Nintendo's Big Press Conference

[Overflow]

Are they actually remakes, or just ports? I was under the impression that Nintendo was just going to re-release a line of "ultimate player's choice games" that aren't changed at all, except for some new box art or something. While I would love wii controls for prime 1 and 2, remember: This is Nintendo. They're probably going to take the easy road, which IMO is fine by me. If I want to play the original pikmin, I want to play it the way it was meant to be played, no extras or added controls. If I wanted the extra wii stuff I should get the wii version, is all I'm saying.

Plus...Is it just me, or does the DSi have better graphics??? It DEFINITELY has a higher resolustion, and the graphics look upped.

[The Mutericator]

EDIT: As if anyone cared, I did wanna weigh in on the DSi. I'm EVENTUALLY gonna buy a DS, because I do love the system. But I totally won't buy it without a GBA slot. I like GBA games. A lot. My point is, Nintendo kinda screws new adopters doing this kinda stuff, even if it is late in the hardware cycle. It seems to me all they've really done with this announcement is REMOVE functionality from the DS, and offer a few downloads to replace it. Correct me if I'm wrong, because I don't actually own one and I haven't really tracked the hardware very hard.

That's not punishing early adopters, that's punishing people who never bought in despite knowing that eventually the slot would be removed. I bought a DS at launch and have had it since, and will get a DSi. Same with the GBA - got an original, didn't upgrade until the DS. You've had literally four years to buy it, and DS sales are slowing down (finally) - basically, 99% of the people who were actually gonna buy DS's already have.

Also all they've removed is the GBA slot, which makes Guitar Hero DS unplayable on it. But if you wanted GHDS, you already have it and a Lite. And if you wanted something to play GBA games, you already have it. They shouldn't have to cater to backward compatibility after all this time, especially when the market has so many popular ways to play those games (GBA, SP, Micro, DS, DS Lite). Again, that's not punishing early adopters, that's moving forward. (Also if all you think they've added is downloads, I suggest you do a lot of research, you're way off.)

I agree with you on Metroid Prime, though.

I don't know about you guys but Gamecube games with waggle controls sounds pretty terrible. That and I'm not paying for games I already own, kthx.

Man if you still think wagglan' is an accurate term for Metroid Prime 3's controls you need to stop going to /v/.

[Shadow Wolf]

While I would love wii controls for prime 1 and 2, remember: This is Nintendo. They're probably going to take the easy road, which IMO is fine by me.

My only hope there is that Retro Studios actually has a LOT of creative control over the Prime games, and Retro half asses NOTHING. So I think if they remake the controls, they'll do a bang up job of it.

That's not punishing early adopters, that's punishing people who never bought in despite knowing that eventually the slot would be removed. I bought a DS at launch and have had it since, and will get a DSi.

That's quite possibly the silliest argument I've heard in weeks. Some people, like myself, haven't bought in because they can't afford it at the moment. But never have I heard a person say "You know, I'd buy it, but it just does too many cool things. I think I'll wait a few months until they take some of the cool features away, and pick up the one with less functionality."

Your late adopters are waiting for the PRICE DROP. The ONLY thing removing the GBA slot does is reduce the size, and I have ALWAYS disagreed with removal of functionality in favor of miniaturization. Now I know there's ways around this, I'll go out probably quite soon and pick up a DS Lite for dirt cheap thanks to this thing. But i shouldn't have to go with the last generation because the NEW gen is missing something it had before.

[Jam Stunna]

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6198478.html?om_act=convert&om_clk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;2

From that article:

"One other issue that the DSi does not address, notes Schachter, is the hardware's microprocessor unit (MPU). However, Schachter believes this fact may be good news for gamers looking for an all-new Nintendo handheld sooner rather than later. "As software capacity is growing, requiring greater hardware MPU capacity for handheld devices, we believe a full model change is needed to meet demand over the next three or more years."

Are you guys really prepared to drop $200 on a DSi next year, knowing that an entirely new system is coming two years after that?

[The Mutericator]

My only hope there is that Retro Studios actually has a LOT of creative control over the Prime games, and Retro half asses NOTHING. So I think if they remake the controls, they'll do a bang up job of it.

You know, if Nintendo passed over the order to Retro to port MP 1 & 2 to the Wii, it would help explain the walkout by the three leaders a few weeks ago. After they were done MP3 they pretty much said they were done with Metroid and very happy to be moving on.

That, and if I were stuck programming for one series for however many years it's been, I'd probably get sick of it too.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6198478.html?om_act=convert&om_clk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;2

From that article:

"One other issue that the DSi does not address, notes Schachter, is the hardware's microprocessor unit (MPU). However, Schachter believes this fact may be good news for gamers looking for an all-new Nintendo handheld sooner rather than later. "As software capacity is growing, requiring greater hardware MPU capacity for handheld devices, we believe a full model change is needed to meet demand over the next three or more years."

Are you guys really prepared to drop $200 on a DSi next year, knowing that an entirely new system is coming two years after that?

Didn't mind it with the GBA or DS, won't bug me now. Also we all know how the DS has suffered so much from having such a weak processor, amirite? With those ugly Final Fantasy games and all...

[The Mutericator]

That's quite possibly the silliest argument I've heard in weeks. Some people, like myself, haven't bought in because they can't afford it at the moment. But never have I heard a person say "You know, I'd buy it, but it just does too many cool things. I think I'll wait a few months until they take some of the cool features away, and pick up the one with less functionality."

Your late adopters are waiting for the PRICE DROP. The ONLY thing removing the GBA slot does is reduce the size, and I have ALWAYS disagreed with removal of functionality in favor of miniaturization. Now I know there's ways around this, I'll go out probably quite soon and pick up a DS Lite for dirt cheap thanks to this thing. But i shouldn't have to go with the last generation because the NEW gen is missing something it had before.

Let me get this straight, you are complaining about removing a feature that's been a cheap addon for the past two hardware generations and is no longer relevant, instead replacing it with downloadable content, SD card support, audio support, a fucking camera, and a shop?

If by "at the moment" you mean, "for the last four years," then that still doesn't make sense. It isn't that hard to save up $130 (or earlier, $150), just get a job.

If you're really that bugged by not having a GBA slot in a new system when hardware has been available to play GBA games for years then you're just nitpicking. Go buy a GBASP and stop bitching, seriously. It's called moving forward, not all of us have to save up our meager allowance to afford a new system.

[Bleck]

If you're really that bugged by not having a GBA slot in a new system when hardware has been available to play GBA games for years then you're just nitpicking. Go buy a GBASP and stop bitching, seriously. It's called moving forward, not all of us have to save up our meager allowance to afford a new system.

I'm almost positive that it's already been pointed out in this thread that a great many DS games and accessories make use of the GBA slot.

'hey everyone buy the second Guitar Hero DS unless you have the new DS in which case haha you're fucked'

[zircon]

Also all they've removed is the GBA slot, which makes Guitar Hero DS unplayable on it. But if you wanted GHDS, you already have it and a Lite. And if you wanted something to play GBA games, you already have it. They shouldn't have to cater to backward compatibility after all this time, especially when the market has so many popular ways to play those games (GBA, SP, Micro, DS, DS Lite). Again, that's not punishing early adopters, that's moving forward. (Also if all you think they've added is downloads, I suggest you do a lot of research, you're way off.)

This is just infuriating. So, if I want to play GBA and DS games on the go with a DSi (or SOME DS GAMES) I need to bring TWO handheld devices. That's beyond stupid.

[Scufo]

Man if you still think wagglan' is an accurate term for Metroid Prime 3's controls you need to stop going to /v/.

Ok I'll admit I wasn't being fair in regards to MP. MP3 controlled well, but I prefer the controls of MP1 and 2 to it. As for Pikmin, I don't see how motion controls could in any way improve the gameplay. It'll probably just have point-and-click functionality for throwing Pikmin which just seems gimicky and lame to me. Y'know like the majority of Wii games.

[The Pezman]

Okay, can we aggregate these different game announcements together? I didn't even know there was a conference til I saw the thread, and now there have been twenty sites linked to with as many things reported. As a recent Wii purchaser and DS holdout this will affect things for me.

I'm still trying to figure out where NiGHTS and MP1 and 2 came from. And also...

Nintendo will re-release Cube classics in a new ‘Enjoy with Wii selection’ lineup

Does this mean the Wiimakes of MP1 and 2 that were mentioned somewhere? How many games are they doing this for?

[Bleck]

yeah wii games are gimmicky I guess I'll go back to shooting games with alien parasites / shooting games in a WW2 setting / madden

[Scufo]

I never said Wii games can't be great when they're done well. Take Super Mario Galaxy, it puts motion control to good use without using it so much that it just seems unnecessary. If games are designed with motion control in mind they can be really cool, but slapping on motion controls to Gamecube games? Ehhh...

EDIT: I mean look at Okami.

[Bleck]

what is wrong with okami

[The Mutericator]

This is just infuriating. So, if I want to play GBA and DS games on the go with a DSi (or SOME DS GAMES) I need to bring TWO handheld devices. That's beyond stupid.

Yeah, but how often does that happen? The last worthwhile GBA game was Final Fantasy 6 over a year ago. Seriously, when I go out there's maybe one or two games maximum I want to play (currently, KSSU and FFIVDS).

It's a valid complaint if you legitimately switch between GBA and DS games in one trip out from the house (or wherever you keep your games), but realistically that's just silly.

I'm almost positive that it's already been pointed out in this thread that a great many DS games and accessories make use of the GBA slot.

'hey everyone buy the second Guitar Hero DS unless you have the new DS in which case haha you're fucked'

Like what? The Opera browser that'll be built into the DSi? Was there a Rumble Pack for a game? Seriously I'm having problems remembering anything remotely worthwhile we're missing out on here.

[Bleck]

so the mutericator is basically saying that it's stupid to want to play GBA games because he doesn't think there are very many good ones

nice job there bub

[Scufo]

what is wrong with okami

Okami is a brilliant game on the PS2 but the Wii version was done sloppily. It was too picky about straight lines and instead of just using a button to swing your weapon you had to waggle. This is what I'm talking about in regards to motion control in moderation. Drawing with the Wiimote in Okami is really cool, I like that and want to see more of it. But waggling to swing your weapon is lame and gimicky. They should have cut the motion controls at drawing. Enough to add to the experience but not too much.

So, that's why I think Wii controls in Gamecube games might not be the best. If you loved the controls in MP3 I'm sure you'll love the controls in the MP wiimakes, but I'll stick to the Gamecube versions.

[The Mutericator]

so the mutericator is basically saying that it's stupid to want to play GBA games because he doesn't think there are very many good ones

nice job there bub

Nice job strawmanning the argument bub.

I'm saying it's stupid complain about the removal of a feature that hasn't been used ('cept one count of GHDS) in over a year and won't ever be used again, when already there are a multitude of devices out there that perform that task (playing GBA games, in case you're still having problems following) perfectly well.

It's like complaining years ago that DVD players don't have VCR players built into them anymore. Yes, there's stuff that the VCR had that DVD's didn't, but it was so easy to get a VCR player (and more likely you already had one) that there was no justification for the complaint.

Okami is a brilliant game on the PS2 but the Wii version was done sloppily. It was too picky about straight lines and instead of just using a button to swing your weapon you had to waggle. This is what I'm talking about in regards to motion control in moderation. Drawing with the Wiimote in Okami is really cool, I like that and want to see more of it. But waggling to swing your weapon is lame and gimicky. They should have cut the motion controls at drawing. Enough to add to the experience but not too much.

So, that's why I think Wii controls in Gamecube games might not be the best. If you loved the controls in MP3 I'm sure you'll love the controls in the MP wiimakes, but I'll stick to the Gamecube versions.

I do want to point out, Okami Wii was incredibly fun. The only real difficulty was learning the motion to attack took some practice. Also, just like the PS2 version, you could hold down a button to force a straight line (or just not suck at holding your arm still).

[zircon]

Yeah, but how often does that happen? The last worthwhile GBA game was Final Fantasy 6 over a year ago. Seriously, when I go out there's maybe one or two games maximum I want to play (currently, KSSU and FFIVDS).

It's a valid complaint if you legitimately switch between GBA and DS games in one trip out from the house (or wherever you keep your games), but realistically that's just silly.

The GBA has the greatest handheld library. You've got FF1+2, FF4, FF5-6, three Castlevanias, the PS Collection, Golden Sun 1&2, Advance Wars 1&2, etc. just to name ones I personally have played or owned and which have received rave reviews. These are not throwaway titles, and considering some (like FF6) were released less than two years ago I hardly think abandoning backwards compatibility is a good idea. Handhelds are very useful for longer trips, NOT just 15 minutes on the bus/train, and having to bring another electronic device AND charger just to play games that, in gaming terms, JUST came out is pretty silly.

[Bleck]

Take Super Mario Galaxy, it puts motion control to good use without using it so much that it just seems unnecessary.

instead of just using a button to swing your weapon you had to waggle. This is what I'm talking about in regards to motion control in moderation.

durrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Nice job strawmanning the argument bub.

and with this I am convinced that nobody actually knows what 'strawman' means

[The Mutericator]

The GBA has the greatest handheld library. You've got FF1+2, FF4, FF5-6, three Castlevanias, the PS Collection, Golden Sun 1&2, Advance Wars 1&2, etc. just to name ones I personally have played or owned and which have received rave reviews. These are not throwaway titles, and considering some (like FF6) were released less than two years ago I hardly think abandoning backwards compatibility is a good idea. Handhelds are very useful for longer trips, NOT just 15 minutes on the bus/train, and having to bring another electronic device AND charger just to play games that, in gaming terms, JUST came out is pretty silly.

In gaming terms, two years is a long, long time. Time enough for a sequel or upgrade or Moore's Law to take effect at least once, and plenty of time for someone to finish a game to the point they don't feel the need to pick it up again.

I think we're using our handhelds in different ways. I don't take mine on long trips, I use mine in between classes or after working on a project or while on break at work. Of course, if you really can't stand being without your precious GBA games (how many of that list are you actually going to play over a one-week trip? Assuming you have actual business to do), there's always the GBA and its AA batteries.

[The Damned]

You know, I'm a big fan of Nintendo's hand-helds. Short of the Gameboy Lite, I've had pretty much each one to date. I've got Gameboy, GBA and DS games than most people have games from all systems. So when I say this, I'm saying it as someone that really is into Nintendo portable stuff.

This news of a new model of the DS is not really compelling. It's actually... kind of anti-climatic.

The GBA cart had some wonderful uses. I know people have mentioned Guitar Hero, but you're also forgetting a much bigger and more popular (and a personal favorite) game that used the GBA slot a lot: Pokemon.

The GBA games did a lot for the DS games, and now those features are gone. Nintendo just cock-blocked a lot of players that use the GBA Pokemon games. Platinum just came out in Japan, and Japanese players like to use the old GBA games to get items, pokemon not found on the DS versions, they still transfer GBA pokemon to the DS... But not any more with this model. I wonder how the ones that buy a DSi will get around this? Keep the old DS Lite, use it's GBA slot, and then swap the DS card over to the DSi? I guess, but still...

I was hoping for some news on the next portable. I guess that's not happening for a while.

I doubt I will get one of these DSis when they come out here.

Man, I'm actually a little disappointed now.

[The Mutericator]

durrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

and with this I am convinced that nobody actually knows what 'strawman' means

It means you try and simplify and exaggerate the opponent's argument - replacing it with a "straw man" version - that can easily be knocked down or mocked. It's exactly what you're doing here.

EDIT:

Why does everyone act like suddenly all versions of the GBA, GBASP, Micro, DS, and DS Lite will suddenly cease to exist? If your Pokemon are that precious to you, just transfer them over before using the DSi.

Personally, if you can't tell, I'm really excited about the new features. I want to see what developers can build with a camera and a higher focus on audio. Will Wright, just a month ago, said he'd love to see cell phone cameras integrated into games in new and creative ways, and he's a fan of the DS (plays Advance Wars). I wanna know if he's planning anything, first and foremost.

[Bleck]

I think we're using our handhelds in different ways. I don't take mine on long trips, I use mine in between classes or after working on a project or while on break at work.

you do realize that your entire argument revolves around the fact that you don't use it very much, right

'people shouldn't care about the removal of the GBA slot because I haven't used it in forever'

[Scufo]

Yes yes I know Mario Galaxy had some waggle controls but the "combat" in that game was different in that most enemies went down quickly and didn't require combos controlled by waggling. A quick flick every now and then is fine but when you're doing it repeatedly to take out every enemy that's where we have a problem.

[Bleck]

yeah if your wrist is made of papier mache

unless you're a toddler you pretty much expend the same amount of energy to slightly shake the controller back and forth as yo would pushing a button over and over and over again

quite frankly, whether or not you have to waggle a stick or push a button is irrelevant - if you have to do something over and over and over than the combat itself is stale, which is an oft-ignored problem that okami had