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Red Rum

finished Streets of Rage "Souled Out"

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Link to the (first revision of the) ReMix: https://sites.google.com/site/redrumb1/SouledOut.mp3

Link to the (second revision of the) ReMix: https://sites.google.com/site/redrumb1/Souled_Out_.mp3

UPDATED VERSION POSTED ON DECEMBER 30TH, 2012: https://sites.google.com/site/redrumb1/Souled_Out.mp3

The source of the track remixed:

Before anything is said, let me just say this. If this arrangement does not make it, I honestly don't know what will. It doesn't matter anyways, this is my one last final attempt. Even if it gets a *RESUB*, I won't be trying anymore. I will move on completely from all of this.

Keep in mind, it has been a few years since I've touched anything VGM, much less the Streets of Rage soundtrack, which is what I'm best known for in the VGM area.

I have had no internet for a while now, which is a burden. So, I put all of my time and effort into this. Yes, this. An arrangement of The Last Soul, probably the track I've mixed most during all of my years working with the Streets of Rage OST.

I have boosted up my production for just this one time. No rush job here, just hard work and dedication. I have never had a single mix on OCReMix, and I've been trying to reach that pinnacle for well over ten years. To me, once I do that, I have accomplished all I wanted to accomplish in VGM.

Anyways, this is Souled Out. The title I thought was fitting for many reasons. For one, the name of the source track. Secondly, I've been working with wrestling music for a good while. "Souled Out" is a wrestling pay-per-view. Thirdly, this track is just that. It's (Last) Souled Out.

Much was added in this. You'll notice off the bat that this mix isn't like any of my other mixes. Traditionally, my mixes are often chip-like and a bit like covers. Only in certain instances was I innovative, like blending in "Sadeness" by Enigma within my S.O.R. Super Mix remix "Soul of Rage."

Anyways, listen for yourself. Even if it doesn't make the cut, I know you guys will enjoy this very much. Production, I know for a fact is 100% perfect. I've listened to it many times between lo-fi earphones to HQ speakers.

This is my legacy: Souled Out. Enjoy.

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This is really well done, I'm impressed. I enjoyed this quite a bit.

Question: If this mix makes the cut, will you continue making more, or have you decided to stop regardless of its fate?

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This is really well done, I'm impressed. I enjoyed this quite a bit.

Question: If this mix makes the cut, will you continue making more, or have you decided to stop regardless of its fate?

If it makes the cut, I actually might be driven to create more mixes for OCReMix. Who knows though? OCR is the one thing that I've always wanted in all of my years working with VGM. Only time will tell.

Also, I'm glad you enjoyed this. I did work very hard on this and with no internet, I had the time to take my time to work on it.

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Well, even if it doesn't get accepted, I think you should keep going with it. It would be a shame if you were to quit, you have talent. Either way, good luck!

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Well, even if it doesn't get accepted, I think you should keep going with it. It would be a shame if you were to quit, you have talent. Either way, good luck!

Thank you. I know I'm good at what I do, but I feel like I need a driving movitation factor to continue on. Making the cut I feel would do that for me.

Again, I'm glad you enjoyed the mix. Thanks for listening. :)

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Sounds awesome Red; Production is very good, and your choice of pads, arps etc added a fresh coat of paint to a pretty awesome classic. If I read your description correctly, you were going for more of a cover right? If so, great job - only a few minor gripes here and there (:48 - When the piano first comes in, VERY minor clash of notes) and being that this mix have been covered a fair amount of times, I feel like you could've expanded on it a bit more (perhaps a piano solo or something of that nature - the source leaves a ton of room for it).

Not trying to be a jerk here, as I know what it feels like to work hard on something then have some dude criticize it - but it's something you may hear from the workshop/judges as great production quality isn't everything.

That said, it's still a very good mix and best of luck either way. You're pretty confident in your abilities, so I personally think that getting accepted here shouldn't be your ONLY driving factor. Have fun with your music and improve while doing so.

Just this wannabes opinion though. Keep at it.

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Sounds awesome Red; Production is very good, and your choice of pads, arps etc added a fresh coat of paint to a pretty awesome classic. If I read your description correctly, you were going for more of a cover right? If so, great job - only a few minor gripes here and there (:48 - When the piano first comes in, VERY minor clash of notes) and being that this mix have been covered a fair amount of times, I feel like you could've expanded on it a bit more (perhaps a piano solo or something of that nature - the source leaves a ton of room for it).

Not trying to be a jerk here, as I know what it feels like to work hard on something then have some dude criticize it - but it's something you may hear from the workshop/judges as great production quality isn't everything.

That said, it's still a very good mix and best of luck either way. You're pretty confident in your abilities, so I personally think that getting accepted here shouldn't be your ONLY driving factor. Have fun with your music and improve while doing so.

Just this wannabes opinion though. Keep at it.

I'm always open for criticism, my dude. That's the best way to actually go back and look on improving on things you can do better.

And you aren't being a jerk. All input is relevant and everyone's opinion is different.

Yes, I know the judges can be picky, but I suppose that is a good thing. That's why they judge works, right? They have to have the ear to breakdown a track from top to bottom.

Well, I wouldn't say OCR is my only driving factor. However, it is a main priority. I have been working with VGM since 2000. I was even there when the old VGMix used to be up and running. OCR is, has, and always will be a goal that I wish to obtain.

With that said, thanks for the input and the listen. Glad you enjoyed.

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Red Rum! Good to see you back buddy, with a new version of a SOR mix, definitely dig your other SOR stuff, even if it does not strictly follow OCR standards.

Ok, I know how discouraging OCR standards can get sometimes, and I myself struggled with it for a while before I got accepted. Recently, I had a collab rejected by the panel (http://soundcloud.com/ambientonline/sakura-remix), which is discouraging, but there are just certain guidelines that make an OCReMix, and if you want to be featured on the site, you need to follow them.

I am intimately familiar with the SOR soundtrack and each midi file. And the source you are remixing here was probably one of the first remixes I attempted many years ago (combining this one with the SOR2 supermix). You have some very cool things you did with the theme - the original piano parts fit in pretty well, the fill at 1:34 is super cool. Also, this is something I very rarely say - you can definitely extend your mix, I was totally expecting the chorus to come in again just as the mix ended (expected to hear the part from 1:25). It should totally work. The variations leading up to the end kind of set the mix up to return to the main theme, and I think the listeners will dig it.

I really really don't want to discourage you, but I don't think this will pass. I could tell you "this is awesome and it rules and jgdfgts better pass it", but it won't do you any good. While you have variations, and some original parts in there, the basis of your mix is identical to the original and it is especially obvious in the beginning. The bass is the same, along with the repeating chords, the drums, the overall feel. What judges expect is rearrangement, and rearrangement in its most basic definition (at least to me) is the rearrangement of the supporting parts, of the bass, the supporting instruments, their rhythm, changes in percussive patterns, switching up the style. So, in general, I don't think the rearrangement factor is quite there.

It would be great if some other remixers or mods would chime in on this.

Please keep at it and don't get discouraged!

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Red Rum! Good to see you back buddy, with a new version of a SOR mix, definitely dig your other SOR stuff, even if it does not strictly follow OCR standards.

ambient! I remember you. I remember many years ago, I was working on a cross-game remix between Shenmue and Streets of Rage and you somewhat walked me through on it. You broke down the track, guided me on what to improve on, etc. etc. How's it hanging?

Ok, I know how discouraging OCR standards can get sometimes, and I myself struggled with it for a while before I got accepted.

Tell me about it. I've been trying for years to get just one song on here, my dude. Haha.

Recently, I had a collab rejected by the panel (http://soundcloud.com/ambientonline/sakura-remix), which is discouraging, but there are just certain guidelines that make an OCReMix, and if you want to be featured on the site, you need to follow them.

This isn't get accepted? Say what? I actually had to go back and listen to this twice. Very good arrangement, very good beat. With HQ speakers, you can hear how booming those bass drums/kicks are.

I am intimately familiar with the SOR soundtrack and each midi file. And the source you are remixing here was probably one of the first remixes I attempted many years ago (combining this one with the SOR2 supermix). You have some very cool things you did with the theme - the original piano parts fit in pretty well, the fill at 1:34 is super cool. Also, this is something I very rarely say - you can definitely extend your mix, I was totally expecting the chorus to come in again just as the mix ended (expected to hear the part from 1:25). It should totally work. The variations leading up to the end kind of set the mix up to return to the main theme, and I think the listeners will dig it.

I actually thought about extending the remix and going back to a loop at 1:25, but I didn't want it to get repetitive. Plus, I was kind of running out of ideas on what to do with it if I looped it back. I didn't know if I wanted to make an arranged version of the chorus or something along the lines. So, I felt to be different and let it go into an outro instead.

I really really don't want to discourage you, but I don't think this will pass. I could tell you "this is awesome and it rules and jgdfgts better pass it", but it won't do you any good.

I kind of figured that in a way, but it can't hurt to submit and see what happens. You never know.

While you have variations, and some original parts in there, the basis of your mix is identical to the original and it is especially obvious in the beginning. The bass is the same, along with the repeating chords, the drums, the overall feel.

Which could be my overall problem. I like to keep true to the original source, but that's not what OCReMix is looking for, it seems. Again like I said, it can't hurt to submit what I got here.

What judges expect is rearrangement, and rearrangement in its most basic definition (at least to me) is the rearrangement of the supporting parts, of the bass, the supporting instruments, their rhythm, changes in percussive patterns, switching up the style. So, in general, I don't think the rearrangement factor is quite there.

^ I'll keep that in mind if I ever want to make another OCR attempt. ^

It would be great if some other remixers or mods would chime in on this.

Hence why I posted it on here after submission to OCReMix. :)

Please keep at it and don't get discouraged!

I won't, and thank you for breaking down another one of my mixes. Much appreciated, my good friend.

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So what's going on in this thread? :<

Hey same OCR icon!

As a big SOR fan myself i really like what you have here. My only gripe is that the ending wasn't set up, it just kinda....falls. Take a few beats to wind it down and do maybe a simple cadence to close it off.

The other thing was the anvil like sound around 1:55. The rhythm is just a bit off from what i was expecting. For some reason i was thinking more along the lines of 1 &2&3&4&. Which I think would work well for that section.

Otherwise it was great. Good to see more SOR people around here, gotta watch out for those Double Dragon, Battletoads, and Final Fight weirdos. :)

I love all beatemups!

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So what's going on in this thread? :<

Hey same OCR icon!

Streets of Rage pride, man! :D

As a big SOR fan myself i really like what you have here. My only gripe is that the ending wasn't set up, it just kinda....falls. Take a few beats to wind it down and do maybe a simple cadence to close it off.

You aren't the first to complain about the ending of this track. Again though, it is a finished product. I wanted to be a bit different and make Last Soul more of a full track instead of a loop as well.

The other thing was the anvil like sound around 1:55. The rhythm is just a bit off from what i was expecting. For some reason i was thinking more along the lines of 1 &2&3&4&. Which I think would work well for that section.

The conga roll at 1:55 was the hardest part to mimic. Honestly, it took me a few days just to get it right. It has a bit of a weird... swing, I should say? Plus, the samples I used to create that section were hard to equalize correctly with the bass I synthesized.

So, this comment, I'm definitely not taking to the heart. I did the best I could with it.

Otherwise it was great. Good to see more SOR people around here, gotta watch out for those Double Dragon, Battletoads, and Final Fight weirdos. :)

I love all beatemups!

Thank you for listening and glad you thought it was great overall.

Beat 'em ups FTW, but Streets of Rage will always be king in my eyes. :)

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How about you switch this from "Finished" to "Mod-Review" bro? That'd more than likely get you the critique/comments you're looking for.

I just tried that. I see no prefix dropdown to change the option when I go to edit the main thread post.

Meh. Oh well. Thanks for trying to help out though.

EDIT : Nevermind, I figured it out. Thanks once more.

----------

More reviews and listens would be nice. :)

BUMP

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This is quite a surprise. I haven't been around OCR for quite a while, but I always try to check out the SoR mixes that have cropped up while I've been gone. Of all the slower-paced tracks in games out there, this is one of my absolute favorites, and it's always nice to see it (well, anything Yuzo Koshiro or Sega in general) get some love.

"The Last Soul" makes me think of a slow, brooding intensity, like cooking with a crockpot instead of a blowtorch, and that seems to give the song both a sense of delicacy and strength that seem to be at odds with each other. It makes me feel anxious, nervous, like there's something big and important and scary coming but I'm not sure what.

You've copied that over into your remix really well, and in that sense, you've captured the spirit of the track, which is wonderful. I think you've done a great job in recreating most of the elements of the song, and I'm really enjoying listening to it, but there are two issues that stand out to me as bit problematic, and I'll try to go over them as clearly as I can here. Unfortunately I'm not too knowledgeable about the technical aspects of music, so my comments won't run too deep and may not be very helpful at all.

The first thing that I look for in remixes of this track is usually how well it is able to build the same feelings of the original. The progression of your song--the gradual introduction of the various different parts of the song--is excellent, bringing all of the elements of the song in a manner that flows... except for at the beginning. I think it feels a bit slow there, and if I heard it on the radio, I would pop out of whatever I doing mentally and probably ask myself what this song was doing before it had started to take off.

For comparison, the soundtrack version of "The Last Soul" that I have and "Souled Out" are both a little bit over three minutes long (3:07 and 3:16), but while the original starts the rubber band-like bassline at 0:10 and the intro to the melody at 0:30, your rubber band bassline doesn't pop in until 0:38, and the melody follows at about 0:48. If your mix were significantly longer than the orginial, that'd be fine, but as it is, I'd like to see the stuff you have starting at 0:10 maybe fade in from the very beginning to shave off a bit of the time it takes for the song to build.

That rubber band bassline is part of the second issue I want to point out. I love how you've matched the original feeling, but the instruments and sounds seem much too similar to the source sounds. I had to go back and double check just to make sure that the rubber band wasn't the exact same one, as I couldn't tell just from hearing it. I really would love to see that bassline rubber band instrument replaced with something else, and, if possible, do a few more variations with it. Your variations on the melody are fantastically unique while still managing to evoke the original in style. Play around with the bass in that manner, and try tinkering with the arrangement so that some different-sounding things show up.

I'm focusing here on the negatives, but I really do love this track, and your mix has some great things going for it that I would hate to just see disappear. This song is a very difficult one, but you're doing a great job so far with everything.

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This isn't a proper mod review, but I do want to pop in and say it's quite an enjoyable listen.

Unfortunately, this song veers dangerously close to "cover" territory, which will be a problem when dealing with the judges.

On the production front, it's very bright-sounding--which isn't a bad thing, everything seems to be pretty well melded together--but there isn't a lot of bass in the song, at least not through my setup. Might not be a bad thing, per se, but the source tune you posted was noticeably deeper-sounding.

There's a bit of an awkward transition at 1:55 or so, which I realize is part of the original, but probably wouldn't fly for an arrangement.

Overall it's a really enjoyable track, just probably wouldn't cut it for the judges. Cheers!

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The intro's a bit long, but once the drums come in at 0:38, it's very funky and the soundscape is unique and intriguing. The squelchy acid bass is cool. Now there's a sound I have yet to create on Zebra2.

That said, the kick is feeling a bit weak. The snare is sufficient, but the kick is hard to hear; maybe you could try sidechaining the kick to the bass, or possibly even layering more kick samples on there to give it a wider character. Rather than just low end punch, perhaps a high end click?

The saw pads you have appear to be slightly too loud, as they're obscuring the piano somewhat until 1:25.

The transitions work. I especially liked 1:34.

The saw lead at 1:36 appears to sound a bit mechanical. Yeah, synth leads have more lenience associated with them, but try not to make it seem machine-gun like. Maybe you could think about how a keyboardist would emphasize certain notes, and write your notes that way? The timbre of the lead works just fine.

Aside from that, great ideas going there!

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Sound design is very 90's. That's cool. :D Production, unfortunately, is too. It sounds a bit like the stuff that showed up in electronic pop music in the early 90's. You need more modern production techniques to get on ocr, imo. That's not particularly hard, tho, some eq and reverb to separate tracks more and it should be in a good place.

Piano feels a bit stiff. I like the sample-y feel of it, and I don't mind the stiffness during the more intense parts of the mix, but when it has a more exposed part (like at 2:43), it just stands out as mechanical.

It's fairly conservative, but I think it's different enough. I like how it sounds like it comes from a shorter and less repetitive source, but the source is way worse than the mix in this regard. I don't mind the repetition in the mix. Drums could have more fills and a few more variations, even if they're subtle. The bass also. You've got a cool groove, but don't be afraid to develop a few variations of it, and use those variations to control the intensity of each part of the track - as you have with the 1:46-2:13 part.

Ending doesn't work. At least give us a delay tail and a bit more silence at the end or something.

Production update and humanization during human parts and it could make it to the site. Good luck. :D

PRODUCTION

- Unrealistic sequencing - not always a problem, but it's there

- Mixing is muddy (eg. too many sounds in the same range) - not horribly so, just 90's so

STRUCTURE

~ Not enough changes in sounds (eg. static texture, not dynamic enough) - could be more varied

~ Too repetitive - not a huge deal, but i bet the judges would comment on the drums and bass

~ Abrupt ending - it's not cut off but it does end poorly

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Saw this gem in response to the judges decision :-D

@ocremix are a bunch of cunts. Six months of hard work every single day, down the drain. I've wasted my time. They can go fuck themselves.

And yet, you had 3 different people basically say a lot earlier what I said in my vote, yet somehow you're still shocked:

I really really don't want to discourage you, but I don't think this will pass. I could tell you "this is awesome and it rules and jgdfgts better pass it", but it won't do you any good. While you have variations, and some original parts in there, the basis of your mix is identical to the original and it is especially obvious in the beginning. The bass is the same, along with the repeating chords, the drums, the overall feel. What judges expect is rearrangement, and rearrangement in its most basic definition (at least to me) is the rearrangement of the supporting parts, of the bass, the supporting instruments, their rhythm, changes in percussive patterns, switching up the style. So, in general, I don't think the rearrangement factor is quite there.

Please keep at it and don't get discouraged!

I love how you've matched the original feeling, but the instruments and sounds seem much too similar to the source sounds.
Unfortunately, this song veers dangerously close to "cover" territory, which will be a problem when dealing with the judges.

Overall it's a really enjoyable track, just probably wouldn't cut it for the judges. Cheers!

Now Rozo was wrong, IMO, and maybe that gave you false hope, but we still have ReMixes that are more cover-ish, retaining the same structure and tempo, but are more personalized than what you had. See what else you can do on the arrangement side or just try another arrangement with more interpretation in mind.

I think djp said it best when I mentioned this offhand in chat just now: "Hey man, no need to call us cunts, we liked the track, we just have requirements that the arrangement change things up a bit more. No hard feelings if you don't feel like it, but we'd love to see you make some changes & resubmit."

That's basically it. Maybe you can't read past the NOs at the bottom of the vote, but we all still enjoyed the track. And we've been called worse than Fucky McFuckcunt, or whatever you yelled, so we don't mind. :lol:

Your production's not bad, just get the arrangement/interpretation component on point, and you're good to go. And if you no longer aim to get something passed on the site here because you don't like the standards, that's fine, but go channel that anger into something positive.

EDIT: Here's the proof that we hate you:

It's definitely cool and well-made, Greg, but it's falling outside of our scope on account of the arrangement approach.
Yeah i'm digging this.

So production as I said, is very good. Clearly passable.

Sorry that you won't be revisiting this, it would make a great track on the site in some form.

Really dig the triplet feel; was not expecting it, and it was a pleasant surprise. I'm really digging the vibe. It's very moody and slightly disconcerting in a mysterious kind of way.

Great vibe, needs some help in the groove arrangement.

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You should try again anyway. Meh, the judges were being nice with the crits, just read between the lines. If you're a person that can bear to adjust an arrangement you already finalized, go ahead. Worth a try. Then ask someone to comment on that again in this topic. Arrangement is a tough judgment call, can't get it perfect right away every time, not when you've just recently become "good" (I'd call myself "good" as of New Year's Day 2013, after 1.66 years). You probably just didn't have all that much time on your hands to practice, or did much of the same level stuff without looking for new and interesting techniques, or something tough in your DAW, or something.

It also helps to have the ability to envision a mix in your head, so you can just try out ideas in your head and then use your sense of judgment to decide what to use and what to scrap.

So yeah. Stay here dude. Don't expect to get something posted within less than 50 OCR forum posts and the rather minimal amounts of advice that you can get within that amount of time on OCR. Not extremely likely IMO. You need more time here to improve your skills in the right direction. I think if you came here earlier than your apparent sign-up date, you probably could have had a mix on the site by now, but wutchagunnado.

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