Auxiliaryinput Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 New song: http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/244444/dnbtaketwo.mp3 Old song: This is my first go at drum and bass. I usually do Trance.http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/244444/Nobuo%20Uematsu%20-%20Let%20the%20battles%20begin(Auxiliary%20Input's%20funny%20DnB%20mix).mp3 It's a little bit cheesy to be DnB I think, I don't listen to DnB that much. But I heard some songs on youtube. I wanted to keep the original soundtrack feel to it. My friend complains about the mastering, and sadly I don't have the speakers to hear this. I'm calling it a mix because it's not much of a remix. (Or is it?) Anyways, I'm not planning on submitting it. Maybe if I replace the original playstation midi orchestra and change a lot of stuff, but I doubt I'm going to do that. In short, it was more of a test. It was actually an original song and then I thought of doing a remix instead because the original melody kinda sucked. For those who don't wanna download the song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o90DxBQsoj0&fmt=18 Edit: Yeah it's not as dry as other DnB songs. I guess that's what makes it a bit cheesy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 You want your review right between the eyes, eh? Okay, I can do that. Let me put my angry face on. If that wasn't enough of a disclaimer, I'm going to be an asshole reviewing this! The first thing I notice about this is: It's the FFVII battle theme. And this is what I mean: The melody is exactly the same, and on the same instruments. It's a blessing and a curse that the FFVII flows and works well. But you gotta change SOMETHING in there. I'm feeling the copy paste love hard here. The D&B bit is very loud, you did hit that nail on the head with volume. But other than in a few areas, it seems to me again like the FFVII battle theme. Just louder. Drum is my forte. (that's a double pun god damn it, that's some clever shit right there) So, you've added a 16th note to the bass drum here and there. WHERE IS YOUR HI-HATS! DNB LOVES THEYS HI-HATS! And you need something else to make a dnb origional. A 32nd note flam on those neglected hats. Massive insanly fast hat/snare/bass builds. Cuts in the middle where you have just dnb with no melody at all. WHERE'S ALL YOUR GOOD STUFF? The CONTENT?! Did you lose a track or two encoding the mp3? As far as bass goes. Other than a loud bass drum, you didn't do anything with the bass. Which is a shame because the battle theme doesn't have anything great in the way of bass and you can REALLY get creative there. YOU DIDN'T, but it CAN BE DONE. At this point, I have to point out that you said. -Maybe if I replace the original playstation midi orchestra and change a lot of stuff, but I doubt I'm going to do that- and requested a harsh critic. Now for the salt. Where did I put my salt and lemon... How much time did you put into this? I mean, I value effort above everything else. I'm feeling a lack of effort motivation on your end of things here. Maybe you need to be more clear in your description AKA 'this was a test that I did in 5 minutes' or 'I'm just bouncing ideas off you guys'. But not hey, I need a harsh critic to tell me that I copy pasted a track into my editor, cranked up the volume on the drum track, and added 3 echo effects. Mmm, okay. Now for the good bits and the happy face I do so enjoy the FFVII battle theme. And this was a chance for me to hear it almost verbatum. The loud percussion had a few nice ideas here and there. And there was some scratch effect here and there. Final explanation: I don't like being on the giving end of harsh reviews because I alwalys feel like to be able to dish it out I should be amazingly godlike. Sit in front of a computer and have it bow to my will. Mixing music like HALO in mere seconds by knowing EVERYTHING in my programs of choice by heart. I like to think that I work towards a goal of getting better, and everything I do is better than the last thing I did. I think giving harsh reviews CAN be counterproductive, but it can also be one hell of a motivator. And that's all I have to say about that. I hope you found it helpful. BE MOTIVATED! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxiliaryinput Posted December 20, 2008 Author Share Posted December 20, 2008 You want your review right between the eyes, eh? Okay, I can do that. Let me put my angry face on. If that wasn't enough of a disclaimer, I'm going to be an asshole reviewing this! The first thing I notice about this is: It's the FFVII battle theme. And this is what I mean: The melody is exactly the same, and on the same instruments. It's a blessing and a curse that the FFVII flows and works well. But you gotta change SOMETHING in there. I'm feeling the copy paste love hard here. The D&B bit is very loud, you did hit that nail on the head with volume. But other than in a few areas, it seems to me again like the FFVII battle theme. Just louder. Drum is my forte. (that's a double pun god damn it, that's some clever shit right there) So, you've added a 16th note to the bass drum here and there. WHERE IS YOUR HI-HATS! DNB LOVES THEYS HI-HATS! And you need something else to make a dnb origional. A 32nd note flam on those neglected hats. Massive insanly fast hat/snare/bass builds. Cuts in the middle where you have just dnb with no melody at all. WHERE'S ALL YOUR GOOD STUFF? The CONTENT?! Did you lose a track or two encoding the mp3? As far as bass goes. Other than a loud bass drum, you didn't do anything with the bass. Which is a shame because the battle theme doesn't have anything great in the way of bass and you can REALLY get creative there. YOU DIDN'T, but it CAN BE DONE. At this point, I have to point out that you said. -Maybe if I replace the original playstation midi orchestra and change a lot of stuff, but I doubt I'm going to do that- and requested a harsh critic. Now for the salt. Where did I put my salt and lemon... How much time did you put into this? I mean, I value effort above everything else. I'm feeling a lack of effort motivation on your end of things here. Maybe you need to be more clear in your description AKA 'this was a test that I did in 5 minutes' or 'I'm just bouncing ideas off you guys'. But not hey, I need a harsh critic to tell me that I copy pasted a track into my editor, cranked up the volume on the drum track, and added 3 echo effects. Mmm, okay. Now for the good bits and the happy face I do so enjoy the FFVII battle theme. And this was a chance for me to hear it almost verbatum. The loud percussion had a few nice ideas here and there. And there was some scratch effect here and there. Final explanation: I don't like being on the giving end of harsh reviews because I alwalys feel like to be able to dish it out I should be amazingly godlike. Sit in front of a computer and have it bow to my will. Mixing music like HALO in mere seconds by knowing EVERYTHING in my programs of choice by heart. I like to think that I work towards a goal of getting better, and everything I do is better than the last thing I did. I think giving harsh reviews CAN be counterproductive, but it can also be one hell of a motivator. And that's all I have to say about that. I hope you found it helpful. BE MOTIVATED! Thank you. Reading this makes me wanna redo it from scratch giving it a much better effort. I did wip it up all together in a day, so yeah, not much effort was put into it. But I thought it turned out OK so I wanted to hear what you guys thought about my first DnB song. You see, I was making a song, no remix or anything and I just thought "hey what happens if I slap on the FF7 Battle theme song onto this?" And so I spent a couple of hours making it fit. I'll try to listen to some more Drum and Bass. But first I gotta find out how to make those amazingly distorted bass sounds. I'm gonna try giving my synthesizer a go. Seriously though, I think I'm gonna start posting songs in this forum when looking for criticism. Are we allowed to post original songs in here? Cause on other forums it's either "it sucks or "that's nice" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishy Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 Are we allowed to post original songs in here? Cause on other forums it's either "it sucks or "that's nice" Post original stuff in this forum. http://www.ocremix.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=19 You generally don't get much response for original stuff though. People here prefer to listen to the game remixes generally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrototypeRaptor Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 There is no such thing as "harsh" criticism...just criticism that is more useful IMO... Anyway! This doesn't sound like dnb at all to me - the drums seem more rockish. Where are the ghost notes? The drums even sound like a kit rather than a break, which, at least to me, is what "makes" a dnb tune - the slicing of some funky 70s break and rearranging the beats. Your bass needs more...maybe more layers, more effects, more samples...it's just not in your face enough. And your orchestra sample needs to be revamped entirely...but I think you already know that. All in all, your dnb is heavily lacking in both drum and bass, but it's not "OMG" bad, it just needs some tweaking. Go for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHands Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 This is a rock song with a midi pasted on top. It's not just the drums that feel like a rock song, the bass's tone feels like it's supposed to support something much more aggressive than the original instrumentation. This doesn't have to be guitar based (though Fishy's presence in the thread at all makes me want to say to go for it, even if it's just a point of information), a really angry synth could do it just as well. That's just one opinion though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxiliaryinput Posted December 20, 2008 Author Share Posted December 20, 2008 I think you guys are right, it doesn't really sound like DnB to me either now that I think about it. But does DnB HAVE to be agressive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted December 20, 2008 Share Posted December 20, 2008 Maybe not aggressive. But it seems to me that most are. Some really laid back chords under a DnB line can sort of take the edge off. Youtube is great for getting/bouncing ideas, both good and bad. Check this out: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxiliaryinput Posted December 21, 2008 Author Share Posted December 21, 2008 Here's my progress so far on the new song. http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/244444/dnbtaketwo.mp3 Still trying to figure out what to do with the melody without going way off track. I'll have a play with it on my piano to see. It's supposed to be the first part of the battle theme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 I'm just chiming in. Love what you have going so far. Checked the youtube link. Great stuff, beats are awesome. I don't know if arrangement is almost exact copy of the original or not, but I like the quality regardless. What you don't have is a good structure and flow of the track. You give this peace a bit of intro, breakdown, and outro, you got a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozovian Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Heard dnbtaketwo.mp3, needs more source, but it's certainly got the drive it needs. A bit quiet, but that's a later concern. You've got a nice drum track, dnb or not. Write a good remix from source, and use those drums, plus lots of slices. DnB or not, it could be awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC Ricers Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Okay, I just listened to your first link. I'll echo some of the people in saying that the instruments themselves and the arrangement is almost verbatim from the source so you have to work on that. HOWEVER, it's all well-integrated into the dnb style and not just a tacked on loop with the source like so many remixes (video game or otherwise) I've heard. It does have a too much reverb for the style. You can have some reverb on the chromatic instruments but keep it conservative on the drums. The snares have punch but it's all washed out sounding, so you don't get the full energy you'd expect without the reverb. And do bring out more of the bass. Here is where I think you should go to town on the interpretation. Make the bass solo on some parts, it should be the star of the genre after all. One of the hardest things to do in dnb is getting the bass to sound well without muddying up everything else. Site note: I can understand why some people see the two-step beat as being too rock-ish. And even some dnb artists are bringing in guitars to complement. So yes, it will sound like rock but with a more danceable rhythm to it. (shameless plug: click the links on my sig for more examples) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxiliaryinput Posted December 21, 2008 Author Share Posted December 21, 2008 Update again. http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/244444/dnbtaketwo.mp3 The synth might get a bit cheesy after a while. Does anyone have any suggestions about that? The main structure is done(lacking an outro though), now for the remix bit. I'll see if I can change some stuff because currently only the first verse is changed. Edit: Updated once again. Added some new effects and stuff like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Vagrance Posted December 21, 2008 Share Posted December 21, 2008 Harsh critiques, my favorite type. I listen to way too much DnB so hopefully I should be able to help you. This is also based off of the newest posting. Bassline: + You have the general sound, which is good because thats the hardest part. - It lacks power though, most DnB relies on the bassline/reese to move the subs in the 20Hz-100Hz range, whereas the kick occupies the 100-200Hz range where it kicks a lot more. Now, this isn't a rule set in stone of course, and your kick sounds like its in the right place but I'm not feeling enough from the bass Drums: + For the most part they sound engineered well - WAY too hectic. You need to clean up all of your samples and get everything sounding more unified. Its hard to tell whats going on first listen because the drums are all over the place. The break most clearly heard around the 0:50 region may be the cause of this. Engineering: - This is the main problem with the track is that it doesn't sound clean. Most good DnB only has a few set pieces, but they play off each other in a convincing manner. Part of this (most of it actually) has to do with the overall mixdown but it also bears a lot of pressure on the arrangement. The drums are stealing the spotlight from the melody. Also, don't leave out the possiblity of playing only one or two components (like the melody and bassline) while having the hats doing a simple 8th note rhythm or something. Change up the way you are presenting the melody, rather than just changing the melody. Interpretation: + Honestly, I don't see any major problems with this as it is now. Its slightly coverish but not really, and this is such an intense reworking of it that I doubt it'll factor in too much. Hell, I got past the judges panel and I just changed the time signature and added a rap, so this should be fine in this area. I really like this though, and I love seeing more DnB that's not Pendulum-based entirely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxiliaryinput Posted December 21, 2008 Author Share Posted December 21, 2008 Another update. More remixing and stuff like that so it doesn't just sound like a cover, plus it has an outro now. http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/244444/dnbtaketwo.mp3 I think I'm done for today. I tried doing some solo stuff, but I don't think it's enough or if it's not solo ish enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Vagrance Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Alright, more critiques: 1. All of the parts are easier to distinguish from each other, but unfortunately it sounds almost like the entire thing is under a low pass filter. Maybe its one of the breaks you took out but the entire thing sounds kinda muddy. 2. I like the random embellishments you made to various aspects of the melody (dropping out the beat and so on), however the whole has kind of a repetitive feel to it. You may be progressing through the song a bit to quickly, feel free to explore different parts of the source longer than the source itself does. Really those are my main critiques, work on the muddiness and try varynig up the arrangement a bit more. Don't feel the need to be going full throttle the entire ride, add a bit more tension and release throughout the thing. Try extending the 0:10-0:38 section more and letting the breakdown right after last longer and get a bit softer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hewhoisiam Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 I'm listening to the newest version of the track. I must say much improved One of the things I like a DnB track to do (and this is just me again) is drop out a lot of the sounds other than the DnB. Your melody goes through the eintire song more or less. Consider exploring/expanding on sections of the melody that you like, or adding in some sort of break. Vagrance is going to hate me for this... but Pendulum does a good job with stopping melody and filling some time with just DnB. Something similar could help with some of that repeditive feel. I wouldn't actually call it repedative, as much as linear. I'm very famaliar with the origional and this has great variation, but follows the same structure of events without expanding or cutting/re aranging any of the events. Hope this helps, this thing is really coming along:sleepdepriv: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SplinterOfChaos Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Another thing Pendulum does (based on the two songs of theirs I've heard) is vary the sound scape through the entire song. I don't know they repeat one measure exactly the same. It has melody, but lacks harmony. I think it would sound more complete if you added a mid-range or another high-range to compliment the main melody. Nobuo always has a counter melody going in the background. He layers his songs very well to create a synergy with the instrument. I usually count 3 layers through most of the songs and two at transitions. I don't listen to DnB (not for lack of enjoyment, but access) but I think the foreground is really not complex enough. You basically repeat the song twice. The second time, you could do it a little different. This is a pretty enjoyable piece as-is, but I think you can do better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auxiliaryinput Posted December 22, 2008 Author Share Posted December 22, 2008 Alright, more critiques:1. All of the parts are easier to distinguish from each other, but unfortunately it sounds almost like the entire thing is under a low pass filter. Maybe its one of the breaks you took out but the entire thing sounds kinda muddy. 2. I like the random embellishments you made to various aspects of the melody (dropping out the beat and so on), however the whole has kind of a repetitive feel to it. You may be progressing through the song a bit to quickly, feel free to explore different parts of the source longer than the source itself does. Really those are my main critiques, work on the muddiness and try varynig up the arrangement a bit more. Don't feel the need to be going full throttle the entire ride, add a bit more tension and release throughout the thing. Try extending the 0:10-0:38 section more and letting the breakdown right after last longer and get a bit softer. I hear the muddiness now. I guess taking long breaks really help so I'm gonna fix it now. Edit: Fixed I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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