Tensei

Thanks a lot! I'll definitely check out your version, but I kind of made an improvised compressor myself (4 Mclass compressors+ 4 Vocoders)

I've made a real quick comparison between the new version and the old version, pretty much the only thing I did was turn down the gain on the limiter and put the master compressor on bypass (The compressor actually wasn't necessary at all, none of the parts were too silent or too loud). Pay special attention to how crisp the hi-hats sound in the first (remastered) part compared to the second. While I've normalized both versions to roughly the same volume (which is what a listener would do too; turn up his speakers if the mix was too soft, and vice versa), the drums in the remastered version are allowed to peak much higher, and thus have a much more obvious impact on the mix (because the second part is pretty much a compressed turd) Not really an update, but I was just intrigued by the positive dynamic impact provided by mastering the mix way softer, and allowing only the drums to peak.

Well, you could try looking on www.hammersound.net, that's where I found a few very decent FREE bass guitar-soundfonts (I'm pretty sure that Fruity Loops is able to load up soundfonts). I actually found that about 50% of the credibility and quality from the bass comes from the way you process it ( compression, EQ, distortion, etc.), you just have to pay attention so that it fits between your kick-drum and your rhythm guitar, without masking either of them.

Holy..Sh*t WHY did I decide today that I'd need a real DAW, and Reason 3 just won't cut it, then came up here to see this. DARN YOU, Propellerhead (Here's to hoping for a multiband compressor )

Ok, mad props for the rhythm guitar work, it sounds really powerful and is definitely the driving factor behind your cover. The lead guitar is definitely a bit worse, some parts sound dissonant and off-beat against the rhythm guitar (don't know whether this is on purpose, it's been some time since I've heard the the original). Generally, the guitars are well produced, but they tend to mask a lot of the lower end, which doesn't do much good for the other instruments. Unfortunately, the drums sound really boring, you should definitely set up more changes in the hi-hat rhythm, add more tom/snare fills, etc. Also, where's your bass-guitar? I couldn't hear a bass at all, and I presume that's not because my headphones are that bad ( because they aren't ).

Well since I'm doing everything in Reason, I do not have access to a fancy multi-band compressor (This might be my last mix in Reason, I really require a decent DAW for some of my needs), a solution might be messing around with the automation for the compression on the cymbals and stuff, but I'm not too sure if that would work out. EDIT: The solution was actually goddamn simple, apparently I had it mastered a bit on the hot side so I guess the volume of the kick+bass+ high-frequency cymbals peaked maybe a bit above 0 dB so that probably caused some artifacts, I've put the master compressor on bypass, turned the master gain on the limiter down, and cranked up the volume on my soundcard, and I'm amazed how this affects the drums ( in a positive way); the snare, the toms and the kick sound totally different. I guess loudness isn't everything.. Thanks a lot for the link, I hadn't found it yet, but it's definitely helpful. I guess I'll have to read up on the workings of an organ a bit more, since what you say hadn't occured to me at all. The Jeux soundfont is really kind of overwhelming with all the Ripieno, Plein Jeu, etc. presets.

Wow this topic is still alive? I had already made a new one, with quite a few updates since the last one here: http://www.ocremix.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10176

I definitely love the vibe you have going on, the arrangement is straightforward, but it definitely works. This might sound like a weird suggestion, but I'd absolutely LOVE to hear vocals. During the section where the piano dropped out, and the focus shifted to the organ and the bass, the soundscape became a little empty, and vocals would just sound so awesome there. But anyway, that's just my opinion. Definitely finish this.

Definitely add live violin to it, if you have the means to record it. A decent live performance goes a long way in raising the quality of the whole mix and adds so much more personal input to just about any song.

I guess it sounds alright, has a bit of a chiptuny vibe, but I'd recommend to not post a WIP before you have some more stuff done, simply because this is way too little material to comment on, and I can't even tell what kind of genre of music you're planning on having this mix be. Anyway, looking forward to hearing some more.

www.tindeck.com that's what I use anyway.

No gripes with the arrangement at all, but your mixes seem to be kind of drowning in reverb. It's almost as if I'm hearing the piano playing from an adjacent room, rather than having the feeling of being up close and personal. Also, some EQ would go a long way to make these mixes REALLY sound top-notch.

Well after re-listening to it a few times, I do agree the guitar takes a wee bit of a too prominent role compared to the other instruments, so I guess I'll just have to take it down a decibel or so while the piano is playing. And yes, I agree about the organ, it's just that I haven't been able to find a sound in the huge amount of different presets of Jeux 1.4 that comes close to sounding like a true gothic/baroque pipe organ, so this was the best thing I could come up with. When I listen to it by itself, I kinda like it, but indeed, after listening to some Malice Mizer, (gee, I just figured out this song looks a LOT like Malice Mizer's work due to the instrumentation) my organ patch sucks donkey balls.

Variable Bitrate Encoding is your friend. Anyway, great mix, and definitely good enough for an OCR-submission. This should get accepted.

While you're at it, try to fit in at least some reverb/delay, it would do this mix so much good, and it only takes a few minutes of work.

Well, I'm going for the most obvious criticism first: as far as sequenced guitar goes, this mix is decent. HOWEVER, it's still miles away from the quality it would be have if you had live guitars. The obvious solution is contacting some decent guitar player to do it for you (heck, even I'd be willing to record it for you, though there's much better guitarists around these forums). You have some interesting things going on with the violin and the choir and strings and stuff, but the guitar is IMO way too loud, and prevents the more interesting counter-melodies from surfacing. Also, the arrangement seems kind of repetitive, mainly because, even though the guitar plays around a lot of different melodies, it tends to stay in the same scale, and doesn't really explore the whole range of the guitar-neck. You also have some dissonance going on at 03:09. Also, the drums are CONSTANTLY repeated. If anything, try to at least change up the hi-hat rhythm, or maybe do some double-time/speed-up at some point to introduce variation. The mix as a whole has some interesting ideas, but it's just really repetitive.

Yay, another update, new stuff: - EQ, compression, limiting, etc. - Newly recorded rhythm Guitar - Piano Piano Piano! - Tweaked the arrangement of the intro a bit so I don't have to play in drop D - recorded "SFX": whammy bar harmonics and pick slides - Sequenced a silly piano intro, I'll probably leave that out in the final thing - New organ patch, straight from Jeux 1.4 All in all, I'm pretty content so far, my only real gripe is how the harpsichord has some dissonant harmonies, so I'll have to fix that. Also, the lead guitars SUCK, so I'm rearranging them a bit, and will be re-recording them with a different preset. Also, rhythm guitar makes things still too muddy, so I guess I'll have to rearrange the rhythm part so it doesn't contain that much full-blown power chords, but mostly one-string runs. Anyway, thanks for the feedback so far, it helped me a lot, but keep it coming!

Okay, I'd say this is a bit better, but still, a lot of my previous criticism remains. A good idea would be to add a LOT more of pads, because I definitely like the phasered-pad-thingy, and this would add SO MUCH more of your own input to the mix. Also, you might want to consider to have some kind of longer intro, and not have the bassline already playing from the start, maybe instead of it just have a few weird noises at the start, and then slowly fade-in the lead instrument, and after some time put the bass in. I would also love to hear some kind of really low-frequency pad, to create a very ominous hum, since that would fit this mix perfectly.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but don't bother submitting this as of now, it's definitely no OCR quality yet. - First and foremost, find decent samples, while the phasered pads and the bassline are decent, the lead-instrument just sounds way too bland and midi-ish to hold my interest for the duration of the song. Same thing for the snare. - You're basically conforming yourself to a very limited soundspectrum, as you have next to no low-end things going on. Even the mere addition of a kick-drum would fix a lot. Maybe layering the bass-like-thingy with a nice sub-bass patch would make it stand out a lot more, and fill up the empty soundscape. - You need variation to hold a listener's attention. Apart from maybe two short parts, the whole melody and rhythm keeps repeating itself. Try adding more melodic context, countermelodies, more pads, change the drum rhythm, the lead instrument, add arpeggio's, in short: be creative. - Utilize your effects rack, that's what it's for. Even the mere adding of some reverb here and there would fill up a lot of the empty space you currently have. - Decide what direction you're taking with your mix; Ambient? Add a lot more pads, delay, weird effects, slow down the tempo, throw the drums out of the window. Techno? Up the tempo, add rhythmic context, pumping bass. Your mix is currently floating sort of in between, it is absolutely critical you have a good idea of how you want your mix to sound, and try to work up to it. Hope my (lengthy) advice was sort of useful to you, anyway, good luck mixing

Yay rhythm guitar take 1 I've spent a lot of time EQing it, and (at least to my inexperienced ears), each separate part is now pretty clearly audible. The rhythm guitar gets kind of meh during the chorus (0:31) but I think that's more due to my sloppy playing (I had this recording lying around for some time, didn't have the chance to make a fresh recording because I busted my strings) than because of bad EQing. Anyway, feedback is welcome as always. Edit: Also, gawd that organ sucks. I need a good organ refill/soundfont, if anyone has access to a decent sounding gothic organ patch, maybe I could send the midi-organ part, and they would be able to fix a .wav file for me? =D

Well, thanks a lot for your compliments on the arrangement. I tend to get dissatisfied with it after working to long on it as it all seems to get repetitive, but I guess that's normal, so I won't touch it. And yes, I've only recorded about a third of the guitars you hear in the synth part, so that explains the improved clarity of the real version. Anyway, since at parts I'm having something like six different instruments playing different melodies, EQing them properly is extremely important, and this is unfortunately my main problem; I've done a few takes for my rhythm guitar, and I am just UNABLE to make it stand out nicely the way I want (I.E. Heavy and clear, yet not intrusive) without sucking up the much needed lower frequencies (I.E. Rolling off the lower shelf makes it sound like a trebly buzz). EQing things the right way is just so hard for me, especially with no spectrograph-reader-thingy in Reason.

IMO you should keep the loose quantization, since having it off-beat like this adds quite a lot to the live-performance-feel, as if it were played by a half-drunk pianist, if you know what I mean. but yes, either contact some live sax player on these forums, or find a half-decent saxophone patch. For the rest, the arrangement is slick, and the ending is awesome.

Guess you might have a point there. Putfile works for me because it just opens and plays files directly in the browser, but I guess it works differently for people with different plugin configurations. Anyway, mirrored them The Midi: http://midishrine.com/midi/15343.mid The Real Deal: The Synthy Real Deal:

Yes, I'm reposting this due to a lack of feedback, I definitely need some production guidelines, so I'd appreciate any and all feedback Full-on Midi Arrangement http://media.putfile.com/Bloody-Tears-Finished Partial MP3 Arrangement with recorded guitars http://media.putfile.com/Bloody-Tears-REAL-GUITAR Longer Partial MP3 Arrangement with Synth Guitars http://media.putfile.com/Bloody-Tears-Fake-Guitar Enjoy

Well, unfortunately, I can be pretty short about this one: The arrangement is basically a midi-rip, with maybe one added counter-melody (during the second half) that wasn't in the original. Also, I miss any kind of drive or lower-end behind this; while the original was a classical piece, this synthy cover IMO needs some drums and a steady bassline, which would go a long way to make it your 'own' remix, and not just a midi-rip. Finally, the whole mix sounds kind of dry, and some reverb would definitely go a long way filling in the now empty soundspace.