Palpable Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Vinnie: Actually I'm not using any swing... but check out this revamp:http://www.zirconstudios.com/music/wips/HH%20Track%204.mp3 I dunno, I'm ready to get crunk. The only problem is that the bass is pitched so low I can't hear it on my computer speakers... Radiowar: Awesome links! Thank you. The J.D. track is particularly excellent. Oh awesome, that's definitely an improvement. Maybe pronouncing the kick more was all it took. It still has a zircon flavor to it, which is cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-RoN Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 Wow! Just got a chance to listen to some of your stuff, zircon. I'm lovin' Track 1 even though it's more of a jazz kinda flavour. Track 2 is kinda more early 2000s-ish. Very neat.Track 3 has a nice meaty West Coast vibe to it (I particularily dug the rides that came in where the full beat officially pops in). But if track 4 would be where the money is, that's not bad too. Just keep it unique, homes! I'm out, Double A. PS The reason I posted those DJ Premier links is to give a little more inspiration to how things are still fundementally done in the streets. There are still heads who want to keep the battle loops and raw in-yo-face feel to rap that's been drowned out by crunk and snap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zircon Posted November 22, 2009 Author Share Posted November 22, 2009 Inspired by the DJ Premier stuff, here's another one, this time with a much lighter mood. I threw a Beastie Boys acapella on top just to see if it would mesh http://www.zirconstudios.com/music/wips/HH%20Track%205%20Beasties.mp3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Derrit Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Just from what I've listened to, track 4 just seems a little too sequenced, and the bass isn't quite what it's supposed to be at first. It comes in a little better later, but when its not the middle section it lacks oomph. Also, while drums are meant to be repetitive I feel like the type of drums you're using aren't quite fitting for hip hop type stuff. Even the set you're using could work, but if you're going to emphasize on it the way you are then it needs to be a little more dynamic. With instrumental rap in my experience (and I'm sure everyone will come up with a counterargument) starting with just the drums usually isn't the way to go unless you're going to make them sound really good, and with the drumset you're using there's just not a ton to it. You might think about sampling the drums as opposed to using a drumset, a lot of hip hop producers do that to good effect. Not that I don't like the direction you're going, but I don't want you to have an inflated opinion of your work if its not truly A+ material. Its a good start but there's some nuances to be understood as well. EDIT: The beasties track is good though. i like that. sometimes with rap simple is better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zircon Posted November 22, 2009 Author Share Posted November 22, 2009 I'm not sure what you mean by sampling the drums. All the drums I'm using are sampled. 100% of them are either drum machines sampled to vinyl/tape/MPC and exported back to digital audio, or acoustic shots ripped from vinyl. I don't use any multisamples or kits at all. As for track 4 sounding too sequenced, it's funny, because Palpable said the opposite. That to me means I'm doing it right. Speaking of, track 4 is supposed to be the same kind of beat as this; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Derrit Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 what i mean by sampled is that instead of using the instruments individually, people pull a full drum loop from an old jazz tune or the like and use that as a base sound, and then chop up the loop if they want to mess around with it. anyways, the drum composition isn't bad, and the samples aren't bad either. but i feel like its neither realistic enough for me to believe someone's playing it, nor is it synthed up enough for me to just look at it as a synthy set. the best way i can think to describe it is as the uncanny valley of percussion; the samples and the unfiltered sound is just realistic enough that you expect it to sound like a real drummer, but it doesn't. something to try, i've been trying to figure out what's wrong that's giving me such a hard time with this, and i think it's the hi-hat staying out so long. if you compressed that sample so it didn't stay out as long as it does (like you do later in the song, but maybe even more so) i personally think it would sound better. i don't know if i agree with the hat where it is but if you like it there then that would be something to try. also the wood blocks are kind of too creative. in a minimalist drum setup it seems to sit at odds with what you're trying to accomplish. once again, its not like you did it wrong but it just doesn't fit with the final goal. i'm not disagreeing with you just to be the guy who goes up against zircon, i just want to make sure you do it right and its not quite right yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zircon Posted November 22, 2009 Author Share Posted November 22, 2009 Yes, that is the old-school hip hop sound. Several of the tracks I've posted use sampled breaks and drum loops in that style. I'm trying to make a variety though, and that includes the dirty, nasty, almost minimal style of drumwork used by artists like David Banner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Derrit Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 i see where you're coming from with that. there's a lot that i edited over the past half hour so check my last post as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palpable Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 There's definitely a huge difference between the style of hip-hop based on sampled drum loops vs. drum machines and sampled individual hits. The former has a smooth realistic flow, the latter a rigidness or even fakeness or tackiness. That's not a hard and fast rule and what sounds good, sounds good, but I think the aim with a lot of drum machine-style hip-hop is stark rigidness, sort of a lack of flow. A lot of what you hear on the radio sounds programmed rather than played, and intentionally so. Though I understand Derrit's point about your songs getting "too creative", I think there is some leeway there in terms of minimalism and the woodblock/hi-hat trickiness didn't take me out of the minimalism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salluz Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 I do notice that some hip hop songs have a tendency to sound junky and non-fluent; unnatural. Any style of music sounds better with less cluttery drumming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noTuX Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Vinnie: Actually I'm not using any swing... but check out this revamp:http://www.zirconstudios.com/music/wips/HH%20Track%204.mp3 I dunno, I'm ready to get crunk. The only problem is that the bass is pitched so low I can't hear it on my computer speakers... Radiowar: Awesome links! Thank you. The J.D. track is particularly excellent. I can see this turning into a Sonic 3 Sandopolis remix. Nice work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kizyr Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Hm, the first thing I would've mentioned was UrbanizmMusic (urbanizmmusic.com) and particularly DCT (http://urbanizmmusic.com/artist/dct), though that's all already been brought up. The latest revamp you posted and mention of Sandopolis zone got me thinking of a few other sources, like with French/Arab hip-hop. Though since you're focusing on the instrumentation, some of these might be of more or less interest to you: Cheb Mami, K-Mel - Parisien du Nord (Cheb Mami does rai, K-Mel rap; there's some mix of the two genres here) Sniper (mostly Tunisiano), Leila Rami - Entre Deux http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4UyIYeLv5k (more mix of Arab/hip-hop influences here) Tunisiano, Zaho - Citoyen du Monde (both hip-hop though I think Zaho is closer to R& Sully Sefil - J'Voulais Tunisiano - Je Porte Plainte http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnLw3Ghjym8 (these're more about lyrics though; the beat gets repetitive after the first 20-30 seconds) For something completely different, there's Hime (Japanese hip-hop, one of the few female artists in the genre). Here're a couple that may interest you: Ukina- In the Rain- Tateba Shakuyaku- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDiP1s0EexE Hope this helps. I tried to focus on stuff that wouldn't normally come up in conversation, and might've overshot it. KF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SynthesizedStampede Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 In addition to the couple of Nujabes recommendations, try out Tsutchie, Fat Jon, and Blazo if you're just looking for random "instrumental hip-hop" for inspiration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zircon Posted November 23, 2009 Author Share Posted November 23, 2009 Can I get more links to the "ballad" kind of hip-hop? Like that Derulo one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palpable Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Not sure if I'd call these ballads, but a similar style to Derulo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGxcL8CYYoc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFknBy7F2R8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hpiwPXkbVc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geneson Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Inspired by the DJ Premier stuff, here's another one, this time with a much lighter mood. I threw a Beastie Boys acapella on top just to see if it would mesh http://www.zirconstudios.com/music/wips/HH%20Track%205%20Beasties.mp3 This one is really fun, I like it a lot actually. Very clear melody and rhythm to follow and move to. There is one track made by someone in this community that just screamed out hip hop to me when I was blasting it from my speakers, even though I'm not sure that was his intention. That track is Diggi Dis's Schala mix on Chronotorious. Maybe not as applicable past the intro, but the first minute evokes everything I love about hip hop: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ab56 v2 aka Ash Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 I didn't fully scan the thread, but here are a couple recommendations I didn't notice: -Nomak -Uyama Hiroto -Emancipator -Marcus D A lot of these guys collaborate with each other, but they have distinct styles you should check out. Substantial and Soul Position are a couple of good hip-hop artists who actually do feature lyrics, though I know you're not really looking for that. You should still check them though. Substantial in particular is pretty heavy on lyrics defining the song. </opinion from person who knows nothing about music> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtuse Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Recently a collaboration album came out between North American and South American artists that I really enjoy listening to called N.A.S.A - The Spirit of Apollo. Check out the related videos if you want to hear more. I really enjoy the following... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SynthesizedStampede Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 I didn't fully scan the thread, but here are a couple recommendations I didn't notice:-Nomak -Uyama Hiroto -Emancipator -Marcus D A lot of these guys collaborate with each other, but they have distinct styles you should check out. Substantial and Soul Position are a couple of good hip-hop artists who actually do feature lyrics, though I know you're not really looking for that. You should still check them though. Substantial in particular is pretty heavy on lyrics defining the song. </opinion from person who knows nothing about music> Dude, I just totally stumbled upon these people right before I came back into this topic wondering if anybody mentioned them yet. From reading the previous posts this time though, it seems the type of hip-hop we're recommending isn't the kind he's looking for unfortunately. Shame though, because what these guys dish out has definitely become my favorite type of music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zircon Posted December 2, 2009 Author Share Posted December 2, 2009 OK, after a brief hiatus, here's my attempt at the ballad style. http://www.zirconstudios.com/music/wips/HH%20Track%206.mp3 Try imagining the "Down" melody over it... since that was the big inspiration Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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