Snes Jurassic Park Mountain Trance/Techno/Garionica (Submitted, thanks all!)

[Gario]

Hey everyone! I haven't posted anything on the WIP boards in a while (and I find myself writing on here often enough), so I decided to throw something out there for you guys to tear up .

Jurassic Park - Hot Steppin' Dinosaurs

http://www.box.net/shared/f3mn1049ky

Source

Yeah, it's a techno/trance mix of the already heavily remixed Mountain theme from Jurassic Park snes game. The drums are weak and repetitive, as I've just copy/pasted the same beat throughout, but they're unfinished... if you know of any good Reason bass drum samples I'm listening - I never seem to find anything that works well for this genre. I'm also not satisfied with the intro and there is no work with any of the velocities or dynamics. It's also unfinished, as I'm sure you can tell .

Feedback is appreciated!

[jabond23]

That high pitched lead that only plays a very few notes seems to be way to loud. It hurts my ears when it comes in, although all the other instruments seems pretty good. I think the bass could use a tiny boost for more kick. I see what you mean about the drums, they are very repetitive but i know its only temporary. The sort of harpsichord/piano thing at 1:25 seems to a little loud as well, but its not too bad. I like the little break there as well before the drums jump back. My only suggestion for that is to double just the harpsichord/piano synth's length and maybe add some synth strings in there for an added atmospheric touch. All the other synths sound very nice and rich and you can hear everything without it being distorted or clipped.

It seems pretty decent so far and the whole techno/trance vibe your going for is working very nicely. Also, kudos on going for a very obscure theme, its works very well.

Looking forward to the next update.

[Gario]

Thanks for the feedback, Jabond - I've boosted the bass, turned down the lead and improved the mixing quality of the whole thing. However, I also turned up the entire mix a decible or two, so it may seem like I didn't turn down any of the things you mentioned . I don't think it's as painful as before, though.

The first post is updated with the new version.

I also added some new stuff... Check it out. It sounds loads better - although I still didn't fix the drums .

[hewhoisiam]

Mmhokae

You may wanna fatten up that lead high synth with some detuning or delay.

The break could use a dynamic change to bring things down before getting back into the meat and potatoes of the song.

You already hit some of the problems with the drum track. I'd complain about the bass drum, but you already know about that. When I sequence my drum tracks, now more than ever, I split my sounds so I can effect each one. Bass drum and low toms get a track, snare and hi-hats get a track. Hi-toms get a track, and cymbals get a track (sometimes bells and effects/fills get their own track) This'll let you put a bass boost on your lows without distorting anything. (esp good for Techno stuff) I'm not famaliar enough with reason to help with the sound though, sorry.

-He

[Giga Bowser]

way to go I'll be looking forward for the released ver you really done a grate job I really loved that techno

[Gario]

I'm glad you like it, Giga Bowser - always nice to know people enjoy what I do .

Hewhoisiam, which break are you talking about? The break in the middle there does have a dramatic dynamic change before it goes into the meat and potatoes... . My drum track is already split into multiple channels - I never write a track without separating the drums, don't worry . I don't know if I will fatten up that lead for a few reasons (mainly, though, because the thin sound is coming from the register rather than from the instrument, and it needs to be at that register for spacial reasons - listen to the texture from 0:55 - 1:25, as that is the exact same instrument without any modifications to the sound; it's not thin, like it is when it's up high).

Thanks for the feedback, though - it's why I post here .

Sorry, no update right now .

[Jewbei]

hmmm i see you have some basic idea's gario the production needs some more work. the arp in the intro sounds to piercing acutally alot of the sounds are very piercing the kick needs to be eq'ed and compressed but its a good start keep working at it. oh and the bass is a lil weak.

[-RK-]

I like most everything, but I really feel like the bass should do something different, other than playing eighth notes on the off beat. Make the bassline move around more. Just because this is trance doesn't mean the bassline has to be boring.

And yeah, I know you said it, but I want more beef on the drums, and maybe a tad more variety. It doesn't need to stay 4 on the floor the entire time.

I like it as a foundation, but it's still kinda bland to me.

[hewhoisiam]

I wanna say I remember playing this on the Sega Genesis, not the SNES. Multi-platform goodness meyheps?

As far as the break goes. Is there a difference between the versions of the song maybe? I don't hear anything that sounds like what it looks like I think I was talking about. I could also be losing it

I think I was suggesting a smoother transition into the actual break at 1:24 where it just sort of drops off. Part of me likes the sudden change, part of me wants smoother. I could have also wanted the very last notes before your build up at 1:51 to be quieter. I alwalys harp on dynamics, but I listen to a lot of the stuff loud so I can really get the dynamic changes. When I export my project I'm usually amazed how quiet my stuff is when I've sone 'soft' parts. So, meh. I would also guess I was hungry when I made the post... Meat and potatoes

@0:55 - 1:25 If that's the sound you like it's good, it's just not my taste. When it comes to 1:25 ish and it's a very weak sound; maybe thin isn't the right word. I want a beefier sound, maybe echo effects or something. And that's my taste I would say. I like the sound of layering a sound like that with something that has a gritty sort of subtracted sound. (At the end of OCR120, I used something with that very high glockenspiel part, because the thing sounded weak when I first did it. Again, that's just what I like)

Hope that clears it up

-H

[Gario]

Yeah, I agree a lot of it is boring... I'll change it up when I get the structure complete. Priorities, though - it's probably best for me to get the structure done first, then change up the bass/ beef up the drums/ get the production up to standards/ etc. I might get to some of it earlier (like the lack of bass in the bass) before I finish, though. Thanks for letting me know, though - like I said before, it's why I post here .

I wanna say I remember playing this on the Sega Genesis, not the SNES. Multi-platform goodness meyheps?

lol, the Sega version of the game has absolutely no relation to the snes version, dude; one's a platformer (Sega) while the other is a top down adventure game (snes) - I'm surprised you'd be able to recognize any of it at all. I posted the source link so you could compare.

The Sega version did have a lot of blood, though - gotta give them props for that .

[hewhoisiam]

I just meant that I played the sega game. I can't remember what I ate for dinner last night; much less the music from a game that I played in grade school. (though I do remember the game vaguely, like I said. I never owned a Sega, it was a friend of mine's. )

[Rozovian]

Careful with the highs in the intro, gets a little shrill especially the dissonance when the first chord is fading over the second one.

Snare/clap is terrible. 1:27 transition to breakdown.... you need a transition! The bells in the breakdown could be more humanized, or at least a little more varied, dynamically.

Hihat panned center? Especially with the cool 2:30 instrument's panning the hihat panning just sounds stupid. Pan it a bit one way, give it an echo or something in the other direction to keep the sound balanced.

Nice to hear you take advantage of this part of source, I was expecting the more memorable melody from source.

Drums, transitions, shrill frequencies... that's about it. Great work man.

[Gario]

Hihat panned center? Especially with the cool 2:30 instrument's panning the hihat panning just sounds stupid.

Umm... actually there is no panning work in this, yet (except at the part you mentioned, of course), so I'll take a look at what your talking about and see what I can do. I didn't put the panning in there on purpose, anyhow, so thanks for catching it.

The drums suck, I agree - they're temporary, for sure. The transition, though - that's something you don't hear very often (the sudden change), and it's an aesthetic I really enjoy, as long as it's not overused in a song. I'm actually upset that people don't do it more often .

Thanks for the comments, though .

[Gario]

Woo, an update (finally). It's taken me this long to find a bass drum and snare/clap that I was finally satisfied with and integrate it into the mix without it sounding like a muddy mess. So, here's what's different...

-Voice clips added (not too many, but enough to give it flavor)

-Better intro

-A hell of a lot of tweaking with the mastering (particularly with the bass)

-New drum samples and such (although the pattern is still rather boring, through most of it)

-A few new sections (anything after 3:13 )

-I tried to adjust the hats so they were centered better (it's hard to hear, though - You've got some sensitive ears for panning, Rozo)

I have not changed the bassline up much until the new material starts coming in, so if it sounded boring and bland before it will this time around - that's something I'm gonna get in the post-production (along with the drum pattern).

The first post is updated, so check it out .

[SoulinEther]

I LOVE ME SOME BASS. I played the old version for a few mins while waiting for the new one to download... and the bass here is just kicking my ass in comparison. Doesn't strike me as too muddy I guess, listening on speakers. I don't have much to say, beyond.. finish plz. Oh, and voice clips are 99% of the time... lame. Just a highly subjective opinion.

[Gario]

Oh, and voice clips are 99% of the time... lame. Just a highly subjective opinion.

lol, well, that's the opinion most people hold, too - but seriously, the intro NEEDS that clip (all others are subject to change ). I'm glad the bass is passing, though - it was my major hurdle, for this song - it should go smoothly, now (and I'll lower the bitrate so it's under 6mbs, in the end ).

[Gario]

Sweet, another update (although getting it to this point today has prevented me from doing an analysis, today... much sadness - I'll get one up tomorrow, instead). I've finished the structure, so now it actually has a beginning, middle and real end - check it out .

I got rid of one voice clip (Dennis) and added another in order to frame the song better (so it does have a purpose now, everyone ), and I added over another minute of music to the whole thing, capping it off at over 6 minutes. Listening to the music up to 2:40 I'm not really happy with how it sounds, at the moment (RK's sentiments are the same as my own, about that), but that'll change soon enough.

I also decreased the bit rate so it's less than 6mgs, but now I'm afraid a significant amount quality is lost, so I need to figure out a better way to encode it.

Enjoy, and don't forget to let me know what to fix!

[Nabeel Ansari]

Well Gario I dunno what to say.

It's insanely long and it feels kinda repetitive. Maybe that's just me I couldn't focus too much on it because I was watching videos.

But it IS kinda long...

[hewhoisiam]

ACK! UGH! VOICE CLIP SOUND BITES! MY ONLY WEAKNESS! *dies*

I am not a fan of them almost ever. I've heard maybe 2 megaman remixes that used various power up sounds and did okay, but I don't like them. I seem to remember listening to a street fighter remix that was very good, cept it kept saying "HEY! VEGA!"

I like the sounds you've got so far. I'd like to hear more panning on the high notes, especally the long sustained ones like at 1:00 The long notes are almost overpowering as is.

The notes right at 2:25-2:34 are too busy for their role. Till that point they've had a very sort of specific role that they've done. But right there, the extra notes don't fit well with that instrument to me. It changes and hits lows methinks, with a very large distance between notes that I just don't like much.

This is a touch long and repetitive, maybe cut the length of some of the later build up pieces. I always figure you have a good build at the beginning, and once that's established, the others can be much quicker. 1:27-1:53 does that in yours, but then it happens again at like 2:34-2:46, 4:47-5:00. Now, I like each one of those, and they're all different and none of them are wrong. This seems like the same sort of idea over and over again and is contributing to me feeling like the song is too long.

Hope that helps

-H

[Gario]

ACK! UGH! VOICE CLIP SOUND BITES! MY ONLY WEAKNESS! *dies*

...now I have to kill you in your sleep - congratulations .

This is a touch long and repetitive, maybe cut the length of some of the later build up pieces. I always figure you have a good build at the beginning, and once that's established, the others can be much quicker. 1:27-1:53 does that in yours, but then it happens again at like 2:34-2:46, 4:47-5:00. Now, I like each one of those, and they're all different and none of them are wrong. This seems like the same sort of idea over and over again and is contributing to me feeling like the song is too long.

Well, you have to admit, the other breaks are considerably shorter than the original at 1:27, thus making them quicker (unless you actually mean a tempo increase, which I'd love to do throughout but Reason 3 doesn't support it at all ). Perhaps this song is a bit long - I'll see if there is anything I can do to prune it (probably taking more from the beginning than the middle/end - I like the material past 2:33 far better than before 2:33).

I'll see what I can do to the long notes to make them more bearable, and work with the centering of all the instruments and such - that's the point I'm at now, anyhow .

I think I hear what your talking about at 2:34 - 2:46... I need the change in 'texture' for the texture, myself (if that makes sense) - other parts are doing that shape throughout the song, but if I leave it in one instrument throughout the whole song it drives me nuts...

Like I said, I'll see if I can make it a bit shorter, or at least make it sound less repetitive - the source isn't that long, so it starts to get difficult to make it fresh, after a while.

[Jae]

I didn't really find the song to be too long. In fact, it kept my interest pretty well. I thought the last "Welcome to Jurassic Park" was the ending though. It did feel like an unnecessary repeat there. I also think that if you chose to remove some sections entirely, it wouldn't hurt the mix since there are some areas that seem sectioned.

I didn't have any headphones on, and my volume was down a little, but I wonder how the shrill of the melody would play against my eardrums. The production is coming along great. I need to listen to the source again. As for the sound clips, I'm not a big fan of the first "Welcome to Jurassic Park" especially. It just seems out of place and doesn't lead into the song very well.

You can take or leave my commentary if you'd like. I'm no expert, but I do like where this is going. Trance is a fun genre.

[hewhoisiam]

You know Gario, a true friend kills you in your wake and in the front, not in your sleep.

You'll have to allow me to make an obscure reference now, and because of your proximity to this thread, you even have to read it. This song is like pie. And I like pie. There's the whip cream, the cherry, the crust, the first bite. All parts of eating the pie. I don't eat 3 pieces of pie; there's no reason.

Now, there are people out there who eat 3 pieces of pie, good for them. They like the pie more than I like the pie, I guess... Oh hell, I should talk about the song shouldn't I?

Some trance and stuff is 10 minutes long, or it's an entire album that sounds the same, and that works. That's the great thing about music is that it's all interpretive and opinions. The double edged sword is that no 2 people like the same thing. I don't like long and repetitive, there's a happy medium where too long becomes old and stale, and not enough leaves me wanting... MOAR! So that's what I'm trying to communicate. And remember, that's just FOR ME, so...

Pie?

-H

[Gario]

Don't worry, I won't kill you - if I was, then I'd need to kill a whole lot of people for not liking voice clips in a remix. I'm a part of a minority, I guess - but at some point one does need to take into account that it is their own song, and I love voice clips. It's a guilty pleasure, I guess.

As for the 'length' and such... well, we'll see - perhaps I'll just change it so the parts aren't nearly as boring (or cut some parts out, altogether). I'll get to it, though, seeing as no one is taking any of the pie, for the length, for one reason or another .

[jabond23]

Ya know, i haven't gotten around to following up on your update yet! AHH!! Anyways...

I think this update is a huge improvement on everything. That one higher lead sounds so much better. For some reason it just seemed very piercing before. I like the small change up at 1:02 to include a fuller synth and the break at 1:27 is a nice touch. At 2:34, the change up there is kinda sudden, but that might've been what you were going for. I like the part at 3:17 it really helps mix things up a bit. From there on out everything seems a bit overdrawn. I think maybe some parts could be cut in halves or just eliminated. Even a good synth solo would be a nice add on to that part.

The drum beat is nice, but gets way too reptitive. I think if you switch it up a lot during the interludes/breakdowns/change-ups it would really help pull the track together.

All in all though man, it sounds really good so far.

[Gario]

That one higher lead sounds so much better. For some reason it just seemed very piercing before.

That's 'cause it was too loud, like you said before; I turned them down almost immediately, lol.

UPDATE! I've done a lot of extra texture work, in order to take the repetitiveness out of the track, changed the drum and bass work dramatically (although the hats are basically the same - if it's noticeable please tell me), replaced a few instruments that didn't belong in some areas. The ending is quite different, although I'm not sure if I'm satisfied with it... I might extend the parts that I cut down to half-time back to what they were - if anyone has ideas on that part let me know .

Enjoy!