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OCR TF2: New Server forthcoming - new server IPs and other stuff

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That seems kinda suspect but you got a trustworthy face, Zeph.

$.25 is on it's way.

Now I can buy a gumball! WOOT!

I like sensai's rotation,




cp_steel (or whatever it's officially called)



cp_castle4 (Seriously, this map is amazing. We really, DESPERATELY need to check it out.)


I'm not a fan of hydro really, but I'm manage to survive... also, castle has all ratings in the 9's, so it must be decent...

as for what I think would be the perfect rotation...










... just kidding

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How's this for a rotation for tonight?









Also, I'll put on Castle4 on the server sometime, just right now I'm too lazy haha. I have a feeling that a lot won't like it though.

Edit: [12:49pm] Tensei-San: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyZxJYo_Q4I

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I really think that the main problem with pyro (pre BB, mind you) is that the flame's are not NEARLY consistent enough. Like, I can be in a group of people and holding down the burner and swinging about like mad...and no one catches on fire.

And as long as we eventually get to play Castle, that's fine. It's a big place, but tons of fun.

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I think the Demoman is pretty powerful, definitely can seem cheap. I don't think the Soldier is though - he's quite slow.

All the classes are pretty powerful in their own way, but they all have their weaknesses, too.

Here are their weaknesses, starting from the left (I play Spy a lot, so I have the order memorized):

1. Scout's primary gun sucks at range and only holds a few shots.

2. Soldier's primary weapon is quite slow and can rarely be used in short range combat without killing oneself.

3. Pyro's long range sucks.

4. Demoman has an abysmally slow rate of fire.

5. Heavies don't do that good of damage at distance and it takes time for their gun to come up to speed... they can keep their gun spinning, but their movement is slowed even further.

6. Engineers have a weak offense power. Their sentry guns are also rather stupid... plus they stop shooting while sapped.

7. Medics don't have a lot of health or offense.

8. Snipers have to be zoomed in for a few seconds before their shots work that well. They also have limited movement while zoomed in). The zoom resets after each shot, too.

9. Spies can be detected fairly easily by shooting at allies, or by trying to run through them. Cloaked spies also show up for a second when they run into someone or take damage.

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The thing about the Soldier that in my opinion makes him cheap is the fact that crits are determined somewhat by how much damage you have been doing that life. Seeing as though the Soldier's main weapon is powerful and does splash damage, they can rack up damage pretty quickly. This is why, and I believe many will agree with me on this, Soldier's seem to get more crits than any other class. And since a crit rocket can kill you in basically one hit unless you're an overhealed Heavy, I think this isn't very fair.

This could technically apply to the Demoman as well, but the Demoman has less health (unlikely to stay alive as long) and his projectiles are usually easily dodged.

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Yeah, but in my opinion rockets are pretty easily dodged too. They travel slowly and lose damage over distance. Sure, they're brutal close-range weapons, but lots of classes have brutal close-range weapons so it's not TOO different. Demo is more effective at taking out structures and neither of their weapons lose damage over distance. Also, stickies move faster than rockets AFAIK.

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A Demo will get totally raped by just about any class that manages to get in close (even engies or snipers) unless he has excellent aim with grenades, can predict his targets movements with stickies, or just gets lucky in melee. That said, if you round a corner and you meet a pyro, soldier or scout, you're dead.

This is why I think the demoman is overall a very carefully balanced character, he has great mid and long-range capability (can go toe to toe even with soldiers and heavies), but his ability to fight at close range flat out sucks unless you have mad skills.

Of course getting hit by a crit mid-air sticky can feel unfair, same goes for a soldiers crit missiles, but really any class can seem to have an unfair advantage in the hands of a capable player (especially scouts, I hate em), but, as far as I can tell, everything seems pretty well balanced.

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Crit Rockets aren't really broken in that rockets are one of the more difficult weapons to hit with. If they didn't do splash damage, soldiers would be worthless at killing anything but Sentries. Splash damage is *life* to Soldiers. And while yes, crit rates get boosted by doing damage, but consider that most of the time a rocket won't be doing full damage unless the soldier is a crack shot and the target moves like a target drone.

The Crit Rocket is the haymaker Soldiers need to do their jobs in the long run. Yeah, it does kinda suck to get instagibbed by a Crit Rocket. Bahamut's done it to me countless times. But with so many other things that instagib you in TF2 now? Sticky traps, Backburnering Pyros, et. al? Crit Rockets are a small matter.

Moreover, all of this is offset by the long reload and small capacity of the Rocket Launcher. It's not like soldiers can spam rockets all day because we run out and we have to reload, and that's when we're vulnerable. It's a pretty glaring weakness if people can learn to exploit it. AND, to make matters tougher for soldiers? The Pyro Patch gave pyros a reflector to push away incoming missiles. It's hard to do, granted, but it can turn the tables on a soldier. Bahamut and I have both been on the receiving ends of each others' reflected crit rockets and I can tell you from personal experience that such a thing isn't fun.

So yeah. The Soldier's not cheap. He's supposed to be the main, bread-and-butter, versatile offensive class. He's well rounded and strong, but he's not invincible. If you're playing as a niche class like Scout, you have to use your niche well to beat the Soldier.

Really, here's the rule of thumb and it's really quite simple:

*Don't think you can beat the guy with the rocket launcher in a straight fight.*

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so we were on granary and there were 3 scouts on our team (i was one of them) and baha was yelling at us to change the ENTIRE match but we didnt

colin is like the best scout ever and ive pretty much been playing scout exclusively the past few days

dunno who the other guy was

ANYWAYS this resulted

[00:03:15] <atmuh> rofl at bahas ban thread

[00:03:18] <atmuh> threat

[00:04:17] <Bahamut> I have little tolerance for team griefing and blatantly keeping it

[00:04:38] <atmuh> what

[00:04:41] <atmuh> i wanted to be scout

[00:04:52] <atmuh> and you spent the whole freaking match telling me to change

[00:04:55] <atmuh> and i didnt want to

[00:04:56] <atmuh> so i didnt

[00:04:59] <atmuh> omg ban

[00:05:08] <Bahamut> well considering it's called TEAM Fortress

[00:05:10] <atmuh> i was trying to win

[00:05:19] <Bahamut> that's exactly griefing

[00:05:26] <atmuh> ts not lie iwas being an idiot

[00:05:29] <atmuh> youre ro rofl

[00:06:07] <Bahamut> well if I see that shit from anyone

[00:06:07] <Bahamut> it's a ban

[00:06:07] <Bahamut> don't care who you are

[00:06:08] <Bahamut> it's called total bullshit

[00:06:14] <garian> what's going on?

[00:06:21] <garian> oh

[00:06:23] <Bahamut> this applies even to reserved slot holders

[00:06:24] <garian> team griefing

[00:07:04] <atmuh> because i cant pick a class that i want to be

[00:07:35] <Bahamut> if the choice causes an unbalanced amount to ruin a team, yes

[00:07:50] <Bahamut> it's called griefing, and no amount of excuses changes that

[00:07:54] <atmuh> ya ill just

[00:08:00] <atmuh> stay off your team :D

[00:08:20] <atmuh> because no one else has ever said ANYTHING about me being whatever classes ive been

[00:08:21] <Bahamut> I can easy find out the class distribution of any team

[00:08:33] <atmuh> omg atmuh is scout

[00:08:36] <atmuh> ban him

[00:08:41] <atmuh> so what if i am

[00:08:43] <atmuh> no one cares

[00:08:45] <Bahamut> I was ready to ban all 3 scouts

[00:08:48] <atmuh> we have

[00:08:49] <atmuh> FUN

[00:08:54] <garian> i goof around a lot but if the team tells me to stop it i usually do :\

[00:08:56] <Bahamut> it wasn't unique to you, but giving me lip for it is deserving of a ban

[00:09:10] <atmuh> you guys are scouts i dont want you to be scouts

[00:09:13] <atmuh> ban ban ban

[00:09:21] <PosiBolt> Hey wes, is #ocrtf2 mentioned in the server info?

[00:09:29] <Bahamut> don't think so posi

[00:09:34] <PosiBolt> We should.

[00:09:49] <Bahamut> no, it's "I don't want 3 scouts when we're getting rolled due to nothing to hold them back"

[00:09:53] <PosiBolt> Get some more people this way, maybe get some more people interested in #ocremix while we're at it.

[00:09:58] <Bahamut> and then "but I want to be a scout waaaaaaaah"

[00:10:13] <garian> "getting rolled" as in you guys were defending, and had 3 scouts?

[00:10:19] <PosiBolt> Mention server and chat room info, and maybe a link to a page with instructions for IRC n00bs.

[00:10:27] <Bahamut> want to be a crybaby about doing something stupid to cause a big reason a team loses, then you're not wanted on the server, simple as that

[00:10:47] <Bahamut> and it proved to be the case as we were able to push back for a win after

[00:10:49] <atmuh> uh

[00:10:52] <Bahamut> with just having 1 scout

[00:10:54] <atmuh> you were the crybaby

[00:11:04] <atmuh> you were the one who was whining the ENTIRE MATCH

[00:11:06] <Bahamut> I was pointing out the shittiness of 3 scouts

[00:11:13] <Bahamut> you were whining about wanting to stay scout

[00:11:34] <atmuh> i didnt say anything

[00:11:38] <atmuh> until the end

[00:11:41] <atmuh> and what i said was

[00:11:41] <atmuh> no

[00:11:43] <Bahamut> sorry but if you want to distort shit and giving a deceitful argument, I'll just ban you right now

[00:11:43] <atmuh> that was all

[00:11:49] <Bahamut> this server will have none of that

[00:11:50] <atmuh> READ THE LOGS

[00:11:53] <atmuh> all i said

[00:11:55] <atmuh> was NO

[00:11:59] <atmuh> and then

[00:12:00] <atmuh> lolololol

[00:12:03] <atmuh> thats it

[00:12:14] <Bahamut> yeah, you were purposely being a griefer and troll

[00:12:18] <atmuh> much more than your SCOUTS STOP SCOUTS STOP EVERY FIVE SECONDS

[00:12:21] <atmuh> uh no

[00:12:24] <atmuh> i play scout now

[00:12:27] <atmuh> i have for days

[00:12:31] <Bahamut> continue one more line of your toolboxness and you're banned now

[00:12:40] <atmuh> check the logs that you so love to refer to

[00:12:46] <atmuh> ive been so much scout the past few days

[00:13:52] <Bahamut> I did warn you one more line, so your reserved slot is now gone

[00:14:00] <Bahamut> one more line and you're permabanned

[00:14:34] <Bahamut> I don't run the server to put up with this type of bullshit

[00:14:44] <Bahamut> if you want to act stupid, go to another server

[00:14:54] <Bahamut> cause this server is not for that


[00:15:13] <Bahamut> k adding steam ID # to banlist

[00:18:18] <Bleck> I am confused as to what just happened

[00:19:09] <Bahamut> basically atma supported team griefing and started trolling for it, which is grounds for permaban on this server as per server rules

[00:19:26] <atmuh> i was neither griefing nor trolling

[00:19:32] <atmuh> and youre just being a dick

[00:19:43] <Bahamut> I've banned others for less, but as a reserved slot holder I was willing to give leeway for


[00:19:58] <Bahamut> but it doesn't mean a free pass for team griefing

[00:20:09] <atmuh> yeah and i SWITCHED teams and you know what?

[00:20:16] <atmuh> they had no problem with me at all!

[00:20:22] <atmuh> they were happy i was on their team!

[00:20:26] <atmuh> you know why?

[00:20:30] <atmuh> because they have FUN

[00:20:36] <Bahamut> uhh others noted the stupidity of 3 scouts

[00:20:39] <Bahamut> you just chose to ignore it

[00:20:54] <Bleck> we've had more than 3 scouts on the server before and nobody seemed to care

[00:21:06] * Bahamut (~wesleycho@pool-141-155-150-216.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has left #ocrtf2

[00:21:06] * Bahamut (~wesleycho@pool-141-155-150-216.ny5030.east.verizon.net) has joined #ocrtf2

[00:21:07] * ChanServ sets mode: +o Bahamut

[00:21:09] <atmuh> yeah and colin was like im the best scout

[00:21:10] <atmuh> and he is

[00:21:11] * Bahamut sets mode: +b *!*@pool-71-125-17-168.nycmny.fios.verizon.net

[00:21:12] * You were kicked by Bahamut (Bahamut)

come on im not the only one that thinks this is a little extreme am i

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I have never seen, in any class-based game, someone call someone a troll because they played as a certain class. And I'm sorry, but disagreeing with the order to do such is not 'griefing' in the least. If every player who has ever killed me as a scout is a griefer, then basically half the gamebase needs to be banned.

I'll be the first to agree that this is a little extreme, and probably the only other person than atma ballsy enough to say that this is probably just prejudice against atma. The fact that everyone I know with dislike of atma is now defending someone (a certain someone many others who have nothing against atma mostly agree is either a troll or very much pushing the limit) who, citing Bahamut's zero tolerance policy against trolling, should have been banned, is simply proof of this.

I think it's important that everyone say what they think about this. Opinions are important in a matter such as this.

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k question... wtf is "griefing"?

and wtf. lol. is there no free will for the players to be whatever class they choose? I understand it's a team game, but the team is composed of individuals, and unless it's some strict clan match with a gameplan where everyone has rules issued to them to carry out for victory, then stifling someones ability to be whatever class they want to be is a bit ridiculous. If I joined a server, and someone told me to be a certain class and I refused because I suck with said class, and they banned me, I'd be outright f'n livid to think someone has a say in what class I choose to be in a game.

Just remember, it's only a GAME. The users deserve SOME freedoms that are within the boundaries of actual rules where they can enjoy the game. I am the furthest person from an Atma supporter, but from what I've read, this sounds a bit like abuse of power only because it's Atma, and there are far worse crimes in an online game than not changing their class to someone elses liking. But I guess I had to be there to really understand what happened.

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