big giant circles

In what ways does it look ancient? Still looks pretty good to me. /shrugs

Sweet, a Willrock mix. I love this kid. It's been a while since I've played it, but did the intro of this one remind anyone else of Cave Story? It seems like it had that vibe to it. Anyway. Uh, well, it sounds like Billy's production has only improved with each sub, so right on, bro! There's not a lot to say here, great synth work, great flow and energy, and clean production. This is probably the coolest remix of this song since the vocal remix competition I remember from way back when of this source - there were some cool things that came from that. But I digress. AYE LADDIE

Pretty much, yeah. Pulling the lazy vote here, only because Vinnie nailed pretty much everything I have to say. The production is the biggest hangup, and overall I'd say there's too much reverb going on. I personally don't really mind GB's sampled instruments for the most part, there's certainly nothing wrong with using those if you don't have access to Symphonic Orchestra or something. That being said, I think the lead guitar really should be replaces with something more authentic. Otherwise, really really really cool take on some great SotN themes. Visit the WIP forums and get all the advice/help you can on fixing the production. Tone down the reverb, make sure you clean out any "mud" that might build up during the *busier* parts, and if you can, find a way to get the lead electric guitar/synth (the one ~1:50ish) sounding not so rigid and fakey. Maybe just don't even bother going for the electric guitar tone and just use a straight-up synth. RESUBMIT or I will find you and then do horrible things to your lawn.

I think this is a pretty sick performance and a great remix in general, but I agree that Vig makes good points in that the drums lack proper power. That could easily be fixed though. The bass is a little quiet, but I'd be fine with just the drums being boosted if that's all we got. I guess I'll take the initiative and go ahead and see if Chris can boost the drums and maybe a little of the bass. I'm pretty much a YES for now anyway, but I would like more beef on the drums. *EDIT* Just emailed Chris about boosting the drums and bass. We'll see what he says. Let's hold until then.

That pretty much says it all, I'm afraid. Remix isn't terrible, but I honestly don't think that it will be easy to get a remix of this track on the site, unfortunately. I'm sure it can be done, but it'll be an uphill battle, I guarantee. Couple things specifically, the remix is waaay too loud. Also, there were various places where you had a MAJOR progression playing overtop a MINOR structure, and with harshness only being a byproduct of my bluntness, it sounded pretty horrible. Palpable vaguely addressed this when he said some of the parts were "clashing", and they certainly are. Anyway, you should know all the places I'm talking about, but I believe 1:50 is the first of several occurrences. So basically volume issues + "clashing" writing + lots of repetition + a source that doesn't offer much melody anyway = NO

I am most flattered Torley! True to your motto, you have amplified my awesome! The remaster sounds great! :-)

Yikes. Very ambitious source music, and even more so the remix. Pretty fantastic writing, I'd say. Uub sounds like a pretty talented fellow, and very well trained too. More trained than I am, I'd pretty easily admit In an effort to not risk sounding like I know more than I don't or less than I do, I'll simply say that I believe the amount of source usage sounded intact to me and I'm highly impressed at the outcome. It takes a solid amount of skill to tackle a remix of these songs in the produced style, and especially to do it well. I am impressed, and I believe this could very well be a first for OCR. I can't really think of any other remixes that tackle the "modern classical" thing. MAKE IT SO

I went back and revisited the old submission to see how the two compared. This one is definitely a little louder, but I still feel like a lot of the core problems remain. The mix has no emotional power to speak of (volume does not necessarily equate power). I don't mean to sound harsh or anything, but I just didn't find the piece particularly moving. There's not much dynamic range, and regrettably, you're doing this from a keyboard with relatively mediocre sounds. I like Yamaha ok, but one gripe I have with them is that all of their lower-end keyboards (and by that I mean pretty much any of them that are under $800 or so) all use the exact same core samples. And they are WAY past due to update those. They just can't hold a candle to any of the softsynth stuff that's out there, even the cheap stuff. The arrangement itself just kind of wanders, doesn't really feel like it's really going anywhere or telling a particular story. The overall vibe is definitely somber and somewhat melancholy, but I think it's just very difficult to get the intended result when you're playing samples on a keyboard like that. If you have MIDI files saves, I'd recommend abandoning the idea of doing it on your keyboard completely and then giving the remix a head-to-toe overhaul using regular samples in a DAW. But at the risk of sounding pessimistic, Vidal, I think it might not be a bad idea to let this one just be a learning experience and let it go. You're only going to get better with practice, and sometimes it's just easier/wiser to let some pieces lie and start anew than it is to try to get them to the point that they'd get where they'd need to be here. Not to say your song is bad, but I really do think it'd just be more work than it's worth to try to keep fixing it up. But if you really want to, don't let me stop you, I'm just letting you know that it's likely to be a long and arduous journey. Best of luck either way. NO

Definitely a pretty chill remix! Seems fairly conservative for the most part, but I believe multiple listens going back-and-forth from remix to source proved that it wasn't merely a cover. In the interest of making this vote short and sweet while covering all the necessary info, it's a solid piece that definitely bears the critical flaw of low-quality and choppy lead instruments (sax and trumpet). This mix has a case of the "Circa 2003" going on, in that it would be accepted in a heartbeat back then, but today with the availability of some really top-notch soundware for even cheap/free, we like for prominent features of your music to not sound so choppy and sequenced. And of course, like my fellow Judges have said you can probably easily find someone who might even be able to record a live sax etc for you, so maybe try that. That's really the only thing holding this mix out of the green, so please, touch those up, and send it on back (feel free to PM one of us if you like) and it should be able to get a pretty solid YES across the board I think. RESUBMIT

Yep, not much to say here. Obvious connection to it's source, good performance and no production gripes. Not the kind of song I'm going to rock out to on repeat for 30 minutes or anything, but a very somber, thoughtful, well-performed piece absolutely. EVEN SO

Andrew's work by default tends to inspire warm fuzzies, I think it's just his go-to style Let's see: Obvious source usage: check Clean production: check Notable reinterpretation: check BONUS: High energy: check Warm fuzzies: check beautiful choir vox: check (2:30) literally gave me chills. Is it a contradiction to experience warm fuzzies and chills at the same time? Is that like dividing by zero? Because it just happened. Anyway, loved the mix. The only thing I might have done differently if I were Andrew would have been to change up the lead synth at least once. But on the other hand, that type of clean, creamy lead synth is one of my favorite lead timbres. So I really didn't mind. Solid. AYE

Although, I'm sure it could be argued that not everyone who watched Black Hawk Down did so because they felt the need to be educated on the actual events or whatever. Some/many probably thought it was just a compelling action flick and absolutely saw it on the premise to be entertained.

Decent job on the drumwork and performance, but the mixing is pretty beginner-ish. Everything is too quiet, and the actual guitar tone is pretty bleh. The melody doesn't seem particularly developed to me beyond the actual source tune. Not bad, but lots of room for improvement. NO

Nice track! Don't think I really had any gripes with the arrangement itself, but the execution and production left a good amount to be addressed. Try to make good use of the WIP forums because I think getting a lot of feedback about specific things you can and should improve will definitely help you out. Without taking all evening, some very quick pointers I can give is that the piano sounds a little too spacious and muffled--like it was recorded with a too-far-away mic, and that doesn't really mix well with the other instruments that sound a little closer and more dry. It's like I'm listening to the remix in the lobby of the concert hall. The cymbals are too loud and don't really blend with the rest of the soundscape. The high hat abruptly stops at 1:56 in a weird way, doesn't really sound like a natural spot to kill them. Definitely lots of room for improvement. A good foundation as far as the melodic arrangement goes but the overall execution is pretty novice. Keep at it! NO

btw, I did talk to Z-man about this, and he's gonna get us another version where the bass isn't quite so loud. Just FYI.

Tres Bien, Dan, very nice work per usual.

Dude, I killed a jockey mid jump, and it's like he turned into a helium-filled balloon His body literally floated off into the sky, it didn't even fall.

haha, that's a fun way to word it Also yeah, I actually thought the new witches crying and proximity music is actually just as if not more creepy now. Can't wait to hear it in the dark.

*Sigh* It is clear to me that like to say things just for the sake of saying things and philosophize as if you are on some sort of plane of higher thinking. Coupled with your inconsistency, I just can't touch any of that. Feel free to keep enjoying your system of thinking. I wish you the best of luck with it. I'm out.

I agree, splitting actually might not be a bad idea. It does seem pretty silly that a thread about reporting plagiarism has actually turned into a discussion on whether or not it's ok to plagiarize.

I'm not trying to be combative or argumentative, but I just don't get why you keep throwing needless philosophy on a black-and-white issue. What does killing have to do with anything? Is stealing someone's work ever OK? No, it is not. Why are you so intent on making it clear that you think it's acceptable? I suppose I may be putting words in your your mouth a bit, but I'm going by the logic that if it doesn't concern you, then that means you don't mind. And if you don't mind, that means it's acceptable to you. If you don't mind that your house is on fire, then it can also be said that it is acceptable that you're house is burning down. We're not talking about some kid playing virtual Robin Hood with our music, we're talking about someone stealing our property for their own. And you can't seriously expect that saying "Oh, why should I care" is going to sound logical or well-founded. Going back to your original statement on the matter, you said and then directly contradicted yourself in the next sentences. Sounds to me like you do care, otherwise why bother timestamping it at all (which isn't necessarily 100% effective) or bothering to clear it up once you have found out? Nobody here really tries to go out LOOKING for people who have stolen their work, 99% of the time it's just found through coincidence or happenstance. But it's still completely ridiculous to not care on any level, whether you know about it or not. That's essentially justifying robbery as long as the victims don't find out about it. Since you seem to enjoy speculating on "the principle(s) of the matter(s)" in your discussions, I'm just surprised that you're turning a blind eye to the principle of this matter, which is that stealing credit for someone else's work is dishonest, wrong, potentially harmful, and therefore unacceptable. Again, not trying to be combative, but I am desperately struggling to figure out which way your ticker is circling and why.

I do understand now, but I maintain that if plagiarism is acceptable to you on any level, then you have a flawed perspective.

I get the impression that you are confusing someone borrowing ideas from your work and someone actually taking your song and saying they wrote it. We're not talking about someone sampling a few measures from your song or using the same melody or chord progression (like in the case of Satriani vs. Coldplay here - ) We're talking about if say, Coldplay had taken "If I Could Fly" straight off of Satch's CD and said it was their song.In response to the "Why should I care?" perspective, I suppose the degree to which you care is probably governed by the situation. If it's just some 14 year old kid who's starved for attention and thinks he can impress a few people who don't know him on the internet by taking credit for a song he did not create in any way, it's probably not a huge deal, but he still needs a good kick in the ass. What if we take the same kid and instead of just renaming your song and putting it on his website as his track, he burns it onto a CD and starts selling his CD locally. Do you care yet? Not really perhaps? Well, what if he sells a LOT of CDs, so he makes more and keeps selling. Maybe more people take notice and he starts getting recognition and attention for your song. Do you still not know why you should care? If you don't care, then you are probably what most people would call a DOORMAT. Here's a non-music example. Your neighbors get called out of town on a family emergency. They don't have time to arrange anything to be taken care of, they just have time to pack and leave. They're gone for at least a couple weeks, and you notice their lawn is getting out of control. You like your neighbors and don't want them to get fined by the city/neighborhood or whatever so you decide to go mow it for them out of generosity. They have a big yard, full of obstacles and bumps and hills and trees, and it takes you a long time. But hours later, you've successfully trimmed the grass, weeded and fertilized their garden, watered the plants and collected and mulched the clippings. The neighbors return, but you don't tell them it was you. Later on, you're talking with them when another neighbor you don't know walks up to you both and says "Hey, I hope you don't mind, but I took care of your lawn while you were gone." "What's the big deal? It's not like I was doing it for the recognition anyway," you might still say. Well, what if your neighbor is so ecstatic that she says "Oh! How thoughtful! Here is a gift certificate to a really nice restaurant to show you my appreciation, and I absolutely insist that you take it!" If any of that doesn't insult you in some way on some level, then there is just flat out something wrong with you. In all seriousness, would you really just stand there and let it happen? Back to what I said earlier, not caring doesn't make you noble, it makes you a doormat. This doesn't mean that every case of plagiarism deserves SERIOUS LEGAL ACTION or something, but you just seem to not comprehend why we don't like it when people steal our work.

Oh, I didn't learn from scratch. I had an implant. Kind of expensive, and I had to travel to the future and back to get it, but it was worth it. Only thing is, I can't remember anything that happened before 2003...

Yeah, Shaggy's right, don't buy that keyboard. You might like it for a couple months, but you'd grow sick of it in a hurry. Anyway, reiterating what I said, just save up. If that means you should save up enough to upgrade your computer as well, then do it. You can buy a new laptop PLENTY fast enough to run Reason/Komplete etc for like $300 now. I sure hate to see people buy something that is not what they need just because they're on a budget.