warranty is pretty short anyway. That would be so awesome. Can the drive be swapped out of both versions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilhead Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Getting way off topic here, but I agree that mouse/keyboard is the way to play FPSs. Controllers are doable, but if you can use your mouse well there is no comparison. You just point where you want to shoot. Analog sticks are just way less accurate, although you can get used to them to the point where you can play well. In the end though, it's just a preference. A friend of mine only uses controllers since he's no good with a mouse. I could go either way. Some PC gamers probably can't use a controller at all. Well, something along the lines of the Wiimote would be far more better for FPS IMO - you have even more freedom and you're not doing something as ridiculous as moving your mouse superfast to do something highly uncharacteristic of a supposedly human-controlled character. This is a contridictory statement. You are admitting that mouse control is so good that it almost makes your character TOO strong, yet you are saying something like a Wii remote is better? I've been using a computer mouse for over 15 years now, all the way back with the old Mac Plus, and it's gotten to be completely natural for me. With a mouse calibrated to my liking I can just instantly point to anything on the screen with great accuracy. So using it in an FPS is quite natural. Using a Wii remote might be fun, but it's far less accurate, at least at first. Take a laser pointer, point it at something across the room, and chances are you'll be a bit off. True, I'm sure you'll get used to it, but a mouse and keyboard is great for those of us who already use them every day and have been for years. Basically, we are saying the option to use it is cool, and that more developers should add that option. If they only way you are increasing difficulty in your games is by limiting the amount of control the player has, you're not making a good game. There are plenty of mouse controlled FPSs for the PC market that are quite difficult, even for seasoned FPS players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigfoot Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Plus with the wiimote, you can't hold the controller perfectly still, so your crosshair would be shaking a little bit like a real gun. So a mouse and keyboard is the best for any FPS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilhead Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Yeah, it comes out to balancing game play experience and gameplay. For instance, when Gran Turismo 3 came out I played it non-stop. Of course I wanted the official logitech weighted steering wheel and pedals. So I bought them. And returned them the next day. True, it was pretty cool to have that fairly realistic steering wheel in my hands but my game was suffering for it. My lap times were terrible when compared to the ones I got using the Dual Shock 2, so there was no point for me. Was it more fun to use the wheel? For about 10 minutes, then it was just frustrating. That's my main concern for the Wii. For some games I think it will be great, as it will allow some pretty creative titles. But why use the remote when you don't have to? Just for the hell of it? The new Zelda title is a good example. Does the Wii remote benefit the game at all? Really, there's nothing you couldn't do with a regular controller in that game, and it seems like the fighting controls are unintuitive and clunky. What's the point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitsuta Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Anyway, look at how Best Buy drops the ball again: http://www.gametab.com/news/731358/ I can't view it. What does it say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigfoot Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Anyway, look at how Best Buy drops the ball again: http://www.gametab.com/news/731358/ I can't view it. What does it say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeFu Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 That's my main concern for the Wii. For some games I think it will be great, as it will allow some pretty creative titles. But why use the remote when you don't have to? Just for the hell of it? The new Zelda title is a good example. Does the Wii remote benefit the game at all? Really, there's nothing you couldn't do with a regular controller in that game, and it seems like the fighting controls are unintuitive and clunky. What's the point? Well... have you played the Wii? I have, and the thing is really responsive. In Zelda, it's not about the swordplay, it's still the same, but with the remote, things become easier, not more difficult like using the steering wheel on GT3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilhead Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 That's my main concern for the Wii. For some games I think it will be great, as it will allow some pretty creative titles. But why use the remote when you don't have to? Just for the hell of it? The new Zelda title is a good example. Does the Wii remote benefit the game at all? Really, there's nothing you couldn't do with a regular controller in that game, and it seems like the fighting controls are unintuitive and clunky. What's the point? Well... have you played the Wii? I have, and the thing is really responsive. In Zelda, it's not about the swordplay, it's still the same, but with the remote, things become easier, not more difficult like using the steering wheel on GT3. No, I haven't, but the same could be said about the DS. The stylus is really responsive, but when given a choice, I always use the d-pad for control. The stylus is needed for games like Wario Ware and Metroid Prime, but do you really need it for games like Mr. Driller or some others? Actually, most of the games I like the best for the DS are d-pad based games like Mario Cart, Castlevania, etc. Basically, I think the remote should be used when it fits the game, NOT being forced into every game out there when it just doesn't make sense. And considering the remote is the primary means of control, we'll probably be seeing that a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigfoot Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Remember, this is a PS3 thread. Engadget interviews Peter Dille, Sony's SVP of marketing, about the PS3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bahamut Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Yeah, I shouldn't have made those off-topic comments, but neither should've Razumen. I won't respond in this thread, although I did also lose sight of my main argument in little of my last set of comments. Anyway, look at how Best Buy drops the ball again: http://www.gametab.com/news/731358/ I can't view it. What does it say? Best Buy cancelled all PS3 preorders via their website. The site the news bit was on was 1up.com, so I wonder if they block certain ISPs (I couldn't view 1up.com when I was at my alma mater and while I was on AOL). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigfoot Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Best Buy did pre-orders? They never do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bahamut Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Online they did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilhead Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Remember, this is a PS3 thread. Yeah, but if I talk about the Wii in the Wii thread I get flamed for 10 pages... Engadget interviews Peter Dille, Sony's SVP of marketing, about the PS3. Good interview. Says a lot about how I feel the PS3 will play out. He was a bit vague in places, but that's his job really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Damned Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Remember, this is a PS3 thread. Yeah, but if I talk about the Wii in the Wii thread I get flamed for 10 pages... That's because you troll there. Here, you're the king of the land, ruler of all you see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilhead Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Remember, this is a PS3 thread. Yeah, but if I talk about the Wii in the Wii thread I get flamed for 10 pages... That's because you troll there. Here, you're the king of the land, ruler of all you see. Well, I troll there now for fun. But I've tried to have serious, legitimate discussions many times there and I get flamed to hell and back for not worshipping the Wii. People who dislike the PS3 are free to join the discussion here without getting flamed. Not the case with the frothing Nintendo fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigfoot Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 NBA 07 load times take FOREVER on the PS3 Yeah, so it looks like putting games on the hard drive is a must. I think I counted like 27 or 28 seconds. I hope it isn't longer when actually starting a game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Damned Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Ever think that because you openly troll (and you admit to doing so), that they don't want to have any kind of discussion with you? Think about it; you show up, you throw some rocks at people's heads, and then you sit there and try to discuss the geological formations of the region and it's advantages and disadvantages over other kinds of rocks. I like where that analogy went. That was pretty good for on-the-spot. Also, Firefox's new spellcheck just suggested "anally" as a possible spelling of analogy. Also, the fanboy comments don't exactly help either. If you think you're above that sort of thing, why don't you prove it somehow? Like, I don't know... not trolling and not automaticly dismissing everyone as a rabid fanboy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitsuta Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Ever think that because you openly troll (and you admit to doing so), that they don't want to have any kind of discussion with you? Think about it; you show up, you throw some rocks at people's heads, and then you sit there and try to discuss the geological formations of the region and it's advantages and disadvantages over other kinds of rocks. I like where that analogy went. That was pretty good for on-the-spot. Also, Firefox's new spellcheck just suggested "anally" as a possible spelling of analogy. Also, the fanboy comments don't exactly help either. If you think you're above that sort of thing, why don't you prove it somehow? Like, I don't know... not trolling and not automaticly dismissing everyone as a rabid fanboy. Ignoring people who mud fling at you is possible. We promise! Seriously though, some people have seen you needlessly troll in that thread and elsewhere, think "he's just an idiot troll" and treat you as such regardless of what you say. I'm not like that - I actually responded to your previous post with the link to the article. But some are and you immediately use that to call everyone in that thread a fanboy. Then the people who didn't think you were trolling get annoyed, and on and on... NBA 07 load times take FOREVER on the PS3Yeah, so it looks like putting games on the hard drive is a must. I think I counted like 27 or 28 seconds. I hope it isn't longer when actually starting a game. Did you uh.. not pay attention to the video? The game said that it was going to load itself onto the HDD. That's actually really quick for loading onto the HDD, which I thought was a one-time load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilhead Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Ever think that because you openly troll (and you admit to doing so), that they don't want to have any kind of discussion with you? Think about it; you show up, you throw some rocks at people's heads, and then you sit there and try to discuss the geological formations of the region and it's advantages and disadvantages over other kinds of rocks. I like where that analogy went. That was pretty good for on-the-spot. Also, Firefox's new spellcheck just suggested "anally" as a possible spelling of analogy. Also, the fanboy comments don't exactly help either. If you think you're above that sort of thing, why don't you prove it somehow? Like, I don't know... not trolling and not automaticly dismissing everyone as a rabid fanboy. I've tried it. A lot of times. Read the whole Wii thread, I dunno. I've come up with some honest doubts or tried to spark discussions MANY times in that thread with no bad intent and literally been flamed for 5 or 6 pages, whether or not I respond. It's rediculous. No discussion is possible, so I'm over it. Try it yourself. Say something that isn't 100% positive about the Wii in that thread. 20 people will jump on you, and some will outright insult you personally, often without any kind of counter argument. Why try to debate with these people? It's a waste of time. Now I get my revenge by typing out a 5 sentence post or link one article and watch the fireworks. It's too easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigfoot Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Ever think that because you openly troll (and you admit to doing so), that they don't want to have any kind of discussion with you? Think about it; you show up, you throw some rocks at people's heads, and then you sit there and try to discuss the geological formations of the region and it's advantages and disadvantages over other kinds of rocks. I like where that analogy went. That was pretty good for on-the-spot. Also, Firefox's new spellcheck just suggested "anally" as a possible spelling of analogy. Also, the fanboy comments don't exactly help either. If you think you're above that sort of thing, why don't you prove it somehow? Like, I don't know... not trolling and not automaticly dismissing everyone as a rabid fanboy. I've tried it. A lot of times. Read the whole Wii thread, I dunno. I've come up with some honest doubts or tried to spark discussions MANY times in that thread with no bad intent and literally been flamed for 5 or 6 pages, whether or not I respond. It's rediculous. No discussion is possible, so I'm over it. Try it yourself. Say something that isn't 100% positive about the Wii in that thread. 20 people will jump on you, and some will outright insult you personally, often without any kind of counter argument. Why try to debate with these people? It's a waste of time. Now I get my revenge by typing out a 5 sentence post or link one article and watch the fireworks. It's too easy. It's because some know that you "try to troll", so when someone sees a post you make about the Wii that isn't positive one bit, they automatically assume you're trying to bash it on purpose. Look at the Zelda article you posted. Although some thought you were throwing hate on the Wii, others were like "cool, it's good to see that not everyone is over generous with their experience" or whatever. So yeah...PS3 load times..woo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Damned Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 I've tried it. A lot of times. Read the whole Wii thread, I dunno. I've come up with some honest doubts or tried to spark discussions MANY times in that thread with no bad intent and literally been flamed for 5 or 6 pages, whether or not I respond. Well, it's a little hard to take your comments seriously when the previous five posts you made were outright trolling. You can't just threw a pile of shit around and then carefully place a tiny nugget of gold in the middle. Man, these analogy things are awesome. It's rediculous. No discussion is possible, so I'm over it. Try it yourself. Say something that isn't 100% positive about the Wii in that thread. 20 people will jump on you, and some will outright insult you personally, often without any kind of counter argument. Why try to debate with these people? It's a waste of time. Now I get my revenge by typing out a 5 sentence post or link one article and watch the fireworks. It's too easy. They only jump on you because... well, I covered it above. That's why. There are other posts with critical comments and articles, but they don't get flamed. Why? I wonder. EDIT: Damn it, Bigfoot... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollgagh Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 That didn't look too bad. Unless those cutscenes were also part of the loading time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evilhead Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 I've tried it. A lot of times. Read the whole Wii thread, I dunno. I've come up with some honest doubts or tried to spark discussions MANY times in that thread with no bad intent and literally been flamed for 5 or 6 pages, whether or not I respond. Well, it's a little hard to take your comments seriously when the previous five posts you made were outright trolling. You can't just threw a pile of shit around and then carefully place a tiny nugget of gold in the middle. Man, these analogy things are awesome. Like I said, I don't give a fuck any more. I posted seriously in the previous Wii thread and this one but I've given up. Everything I do there now is to piss people off. It works. It's funny. Especially Kak. That guy sure gets worked up. But this is way off topic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigfoot Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Ever think that because you openly troll (and you admit to doing so), that they don't want to have any kind of discussion with you? Think about it; you show up, you throw some rocks at people's heads, and then you sit there and try to discuss the geological formations of the region and it's advantages and disadvantages over other kinds of rocks. I like where that analogy went. That was pretty good for on-the-spot. Also, Firefox's new spellcheck just suggested "anally" as a possible spelling of analogy. Also, the fanboy comments don't exactly help either. If you think you're above that sort of thing, why don't you prove it somehow? Like, I don't know... not trolling and not automaticly dismissing everyone as a rabid fanboy. Ignoring people who mud fling at you is possible. We promise! Seriously though, some people have seen you needlessly troll in that thread and elsewhere, think "he's just an idiot troll" and treat you as such regardless of what you say. I'm not like that - I actually responded to your previous post with the link to the article. But some are and you immediately use that to call everyone in that thread a fanboy. Then the people who didn't think you were trolling get annoyed, and on and on... NBA 07 load times take FOREVER on the PS3Yeah, so it looks like putting games on the hard drive is a must. I think I counted like 27 or 28 seconds. I hope it isn't longer when actually starting a game. Did you uh.. not pay attention to the video? The game said that it was going to load itself onto the HDD. That's actually really quick for loading onto the HDD, which I thought was a one-time load. I must have missed it, because I thought all it said was "It needs to be installed", but I don't remember any installing. I only saw "loading" like it was loading the menu. So it installs it without giving you a choice whether you want to or not? EDIT: Damn it, Bigfoot... what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Damned Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 You posted exactly what I was saying, but before I did. I believe the proper term for that is "jacked". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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