Crowbar Man

Hyperion: Just so you know: Sega only published/funded Bayonetta, Platinum Games was the developer. This has nothing to do with Revengence, which is published/funded by Konami (who are doing a lot better than Sega financially). Like Ptazza said, Platinum has a safe funding with Nintendo publishing/funding some of their games now too, why they would be sad? Though, I have a feeling Revengence won't be vital to the MGS timeline. If even canon at this point, but we'll see

Well considering that the timeline is currently "Complete" for now, you can get the full story playing through all but Ground Zeroes. Ground Zeroes will tie into MGS5 somehow, so unless you want to wait until MGS5 comes out, you wont get the new "complete" timeline until after MGS5 :/ Ground Zeroes is also a Naked Snake aka "Big Boss" game, takes place after Peace Walker but before MG1 for those who didn't know AC!D and Ghost Babbel are non-canon as mentioned, so they wouldn't complete the timeline. (Same with Snake's Revenge, which we can kindly forget about)

People are also assuming that the PS4/720/whatever will be power houses beyond imagination. I do not think this will be the case, I think we'll be seeing cheaper to produce consoles from all the big guys this next cycle. Only time will tell though. If any of the next gen consoles can run current titles in 60fps @ 1080p (or even 720p, most games can't even hit that target) that would be enough IMO More importantly, if devs were able to make fun and enjoyable game on the Wii with its ancient hardware and 88MB of RAM, they can make games just fine with slightly more modern hardware and 1GB of RAM. Also, as with any Nintendo console, you really are buying it for Nintendo's stuff anyways (anything else is just extra). If they pulled off great visuals on the Wii's crap hardware, they can pull out way better stuff with this.

Mirby: That is one way of doing it, if your system isn't powerful enough to have any sort of sandboxed hypervisor, which the PS2/Wii/GBA/etc didn't. The Wii U should, as they've even reserved an entire gig of memory for the system OS. Also see PS3 and having virtual memory cards for PS2 Well, for local multiplayer you could use the Pro controllers Why would you say such a hurtful thing Brandon? Also as mentioned by others, Nintendo rarely has ever made "casual" games, especially before the Wii. Not having blood and guts doesn't make a game casual.

The Wii U wouldn't have to have that much power to display Wii games in 720/1080p. It doesn't have to emulate much, if anything at all. Its doing Wii compatibility via hardware. 25GB is a lot of space, proprietary or not. Bigger than the 8GB that 360 currently uses. And if it reads faster than the PS3's slow drive, that is more important for games than even more GB. The N64's issue with its format is that 4MB-64MB carts were a lot smaller in storage AND more expensive to produce on compared to 600MB CDs (plus cheap multi disc = even more space). Not that they were proprietary.

They probably are, honestly. But offering a "Pro" route for those who want to be accurate shouldn't hurt, I don't think! As far as Genesis goes: VGM Music Maker For a multi FM/PSG tracker (Genesis, PC-Engine, and tons of 8bit consoles): DefleMask For NeoGeo: MVSTracker but software is old All of these are trackers and harder to do than covering each topic with a DAW type software though Covering all of 16-bit's (4th Generation) spectrum is a slippy slope indeed! Might be easier to focus on SNES after all, but theres definately Tracker and DAW support for FM stuff in both tools and community Anywho, probably over thinking it as usual. Good luck with the site! EDIT: Why Hello Gecko! Listen to Gecko, he knows his stuff. Also, Listen to Gecko's stuff.

Also, not to be picky, but what is listed so far isn't creating SNES music. Its music that sounds kind of like SNES. Currently there are no tools on the site at all to make actual SNES music (that will run on an SPC player / SNES/SFC hardware). Its just soundfonts and DAW software

LOL, yeah, it was in reference to the argument before. Thanks for chipping in with well thought out post though.

No Dhsu. There are no differences between PCs and consoles. Stop trying to bring up information and facts. STOP!!11 Emperor Charlemagne: Technically it is a type of DRM, but its the only DRM that actually works and is a benefit to customers than a hindrance. (Good prices, lots of sales, great interface, tons of community options (they added a whole lot recently), in game/cross game IM/chat/voice, in game web browser, achievements, a workshop for submiting your own fanmade stuff, Greenlight as a path for Indies onto its service, Big Screen for TV use, etc, etc). Benefits far outweigh the tiny con in this case. Most DRM is "Well we broke your game, sorry legit paying customer." The only major problem with Steam as a "DRM" is when companies decide they need more DRM on top of Steam, then crap gets broken like normal. And it was far from the first DRM, as mentioned. Wow, maybe find people who like to play videogames? People have LAN/console parties all the time (small personal ones, not big venues). Also as Bardic mentioned, a gaming spouse/couple is always good for at least 2 player Part of the Wii's business model focused on people in the living room playing together, and thats continuing with Wii U (with an extra 5th player screen to boot!). Not sure if we'll see too much of that on Ouya since its isn't exactly a power house, but 4 player on the same screen, non split, I definitely want to see some of that.

Been waiting for this, I think the Big Screen Steam interface is a fantastic idea. Combined with Greelight, it gives yet another option for indies to make games for controller/TV, though not quite a console (NEXT STEP VALVE), its better than one for power gamers / PC gamers. Steam really is the best thing to happen to the PC. Or the game industry in general Ouya supports up to 4 Ouya controllers

Ramaniscence pretty much is on point. The only thing I can figure out why Neblix/Derrit are getting so fired up is because somehow they think me pointing out basic definitions is saying one is better than the other. I clearly just said people have different preferences. But they aren't willing to accept anybody has preferences different than their own. At this point its not even rejecting Ouya, its just rejecting the entire concept of console gaming itself. Clearly, nobody must of bought consoles. Ever.

Well, the only thing unique about Ouya at this current time is the concept. The promise of free/cheap software in mass, an easy gateway to Indie gaming for both consumer and dev, and the ability for devs to affordably update/release new content for their software easily. Consoles currently do not do any of this. That unfortunately is all they have right now until they get some actual games that make it popular enough / unique against the other consoles. Since they do not develop software themselves, they are completely at the whim of whoever develops for them at this time, which is why I mentioned its very important for them to appeal to devs/hobbyists alike. Without them the console has no chance, because software is key for any hardware As far as "mainstream" attention and "Walmart", I don't think they will be able to do either of those unless they have a much larger capital than anybody knows about. Those can always come later, but for now I really only see this being marketed and shipped online. The Derrit: Firstly, my post was about Mercenary Kings. It has only been announced for PC/Ouya. You didn't even read my post, yet you are trying to form poor arguments. I don't even see where you are getting your Wizorb information from, its not on the Wizorb website or on any of Ouya's information. SO why Wizorb is in the conversation I don't know. It isn't an Ouya game yet, but it could possibly be later I'm sure. When/if it does, why would it be bad for either consumer or the dev exactly? Your only argument was you don't want people to have a choice to buy it on Ouya. Uh, I don't think I'm the only one that likes to play games on a console. It is a pretty big industry overall if you didn't notice. This website your on? OCRemix? Mostly remixes of console game music past and present. My opinion isn't important, I'm speaking in generalizations because I was talking about the general advantages and why people in GENERAL like consoles. You seem to have a hard time understanding anything but your own likes and can't see beyond that scope. I play games on my PC all the time. Probably far more than my consoles, especially now that more and more multiplatform console games are on the PC too. I still play console games all the same. Maybe its a hard concept to grasp, but I like videogames.

Neblix: RTS typically do not sell well and do not play well on consoles. This is a known issue, and nothing new. Ouya at least has a touchpad, and maybe they might include mouse support, but I don't see this changing for consoles. However, there aren't a ton of indie RTS games either. FPS however, is extremely popular on consoles (Halo, Call of Duty, Battlefield, Resistance, Killzone, etc). While I agree that Mouse & Keyboard is a superior option, there is nothing "uncomfortable" or "akward" about playing an FPS on a console. Its just not as fast/precise, but console-specific FPS games are generally tweaked that it doesn't matter as much. I've never said anything about developers NEEDING Ouya over the PC (DaMonz said that, and went too far with that). I'm just saying Ouya is the only affordable console to develop on. Again, PC is not a console. No matter how much you try to argue it is, its not. But yeah, Indie devs should definately make sure to support any platform they can spare time dev'ing for. More platforms = More sources of income = better, after all. Steam is a terrific place (though you aren't guaranteed to ever get there, even with Greenlight), along with Desura, Indievania, putting up on your own website, etc. The Derrit: 2) Um, its one of the big focuses of consoles is playing on a TV, with a controller. Its one of the main selling points of Ouya. Yes you can play consoles on a monitor technically, but that doesn't make it the norm. 3) There are lots of computer illiterate people in the world. 5) Again, there are people who do not buy computers for gaming, or just do not want to game on a computer and/or play PC games. 6) Those people are pretty irrelevant, because those people would not really be interested in consoles at all. 7) Then they shouldn't buy one? Whats so hard to understand about that? Not everybody has to buy an Xbox 360 or PS3 or Wii, but some people did. I bought all 3. Not everybody does that. And I still game on my PC to boot. To each their own Thats great for you? What about the people who wanted and bought the Ouya and want to buy the game on it? They shouldn't have that option because you don't want to buy it there? Are you suggesting there shouldn't be options other than the ones you want? There really isn't point here

Now past the arguments: OUYA NEWS: Some of the developers behind the excellent Scott Pilgrim Versus the World : The Game have made their own indie studio (Tribute). Tribute has made Wizorb and now have Kickstarted their second game : Mercenary Kings! The game is slated for Windows (Steam) first and then later Mac (Steam) and Ouya! Art is by (bizarre) pixel artist, Paul Robertson! It looks like Contra/Metal Slug style side scroll shooter mixed in with RPG elements and uh... Crafting!? 4 player local coop! http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/322438897/mercenary-kings Kickstarter is still going (has met goal though) for anybody interested

Neblix: Super Meat Boy on a keyboard? Why would you do that to yourself? Also, lots of games that "support controllers" including the ones you mentioned again only support one specific controller, the Xbox 360 controller. See my post about if you DON'T WANT TO USE a 360 controller. Also, there are tons of indie games that just have "use xpadder/joy2key" in the readme for "controller support". I can go gather them up if you really want me to, but trust me, I've played plenty. Wyn and Keep off the top of my head is a platformer that didn't have controlller support. Even has 2 player single screen co-op, using the same keyboard. Blah! I had to, as usual, fiddle with Xpadder to get 2 player controller support going. Much more fun that way IMO, but again, not everybody is going to take the time to do that. Binding of Isaac literally says it in the options. "GamePad ?: Use JoyToKey", and the game plays way better as a dual stick game. Older versions of Game Maker, a popular game creation tool, didn't have controller support, even after they added it it, some devs do not implement it for whatever reason. Flash doesn't support controllers at all, and there are lots of Indies that use Flash to create their games. The original Meat Boy, Binding of Isaac, and VVVVVV just to name a few. Neblix: Not entirely sure where your point is going here, but just so you know DirectX is basically only for Microsoft's ecosystem, and I think its slightly different for each one of their platforms. OpenGL (which is only video) is far more cross platform, but even that has a different flavors for different types of devices. I don't know what your point is exactly, but acting like DirectX somehow solves all multiplatform problems is weird. Neblix/DaMonz: Like or not he does have a valid point that a lot of games these days do support controllers, even if it is usually just the 360 controller. Also, if you are oddball enough, you can technically play all kinds of games with a KB. I wouldn't call it fun but to each their own I guess. However, just having a controller doesn't make something a console. There are even hassles associated with trying to get a controller to work on a PC (i've mentioned) which don't exist with consoles. Trying to get PC players to use a controller sometimes is its own obstacle (See Neblix playing Super Meat Boy with a KB for some bizarre reason) Also have no clue where hes getting his "Theres no difference in developing for different hardware" info, but thats just wrong. The Derrit / Neblix: Why are we talking about high end games again? Has nothing to do with indie development, generally indies stay away from high end because of cost. For People Still Going On Console Vs PC: Console Advantage: 1) NO technical skills required 2) Smaller size and generally more accepted near a TV 3) Ease of use, and No OS/Driver issues 4) No broken DRM systems 5) Far less expensive 6) Controller as a focused input instead of "maybe supported maybe not" 7) Some people have no interest in PCs/PC games and wont buy one, or buy games on one anyways. I play games on my PC all the time. I also play tons of console games just the same. If you can't even understand the benefits of a console to begin with, then you aren't going to understand why someone would want an Ouya (or any console) or to develop on one. Well, I don't know about each one of them, but maybe just because they wanted to? Again, there are plenty who make games without even charging for them. Also: Its hard to get a job period, so don't act like its so easy for everybody to just go out and get a job in any sort of software field.

I don't think anybody enjoy some those examples on a keyboard. But I guess you missed the spot where I said they would technically "work" just not be any fun. Uh yes, there is such a thing as not supporting a controller. Why would you even say this? You have to program in controller support. If its not there, its not there. If you bothered to read the rest of what I said, having to use joy2key or xpadder or something similar is not "Controller Support" by the dev. Its outside support, and not something your average joe will put up with or know about. Its not even fun for those who are in the know. 1) Being good and popular doesn't magically give you enough money to produce on a console. 2) Again suggesting if you aren't on a console you aren't good/popular enough. 3) See Valve. Even if you have enough money to get your content to a console, its still a gigantic money sink to continue to produce updates and content, don't even think about doing it for free. Unlike PC/Android/iOS where you can get frequent updates and new content, even for free. This is something that would be amazing to have on consoles. *sigh* Well, the Dev Kit, and I'm sure there are other costs, but most of them unrelated to actually making games. The hell are you even talking about here? Indie games are not typically high end, even when they manage to have enough money to get on a console. Consoles are typically lower end than PC anyways, sky is the limit on the PC. Really, you aren't making any sense. I serioiusly think you've confused "Console" with "High End"/"AAA". I have no freaking clue what you are talking about with the 2D to 3D transition. That has nothing to do with anything, console games don't even have to be 3D. Even if they were, there are plenty of tools now to develop a 3D game, its far less expensive then when doing 3D at all was considered high end. But that has nothing to do with anything.

I can name whole genres. Platformers (like the before mentioned Super Meat Boy), Fighters, and Racing games are pretty akward to play on a keyboard & mouse. They may technically "work" but yeah. No thanks 3rd person action/adventure games are kinda wonky if they dont get it right, which they usually don't. Thats more of a preference than a problem though Also, any sort of game where you want to play with more than one player on a single screen. Again, possible but sharing a KB isn't fun (this is to those who keep saying PC = Console, too) As I mentioned earlier, lots of PC games simply don't support controllers. Or only work with the Xbox controller. You have to use stuff like Xpadder or Joy 2 Key, or use the Xbox 360 controller emulator or DualShock 3 / Sixasis custom bluetooth drivers (and buggy Motioninjoy). Even if you get it working, you have to map keys every game. I can do it because I'm willing to fiddle all day to get something working, but its a lot to go through for your average joe. And thats on top of possible driver issues, possible OS problems, possibly crappy DRM that breaks your game, etc. Consoles you select a game, pick up a controller and you are ready to go. If only this were really true :/ A good game is a good game. Acting like having tons of money to afford a console license somehow makes games better again is, again, a shallow thought. There is plenty of garbage that comes out on consoles. Acting like its a space Indies do not deserve to be on isn't helpful. Even Valve thinks consoles are too expensive to produce content on like they do regularly on the PC An affordable Indie focused console would be nice outlet for those who want to make console style games, but don't happen to millionaires.

PS3 wont help you with III (PSP), X, XI, and XII unless you find an older BC model. (PS2 games) The only game that requires a PS3 is XIII, which isn't that great. Get a PS2 and your all set except 2 games! $450 is a ridiculous price though. Square must still think their brand is still worth something.

Nope. I've already said this (repeating myself): As a person who regularly uses his computer with a controller, I can safely say it is not a game console. Your average person doesn't have the patience to deal with the problems a computer has, nor the skill to build one. Your average games do not have good/any controller support. There is no way to do it on the cheap either. Conversation was about marketing a console to both devs and gamers. So why Steam was mentioned at all is a mystery, as with why he feels its "impossible" since its done all the time, and they already have started (See Kickstarter, marketed the console to both devs and gamers. Not hard) I originally asked you if a console that was available was made that was affordable to develop for, why not? You have sidestepped this, and responded with another one of your insulting, shallow remarks about Indies. The whole point of Ouya is that it is an inexpensive way for Indies to get their game on a console. Admittedly, that picture is a bit misleading. However, maybe I should quote the kickstarter? This sentence is RIGHT next to the other one. Convenient you left it out. "Free 2 Play" and Demo w/ full upgrade are completely different concepts. While these still may be "free to play" (this is where the image is slightly misleading) they aren't "Free 2 Play" models. Either way, other people and I have pointed out the demo with full charge thing over and over and you seem to ignore it. If you are going to still say the Demo model isn't good for consumers and developers a like, I'd say id Software and even the entire industry (even XBLA/PSN) disagrees with you. [EDIT to finish] 5. Its an Indie focused console. That is technically new. It is also bringing Free 2 Play (the model) to consoles. Again, new. Note: Wii's "custom chipsets" were redesigned GameCube parts. Either way, custom chipsets, even recycled ones, are more expensive than SoCs. Not something you do when you are offering a budget console AND a start up. 6. It makes it more fun that way, Sugar Pie Sweetiekins. Also a computer isn't a console. You can just stop calling me ignorant because clearly, I'm not the one who is. Oh and Great advice. That is the way things change. Not doing anything. 7. Uh we've been over the whole controller thing. Do we really have to go over it again? Are you really going to ignore everybody on that? Quoting some random guys opinion on PA doesn't make everybody elses examples go away. We've already gone over this multiple times on how projects can be ported over essentially for free. If you'd like me to repeat what me and others have said, I can do so. But yes, the ports of pre exsisting Android produts are essentially free. Clicking "Make Ouya Version" and changing a few scripts on Unity is also pretty "Free" when Unity gets the option. 8. You can continue to say pepole giving them money and them getting a console is not a sale, but that person still gave the same ammount of money a person buying the console would of if they never had a Kickstarter. Also, when the units ship, those people are still going to get a console, and still be counted as users, and will (hopefully at least) buy products for it. I was under the impression they were just porting the already exsisting Android version over. Do you have some new information that hasn't been announced yet? Otherwise, again, you have no idea what you are talking about.

Neblix: I have no idea what you are trying to say with the Mojang stuff then. WE both agree the console isn't out (because that is reality). I have no idea what your other point is. Eh, you can call them not sales if you want. People paid they are selling the machine to get one (or higher). Same thing with preorders, since you pay full price. Maybe by some semantics you can say that is not a sale, but its pretty close to one IMO Well you are switching subjects. Topic was simply about what the device was being marketed as, now you are talking about the cost of marketing itself? That is a completely different subject. Incorrect. I was going to mention, Raspberry Pi and Arduino are better for hardware prototyping and something more compact in a DIY project, I decided my post was getting too big and cut it out. A mistake I guess. Ouya is still more powerful when it comes to things that need more raw power / RAM. Ouya has already mentioned the device will be "hack friendly", meaning more than likely its boot loader can be changed to make it an ARM linux box. Its not practical for some projects but for like, a media server, media box, general linux server, etc it can still be useful for its power over Arduino/Raspberry Pi. I am just going by what Ouya has said, if they turn on their word, then you are correct. Either way, making games is still important for some people, no? EDIT: Actually you could take the MB out of the box to reduce the Ouya's size, then the only issue is whether they put any sort of extra pins for hardware interface (probably not), otherwise you'd have to go through USB. Not a giant issue but inconvenient. Also, Ouya has Wifi. Maybe you missed every single post where I've pointed how Ouya is doing things differently and on the cheap compared to the big guys? Yes certain things will still need to fall in place, but they are SIMPLE ECONOMICS like "Developers makes games, so console manufactures need to appease and gather devs". These still apply, because it is a game console. I'd like you to point out where I've said something wildly different that conflicts like you are saying I did. I've given examples of how a dev could put a game with very little risk on the system. If you want me to repeat myself, I can, but I'm just about tired of typing it and it being ignored. It doesn't apply to every dev, but it does in the case scenarios I've point out over and over. It is a great idea! IMO at least. They DID meet their Kickstarter goal! (FACT!11) And Dhsu gave the facts about the deep pocketed friends. "They have everyone's support" They should, for anybody wanting to support the cause. But its obvious there is a ton of pessimistic people, and people who don't care about Indie scene at all obviously not. "Everyone will buy the system" Not something I've ever said? I said quite the opposite. They could start a project, but I stated (in my post you are responding to) it is not a good idea to do anything without testing it on hardware at some point. So agreed? I wasn't sure what your original point was anyways They can do it for phones and tablets because they all work the same way. Uh, this isn't true at all. The behavior between Emu and devices can be radically different. Even different phone models can unfortunately behave differently, and tablets by design behave different than phones. I have no idea where you are getting this misinformation. This is why Android developers need to gather feedback (before would be helpful, but definitely after) for different devices in case there are issues. Issues lead to lost sales. If what you said were the case, you'd be arguing against yourself, because Ouya is an ARM chipset (Tegra 3) running on Android so should technically run the same as a phone/tablet. A controller is just another type of input. It doesn't change the OS/framework. We've had this conversation before. Also, "testing costs" depends on the dev/size of the project. A tiny project can be tested by yourself and/or peers for nothing. Having a testing group is something big name companies do (well, sometimes. and not that it helps if they dont listen to their testers, but thats another story) You should definately test it on hardware before you release it (incredibly stupid to only use the Emu), but it doesn't mean you can't start development (general prototyping, brainstorming, etc) on it without hardware, which was my point. The Derritt: *sigh*. Im going to have to clear an afternoon to respond to that heap of BS. No time now.

So my interpretation is wrong because its different than yours, but neither of us have facts to prove each other wrong? The only facts we have is it was on a Kickstarter that met its goal. Mojang didn't give numbers, big or small. 60K / $9 million is pretty big though for a product that isn't even real yet. So whatever, you can interpret it any way you want I guess? You aren't making much sense to me though Buy Games: Wow thanks for the obvious. Develop Games: Wrong. Right now you can technically start developing on the "Ouya" by making an Android product or Unity game. When the SDK comes out, you then convert your project over. The SDK should still be released before the hardware is. If its based off the Android SDK, it has an emulator. Unity, you just have to wait for Unity to sell a Ouya license, then buy it and click the "Make Ouya Version" button. Unity is slow to adopt new licenses sometimes, so it might be best to start elsewhere unless your going multiplatform anyways. But it is better technically to have the hardware, Emulators don't always act the same as the real thing. I'm still not entirely sure what your point is though. Obviously when/if it comes out, devs will be buying it to test their products on real hardware? Except their deep pocketed friends that Dhsu already pointed out. Again, nobodys know how much money they already set aside to start this project. They obviously did not plan on using the Kickstarter for anything but advertisement, because 950K is too small to start a project this ambitious. NOt even sure why they were allowed to do a kickstarter if they had previous funding. Regardless, when/if the product comes out, it wont just be a mission statement, it will be a product. If it never comes out, none of this matters? This is obvious. Ouya has made 60K sales so far. If they aren't selling it at cost, then they are already making sales as we speak. I'm sure some of those people plan on buying products for their hardware? Controllers, Games. More sales/profit. Sales numbers will go up when the hardware releases, numbers will go up once more games come out, etc Uh, console manufacturers technically sell their business to developers all the time (See gigantically expensive Dev Kits and Licenses per game). The only difference here is the risk is dramatically reduced for both parties with Ouya (well, Ouya is taking a much bigger risk than the devs actually, but no where near as much as MS/Nintendo/Sony does). In fact, as i've mentioned multiple times, depending on the product, it may as well be no risk for some devs. Also, maybe you havn't seen Android/iOS devices? I've mentioned them or twice. And the fact this is borrowing from their current success models. And even using Android (*sigh*) Steam doesn't sell hardware, as you said, so why are you saying "they can do it for both (sell hardware)"? Depends on what kind of programming, no? Game programming would be easier/better on the Ouya obviously. Honestly, I don't get most of your points.

Uh, I said they haven't made the product yet. Obviously since not a single unit has shipped. How exactly do you release a game on a product that is not out? And they did get enough people. The Kickstarter met goal. And if 60K people pledging $9 million isn't enough people to warrant a free port, why exactly did they put this quote on a page only asking for $950K? This was obviously a line to encourage people to join the Kickstarter, which they did. You are just assuming the numbers Mojang wanted is larger than what they got. Neither of us know this for sure, but regardless, it was on their Kickstarter which met goal. If Mojang has said "These numbers are still not enough" then at that point, I would be in fact wrong. And Mojang would be dumb ? Billy should look into Ouya. It can let him do awesome things too You can say this about any console. But Ouya is the only one where the games are dirt cheap / free. And, may get exclusives from smaller devs in the future. Developers make games. Right now it is important for the system to be aimed at developers ease of use and low cost to port/create games. What part of that is hard to understand? Games will obviously come later if it gets off the ground at all. Since Ouya themselves do not make games, how exactly do you expect them to magically get games unless they aim to appease developers? Also, it is marketed at ALL THE ABOVE. Developers, Gamers, and Hobbyist. Anybody who can get their hands on it and wants to play with it and create anything they want with it. Its part of their mission statement If you aren't of the creative nature, you can just sit and play games on it (once they start accumulating). EDIT: I should mention this is if it gets released. All points are moot if they never make it to market.

1. When Ouya comes it, it will be an actual thing? 2. A hobbyist device is a larger market then that PLUS a game console? Really? 3. Ouya is dirt cheap, and it has a simplistic design with a SoC inside. 4. Raspberry Pi has a community of developers that release things for free. If it can gather developers who aren't even making money, your saying that Ouya can't when developers are making money? And you can make your own programs/games on the Ouya, obviously. You don't even need to hack it. But you can do that too on top of it. Um this was for getting people to join the Kickstarter. They met goal, maybe you didn't hear? It was kinda a big thing. Though they still need to make the final product. Also, Minecraft was running on their prototype, if I recall. Once again, $9 million is just their Kickstarter. It is not their total funding capital. It was mostly free marketing and a preorder campaign. Seems like it worked! Obviously they couldn't do it on 9 Million alone. They were only even asking for 950K for the Kickstarter which would of been nearly impossible if that was all the funding they ever had period The Derrit: Once again, you are wrong, because you don't even know the definition of Free 2 Play. "Free 2 Play" model is where you give the entire game away, and the player can complete it without spending a dime. However, it offers several items for sale, that either help or are just for show. See the games you listed in the quote about Free 2 Play. A demo where you can unlock a full game is not Free 2 Play. Otherwise most XBLA/PSN games are "Free 2 Play" which is definitely not true. They do support and encourage the Free 2 Play model. That is all they said. They do not require it. Developers are free to charge for their games. They just require a free demo. And if you are saying you can't make money off games when you give away a free demo, again, thats one of the oldest economic model in the industry, id built their (once huge) empire by doing just that. See, this is a terribly anti-indie statement, and shallow thinking. Just because you don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars, doesn't mean you are good enough to make a game? Bullshit. Again, I guess all the developers who make games that aren't on Steam/XBLA/PSN, but may make it self release/Desura/Indievania/freeware/etc on the PC/Mac/Linux/Android/iOS just aren't good enough and shouldn't be making games. Yeah, nobody else does that. pointing at Nintendo So there is another inexpensive console which focuses on cheap or free content? Also, what else do you suggest for someone trying to bring an inexpensive console for indie development? XBLIG: XBLIG is trash. MS treats their XBLA devs like trash, so you think XBLIG is better? and they completely hide the fact XBLIG exsists half the time. You can't even play XBLIG games offline I dont think. You can't even port anything to XBLIG easy, it uses XNA tools which at the time basically means just PC and XBLIG. Maybe Windows Phone, the most unpopular platform on the mobile market! Also it uses C# to boot. Android, and I assume by extention, Ouya, can use JAVA (multiplatform) and C++ (the best) with the NDK. Unity also does not support XBLIG and probably never will. I don't think any middleware platform does There were still some sucess stories there regardless. But it wasn't MS's doing. It was the developers. Cheap PCs aren't consoles. You can hack anything to get pirated games/emulators/etc. Doesn't stop games from selling. Tired of hearing about that like thats a real problem. So again, you find quotes for things I've already mentioned, over and over and over.

Having a library of games at all is important. You can keep denying that if you want. The exclusives may come later (may not). Not even big name consoles have a lot of exclusives or interesting games at launch. That is why backward compatibility is sometimes a selling point. "Android" is sort of their "backwards compatibility" if you think about it in a very odd way They do support the Free 2 Play model and encourage developers to use that model. However, "force" indicates that there is no other options and you have to do this. I've pointed out (and other people) over and over and over, the only minimum requirements is at least some portion, ie demo, of the game has to be free. See Final Fantasy III (Free Demo, pay full price for unlocking the rest of the game), and more than likely, Minecraft, Shadowgun, etc (Unless they change the way they are sold on Android). So no, I'm not wrong, they aren't wrong, you are wrong. Geez. Why not, if an affordable option becomes available, exactly? This comment makes no sense. Uh, how do you figure? Especially for people making an inexpensive console for indies, like oh say... Ouya is trying to do? I doubt everybody wants a Rasberry Pi. Didn't stop Rasberry Pi, doesn't stop people from buying it, doesn't stop it from being used and loved by the people who do.

Yeah, I caught that and decided to delete. Thanks!