Silent Hill Discussion

[Firedrake]

Teehee...

[StarZander]

Teehee...

Old, but cool nonetheless.

[Firedrake]

Anyone here read the SIlent Hill: Dying Inside comics? I've just finished reading them myself. The artwork, done by Ben Templesmith, who did 30 Days of Night, works well for the Silent Hill universe, in my opinion. I wouldn't say it's a bad comic book adaptation, but it isn't fully accurate, and it all feels rushed near the end. It's also very "comic-book" too, as it features substantial amounts of gunplay. One of it's major flaws though is it's lack of subtlety, something which made the games great, as well as truly introspective humanity. It also becomes kind of campy once the whole gothic punk teenager crowd is involved, but overall, I'd say it's decent and doesn't rape the franchise.

[Eccles]

I've picked up 1, 4 and 5.

I liked the artwork in the first one...but the way the fourth and fifth are drawn doesnt really grab my attention.

I also don't like the way some of the scenes are done. Like the bit in the gun shop...subtlty can work well if you do it right (Eg: the ear scene in Resevoir Dogs) but in Dying Inside it was like

"OH SHIT!"

*red smudge*

"OH SHIT! LOOK WHAT IT DID!"

Which, to me, showed the fact that the artist/writers were rather unimaginative...and I agree with you, the ending is far too much of a "Wait...WHUT!?" affair.

But overall the three volumes were worth the £9 I paid for 'em...

[ifirit]

According to Silent Hill Heaven and IDW Publishings, there were two different people who illustrated the Silent Hill "Dying Inside" comic series. Ben Templesmith did the artwork for the first and second issues, and then, Aadi Salman who picked up the artwork from then on out (Issues #3-5). Scott Ciencin wrote the story for the entire series (so, you can blame him for an abrupt ending). Also, for those who purchased the comic online when it first came out, recieved autographed copies (by Ben Templesmith) with an added introduction.

However, if you remember, Konami issued two licences to IDW Publishing for the Silent Hill Comics, and the second series has already been announced. "Among the Damned" is set to be distributed for November 2004. Again, Scott Ciencin will be writing the storylines, with cover artwork by Ashley Wood and interior artwork by Shaun Thomas. The story is about a soldier who is suffering survivor's guilt which leads him into Silent Hill. (IDW stole my Silent Hill plot! I want my royalties!)

Personally, I liked what I saw of the ComX Comic Novel, which was completed, but never released. Silent Hill Heaven's Graphical Novel section has all the information regarding this (I believe that the staff even has a copy of the comic), including the "Dying Inside" series. Of course, they cannot release the ComX version to the public, as they could get sued by Konami for it. However, you can check out the preview pages below:

ComX Preview Page #1: In the Shadow of Charred Fury

ComX Preview Page #2: Dead End

ComX Preview Page #3: Devil's Lyric

EDIT: All posts are now spoiler-marked. :wipes brow:

[Eccles]

I picked up my copy of SH4 today (the bastards didn't gimme my free stuff, but what're you gonna do?)

The telephone has become my mortal enemy. I *know* they put an easter egg in there...I know it...but I haven't been able to find the right number to make it work.

I've tried Jenny's number (867-5309) and that didnt work. I've tried the ISBN from Thriller (apparently Jackson hid his phone number in the ISBN) and that didnt work. I've tried the tech support numbers, I've tried the barcodes for all four Silent Hill games...

Ideally the solution would be to wait a month so that people who are freaks like me but have more patience than me can try out all ten million combinations and find out what it is, but I dont wanna...

And now, a little on the psychological aspect of the game.

The main monsters are, of course, the people. 'Victims' as the game calls them.

One of the reasons these monsters are so scary is the fact that theyre human, but at the same time totally inhuman.

One reason they're scary is the way they don't move. They glide, slowly and effortlessly towards you, not thinking about what to do. Yes it's pretty scary to see something lurching towards you (See: Pyramid head) but to see something that could very well kill you without even trying...that's where the horror lies.

It's like with the Daleks...the Daleks scared people because they were so cold, calculating and emotionless. Take these and you have a wonderful recipie for horror, but take into account the fact that you *cannot* escape them and they're absolutely terrifying.

Also the way they move...they look like theyre marionette's being strung along by something...of course this is pure speculation from me since I havent found anything out yet (I've just got to the Prison if anyone cares).

[StarZander]

I like how they've put the bunnies from SH3 i the game. The one in Eileens room creeps me out, but I like the floating heads of the dolls/suits that you can se in the air when you look out the bedroom window.

[StarZander]

Wow, did that game dissappoint me. Frustrating, tiresome and oh so repetitive. If they make a SH5, then I might just throw up. I'm too tired and too depressed over this game now, to write something big about it.

[RimFrost the Tourianist]

Silent Hill 4 is a gargantuan step backwards.

I played it for 2 or 3 hours and it let me down so much i almost vomited out of boredom, and why in the name of FUCK did Konami include 1st-person view and a RE type itembox i will never know..and ONE savepoint !!?? :vomit: :vomit:

Youll be better off playing SH2 and SH3 instead !

[Tiamat570]

I'm guessing some of you SH fans like me already know this site, but I for some reason don't like the idea of 'skimming' through 38 pages to check it hasn't been posted before, so here it is regardless,

http://www.shfanfics.tk/

Has 3 stellar fanfics which, as many have said, capture the mood of the Silent Hill games excellently, far better than the comics IMO.

[Lasakon]

The poor baby.

[ifirit]

Sadly, I have to agree with the consensus on Silent Hill 4. The biggest fault with this game stems from a single element in the design: the real-time weapon change menu.

The producers (Team Silent) made 1 really bad mistake with the game: they decided to include the real-time weapon change system. In order to include this option into the control scheme, they had to use the square button and directional pad. Well, this removed the 3-D control scheme (or tank controls as people sometimes refer to it). By doing so, they had to create a 2-D control scheme with the left analogue stick, which was difficult to manage considering that the levels were tightly spaced and required more camera shifts than any other game before it. This made walking and running (especially running) hard, to say the least. Changing the movement design to 2-D also required that they include an auto-targeting system, since control is so very hard to do manually. Well, this was done rather poorly as it doesn't allow you to switch between targetted enemies. This makes fighting really, really, "I couldn't beat 'Easy Mode'" really frustrating. Seriously, I cannot play that game without screaming at the terrible combat controls.

Also, the real-time weapon change doesn't really save you very much time in actual gameplay. Though it looks nice on paper and makes programming and load times much quicker, it distracts the player and at times still makes them pause the game and search through the menu anyway; defeating the purpose all-together. Since this scheme was introduced, they had to limit the number of items in your inventory so to not confuse the player and take even more time to shuffle through the on-screen menu. This, in turn, required that the dated item-box system be placed and thus the frustration of item retreival and maintainance reintroduced.

The single save box also adds to the tiresome nature of the game, as you have to re-enter the tunnel to return to the room, which requires loading; go to the living room, which requires loading; and access the memory card, which requires loading in addition to the time it takes to save. And then, you still have to return to the actual gameplay, which requires more loading time. (Going back to the portal, entering the portal, ect.)

To think that all of these frustrating gameplay elements came from a single feature that Konami was too determined to include, but failed for them to see how much it hindered the game. I applaud the idea that you wanted to try something new, but it took too much time to manage, too many elements away from the game, and ultimately, too much fun away from playing. Know when to cut your losses, Konami.

I'm going to strip this thing of all its content, so that I never, ever have to play this attrocite ever again. Good day. :Storms out:

P.S. I'll discuss the story-line at a later time. This story was the weakest of the series, but did provide more information that allows retrospection on the last few games. So, it's not a complete loss.

EDIT:

The poor baby.

That's reassuring to know that the movie has a production member that is just as devoted to the series as its fans. Go Christophe! Anyway, leave the guys alone, you fan-boys. :Pulls out steel pipe to fend off the masses:

At least the movie should be good.

EDIT2:

I'm guessing some of you SH fans like me already know this site, but I for some reason don't like the idea of 'skimming' through 38 pages to check it hasn't been posted before, so here it is regardless,

http://www.shfanfics.tk/

Has 3 stellar fanfics which, as many have said, capture the mood of the Silent Hill games excellently, far better than the comics IMO.

In all my searches through the Silent Hill websites, I've not come across this little gem. I think the works are very good at capturing the style and atmosphere, but could have taken more liberties than it had.

I'll try reading them again.

[The Instrument of GAWD]

well then, last night i just finished SH2. was it just me, or was that game a friggin' tear jerker?

anyway, with the first and second SH games beat, i'm free to go off and buy SH 3 and 4, but from the sounds, they're not as great... that won't stop me from buying them tho, but it will hold me from doing it right away, i still got Shinobi and Devil May Cry to beat yet.

I would like to post something relavent about the plot or characters of this series, but i've only beaten the games once each and it's too early to talk about such things.

EDIT: all this talk of the soundtrack reminded me. i'm not sure if anyone remembers the trailer to SH4, but there was a song in it that caught my ear and i was wondering if it was on the soundtrack? all i know is it has lyrics: "It was always you that I despisied." and "I don't feel enough for you to cry."

[Juste]

The song is called Room Of Angel and the OST is easily found on soulseek.

[Night10194]

SH2 was, indeed, a tearjerker. Did you get the Maria or the Leave ending?

[The Instrument of GAWD]

SH2 was, indeed, a tearjerker. Did you get the Maria or the Leave ending?

I got the "In water" ending. I'll visit that game again and get the rest of the endings eventually tho.

The song is called Room Of Angel and the OST is easily found on soulseek.

thank you sir. good luck with the sanity issues as well (your sig)

[M@]

Warning – mild spoilers.

Oh, I don't know. SH4 wasn't up to the hype, that's for sure, but I think people are giving it more stick than it deserves. I’ll start with the controls, something everyone seems to dislike. Me, I instantly switched to configuration 3, which allocated square to be used for cancel/run ala past instalments, which helped me ease into the new item swap system by assigning circle to this task, which once operated the flashlight. Configuration 3 was the more logical default option, in my opinion, as fans of the series needed not to become familiar using circle for cancel/run and square for item switching, halving the amount of new things to learn. Having played MGS alongside SH in the past, the switch to 2D movement wasn’t so much a shock either. The only problem here I similarly encountered in Devil May Cry, that sudden switches of camera, of which MGS had little, would rocket Henry in the wrong direction should I neglect to move my thumb in time. In fact, the main problem I encountered with regard to control that few have mentioned, was the function of L2. In the past, this has been used to let the player move the camera a little, usually by way of swinging it around a touch with the right analogue stick as to get a better look around. Now the camera transposes instantly behind Henry’s head when L2 is pressed, and the right analogue stick serves to perform the original function independently, only with less freedom of movement. As I was used to almost permanently using this feature in past games, its new execution took some getting used to, and often left me disorientated.

Battles, I feel, were not as hard as people are letting on. I played first in easy mode, and met few problems other than getting stuck around downed ghosts, which, due to their undying nature, were solidified unlike other enemies and became unavoidable obstacles if downed in the wrong place. This was more of a design flaw than a combat issue, and Eileen sure as hell took advantage of this to frustrate me. In the pet shop for example, she was sandwiched between Cynthia, Jasper, and some other victim for some time, and I was not too impressed. I felt the new charge gauge could have been tweaked though, to have more than two attacks per melee weapon. Considering the size of the gauge, varying degrees of damage could have been issued dependant on the charge, as opposed to ‘some’ as it fills or ‘lots’ when it’s full. Hell, gently or fiercely pressing the attack button performed this task in past instalments, in less time, too. This gauge could be easily exploited to render Henry near invincible, too, as enemies could not damage him during a powerful attack. All that need be done is to execute an attack as an enemy does, and your attack takes priority, damaging the enemy when their faster attack should, logically, damage you. Some bosses would have been nice, too.

Also, how many of the weapons were actually useful? Some had imagination; the spade was fun, as were all of Eileens’ weapons – if not a little kinky. However, an absurd amount of golf clubs and some bladed weapons, many of which were redundant, are hardly innovative. It was nice to step back from the mundane Handgun – Shotgun – Hunting Rifle / Good – Better – Best routine, but I didn’t bother with the pistols at all, as having to carry separate rounds was a terrible hoax, and coupled with the need to run back to the item box should you run out, a step beyond backward. SH isn’t supposed to be realistic, it’s supposed to be fun! The item box I can agree, hands down, was a mistake. On the other hand though, I found portals to be liberally scattered throughout the areas, so the need to go back was hindered less by a huge trek, but more by loading screens. Mind, play with your analogue sticks during these and watch what happens. Simple, yet amusing. More fun than watching footprints appear.

The story isn't too bad either. In fact, I enjoyed how the 'main' SH story revolving around The Order was branched out from Dahlia/Alessa into something glanced over in SH2. It would have been nice to hear Frank mention James though. I know we all want to hear more from that guy. Hrm, that’s all I can think of for now, but I’m sure more defences will come to me soon, heh.

[StarZander]

I was thinking last night, and even though the games in the series are going way downhill, there has been one splendid constant throughout the games, that hasn't deteriorated or anything. It's just as great as it was in the first game; The music.

When I beat SH4 I was so sick of it, that I didn't think I'd play it again for months. But I was listening to it's OST yesterday, over and over, and I felt like playing the game again, just because of the great music.

This fact comforts the idea of Akira Yamaoka coproducing the SH movie. There is still hope.

[Night10194]

I will admit I'm not terribly far into the game yet, but I'm enjoying SH4 a great deal. It certainly beats SH3. I'm a little unhappy with the ghosts, but I can deal with 'em, and the controls...they're a godsend! FINALLY pushing the stick one way, moves me THAT way! God, did I ever hate the tank controls. Now I can dodge and move much more easily then ever before, and so far, the atmosphere, story, and such seem quite neat. Again, better then the abyssmal (in relation to 1 and 2) failure that was 3...

[M@]

I tend to believe that 3 was a knee-jerk response by Konami to the fans of the fist game that complained about the second being unrelated to its predecessor. That said, I still enjoyed it, my only major complaints being that it was insultingly short, and that the reuse of Brookhaven Hospital and surrounding area seemed a tad lazy on the developers' part.

[Eccles]

This fact comforts the idea of Akira Yamaoka coproducing the SH movie. There is still hope.

Seeing as how he produced SH4, this news somewhat irritates me now.

On SH4 (Spoilars ahoy!)

Like most games I play, I once again found myself directing the game in my head; coming up with little snippets of "I would have done that better" or "If I were in charge, I would've done it this way..."

One thing I found myself complaining about again and again was the pace of the game. There's almost no character development throughout.

Example (spoilers):

"Hey, I'm the fanservice character. But I'm dead now."

"Hey, I'm the token nutjob. But I'm dead now."

Another thing I would have done would be to edit the way the monsters (specifically the victims) look and behave.

Look at the victims as they fly along...the way their legs are slightly bent at the knee suggests that their model was sitting at the time of creation. Frankly I would have thought they would have been scarier had their legs been straight and it looked as though they were hanging from a noose of some description.

The nurses. I would pretty much totally overhaul the nurses.

Their model is fine, but that's about it. For starters I would have them lurch about more rather than the confident swagger they seemed to have. Secondly I'd have them recoil in some way when you hit them...that really REALLY irritated me about them; when I hit a monster with neck severing force I want to see them recoiling in immense pain, not just sliding back a little.

Thirdly I would take out that stupid STUPID burping sound they made as you hit them. The team didnt even TRY to disguise the fact that it was a burp. The hospital was ruined enough as it was, but the burping nurses just ruined it.

On the same vein...am I the only person who thinks they let the teaboy design the hospital and everything in it?

The nurses suck (as described above) the maniac wheelchairs suck, some of the puzzles are stupid and the only things that redeemed it were the giganto-head and the cameo of a mannequin from SH2 (if you look out the window in one of the cells on the second floor there's a mannequin stood there. I can't say which room since that floor is randomly generated every time).

And they didnt put Harry in it! I mean what the hell's up with that? He's been in all three so far, so why not the fourth!?

(Yes, I get so worked up over the smallest of things).

Things I did like:

Pushing monsters down the stairs and watching them take other monsters with them.

This one bit when I was on the rooftop of the building across from Henry's appartment I smacked a gorilla round the neck with the bat and it rolled down the stairs, crashing into another gorilla and taking it down too, killing them both.

I paused and I laughed my ass off for about ten minutes...and soon after this became my tactic. Camp at the top of the fire escape charging the baseball bat and using it to drive any attackers down the stairs before crying "Yeah, take THAT you big gorilla bastard"

I dont have any qualms at all about the real-time item selection since it's cheatable. Just hit select to pause the game and open up the item help thing, position the cursor over what you want, hit select to unpause then square (or whatever your designated button is) to equip.

The only waiting time you have is for Henry to shrug his shoulders as the weapon appears.

The way you didnt need a radio like in SH2. I cannot have been the only person who did this...just turn the radio off and let the music guide you.

Take the hospital for instance...normally you had a quiet howling of wind or a gentle sine wave. When a nurse came by, you had the evil clangings of the "Ashes and ghost" track. It got louder and quieter as the monsters got closer and further away and it stopped when all the monsters had been vanquished.

I didn't find NEARLY as many cameos in this game as the others.

Eileen has a Robbie the Rabbit doll on her bed (I swear that rabbit is a psycho bitch...he's going to murder me in my bed and I know it!)

Robbie's head sometimes floats by outside your window (over the hotel, around that kinda area)...though I gotta gives props to Starzander for finding that one.

There are posters from SH3 littering the subway. Those for "Fruity Rouge" and "Havocs business daily" are the most obvious ones, since they appear the most.

The bit with Richard in the appartment (when you get there you'll know the bit) is a reference to that scene from the film "The Green Mile."

I'm pretty disappointed they didnt do anything with the TV. I would have loved to see a Ringu reference or something like that bit from Poultergeist.

"Theyre heeeeeeere...."

Thoughts (SPOILAR!!1)

Weren't two of Sullivan's victims little girls? You find an article about it in Blue Creek and there's a question about it on the Trick or Treat show (both from SH2)...

So why aren't there little girl enemies? Or at least little girls parodying that bit from the Shining "Come play with us Danny...forever and ever and ever" *DEADED*

Not about SH4

My SH stories are coming along nicely. I've come up with another idea (bringing my total to 5)...and I'm kinda writing that, but it's not going to be a story, but a comic done by me or one of my friends (who cares if I can't draw well...it's the story that matters, AM I RITE!!!?1!1/)

I'll put out some stuff just as soon as I'm good and ready, alright?

[DarkPoinko]

I think I'm about halfway through SH4 by now, and so far it's been an okay experience, but a few of my gripes are like some that the others have posted, there's not enough puzzles, the puzzles that are there are too easily solved, lack of big, giant bosses, etc.

I do, however, like the real-time inventory, since it's easier to just scroll through the inventory and use it right there, without having to stop and look and everything and navigate a pause menu. Having to go back and get stuff out of the chest as you need it is a real pain, especially since there's so many pointless weapons in the game. I've only used the pipe you get at the beginning the bat, and now the axe, I haven't had much need for anything else(though I'm sure the fact I'm playing it on Easy right now is helping to contribute to that).

SH4 has some of the most amusing enemies I've ever encountered in a Silent Hill game, so far. The bat/mosquito things at the beginning are great fun, if you wind up and land a shot on one of them with the pipe. I think I got a good 15 feet off of one of those. The giant leeches are fun to step on and smack against the walls, almost makes me wish there was a paintball mode in SH4. The burping nurses made me laugh, but I miss the real creepy, terror-inducing monster desings, like the mannequins from SH2 and the sloth children from SH1.

I don't miss the radio, but I miss the flashlight. That was part of the SH charm right there. And if they bring back use of the radio, I'd think they'd have to cut out a lot of music in the game, because, as Eccles pointed out, you can just be guided by the music. If you turn off the music, then you only have the radio to tell you that a monster is nearby. But I guess the monsters make enough sound now that you wouldn't need it anyway. Blagh.

As far as a Silent Hill game, it's decent enough, and I think it's pretty cool they were able to bring something that was of almost no story importance at all from SH2 and buiild a history and plot from it, but it just isn't in the same league with 1 and 2. I'd like to see a return to that type of storytelling in the SH games.

[StarZander]

I must say I really miss the flashlight, or really the need for it. This game has been way too bright. Every area has lights, and it just ruins alot of atmosphere. It is SUPPOSED to be dark in most places! I read a preview of the game, right after E3, and they complained alot about the lack of darkness. I can see what they meant now.

The lack of a radio didn't really bother me. I never really notice it anyway.

They should have made it like the "Born from a wish" scenario in SH2, where you didn't have a flashlight nor a radio. But it was still dark, and the music didn't change every time you met a mannequin, so they freaked me out a few times there, popping up, when the camera shifts, since they're so silent.

Something else I didn't like about SH4, was the lack of significance of the main character. In the previous games, the main character was on a quest to find someone or something inside all the madness, or they were the actual reason for the madness, or both. But in SH4 it's like Henry just happened to be there and thought to himself "Hmm, mosters are coming out of the walls, and I'm being teleported to various areas through my bathroom wall. Let's check this out, there's nothing good on TV anyway." and he just doesn't seem to care about anything that he does throughout the game. He hardly ever says anything, and when he does, he sounds like a moron. The fact that he was the last sacrament didn't make him one bit more interesting.

Henry is no hero. He is just a passer-by who had nothing better to do at the moment.

[M@]

And they didnt put Harry in it! I mean what the hell's up with that? He's been in all three so far, so why not the fourth!?

Harry was in SH2?

I'm pretty disappointed they didnt do anything with the TV. I would have loved to see a Ringu reference or something like that bit from Poultergeist.

"Theyre heeeeeeere...."

I think Ghost-Cynthia is pretty much a reference to The Ring in itself, with the hair and the crawling and whatnot.

Weren't two of Sullivan's victims little girls? You find an article about it in Blue Creek and there's a question about it on the Trick or Treat show (both from SH2)...

So why aren't there little girl enemies? Or at least little girls parodying that bit from the Shining "Come play with us Danny...forever and ever and ever" *DEADED*

The doublehead enemies are supposedly representative of the twins in question, as detailed in the victim files on the official website.

[Eccles]

Harry was in SH2?

SH2+3 SPOILERS! (but not really)

He turned up in the UFO ending and abducted James. Also, it's worth pointing out that James is in SH3...he's having a tea party with Harry and an alien in the UFO ending just before Harry wigs out and blows up Silent Hill)

I think Ghost-Cynthia is pretty much a reference to The Ring in itself, with the hair and the crawling and whatnot.

Well yeah, but that's not the TV.

Half-way through the game it'd make perfect sense to do something weird with the TV like show that video or have the hand woft out of it...

(When you get that far, you'll understand why)

The doublehead enemies are supposedly representative of the twins in question, as detailed in the victim files on the official website.

Hmm.

So why weren't they all floaty like everything else?

Why turn them into a big-ass demon that flaunts the laws of physics like they were the speed limit.