Sonic and Knuckles - Death Egg Zone (Chromium Asphyxiation)

[Level 99]

Well, I plastered this all over the web and totally didn't post about it here. I've already submitted this song to OCR and will be submitting it shortly to thasauce, but I didn't want the workshop thread to think I didn't love it anymore. Consider this me coming back on Valentines day with a Box-of-ReMix-Chocolates in-hand. (Except Valentines day was last week...so yeah, you get the idea).

http://www.tindeck.com/listen/wuau

I still believe that the Xenogears project track I worked on, Quickening, was the fastest I've ever done a ReMix (done in less than 24 hours with Avaris). Not that I'm doing it with the mentality of a speedrun, sometimes a song or idea just grabs hold of you and won't let you sleep until you get it out. This is definitely one of those tracks, and it was done between two and three days last week. Despite having such a huge list of things on my to-do and to-ReMix list, I couldn't go on with other tracks really until I got this one out. Cool story, fro'.

But yeah, that's about it. Enjoy! It's definitely a lot of fun to drive really fast to.

[Jhawk]

i dont know about you but i wound like this to be a lil Heavier. uhhh in the main theme 0:51 to 1:16 sounds like crap. i dont know the right musical Terms but it sounds bad. tune your guitar or something 1:17 to 1:42 sounds OK no real problems 1:43 to 2:08 crap.

So (in my Opinion) make it more Heavier

Fix the main theme

and this remix need something else i dont know what

[Level 99]

i dont know about you but i wound like this to be a lil Heavier. uhhh in the main theme 0:51 to 1:16 sounds like crap. i dont know the right musical Terms but it sounds bad. tune your guitar or something 1:17 to 1:42 sounds OK no real problems 1:43 to 2:08 crap.

So (in my Opinion) make it more Heavier

Fix the main theme

and this remix need something else i dont know what

Well, I don't know what "crap" you're talking about, but if you're talking about the off-tune bends, that was intentional. And next time, remember that the word "crap" is opinion and really isn't specific enough criticism. If you don't know the musical terms, google it or describe it more elaborately.

In terms of heavier, I'll agree there's less bass than one would expect, but that was also intentional for this mix.

Lastly, saying it "need something else i dont know what" is also not constructive criticism.

[Nabeel Ansari]

i dont know about you but i wound like this to be a lil Heavier. uhhh in the main theme 0:51 to 1:16 sounds like crap. i dont know the right musical Terms but it sounds bad. tune your guitar or something 1:17 to 1:42 sounds OK no real problems 1:43 to 2:08 crap.

So (in my Opinion) make it more Heavier

Fix the main theme

and this remix need something else i dont know what

That was possibly the weirdest crit I've ever read. 0_0

I mean that was just plain weeeird. :/

[WillRock]

Well I've commented on this already - imma comment again

basically, guitars sound awesome, I think the production needs a little work to make everything clearer, and you need better synths frankly, they sound kinda cheap imo...

however, arrangement sounds cool to me, I think its the production is what needs work, it sounds rough around the edges, just give it that little polish to make it shine

As for Jhawk... play no attention to him, anyone that says something is crap with no clear reason shouldn't say anything in the first place.

Keep at it man, its not done yet, but its close. sounds awesome tho, keep at it

[Gario]

Jhawk, for your lame ass review you've been SHUNNED! Away with ye, vile crap-spewing reviewer! In all seriousness, though, if you don't have anything constructive to post, just don't post it next time, alright? Saying something is 'crap' without knowing what it is that sounds wrong isn't very helpful.

Level99, glad to see that you're giving this forum some love (more than I have, as of late ), especially with a remix of this source. It just can't get enough attention, especially from you .

Alright, time to wipe the brown off my lips and move onto the crits...

I love the effects on the guitars in the beginning, and the use of percussion outside of a trap set, there. It's a very nice touch.

At 0:26 - 0:37, the background guitar there sounds like it would be a bit more fitting in the foreground. However, the transition from 0:37 to 0:38 almost makes up for it, imo, so perhaps it isn't a big deal.

The main theme (you know, the one that sounds like 'crap') doesn't sound bad, but there are some points where your slides have rough landings (as in they land on a sour note). Be careful about that - Jhawk may have had a point, but was unable to articulate it. It only happens only once or twice, really, but watch out for that. Also, because the music before had such a full texture the music from 0:51 - 1:16 sounds very hollow. Of course you want it to be a little more open so there'll be room for the theme, there, but I believe the soundscape needs to have a little bit more in there so the transition isn't as jarring.

The effect on the guitar is a touch loud at 1:16... Nice, but a little too loud, compared to the instruments around it. It's quieter at 1:24, which sounds more appropriate, so try to match that level the first time around. It could be that the sudden change in the texture (from hollow to full) is tricking my ears into thinking that one sounds louder than the other, so perhaps fixing the earlier part will 'fix' this part, in turn. Use your judgment, there.

1:43 to 2:08 actually don't have any of the problems from earlier, so I guess Jhawk was, indeed, talking about the pitch bends and not the landings. Meh, whatever, I'm not hear to figure Jhawk out .

The soloing was great, later on, although I believe the lead is a bit quiet, there. Bring it up a tad.

3:12 has the same problem as 1:16 - crits from earlier apply.

I'll say this real quick - I hear Parallel 5ths when the main theme is played with an accompaniment, but (for the first time ever) I'd say they're appropriate to the genre. Personally, I'd change them to something like 6ths or something, but I understand it's inherent to rock/metal, so... yeah. I'll stop now .

Otherwise, great remix, dude! Obviously, everything I've said is pretty minor; they're just things that'll help make the idea clearer. Clean it up and I feel it'll be safe® when it comes to the judges. I don't think it'll be rejected, as it is, but it could be a little bit better. Good luck!

[Shade]

I'll say this real quick - I hear Parallel 5ths when the main theme is played with an accompaniment, but (for the first time ever) I'd say they're appropriate to the genre. Personally, I'd change them to something like 6ths or something, but I understand it's inherent to rock/metal, so... yeah. I'll stop now .

Man, proving theory wrong about parallel 5ths was like the reason rock was invented!

Sweet mix! I'm with Willrock, the only issues are some minor production things. The rhythm guitar feels a tad muddy, and the accenting on the drums feels a bit off. For the beat you use at :51 and 1:55, you have the off-beat snare hits at the same level (or thereabouts) as the hit on 3 and it makes the whole thing a bit jerky since your snare is so cutting. I think if you brought down the volume on those a bit and maybe didn't accent the beat so heavily with the tambourine sound at 1:55 (am I hearing that right? Is it playing 8th notes or just quarters?), it would give those parts a lot more momentum.

Is the lead at 1:16 just a really phased guitar? Sounds exactly like a synth lead - very cool. That part followed by the phased clean lead at 1:29 has this electro-bluegrass kind of vibe which I love.

[Gario]

Man, proving theory wrong about parallel 5ths was like the reason rock was invented!

... I'd dig into you for this, but you know not what you're saying .

I guess I shouldn't get so into ripping apart people when they lack Music Theory and mock it on here, but it's so.. damn... hard... not to...

[Shade]

... I'd dig into you for this, but you know not what you're saying .

I guess I shouldn't get so into ripping apart people when they lack Music Theory and mock it on here, but it's so.. damn... hard... not to...

It...was a power chords joke, dude. Put down the axe. XD

[Gario]

Don't worry, mine was a joke, too ...

... although I'm sure there are a few posters who've actually experienced some counterpoint wrath from me, so it's sometimes hard to tell .

Level99, hurry up and give us an update - we're tearing each other up in here, 'cause you're not feedin' us any music!

[Level 99]

Haha well, I did consider this finished. I've had a few other people give very small crits, and I did already sub it. I might make a few changes just for sake of my own portfolio of music, but I dunno if those changes will make it into the sub. Despite that, thanks to all of you for the feedback!

That synth sound that Gario is mistaking for a heavily-fx'd guitar is actually a synth.

I'll let you all know when/if I get the chance to apply any of the feedback, but as of the moment I'm back to being a remix project whore Glad for those that enjoyed the mix!

[Gario]

It's actually a synth? Damnit, I need my ears checked.

Unless the J's already reviewed your work, you could probably make changes to the file and upload it and replace the file you submit. That way it'll have the changes before going through the panel.

If you want to change it, that is

Originally posted by Level 99

I'll let you all know when/if I get the chance to apply any of the feedback, but as of the moment I'm back to being a remix project whore

I know how you feel, man... Project whoring, ftw.

[Level 99]

Well, it was a mediafire link, and those links are dynamic for each file that's uploaded, but I might just come crying to them saying I CHANGED IT A WEEK LATER PLEASE FOR TO ACCEPT NEW MASTERED VERSION PLEASE! Gario, you give the WIP forums great loving.

[Gario]

DAMN YOU, MEDIAFIRE!!

I didn't know some sites had that feature... Ah, bless Box.net for it's dl-replacing capabilities (I actually rely on it - sub a half finished song and get'er done a week before it's judged... don't tell the J's mah secret...)!

Best of luck with this in the panel, anyway - I believe it's passable, even as it is. I think the J's allow for changes to a song after it passes, anyhow (as long as those changes are not significant, like structure changes), so if you want to make changes after it's passed I think it's possible,

[Level 99]

I've decided to update this a little, time-permitting, with a number of the notes y'all have given me. I did want to point out a few things that may in-fact be tricking your ears:

Gario:

I checked and both the bends AND the landings are slightly off on the lead guitar for that first melody runthrough. However, funny thing, is that same run is copy/pasted for the second and third time later in the song. Funny how you said that the second sounded on because of the accompaniment. I am curious as to if the accompaniment's notes make it seem more on-point.

The synth-tar lead for the 1:16 section is the same volume throughout, but what might be throwing you off is something that's not as apparent: there's two synths playing the same thing. The more apparent one is a single lead with a bit of distortion and warble. The BACKING of it is a phased and delayed lead with some really cool latency (you can hear part of the effect right after all the instruments cut out after that section, listen in your right ear and you'll hear the delay being phased and faded out and then slightly faded back in). It's a dynamic phase so each time it's exported it is usually rendered differently. That track is frozen, though, so I can try to automate the volume on the first part to be slightly lower than during the second part, where you said it sounded better.

Shade: That off-beat snare hits might be exhibiting that because they're not quantized. I don't think the volume of the hits will make much of a difference, but I'll try it out. That particular beat was from a Groove Monkee midi pak, which they ship unquantized to have it seem more human. I'll see what kind of tweaking is needed to stop the jerky-syndrome you're experiencing.

and just in-general stuff:

The parallel 5ths stay.

I'll do my best to clean up the production where I can. I'd say this is 97% done to my satisfaction with production, and usually whenever I'm mixing, I will settle for things above 90% in my weaker areas such as production and drums (this is to combat my perfectionist tendencies and have it so that I do FINISH mixed instead of infinitely trying to improve them). So if nothing else can be done to improve it on my end, I'll keep it as-is. BUT, like I said, I will try.

I'm going to try recalling my sub and sending in this one ASAP, so it might be updated before you know it.

[Level 99]

Tweaks applied:

FINAL FOR SERIOUS I THINK

[Cyril the Wolf]

For serious.

[Kizyr]

I don't have much comment on the song itself beyond what's already been said. But, I will add that it's always great when a remix reminds me of a song that's awesome that, until now, I totally forgot.

I didn't even remember Death Egg Zone until I heard the mix; now I can pretty much picture all the weird gravity-flips and background of that stage. Great choice.

Mix is awesome too, by the way. KF

[Level 99]

I do realize I'm kind of reviving this thread from the dead, but I got some new mastering software recently and I wanted to get a little feedback on how much of a difference it makes. Some of the feedback on this song, when I released it, indicated to me that I should really focus more attention to mastering. I listen back now and realize how muddy it sounds, especially in comparison to the new master.

So any comments or critiques based on the sound alone would be appreciated.

Here's the original, as was posted on OCR:

http://ocremix.org/remix/OCR02066/

And here's my new master:

Level 99 - Chromium Asphyxiation (Remaster)

If this has made a significant improvement, I may just have to go back and remaster all of my old songs.

[Icrosonze]

First post and all that jazz.

Yeah, the new mastering software has just made a world of difference in the sound. Love the song, I've had it downloaded since febuary. Actually, I love pretty much all of your music - but there's no denying that a lot of it sounds muddy and less clear than it could be. A few of them could probably benefit from a remastering.

The old song sounded a little far off, and the sounds kinda bleeded into each other (don't know if I'm saying it right). The new one is much more upfront, clearer, and all the sounds cut through each other much more sharply. At first I thought it was volume, or that one was recorded much louder than the other - that's definately not the case. You just became really proficient at mastering.

And before jumping back to re-do old songs, why not finish new ones? Like Battle with the Shelled king ?

[Rukunetsu]

Wow - this is really good L99! If you don't mind my asking - was what program did you use for the guitar?

[Level 99]

First post and all that jazz.

Yeah, the new mastering software has just made a world of difference in the sound. Love the song, I've had it downloaded since febuary. Actually, I love pretty much all of your music - but there's no denying that a lot of it sounds muddy and less clear than it could be. A few of them could probably benefit from a remastering.

The old song sounded a little far off, and the sounds kinda bleeded into each other (don't know if I'm saying it right). The new one is much more upfront, clearer, and all the sounds cut through each other much more sharply. At first I thought it was volume, or that one was recorded much louder than the other - that's definately not the case. You just became really proficient at mastering.

And before jumping back to re-do old songs, why not finish new ones? Like Battle with the Shelled king ?

Heh, awesome, glad you like the song! Thanks for the comments and feedback, it was exactly what I was looking to get out of it. I've had the issue for a while where something will sound good to me, and good on my recording headphones, but not sound good anywhere else. I will be shooting to have the same improved quality on all my songs henceforth (or at least all the ones where I do the final mixdown on).

It's also good to know that people are silently keeping a hawk's eye on things I, erm, *ehem* haven't finished yet, hahaha. I will add that track back onto my to-do list, but that also may take a while due to my project obligations at the moment. No doubt I intend to finish almost every track; it's just a matter of when. Thanks for listening!

Wow - this is really good L99! If you don't mind my asking - was what program did you use for the guitar?

Well, that depends on what you're asking, but I'll answer the two questions you're most likely asking:

1) are the guitars real or programmed: they are real.

2) what did I use to get them to sound like they do: I used a Pod XT, with some after effects with sonitusfx plugins.

[Rukunetsu]

Thanks for the answers L99-Keep up the good work.