Pokémon HeartGold and SoulSilver

[Aninymouse]

seriously, lighten up mr. grumpy pants

[Archaon]

You seriously outclassed all the Gyms

To be fair, you pretty much outclassed all the gyms as long as you did a bit of levelling up first and used the right type of mon.

Chuck? Oh look, I've got an Alakazam that's about the same level as your guys. I win. Jasmine? Suck my Cubone, bitch. Clair?

ICE BEAM

ICE BEAM

ICE BEAM

dragonbreath ICE BEAM

ICE BEAM

ICE BEAM

[PROTO·DOME]

To be fair, you pretty much outclassed all the gyms as long as you did a bit of levelling up first and used the right type of mon.

Wow, that's still more strategic than most people. It's just grind your starter and maybe the first Poké you caught to like level 25 for the first gym and just use that all through the game. Screw type match ups.

[Archaon]

Wow, that's still more strategic than most people. It's just grind your starter and maybe the first Poké you caught to like level 25 for the first gym and just use that all through the game. Screw type match ups.

Perhaps, but I, for one, can only handle so many encounters with wild Rattata before I start seeing red mist.

[Bleck]

in Pokemon Red I didn't even catch any other pokemon until I caught Zapdos

also the damned stop taking pokemon so seriously

[PROTO·DOME]

On another note, anyone here play the metagame much? I dunno, I find myself rushing through the story mode so I can just create a perfect team and battle. Making more Pokémon games with a story just seems a lil' pointless in some ways.

[cobaltstarfire]

I've only really played the games semi seriously, I can't play them fully seriously, cause well, a lot of the pokemon I like fall into the "never used" or "under used" category as far as competitive play.

So screw competitive play.

As far as stories being pointless? Eh well, I dunno I like games with story elements so I don't mind gamefreaks half baked attempts at adding them.

[Aninymouse]

I've only really played the games semi seriously, I can't play them fully seriously, cause well, a lot of the pokemon I like fall into the "never used" or "under used" category as far as competitive play.

So screw competitive play.

As far as stories being pointless? Eh well, I dunno I like games with story elements so I don't mind gamefreaks half baked attempts at adding them.

I enjoy both, myself. That is to say, I like to play through the main story with a new team idea from time to time, and I really like raising Pokemon for battles with friends as well. We had a little tournament of sorts at Remod recently, and I had a lot of fun with that (even if it died out before we finished it).

The one thing that bugs me is that Platinum is so much better than Diamond/Pearl, but I can't restart my Platinum because then I'd lose my Secret Key for my Rotom :[ I went through Pearl recently with your Rival's team from Pokemon Silver, and had a lot of fun with that, but it would have been better in Platinum. It gets pretty boring with so few species in the wild...

Hopefully you won't need a Secret Key to change Rotom's forms in HG/SS... Maybe there'll be a room in the Team Rocket hideout where they stash the appliances? Hopefully.

Also... about the "I hate to battle people because all my favorites are UU/NU" thing. It's not a big deal, seriously. Most people who are really into Pokemon battling (like myself) have an UU team they can pull out against people who don't like to use the biggest or best just to win. I mean I think Mawile is one of the coolest Pokemon in the whole game, and look at how weak it is. They better evolve that sum'bitch next time. And Sandslash? AWESOME. Who doesn't like pangolin? Cute as all get out.

[D.Radium]

I'm surprised that people still care about this overmilked recycled franchise.

That artwork is nice though.

[Aninymouse]

I'm surprised that people still care about this overmilked recycled franchise.

That artwork is nice though.

"Overmilked franchise"? Ha. No more than any other Nintendo IP.

Pokemon's always had something to appeal to most people. I do know a lot of people who love the art who don't even play, though, so you're probably right to single out the design more than anything else.

[cobaltstarfire]

I don't mind battling people, but I just can't win in a competitive situation (I'm not talking about literal winning or losing).

I'm talking about the split between player types.

See I do EV train on occasion, as well as sometimes breeding for moves, IV's, and nature. So some people will be rude to me for daring to do that, example: my last battle in the OCR tournament before it fizzled out, my opponent said it was lame that I EV trained (only 4 out of was it 10? that we had to register). Apparently it's no fun that way? (Well I thought it was pretty fun, especially knowing full well that no matter how far I got I was going to be squashed like a bug by Drack should I reach him lol, best I've done against him is knocking out maybe half his team).

Or it'll go the other way, since I favor NU/UU/BL pokemon, and suddenly people have to slam me for pokemon choice.

I like battling though, it just has to be on friendly terms, and with people I know, cause really it just get's tiresome dealing with both sides of the split. Course it doesn't matter either way, cause I don't have the means to battle online anymore, so now I get to just play around with breeding, and the battle tower.

I do hope that G/S has the extra battle area stuff like platinum has, it'll give me more to do post game since I don't have anyone to play with these days. (I only have diamond, I don't want to restart either cause I have a lot of pokemon traded from clanocr people).

Some little bit of me thinks it'd be cool if they somehow crammed all the countries into G/S instead of just Johto and Kanto, but that won't happen, and even if it did they'd have to add another 100 levels or something. XD (would it even be possible to fit all the countries on one gamecard?)

[The Damned]

Yes, the memory capacity of the DS cards is actually pretty high. It's more a matter of textures and map data. The real memory hog is the storage box system. Each box must have space for so many pokémon, and since each pokémon is a string of data, and there are so many boxes, it becomes a massive amount of data to save each time.

[Aninymouse]

I don't mind battling people, but I just can't win in a competitive situation (I'm not talking about literal winning or losing).

I'm talking about the split between player types.

See I do EV train on occasion, as well as sometimes breeding for moves, IV's, and nature. So some people will be rude to me for daring to do that, example: my last battle in the OCR tournament before it fizzled out, my opponent said it was lame that I EV trained (only 4 out of was it 10? that we had to register). Apparently it's no fun that way? (Well I thought it was pretty fun, especially knowing full well that no matter how far I got I was going to be squashed like a bug by Drack should I reach him lol, best I've done against him is knocking out maybe half his team).

Or it'll go the other way, since I favor NU/UU/BL pokemon, and suddenly people have to slam me for pokemon choice.

I like battling though, it just has to be on friendly terms, and with people I know, cause really it just get's tiresome dealing with both sides of the split. Course it doesn't matter either way, cause I don't have the means to battle online anymore, so now I get to just play around with breeding, and the battle tower.

Now that's a sad story. I've never met anyone who complains about his opponent EV training... sounds like a sore loser who hasn't been weaned off the anime mentality yet.

If you ever get some wifi, look me up. I like to think I'm pretty accommodating.

I do hope that G/S has the extra battle area stuff like platinum has, it'll give me more to do post game since I don't have anyone to play with these days. (I only have diamond, I don't want to restart either cause I have a lot of pokemon traded from clanocr people).

Some little bit of me thinks it'd be cool if they somehow crammed all the countries into G/S instead of just Johto and Kanto, but that won't happen, and even if it did they'd have to add another 100 levels or something. XD (would it even be possible to fit all the countries on one gamecard?)

I hear a LOT of people asking for this kind of game lately.

My guess is that something like that won't happen until the next handheld is out for a while and Gen V is fast approaching. Maybe even Gen VI. It'll probably accompany a game engine overhaul and new storage media.

[Drack]

Yeah, EVs, Natures, IVs.

Really annoying and time consuming. I can see arguments for and against including the system altogether.

+Natures are decent: Is my Lucario Jolly (Higher speed, but unboosted attack) or Adamant (bootested attack, unboosted speed)? Or did I pull a fast one and train a special-attack based lucario with a Modest (boosted special attack) nature because everyone expects a physical attacker? Natures are probably the best thign to keep as it has a significant impact (+/- 10%) on stats, doesn't require training, and they're pretty easy to breed for.

+IVs are stupid. They are annoying and most of the time you want all of them maxed (exception being gyro ball bronzong who benefits from low speed). They're hard to breed for and you can't change them later like EVs. I think they're a terrible idea. The only thing they're good for is determining Hidden Power type, and just one random number would be sufficient for that.

+EVs allow further customization but are a pain in the ass to train, especially if you fuck up and need the stupid berries to remove unwanted EVs.

IMO, this whole problem would be solved if there were a "No nature/IV/EV" mode. Casuals could use it without having to worry about this garbage and the super serious competitive types would just use the regular mode and customize to their hearts content.

By the way, I lost my Diamond save (but have been building up - slowly - a team in platinum. Already post hall of fame now) so I don't have that team I built before, and no record other than what I remember. I do now know its greatest weakness though - If the opponent leads with someone with taunt (like the popular Azelf with stealth rock // taunt // psychic // explosion @ focus sash) my old team would be destroyed. It relied on passing speed boosts to slow but massive stat'd pokemon like rhyperior using a protect // baton pass // substitute ninjask lead. If you used a taunt (or a choice+trick) lead, you probably could have won against my team. Also, blissey would have completely countered my choice specs salamence.

Also, to respond to the rest of your post .. No one should fault you for EV training or using UU/NU/BL. That's just plain silly. There's nothing unfair about it.

[cobaltstarfire]

See I don't know the game well enough to play against the likes of Drack, but that's ok it's a nice challenge.

[Aninymouse]

I agree that the IV/EV stuff is a pain in the ass and more hassle than is necessary at times, but removing them would mean a total overhaul of the system. Right now, there is so much hidden math built into every Pokemon that a lot more than just Hidden Power would no longer work in "Casual Mode," let's call it.

See, stats in Pokemon are dynamic, in that every time you go to look at your Pokemon's numeric stats, the game calculates them from scratch using an algebraic formula. If you took out the "random attributes" (or shall we say, "unique attributes"), all Lv.50 Sandshrew would have the same stats, save for differences in Natures (since you wanted those to stay specifically). There's nothing inherently wrong with that, since a lot of RPGs handle things that way... and in a way, I'd enjoy the security in knowing that my Sandshrew was just as powerful as the next guy's Sandshrew.

But I'm content with what we have. EVs are simple to deal with if you use a resource like Smogon to grasp where allocating them is most effective for your Pokemon, and they don't take much time to finish either, once you have the "Power" items and the Pokerus (which I'm blessed to have and always willing to spread). If anything, keeping count is the biggest hurdle, so I always keep a pad and paper near me when I start.

IVs suck though, no bones about it. Sometimes I'll breed for good ones, sometimes I won't. They're only good for 31 points at Lv.100 in each stat, whereas EVs can make up as many as 63 in two stats. If anything, I think you should pay attention to the Speed IV for your faster Pokemon, since you're not going to want to find out the hard way that your Espeon is slower than your opponent's Infernape when it should be faster, etc.

[The Damned]

Maybe I got lucky and/or my patience paid off. I have quite a few pokes that have IVs 27 and higher. Hell, I got one that has 4 31s... just not in the stats I need them to be. Some of my main team have almost perfect stats because of their IVs, Natures and EVs.

Now, I suppose if you wanted to, you could try to set up some sort of randomly selected team, but that's best done on something like Shoddy. Maybe the next version will have some sort of random team generation for battles.

Yeah, a mini-Stadium for the next version of the Battle Frontier would be kind of awesome.

[cobaltstarfire]

I do agree it's a pain to breed and train for things like that, but I think I would miss the variety in stats produced by the combination of IV's, Nature, and pokemon battled.

It's kind of cool that if you battle a lot of fast pokemon they probably provide speed EV's and that in turn influences your pokemons overall speed. I think if the game made it easier to to control where EV's go and relocate them (and possibly lower the range for IV's?) It might make it less a pain to play with pokemon genes, without taking away the neatness of such a system.

At least breeding in pokemon isn't like in Monster Rancher, although the two games could take some pointers from one another in various things within their battle/breeding/training systems.

[Aninymouse]

The sad thing is, every time they revamp the basic system, they don't allow you to import your old monsters... That's gonna be a bummer when it happens, since I've trained more Pokemon in DPPt than ever before :/

But then again, I don't mind starting off fresh too much I suppose. Just so long as they give us more than 150 monsters to use before the main quest ends... Diamond & Pearl feel so bland, having played Platinum.

[WarpstarRider]

I just hope they do a good job with the music. And that it gets an actual soundtrack release; it's a shame that the original G/S is the only generation not to get one.

[BardicKnowledge]

On the IV/EV subject, it's the main thing that kept me relatively turned off to Pokemon (though you guys did motivate me to play through Platinum). Too much work for too little ingame reward outside of online battling. I'd like to see more depth added to the single-player experience (where EV/IV training is basically not important at all).

[PROTO·DOME]

On the IV/EV subject, it's the main thing that kept me relatively turned off to Pokemon (though you guys did motivate me to play through Platinum). Too much work for too little ingame reward outside of online battling. I'd like to see more depth added to the single-player experience (where EV/IV training is basically not important at all).

Y'know in a way I agree with that. While competitive battle has been fun- and very rewarding if you know a group of people who do the same- I sorta miss the days when you cared only about the "single-player" experience. G/S/C were my favorite for that; I remember playing intently, not to raise the EVs of said poké or even planning a specific moveset, but to get all the badges, raise your favorite team and explore Johto/Kanto.

While I guess I'm just being overly nostalgic and I'm older now and all that, I just found the new games to have very little awe and adventure to them. *shrugs* Dunno, just hoping that the remakes are as good as I found the originals as a kid...

[Aninymouse]

I don't think a Pokemon game will ever manage an "awe inspiring" scope now, at least to us. I've been playing this damn game since 1996 or whatever, and it's evolved little by little, but so have I - apart from it and together with it. Because of this, and judging by the snail's pace at which Pokemon's "single-player" grows and expands over the years, I suspect that it would take a radical departure or a total graphic overhaul to really inspire and amaze me.

I'm fine with the way they go about things as it is, but I'm not going to deny that the untapped potential of the Pokemon world easily exceeds all the other Nintendo IPs put together. That they're content to simply refine the "same game" has resulted in a truely polished & streamlined experience, but it also means that we get a lot of lackluster side games that try to sell themselves on the kind of innovations we all wish we could explore from the beginning; things like the microphone in Hey You Pikachu, the racing in Pokemon Dash, the exploration of natural Pokemon society & the deeper story present in Mystery Dungeon, the terrain control in Ranger, the darker side of the underworld in Colosseum, etc.

[The Damned]

I just hope they do a good job with the music. And that it gets an actual soundtrack release; it's a shame that the original G/S is the only generation not to get one.

Whaaaa...? I have all the game OSTs to date, even the DPPt ones.

Are you sure you're not thinking of some other soundtrack collection?

[WarpstarRider]

Whaaaa...? I have all the game OSTs to date, even the DPPt ones.

Are you sure you're not thinking of some other soundtrack collection?

No, there never was an official soundtrack album released for G/S. There are a few unofficial rips out there, though. (I made one myself, but it's not very well-circulated.)