Zelda: Ocarina of Time (Covers & remakes)

[Clayjrjr2]

The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time is my favorite game to this day, and is still one of the most impacting video games I have ever played.

Since I love the game so much, and I honor the music (because if not for the music the game would have just been mediocre) I have made several cover songs from the game.

I plan on adding more to this list because I don't think they had good enough quality sounds to work with when making that game back then.

These are my tribute to the best game.

http://soundcloud.com/clayjrjr2/sets/the-legend-of-zelda-ocarina-of-time-covers

[Rozovian]

I don't think you have good enough quality sounds to work with atm.

I had a quick listen to each of them, I would suggest you work on your production. Whatever tools you're using, know them inside-out, and if you find that there's something you want to do that they can't do, see what free resources there are out there that can do it.

Learn to listen, compare your stuff to what others do with similar tools and resources, learn from the differences. Listen to "real" music, out there, be it orchestral, folk, jazz, rock, electronic, opera... whatever. Always strive to improve. As you have in order to get where you are now.

Just keep going.

[Charry]

I listened to all of them and the quality isn't that bad but in someof the covers I don't hear the source at all and others sounded too much like the original to be excepted on OCRemix. I liked them though regardless but I don't think OCRemix will except them

[Clayjrjr2]

I don't think you have good enough quality sounds to work with atm.

I had a quick listen to each of them, I would suggest you work on your production. Whatever tools you're using, know them inside-out, and if you find that there's something you want to do that they can't do, see what free resources there are out there that can do it.

Learn to listen, compare your stuff to what others do with similar tools and resources, learn from the differences. Listen to "real" music, out there, be it orchestral, folk, jazz, rock, electronic, opera... whatever. Always strive to improve. As you have in order to get where you are now.

Just keep going.

You have got to be joking me.

I used EWQL SD2, EWQL Symphonic Orchestra, EWQL Symphonic Choirs, and Spectrasonics Omnisphere. You mean to tell me that those aren't quality sounds? These are cover songs. They are supposed to sound very close to the original. I know my tools inside and out. I think you don't know what you are talking about.

I suggest you get a straight jacket because you might be crazy.

[Clayjrjr2]

I would like to challenge anyone here to make a cover song that sounds as close to the original as some of these. I will count the days...

[Rozovian]

If you've got those tools, you're not using them right. This stuff sounds sampled, raw, and not dynamic and organic in any way. If that's your goal, congratulations.

[Gario]

If you've got those tools, you're not using them right. This stuff sounds sampled, raw, and not dynamic and organic in any way.

Pretty much this. Having the samples is excellent (I can only hope to have them someday... soon), but the samples aren't everything. You need to learn about humanization of your instruments, as well.

If a person played an instrument at the same volume levels, hit every note with the same articulation, had no variance in their tempo, no vibrato, etc., then they'd sound like the tracks you're providing. You need to work with the instruments at these levels - just using the samples (and adding reverb - is just not enough to make them realistic. There's more to performance than getting the notes right.

I don't think you care about getting them onto OCR, so being conservative isn't a bad thing at all. Many (if not most) of us don't really care about being 'close to the source', though, so you probably won't find anyone to meet your challenge (I would try, but I have better things to do, I'm afraid). Make your request on Newgrounds Audio or Youtube and you might have some better luck - people there don't have the same restrictions as here.

Oh, and don't beat down someone that's giving you advice when you post in here. There's always room for improvement, so blocking them off with retorts such as 'I know my tools inside and out. I think you don't know what you are talking about.' and 'I suggest you get a straight jacket because you might be crazy.' are unproductive. Like Rozo said, unless you were really trying to imitate the poor midi-ish sound that the N64 had, then you have some work in front of you. Take constructive criticism better and you might improve at your craft.

[Sbeast]

Well its certainly a good start for a tribute to Zelda, but I think there could be some improvements made. Personally, I would choose a clear musical direction; either all covers or all remixes. If its covers then the production has to be flawless. If its remixes then both the arrangement and production need to be considered. I'm not sure what your goal with these songs are. After you have decided this, you should post just one of the songs here, so people will be able to give you more accurate and specific feedback on the chosen song. That's what I would do anyway.

[DMZ]

Clayjrjr2 needs to learn how to take critisicm, a bit of humility, and what OCremix is all about first.

OCremix is a place for remixes, not covers, i.e. don't just open up a midi file and asign samples to each channel. I have little music production experience but I know virtually every OCR song inside-out and what I listened to was not a video game remix by OCR standards.

You should probably rethink what you are trying to achieve by posting in these forums, because so far it is not on par with OCR expectations.

[Clayjrjr2]

If you've got those tools, you're not using them right. This stuff sounds sampled, raw, and not dynamic and organic in any way. If that's your goal, congratulations.

Thank you. Yes, it was the goal.

[Rozovian]

...needs to learn ...what OCremix is all about first.

These forums are for any vgm remixes/remakes, not just for ppl trying to get their stuff posted on ocr. OP stated clearly they were covers, it's even in the thread title. Eyes open, and comment on the tracks.

[Clayjrjr2]

Pretty much this. Having the samples is excellent (I can only hope to have them someday... soon), but the samples aren't everything. You need to learn about humanization of your instruments, as well.

If a person played an instrument at the same volume levels, hit every note with the same articulation, had no variance in their tempo, no vibrato, etc., then they'd sound like the tracks you're providing. You need to work with the instruments at these levels - just using the samples (and adding reverb - is just not enough to make them realistic. There's more to performance than getting the notes right.

I don't think you care about getting them onto OCR, so being conservative isn't a bad thing at all. Many (if not most) of us don't really care about being 'close to the source', though, so you probably won't find anyone to meet your challenge (I would try, but I have better things to do, I'm afraid). Make your request on Newgrounds Audio or Youtube and you might have some better luck - people there don't have the same restrictions as here.

Oh, and don't beat down someone that's giving you advice when you post in here. There's always room for improvement, so blocking them off with retorts such as 'I know my tools inside and out. I think you don't know what you are talking about.' and 'I suggest you get a straight jacket because you might be crazy.' are unproductive. Like Rozo said, unless you were really trying to imitate the poor midi-ish sound that the N64 had, then you have some work in front of you. Take constructive criticism better and you might improve at your craft.

I think my original post made it difficult for people here to understand my ultimate goal with those songs. I was trying to get some of them to sound as close to the original as possible.

Here is just one thing that you're wrong about.

I have learned about humanization. This is why I was able to reproduce the songs so well. Obviously the point of the songs was missed.

I just don't want these songs to be seen as something that they were not intended to be. If you think about it, maybe I am the one trying to change your paradigm.

http://www.Clayjrjr2.com

These forums are for any vgm remixes/remakes, not just for ppl trying to get their stuff posted on ocr. OP stated clearly they were covers, it's even in the thread title. Eyes open, and comment on the tracks.

Thank you. One person gets it.

Clayjrjr2 needs to learn how to take critisicm, a bit of humility, and what OCremix is all about first.

OCremix is a place for remixes, not covers, i.e. don't just open up a midi file and asign samples to each channel. I have little music production experience but I know virtually every OCR song inside-out and what I listened to was not a video game remix by OCR standards.

You should probably rethink what you are trying to achieve by posting in these forums, because so far it is not on par with OCR expectations.

It is funny that you think that my cover songs came from a midi file. Your ears deceive you.

Since you have little music production experience, and I have ten years under my belt, would it not make sense to just leave that part to me?

You are right when you say you didn't listen to a remix. 100% correct. They are cover songs.

I know what I was achieving, and I feel that I did a damn good job of it. Go comment on a remix if you want to bash someone. Maybe I will make a few remixes and give you a taste of what you really want. That seems to be what your audio diet consists of. I really don't care who accepts the songs & for what "standards", whether it be OCR or God himself.

Would you like me to do remixes? I assure you that I am fully capable of the task.

[Anti-Syne]

Mate you need to calm down a bit, coming on here, being arrogant and wanting to argue with everyone is not cool.

From what i gather you wanted to reproduce the tracks as close to the originals as possible, and seeing as your tracks are getting confused with midi rips you must have done a good job so i'm saying a very genuine well done.

But people here do only try and help you, when they say 'your samples don't sound good enough' or 'your tracks don't sound human enough' they're not insulting you, they're telling you how you can improve on the work you've already done. Having the attitude of 'you're wrong and i'm more experienced than you' is not going to get you taken seriously here, or anywhere else for that matter.

[Rozovian]

Yeah, chill dude. We have no idea who you are and what you can do, so coming here with a sense of self-importance expecting us to see how awesome your work is (in this case how exactly like the originals it sounds) is a bit silly and it's gonna get in the way of you enjoying the community. Even if you're a professional with x years of experience plus music-specific education and training, an established artist and composer in every conceivable field and a friggin' child prodigy, to us you're just another new name. In this case a new name with an attitude problem.

Case in point:

I know what I was achieving, and I feel that I did a damn good job of it. Go comment on a remix if you want to bash someone. Maybe I will make a few remixes and give you a taste of what you really want. That seems to be what your audio diet consists of. I really don't care who accepts the songs & for what "standards", whether it be OCR or God himself.

Would you like me to do remixes? I assure you that I am fully capable of the task.

That's your ego speaking. Get in under control or you're not gonna make many friends here. If you have a problem with remixes and ppl who listen to remixes and are gonna be an asshole to them, maybe a site with the word remix in the name isn't the right place for you.

[Clayjrjr2]

Yeah, chill dude. We have no idea who you are and what you can do, so coming here with a sense of self-importance expecting us to see how awesome your work is (in this case how exactly like the originals it sounds) is a bit silly and it's gonna get in the way of you enjoying the community. Even if you're a professional with x years of experience plus music-specific education and training, an established artist and composer in every conceivable field and a friggin' child prodigy, to us you're just another new name. In this case a new name with an attitude problem.

Case in point:

That's your ego speaking. Get in under control or you're not gonna make many friends here. If you have a problem with remixes and ppl who listen to remixes and are gonna be an asshole to them, maybe a site with the word remix in the name isn't the right place for you.

I am perfectly calm.

How "awesome" it is or isn't something I could care less about. I care about honesty, validity, pertinence, and sound advice within a review.

I don't have a problem with remixes. If I did, I would have said so.

Yes, I am an asshole.

I want honest reviews without all the bullshit. (a request, not a demand)

If I have communicated to you in a demeaning way, then I apologize. I'm also sorry that the truth (even when spoken by an asshole, as you put it) is hard to accept. When someone says something that I can verify as either bias, or false, I cannot help but call them out on it.

Once again, I apologize. May I please have some reviews that are congruent with the subject at hand?

[Benjamin Briggs]

HEY KANYE

you're not all that

and certainly no bag of chips

if you don't want feedback don't post your shit on public forums

[Anti-Syne]

Once again, I apologize. May I please have some reviews that are congruent with the subject at hand?

I don't think you have good enough quality sounds to work with atm.

I had a quick listen to each of them, I would suggest you work on your production. Whatever tools you're using, know them inside-out, and if you find that there's something you want to do that they can't do, see what free resources there are out there that can do it.

I listened to all of them and the quality isn't that bad but in some of the covers I don't hear the source at all and others sounded too much like the original to be excepted on OCRemix. I liked them though regardless but I don't think OCRemix will except them

Well its certainly a good start for a tribute to Zelda, but I think there could be some improvements made. Personally, I would choose a clear musical direction; either all covers or all remixes. If its covers then the production has to be flawless. If its remixes then both the arrangement and production need to be considered. I'm not sure what your goal with these songs are. After you have decided this, you should post just one of the songs here, so people will be able to give you more accurate and specific feedback on the chosen song. That's what I would do anyway.

You've already had some very good reviews and advice, listen to these people and i promise you will be able to improve any work you do.

[Clayjrjr2]

Can we move on please?

[halc]

Can we move on please?

to what? nobody is going to leave any feedback if you continue making personal attacks and dismissing everyone's critique as crap. if you can't handle civilized feedback, don't post on our workshop forums.

some of you also need to use your eyes; these are clearly stated as covers and the artist has not mentioned a word about submitting any of them to OCR. this forum is the place for any VGM-related works, be it ReMixes, covers, or mash-ups. critique accordingly.

[Nabeel Ansari]

Clay, word of advice.

If rozovian tells you your samples are crappy, they are crappy.

You don't need to show him they are humanized, because he doesn't think they sound humanized. You can ignore him or you can listen to him, but you do not treat him like he has no idea what he's talking about (because in my experience Rozovian is one of the most valuable critics I've ever had and he's mostly right when it comes to this)

And get that stupid ego under control.

EDIT: Get your HORRIBLE ego under control. 10 years of music production experience doesn't mean much, and it certainly doesn't show in this stuff you posted up.

In my opinion you have ten years of something, and that's age. You pretty much sound like a little kid who's getting offended. Kudos to you for not actually using curse words.

We get the point of these songs were to be covers, but they sound just as MIDI-ized and low quality as the original.

Humanization goes a long way, you may have tried but what you fail to realize is that you're not even close.

And I'm being an asshole in this review because what goes around comes around. :/

ANOTHER THING:

I know what I was achieving, and I feel that I did a damn good job of it. Go comment on a remix if you want to bash someone..

1. This is a review thread, n00b.

2. From the reviews I've read, it seems the people here don't think you've done a good job.

3. If you don't like the feedback, you shouldn't have posted here in the first place.

4. You are not the greatest musician in the world, nor do you claim to be, but you seem to think that you can do anything and it will sound good. It doesn't, it didn't, and it won't until you're willing to learn rather than defend your work against any and all criticism.

Criticism is never going to be 100% positive, and if you keep attacking the critics, your work will just deteriorate into mindless mp3 garbage going circles because you won't realize how bad at music you're becoming because, basically, you're shutting off the outside world.

[Rozovian]

Enough. Nobody cares what Clay is doing, everyone is just picking on him at this point. WiP feedback or shut up.

(also neblix, the guy is trying to make it sound as close to the originals as possible, intentionally using good samples to get an aged, rigid sound. it threw me off. it's already been covered in the thread.)

[Nabeel Ansari]

Enough. Nobody cares what Clay is doing, everyone is just picking on him at this point. WiP feedback or shut up.

(also neblix, the guy is trying to make it sound as close to the originals as possible, intentionally using good samples to get an aged, rigid sound. it threw me off. it's already been covered in the thread.)

Really? Because later in the thread Clay stated he reproduced the tracks with perfect humanization, which is a claim I certainly think we can attack but we won't because I failed to realize he was intending what you are suggesting.

It's confusing me because on the soundcloud page he almost sounded like he was TRYING to make it sound higher quality. (Yes, I'm being sarcastic, Rozo, because he's openly stated several times he's attempting to make it sound higher quality and humanized)

WiP feedback:

Lacks humanization. They can be as close as they want to the source, but the source tracks are just repetitive, you really didn't need to render long mp3's to cover what's there. It sounds to me like you're prescribing your own MIDI and then channeling them through Composer's Collection. Nothing much else to comment on, because instruments/samples are really the only thing to pay attention to with covers.

[BlackPanther]

Lol you guys aren't gettin it. He was wanting to get as close to the originals as possible, they're good I guess. I don't know why one would do that when I can just go listen to the originals somewhere else I would like to see you actually remix a OoT song, put as much effort and love as you did with these originals, lets see what you got!!

Maybe we should lock this to prevent this from gettin worse? I'm pretty sure everything that needs to be said, or should be said, has been said already @_@.

[WillRock]

Wow. Drama.

Anyway, going to ignore that and comment on the remixes.

For what its worth, I think you do have good samples, but the samples could be put to better use with more tlc on the sequencing aspects, humanization, velocities, timing etc. I know thats not what you were going for, but I can still hope for it right

For what its worth, these sound mechanical and I find it somewhat a shame that if you are capable of better you are showing us these pieces.

I'm not really sure what to say... it seems to me that you've done what you intended and you don't want any constructive feedback at all. If that's the case, then well done I suppose, but I can only judge your skills by what you have shown here, and these don't really show much musical skill other than having a good ear for scoring out the originals note for note with modest production values.

If you are as good as you say you are, I hope we see something with a bit more personalization from you in the future.

[Clayjrjr2]

I will do a remix.

I love doing remixes.

What song should I do?